>Free will is a joke
>People commit sin
>Automatically can't get into Heaven
>God knows every decision you will and will not make
>But you totally have free will, just listen and believe
>Wishing life is just a simulation/game thing
>You just had a bad game
>You are actually truly happy
>>27271990
It's better to have Free Will than pay a price for it, if ya ask me!
>>27271990
>>27272022
Why believe in God when you don't believe in free will don't you belive he granted it to you?
>We are all God's little play things
>>27272022
Free will literally can't exist because every action has a reaction. Ever since the beginning of the universe, your life has been planned out by atoms and shit bouncing around.
>>27271990
>doesn't know about confession
If God's all powerful and all knowing he can create free will you retards, if he can't contradict himself and exists in the laws of physics then he's not really all powerful.
>>27271990
God is a sociopath anyway.
>>27272093
That's only a theory though.
Alternatively. Break the law of circle, become god and become the next evil to counter this universe.
Give birth to a new balanced universe that will get corrupted again and repeat forever.
>>27272149
I don't think it is, but it's good to keep it out of your head overall. An atom bounces off another atom, they go at a certain speed and then they hit other atoms etc forever. You are made up of atoms which make up chemicals that behave in the same way at a fundamental level; you ultimately have no control. Live your life like you control it, that's all that really matters.
>>27272099
>doesn't know about Christ's forgiveness
>Free will is a joke
>your whole life is predetermined by chemicals
>>27272099
>implying you can confess and be forgiven if you break the commandments
>>27271990
>People commit sin
>Automatically can't get into Heaven
Christianity is not "pray your sins away." The reason humans sin in the first place is because of Original Sin. When Adam and Eve sinned against God, they were irreparably cursed, and so was every human to follow. This curse (or Original Sin) compels humans to engage in sin, even to the point where humans are born with psychopathy or a genetic predisposition to commit acts such as rape or murder.
So Christianity in a nutshell:
- Humans are enslaved to sin due to the curse of Original Sin, and possibly have no free will.
- Jesus interjected and allowed himself to be crucified as a form of universal penance for mankind's sins, because humans are simply unable to stop themselves from sinning.
- Anyone who genuinely believes in Jesus is thereby granted salvation despite their nature continuing to make them sin.
>>27272546
>implying you even know what you're talking about
underage pls
>>27271990
The idea of heaven and hell always seemed really childish to me, it's like when kids say they win times infinity and you lose times infinity.
>>27272877
>underage pls
nice rebuttal
>>27273599
Do you know what you're talking about? Explain why breaking a commandment sends you to hell
>>27273934
Give me the reason why there's commandments
>>27272803
original sin=/=genetic determinism
Original sin is basically the idea that all things humans are bad BECAUSE they are human. Genetic determinism usually assumes there are adaptations behind why we do the things we do. "Evil" in christianity is mostly a thoughtcrime
>>27275219
Because God has high expectations of us and wants us to live righteously, and those commandments are very important laws to live by, the cornerstones (teehee) of living righteously. I like how people go *hurr commandments* but ignore Christ's sacrifice for the forgiveness of sins
I think qualia equals free will
especially when you're aware of the way free will "doesn't" exist
>>27275346
"sin" in christianity is literally just thoughtcrime. God punishes you more because of what you THINK than what you DO. In fact Jesus basically said hating someone is the same as actually killing them. Also all sins are weighed equally. Getting an erection is as evil as killing 50 kids with a baby seal. The christian god is basically the dictator from 1984
>>27275495
I see where you're coming from, but please just drop the fedora and think clearly without hatred of God flowing through your veins and things might be clearer
Yes, we are all sinners. Yes, lust and wanting to cause harm to people is a sin. Yes we are doomed to hell and death if we don't accept Christ. It's literally this simple
What do you want from me anon?
>>27275495
No it isn't. Sin is literally just falling short, doing something that is against God's will. The Commandments (also referred to as LAW) is the set of expectations, basically the guideline for how you have to live to be good with God. God by his nature destroys sin so anyone with any sin (even a little bit) can't dwell in the presence of God. People, by our nature, are sinful beings and thus you have an eternal separation of sinful beings from sinless God. God knew when he gave the commandments that no one could ever perfectly keep all of them, and that's why there was a system of atoning sacrifices set up so that pre-Jesus people's faith could be atoned for and credited to them as righteousness because they had the faith to live for God. Now when Jesus came, died and rose again, he was the ultimate sacrifice such that no more animal sacrifice was necessary and anyone who wants can enter a covenent relationship with God through acceptance and faith in Christ Jesus, which covers all sins, past, present and future. Sinning once you've accepted Christ doesn't undo the covenant and sentence you to hell (again) but it does affect your relationship with God, but still.. It's not God's will that anyone should go to hell, but each of us has to make that choice for ourselves. 2Peter 3:9
Both causality and acausality are incompatible with libertarian free will.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=joanVUoXY0s
>>27275738
>hatred of God flowing through your veins and things might be clearer
I don't hate what I do not believe exists. That's like saying I hate superman.
>>27276074
Jesus said himself that just thinking about a sin is a sin even if you don't do it. He also said that you can only divorce if your husband/wife cheats(no exceptions for violence, drug use, etc) and that his followers were immune to snake poison.
>>27271990
>Free will is a myth
>Religion is a joke
>We are all pawns, controlled by something greater
>>27276253
You hate him even if you claim not to
Sorry fammo. Mental gymnastics won't save you from anything
>>27276323
THE MEMES JACK
orgi
how stupid are you fuckers?
>free doesn't exist because god is the beginning and the end
can you see the future? No. What you do from here on may be predestined, but YOU have no idea what it is. THAT is your free will.
>>27271990
If free will doesn't exist you can't reasonably punish people for wrongdoings because they had no other choice
>>27271990
Christians just cherrypick the rules of Christianity based on their own personal lifestyles anyway.
do you ever think that god hides in the heavens because not even he can face the destruction hes created?
>>27271990
>believing heaven exists
>>27277685
Free will is more than just not knowing what you're going to do in the future.
>>27271990
No where does it say sin bars you from heaven. The bible explicitly states all humans sin, but Jesus died to free us from them. You must only be truly sorry and repent your sins.
>>27272022
the bible does not state God knows every decision you will or will not make.
The new pope, most likely your priests, and everything you see about Christianity on TV are pretty much false representations. They interpret what ever is popular at the time or what ever sounds good. Most of the values they push as Christian values are no where in the bible or part of original Christianity and should be thrown in the trash.
No where does it say you'll go to heaven if you've been good. No where does it say you'll go to hell if you've been bad. It says all humans are sinners and no human can be good in the eyes of God. Nothing human can impress him.
>>27276476
>You hate him even if you claim not to
only time I talk about religion is when someone brings it up. If it was never brought up I'd probably never really think about it
>>27277834
And your point is...
>implying rejecting the creator of the universe isn't hateful
WEW....LAD
>>27277787
>the bible does not state God knows every decision you will or will not make.
Psalm 139
>Lord, you have examined me and know all about me.
>You know when I sit down and when I get up. You know my thoughts before I think them.
>You know where I go and where I lie down. You know everything I do.
>Lord, even before I say a word, you already know it.
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Psalm+139&version=NCV
>>27272022
You retarded faggot read a book for once. Saint Augustine already solved this by proclaiming that divine foreknowledge dosent interfere with free will becuase free will is an intent to act not the act itself. Your free will is the choices that are presented to you and the one choice u do make god knows about it already. He dosent choose for you. You do. As for sin it's your decision to sin.
>>27271990
On a side note, do people actually believe in the old testament? I'm not really christian, more agnostic, but I was raised as a christian and we believe in the new testament, aka don't do bad onto others, acceptance, love, all that hippy shit.
But apparently the old testament is about jews and revenge, eye for an eye, sin of the father, that sort of stuff. I thought white people believe in the new testament.
>>27279112
>You retarded faggot read a book for once.
If you're a Christian, why on earth would you talk this way to your fellow human beings?
>>27279112
>free will is an intent to act not the act itself.
But scientific experiments have shown that intent arises unconsciously, before a person is even aware of it.
>Your free will is the choices that are presented to you and the one choice u do make god knows about it already. He dosent choose for you.
Assuming that God made me, he made me in a certain way, knowing everything I'd ever do.
If he made me better, I wouldn't have the desire to sin. Simple logic.
And if you say it's Adam and Eve's fault, God made Adam and Eve with such natures that they would be tempted. If he had made them smarter, or more pious, or more careful, they wouldn't have.
I believe that science explains the universe is on a pre-determined track, and everything we do is a reaction of previous occurrences, but doesn't quantum physics state that atoms bounce around randomly?
Or do we assume that they are doing so "seemingly", due to the unpredictability of the universe at our current point in time.
>>27279438
The answer of whether quantum mechanics is fundamentally deterministic or indeterministic has yet to be solved.
There are problems with all the major interpretations of quantum mechanics.
On a very deep level we still don't have it figured out.
But both pure determinism and indeterminism at the quantum level preclude libertarian free will.
Either your intentions, actions, thoughts, and so on are the necessary result of prior causes (in which case you have no libertarian free will)
or they're the result of quantum events that have no cause, then our wills, feelings, hopes etc. can't cause those quantum events to begin with, meaning that if a quantum event causes you to stab yourself, that wasn't your "free will" but rather the causal result of a prior state that was itself acausal (meaning you could not have caused it or prevented it)
atheists are all in denial because they're just too lazy to pray and can't give up their free and happy life for a religious boring life. Deep inside, they kind of force themselves to not believe in God, they actively search the internet to assure themselves that God is not real and they're doing fine by not believing in God. They're triggered everytime posts like these existed because they're scared. Because they don't want to believe, because they know, if they fall for it they'd lose the good life and be in the ridiculous group of people that they actively mock on the internet to make them feel good about themselves. We religious people aren't triggered when they bash on religion because deep down we feel secure.
>>27279556
>Bearing false witness.
>>27279474
So your post is basically saying
>we don't know enough about quantum mechanics to know if we have free will or not
Which makes believing in either free will or predestination is loosely-based ideology.
>>27279667
>we don't know enough about quantum mechanics to know if we have free will or not
No, that's wrong.
Both causality and acausality are incompatible with libertarian free will.
A lack of predeterminiation is necessary BUT NOT SUFFICIENT for there to be libertarian free will.
>>27279667
>>27280096
Getting more into it,
Just because some things might not be predetermined doesn't give you free will.
Libertarian free will isn't just that things aren't predetermined.
It's that they're not predetermined, and "you", apart from all your genetics and conditioning, can break chains of cause and effect with your ability to make choices free of all prior causes.
That idea is incompatible with both determinism and the idea that acausal quantum events can cause your actions (because your will/intention cannot be the cause of any acausal quantum events--else those events would not in fact be acausal, but rather, causal).
