athiesm
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Anyone else totally enjoy arguing with athiests? Engineering student here and I totally get a kick out of totally destroying all atheists in argument in my university. They are usually liberal arts majors so pretty much can't hold an argument.
Anyone else totally enjoy arguing with christcucks? Engineering student here and I totally get a kick out of totally destroying all christcucks in argument in my university. They are usually fat americans or dirty niggers so pretty much don't even know what an argument is.
>>71613284
>engineering student
>being a christianfag
you'll remain virgin but not because of your religion
>>71613284
Usually. Probably not a good thing to take pleasure in other people's failures though. I don't know how to shake the value.
>>71613377
There are an infinite number of ways to articulate origin theories. But don't worry. It just *HAS* to be a naturalistic one.
also
>athiesm
>>71613284
Lawyer here. Atheist neckbeards only argument is literally 'why can't here appear infront of me right now!'
>Atheism goes hand in hand with Jewish controlled degeneracy
>>71613551
>There are an infinite number of ways to articulate origin theories
Name one that isn't Darwin's. Go on, I want to laugh at you.
>>71613588
>lawyer here
totally relevant to the argoment you wagecuck
>>71613605
Omphalos hypothesis.
It's still a set belief, which is retarded.
>>71613673
>argoment
I knew Atheists are poorly educated but wow
>>71613719
The more retarded belief holder is the one that shifts from the correct one to the wrong one for the sake of claiming they're dynamic.
>>71613674
>God created the world in the last 10k years
This is why nobody takes you Godcuck rednecks seriously.
>>71613787
I think it's retarded to follow any and even more so to think a certain one is the correct one.
>>71613840
The fact that you can only spout empty rhetoric without formulating any kind of real criticism isn't something that surprises me coming from a third-worlder. You do all seem to be so invariably inarticulate and dogmatic.
>>71613605
>Darwin
>Origin
When, where, and how did Darwinism try to explain the origin of anything besides the varying sub-species of animals, and fundamental biology?
>>71613840
>eng student
>redneck
Serbian "engineers" arent real engineers
>>71613674
LOL... this old trickster god, he is just testing our faith with dinosaur bones.
Such a shame no holy book nor prophet nor angel mentions this ever.
Nice try though. It basically proves that you don't know what argument is.
>>71613870
>I think it's retarded to follow any
And yet you do, making you and everyone else a retard. Congrats.
Here, this is an irrefutable proof that YOUR god doesn't exist.
Atheists: pure win
Religioncucks: 0
>>71613963
There's nothing tricky about creating matter in motion. In fact, it's necessary for the Creation account to hold. "Let there be light" - and there was. Ex nihilo.
>>71613979
I don't follow any. Clearly you do since you're getting so worked up about it.
>>71614032
>pure win
>doesnt win
cringing at ur life desu
>>71614094
So you don't believe your hand is attached to your arm, or that I or anyone else is a real person?
>>71613947
>and that therefore no evidence that we can see of the presumed age of the earth and universe can be taken as reliable
From Jewpedia. So yeah, conveniently disregard hard evidence you don't like in order to further your narrative. How are you different than SJWs? Pro-tip: you're not.
>>71613958
>eng student
So a barista with a worthless degree? Sure showed me.
>Serbian "engineers" arent real engineers
There's actually a pretty high demand for them in Austria, Germany, US etc.
t. engineer who'll be working in the US next year
>>71614032
>This is an atheists burden of proof
>>71614070
Oh, I see you made a basic mistake, god actually must have said (pic related) as totally must have been written in your book, right?
I mean, god wouldn't lie to you, right?
>>71614142
What is "hard evidence"? Why should anyone be a physicalist/materialist/empiricist/naturalist?
>>71614228
I'm a professional cowboy and I use catheters. Been cowboyin' for 25 years. I've had 14 broken bones, 2 concussions and a punctured lung. I know pain and I don't want any more of it. Especially when I cath.
>>71614228
>must have
Really? God *must* have done something? And how do you determine that?
>>71614109
Than't not an argument, silly religioncuck =D
>>71614032
>God isn't real based on your feelings
No wonder atheists only find friends in SJWs
>>71614159
Atheists have no burden of proof - they aren't out to prove that something exists. The burden of proof remains, as it always has, with those who assert its existence. An atheist would not even have a stake in the argument if those who assert this existence did not do so.
This is instead an atheist's appeal to rationality.
>>71614231
>What is "hard evidence"?
Back to Tumblr, relativist.
>>71614159
> I don't have to prove negative
> Christcucks provided no evidence what-so-ever for their claims in 2000 years
Do you even logic?
It is so funny when stupid christians talk about proofs and arguments all the while they don't even know what those words mean.
Truly, for if they knew they wouldn't be religiouscucks.
Argument not an
>>71613963
That's a straw man, and I don't even know what half of these big words mean.
Either way once trump is elected we are going to build a fucking wall.
Atheists are so thin-skinned. Theists at least believe they will be proven right someday, and can handle criticism. Atheists know they will never get the satisfaction of being "proven" right, which is why they desperately try to beat theists in arguments, because they will never really be satisfied with theological discourse.
So they congregate in their atheist hugboxes, get their "deserved" affirmation for their virtue signaling, and shaming the oh so evil presence of organized religion. However, their ego getting stroked isn't enough. They want the satisfaction of seeing hope leave the eyes of theists like it left their's. They can't let other people be happy, they have to try to make them as miserable as they are so they don't feel left out. In the end, theists are usually pretty alright with not talking about their faith, or trying to convince anyone they are right.
Christians debate this topic, but most I meet think that the only requirement to get into heaven is being a good person. They don't want to argue for the most part. They show restraint, and patience, and want others to know that Christ loves them despite their non-belief. Atheists literally have a problem with this.
>>71614264
>>71614261
>>71614276
No arguments what so ever... well, I'm not even a bit surprised and I called it at the beginning or the thread...
> "muh doooog..."
> every religiouscuck ever
Why?
>>71614331
I'm a moral absolutist - I'm as far from a relativist as you can possibly be. You can't define evidence though.
Determine for me if the following premises are evidence for the claim that comes after it.
p1) There is a perfectly clam shaped indention in the sand
p2) A clam whose shell perfectly matches that indention sits very close to that indention
p3) You believe you saw the clam in that indention, and that you moved the clam from that indention to where it now sits
------
c) The clam shaped indention is evidence of a clam having been there
>>71614510
Atheists might give a few less fucks if our Congresspersons would knock off proposing marginalizing bills based on Muh Emotions backed by a very flawed compilation of stories.
>>71614510
We have be proven right time and time again... the fact that you ignore it has no effect on that.
For exmple when holy mary came to earth and thousand saw a sun disappear? Remember that? She promised the conversion of russia and unified church.
Either it wad a fake or holy mother lied. Both means your religion is fake.
>>71614526
I'm making a very obvious argument, you inarticulate bad-English speaking Finn. Your statement was wrong, and I'm asking you questions that will make that abundantly obvious. C'mon - make an idiot out of yourself, le tipping man.
>>71614510
>Theists at least believe they will be proven right someday, and can handle criticism. Atheists know they will never get the satisfaction of being "proven" right
Literally just a bunch of "muh feels" arguments. Godcucks once again proving themselves just a different brand of SJWs.
> In the end, theists are usually pretty alright with not talking about their faith, or trying to convince anyone they are right.
OP and the other Godcucks here show you're wrong. And a dumbass.
>Atheists literally have a problem with this.
I don't have a problem, I just view Godcucks as an infinite source of keks. I like to rustle their jimmies purely for entertainment.
>>71613588
>Atheism goes hand in hand with Jewish controlled degeneracy
>Worshipping the crucified Jew
Pic related, it is a typical deeply religious person.
>>71614663
>Literally just a bunch of "muh feels" arguments. Godcucks once again proving themselves just a different brand of SJWs.
No, my argument was trying to suggest why Atheists are thin-skinned. From an atheist's perspective, they will never have the satisfaction of being proved right.
>OP and the other Godcucks here show you're wrong. And a dumbass.
OP made a thread talking to other theists, so of course when atheists join the thread the theists who were invited are going to talk about their faiths
>I don't have a problem, I just view Godcucks as an infinite source of keks. I like to rustle their jimmies purely for entertainment.
Fair enough, I find atheists to be a source of pity
>>71613284
I used to. They tend to bore me now though. It's the same things every single time.
I made links to sources and so on over the years for pretty much every argument, but the number that actually bothered with reading anything I sent them (and I never used creationist sites, etc, because I'm not a creationist, and so on).
Now, meh.
>>71613377
>appeal to numbers
>something that was probably said by Gervais
Pekka pls don't
>>71614760
pretend there are some commas
DAILY REMINDER:
Cristianity is Cuckâ„¢: the Religion.
Joseph is the original cuck, cucked by the god himself.
In this religion, god is a bull and all his followers must prep their wifes for him and his delegates on earth - srong black alpha males.
Also - jesus is the original SJW. Every time a refugee rapes your wife, think what would jesus do? And the answer is: he would turn the other cheek.
So please respect thy neighbor, turn the other cheek and prep the bull, christcuck.
>>71614793
Please show us why yours and yours only god is the right one.
>>71614892
I avoid them, I consider myself an atheist but I can't stand the militant "Dawkins is my god and all religious people are stupid" people.
I also wouldn't mind Europe going back to it's Christian roots if it means that we don't get Islamized.
>>71614760
>OP made a thread talking to other theists
>being rustled because atheists exist
>it's OK when we do it
Hello, proto-SJW.
>I find atheists to be a source of pity
Because we're self-sufficient enough to find a meaning in our lives without a supernatural force "guiding" us or because we won't go to your imaginary friend's party when we kick the bucket?
>>71614921
That's a very simplistic way of looking at it. I expect better from you.
It's not about "only mine": it's about the one that makes the most sense.
Start from the major and go into more detail as you progress. Why would I argue that "this religion is right", if you don't believe in God? It seems counter-productive.
>>71614933
>>71614945
No arguments what so ever.
Did you guys even finished elementary?
Do you have actual elementary schools in your countries, or just bible: the basics?
>>71615013
>Because we're self-sufficient enough to find a meaning in our lives without a supernatural force "guiding" us or because we won't go to your imaginary friend's party when we kick the bucket?
I don't know, most feminists, intersectionality types, BLM members are probably atheists. But i would bet money that these people find spiritual aid in their shitty belief systems.
>>71615069
>ignore responses with substance
>responds only to tipping call outs since they hit too close to home and he doesn't have to actually defend his statements
>>71615058
How does one determine what makes the most sense when the most influential factor in selecting one's religion has proven to be synonymous with which language they make their primary one - that is, the one that most-conforms with one's upbringing and peer group ?
>>71615013
Hey pseduo-nigger. I haven't finished making you out to be the idiot low-IQ third-worlder you actually are here in public yet. Respond to >>71614563 so I can finish you off.
>>71615058
No, it is about yours and yours only. Becouse if protestans are right then catholics are wrong, even though they worship the same shit.
Also, it is not about "what makes the most sense", it is about evidence.
Are religions even making sense? Like infinite punishment for finite crime... or all hindus babys straight to purgatory for no reason, done by "loving" god... or that hte mind that conceived, planned through and created whole universe from subatomic particles to galaxy clusters is interested in my masturbation habits... or likes the smell of burnt bovine... well, if this makes sense to you then congrats, you totally shifted your mind to another dimension.
>>71615128
Which response has substance? =D
Damn people, these threads are hard on my sides...
>>71615242
>evidence
Lmao. >>71614563
So what happens when masochists and brain dead people go to hell? Not an argument just a serious question. If I'm in a coma and I die, am I still in a coma in hell/heaven? Or what if I suffer a traumatic accident and become retarded, do I go to heaven/hell in my deficient state? Or do I revert back to a previous state? How do people who are unable to experience pain or emotions go through suffering in hell, and do people who feel less pain than others get an unfair advantage? What are the properties of heaven and hell, and how does the Bible answer all these questions?
>>71615270
>>71614659
>>71615274
What denomination are you senpai?
>>71615288
What do masochists have to do with anything? And are you talking about brain dead their whole lives?
>>71615312
Non.
>>71615109
>I don't know, most feminists, intersectionality types, BLM members are probably atheists
And yet their modus operandi relies on "muh feels" and conveniently ignoring truths they don't like/don't fit the narrative. These are the exact traits you can observe in this very thread from people defending religion.
In other words, feminists, BLM folk etc. are not atheists. They're very religious, they just have a religion of their own which isn't Christianity.
Is there a more pathetic insect than the atheist?
>>71613284
Bahnsen destroyed atheists
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bL6Vmzk56Uc
>>71613284
I believe in god but jesus is a massive cuck, a jewish sect who flourish in the death of rome no more
>>71615333
Ew. Non-demon is the worst. People who say they have no tradition have their own traditions.
>>71615354
The Moslem.
>>71615408
I wouldn't know what those traditions would be, since I'm sola Scriptura.
>>71615323
If a masochist goes to hell wouldn't their mental state provide pleasure over suffering, thus negating the idea of it being punishment? And I'm wondering in both cases, actually id like concrete answers for each individual case and question listed. Thanks.
>>71614563
>I'm a moral absolutist
Yet you apply relativism to the scientific method. Making you a complete and utter fucking imbecile.
>Determine for me if the following premises are evidence for the claim that comes after it.
It's inconclusive, which is why I'd look for more evidence and try to form more premises. See, not so hard, is it, you dumb monkey? Now show me some evidence, however you want to define it, of Earth being 10k years old. I want to laugh some more, it's like watching a chimp in the zoo.
>>71615334
I'm not talking about religion though. I'm talking about theism. I consider progressivism to be an atheistic religion.
>>71615458
You would you say you're Protestant? Also do you think Roman Catholics and Eastern Orthodox are orthodox Christian?
I usually call myself a skeptic, if anyone asks. (secular society; nobody asks)
Seems to translate my ideology across more accurately.
>>71615464
To be clearer, I am talking about religion as well. However, I brought up that these non-theist people who are not self-efficient and still flock to religion.
I just don't think God exists. If it, or one, does that's pretty neat. I'm not a shitty person so if it is real I hope it will take some mercy and understand my skepticism.
>>71615415
He doesn't deny the creator. Of course both the Muslim and the atheists are guilty of idolatry. They nonetheless affirm a god.
>>71615415
>Is there a more pathetic insect than the cockroach?
>The dung beetle
They're still insects.
>>71615303
I don't see any argument. It seem like you really don't know what it is. Ahh, you christcucks =D
Anyway, light came into being by a process we alredy identified. Not on a single place in that process was "let there be light". So if light exist in a certain way and god created it, then god must have done something comletly different then whats written in a bible.
See, I can spell it out for you as if you were an elementary school kid. Which again brings up a question of the state of american elementary schools... which seems to be worst then I thought... And I didn't thought it was any great to begin with.
>>71615196
In short: it doesn't. Humans are social animals and prefer to go towards familiarity and others who could hold similar views.
But truth =/= familiarity.
>>71615242
>No, it is about yours and yours only.
It isn't. You're starting from far too narrow a view.
>Becouse if protestans are right then catholics are wrong, even though they worship the same shit.
Nope. That's humans being idiots.
>Also, it is not about "what makes the most sense", it is about evidence.
Naturally - but I excluded that one because I took it for granted that you would know that.
>>71615242
>Are religions even making sense? Like infinite punishment for finite crime... or all hindus babys straight to purgatory for no reason, done by "loving" god...
>infinite hell
>hell for everyone else
This is what I mean. You're starting from something too narrow. This is American-baptist tier.
>or that hte mind that conceived, planned through and created whole universe from subatomic particles to galaxy clusters is interested in my masturbation habits...
You're seeing it from a human lens. If God was interested in your sexual habits, would it not be because they were bad for you in the long run?
You're seeing God like some kind of moral king policeman thing.
>or likes the smell of burnt bovine...
You're thinking of "a pleasing aroma to the Lord" in the sense of "God likes the smell of this", instead of "this smells nice and is dedicated to God".
Even then, understand that:
Genesis and much of Exodus - stories
Leviticus, Deuteronomy, Numbers etc - cultural, hygiene, etc of a day without sanitation, etc. Building a culture of non-waste, non-selfishness, and so on.
>well, if this makes sense to you then congrats, you totally shifted your mind to another dimension.
Or you're simplifying it. Speak to a well-versed priest on these things if you're speaking of a specific religion (i.e., not Protestant).
>>71615460
Oh I see what you mean. Heaven is paradise period - that goes for any soul. I'm not going to pretend to speculate on the specific mechanics of what that means, since the Bible has incredibly little to say about them.
It's the ultimate end of all human life to be with God, either way.
Brain dead people who are so their whole lives must get some reality in which they're not so in order to be able to be judged. They have to have thoughts and actions in order to be judged for them.
>>71615464
>I'm talking about theism
So what's the point of arguing in favor of a higher power when it doesn't interfere in our lives whatsoever? Is there intelligent design? I don't believe so, but I'm not ruling it out 100% either. I just think it's a waste of time trying to either prove or disprove it.
>>71615463
>relativism to the scientific method
Oh not *at all*. Where in the world do you get that, pseudo-nigger?
So what evidence is sufficient to make a judgement in the clam case, if your direct observation and senses can't be trusted?
>>71615570
Are you a universalist, do you believe all people to go to heaven?
Pic related, summs up all religious fag, and also why religion cucks people - because they live in chains and they are happy about it = best slave mentality for the best goyim.
>>71615509
I'd say I'm Protestant, yeah. They have all the sufficient beliefs to be Christian - Christ is the Son of God, died on a cross for our sins, rose again, etc - so yes. The issue I have with them is they add a whole slew of absurdities on ex nihilo.
>>71615552
Gonna keep repeating the questions until you answer, Finn-cuck ;)
>must have
Really? God *must* have done something? And how do you determine that?
>>71615719
I love how the only thing atheists can offer are retards like Dawkins and Hitchens who have tantrums on stage whining about atheism. It sad how you guys have to use the label of reasonable and logical yet you can't employ either when arguing against Christianity. Heck , you don't argue you just state your opinion. Learn how to make an argument.
>>71615670
No. That's an absurd belief. The path is narrow.
>>71615646
>Where in the world do you get that
"You can't define evidence" - your words. Pic related is someone who argues on your own level, maybe try taking your relativist bullshit to Tumblr?
Just because you keep saying you're not a relativist doesn't make it so.
>>71615631
Complete non-sequitur. I was arguing that atheists still flock to find some kind of "higher power" without this so called self-sufficiency.
>So what's the point of arguing in favor of a higher power when it doesn't interfere in our lives whatsoever?
When was I ever doing that?
>>71615779
That's pretty much why I stopped arguing with them for fun. It soon becomes pretty empty and dull.
>>71615867
That's not relativism - I'm pointing out that you can't do it. And so far you've demonstrated I was correct in saying that, as you haven't been able to do so.
>>71615566
I can start wherever I want. My arguments are rock solid.
Also, do you really believe that my masturbation is so bad on a cosmic scale of things that god must have warned me about it? And if yes, what does it say about the creation?
Isn't it just a terrible smugness, to think that human and his behavior has an importance on a cosmic scale?
Also - what is the key do discern what in a bible are "stories" and what is "holy word of god"?
Also, you still didn't told me how can I tell that your god is truth and krishna isn't.
No argument, like all the others... just talk, talk talk, without any substance. You should provide proof for your god or stfu.
>>71615923
Which god?
>>71615807
I don't know. There is this cancer going around with CS Lewis 'mere Christianity' nonsense. Where you just pick the church you like and ask questions about theology and its adherence to the Bible later.
This movement to bind Evangelicals, Roman Catholics and Eastern Orthodox together when there is little that holds together. It certainly isn't the gospel. Can I recommend you research Reformed theology? It would help you in your understanding of the Bible, church history and apologetics. Also see the video I posted before.
>>71615724
> They have all the sufficient beliefs to be Christian - Christ is the Son of God, died on a cross for our sins, rose again, etc - so yes
No they don't.
Galatians 2:15-21 read it.
The gospel message is that Jesus is God incarnate and he came as per the prophesy to live a sinless life and die for all who would believe (or where elected/predestined to believe) and atone for their sins. You take on this atonement of sin by having faith.
Ergo since they have compromised on justification by faith and ergo the gospel they aren't my brothers in Christ. Yet I would make that compromise with Pentecostals, Anglicans, Lutherans, Baptists and Methodists.
The root cause of this movement is the spread of Arminianism (which is just closet Romanism).
Romanism and Easternism both teach work salvation. I.e. not complete faith on Jesus's work on the cross. So our soteriology are very different.
>>71615923
You do realize, I hope, that not a single physicist in the history of humanity had Jesus or Allah or Jahwe or whatever in mind when they say "God"? Even Newton, who studied the Bible obsessively, didn't subscribe to the Christian doctrine.
>well it might not be real but christianity is the only thing that can stand against islamic invaders!
>the entire christian religion is based around charity and forgiveness
>>71615779
It is Voltaire, can you even read?
Also, if you don't trust me or Voltaire, what about Napoleon?
>>71615779
Ken Ham vs Bill Nye debate.
Bill spends most of the debate explaining cool theories, often going off on tangents regarding interesting topics.
Ken spends most of the debate trying to justify the language used in the bible, and how it directly relates to very specific scientific information.
Then at the end, someone asks "What would make you change your mind" ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z6kgvhG3AkI its at 2:18:00 )
The answers each give really show you the type of person they are.
>>71613284
God is real, but he respects manufacturing capability and not prayers.
>>71616016
The God that has survived on to this day.
>>71615960
Masturbation isn't a sin.
> Also - what is the key do discern what in a bible are "stories" and what is "holy word of god"?
All of it is the inspired and inerrant word of God.
> Also, you still didn't told me how can I tell that your god is truth and krishna isn't.
Krishna and metaphysical naturalism (atheism) doesn't provide the preconditions for intelligibility and knowledge.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bL6Vmzk56Uc
>>71616069
This
>>71615960
>I can start wherever I want.
Not if you want to make sense of the discussion.
>My arguments are rock solid.
It isn't. Sorry, Pekka.
>>71615960
>Also, do you really believe that my masturbation is so bad on a cosmic scale of things that god must have warned me about it?
Again, would it not be that masturbation -- if bad -- is something you should avoid, not because it angers God (how you're looking at it) but because it's better not to do it (another view)?
>Isn't it just a terrible smugness, to think that human and his behavior has an importance on a cosmic scale?
You're the only one thinking that.
>Also - what is the key do discern what in a bible are "stories" and what is "holy word of god"?
There's huge sections on this that you can read available all over the place. Again, you can ask a priest for recommendations.
>Also, you still didn't told me how can I tell that your god is truth and krishna isn't.
There's multiple factors that could be discussed, here. Discussing their characteristics, stories, and the doctrines of them. But again, you're getting caught up in the stories to begin with and so you're causing yourself to be very unhappy.
>You should provide proof for your god or stfu.
You spoke to me. That's pretty rude of you, isn't it? You don't walk up to someone who's having a conversation and tell them to stfu.
Why are you so angry, anon?
I don't get a kick out of debating anything "serious" with anyone. It feels like a pretentious waste of time. It's just verbal masturbation.
>>71613963
are you kidding me? the bible talks about many animals and also dragons/dinosaurs. read job leviathan. . Oh i wonder what these bones are they must be of lizards millions years ago, being this stupid
It takes a lot of time and effort to debate christians to be honest. They all have completely different interpretations of Christianity, ranging from the objectively false 6,000 year old Earth biblical literalists to vague spiritualistic views not even recorded in the Bible. You have to dedicate a large amount of time and energy just figuring out what their particular form of belief is. I will say that the people who unironically think they "own atheists" in debates are fedora tier, typically southern United States rednecks with bad hygiene. Only a small step above the obese neckbeard "le enlightened" fedoras. Actually, that goes for anyone that brags about "lol xD I own at debating my opposition they're so dumb". Or "I have 165 iq and you're not even HALF as smart as me I WUZ in college an shieeetttt." Atheists are thin-skinned though. So if you just like making people upset, go for it. All you need to do is say "atheists believe an explosion from nothing magically created everything" or "YOU CANT PROVE GOD DOESNT EXIST" and you will get responses.
>>71616053
I'm more educated than most priests. And I'm *far* more reflective. I don't mean to say that to float my own boat, I say it because to say otherwise would be dishonest. The largest issue with Catholicism is that it relies on circular logic in the form of
1) apostolic succession is justified by church tradition
2) church tradition is validated by the words of the church hierarchy
3) the words of the church hierarchy are reliable because they are ordained by apostolic succession
>>71616196
>Browsing /pol/
I mean, why ARE you here?
>>71613377
>Believe in one ultimate God and every other deity and spirit is an emissary to guide people and aid in building civilization and becoming comfortable with idea of a single deity, the same way abstract spirits became refined gods with jobs as civilizations became more refined with specialized jobs, and senates and councils could do many things at once which helps us understand a deity that can do many things at once
I always found the "You're an atheist to all but one religion" a stupid argument.
>>71616100
It's a matter of presuppositions. There is evidentialist arguments against creationist (see John Leslie, Jonathan Sarfati, Jay Wile) but from a presuppositional perspective atheism can't account for the uniformity of nature and ergo can't justify Darwinism. Also Plantinga's naturalistic argument against evolution. If we came about due to random unguided naturalistic evolution then how can we trust our reasoning abilities which produce this idea (i.e. Darwinism) since we can't be certain of our reasoning faculties.
>>71616069
Yet he published more books on Christian theology than physics. Hmm. Yugoatheists are the worst kind of fedora there is.
>>71616053
>No they don't.
Yes they do? Have you ever read Catholic texts, or gone to their services? Also, why would you list back to me the same thing I'd essentially said?
>>71616141
So you mean Allah?
What is Genesis 38:8-10?
You don't even know your own holy book. Or rather, I, the Atheist and fedora, know your book better then you do.
You are a total joke =D
Jesus, do you even know what "preconditions for intelligibility and knowledge" mean?
Can you show me where in bible are laid basics for those?
Also, if it is all "inspired and inerrant word of God" then I hope you still stone people for working on sabbat... damn son, it just stopped to be funny. You are out of your mind.
>>71616016
Don't worry about that until you believe in God.
>>71616069
>>71616160
[citation needed]
Stephen Barr
John Barrow
Pamela Gay
Michal Heller
Joel Primack...
... there's a lot, anon. This isn't a good claim.
>Newton
>not a Christian
Stop it, anon, you're making yourself look ignorant, and I don't want you to.
He had a bunch of unorthodox views, but he was obsessed with the Bible and trying to find hidden messages in it.
>>71616196
So you're one of those people who gets uncomfortable when anyone talks about anything that isn't happy or related to your worthless hobbies? Heaven forbid people discuss matters of *actual* import.
>>71616326
News mostly. Sometimes I leave a post or two but I try to stay out of debates.
>>71616285
Well similar reason to why I reject Romanism.
Romanism states that sacred scripture and sacred tradition are equal sources of revelation. Scripture doesn't teach that but their tradition interprets scripture to teach that revelation can come from the Roman church ergo they have made scripture subordinate to them.
>>71616196
Debating on /pol/? Waste of time honestly. You can have discussions and share your views if you see that they are responding well. I have been convinced of a lot of things like that but debates rarely work.
Atheists are not a homogeneous group of people. Neither are theists. This is a very low tier inflammatory engagement thread. There are a lot of those on /pol/ but you need to set the bar higher than smug reaction pictures and the worn out fedora strawman. It's about as effective as posting a westburo baptist church member and saying "This is christianity. This is you".
>>71616190
There are thousands of gods for thousands of years.
All claim theirs and theirs only is the divine truth.
Not a single one can provide evidence for their claim.
Ergo, we can refuse them all, for they are all false.
Now tell me something about it.
>>71616228
all the more reason it is fake. I mean, leviathan? really?
>>71616368
Yes. You don't understand how justification works in the Roman system. It's by works. Participation in the sacraments and the mass. Which is blasphemous as it undermines the saving power and sacrifice of Jesus. Meanwhile also supposedly putting you in right standing with God.
https://blogs.thegospelcoalition.org/ryanreeves/2016/04/10/infographic-medieval-view-of-salvation/
>>71616384
The Bible debunks Islam.
>>71614228
God created everything by number, weight and measure.
So yeah, he did speak the numbers and parameters and create the world. Math is the language of God, it's the purest form of everything.
>>71616461
Yes, that's that objection. It doesn't surprise me that people would want to be able to claim authority and have the luxury of stating their calls on faith are ordained by God, but I certainly find it abhorrent to see my faith subverted and that people would rather listen to some random man rather than read the Word of their God.
>>71616578
quran debunks bible... still no rpoof of any of those being actual truth.
>>71616409
Ah man, it is getting boring. It is not an argument. Tell me, why your god is truth and the other isn't?
>>71616330
Uniformity is created, and perceived, only through intelligent life. The universe is not, in anyshape, uniform.
>>71616618
Your argument proves that you are a huge faggot. Ugly too.
>>71616618
>God did it
Provide evidence for that claim.
>>71616618
too bad he never mentions that in his holy message to humanity...
>>71616578
It's not by works alone. I've had this conversation to *DEATH* and back with Catholics. They misunderstand the Protestant position, and most Protestants mischaracterize theirs.
Let me give you and example. Someone comes to faith, *real* faith, and dies in the very next moment by some freak occurrence. Both Protestants and Catholics will hold that person will be judged mercifully by God and find themselves in eternity with Him. It's because the *ESSENCE* of salvation is in faith - works are subsidiary to faith. You do good works when you have real faith *NECESSARILY*, unless, of course, you're physically prevented from doing so like in the example.
>>71613284
>They are usually liberal arts majors so pretty much can't hold an argument.
This. The leftist academia establishment churns out nothing but hollow drones, incapable of real thought. They rely mostly on canned and rehearsed responses, but cannot think of original arguments on their own. In short, if their teachers haven't taught them how to answer a certain question, then they can't answer it properly.
Once you hit them with arguments that they haven't been taught how to answer, they either short circuit or resort to juvenile reasoning to somehow do damage control to save face and defend atheism, but mostly to save face.
>"LALALA I can't hear you!"
>"Well, you're a poopyhead!"
True story.
>>71616686
In such a complex existence, we can actually understand our existence through numbers and can manipulate our world with said numbers.
For the fact we can comprehend anything is nothing short of a miracle, but even greater than that is that we can actually manipulate our surroundings. God created us in his image, not his physical image, but in his image as a creator, something that can understand and manipulate math to change the existence around us.
>>71616706
He did though. I mean there's a whole book in the bible called Numbers!
That's a joke. I'm just having some fun with you.
>>71616956
Same happens with bible huggers aswell. Kinda with everyone who are not educated enough.
>>71616549
>There are thousands of gods for thousands of years.
Possibly because they're connecting/trying to connect with them?
>All claim theirs and theirs only is the divine truth.
False
>Not a single one can provide evidence for their claim.
>Ergo, we can refuse them all, for they are all false.
Also false
>Now tell me something about it.
Define 'it'.
>>71616654
Why are you worrying so much about this? All you're doing is being rude.
There's a term I'm looking for, but I can't find it, which I feel answers this in some detail.
Basically, it's the same God that people are trying to grasp, it's just that people have altered it throughout their own time according to customs, language, time, and so on -- and this is the/a valid experience and definition of God as it keeps to the essentials. It may have errors, but these are not errors of God, but humankind.
I think it starts with a p. Or s. Or t. Sorry, I can't recall it. I tried looking but to no avail right now. I think Augustine uses it.
>>71617022
That just proves that we are just awesome and god had no part with it.
>>71617142
It's not even conceptually possible to prove God isn't responsible for reality. There is no conceivable state of affairs where it could be managed.
>>71617022
What you provided was not in fact any form of evidence, but a rather nicely dressed opinion disguised in assumptions.
>Existence is neither simple nor complex, as there is no other existences to compare it to, and 'simple' and 'complex' are relative comparisons
>Comprehension and higher order thought is impressive and unique but there is no reason to suggest that it is magical in any way
>God creating us in his image is a baseless claim
>>71617208
Also it isn't possible to prove that god is responsible for anything.
>>71617208
>It's not even conceptually possible to prove God isn't responsible for reality.
This does not mean that the positive and opposite claim is a valid one worth giving any weight to.
>>71617286
It's also not possible to prove your hand is attached to your arm. Or that your sensory experience corresponds to real objects. How deep you wanna go senpai? It goes down forever.
>>71617320
Give me a single inductive claim I should give weight to. And tell me why I should give weight to it. Give me an ought from an is bruh.
>>71617335
Ahahahahaha, the cucklord is real.
>>71617142
>God gives you tools instead of serving the end result on asilver platter
>"Fuck you God, we did it all on our own!"
The man gives you numbers, and then you tell Him that He had nothing to do with it because you used the tools provided.
>>71617239
Legit discussion, not trying to argue anything here with my following question, I am simply curious.
How do Atheists explain life? How do chemicals begin to work together to create a living being? Why has it occurred so rarely in the observable universe, with our tiny speck of dust in the great everything being the only known example? Why did the cell that crawled forth from the first life decide to create others like it, that worked together as one being with one mind as a multicellular organism? How does evolution do that?
Mind you, I do believe in Evolution, I just find it mind blowing and I always wanted to discuss it with you guys and never had the chance since it's not politics, but, this thread seems to be the best place to have such a discussion.
>>71617406
So you can tell me without any doubt that you're not a brain in a vat?
Jesus Christ would not be a faggot, and therefore would not use a trip, as his message was more important than his identity. Since you fail to grasp the teaching of Jesus, you are not a Christian, bit an enormous faggot.
Qed
Pol is against atheism?
Prove god exists pol
>>71617467
Basically you are asking me to prove something for you what you think is real. That isn't how it works.
>>71617550
Prove your senses correspond to real objects.
>>71616549
>all the more reason it is fake. I mean, leviathan? really?
name leviathan must be fake ? not a argument
>>71617602
No, it's *you* who believes something is real to begin with. Otherwise you couldn't believe in "proof" as a concept in the first place. You have to believe in concretes for any inductive claim to be provable.
>itt: weeb nigger trying to act smart
Every
Time
Not to mention its a tripfag as well
>>71617382
The Atlantic Ocean is east of the united states.
>>71617441
I don't know the answers to any of those questions. Abiogenesis is an incredibly daunting theoretical field of science. I am a humble college student chasing the biology dream as of now.
The thing is I admit to acknowledging my lack of knowledge on the subject, and don't presuppose a God figure as an explanation for things I, nor other people, have the answer for. I don't know God didn't do it, but I also don't know if James Bond didn't do it either.
>>71617467
I can't, but considering there's no evidence to suggest that I'm a brain in a vat then I have no reason to assume that I am a brain in a vat.
>>71617609
Prove to me that spiderman isn't giving me a handjob.
>>71617675
Say what do I believe in?
gods are just axioms
t. 300k starting
>>71613284
there are too many problems with organized religion for it to be logically consistant
the only thing you have is belief, just like every ideology out there
>>71617730
Why should I believe the Atlantic Ocean is east of the United States?
>>71617730
If you're a brain in a vat, nothing you count as existing actually exists, thus you have nothing that constitutes evidence in the first place.
Since it's entirely possible you're a brain in a vat, that calls into question whether *ANYTHING* you call evidence actually *IS* evidence.
>>71617757
I'll guess what you believe in if you're even bothering to engage in this conversation. You believe your hand exists, and is attached to your arm, which also exists.
>>71613284
maybe when I was 13 you fucking loser.
>>71617828
>brain in a vat
Prove that your's isn't in a vat.
>>71617828
Are you retarded? Genuine question because no one can be this fucking stupid.
i am already done here good luck in hell cunts because there is where you probaly belong also.
maybe you will think about this amd i will be lauging on my cloud Satan will laugh at you for not believing while billions did belief and the clues where all around.
bye faggot maybe fuck some girls fast before eternity in hell awaits
>>71617920
You must be to not even grasp an extremely basic skeptical inquiry.
>>71617915
I can't. But you still believe something is provable in the first place, otherwise you wouldn't even talk about proof.
>>71617828
Because the Atlantic Ocean, by all observable evidence, is east of the United States.
The disconnect here is that you think by weaseling your way out of any objectivity you can smuggle your god away from the objective reality we live in.
God may exist in your meaningless thought experiment fantasy world but he does not exist in our objective reality.
>>71613840
Do you even philosophy?
>>71617994
How do you know your senses correspond to real objects, given you have to believe they do in order to put any value or weight in observables?
>>71617999
I sincerely hope you aren't suggesting that people don't believe in the literal young earth myth.
>>71613284
Ebic post my dude, please tell us more about how you "totally destroyed" all those liberal atheists at your university. I'm sure it happened. Did everybody clap after you were done demolishing their "lol you believe in a man in the sky? I can't even... ugh"?
>>71618043
Oh you are one of those braindead slugs which we keep in our laboratories. Gl with this thread, I am off to read to exams and actually do something productive.
>>71617730
It just feels like if existence were all just chemicals interacting with each other to create life seems rather convoluted for the way chemicals often work, becoming radically complex and manipulating the world rather than taking the simplest option of reacting and decaying? Life just seems so "Unnatural" to the universe, Big Bang to Big Crunch makes sense, energy exploding and then coming back together. Life just does a whole big weird scribble on the whole formula though, and it's because it's so unnatural that I feel it's super natural. That's also why I believe that Christianity is the most right of the three Abrahamic religions since it's the least "Natural", Judaism appeals to nepotism and tribalism, Islam appeals to domination and violence, though, Christianity is more against nature than the primal appeal of the other two, it promotes sacrifice for others, and forgiving your enemies, something that goes against our survival instinct.
Not trying to persuade you here, that's just my take on it.
>>71618138
Nothing is productive when you're hellbound, but best of luck m8.
>>71613284
Explain this shit that everything that impacted all the world, the solar system and the countless number of fucking galaxies discovered happened with a 500 square mile stretch of land in Israel and Egypt.
>>71618043
I have no evidence to believe otherwise. The same could be said for any other brain-vat esqe thought experiment.
I could be a crazy man in a mental institution, I could be a computer simulation, I could be someone else's imaginary friend.
I have very good reason to not believe in such silly ideas. They do not have any evidence to suggest that they are real. Much like your bronze age myths.
I just came here to say that god is literally a nigger.
>only worked for 6 days and then never did anything again
>fucked a woman and then left her despite her being pregnant
>prone to violence
>you are only ok if you belong to his gang
Jesus also shows characteristics of a nigger.
>convicted criminal
>never worked a day in his entire life
>only hung around with his group all day
>probably stole bread and fish when noone was looking
>his defenders literally say HE DINDU NOTHING
It's always reassuring to know that there are just as many arrogant fedoras overseas as in the States.
It's funny because actual theologians and philosophers always BTFO these pretentious faggots and they just resort to condescension.
I'm an atheist, but I think I have a decent understanding of why and how people are religious, and I respect it. The arrogant spergs are 9/10 drug addicts or alcoholics, by the way.
>>71618222
God is omnipotent.
Do you not understand what that actually entails?
>>71618263
>The objective relativist making truth claims
You have just discarded yourself from being treated like an adult.
>>71618250
You can do that wacky XD so randum summary thing on just about any subject honestly.
>>71618240
Your evidence *itself* is called into question as being reliable or not. Unless you can establish your "evidence" as corresponding to truth, then there's reason to doubt it.
>I have very good reason to not believe in such silly ideas. They do not have any evidence to suggest that they are real
You have no evidence to suggest your senses correspond to real objects, and thus that what you qualify as evidence is itself reliable.
You can't escape skepticism from your axioms. It literally devours you.
>>71618330
So you don't assume God in conversations about God? That must be real fucking productive.
>>71618418
You claim that we must be skeptical about our axioms, but you claim that you cannot be skeptical about the underlying claims and assumptions in a discussion about God or it "won't be productive" , in which case nothing you do is productive. Good job. Now fuck off.
>>71618418
I applaud you for your relative patience with these faggots. I assume your God helps you with stuff like that.
They're like liberals with their complete inability to avoid snark and condescension when posing an argument.
>>71617609
lol, how can be god real if the reality is not real?
>>71618340
Tell me then, what else would fit the description? Neonazis are clise but they can't get poon.
Not to mention that god can't be white since he created men in his own image. Whites are a minority worldwide. Also, notice how the 3 sages didn't give baby Jesus a book or something useful? They gave him the olden times equivalents of grillz, Jordans and Blingbling.
>>71618526
You can be skeptical, but *we're talking about God in the first place*. God has the quality of omnipotence in virtually any conception of Him - so saying "hurr explain how x could happen XD" is *HILARIOUSLY* stupid, given you already know it could have. How many dicks have you sucked tonight? Meet your quota?
>>71614142
>>71614142
>t. engineer who'll be working in the US next year
I pray your hopes and dreams of deserting your land and people for a little more consumerist ability come true. Poдoпpeдaтeл.
>>71616327
How does that even work when a lot of religions directly oppose the other?
>>71613284
So cool m8. Sage
>>71618365
This reminds me a bit of Descartes. The hyperbolic Cartesian skepticism in which all is questioned because nothing but the most basic of reality is, even tentatively, assumed to be real.
Functionally useless, but cute.
I do not presuppose God. I doubt God. I doubt all baseless truth claims. The objective reality is supported through our baseline, what we observe.
You may infinitely question bases for reality in a regressive loop but it's no more deep than a child incessantly questioning his mother's reasoning for putting him to bed.
I'm off to class. Please consider a deeper line of inquiry.
>>71618609
>Ad hominem
>Sweeping generalizations
There's a reason you condescended to, imbecile.
>>71613588
>Lawyer here
You're a parasite and may as well be a jew yourself.
Atheists and Religious fantaics are the same kind of degenerates. I myself don't believe in god, but I will not make fun of people who. Just shows how little class you have if you do that.
Atheists are cancer.
>>71618609
I wouldn't applaud me for being derisive.
God does help, but it's more that I actually enjoy arguing, even with idiots, and I'm listening to music and working on a manuscript while I do this. Probably a good 1/3rd of my posts are usually just mocking people who aren't saying anything substantial yet continue to post anyway.
>>71618681
Human error. Mixed messages, human traditions taken as religious law and dictation, dick emissaries. Lots of Angels were dicks, One angel was given the title of King Dick and kicked down to hell.
This is why Islam is winning in the West.
>>71618655
Are you actually autistic? You didn't respond to my accusation, friend. You were also talking about evidence, and the only evidence we can understand and process is one that relies on our senses. Why should God have different standards? Your personal bias makes you inconsistent. You should just kill yourself at this point tbqh.
>>71618762
I don't think insisting like a stubborn baby "it just is real" is a very deep stance, sorry kiddy. Have a nice night.
>>71618895
>the only evidence we can understand and process is one that relies on our senses
Right, which means you're fucked. Since there's no reason to believe our senses are reliable.
>Why should God have different standards?
What? God is omniscient - He knows everything there is to know *necessarily*. Of *COURSE* He has different standards.
You should stop sucking dick, but I won't hold my breath baka desu senpai.
>>71617467
Gee I read all your posts and it genuinely seems you have gone down this path of madness. The fact that something is not disprovable is actually a very poor argument for it being true...It also leads to denying everyday existence, which you are obviously doing. Following your logic there is no reason you would not jump into a fire thinking it would be soothing this time, or jumping from a tall building thinking that the pavement will bounce you back up. Your way of thinking does not work in the universe we live in.
>>71614563
>sophist anime poster
human garbage
>>71619056
I mean different standards of evidence and argumentation you tremendous faggot. I doubt you are playing dumb at this point, but you should really stop.
>>71619107
I don't use that something isn't disprovable as reason for belief in anything.
>>71619151
Just because you can't answer the question doesn't make the question sophistry, babby.
>>71619056
>blah blah theres no way to prove anything is real
fuck of decart
this is literally lowest possible tier bullshit philosophy
>>71614664
This. You have to be bonafide retarded to believe in the Jew-book and a Jew on a stick.
>>71619166
God knows everything necessarily. There's no such thing as evidence toward a claim - there are only brute Truths and falsities to God. You should take the dick out of your mouth before trying to type in a foreign language, Abdul.
>>71619256
The fact that you have no answer to such basic skepticism is the far more pathetic thing.
>>71619275
God does not know everything necessarily. Can you prove that there is nothing that an omniscient being cannot know? Words are a human invention and based on our senses, thus according to your argumentation flawed and uncertain.
>no such thing as evidence towards a claim
This must be bait
>dicks dicks dicks
Got an unhealthy obsession there, mate. Does it really tingle your willy so much to imagine a man sucking dick?
>>71619216
>You can't define evidence
>Right, which means you're fucked. Since there's no reason to believe our senses are reliable.
>not sophistry
literally u dun no nuffin meme tier facebook sophistry
>>71619397
>God does not know everything necessarily
Then we're not talking about the same God. Because my God does.
It's hard to not talk about dicks in a conversation with the Grand Wizard of Cocksucking, Abdul the Dane.
>>71619477
If you actually knew what sophistry was and actually articulated my use of it, you might get more than a cute anime girl in a response. You might get two.
>>71619485
Prove your god does, faggot. Be skeptical about your assumptions, or does that only count for people you disagree with? The cognitive dissonance is incredible.
>>71619570
I'm completely skeptical about my assumptions - I take it on a matter of faith. Just like you take it as a matter of faith you're not a brain in a vat, Abdul.
>>71619485
You should know that knowing everything precludes being all powerful.
>>71619180
You did, I quoted you.
>>71619619
>I take it on a matter of faith
Hahahahaha, nice skepticism. This is incredible.
>I am s-skeptic
>I just take it on faith!
Literally the opposite.
>>71619694
>You should know that knowing everything precludes being all powerful.
In what way does "everything" preclude omnipotence as a quality?
>You did, I quoted you.
No you didn't. You've made one other post to me, and nowhere in that post did you quote me.
>>71619305
Because an unfalsifiable claim you retarded cunt.
I can't prove that I exist, or that my observations of reading some self masturbating yank retard on a Cantonese paper mill singing circle thinking he's smart are actually what is in front of me, because people are limited by their own sensory organs. It's a completely insurmountable position; "ahaha! how can you possibly trust your feeble sensory organs to be telling you the truth!"
because they're the only reasonable metric with which one has to observe and understand the world
you halfbaked, psudo-intellectual anime posting retard
people like you are what we used to use fedoras to describe.
>>71613284
Are you me?
Also engineer.
I don't really know if there is a god or not, but I get a kick out of humiliating fedoras....
Also, of all religions, roman christianity (Catholicism) one is the most based.
Buddhism is so ridiculous is almost as bad as Hinduism... Atheism is also fucking retarded (if there is no god, no need to create a religion about there being no god... Fuck)
>>71619757
I find that hilarious. So you're saying Descartes wasn't a skeptic. Or Hume. Or Socrates. Because they all believed in things as brute axiomatic faith positions. Literally no one but a hard solipsist is a skeptic by your hilariously wrong definition, Oh Cock-mongling Abdul!
>>71619808
All claims are unfalsifiable outside "there are thoughts". This is one of the the oldest conversations in philosophy. My God what a stupid cunt you are.
>>71614032
1. Zeus
2. No one really believes in him because his existence is impossible.
3. k
4. People still believe in my God because my God is not only possible but definitely exists.
>>71619862
Christianity is as ridiculous as Hinduism.
>>71619794
>>71617467
Here.
Omnipotence would mean you can change anything, which makes it impossible to know everything. If you know something will happen and want to stay all knowing you can't change it.
>>71615058
Theists are almost always from abrahamic faiths. A theists advocating a "divine craftsman" god ala Neo-Platonism would not face such fierce resistance from atheists
>>71618655
How can god be real if reality is not real man?
>>71614032
Australian lobby for seperation of church and state? Whoever runs that group really has no idea how this country runs
>>71619915
But you only apply that standard for God, not for evidence you fucking moron.
My axioms are wrong for some reason, but yours are somehow infallible, despite having the same origin. God bless your wretched soul. Your are so unbelievably inconsistent. You are the fedora everybody hates.
>I can't respect the beliefs of others so I'll be a dick
Desu I'm atheist and I don't care.
>>71620104
Where in that post do I imply someone *SHOULD BELIEVE SOMETHING -BECAUSE- THAT SOMETHING IS UNFALSIFIABLE*?
>>71620051
Its not.
Hinduism is the most ridiculous POS trip-gone-wrong shit fest you can produce.
>>71620115
But not all are Abrahamic.
Sikhs aren't. Hindus aren't.
Confucians (not the shitty Neo-Confucians, but the traditional ones) weren't. Shenists aren't.
And theists of no particular religion aren't.
But, indeed.
Theism != Religion != Abrahamic != Christianity != Literalist != YEC
I wish some understood this. I regard YEC and literalism are cancerous.
And, throughout this whole thing, I've not once stated my religious beliefs.
Crom laughs at your Four Winds
>>71613284
>the year 2016
>mankind has worshipped a FUCKTON of different deities thourought history, many of which are impossibly older than the Judeo-Christian god and are still worshipped to this day
>b-but not only God is real, he's the only God guys!!!!
>>71619971
This is insane, it's like you read a few wikipedia articles on well known western philosophers and now try to use what you've read to somehow argue with people on the internet.
The Cogito Ergo Sum thought experiment is one of the oldest arguments in philosophy, yes, and yet we're still managing to press on. People have continued to develop more sophisticated existences because there is the blunt realization that sitting around trying to base arguments off of "yeah but how do you KNOW thats real" is completely fucking fruitless. Decart didnt say "WAIT guys I'm not sure anythings real", and then suddenly the whole world stopped and just sat in a circle waiting to die because everything is pointless if you can't verify your own existence. No, people realized that forcing your horizons to be limited because of a question that, in the end, is completely pointless (moreso than philosophical questions usually are). It doesn't fucking matter if the whole universe exists inside your head, and your head is inside a jar in a lab in some alien spaceship. This is the life you have, it is pointless to waste it trying to validate that which for a start, is unfalsifiable due to the nature of out existence, but the answer to which in the end doesn't fucking matter. If it turns out you dont exist, then it doesn't matter that you wasted your life.
tl;dr shut the fuck up you smarmy little shit, you braindead halfcocked champ cunt
>>71620178
What standard? There *is no standard*. I don't say your axioms are wrong - I say fuck you I don't give a shit about your baseless opinions. You don't have *ANY* reason why I should use your axioms instead of mine. Which is why you keep slurping that dick day in and out - to fill the void in your Godless world. I think you'd have learned some time after a few thousand it wasn't working though.
>>71615773
I read some of your shitty bait thread but what question are you asking i cant se one phrased anywhere?
>>71620281
Now, Hinduism makes total sense, just talk to a well versed Llama and he will explain it to you.
But christianity? I mean, all people just from one pair? Who have only sons? This is incest, ugly degeneracy and a complete nonsense.
So yeah, Hinduism actually makes more sense then Christianity ever did.
>>71620350
What's insane about it? Why should I *CARE* if it's "insane" or not? I don't buy the skepticism - I just use it against people who don't have an out from it. If you're familiar with the name you keep invoking at all, you ought to know that Descartes gets out of the solipsistic pit with God. I do the same, but for the Godless they have no answer.
>>71620351
And you don't have any reasons why I should use yours, in which case we come back to my original conclusion. Talking with you is fucking pointless.
>>71620455
Is this your first day on 4chan?
Tripfags = cancer on every board.
>>71613588
Based af.
>>71620351
First prove that what you see is actually corresponding to real objects faggot.
How can a god be real when you can't be sure that anything is real?
Also, how does it made yours and yours only god real?
You are just spitting nonsense.
>>71620367
I don't make threads, so I don't know what you mean. In regard to the question I'm posing the Finn, read the chain of replies - it makes sense in context if you know any English.
>>71620490
I know, I'm just humoring his need for attention and gay dicksucking fantasies.
>>71620510
Are you just ignoring me because you got no answer and got trapped in your own nonsense?
>>71620455
I think it's fucking great - I get to mock you for being a dogmatic idiot who is existentially incapable of proving his own positions as truthful while simultaneously posting cute anime girls, listening to music, and writing a manuscript. If it's pointless for you, that sucks Abdul~
>>71613588
I seriously doubt you are a lawyer. Who is the most infamous High Court Justice amongst law students and legal academics?
>>71620499
I can't, and have no desire to.
Neither can you though, and you *do* have a desire to assert your worthless positions, so l e l.
>>71613284
>engineering student
>religious faggot
Lmao.
>>71620612
Well, you are doing exactly the opposite - proving yourself an idiot, proving that tripfags are cancer and also proving that religious people are total wackos.
>>71620593
Sorry Finny, I'm doing other shit - I'm not constantly monitoring looking for more idiots to baste. Auto-refresh is sufficient.
>>71620299
Sure but athetists almost always argue against god from Abrahamic faiths. Which a moral compassionate god. A creator god is more palusible than the former and usually scientists speak of the latter when they talk about god
>>71620714
Nothing is more wacko than the guy who literally utilizes circular reasoning to justify his beliefs about virtually everything in his life, which is you, Finny-binny~
>>71620663
Well then you should admit that there is no reason to believe that there is any god.
>>71620612
There is something woefully ironic in you calling someone else dogmatic. It is impossible to prove anything as truthful within your framework beyond what you accept as God-validated absolute truth. In your world there are no disagreements because God is always right, in which case it would be impossible to disagree with you since you obviously represent God's position. What a wonderful little fantasy. You have yet to prove your framework is valid, which is what this entire discussion is about. Stop being intellectually dishonest and actually rise to the challenge.
Why should anyone ever want to operate within your framework? Why is your framework valid for discussion about the real world as humans experience it with their senses?
You claim that my framework doesn't interest you, so why should yours?
>>71620709
Do you have an objection to it?
>>71620808
I have plenty of reason to believe in God. Otherwise I wouldn't believe in God.
>>71620764
Well, thats no argument.
What are you even trying to say? That you can't trust that anything is real so you must trust that god is real? What a fuck?
>>71620860
Nice non-argument. What reason?
>>71620860
So what are your reason and why are they real while reality is not?
>>71614142
You know taxpayers spend a lot of money to put you through school just so you can fuck off to murkka first chance you get.
>>71620203
Now you're just being thick. You gave credence to the matrix idea for it not being disprovable. That's a stupid thing to do, as I said.
>>71620831
No i want to believe the world is created by Haruhi. It's much more fun than the christian wizard.
>>71613284
How is being a Christfag any better than being a fedora? You're both faggots.
>>71620922
No reason and no argument, like all the religious cucks...
>>71620742
>Sure but athetists almost always argue against god from Abrahamic faiths.
That's their problem, though, not mine.
>and usually scientists speak of the latter when they talk about god
Not all the time, no. There are a lot of scientists of all religions. I mean, they're calling some religious Jew 'the man who will one-up Darwin'.
http://www.ozy.com/rising-stars/the-man-who-may-one-up-darwin/39217
If anything, though, this says more about how people understand religion than anything, to me.
>>71613605
>Implying that evolution disproves God.
Good job bro, you forgot how to science.
>>71620810
I operate my life with God as an axiom. I can't instantiate God as existing necessarily, but I never try to. Ever. What you're trying to articulate about my own position is absurd though. Never in my life have I ever claimed I'm always right or that I necessarily represent God's position.
>Why would anyone ever want to operate within your framework?
Because God provides purpose, life, and salvation. Those are great reasons. For inductive claims, God is Truthful, so we can trust our senses under *my* framework, as opposed to your which provides no reason to.
>>71620922
>>71620934
I want to.
>>71620938
What? No I don't. Your English must be really bad if you're drawing that conclusion.
>>71620957
You can do that, but I wouldn't make that bet.
>>71620979
Nah, you don't get it. You see, there is something wrong when you supposedly use circular reasoning even though he pointed out no examples of such, but when he justifies his belief in God with:
>I believe in God
>therefore there must be plenty of reasons to believe in God
>because there's plenty of reasons to believe in God I believe in God
>therefore there must be plenty of reasons to believe in God
It's based on the assumption that he's not a delusional retard.
>>71621091
Pfff and the cat is out of the bag. The reason for your close mindedness is just wishful thinking
Legit question: how do these arguments come up?
I'm an atheist but I don't think anyone even knows that, because why the hell would anyone talk about their faith under any circumstances? Isn't it like a personal thing?
I mean, how does anyone escalate to a situation where they end up arguing about "GOD MADE EARTH / SKY DADDY LMAO"
>>71621180
I never use that reasoning. I have an image just for that though.
>>71621078
Ok, so you basically have a theory about world you cling to without any evidence and believe it is really because it makes you comfy?
Yeah, that's basically what I've expected.
And it is also not an argument, evidence or reasonable... but yeah, if it makes you comfy, then by all reason, stay sheep, don't search for the actual truth. And certainly never leave your comfort zone...
pic related, my face when I see your kind =/
>>71621206
That's funny, because it's the same reason you believe your senses correspond to real objects - because you want to.
>>71621078
But you have yet to prove your axiom is fucking valid, which is why it makes no sense to accept is, as you use your senses to accept your axiom. You cannot use that to retroactively justify picking those particular axioms, since it could just be your senses that trick you into believing in a God, despite a God not actually existing and you just being a walking bag of meat in a universe with no spiritual purpose. All your assumptions of God being truthful and right can just as well be made up by your senses.
Checkmate, atheists.
>>71621263
The exact same as you - you belief your senses correspond to real objects without any other reason for believing so. You just want to.
>>71621314
Why are you talking about validity in regard to axioms? Do you even know what an axiom *is*?
>>71621120
>So you can tell me without any doubt that you're not a brain in a vat?
You just said that as a random statement then?
>>71621239
You just did you loon. Do you have Alzheimers? Good thing there's a post history with your trip plastered all over it, huh?
>>71620860
>>71621091
>>71621078
Lol you what mate?
"mug god... because muh feeeeeels"
Damn you are truly stupid.
>>71621091
Wow, now you just went full retard =D
You religious cucks are just making my sides suffer =D
>>71621363
It's a skeptical inquiry - it's a question posed to produce *doubt* about a different premise or conclusion, not as a positive endorsement that anyone *SHOULD* believe that.
>>71621350
Yes. Do you? Your base assumption that God is somehow real could be entirely based on assumptions. Now answer the question and don't run away.
Is it not possible that all your assumptions of God being truthful and right can just as well be made up by your senses in an attempt to cope iwth a God-less reality because your feeble mind cannot handle not having a divine purpose?
>>71621365
Wait. WAIT. Do you believe people can believe something *for no reason*? Do you HONESTLY believe that?
>>71621290
Not in the slightest. I believe in my senses (to a degree, there are many known illusions) because they work. They are trained and sharpened every single time I do anything.
>>71621323
Well, even if I wanted to NOT believe my senses, I can never walk through wall. It is not that I chose to, it it because the wall is there.
Now show me how you walk through the wall...
Or rather roll back in shame, leave this board and never use a trip tag again, that is only think a honorable man would do after such a shameful display.
>>71621398
You believe your arm is attached to your hand, and that you're not sucking Tyrone's dick while taking Abdul to the rear (even though you are) because you want to - sorry to break it to you.
>>71621461
What the fuck are you talking about at this point? You provided "evidence" with
>I believe in him
>So there's evidence
>Otherwise I wouldn't believe in him
Bravo.
>>71621290
You are right desu, just jump of a bridge and believe that it is all just in your head.
You can do it, free yourself and sociaty from your existence.
Mabye a written manifesto would be a good idea, because otherwhise people are just going to asume that you are bat-shit-crazy.
>>71621452
*Axioms aren't based on *ANTYHING**. They're a *STARTING POINT OF REASONING*. Holy *SHIT* Abdul! You almost passed as knowing something about philosophy all this time!
I once saw a flying saucer type craft up close. I don't have physical evidence of what I saw, but I know it happened. I guess it never happened since I have no evidence.
>>71621022
>That's their problem, though, not mine
It is everyone's problem coz everyone is going to talking past each other.
Plus that says nothing about religion, unless you are saying smart people are religious then that is some appeal to authority
>>71621239
Kek. Saved.
>>71621222
It is for me. I don't tend to talk about it unless they do. I never bring up my belief just "out of the Blue", or whatever. I have to be asked for my opinion or whatever.
Strangely, I've ended up debating it a fair bit because of them.
Before, atheists used to be well-read and versed because they grew up with religion and consciously chose to reject it.
Now, though they're more likely to be rebellious and not even that well-versed on religion. Instead, they'll often google and go to the most retarded of groups like YECers.
When the response is "sky wizard lmao" and stuff, you know they're not well-read on it and often resort to memes. That's why the fedora meme probably became a thing: they're posting stupid shit that's inaccurate, so stupid hat tipping is a thing.
>>71621461
Go home kid, you already showed us all that you have.
Try read some books on astrophysics and then try to compare it with a thought that the being that created it all is deeply concerned that you don't work on sabbat.
Silly fag.
>>71621469
You don't know they work actually. You just believe they do, since they could be fed to you all while entirely different things happen.
>>71621551
Yes, and I'm telling you that YOUR starting point of reasoning is what is wrong here. Is this so hard to understand?
>>71621410
You're plainly strawmanning, I never claimed that. But again, you obviously give credence to the thougt while you shouldn't.
>>71621487
>I can never walk through a wall
Until you've tried walking through walls in every possible configuration of matter and energy in the universe, that's a pretty stupid conclusion to make.
>>71621551
Please don't throw tantrums. It will make you look even worst.
1+1 is axiom.
God is not.
>>71621521
That's not evidence - it necessarily follows that if *ANYONE* believes *ANYTHING* there is a reason for that belief. It's a brute deductive connection - there's no evidence involved. Oh God Abdul, you're so fucking DUMB!
>>71621551
Whats next? Are you going to cry?
>>71621536
I could also just as easily not ;)
>>71621562
>It is everyone's problem coz everyone is going to talking past each other.
But it isn't. It goes more like this:
"Haaa God's not real"
"See, this that and the other"
"omg kike on a stick skyfairy loool"
"But we're not..."
"joseph was a cuck lol religitards :D"
>Plus that says nothing about religion, unless you are saying smart people are religious then that is some appeal to authority
You misunderstand. Basically, I mean it shows how people understand religions to be. People are more likely to look at a text and say 'okay cool', rather than looking in detail, understanding context, etc.
So you have people on all sides not looking at things in more detail. I blame Protestants.
>>71621586
>third-worlder still posts in a language he barely understands
K E K
E
K
>>71621713
Not if that person is fucking delusional and is basing his belief on "I want to" (>>71621091) you mental imbecile.
>>71621600
>>71620938
That's all I can say really. You thought yourself in this endless circular brainfart and there is no way out for you. I wonder what it feels like if you really think that all you experience is an illusion. Do you think I am real? Or is this all inside your head. I really do feel a little sorry for you.
>>71621605
*REALLY*? "God exists, is responsible for x, and has qualities y" is 'wrong'? *REALLY* Abdul? Cuz I'm pretty sure that's an unfalsifiable premise.
>>71621656
Well, you simply can't. As with your god and trying to defend it with reason and logic - you cant, there is no reason, no logic, no evidence. Just "muh feels". And thats exactly why there is no god. You just desperately want it to be so you try every trick there is in the book to make some reason out of it, but when faced with opposition it always reduces to "I believe because I want". And that it turns makes you a plebian sheep.
Now please discard your stupid tripfaggotry and reconsider your "faith".
>>71621688
Holy. Shit. LMAO!
http://www.importanceofphilosophy.com/Metaphysics_Axiom.html
http://www.importanceofphilosophy.com/Metaphysics_Axiom.html
http://www.importanceofphilosophy.com/Metaphysics_Axiom.html
L M A O
M
A
O
>>71621869
And it is EXACTLY because it is unfalsifiable that it is ultimately pointless. Are you actually this stupid?
I'm agnostic
>>71621609
>You're plainly strawmanning, I never claimed that
>You gave credence to the matrix idea for it not being disprovable
>>71620938
>>71620938
>>71620938
You're either an idiot, bad at English, a weasel, or a combination of those. In any case, I'm going to stop responding to you, since it's too hilariously sad.
>>71621718
LMAO
>>71621775
>>71621869
lol... are you feeling smart now? Shouldn't you provide evidence or something? =D
Also our educational system is superior to your in every way, we have exactly zero niggers and muslims, have the hottest chicks and are the most atheistic country in the world.
I bet god simply loves us.
>>71621775
>>71621869
Really? How old are you? 12?
>>71621804
That's what your entire world rests on. Sorry to break it to you ^_^
Well, that and cocks.
>>71621753
>using a straw man example as proof
The tripfag here is getting BTFO'd and you are having limited success because they don't know you are advocating a divine craftsman instead of a moral god.
>People are not looking at religion like I do :(
If you say so senpai
>>71622097
And once again you just shitpost.
>>71622012
Me too I don't know whether Fairies or Thor exists or not but better safe than sorry, sure I come across like a huge faggot but the important thing is I can't be wrong if don't take sides.
>>71621917
You can believe that all you want. That belief won't see you judged any less righteously.
>>71621928
> metaphysics
> importance of philosophy
well, maybe in your reality, where people can walk through walls and where there is a god and where you feel so comfy, this counts as an argument.
It ok kid, your god is totally an axiom and you don't have to prove anything as long as it makes you feel good. It is ok.
>>71622193
I don't mind being judged by your imaginary God. Perfectly fine with me.
>>71620656
Learned Hand
>>71621957
And we're back to SQUARE ONE ABDUL! Where I re-explain to you that literally *EVERYTHING YOU BELIEVE* outside "there are thoughts" is unfalsifiable! But given I devoted half the thread to that, I'll just let you reread instead. Try to enjoy that as much as you enjoy your aids!
>>71622054
So fucking funny that you keep posting.
>>71622193
oh no, your imaginary friend will punish me. what a tragedy
>>71622193
I believe in reason, logic and evidence. In this, there is no place for god, especially of any religion.
You believe any a comfy place after your life ends. Well, thats also ok, but stop claiming it as a truth when it is only your feels.
>>71622279
You are a special kind of stupid.
>>71622157
>strawman
Not quite. Example of what's going on. I wish I was wrong and it WAS a strawman.
>The tripfag here is getting BTFO'd
That's not my issue if he is or is not.
>and you are having limited success because they don't know you are advocating a divine craftsman instead of a moral god.
If people actually asked, thoguh...
>>People are not looking at religion like I do :(
>If you say so senpai
NOW who's making a strawman?
If you look at religion from merely the text then you're going to have problems with it. Augustine etc warned against this in the past.
Literalism is actually kinda new as people have been cut off from their roots.
>>71622173
All of your beliefs stem from axioms that you work from because you want to. Not a single one of them do you adopt for any other reason.
>>71622220
l
m
a
o
>>71622307
Well, at least they thought us basic logic ;)
Czech-and-mate, friend.
Czechs: Master race
Burgers: Fat
>>71622279
>EVERYTHING YOU BELIEVE* outside "there are thoughts" is unfalsifiable
every baby has wings when its born, but they fall out in 2 years
pretty fucking falsifiable isnt it?
>>71622408
lol =)
>>71622233
If you'll be fine with that you'd be fine with any atrocity being committed to you or anyone else. But obviously you're okay with being raped by large foreign men from day to day, so maybe that's actually true of you.
>>71622314
You don't believe in logic, otherwise you'd stop using inductive reasoning.
http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/induction-problem/
>>71622338
You are a special kind of completely inarticulate obstinate moron.
>>71622431
Playing religitard I just have to say they are invisible and you can't touch them, only true believers can see the evidence these wings exist.
>>71622362
And god is an axiom becausee you want it to be, because it makes you feel warm inside, yeah, we have already heard that... So what?
Evidence?
Do you have any, cuck?
>>71622431
It's not, since they could have wings, and someone feeds you an illusion that they don't.
>>71622558
fuck me i guess youre right, religion wins again :(
>>71622185
If there's a God he may or may not love you.
>>71622584
L M A O
Determine for me if the following premises are evidence for the claim that comes after it.
p1) There is a perfectly clam shaped indention in the sand
p2) A clam whose shell perfectly matches that indention sits very close to that indention
p3) You believe you saw the clam in that indention, and that you moved the clam from that indention to where it now sits
------
c) The clam shaped indention is evidence of a clam having been there
>>71622587
yup, even if i see a baby being born someone probably just hypnotises me and erases all the memories about the wings
>>71622516
Come on buddy, what about some evidence for a change? Your words are empty ever since you came out with "god is a truth and an axiom because it makes me feel good"
>>71622660
That's entirely possible. Which is why it's not a falsifiable premise.
>>71622601
If there is a god I'm sure there's a special place in hell for people who post on 4chan, I mean if you were god would you want these faggots in heaven with you?
>>71622709
>That's entirely possible
it isnt though, i mean do you really not realise how much hoops do you have to jump through just to believe something you have no reason to believe in?
>>71622649
Yep, that sounds like a solid evidence.
Now do you have something showing us that got is actually truth?
>>71622678
The problem of induction demonstrates all inductive reasoning - which is entirely what evidence is utilized in making claims in - is logically unjustifiable in use under materialist/physicalist/empiricist/naturalist axioms. You're so fucked, but you're too dumb to even understand how you're fucked. It's so fucking hilarious to me how dumb you people really are.
>>71622812
So you think it's impossible to hypnotize someone? Or for them to see or not see things that are either not there or are there?
>>71622816
It's actually not evidence, since the indention was actually caused by a man inducing the whole scene in a dream of yours. Good try though!
>>71622828
yeah yeah, so reality isn't realy, but somehow, god is.
Ok, you totally proved it this time, I think that now christianity will spread among the people of the earth as a will fire as every one will clearly see that Yahwe and Yahwe only is the truth and the way... or... what, wait a moment, thats bullshit! =D
>>71622862
first of all, yes hypnosis is bullshit, at most its the power of suggestion, and secondly, im pretty sure its immposible for babies to have wings and or that after every birth the parents memory is erased and all the video footage and photoes are altered
>>71623001
You didn't even look at the article. And you never will. Or if you even do, you're too stupid to understand it. You are quite literally a nigger as far as intellectual capability. It's so. Fucking. Funny. Sometimes I wonder how God ever expects people as dumb as you to ever know Him. Or why He'd want to.
>>71623041
But we're in the Matrix right now how do you know in the real world babies don't have wings?
>>71622352
It is strawman senpai. Deal with it
>If people actually asked, thoguh...
How about you say it before pushing for it. Not mentioning about it and then bitching about it later is fucking petty.
It is not strawman coz I didn't make a statement against it. Though I did roll my eyes when I typed. Also if you are a) claiming people should look at religion like you do b)upset it isn't the case, then my greentext is not wrong, it just hurt your feelings
>>71622932
Ahh, so there can be no evidence what so ever of anything because everything can be only a dream?
Superb. How can you then know that anything is truth, much more something a preposterous as God and especially yours god and yours only?
You can't.
No evidence = no truth.
Therefore god can never be truth.
QED.
Thank you all.
>>71623041
There's nothing impossible about that. What if you were in the Matrix? It's very obviously not impossible if that's the case. And there's nothing impossible about the possibility of you being in the Matrix.
>>71623201
lol don't be so harsh on the boy =D
>>71623201
I'm saying in any case it could be a dream, and if it is then there's no such thing as evidence that you're able to access.
Truth exists independent of reasons for believing or not believing it. And that's all evidence is - material reasons to believe an inductive claim.
>>71623171
>>71623208
im not talking about the matrix, im taling about the same world ew are both percieving now
>>71623327
Which could be the Matrix. Unless you can prove we're not in the Matrix.
>>71623208
God is only in your dreams.
>>71623174
>It is strawman senpai. Deal with it
It isn't. Just accept that.
>How about you say it before pushing for it.
No - My views should not matter when discussing facts.
>>71623174
>Also if you are a) claiming people should look at religion like you do b)upset it isn't the case, then my greentext is not wrong, it just hurt your feelings
But your greentext is wrong and didn't hurt my feelings.
Next?
>>71623327
How do you know we are both perceiving the same world?
>>71623357
God is an illusion of the matrix, Neo. They just want to trick you for your loosh.
>>71623370
You'd best hope He's only in yours. That hope won't do you much good come Reckoning though.
>>71623357
and what if the matrix is also in a matrix of even higher beings than the ones controling our matrix? what is there are even more matrix layers?
what if all these assumptions are completely pointles waste of time unless you have proof that youre actually in the matrix?
>>71623393
ok how is your world different than mine? you can try to prove it, and then if you actaully have decent proof we can agree on the same universe
>>71623451
Reckoning is just an illusion. You must see through the Matrix neo.
>>71623461
You can't prove you're not in the Matrix - but just because you can't prove it doesn't mean it's pointless at all. Whether we're actually in the Matrix or not matters a *GREAT DEAL* - it would completely change how most of us conduct ourselves to believe every moment of our lives is an illusion.
>>71623520
Impossible to tell it could literally be anything you have analyze every particle in the universe to make sure.
>>71623451
No, you only dream that he is in your dreams. In fact, it is all just a simulation and they are forcing you to believe in a false god. You must see through the illusion. Reality is simulated. there is no god...
You have lost your marbles man =D
>>71623604
What if the idea of god is just an illusion though?
>>71623604
you cant prove im not superman, i bet the world would be different if i was superman
your point being?
>>71623632
At least I had marbles to lose, nigger.
>>71623604
I can prove it, in your dream =D
>>71623672
My point being you saying the question is pointless is wrong - there is a value and a point to it.
>>71623520
It could be anything as small as me seeing colors slightly different to you to the fact that in my world Lord Hitler IV is the supreme leader.
>>71623690
Im nigger, but only in matrix, in real world Im the god, so you should watch your language, boy.
>>71623625
>Impossible to tell it
not really, it basically boils down to 'do you believe in anything supernatural' and "do you believe current science"
prove something supernatural or debunk something scientific and were done here
>>71623665
What if He is? If He is then He is. Why would I ever make that bet, Finny?
>>71623697
You can't, since there's an infinite regress. But you don't even know what that means.
>>71623761
But what about alternate universes and dimensions? For all you know we could be in different ones and not even know it.
>>71623690
It is pointless? Really? Isn't it just another level of matrix control? We must go deeper.
How can be anything pointless if reallity is just a matrix? =D damn, you are putting a crown on the word stupid =D
Yeah, I have finally igured it out, you are just a reloplayer! I Trinity your waifu?
>>71623869
Your English is top notch. Did your mother Esmerelda help teach you while your father was out fucking goats?
>>71623762
Sure, I bet you can't walk through the wall, no matter how much you may think it is just an illusion.
I bet all my worldly possession.
>>71623722
whats the point then? you cant prove it and you cant disprove it. just because something would happen if you somehow would be able to prove it doesnt mean you can actually prove it. the only value it has is being a mental exercise
>>71623949
Well, at least Im not living a lie.
>>71623973
My point is that if you care about intellectual honesty and the dictates of logic, you have to maintain doubt.
>>71623999
Nothing is more truthful than my faith - have fun being destitute though ^_^
>>71623949
What an argument. Did they downloaded all the logic directly into your head?
=D Tell me some more stories about the matrix, I want to know the truth Morfeus.
>>71623865
theres no proof of them so theres no point in believing in them or doing anyting based on that belief, whether they actually exist or not is irrelevant
>>71624024
ok i doubt im in the real world, what now?
![iu[3].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/8qwLT8n.jpg "iu[3]")
