Socialism is literally only about believing that workers are the rightful owners of the fruit of their labor.
Any other notions of cultural marxism, gun control and feminist censorship are pure degeneracy and should be disregarded by any socialist worth his salt.
Any conservative socialists on /r9k/?
>>25225192
>about believing that workers are the rightful owners of the fruit of their labor
And redefining labour to only mean physical labour and not intellectual and managerial that requires setting up a business.
td;dr 'things I do deserve more credit than things you do because reasons'.
>>25225239
Who said that nigga?
All work is work
>>25225239
The Jewish Capitalist propaganda is strong with this one.
>>25225192
Socialism is an economic paradigm.
Leftism, as shown in your picture, is a social (and economic) paradigm.
That being said, I am economically leftist but social I'm right-moderate. I haven't taken the political compass quiz in a while but I think homos need to shut up and trannies need electroshock therapy.
>>25225192
>conservative socialist
So you combine the worst of both worlds? You want to oppress people AND the free market? Jesus Christ man.
>>25225192
get that labor-theory-of-value nonsense out of your head. nothing has intrinsic value just because of the labor that went into making it, they only way to ascribe value to any product or service is "what's someone willing to pay for it?" Labor is just like any other commodity in that regard.
>socialism in non homogenous societies
Enjoy supporting Jamal
>>25225192
>an incredibly small minority of leftists act like a bunch of dumb faggots and create the most noise
>because of this noise this the only people 4chan hears about in the media
>generalizes all leftists from this minority
>many reasonable leftists out there that agree that this sjw/tumblr/hyper-liberal bullshit is out of hand and completely obnoxious
>have to put up with this generalized stereotype when in fact I lean left but would vote GOP if I felt the candidate was substantially better
>>25225506
My country is more homogeneous than yours
desu senpai 90% of all work is done by machines. Socialism is just saying we would rather the government controls the machines than the machines control the government a la capitalism. If you aren't a trillionaire you have no reason to oppose socialism, since it's your own interest at stake.
>>25225568
> 90% of work is done by machines
Not in agriculture and not in my country.
>>25225192
Fuck off socialist shill
>>>/pol/
>>25225192
>all those microaggressions
fuck off
>>25225192
>Nearing the next current year
>not being centrist
It's like you don't want anything to get done.
>>25225634
Hell yeah in agriculture. It's called the green revolution. They make fertilizer from oil, manufacture new strains, and use goddamn gigantic vehicles to accomplish the whole thing. Then they use even bigger vehicles to distribute the product. Soo machine dependent.
What country are you from where this is not the case?
>>25225549
Implying niggers are people thus are entitled to welfare lol
>>25225745
> centrist
It's like you don't have any convictions
>>25225777
Guatemala, terrain is too uneven for machines and agriculture is not yet technified
>>25225793
Kek
Centrism is a political ideology based on reason and pragmatism considerate of short and long term thinking - Centrism is not defined by compromise or moderation, it is considerate of them.
Honestly centrism is just common sense. I have convictions I just don't push my subjective morals on to others. The world would be a beautiful place if everyone was centrist.
>>25225464
>Le people must be free! Le market must be free!
Go back to Reddit.
>>25225568
>If you aren't a trillionaire you have no reason to oppose socialism
jesus christ this is what lazy neet shits actually believe
I would absolutely vote for Sanders if he were more conservative and not a total cuck.
>>25225568
>If you aren't a trillionaire you have no reason to oppose socialism, since it's your own interest at stake.
why is the left unable to comprehend that people consider things other than "what directly benefits me" when deciding what policies they favor?
Yeah, sure, I personally would really enjoy living in a place where I got a bunch of benefits. Either neetbux or just ironclad job security with high wages. It's not a good idea for society to be set up to favor people like me though, since people like me will work as little as possible. If you don't force us to contribute then we'll just be a drain on society. And the best way to force us to do that is capitalism - "okay, go out and find a way to support yourself, society won't give you any benefits or guarantees" The people you do want to favor in society are the ones who want to work hard, build new things, etc. and you incentivise that by... letting them keep whatever wealth they create and not taxing it away to fund people like me.
>>25225192
>If I make a chair for company that sells it for $20 I deserve $20
>What is materials costs
>What is transport and freightage costs
>What is advertising costs
>What is managerial and administrative costs
>What is rent for the plant, costs of tools used and maintance
Jesus Christ MUH COST OF LABOUR faggots are the worst
If you really are being ripped off by the lazy manager who earns nothing, there is literally nothing stopping you and your buddies from making a co-op and competing in the market while paying yourself the $20 for the chair. Good luck with that
>>25225239
>intellectual
>managerial
It's literally just cutting costs and fucking over workers and limiting quality control to save a few shekels. It's not real work, you charlatan.
>>25225976
> co op
Literally socialism
Don't assume i don't know economics, nigger.
You don't get $20 for making a $20 chair for a company, you and your worker friends share the net profit of the chair, without some lazy jew taking a cut.
>>25225793
What's wrong with being in the middle?
I support border patrol for crime reasons, language burdens, cultural reasons, welfare dependency, etc but I'm not too right to support it for racial reasons.
I support Capitalism but I also support worker safety laws.
I'd support the minimum wage for non small businesses if it was 6 or 7 bucks but I think anything above that is fucking retarded.
>>25226118
Nothing, i'm playing nigga.
>>25225192
>Socialism is literally only about believing that workers are the rightful owners of the fruit of their labor.
That is true under capitalism. The workers trade their labour under mutually agreeable terms with the capitalist.
>>25226047
who made you the judge of what is or is not worthwhile work? Someone's paying that manager to do that. His boss, the shareholders, whoever. If they're paying for him to do it, they must be getting at least as much value as they're paying him.
>it's just fucking over workers
yeah, this is an adversarial relationship. absolutely nobody is surprised by this. employers try and get as much labor from employees as they can for as little money as possible. Employees try to get as much money as they can, and try to do as little as possible. It's the same in any transaction. You go into a store to buy a TV. The store will price that TV as high as they think they can get away with, since they like money. You will try and buy the TV at the cheapest price you can find, for the same reason. It's not evil when one side does it and virtuous when the other side does it. It's neutral. It's also the natural way of the world.
>>25226499
> agreeable terms
Not necessarily
Under socialism ownership is not a legitimate form of income, and direct work input is required to reap benefits from the enterprise.
Labor is not sold to an owner, the profits are directly received by the workers.
If a capitalist company starts earning more, the workers won't necessarily earn more, just the owner/s
>>25226584
>Not necessarily
Yes, necessarily. Otherwise it's not capitalism.
>>25225935
>It's not a good idea for society to be set up to favor people like me though,
You're the political equivalent of a cuckold.
>And the best way to force us to do that is capitalism - "okay, go out and find a way to support yourself, society won't give you any benefits or guarantees"
If that was instated, most people would starve. Most people cannot compete with capitalists. In fact many services today can ONLY be provided by capitalists, people who own a large amount of stuff like mines, farms, factories, ships, satellites, nukes, etcetera. In your cuck world, these people would own us completely.
>>25226642
Tell that to exploited laborers
>>25226668
> would own us completely
> imblyign they dont'
>>25226701
Not quite. We could theoretically elect a government that completely tore most of the NWO's holdings to shreds. But then China would probably just replace it.
>>25226862
> theoretically
No candidates fit this purpose atm
>>25226884
If Trump is elected it will at least demonstrate our power, since the main reason he's so popular isn't imo his policies but that every establishment media outlet runs an attack on him every single day. So electing him would demonstrate how unpopular the establishment is.
The problem is that he could just be a shill. Obama was also supposedly anti establishment, but he seems to have just made a lot of money for insurance and the MIC. Trump is vague on his policies that will impact actual Americans and not aggressive enough in condemning the established order. It's as if the only real insurgent aspect of him is his lack of political correctness.
And his dynamic with Bush is comical. That's what first got me started thinking about this. The gaffes that Bush is pulling, in particular his subservient demeanor towards Trump, seem to indicate an actor playing his role rather than a competitor trying to win.
The best solution is to meme a candidate from nothing. We have social media now, including 4chan - we don't need FOX, CNN, the Republicans, campaign donations, etc. All we need is a movement.
>>25227126
Trump 2016
Fuck shillary
>socialist
>not 19th century
rip humanity
>>25225192
I agree, but communists were still filth on account of their atheism
>>25225506
Slavery is the best form of socialism, since it supports Jamal while he is forced to work and behave like a civilized human being.
Read George Fitzhugh
>>25225192
Im a leftist, im progressive in the way that i dont care if one dude fucks another dude, i believe LGBT people should have the same rights as everyone else, however parading it around and supporting it is disgusting. Progressivism has nothing to do with left or right wing politics btw.
Anyways, leftism really has nothing to do with the American "left". If anything a leftist would support the 2nd amendement and other liberties.
>>25225192
Cultural Marxism is a meaningless phrase made up by 4chan.
Marx had nothing, NOTHING, to do with modern degeneracy and I can't fathom why you people associate him with the godamn gay liberation movement.
>>25225506
So you're saying that maybe we should try... National... Socialism...? Just maybe? Just- Just maybe give that a little try there? Could work out nicely?
>>25227936
>a meaningless phrase made up by 4chan.
No, it's much older than 4chan.
>>25227464
Please. Think rationally, truly rationally, without any personal feeling clouding your judgement, and really ask yourself whether you believe a God can exist.
I really wouldn't be surprised if those dudes in the OP pic voted republican. They're definitely a type.
>>25228192
> not believing in god
Degenerate out
> i am le smart and enlightened atheist i dont need a god u r just emotional
Fug off
I don't know, being a faggot seems more in line with capitalism than Marxism. Fagism goes hand in hand with capitalism since it promotes indulgence and all that shit only rich people who live in a bubble seem to believe in.
>>25226118
>minimum wage 6 or 7 bucks
WeW. Minimum wage should be raise and on an inflation index. Min wage was made so you have the live off it, not "build experience" like retarded rights think.
>>25228357
I second this.
Although burger flippers are retarded
>>25228299
> Fagism
Faggotry, no?
I agree entirely, fags have no restraint or respect for relationships.
>>25228372
Yeah, I'm not saying burger flippers should be paid 15 across the board, that's utterly ridiculous.
But living off min wage is literally why FDR wrote it in to existence. That's what these "hurr durrrr muh big govt, hands off" Darwinian morons don't understand.
We're one species. There doesn't need to be such intense "competition" that people of your own species die from it.
Sadly this is why centrism is the only correct political view. Almost every other one implies that they know what is best for EVERYBODY.
>>25228508
when FDR wrote it into existence it didn't take into account that people would WANT an iphone, that they would WANT super fast internet, that they would WANT expensive hair weaves (niggers) that they would WANT to do drugs
minimum wage is perfectly liveable. Advocates of a higher minimum wage just dont want to admit their failure to live off minimum wage might have a bit to do with their dope smoking consumer lifestyle.
>>25228592
If you think 8-something/hr is liveable in let's say NYC, then you're a funny nigga.
It should have been put on an inflation index imo.
>Advocates of a higher minimum wage just dont want to admit their failure to live off minimum wage might have a bit to do with their dope smoking consumer lifestyle.
I thought the point of having a middle class was for them to spend/consume? I agree that sometimes it's poor financial management but it some places it's also just the way things have turned.
>>25228739
>If you think 8-something/hr is liveable in let's say NYC, then you're a funny nigga.
wow, almost like they shouldn't be living in NYC. almost like living in a trendy city is a privilege for those who can afford to make it work.
The min wagers should be out filling our country towns again where their money actually means something.
>>25228776
Where should new York's workers live then, you nigger?
>>25228835
if there aren't enough workers to fill their mcdonalds, mcdonalds will raise their wages.
There are just too many people in the cities and not enough people in the towns. This is the problem created by it.
There is a finite amount of space in a city.
>>25228957
Yeah, i agree, centralization of jobs and people is super shit
>>25228957
Might have something to do with
1938 US Pop: 129.8 million
2016 US Pop: 322.7 million
Hmmmm, if only there was some kind of index that would take into account a booming population brought forth by lack of "real" war and advancements of medical science.
if you are a socialist on economic issues and a patriot on social ones, you are a national populist.
if you are a socialist on economic issues and a nationalist on social ones, you are a national socialist.
it's not that much of a taboo. mussolini himself was a member of a communist association before rising to power. but socialism combined with neo-liberalism is literally cancer.
>>25229043
implying its not all breeding niggers and illegal mexicans
>>25229312
while i agree we should definitely do something about illegals. We should be helping our CITIZENS regardless of race/gender/sexuality,
NO ONE gets to choose (how/where/the fact that ) they were born.
>>25229528
sure but eventually the system will buckle under the sheer amount of niggers being pumped out, raised by shitty mothers, not receiving education and living the hood life.
Printing more money for mcdonalds workers is only going to make long term problems.
>>25229617
> what is subsidizing education
> what are social programs
These problems are solvable, just because a man is black doesn't mean he has to be a nigger if he grows up in the right conditions.
>>25225192
>conservative
>socialist
Lol pick one familia. Socialism can't conserve certain values and ideas in different countries and nations, open borders and international socialism will literally lead to the entire world having no culture except for worshipping a hammer and a sickle
>>25229724
Funny meme, faggot.
Socialism is an economical system.
Progressives can suck my dick
>>25229849
The only socialists I know of who didn't support progressive ideas and policies were the Nazis. Shit even Lenin legalised gay marriage, Stalin decriminalised it but who tf wants to live under Stalins rule?
>>25225888
do you ever post a retort that doesn't involve telling people who post things you don't like to go back to reddit? Is Jerry Messing the only pic in your chan folder? Are you aware that you are a tumor cell?
>>25230922
Well that's your personal experience.
Castro didn't stand for this degeneracy.
>>25231008
>degeneracy
> projecting your subjective morals on to complete strangers
You're the cancer of humanity that's blocking the gate to greatness.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PuvIqbAw5dA
>>25231054
Feminst shill pls go.
> imposing your subjective morals onto complete strangers
You say that homosexuals keep to themselves and we shouldn't mind them because they do their shit in their own time and privacy.
However, in practice, most homosexuals make their sexuality a huge part of their personality, it's all they talk about, it's all they stand for, and they have nothing else More interesting to say.
>>25231301
>However, in practice, most homosexuals make their sexuality a huge part of their personality, it's all they talk about, it's all they stand for, and they have nothing else More interesting to say.
That's because you judge them on their sexuality and the unintelligent normie ones(since all normies are literal sheep) make their sexuality their identity.
I'm bi but even I hate pride parades. The fuck is there to be proud of something you didn't accomplish. You were born gay, straight, black , white. I cant logically understand how one can feel pride for it.
>>25231503
> make their sexualities their identity
Exactly the problem
> normie ones
All gays are normies
>>25231503
Also, gay meme weakling sjw liberal degeneracy culture is cancer
>>25227989
I hate socialism and all, but it's not the reason that nazis were shit.
>>25225192
I might qualify, I dunno. With economics, I'm for government support of people for healthcare, housing, and education. That said, I'm also very much against a controlled economy, which may make me a capitalist by some definitions, but I'm also for more democratically run firms, and I'm for making government closer to a direct democracy.
With social issues, I'm basically libertarian. I'm very pro-free speech, freedom of movement, and pro-choice. I'm for gay marriage and freedom of religion, and I'm also intensely against "safe spaces" and anti-hate speech legislature. I think modern feminism is stupid, but I also find MRAs pathetic and contemptible.
>>25231855
> Controlled economy
Socialism doesn't require controlled economy, and this is even detrimental to the worker
Why does it even matter? Socialism won't cure my autism or give me social skills. Those pseudo-intellectual discussions among really serious political scientists from some taiwanese forum are the reason /pol/ was created. Also, 90% of this is just opinion.
What about socialist anarchism like syndicalism? Or just anarchism.
>>25231004
Your comment was the same thing as his.
Do you have no self awareness?
>>25225516
Because that "small minority" creates the most noise, they create the most pressure and cause the most change. Even if the the majority of leftists disagree with them, letting them act on their stupidity with impunity is a funny way of showing it.
Marcuse and his followers killed the left decades ago, and its probably never coming back.
I'm still confused as fuck as to how so many on /r9k/ are supporting Trump, the ultimate Chad, who will help other rich people and force everybody to work their asses off to survive.
Meanwhile, Bernie will fuck over the rich people and normies to give free shit to NEETs, and if it drives up the debt, who gives a fuck because we won't live long enough for it to matter and it'll be Chad's kids and not ours (since we're not having any) picking up the tab down the line.
If you support capitalism over socialism as a robot, you're cucking yourself for no reason.
>>25225568
>since you're a trillionare
you must be a dumbass who doesn't understand tax rates. If you're not outlandishly poor you get a huge amount of your money chopped already. Why the fuck would you want more.
>>25225516
Same here.
I lean toward leftist economic policy and social programs and a secular culture, but I also love guns, support a strong military, strong punishments for criminals, stuff like that.
It drives me crazy that the SJW nutjob types, reactionary gun grabbers, etc. hog the limelight and taint the perception of those of us who are just on the left because we believe that using tax dollars to create a healthy and educated populace is the only way to remain relevant and competitive and not turn into a third-world shithole.
>>25232421
>I'm still confused as fuck as to how so many on /r9k/ are supporting Trump, the ultimate Chad, who will help other rich people and force everybody to work their asses off to survive.
trump supports universal healthcare
i'm a degenerate so i'm in the democratic camp but you really have to acknowledge
can't stump the trump
>>25232485
>Why the fuck would you want more.
it would be really, really nice to have a government that actually provides relevant services
i'd pay a lot of money for that
>>25232421
The social policies offered by those with sensible economic positions will work directly against us. An economic leftist with reactionary social view would be great.
>>25232684
Yeah, an economic leftist is basically what I've been saying is best for NEETs.
And shit, rich people got rich by not giving a fuck if they fucked over poor people, so why the fuck should we give a fuck about fucking over rich people? (Or anybody else with more money than us.)
remember this holiday season, family
there is no such thing as ethical consumption under capitalism
>>25232987
Ethics are a farce.
>>25233102
posting on 4chan is a farce
>>25226097
Yeah, you don't know socialism to work on something as a group and make profits. You need socialism to enforce redistribution of those profits.
>>25232987
>lefty
>not saying ethics are relative
pick one
>Live in small, second rate city.
>20-30 hours/week at 20/hour plus second job 15-20 hours/wk at $10/hr.
>Still took 3/4 of my income to pay rent and utilities on a two room apartment with gang drive-bys happening in daylight in front of my house on the regular. Sometimes have to beg money off friends/parents to afford bus fare/ food. No car.
$15 for burger flippers seems fair from where I'm standing.
>>25225239
this
Manual labor is easily replaceable and expendable
having intelligent people who can manage the company's direction and finances among the sea of competitors trying to out due them is more important
>>25233266
you're not as important as a manager my friend
ethics are relative
>>25233282
this is literally only true for capitalist system, socialism would have very different market dynamics.
>>25225976
>If I make a chair for company that sells it for $20 I deserve $20
That's not socialism at all faggot.
Anarchist communism is the only way.
>>25233591
that is pretty redundant family
>>25233608
Well, as opposed to individualist anarchism.
>>25233629
no man is an island
