Good night right side!
yeah dude equality bro *smokes weed*
>>75856058
Don't forget to sage!
>>75856058
>>75856058
How do you feel about communism not working?
>>75856164
get involved
>>75856058
DUDE
Kill yourself faggot
>>75856385
national socialism- failed in 1945
communism-still present in north korea china and Venezuela
if you ask me national socialism doesn't work :^)
>>75856507
involved in what?
>>75856739
>national socialism
Notice the word SOCIALISM. Also North Korea is an example how communism doesn't work.
>>75856949
join your local antifa
make your country a country for all :)
>>75856988
you've never even been there, keep getting your right wing propaganda
>>75856988
>Notice the word SOCIALISM
Nazism was just capitalism with a populist veneer. Fascism is capitalism in decay. It adopts thunderous rhetoric but ultimately failed.
Gass yourself kike.
>>75856739
National Socialism didn't fail, it was brutally brought to an end by the other superpowers.
>>75858738
so was communism, and communism is still here.
seems like national socialism did fail.
JUST
>>75858897
Communists don't like Israel though. And nobody admires Stalin other than a few hardcore tankies.
>>75856949
white genocide
>>75859672
>Communists don't like Israel though
they are jew puppets anyway
>and nobody admires Stalin other than a few hardcore tankies
top kek
>>75856058
Let's get some lefty music comrades!
I'll start.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9XEnTxlBuGo
>>75856739
Nice bait fag
>>75858897
>Implying leftists like the zionists who are occupying Palestine.
>>75859672
>Communists don't like Israel though
Fuck off retarded kike puppet autist
>>75860710
>Israel
>Identity politics
Not my comrades, family.
>>75860760
Kill your self you retarded cringy brainwashed retard
>>75856058
will you give me some money? im poor
>>75856058
I have that shirt. It's a really good shirt. 10 years old, no wear & tear, and the print has only started to flake.
>>75860849
>>75860710
https://youtu.be/mZpDqRuxGFo
>>75859672
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/a-christian-arab-just-won-israels-transgender-beauty-pageant_us_574dd88de4b0757eaeb0cbf3
>>75856058
Implying /pol/ isn't already absurdly left in their thinking.
>>75861041
What is this supposed to prove besides that israel is full of liberals who focus more on identity than class consciousness?
>>75856058
Why do you compare the Holodomore to the Irish potato famine. You claim the holodomore is not a genocide, yet to frame the the USSR as a good system you have to compare its action in a crisis to save its citizens with an Empire commiting genocide in order to subjugate another state. What the fuck are you thinking with?
>>75856385
>falling for the captialist propaganda
The Soviet Union was a God tier country. Literally fucking over everyone else in accomplishments. Zero unemployment. Brilliant scientists, and they didn't steal them from Europe unlike the US. Landed a damn probe on Venus decades ago but you never hear about it. The US "won" the space race only at the end after losing in every other benchmark then declared it was over.
why it is always people who never lived under communism who have romanticized fetish for it ?
it sucks
>>75856058
>>75856058
ANTIFA, 3rd faggot regiment reporting in for this thread :^)
>>75861412
>The Soviet Union was a God tier country
Why did people flee from it then? Why did several European countries have charities dedicated to poor people within the USSR? Why did Fridtjof Nansen get the Nobel Peace Prize for his efforts to negotiate so that food aid could be sent to Ukraine? Why did they accept it?
> Zero unemployment.
That's retarded,
>Brilliant scientists
Is this why Russia and Eastern Europe lagged behind the West and still does?
>and they didn't steal them from Europe unlike the US.
The Marshall Help is stealing? How does giving monetary aid (not loans) to rebuild nearly all of Europe constitute stealing?
>>75861937
because they've never experienced it
they've been coddled and sheltered their whole lives, the aspect of hardship and suffering that accompanies their ideology is beyond their level of comprehension.
>>75856988
>Also North Korea is an example how communism doesn't work.
Falling for the memes again I see.
You only think that because of all the ridiculous propaganda in our media.
All of North Korea's problems can be traced back to the barbaric trade sanctions imposed on them by the "free and progressive" western nations.
Of course a country that is banned from importing food is going to have trouble feeding it's population - that's why almost every country in the world was prone to famine before globalisation
>Leftists on /pol/
Hold up nigga.
>>75859672
>nobody admires Stalin other than a few hardcore tankies.
Fuck off you trot cunt. Your kind aren't wanted here.
Question, how do lefties and Marxists handle the fact that their ideology is ultimately dysgenic? As in it rewards failure instead of incentivising success?
Also, how do you feel about "tall poppy syndrome"?
Requesting an honest answer.
>>75862321
Get fucked tankie.
>>75862253
You can't seriously be defending DPRK can you?
>>75856988
national socialism isn't socialism you fucking retarded kraut
>>75861937
No one's lived under communism since cavemen mate - no idea what you are on about
Leftism is good if there is a redistribution of gf. I guarantee I would have gf in soviet russia.
>>75856385
how do you feel about the slavic untermenschen raping ten thousands of muh aryan race women when their weak-as-fuck men folk got fucking wrecked by the "sub-humans" they so despise?
>>75856058
Eat shit commie
>>75862064
>why did people flee from it?
Every country has tards thinking the grass is greener on the otherside. Of course the capitalists decided to publicise this.
>zero unemployment is retarded
You're retarded
>Russia and Europe lagged behind
Fell for the propaganda again. They didn't. Look it up. The only key point in which they lagged was the development of nuclear weapons, which was thanks to the Jews in the US. I'm not being anti semitic, the Manhattan projects notable members was literally 99% Jews.
>the marshal plan is stealing?
Operation Paperclip.
>>75856058
Are you trolling?
I'm not sure
Unfortunately our "conservatives" in Ireland tend to be leftwing open border cuntbags, fuck the IRA
>>75862451
>Using tankie as an insult
What's your ideology? We should all just hold hands and pray that god gives us socialism.
Trots like you are no better than liberals. You secretly love capitalism, which is why you support an ideology that has no chance of ever overthrowing it.
Communism is only won through struggle against imperialist powers - which is why we should celebrate the achievements or countries like North Korea.
>>75862253
>All of North Korea's problems can be traced back to the barbaric trade sanctions imposed on them by the "free and progressive" western nations.
Why? They share a border with China, every aspect of trade could be settled with China, and they are not far away from Vietnam. This is like the case with Cuba, except here only the US is imposing sanctions, this excuse is used no matter what.
>Of course a country that is banned from importing food is going to have trouble feeding it's population
They get food aid from the West. and they can import food from China, Vietnam, Cuba, Bolivia, Brazil and several African states. If Zimbabwe had not fucked up their farming, they could import from them.
> that's why almost every country in the world was prone to famine before globalisation
No it wasn't, famines were rare. The only difference is that in the developed world, they are now non-existant. The closest thing you have is drought, like in Venezuela now.
Socialism is based as hell, people have just fallen into the /pol/ hivemind
>>75862534
You're brand of communism can only exist in a society that comprises less than a dozen people or so, and one where everyone shares a close relation with one another.
Communism as practiced by modern nations that comprise of millions of people is nothing more than a method for poor nobodies to rise to prominence, become drunk with power, and slaughter their own people and culture.
>>75862813
Tankies have no clear objective to overthrow capitalism. They're social democrats at heart.
>>75862291
>when you listen to nigel farage
Still wanting an answer to if you guys believe this ideology is dysgenic. This is important.
>>75862395
How about form your own opinion then repeat a worthless platitude which has no basis in reality?
>>75856058
pls no
>>75862843
> every aspect of trade could be settled with China
that's not how it works - China has the largest population in the world, and is hardly a first world country - they don't just have spare food that they can give out for free to feed an entire country.
>and they are not far away from Vietnam
Vietnam isn't a socialist country.
Also, you keep saying "North korea can buy from x country" when the reality is they can't, because no one will buy anything from North korea - meaning they have little to trade with.
>>75861371
>>75861437
>>75861787
>>75862878
>>75862955
Holy crap all those permavirgin autistic faggot leftypol shills from 8gag and their cringy memes.
>>75862955
You are an idiot.
"Tankies" are supporters of the only ideology that has actually led to the creation of successful socialist nation states.
Remind me of all the people who have lived in a Trotskyist country?
>>75856058
Fuck off commietards. Communism is a failed ideology that has never worked, and will never work.
>>75863302
>Soviet Union
>Successful socialist nation state
>Literally believes a totalitarian state capitalist regime is socialism.
>>75862291
What are Russell Brand's viewpoints? I've never really heard him speak.
>>75863466
>Stalin is a capitalist! I have done my research!
>>75863018
It IS my opinion.
I AM that guy who created that "platitude," either debate me or fuck off with your ad hominem, because that's what you just did. No seriously, I really am a very influential voice here, you must debate the non shitposting Australian to be taken seriously.
Fallacious posting should be a banable offence.
>>75862955
I'll address you directly then...
How do you feel about affirmative action and the redistribution of opportunities as a preemptive measure against "privileged" classes? Do you believe it's fair that different demographics have different standards applied to them rather than a strict meritocratic approach?
For more questions: >>75862395
Seriously, have you heard of tall poppy syndrome? Do you feel it's in any way appropriate for achieving equality?
>>75863466
>State capitalism
got to love these fresh trotskyist memes.
So we're not allowed any sort of transitory period before communism? We just have to suddenly completely change our entire society in the blink of an eye?
Also - that's literally what socialism is - a dictatorship of the proletariat.
If you can't handle that and prefer the comfort of a dictatorship of the capitalist class, then good.
Your views will never lead to any significant change.
>>75862739
>Every country has tards thinking the grass is greener on the otherside. Of course the capitalists decided to publicise this.
Yes, but there have never been a mass exodus from a capitalist country to a communist one. No one is building rafts to get from Florida to Cuba, and no-one fleed from England to Russia to escape poverty. There is no italian minority in Russia. The Berlin Wall was meant to prevent people from fleeing from East-Germany to West-Germany.
>Fell for the propaganda again. They didn't. Look it up.
This is litteraly the opposite what everyone who visited Russia after the fall of the USSR says, there is a reason why none of the migrants want to go to Eastern Europe. Moldova and Belaruss score below most of the Middle-east.
But, hey I can either trust a deluded commie on the internett or anyone that has ever traveled and compared any of the former USSR countries with a Western or Souther European country. And we know it's because of communism because of rapidly Eastern Europe is catching up.
>Operation Paperclip.
The Soviets also captured German scientists, if that's your best claim to back this up, you're retarded. The US taking 20-30 German scientist after WW2, is not "stealing from Europe".
>>75856739
>communism-still present in north korea china and Venezuela
and people still make sure to bump these threads
>>75863671
>Yes, but there have never been a mass exodus from a capitalist country to a communist one. No one is building rafts to get from Florida to Cuba, and no-one fleed from England to Russia to escape poverty. There is no italian minority in Russia. The Berlin Wall was meant to prevent people from fleeing from East-Germany to West-Germany.
Capitalists love to make this point. "look, at all these capitalist countries that are better off than communist ones"
Yes, but also look at all the countless capitalist shitholes that are immeasurably worse than communist countries.
The primary cause of a countries standard of living is it's geography - this has always been the case and only under full communism will this be able to overcome.
Also do you not think that maybe Socialism is a more appealing ideology to poor/downtrodden countries - and that's why many socialist countries are poor?
>>75862739
>Every country has tards thinking the grass is greener on the otherside. Of course the capitalists decided to publicise this.
expect virtually none immigrated to the Soviet Union, save a few double agents that were granted very comfortable lives for betraying their former country
>You're retarded
ad-hominem
not an argument and their was never zero-unemployment in the USSR
>Fell for the propaganda again. They didn't. Look it up. The only key point in which they lagged was the development of nuclear weapons, which was thanks to the Jews in the US. I'm not being anti semitic, the Manhattan projects notable members was literally 99% Jews.
Literally using /pol/'s Jew boogyman argument, after bitching about identity politics and all the other bullshit letfypol spews.
Also who is Julius Klaus Fuchs
literally no argument
>Operation Paperclip.
The Soviets swiped up their fair share of nazi scientist after the war
>>75863209
>that's not how it works - China has the largest population in the world, and is hardly a first world country - they don't just have spare food that they can give out for free to feed an entire country.
It's the world second largest economy, they have 1 billion citizens and North Korea has 25 million people. Every now and then commies come on here and proclaim Chinas economic growth is proof of how superior communism is, despite being corrupted by capitalism to some extent it still produces this extreme aboundance. Now it's too dirt poor to do anything for it's allies or it's people. It can build ghost cities the size of New York, but it hasn't really quite learned how to grow rice and raise pigs.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2r_84fnKQco
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F1ZsVUB_-qg
>Also, you keep saying "North korea can buy from x country" when the reality is they can't, because no one will buy anything from North korea - meaning they have little to trade with.
But, they can have labour camps in Russia, where North Koreans work as wood loggers for 5-10 years for the North Korean state.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=awQDLoOnkdI
>tfw Marxists won't debate me
>>75863665
You're allowed a transitory period, but considering the ~5000 years of feudalism you need to accept at least 3000 years of capitalism, see how this works?
If we are to believe the Marxist dialectic (which totally looks like something Plato did and was even parodied in BSG by Gaius Baltar) and considering that capitalism is quite a lot more beneficial and successful than feudalism, isn't it fair that we spend as much time in capitalism as we did in feudalism? Why try to skip something that's doing quite well? Most technology is a direct result of capitalism and various industrial revolutions (plural).
>dictatorship of the proletariat
Isn't that just mob rule? Sorry bro, but that doesn't sound very appealing even at its most ideal
>significant change
Are you actually implying change should be pursued for its own sake? What if significant change is a bad thing against slowly tweaking our system into... Say... Something best described as syndicalism. This can even be achieved through libertarian ideologies, I can explain if you like?
>>75863952
So how do you feel about Venezuela which does have that geography? It's prime position to work well with America and completely shit on OPEC which is an oppressive, Islamic based theocratic authority and is an enemy against both the left and right.
>>75863562
He sure called himself a communist but that doesn't make him one and it certainly doesn't make the state he created communist.
This is the same shit as people who call north korea democratic because they're the "Democratic People's Republic of Korea".
>>75863665
Look, we're all leftists here. This infighting is literally why we aren't getting anywhere.
If tankies start a successful revolution I'll be a fellow traveler but I don't think you can call (except maybe the very beginning) the soviet union's system of government a dictatorship of the proletariat. It degenerated really fucking quickly.
>So we're not allowed any sort of transitory period before communism?
Never said this. We'll need a transition period but I'm not sure what it will look like. There needs to be widespread class consciousness before a successful revolution. The soviet union wasn't ready, china wasn't ready.
Convince me senpai. Is totalitarianism really the only way you see transition period happening? It's certainly possible but we can't fill up gulags with half the country.
>>75863665
>So we're not allowed any sort of transitory period before communism?
You mean capitalist, imperialist and socialist phases? Yeah, it just that commie leadership needed arms to commence WW2 so agrarian shithole was hastily upgraded to industrial shithole and then froze there.
>dictatorship of the proletariat
That's funny way of spelling "dictatorship of the nomenklatura".
>>75864151
What are these arguments.
You are comparing the cost of running a single labour camp with the cost of feeding an entire country of millions?
So North korea should just spend on nothing but food - and let criminals run about in the streets, have no police etc.
It's an incredibly isolated socialist state - what benefit could they possibly gain from intentionally starving their citizens - as that is what you seem to be claiming?
>falling for Vice's propaganda
>not realising Vice is owned by Murdoch
>>75863952
>Yes, but also look at all the countless capitalist shitholes that are immeasurably worse than communist countries.
Such as? Name one that is not a wartorn country or in Africa.
>The primary cause of a countries standard of living is it's geography - this has always been the case and only under full communism will this be able to overcome.
Then how the fuck did all those Marxist-Leninst one Party states in Africa fail? The entirety of Sub-Saharan Africa is extremely abundant in all ways, whether it comes to the farming potential or minerals, metals, oil etc,
>Also do you not think that maybe Socialism is a more appealing ideology to poor/downtrodden countries - and that's why many socialist countries are poor?
Yes, I think the poverty causes them to make the poor decision of socialism. This way they shoot themselves in the foot.
want a dance?
>>75864296
>If we are to believe the Marxist dialectic (which totally looks like something Plato did and was even parodied in BSG by Gaius Baltar) and considering that capitalism is quite a lot more beneficial and successful than feudalism, isn't it fair that we spend as much time in capitalism as we did in feudalism? Why try to skip something that's doing quite well? Most technology is a direct result of capitalism and various industrial revolutions (plural).
Because Communism is more beneficial than Capitalism? As Marx said - communism is inevitable - automation will rip capitalism apart - the desires of the individual capitalist will be completely opposed to those of the capitalist system - but why not try to speed the process. Surely you want to see your ideal society come to some sort of fruition in your lifetime.
>Isn't that just mob rule? Sorry bro, but that doesn't sound very appealing even at its most ideal
No. it's just like any other dictatorship - except:
It's extremely democratic at a local level - even if it isn't at a national one
The leaders have the interests of the people in mind - and strive towards a communist society.
>So how do you feel about Venezuela which does have that geography? It's prime position to work well with America and completely shit on OPEC which is an oppressive, Islamic based theocratic authority and is an enemy against both the left and right.
venezeula doesn't have ideal geography by any stretch of the imagination. It has a tropical climate ffs - these countries have always struggled with food, disease, disaster etc.
Also proximity to the US will work against any socialist country.
>>75861714
>>75861714
>>75861714
>>75861714
>>75861714
if no one gives me money im going to get a gun and take it from you, i work too hard for this shit
Board moves so fucking fast it's hard to get long responses before the thread gets pushed off.
Up you go
>>75864440
>You are comparing the cost of running a single labour camp with the cost of feeding an entire country of millions?
No, it shows that they can do buisness with other nations. They work with South Korean buisness every now and then, it's why they like Choco pies so much.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2547061/The-chocolate-treat-popular-North-Korea-workers-buying-days-wages-black-marke
>So North korea should just spend on nothing but food - and let criminals run about in the streets, have no police etc.
No, but it shows that they can trade with other countries. Many countries don't care what the US thinks.
>It's an incredibly isolated socialist state - what benefit could they possibly gain from intentionally starving their citizens - as that is what you seem to be claiming?
No, I'm saying it unintentional. It happens because their system sucks.
>falling for Vice's propaganda
>not realising Vice is owned by Murdoch
On the other hand Murdoch is a jew, which would make sympathetic to communism and the suffering of goyim. Clearly this interest out-weighs his economic self-interests.
>>75864303
>Is totalitarianism really the only way you see transition period happening?
yes - because no other system has come close to achieving socialism.
Why mention gulags? you live in the country with the highest prison population in the world, so you don't really have anything to fear.
It's as Marx said - democracy can't be bent to the use of the proletariat - as our democracies are a creation of the capitalist class (obviously communist society would be democratic - but that would be a completely different type of democracy)
>>75864403
What are you even on about lad?
The revolution was undertaken in order to start WW2 - despite it's explicitly anti-war stance?
Hah! These white devils are all going to be dead in a few years.
The EU is our best hope for an enlightened future.
>>75865096
this. the EU will give me free money
>>75856739
>Venezuela
>Working
>>75863030
rare
>>75864440
>So North korea should just spend on nothing but food
North Korea literally only developed nuclear weapons as a bargaining chip to receive copious amounts of food relief from the UN.
>It's an incredibly isolated socialist state - what benefit could they possibly gain from intentionally starving their citizens
it has less to do with their starvation being intentional, and more to do with the Jon Un family not giving a fuck about people starving to death, as is the mentality with all communist leaders.
You hate capitalism so much then why don't you fuck off to Cuba or NK? Oh wait that is right
>"they don't follow muh infallible brand of socialism that has neva ben don before"
Yet here you are defending the absolute failure of a nation state that is North Korea, blaming all of its shortcoming on the ebil capitalists.
As someone who's family fled from a communist shit hole, and has visited said shit hole, go suck dick you fat squishy shit.
>>75864488
>Name one that is not a wartorn country or in Africa.
Why should I exclude these countries? Because they make you question your own "capitalism is brilliant narrative"?
Haiti, Bangladesh, swathes of India, SE asia are all examples though.
>Then how the fuck did all those Marxist-Leninst one Party states in Africa fail? The entirety of Sub-Saharan Africa is extremely abundant in all ways, whether it comes to the farming potential or minerals, metals, oil etc,
because those countries are incredibly prone to disease and famine owing to their location - as well as US proxies waging guerilla warfare throughout the country.
>Yes, I think the poverty causes them to make the poor decision of socialism. This way they shoot themselves in the foot.
Except socalism leads to a higher standard of living for these people? Obviously you have to take technological progress into account, but come on.
Russia went from a completely backwards nation that had a famine every couple of years, with the majority of the population living in slave like conditions - to the world's second most powerful country, with pretty average living standards, in the space of 30 years.
Yet supposedly this was a "poor decision" by the people of the Soviet Union.
>>75865123
They'll give us all free shit, comrade. Then we will truly be free.
>>75863302
>USSR
>Successful
well...if you say so..
>>75865447
Stop oppressing the memory of the greatest country ever.
>>75864911
>On the other hand Murdoch is a jew, which would make sympathetic to communism and the suffering of goyim
>being this stupid
You do realise that communism would lead to this man's media empire crumbling - and that's why he opposes it with his fascist propaganda outlets dressing up as "quirky" youth media organisations?
I can't tell if this is satire or legit delusion anymore
>>75864813
>Because Communism is more beneficial than Capitalism? As Marx said - communism is inevitable -
So we only really have Marx' and Engels word for that? That's the begging the question fallacy unless you're arguing Marx was a religious leader who prophesied?
>automation will rip capitalism apart
As a computer engineer I could very easily argue how bullshit that is, I'd recommend you find a different path unless because ultimately the end result is I'd tell you to dismantle all excavation machinery and equip workers with spoons.
>Surely you want to see your ideal society come to some sort of fruition in your lifetime.
But whose ideal is that? I want a more intelligent human race, not a harder working one.
>It's extremely democratic at a local level - even if it isn't at a national one
So all the important decisions are exempt from your "dictatorship of the proletariat".... Right.
>venezeula doesn't have ideal geography by any stretch of the imagination. It has a tropical climate ffs - these countries have always struggled with food, disease, disaster etc.
Oil dude. Oil and the perfect trade opportunities for the Caribbean and southern USA. what do you define as good geography or is it just a guns germs steal platitude?
Even if, after deforestation tropical climates are great for agriculture. Sell wood one generation, wheat and beef the next.
>Also proximity to the US will work against any socialist country.
Only if they drop the "America pig disgusting" mentality. Sweden and America work fine together.
>>75865505
Are you not going to mention his rampant antisemitism? That alone should discredit his entire argument.
>>75865358
>Russia went from a completely backwards nation that had a famine every couple of years, with the majority of the population living in slave like conditions - to the world's second most powerful country, with pretty average living standards, in the space of 30 years.
Post-war economic surges are truly amazing, no?
>>75864151
>not posting the best part
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AtlxTF_SX28
>>75865563
Don't worry. The right wing is dying.
>>75865299
>North Korea literally only developed nuclear weapons as a bargaining chip to receive copious amounts of food relief from the UN.
It actually developed them as a defense mechanism against the US constantly trying to undermine their sovereignty. The development of nuclear weapons has led to much harsher sanctions being imposed on the country.
>it has less to do with their starvation being intentional, and more to do with the Jon Un family not giving a fuck about people starving to death, as is the mentality with all communist leaders.
Why do they align with communism then? Would it not be easier to open up their people to exploitation from the west and roll around in the money?
Idiot.
>>75865447
>Tsarist russia
>better than the Soviet Union
well... if you say so..
>>75862064
>The Marshall Help is stealing? How does giving monetary aid (not loans) to rebuild nearly all of Europe constitute stealing?
All gold reserves were given to the US as insurance.... No one ever got any of it back after paying back the debt.
Professional jewing right there.
communism didn't work?
were you dumb niggers sleeping? how many homogeneous non degenerate societies in East and Central Europe were created through communism.
How much degenerate tv did they have while you watched race mixing propaganda and cultural Marxism of the Jew spread through west culture.
Fuck off with your memes, it was not great but it actually accomplished the goals of /pol/ regardless what feels u have
>>75865699
Lol what a retard, even I'm not that delusional.
pic only semi-related
>>75865505
>You do realise that communism would lead to this man's media empire crumbling - and that's why he opposes it with his fascist propaganda outlets dressing up as "quirky" youth media organisations?
>>75865585
>Are you not going to mention his rampant antisemitism? That alone should discredit his entire argument.
Impressive
>>75865064
>The revolution was undertaken in order to start WW2 - despite it's explicitly anti-war stance?
>that reading comprehension
Revolution, if successful, would essentially become WW2. Even Marx realized that shitton of people would never accept unnatural and anti-human communist dogma, hence his suggestion to execute anyone trying to flee worker's paradise that is freshly-baked commie republic.
>despite it's explicitly anti-war stance?
Verbally? Yes. In practice? No, communists were never anti-war, they just exchanged "war" for "revolution" or "liberation of oppressed workers".
>The path to Germany lies trough corpse of white Poland
Rings any bells?
>>75864874
>working class will establish a vanguard
Yeah Lenin was so fucking working class wasn't he, stupid fucking commie.
>>75865649
>It actually developed them as a defense mechanism against the US constantly trying to undermine their sovereignty. The development of nuclear weapons has led to much harsher sanctions being imposed on the country
that is complete and utter bullshit because for the decades following North Korea developing a nuclear weapon they were under big brother China's protection from an American incursion.
The moment Ill got his grubby little fingers on something resembling an ICBM he went full retard and started threatening to bomb it neighbors unprovoked.
>Why do they align with communism then?
because you're a fucking dumbass who has lived a comfortable sheltered life in a first world country, never being exposed to atrocities that follow a communist uprising a regime. You fantasize and romanticize it as some form of ideal because evidently you are a complete failure in life.
shoo, communist leech, shoo
>>75865581
>So we only really have Marx' and Engels word for that? That's the begging the question fallacy unless you're arguing Marx was a religious leader who prophesied?
No, he elaborated on that point and the reasons he made it in his many works, most of which are freely available on the internet.
>As a computer engineer I could very easily argue how bullshit that is, I'd recommend you find a different path unless because ultimately the end result is I'd tell you to dismantle all excavation machinery and equip workers with spoons.
Not sure what your point is here? Do you not see that it's in the interests of the individual capitalist to automate his business i.e spend less on workers - but in the interest of the capitalist system to resists automation - as it will lead to mass unemployment, an increase in class conscioussness etc.
>But whose ideal is that? I want a more intelligent human race, not a harder working one.
In a communist society, people would work less - as we would produce what we need, rather than producing speculatively to make profit for the capitalist class. It's not the 20th century any more.
>So all the important decisions are exempt from your "dictatorship of the proletariat".... Right.
What's an "important decision"? Many of the things that affect you most relate to your employer and how they treat you. The workers democracy in the Soviet Union was unparalleled.
>Oil dude. Oil and the perfect trade opportunities for the Caribbean and southern USA. what do you define as good geography or is it just a guns germs steal platitude?
And what happened? They invested everything in oil and when the price crashed, combined with drought, the economy collapsed. That isn't some sort of communist boogeyman effect - it is because of the market economy that their economy is so fucked.
>Sweden
>socialist
hahahahaa
>>75865585
I mean yeah, obviously it does - but you sort of take that as a given on here.
>>75865608
>communism is really bad it stunts the growth of countries and hurts the people who live in them
>it's actually just as capable at growth and development as my beloved capitalist countries
>>75865923
you edgy faggots were the ones who killed all those polacy on the way to germany. wtf are you talking about you enjoyed it when they gave you right to kill. Ukraine also like to sit in kolhoz and song "Volga Volga" while everyone else did work and wait for someone else to feed them.
give Lwów back pidorashka
Face it - the days of patriarchical western society are numbered.
The socialist utopia mankind will inevitably live under is at hand - you will either accept it, or you will suffer. I don't want you to suffer, Anons. Just trust me on this one. I just know you won't regret it.
>>75866277
>just as capable at growth and development
>collapses 50 years later
Please, do tell me more.
>>75856739
>Venezuela
>North Korea
>working
>>75865923
You are conflating the capitalist war machine with the period of unrest and repression that is inevitable after a revolution.
Revolutions create power vacuums, which in turn creates counter-revolutionaries. These groups need to be crushed if you actually want to see your revolution succeed.
>>75856739
>Current Year
>China
>communism
You're such a retarded piece of shit.
>>75866000
>because you're a fucking dumbass who has lived a comfortable sheltered life in a first world country, never being exposed to atrocities that follow a communist uprising a regime. You fantasize and romanticize it as some form of ideal because evidently you are a complete failure in life.
>not being able to read
>>75856058
Hang yourself commie scum
>>75856739
Yes because all those places are so great and everyone wants to move to those shit holes paddy
>>75866431
>Collapses
So you've never heard of the cold war then?
Also, just because a nation-state came to an end, as all nation-states inevitably do, that completely invalidates all of the progress that said state was responsible for? Ok then
I suppose every nation in history that is no longer around is a failure then
>>75865738
>legislated morality
Fuck off? Besides the difficulty finding a reproduction partner with compatible morality, there is disadvantage to the individual if they're the only virtuous person alive. Contemporary philosophy includes the idea that virtue is beneficial to the self and to the other.
>>75866108
>No, he elaborated on that point ... most of which are freely available on the internet.
You're not trying to tell me to "educate myself", because that's a form of ad hominem and won't work in a serious debate.
>Not sure what your point is here?
That fearing automation is a fallacious, luddite argument completely ignorant of the (albeit non physical) jobs created by greater technology.
Furthermore, if this technology is freely available, which in libertopia of open source information and 20 year hard cut off of patents, what's to stop other capitalists using this technology to create more jobs?
>In a communist society, people would work less ... producing speculatively to make profit for the capitalist class.
If you're about people working less, then why would you be opposed to automation? Also, have you heard of supply and demand? It's far from "speculative" in your sense.
And avoid alluding to the current year as a source of an argument, it's quite infuriating.
>What's an "important decision"?
Taxation, trade deals, military decisions, high court judge assignment, the list goes on.
>And what happened? They invested everything in oil and when the price crashed, combined with drought, the economy collapsed. That isn't some sort of communist boogeyman effect - it is because of the market economy that their economy is so fucked.
Are you ignorant of their unwillingness to trade with capitalists nations? They fucked themselves. Please, research Venezuela it's a beautiful example of failed socialism. OPEC crashed the price deliberately.
>>Sweden
>>socialist
High taxes, welfare state, legislated morality, yes it's socialist, just not openly Marxist.
>>75857273
ANTIFA is a fucking joke fag
>>75866108
>And what happened? They invested everything in oil and when the price crashed, combined with drought, the economy collapsed.
Ask yourself why did they invest it all in oil? Why did all money go towards oil? Because the government directed it there. That is what socialism leads to, incompetent bureaucracy pretending they understand economics. That is how you crash an economy.
>t. Venezuelan
go fuck yourself
>>75856058
>>75856739
Why are there no communist world powers?
Oh, and you need to read the dialectic again or more likely for the first time. Communism has never even come into being. The transition from socialism to a stateless, moneyless society in which the workers collectively own the means of production has never fucking happened. There is not now, nor has there ever been an actual communist "state." Its such a batshit idea that it can't even be implemented.
>>75866543
Fucking ate my response
Point still stands
>why do they align with communism?
Because it is literally the best system tp give the Jon Un family absolute power over their country and people and literally have themselves worshiped as gods.
Communist revolutionary leaders rarely give a fuck about the ideals and care more about what they have to gain. Taking property and power from those who have it and stealing it for themselves, only to create and even worse system than they one they started with.
>>75866943
If you're going to talk about NK as if you know what you're talking about you should probably know that the family name is Kim not Jon Un.
You guys really need to not be so against the idea of socialism - just look at Denmark. Great place. Good beer. Nice people.
Is there anyone over the age of 30 that still thinks communism is viable?
>>75856739
>Venezuela
>>75866764
How did the cold war lead to the USSR's collapse? If losing proxy wars leads to collapse, shouldn't the US have collapsed after vietnam and afghanistan?
The point I am getting at is that both the US and the USSR, two states with contrary ideologies, had a boost in their post-war economies. One of them collapsed already. What does that say?
>>75867063
whatever
They're all a gaggle of fucking sociopaths that make Mao and Stalin look sane
The proletariat revolution is coming soon, comrades
>>75867085
Also not socialist, but not as bad as a capitalist nation could be.
>>75866486
>You are conflating the capitalist war machine with the period of unrest and repression that is inevitable after a revolution.
Nope, just reminding that entirety of commie movement hinged upon dictatorship of party leaders and armed expansion under variety of pretenses.
>Revolutions create power vacuums, which in turn creates counter-revolutionaries. These groups need to be crushed if you actually want to see your revolution succeed.
And definition of counter-revolutionary is more loose than Tchaikovsky's asshole, thus leaving revolutionary vanguard had ample authority to crush just about anyone.
It's no big surprise that this vanguard inevitably refused to relinquish power and property ownership to the common people or comply with demands of those nasty worker's councils.
>>75866824
>You're not trying to tell me to "educate myself", because that's a form of ad hominem and won't work in a serious debate.
I'm saying that you can read Marx if you want to understand his ideas. Or you can choose not to. Whatever, you just seemed interested.
>That fearing automation is a fallacious, luddite argument completely ignorant of the (albeit non physical) jobs created by greater technology.
You completely misunderstand me. I welcome it completely - not only will it precipitate the downfall of capitalism - it will produce a much more desirable communist society.
>Taxation, trade deals, military decisions, high court judge assignment, the list goes on.
yes, things which we have no contorl over in our current society either. Socialism paves the way for communism, the only system in which people actually have control over these things.
>Are you ignorant of their unwillingness to trade with capitalists nations?
No, I'm not. But market forces are what caused them to invest in oil way beyond the needs of their own country.
>High taxes, welfare state, legislated morality, yes it's socialist, just not openly Marxist.
That's called social democracy mate. Completely different thing. Can't be arsed arguing semantics though - call it what you like - no one in Sweden believes they live in a truly socialist country - no one who identifies as a socialist believes Sweden is a socialist country.
>>75866844
And why did the government direct it there pal?
Perhaps because market forces demanded it.
Do you think a capitalist Venezuela would have not exploited the massive natural resource sitting under their feet, despite the fact that capitalism is entirely based on exploitation of labour and resources
>>75856739
>venezuela.
Didn't Maduro just recently advertise Bernie boy if the world is fair? kek.
>>75866943
Except they would have far more property and power if they were the dictators of a capitalist state.
>I hate those darn capitalists
>let's do everything they did, except worse
>>75866824
>Fuck off? Besides the difficulty finding a reproduction partner with compatible morality, there is disadvantage to the individual if they're the only virtuous person alive. Contemporary philosophy includes the idea that virtue is beneficial to the self and to the other.
Wtf? Because all of this bullshit has worked in western society? Like even alittle? Nope. Western society has only raised the flag of multiculturalism.
Fucking quit cucking Jesus and look out your fucking window.
>>75867136
It says that the US won the cold war. It did this because it is an imperalist nation that has very favorable geography, colonised and exploited the vast majority of the world to meet its own ends, and has an incredibly vast, sophisticated and brutal secret service dedicated to crushing socialism and dissent.
>>75867183
"All these powerful leaders are clearly lunatic murderers who somehow took the reigns of world superpowers"
How about looking beyond sensationalist american media for the truth.
>>75867208
Wouldn't argue against either of these points.
I wholeheartedly believe that this is the way forward.
Why is a dictatorship formed in the interests of the working man worse than our current ones formed in the interests of the capitalist class?
Smells like commieshit in this thread
>>75867183
Mao had some good things to say about liberalism though.
>>75867183
>>75868082
https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/mao/selected-works/volume-2/mswv2_03.htm
Venezuela's Maduro backs Sanders
http://edition.cnn.com/2016/06/01/politics/bernie-sanders-donald-trump-nicolas-maduro-venezuela/
>>75856058
Awful lot of SJW shilling tonight.
>>75856739
Ok this thread is definitely just bait for bait sake.
>>75868067
that's what happens to sjw in a real communist society, try that with your "democracy" and "virtues" and protecting the minority rights etc jew lead capitalist society
>don't you see? the capitalists will seize all power
>we can only prevent this by seizing all power
someone explain how it was a failure.
1. created non degenerate societies
2. created homogeneous societies
3. did not flood europe with immigrants
4. closed mosques especially in afgan, repressed islam
how was this shit a failure, prove me wrong pro tip you can't
>>75867466
>I'm saying that you can read Marx if you want to understand his ideas. Or you can choose not to. Whatever, you just seemed interested.
I am always interested, I'm one of those guys that gets a dopamine rush from learning. I've read some Marxism, I actually read either Das Kapital or the manifesto in high school. I was once a Marxist, which is why I find it ironic that a policy distantly descendent from it, affirmative action, has caused me so much pain. When you're scoring better than the woman of colour but she found a job so much faster... Or when 90% of your callbacks are from men when less than 40% of the HR industry are men... Look, most people don't believe me, they don't want to believe me, but I've been negatively affected by Marx, albeit in a very round about way.
Of course I have an opposition to him and his followers, without him I'd be judged by my merit alone rather than my olive skin, big nose and Germanic surname.
>You completely misunderstand me. I welcome it completely - not only will it precipitate the downfall of capitalism - it will produce a much more desirable communist society.
Only via syndicalism, which at its best is an extreme preference for small business. My main appeal of this system is how I believe it would lead to job vacancies rather than unemployment. This naturally prioritizes employees over employers.
This is still capitalism though, it's just competitive to the point that everyone gets a chance to succeed, not just classes a Marxist sociology professor says are.
>yes, things which we have no contorl over in our current society either.
Hardly, do you vote for your federal government?
>market forces are what caused them to invest in oil way beyond the needs of their own country.
Their anticapitalist sentiment is what made the logistics of this investment impossible. Seriously, look up what Zeihan has to say about the Venezuelan oil trade, if that doesn't convince you the us and them attitude of Marxism is cancer.
>>75862968
>When you don't listen to Farage's points because "he's a bigot"
You lefties never change. Never direct arguments, always nothing but empty rhetoric to humiliate the other side.
I hope we purge you.
>>75867902
>How about looking beyond sensationalist american media for the truth.
100+ million killed in the 20th century isn't enough?
Go live in Cuba for a month or two
See how the Government talks about the United States having no roads or working electricity as walk barefoot through demolished streets and lose power after 7 pm.
Eat a dick limey
>>75867583
Capitalist Venezuela would have (since it never existed), at the bare minimum, shifted some funds into maintaining the infrastructure surrounding the oil industry. That at least leads to consistent profits, basic capitalism.
Communist Venezuela (the one that exist) did not spend the money on the infrastructure. The money went to welfare programs to garner support, or into the pockets of Chavez's favorite nephews.
You know nothing of Venezuela, do not pretend you do. All the shit that is going on in venezuela can be directly linked to Chavez and his socialist agenda. The typical socialist crap of bread lines, food shortages, and no FUCKING TOILET PAPER.
Fuck you stop ruining countries you communist pig
>>75862626
Wasn't there a 20/1 ratio between soviet and German deaths?
The soviets just didn't give a fuck about thier people.
>>75868560
this meme again about how many billions the communists killed.
>>75868385
>someone explain how it was a failure
It created exactly what capitalists desire. A society in which
>borders do not exist
>nationalities are repressed
>a central power holds all authority
Communism is what we Germans call "Trickbetrug", roughly translated it means "trick fraud".
>>75868946
Capitalism and communism are the exact same thing, so all your points are moot
>>75867838
>It says that the US won the cold war.
It also says that USSR had inferior economy. Not only that, but the fact that ~proletariat~ was disarmed and isolated from making any sort of critical decisions was final nail in the USSR's coffin - they either didn't want to defend failed regime, or simply had no means\skills to do anything at all.
>>75868052
>Why is a dictatorship formed in the interests of the working man worse than our current ones formed in the interests of the capitalist class?
Because interest of the working man is often at odds with interest of ruling class. I highly doubt that it was in interests of working man to abolish family, give up children or getting dragged into WW2 while his family lives in shitty conditions. Hence the abolition of soviets, suppression campaigns, etc..
>>75869029
two sides of the same shekel.
>>75862739
ABLOO ABLOO
Real socialism has never been truly implemented!
ABLOO ABLOO
ebil probaganda made everyone leave!
You guys are worse than dindus with your excuses
>>75868811
You fags love changing history.
First it was the holocaust creation.
Now Stalin DINDU NUFFIN
Road of bones, that is all.
Bodies are still literally in the road thanks to that brutal regime.
Fucking commie cucks.
>>75869127
Well he did do one thing right. Mass murdering Jews, something Hitler could've done desu.
>>75862878
Don't cut yourself on that edge
>>75869082
Couldn't have said it better myself.
>>75856988
Fuck off schlomo
>>75861402
>ISIS is making threats/attacks that will make western countries act in their own rational self interest.
>The migrant crisis is caused by the syrian conflict, the migration having occured started long before the syrian conflict, and the vast majority of migrants not being syrian
Wow, Soros is fucking retarded.
>>75869233
Yeah, he mass murdered the very same jews he exploited to push communist agenda in the first place.
What a nice man.
Killing his own brethren.
>>75863018
>>75868811
>this historical revision
you don't deserve to live in this country
>>75861402
>behave 'irrationally'
Apparently lefties think fight or flight is irrational.
Literally cucks. They think the rational way of thinking is to let themselves be murdered.
WHAT.
obligatory aus shitpost
>>75856058
Try. Please leftifucks. Try it. Start your "redrevolution". I can't wait to give away little lead-presents.
https://youtu.be/BYquuFjE0cc
>>75868463
Wrong. The attempt to reconcile Marxism with capitalism has led to the unsavoury features of liberal, social-democratic society that you describe. In a society that was actually founded on Marxist principles, rather than borrowing them where convenient - there would be no discrimination - "from each according to his means"
>>75868560
>le communism killed billions
Fuck off propagandist shill. Imagine if every death due to starvation in Africa was attributed to the capitalist system that fails to provide them with the fundamentals of life
>>75869640
not my country faggot.
there is no revision, yes they had boarders faggots. not like you could go to another region without signing paperwork or without a passport.
you are the dumbest group of niggers on earth and cannot accept that communism accomplished everything you dream of.
no more sjw, no more immigration, no degenerate tv, no fee movement of people, no more multiculturalism
list goes on and on fags, keep sucking jew cock, capitalism is a pyramid scheme with jew on top
>>75860562
I guess that's why the USSR armed Israeli foes and all lefties support Palestine
>>75860710
>LGBT flag
Bourgeois, next.
>>75861041
Transgender people are a capitalist phenomenon. It's profitable so corporations push social liberalism. Socialism has nothing to do with liberal identity politics.
>>75862321
I'm not a Trotskyist. He's an authoritarian twat like your precious glorious vanguard leaders.
>>75868632
>welfare programs to garner support
top kek
Maybe people support a party that provides welfare, because people enjoy the benefits of welfare?
Such a leap of logic might be beyond you.
>>75870907
It's still redistribution bro.
It's still class warfare bullshit.
Fuck you, it's still Marxist and if you agree it's not fair, maybe you're not a Marxist? Maybe the best way of distributing each according to his means in the fairest way is the free market?
In my opinion, we're all Marxist... Until we actually experience Marxism.
>>75868859
boarded didn't exist lol fucking retarded, yeah you used to be able to walk around all over without anyone asking for your passport or documentation
nigger please, you had to fill out so much paperwork to move or travel it was unreal lol
no boarder, what about the Berlin Wall.
Top kek Achmed
>>75869032
>Not only that, but the fact that ~proletariat~ was disarmed and isolated from making any sort of critical decisions was final nail in the USSR's coffin
Yes - the ussr was came under the leadership of a series of revisionist, liberal leaders who had no program for the institution of a communist society, and for whom capitalism was the logical "next step" as it allowed them to exploit people without having to conform to a troublesome socialist ideology.
>>75868859
"repressed" lol fucking sjw someone should check the kremlins privilege.
holy shit, they complained about repressed nationalities and gays were repressed. all that shit is another word for "minorities". oh please ussr repressed minorities oh fuck lol hahahahahahah
nigger please take your sjw bullshit elsewhere "repressed nationalism" top kek
>>75869640
Always interested to see what happens when some idiot capitalist is presented with actual facts and figures that combat his incredibly biased view of the world
>>75869330
>>75857794
>>75862533
>If I ignore all those restrictions set up by the government, suddenly Nazi-Germany becomes capitalist, how weird!
National Socialism worked, but failed due to external pressures and Hitler thinking he could take on the world.
>>75856739
>North Korea
>Venezuela
>Blacks are still around, therefore they are superior :^)
>>75862253
>We can't feed our population
>Let's invest in research for nuclear bombs and buy lots of weaponry, that'll fix the problem :^)
>Let's give our glorious leader everything he wants, that'll fix the problem :^)
Admit it. In the real world, every attempt at communism WILL eventually turn into a totalitarian socialist government, as history perhaps anecdotally proves.
>inb4 anecdotal evidence
>ignoring how went wrong due to human sin time and time again
>thinking it'll work this time
>>75871137
>not a trot
>not a marxist-Leninist
What are you then? Some fucking meme socialist who has no idea how to implement his ideas?
>>75871105
This right here
This is the post of someone who has been given more opportunity to succeed than 90 percent of all other people in the world have, and is still a miserable fucking failure.
My family came to this country to escape a communist shit hole in the 50's without a dime to their name.
My grandparents worked multiple jobs, as did my parents so that I can have a better life. I am going to college now working on a masters, my cousins have a college education and have nearly half a million saved up from their careers.
There is so much opportunity and this country, and I thank God every day that I was able to be born here.
It may not be the perfect system but it is infinitely better than any communist hell hole that has ever tainted this earth with it presence.
>>75871250
Ugh
Yes, we are separated by class.
Marx never advocated these petty and contradictory measures of redistributing tiny amounts of wealth and privilege - he advocated a complete abolition of the class system.
You know, to stop this "class warfare" bullshit that you hate so much. As does every communist, hence their support for communism
Attention all traitor Degenerates!
tinychat/thirdxposition is a politically partisan room for serious discussion about history, science, politics, religion, and also general philosophy.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_Position
The founder of this room is a believer in third position ideology and third position movements and seeks to make this a space for people with similar beliefs to discuss current affairs and historical events from that perspective. People with other viewpoints who disagree with Third position ideologies will be tolerated if they express themselves in a civil and respectful manner. Only Third positionists will be allowed to steer the discussion and if they are not interested in discussing a subject raised by a non-Third Positionist then those topics will not be discussed in this room.
This room is for the discussion of serious subjects in a serious manner. People that detract from that objective will be excluded.
(Guidelines)
1. Be relevant;
2. Be civil;
3. Respect others' turn to speak;
4. Do NOT hog the mic, everyone should get their turn;
5. No nudity;
6. Keep promiscuity to a minimum;
7. Do NOT mute other participants in the chat;
8. NO open mic.
http://pastebin.com/QpuSKWUW
>>75871659
>facts and figures
>sources from old soviet census
yeah ok
Even the soviets were keep the mass starvation of their farmers secrete their general population
>>75871964
Hilarious that you claim some sort of intimate knowledge of communism because your distant relatives once lived under a communist system 60 years ago.
They moved to the United States and made money by exploiting the labour of others. Your family are capitalist cunts who were dissatisfied with communism because it made them lead normal lives instead of lording over their subjects
READ GROVER FURR
READ GROVER FURR
READ GROVER FURR
READ GROVER FURR
READ GROVER FURR
READ GROVER FURR
>>75872437
>family lived in communism
>realized it was shit
>but here comes little britfag, raised in capitalist country, telling them that it was the best
kek
>exploiting the labour of others
Or they worked and got promoted, which wouldn't happen in a purely communist nation.
>normal lives
You mean being forced to forever be part of the proletariat when you can achieve more? Yeah you're right, that's definitely something bad :^)
>>75872437
it's actually imperialism and atomizing liberalism that made them do that
>>75872437
white leftist kids get so flustered when they meet someone with any connection to the realities of Communism
>>75872126
>why would I trust sources from the actual country when I could listen to American propaganda propagating the individual testimony of imperialist clerks like Robert conquest?
>>75856058
commies get out reeeeeeeee
>In their discussions philosophers like to evoke not only historical events but also the categories with which we interpret these events. Today, what is the category with which Stalin is interpreted? That of bloodthirsty madness. This category has already been used against Robespierre, against the Revolution of 1848, against the Paris Commune, but never against war, or against Louis XVI, or against the Girondins or Napoleon. Regarding the twentieth century, we have psychopathological studies of Lenin, Stalin, Trotsky, Mao, but not, for example, of Churchill. However, all of the Bolshevik leaders spoke up against colonial expansionism, while Churchill wrote: "War is a game at which one should smile." Then there was the carnage of the First World War. The Bolshevik leadership group, including Stalin, was against this carnage, but Churchill said again: "War is the greatest game in world history, here I play with the highest stakes, war is the sole acute sensation of our lives." So why the psychopathological approach in the one case and not in the other?
>>75872437
>They moved to the United States and made money by exploiting the labour of others
Really? Working as janitors was exploiting labors of others? Neither one of my parents or grandparents ever owned their own company or coorportation, so try again.
> Your family are capitalist cunts who were dissatisfied with communism because it made them lead normal lives instead of lording over their subjects
The communist regime killed members of my family you worthless sack of bile.
You are just as much a failure as the other anon I called you.
You aren't getting anywhere in life because the ebil capitalist are keeping you down, its because you are a lazy worthless blight on society. Your kind would be the first to get shoot in the back by the commissar over "questioning loyalty".
>>75873125
>muh american propaganda
>this soviet propaganda is much more accurate
Anti-communism sensationalism has been present in the US since the 80's
anyone with half a functioning brain understands its is a failed system that leads to autocratic regimes that give no fucks about personal freedom or the value of human life.
Trying to re write history doesn't make you right.
>>75872080
>Third position
Is a lie.
The cake is a lie.
We might be forced to adhere to spectrums to some degree in order to get humanity to move in one way or another.
Most are too stupid to allow logical engineering of ideologies.
>>75856058
Bread lines were very good.
The holodomor never happened and is a fascist lie
>>75860613
Viva la Republica!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-tvG7R3Rs2M
>>75865699
No one said that you stupid faggot. What was said though is that the USSR failed to do the one thing it set out to do: liberate the working class. Instead it reduced them to drones with no aspirations, each living in the same dull flat while stalin and his comrades sipped champagne by the poolside. Quite like the tsar wouldn't you say?
>>75874375
it actually did liberate the working class, that's why it was assailed on all sides by the real champagne sippers in the west
fuck off trot, full communism or no communism
>>75872941
Your connection is as big as mine.
In fact it's less - you clearly have no knowledge of the subject.
But apparently the testimony of a couple of individuals - from some unspecified - source, is far more credible than all the documented evidence in the world because "muh family"
>>75871964
Nobody has to even claim intimate knowledge of communism to know it is dogshit because it is and has been a fucking failure every time it is tried. The ENTIRE WORLD has SEEN it fail again and again.
You fucking faggots larping a failed idea of government to try and look edgy. There is a reason people talk shit about communism - because it WAS and IS shit. If you love the idea so much, go there. Go to North Korea, Go to China,Laos,Vietnam, wherever. Go there and live a happy life. The rest of the world won't miss your existence.
>>75871964
>came in the 50s to escape communism.
i am now a #cruisemissile
my family came in the early nineties after "capitalism" ruined the entire ducking country.
>>75874718
Who says I'm disagreeing with you?
>>75873509
>my family didn't exploit anyone's labour
How are they millionaires then laddo?
Working as janitors was it?
Please at least name the country, can't really make any comment until you do that.
>we have been fed propaganda for years
>but it's obviously correct guys!
Maybe you think it's "obviously the truth" because you've been fed this shite your whole life.
People in North Korea think it's an "obvious truth" the the kims rule by some divine mandate and are brilliant people. Are they right because it's "obvious"?
>>75874375
And exactly like our current society.
So what's the problem?
>>75873789
I remember that shit starting after everything fell apart not before
>>75874945
no, not you, the idiot that replied to you.
>>75875014
that isn't the problem really the problem is origins of private property
>>75874718
>Africa is a paradise
>Haiti: great holiday destination
>Bangladesh: workers paradise
>>75875014
>Please at least name the country
Cuba
I have visited it, and its is an absolute shithole
>Maybe you think it's "obviously the truth" because you've been fed this shite your whole life.
>pic related
You western neo-communists are like spoiled children begging to put your hand on the hot stove your parents told you not to touch.
As I said, go live in a communist country for a few years, you won't last a week
>>75868811
Literally remember the 60 million!
Soviet Union faked its own death toll in the WW2. It wasn't 20 but over 50 million Soviets.
And even that is not enough.
>>75856058
Left=communism? At least you're honest.
>>75875014
>How are they millionaires then laddo?
>Working as janitors was it?
My grandparents worked as janitors and other odd jobs
My uncle became an engineer that worked for Motorola, my aunt works as an optometrist in UM
My cousin is an accountant.
My family nucleus doesn't make as much because my father never went to collage, just straight to the work force and my mother accepted a lower paying a job so she can watch after me and me siblings when we were younger.
We aren't millionaires either
but we are well off compared to were we started.
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/28/world/americas/venezuela-economic-government-collapse.html?_r=0
Since I am sure you "communists" will call the article propaganda, go take a stroll to Venezuela and let us know how the glorious world of communism is doing.
Go ahead, I dare you to.
>>75875443
Maybe it looks like a shithole because you live in one of the most privileged countries in the world.
Ever been to the capitalist paradise that is Haiti.
Your economic system doesn't start and end at your borders you fucking idiot. Go to anywhere in Africa and you wouldn't last a week.
>>75876209
Of course Venezuela is a shithole. No one would deny that.
That doesn't change the fact that that article is propaganda.
Funny how much press Venezuela gets despite the suffering that goes on in glorious capitalist countries on a daily basis.
Almost like the media are trying to force a certain narrative, which all you "alt-right" "mavericks" swallow up, just like your servile parents before you.
>>75875591
that isn't even fucking possible.
>>75876282
>Maybe it looks like a shithole because you live in one of the most privileged countries in the world.
Gee billy I wonder why the US is so privileged, it wonder if it could be because of the success it has had with the capitalist system it has had for fucking centuries
>Ever been to the capitalist paradise that is Haiti.
you mean the country that has dictators that kept the local population under the control under the threat of "voodoo" magic?
top laugh
>Your economic system doesn't start and end at your borders you fucking idiot. Go to anywhere in Africa and you wouldn't last a week
the African continent is literally torn apart by civil wars over ethnic conflicts caused by the creation of nation states by former European colonizers that drew up borders that gave zero fucks about ethnic and language barriers. The fact that Africans are all a bunch of violent retards with an average iq of 60 doesn't help.
I don't see how this supports your anti-capitalist rhetoric, how is Angola doing now compared to lets say South Africa?
>>75876282
also
>Maybe it looks like a shithole
Faggot it is a shithole
maybe if you actually got off your fat pasty ass and left your cozy little island and visited the non-tourist areas you would fucking know.
>>75877051
could be that the USA is in an advantageous position to exploit the global labor market with its access to both Asian and European markets while having little competition in Latin America.
Yet, this country still is shit, can't buy real food.
You think chosing McDonald's or Burger King is down sign of fucking freedom. There isn't shit here but broken roads, Xbox and gmo food. Shit food, shit cars, shit roads, shit healthcare.
Don't kid yourself that you live eoth such privilege you don't
So privilege #blessed cause I have an Xbox live account
>>75876525
It may come as a surprise to you, but there is suffering everywhere on the planet.
But where is the glorious idealism of communism in Venezuela? I get it, that wasn't REAL communism, right?
Yes, media boogeymen are everywhere, only socialism tells the truth! Ask North Korea about their media, they will tell you Kim Jong-Un invented fire.
The bottom line is if you love communism and think it's wonderful, go live it. Far away from people with common sense.
>>75877051
>>75877051
>voodoo magic
>>75877440
>Yet, this country still is shit, can't buy real food.
>You think chosing McDonald's or Burger King is down sign of fucking freedom. There isn't shit here but broken roads, Xbox and gmo food. Shit food, shit cars, shit roads, shit healthcare.
Wow look at all the strawmen
Yes because in the US you are forced to only eat fast food
I don't eat either, but then again I'm a health nut
Don't like a company? don't buy its product
>>75877745
the food is entirely genetically modified and crap. you can't buy anything else here but low quality food, i don't think people in america even know what real food tastes like
>>75877051
So let me get this straight.
When a socialist country fails, it's because "muh communism is evil" and no more serious debate or discourse is required.
When a capitalist country fails, it's "well actually there are many complex reasons relating to the ethnic and religious history of the area" etc etc.
Also "oh by the way Africa's shit because of colonialism". Colonialism that's directly caused by capitalism?
>>75877506
I really, really can't stress how ironic it is, that your claims that "north Koreans believe that Kim Jong in invented fire" is in fact a complete invention by your own propagandist media that seeks to discredit North Korea for resisting American imperialism.
>>75871820
I believe in socialism like in the Paris Commune or 1930s Catalonia. Syndicalism and market socialism are also appealing for overcoming the problems of Leninist/Trotskyist/Stalinist states, where the party becomes authoritarian and ossified.
>>75878085
>the food is entirely genetically modified and crap. you can't buy anything else here but low quality food
Oh, I'm sorry capitalism made you fat
I'm 6'2" 220 lbs with 15 percent body and have lived in the US my whole life
I'm sure you'd lose weight if we implement communist style weekly rations
>>75878116
>When a socialist country fails, it's because "muh communism is evil" and no more serious debate or discourse is required.
When a socialist country collapses because its economy goes to shit over its retarded socialist policies then yes, yes it is.
>When a capitalist country fails, it's "well actually there are many complex reasons relating to the ethnic and religious history of the area" etc etc.
>country breaks out in civil war over ethnic conflic/religious disgreement/ dictator takes control
>this is clearly the fault of capitalism
Do you fucking faggots even analysis the idiocy you spew? comparing apples to oranges
>correlation=causation
No wonder you are all a bunch of failures
>lso "oh by the way Africa's shit because of colonialism". Colonialism that's directly caused by capitalism?
Except the "capitalist" imperial nations did not collapse or suffer from its action in Africa, only the former colonies were falling is disarray.
also
>capitalism is to blame for the actions of a government controlled by a monarchy
reminder
communism created more homogeneous, culturally stable, societies than capitalism ever did after ww2. all of the based countries were communist and immune to jewish capitalis
>>75878887
you just don't get it, the food isn't healthy.
look at how they raise chicken pumping full of hormone or your cows, and the chemicals they put into the food.
milk doesn't even taste like milk. bread can last for weeks and weeks without spoiling, it's completely unnatural.
doesn't matter how many calories, everything in the USA is shit food, wouldn't even feed to animals
>>75878887
>Except the "capitalist" imperial nations did not collapse or suffer from its action in Africa, only the former colonies were falling is disarray.
Wow. It's almost as if the western nations were the exploiters, and the Africans were exploited.
>monarchy
Fuck off you clueless cunt, the British empire was entirely driven by the capitalist class. You know, the East India company and all that shit you idiots fail to educate yourself about.
>>75865738
>communism created eastern europe and worked
Hmm its quite great to still be a 2nd world country and thanks to communism have millions of dead white babies for pushed abortion not only that it killed so many innocent people and gave people shit condition to live in and had idiotic dictator cults like if they were demigods
>made us homogeneous
Deporting germans to germany doesnt mean all peoples were deported aswell to their homecountry
What do commies think of Japan, South Korea, and Singapore
>>75879355
American proxy states.
Neo-liberal politics have been exported to these countries, destroying any sort of progressive tradition or national sovereignty that they had.
They are so reliant on US imperialism that Japan daren't even demand an apology for their innocent citizens who America literally nuked.
>>75879209
>Wow. It's almost as if the western nations were the exploiters, and the Africans were exploited.
Yes that is correct, your point?
The Europeans came to Africa with better weapons, and better tactics and conquered. Just as nations have always done since the dawn of civilization
You are going to pretend the Soviets did not exploit the shit out of its satellite states?
Taking all the crops harvested by Ukrainians to the point of starvation
Extensively using Kazakhstan as nuclear test site to the point where it is the most irradiated country on earth today?
Draining the Aral sea to mass produce cotton?
>Fuck off you clueless cunt, the British empire
>the British were the only imperial power
if it wasn't evident already that you are a self-centered little bitch
>>75879507
You mean wildly successful, beautiful, and vibrant countries that are completely fucking awesome and smart enough to know, 'hey, war is war and we went pretty overboard. No apology necessary, we understand'.
