Why is this allowed?
Hey, looks like that time the US got off the gold standard internationally.
>outsourcing
>mass immigration
>wall street debt
basically every economic kike policy
>>70871026
Oh pshaw. Jews are good at economy and money.
>>70870762
Because the company gets more workers and pays them instead of highering the salary of the already hired.
>>70870762
>Feminism
>Immigration
These two factors lowered the value of labor immensely
>>70871026
The federal reserve
>>70871163
>Jews are good at economy and money
They are good at destroying the economy and looting it to get rich
>>70871322
>federal reserve
>wall street
>not kikes
>women join and borderline double the work force
>immigration brings an influx of even more workers
>at the same time manufacturing is driven overseas
>technology and better managerial practices makes companies able to produce more
B-b-but all we need is a bandaid to artificially raise prices right?
>>70871587
>technology and better managerial practices makes companies able to produce more
The graph clearly shows productivity rose with wages until the globalist kikes ruined everything
>>70871340
This is just regular old white people, not jews.
Why is greed good in capitalism, but if if a jewish person is greedy somehow theyre evil?
>>70871163
>They are good with THEIR OWN money
>>70871834
>not jews.
kek fuck off Shekelberg are you posting straight from Goldman Sachs?
>is greed good in capitalism
That's a meme that the kikess Ayn Rand spread to the stupid goyim
>>70870762
hmm i wonder what happened around 1970-75
>>70872037
lets look at the kikes that destroyed the economy
Robert Rubin
>>70872100
Carl Ichan
>>70871985
They literally own our money. It is their own money that is crashing.
>>70870762
Globalist kikery.
>>70870762
because it's 2016?
>>70872133
Larry Summers
>>70870762
The Reptilians made their move when they saw how far we've progressed after the Moon landings.
>>70872037
Actually the "greed is good" movement came out of the 70s. The slogan largely reinforced by movies like Wall Street, Glengarry Glen Ross, American Psycho, et cetera. It was the culture of the time and we're suffering the consequences of that culture now.
>>70872203
Stephen Friedman
>>70872203
Larry Summers? You mean the guy that crashed Harvard's savings and then got hired to be Obama's economic czar?
>>70870762
Lets say theres a dildo factory
Your job is to press a button then a dildo pops out
If the factory buys a machine that makes two dildoes pop out instead of one, productivity has doubled but you do the exact same job as before.
Productivity isnt employee productivity.
>>70872264
>he never read Atlas Shrugged
kek Rand faps over Greed (and rape) constantly in her books she was one of the biggest early promoters of greed, her cult influenced jews like FED chairmen Alan Greenspan.
>>70872413
he was one of the major figures behind deregulating wall street under Clinton
>>70872613
Jim Cramer biggest promoter of the housing bubble
>>70870762
Increase in capital and technology lead to increased worker productivity durrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.
Also
>goods producing workers
So, what? Manufacturers? Lmao. Get a relevant job for today's economy.
God if I see this fucking meme leftist graph one more time.
>>70872703
Joshua Bolten
>>70872766
>If I call it a "leftist" graph then it isn't true
>>70872766
wages rose with productivity for decades fucking kike apologist
Gary Gensler Commodity Futures Trading Commission chairman
>>70871292
This
a lot of people grossly underestimate how much Women entering the workplace affected labor
>>70872613
Jews are like 2% or less of the US populations... and you're saying they are the cause of all the problems?
Meanwhile most of the large companies and banks are run by non-jewish people, but you're just going to point out the handful of jewish ones.
You're retarded. Even if there were no jews in the US, the same stuff would have happened. Greed is the problem, not jews.
>>70872264
Yeah, those movies are very big 70s hits, right next to Star Wars, Jaws, and Grease.
>>70872525
still, when the money put in investment to buy the machine is paid, the compagny can sell twice as much and the worker got nothing more, that's unfair.
The job you do may be the same, but allows the compagny to sell twice as much, so you should get a raise.
>>70872948
I'm just saying the media was a reflection of the culture's views of economy at the time.
>>70870762
The skills required to make a box have not changed.
The skills required to connect 23 international box making factories has changed quite a bit.
>>70872939
What a walk down memory lane. I remember when people were actually upset at that guy.
>>70871834
Because they're not our people, and they have overall evil intentions. When were not in a multicult hell, (as we are now because jews), the elderly make better decisions.
>We
Doesn't matter either ways, Jews pls quit america before violence.
>>70872945
>you're saying they are the cause of all the problems?
obviously they are the majority of the media, academia, wall street, DC establishment etc that hate the US and want to loot it.
You might as well say AIPAC isn't jewish.
>>70873048
2008 was a long time ago
>>70872525
Sure. but the question is how the gains are divided. Does the dildo company lower prices? Do they pay the employee less and cut production hours?
Most of the gains in productivity went to the wealthiest members of wall street and the companies. Whether or not it was employee productivity or not is irrelevant, since the increase in productivity has the same economic outcomes. The question is who gains from productivity increases.
>>70872413
It's the who's who of people who need to be hanged after a summary trial...
>>70873240
>obviously they are the majority of the media, academia, wall street, DC establishment etc that hate the US and want to loot it.
No they aren't.
>>70872939
>>70872902
>le holding all else constant
you fucking fags don't understand the first thing about economics
>>70873288
Educate us. We're listening.
>>70873043
productivity increased for decades with wages how are you people not seeing this?
>>70873287
>last 3 FED chairmen jewish
>hurr it's not the jews stupid goy
>>70871163
Sounds like a Bernie endorsement to me!
>>70873482
>all media companies run by jews
>hurr not the jews
>>70873530
>>70873560
>>70873020
Big the films you listed are from 1987, 1992, and 2000
Unless your point is that those movies represent the economic reality of the 70s extremely well despite being made decades later, and that the climate in those movies can explain OP's graph. Then I'd tell you that getting your history from an ultra exaggerated anti-capitalist anti-macho movie about an obsessive psycho killer isn't all that sound.
>>70870762
Cheaper labor from Newly industrialized or industrializing countries, increasing of free trade policies, and increasing automatization.
Increasing wages is not going to solve this at all.
>>70873600
>jewish academics behind majority of anti white academic theory
>hurr not the jews
>>70873726
>increasing automatization.
again productivity rose WITH wages for decades
how can you people not read a simple graph?
>Jews
>>70873713
All those movies are set in the 80s. And yes, American Psycho was made in 2000 to satire the horrible society we created in the 70s and 80s.
>>70870762
Because what are you going to do about it, goy?
Might makes right.
>>70873952
What is your pic? Is that Saul Alinsky or is it the Protocols?
>>70870762
jews
>>70873952
All that stuff occurred even without the jews. Explain the Great Depression, and monopolies, et cetera. This was a time in american where anti-antisemitism was very real and we turned away jewish immigrants.
>>70874079
>we created
seriously fuck off Goldstein
Stop blaming goys for jews wrecking the economy.
>>70874274
Jews began looting the US goy economy in the 70s with corporate raiders
blaming the goy really is like blaming the rape victim at this point.
And jews dominated the media so they justified it. wall street jews' rape of the economy
>>70874274
You're pants on head retarded
Go to /x/ with your jewish lizardman bullshit
>>70873328
Reread my first post, go to Google scholar, verify what I just said. Jesus are /pol/acks this retarded for real?
>>70874387
Yes, people that don't post here ironically are retarded. It's a psuedo-containment board where we can laugh at the idiots in this zoo. They honestly believe it's an alt-right safe space.
>>70870762
CEOs have a legal responsibility to maximize returns, that's how.
>>70874380
kek
you are literally retarded and delusional
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_raid
>muh good jew boys dindu nuffine they just on they way to synagoge
>>70874522
>>70870762
Capital became more efficient, human labor stayed the same in terms of productivity and was globalized, capital owners then see the returns.
Women thirdworlders and technology in the workforce to drive down wages
>>70874576
Fun Fact the Wolf of Wall Street was based on the true story of wall street kike scam artist, Jordan Belfort
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Wolf_of_Wall_Street_%282013_film%29
>>70874629
hey fucking moron, wages rose WITH productivity until the 70s
>>70872264
Calvinism literally considers profit a moral good in and off itself. Profit is a sign from god you are following his plan.
Dutch have been living this way for centuries mate, its not a new thing.
>>70874522
OK, what about Bain Capital, the infamous Mitt Romney company. Are you going to say Romney was a secret jew or something? Are you going to claim 100% of people on wall street and in banks are jews?
>>70874687
>technology in the workforce
to repeat for the x millionth time productivity rose WITH wages until the 70s
how do you not get this?
>>70874387
>Increase in capital and technology lead to increased worker productivity durrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.
Does that actually do something on Google "Scholar?"
The housing bubble was Alan Greenspan's great innovation to get out of the tech bubble. And now we're having another tech bubble because of the blind faith that we can finally achieve transhumanism if we just run the printing presses just hard enough. Whom did Google hire? Was it Ray Kurzweil who wants to become God, or was it Eric Schmidt who wants to become the mind of God? Was the whole thing funded by the CIA?
>>70874252
>This was a time in american where anti-antisemitism was very real and we turned away jewish immigrants
>time in american
>anti-antisemitism
Perhaps Google Translate is not the best method to translate Hebrew to English for your shilling, Moshe.
>>70874380
>$0.05 has been deposited to your account.
>>70874784
We didn't have mass immigration until 65, same with working women
>>70874699
Thats because it was before computers rendered increases in human skill level meaningless. The computerization and automation of various processes in the workplace exponentially grew since the 80s and now the proportion an unskilled individual contributes is next to none.
Almost any worker at a retail store is replaceable, the capital in form of registers, anit-theft, inventory tracking, inventory transportation and storage has all advanced.
It just means you no longer get a free ride and have to actually have marketable skills to make money for upward mobility.
>>70874252
Great depression happened years after the Rothschild owned central bank was installed in 1913 under wilson.
Fun fact: many of the opponents to the federal reserve act died during the sinking of the TITANIC.
>>70874726
No, they aspire industriousness. There is a difference between working hard and ripping people off.
>>70874750
Mormon of that level are in fact Jews. Bain Capital was an asset-stripping operation.
You could maybe call it "vulture capital" rather than venture capital. Who invented capitalism again?
>>70874750
>there are white murderers
>there for blacks don't murder at a much higher rate
how are you people this fucking dumb?
And yes Romney is shit.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BwqBmo6brzQ
But you realize he didn't invent asset stripping right? Kikes did.
>>70875020
>But you realize he didn't invent asset stripping right? Kikes did.
>jews invented evil
>white people can't be evil. it's impossible
>when white people do evil, it's perfectly ok.
>>70874977
Profit is profit mate. Its why we sold to both sides in every war, dealt in everything from slaves to opium and now own some of the largest businesses in the EU.
We have no morals when it comes to making a profit. Profits *are* moral, after all.
>>70874984
>You could maybe call it "vulture capital" rather than venture capital. Who invented capitalism again?
The famous jew Adam Smith, obviously.
Because you dumb fucks don't have unions. *love my civil engineering union*
>>70874923
>productivity didn't increase during the Industrial Revolution
what?
>>70875176
>kikes do most destruction of economy
>call them out
>hurrr you' can't say that
typical
>>70875248
Nope. That would be Karl Marx who invented the word "capitalism."
It is bullshit how little we get paid but you could argue that the productivity increase is derived from capital and not labour.
Therefore you don't compensate workers for shit they arent doing
LOL at poor people
You have to own the means of production if you want to make it prol scum.
>>70875424
>Karl Marx who invented the word "capitalism."
This might be the single dumbest thing I've ever heard on /pol/
congrats you dumb kike apologist.
>>70875393
I didn't say you can't say anything
I just said you're retarded if you think the jews have some conspiracy to crash the economy, rather than the system itself being flawed.
>>70875393
lol Bernie Madoff. Oy vey, he stole some stupidly small amount of money! Oy vey he jewed the jews! Oy vey! Secret trial! Oy vey!
Look, look, goyim, we burned the financial malefactors! Problem solved!
>>70875393
And workers wages in the revolution increased as their manufacturing labor was more productive then their subsistence farming ever was, as you can see in any developing country. I don't think you understand how utterly exponential productivity grew from computers it obsoleted about 90% of the clerical work force in short order.
No longer can you walk into a businesses doors and get a house, a car , a family out of doing some shitty unskilled labor because any schmo can do it thanks to computer training, hour tracking, register manning etc.
You must understand, a machine that automatically welds together car parts will likely contribute more to GDP and society then an unskilled burger flipper ever will. The bottom bar for skills has risen and its easier to get them especially thanks to the internet.
Anyone who whines about wage deprivation is just a lazy retard.
>>70875523
There was no conspiracy any more than there is a conspiracy between all niggers to rob liquor stores
jews just do what is in their Semitic nature (destroy everything) just look at Islam
>>70875536
yeah ok Mr "Karl Marx invented the term capitalism"
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/capitalism#Etymology
>From French capitalisme (“the condition of one who is rich”). First used in English by novelist William Thackeray in 1854.
>>70875454
And you drive the wages down, on the labor side,by doubling the workforce be emancipation of women and grow gradually with immigrants. This even screw traditional women since its so bad you HAVE to wagecuck. There is all sorts of displacement going on like musical chairs.
>>70875683
>Anyone who whines about wage deprivation is just a lazy retard.
yet private debt has increased while wages haven't making the economy unaffordable.
you're a complete fucking moron
see
>>70871026
>>70875721
And let me guess.. whites are someone inherently good and honorable people by nature?
>>70873240
>2008 was a long time ago
:(
>>70875809
No but they aren't as bad as kikes
>>70875721
There's nothing new under the sun, but Karl the Kuck was the one who laid out all the relevant isms that we go in circles about these days. It's why I try to stay away from isms when I can because next time I quote Il Duche about what Fascism is I just know I'm going to get dogpiled by people with alternate definitions.
Orwell was right.
This graph is completely flawed. Wages are being adjusted with consumer prices and productivity with producer prices. If you adjust wages with producer prices there is no longer a difference . In the condition w = p * mpl from basic micro, p is producer prices. So this shows that the prices of what ppl consume have grown relatively more than the prices of what ppl produce.
>>70875804
Wages of the masses of retards who are unskilled have not increased, skilled wages have risen at a decent albeit slower rate than capital returns.
Learn to code, learn to use a CAD program, learn a trade, all low cost to you ways to get a growing and livable wage. As i said human productivity relative to capital is at all time lows, and will get even lower as more is automated. The economy will change as unskilled wastrels are kept alive by the state with excess capital. That is fine it grows GDP.
You need a skill thats all there is to it, and you get a livable wage, the wealth created by a single unskilled humans work is just negligible at this point.
>>70875498
>>70875424
While Karl Marx invented the word "capitalism", he did so because he was saying that capitalism is all about money. Communism is also all about money.
Inventing a word is not inventing the ideology that word describes, however.
The only ideology of the modern era (in fact, it could be considered to be a postmodern ideology) that seeks to diminish the importance of money in the system is Fascism. While money in Fascism is still the means of exchange, it is not through holding capital that one acquires power. In Fascism, power comes through finding one's place in his syndicate, gaining the admiration of one's peers through work ethic, and is all dependent upon the needs of the state.
>>70876059
What I've said is true for the median worker and only up to 2000.
>>70876084
>Wages of the masses of retards
You mean the middle class? Why do you hate the white working class so much Kikenstein?
also
>learn to code
yeah that will get you out of the mountain of debt it takes to afford anything because wall street jews have raised the debt levels to astronomical highs over the last 30 years
some of you people are just too retarded to live
>>70876059
>>70876329
consumer prices are irrelevant when you're drowning in housing debt
see
>>70871026
>>70876182
Oy vey. Did I call it or did I call it? What's your definition of Fascism here?
>>70876378
>The middle class is made up of unskilled workers
Maybe in the 1950s? The middle class is nurses, engineers, firefighters and such, not farm and factory workers.
>college debt
The methods i suggested all involve certification tests and personal work portfolios you do not need a college degree to get a job in any of those fields, just some time and effort on a computer.
But if you want to blame the jews for economic changes you don't understand, cannot adapt to, are too stupid to comprehend the interwoven systems of the complex economy that gets you a computer to shitpost on, be my guest and stew in your shit.
>>70876598
I got a masters in information systems but no certs yet. i'm paid well and have tons of work.
but my friends who got welding certs thru unions are doing just as well.
>>70876598
I ain't got nothing but a BS and I tell professors what to do sometimes.
>>70876598
>not factory workers.
Yeah those are in China now
Bravo on being a cuck for the Changs
>>70876598
none of that is going to lower the private debt levels
seen
>>70871026
how are you this deluded?
>>70871026
>>70870873
>>70870762
>>70871163
>>70871235
>>70871322
>not accounting for non-cash benefits
>believing the gold meme
>>70876598
also FYI the average person isn't smart enough for STEM fields like it or not
I know there are still faggots on /pol/ that deny IQ being genetic though so you are probably one of those.
>>70876433
You are drowning in housing debt, precisely because housing was the good whose price has increased the most. The median worker, however, has not gained from it, because what really increased in value were land prices, because people are obsessing over living near big cities. Hence, the prices of what the median worker consumes (which includes rent) have increased more than the prices of what he produces.
>>70876890
also STEM wages are just as stagnant as any other wage group so saying "hurr go STEM" makes you retarded. How is that going to combat the rising private debt levels?
>>70876905
>the good whose price has increased the most
because of increased debt from wall street
way to pay attention.
>>70872959
Why is it unfair?
You are payed for skill time and labor which in this scenario doesnt change.
>>70876765
>Private debt levels are bad
Debt isn't bad as long as its paid, consumers themselves decide if they want to leverage their private debt to unsustainable levels.
>Le trade deficit is bad meme
For every dollar the Chinese spend to keep it up is a dollar in our pockets in the form of cheaper prices. If you want to reduce the wealth of your fellow citizens just to wave your nationalistic dick around be my guest.
I mean you're literally operating on a gut feeling understanding of economics, not even a 101 class level. There are certainly some structural problems in the US economy, but none of what you described is anywhere close to what they are. I mean it would be akin to debating physics with a person who doesn't understand newtons formula, I don't even think you know how GDP is calculated, how technological unemployment benefits the economy, how comparative advantage gives benefits from trade.
Well since I have work to do I'll leave you to your delusional non-models spouted by retarded politicians.
>>70877050
No, the growing trend in land prices reflect the high demand for central or near-central locations in big cities on the part of households and firms. What you are saying would mean prices were increasing all across the board. This is not the case. Prices are not increasing in all cities, only in some, and particularly in the big ones.
>>70877243
>delusional non-models spouted by retarded politicians.
So we're talking about LTCM where they somehow weren't let in on how the entire government was crashing the USSR and got taken out in the process because they had mathematically "eliminated" risk?
One gets the feeling that was intentional collateral damage.
>>70877243
>Debt isn't bad as long as its paid,
High private debt levels are inherently bad they raise prices and make affording anything without debt impossible.
Enjoy your million dollar shacks, moron
>Le trade deficit is bad meme
Yes let's send all our jobs to China, and fun their entire country (not to mention their military)
http://www.usnews.com/news/blogs/data-mine/2014/12/11/outsourcing-to-china-cost-us-32-million-jobs-since-2001
what could go wrong?
>>70877479
high demand is created by debt financing
>>70873247
No that answer is trivial, the owners of production
these cucks are making some nebulous claim about how the workers should get payed more just because their employers bought better tools.
>>70870762
>allowed
>>70877492
LTCM's model was equally filled with delusion that there would never be any large scale market panics, it was just as much gambling as playing roulette. Their leveraged gamble was their own grave.
>>70877561
Higher levels of debt does not significantly increase the money supply enough to raise prices on goods. Inflation has been completely stagnant since 2008 until just this year, where the recovering job market is pushing it up.
There is nothing wrong with unemployment, pay them welfare from our capital surplus if they are unwilling or too stupid to get skills ,at least they contribute to GDP that way.
>>70877813
>to raise prices on goods
It raises the price on whatever is borrowed to afford (housing, college, etc) not goods.
>>70877813
>Inflation has been completely stagnant since 2008 until just this year
Which version of inflation are you using? I suppose it's the one that doesn't take food and energy costs into account, says we can consider the price of decent beef to be priced at the level of shit beef, uses the birth/death ratio to rig it even further, and then regularly misreports it so that it can be quietly corrected later on every time without most people knowing. Or is it the one that was based on one gender vs. the other -- oh that's right, gender is a socail construct.
Maybe was it the last time I went to the grocery story or tried to have a bank account? Maybe it was the time I tried to window shop for a new car and it turned out that it would cost me more to by the very same car I already have?
>>70877561
No, high demand is allowed by debt financing (quite a different thing if you think about it). The demand is still there, you wouldn't just allow firms and individuals to forego future consumption to buy what they want now. By limiting debt financing, you would just credit-constrain them and preventing them to make their most preferred choice. Still, note that if people did not want to move to big cities, no amount of aggressive marketing by lenders or low interest rates would change housing prices.
>>70878105
inb4 private debt levels havn't been increasing
>>70878150
>high demand is allowed by debt financing
Which is what raises prices far above what would normally be affordable and what led to the subprime crisis (lending to people who could never afford it)
>>70878150
I'm surprised you can afford anything in Portugal without debt
>>70878170
>>70878299
yes, yes, we need more leverage. Take the limits of the leverage and we can make it work!
>>70870762
Because of the bootlicking libertarianfags.
>>70877561
Debt is usually reactive, as it depends on the underlying expectations and realized outcomes of all economic agents. Debt usually rises because people expect the future to be brighter, not the other way around.
>>70878418
Or the banks can create their own debt be relaxing lending standards and driving up housing prices and therefore private debt
Open borders drive wages down
>>70873247
If the employee's wanting a raise all they half to do is threaten to quite. But guess what. they're still just doing the same skill of pressing a button and can easily be replaced by someone who will press the button at a lower cost.
You did not increase production, the machines did therefore you are still just a useless button pusher.
If you pushed the button twice as fast as most people you can then demand a higher pay and will get it because it was you who produced more and therefor they need you.
>>70878490
>thinking private debt to gdp is relevant
>not looking up US net Worth
KEK
>>70878622
Net worth of what? All the land rights we're selling off? Are you another asset stripper?
>>70878622
yeah that really helps the average goy afford housing and education
thank you shekelberg you opened my eyes
>>70878567
And because of globalism and free trade, there will always be someone willing to work for less. How many Americans need to suffer before we change this, anon?
>>70878299
You are mixing up two different phenomena, which sometimes conflate.
Debt allows demand to be realized. The rise in prices you see reflect actual wants from people. Note again, they reflect actual wants from people. This is what we call efficient allocation of goods. If people really, really want a thing, prices rise as to signal supply to produce more of that thing. In other words, if you credit-constrain people, you do not allow prices to reflect what people really want. This gets price signals all wrong is deemed inefficient.
Bubbles and the recent financial crisis are the result of expectations going haywire and problems of incentives inside financial institutions. This is a completely different beast to take on and is much, much more complex than you put it. What I said in the paragraph is what is always happening in the economy, under recession or not. What I'm saying in this one happened in very particular moments in history. Don't conflate the two.
>>70878390
Is this supposed to be an argument? I don't get your point here.
>>70878726
get in that cage goy, Chang will work for pennies if we tell him to.
It's where you belong
>>70878967
>Debt allows demand to be realized
Debt allows banks to make more on interest and trading mortgages
>Is this supposed to be an argument?
Your country is getting raped by debt and you don't seem to care
>>70878490
"banks can create their own debt" does not make any sense.
Again, preventing people from being credit-constrained allows prices to reflect actual wants from people.
Also, increasing private debt as % of GDP is not really a problem per se. The real issue is how that debt is being serviced.
>>70878967
Debt can work, such as in the case Hjalmar Schact, or Kublai Khan, who issued script to juice domestic production.
It doesn't work in the modern conception or in the case of for instance China who built ghost cities just to fight the currency war. That doesn't work.
>>70870762
THE MISLEADING CLAIM: Incomes have not kept pace with productivity.
The Reality: This is arguably true, but even if accepted as true, it remains entirely misleading if not set in the proper context. Allow us to explain via thought experiment:
Imagine "Joe" could have a product simply by wishing it into existence. Perhaps a large winter jacket because it's been quite cold lately.
Now, this may sound like a silly question with an obvious answer, but in this scenario, had Joe previously not owned a winter jacket, did his quality-of-lifeincrease once obtaining the jacket? The obvious answer should be, "yes, of course."
Now consider all the hours he worked that week and all the goods he's acquired that week. His weekly labor numbers would not have changed from the prior week. It would still be 40 hours of labor and 40 hours of income. However, the number of "goods acquired" increased by the magical production of that one additional item; his new winter jacket.
On paper, what just happened?
What happened was that his income did not improve at pace with productivity increases. Regardless of this fact, however, that additionally produced item improved the quality of his life.
At this point of the thought experiment, one might be questioning the absurdity of suggesting that products can manifest magically. While true that this is hyperbolic, the point remains that labor and income did not increase in order for quality of life to increase. Now, remembering this specific point, let's demonstrate how this concept actually occurs in the real world.
>part II soon
>>70879188
>"banks can create their own debt" does not make any sense.
That's how the financial system has always worked
Banks create their own debt by fiat.
>Also, increasing private debt as % of GDP is not really a problem per se
Of course it is because it makes housing unaffordable without increasing levels of debt
>>70879376
Consider the introduction of computerized automation in a factory. Workmen who once produced only 1 automobile a day could instead produce 10. If one were to add up the hours worked by each employee, little would have changed in terms of time, and yet additional products were created, almost like magic.
Again, on paper, what happened?
What happened was that incomes did not improve at pace with productivity increases. And again, regardless of this fact, the additionally produced items still improved the quality of people's lives.
The term to learn here is "Total-Factor Productivity." "Total-factor productivity captures the contribution to output of everything EXCEPT labor and capital: innovation, managerial skill, organization, even luck." [a] Increases in this type of productivity have, in the long run, benefited society greatly.
We mustn't look at productivity increases via automation and forget that they couldn't continue to be viable business options unless the products were actually being purchased. It can't be denied, then, that the population IS experiencing these additional goods, DESPITE the fact that wages have not increased at the same rate as production.
The last question to ponder is whether the loss of jobs that comes with increased automation is a net detriment or not. Luckily, empirical evidence indicates this is not the case. Based on a formula by Gilles Saint-Paul, an economist at Toulouse 1 University, the demand for unskilled human capital DECLINES at a slower rate than the demand for skilled human capital INCREASES. [b] This means, as time passes, we drift upwards into more luxurious positions which rely less on unskilled labor.
>Conclusion and sources next
>>70878133
This comment is fucking garbage and you should kill yourself.
>>70879482
CONCLUSION:
The end result of increases in total-factor productivity is that our goods grow in quality and abundance while our jobs grow less strenuous and more luxurious. There's some truth in the claim that wages have partially stagnated since the 70's. What's more appropriate, however, is to remember that this doesn't really matter, since WEALTH (income + assets) has improved. As many economists have proven time and time again, PRODUCTION is the fundamental source of wealth creation, rendering all other variables less pertinent. So when automation results in more products from less manual labor, yes, it's increasing our wealth, despite our incomes not increasing at the same rate.
-----------------------
Sources:
[a]
http://www.econlib.org/library/Enc1/Productivity.html
[b]
https://press.princeton.edu/chapters/i8659.pdf (this is the copyright info and introduction only. Complete book must be purchased.)
>OP on suicide watch
>>70879500
Educate me.
>>70879482
>>70879376
>not one mention of debt
this is how blupilled and retarded libertarians really are
real red pill
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gToAMHq0IiQ
>>70870762
FIAT CURRENCY
>>70879653
Help me out. What does "fiat" mean?
All I know about it is "Fix It Again Tony" and then it got sold off to the head of the Bilderberg Group.
>>70879141
Don't forget that there are actual limits to how much a bank can lend set by capital requirements. Therefore, banks cannot increase debt to infinite and have to extra careful the projects they lend to are actually profitable, or they lose their banking license. More debt -> more interest -> more profits for banks is not really, really true. It is mostly true. Still, I don't get your point here. You stated the obvious. Is it supposed to be bad?
My country's growth stagnated in the 2000s. Governments thought it was a mild recession and tried to boost demand, which increased debt. They tried and tried and failed (like Japan, that did try and failed as well). That and public workers here have a really strong lobby, so the wage bill in the public sector was out of control. Lastly, you have the typical shenanigans by politicians.
>>70879738
Currency that is not backed by an inherently valuable commodity.
>>70870762
in case any of you deluded commies are still in this thread.
from https://research.stlouisfed.org/publications/es/07/ES0707.pdf
I have several others to post. The image in OP is highly misleading.
>>70879797
Why did they stop trying to keep the banks to Basel rules in 2010?
I mean, c'mon, it's 2016!
>>70879647
This is why you fail at debating. Debt was not apart of the equation on the field.
>>70879867
What "fiat" really means is that the dictator dictates what it is.
>>70872959
>the company invests in the machine, not the employee
>the employee should benefit from the financial risks and investments even though they aren't working harder/longer
but the economy is recovering :^)
>>70879912
With a larger timeline.
>>70879797
>there are actual limits to how much a bank can lend set by capital requirements.
That's a myth
http://michael-hudson.com/2010/01/wall-streets-power-grab-the-financial-crisis-inquiry-commission-hearings/
>>70879923
This is why libertarians fail at everything
>>70879647
Also
>Keyensian trash
hows breaking window for you?
>>70880035
Stop halting our economic recovery.
>>70880061
>not even arguing
Let the grownups speak
>>70880041
>>70880071
>log scale
kek
>being a heritage kike shill
no wonder
also
>Krugman
>Keysian
kek he is a neoclassical shill
>>70880126
libertarians aren't adults
They have the economic understanding of a child.
>>70879481
"Banks create their own debt" means they lend money to themselves. This is non-sense. I understood what you said, but note you are not being clear at all.
The financial system has not always worked that way.
The fact that banks can create money without having reserves backing it is not really that important because debt is driven by demand, not supply. This is actually good, as it allows the amount of money borrow to fluctuate with demand, meaning that interest rates don't spike seasonally or in the presence of a big demand shock.
Housing is unaffordable because people with higher expected future income than you have borrowed money to buy a house near a big city. If you want to know who these people are, look at all the highly educated immigrants flowing into your country. They are not going to Alabama or some other random state. They are going exactly to the places where housing prices are rising. This is exactly what is happening is Lisbon, as the highly educated immigrants live in Lisbon. This is also what is happening in virtually all capitals of the developed world.
>keynesians
>>70880041
Further, real compensation per hour does not measure healthcare and other employer benefits. I would imagine that, when adjusting for the discrepencies in this table (from http://www.nber.org/papers/w17164.pdf), compensation would actually exceed productivity by 2012.
>>70880289
>they lend money to themselves
No, they lend money to us at interest.
>>70880289
>"Banks create their own debt" means they lend money to themselves
They lend to dumb shmucks trying to afford the housing prices they're increasing
>>70879915
Basel III, from 2010 onward is a thing.
>>70880405
I'm getting the feeling Portugal is being taken over by Jews.
>>70880375
They lend money to the rich then our descendants pay the interest.
We don't get anything because we get the currency at its deflated value.
>>70880320
maybe if you didn't fail math as a grade schooler and understood keynesianism, you'd come to revelation that they're measuring sand for sandbags using the wheelbarrow
>>70880218
The information in that graph is consistent both with actual BLS data and St. Louis Fed analysis. What makes me a Heritage shill?
What problem do you have with log scale? Are you so lacking in imagination that you would accuse the graph of misrepresenting information?
>>70870762
Reagan
>>70880466
Really? I'll wait for the international news headline.
>>70880365
healthcare itself is a giant debt bubble
you really are too dumb to live
>>70880538
>using a LOG graph to manipulate people
you are such a dumb pawn
>>70880061
Where does that blog post say banks are not bounded by capital requirements?
>>70880629
Do you know what the laws are in the City of London Corporation?
>>70880375
Thank you for stating the obvious. Still, you probably think that's a bad thing.
>>70880609
>the regulatory capital requirements for holding these rated instruments were far lower than for directly holding these toxic loans,
>>70880538
also just keep pretending wages didn't decrease
your denial is astounding
>>70880724
Not many people understand leverage apparently.
>>70880218
>He keeps proving my point by not arguing
enjoying yourself?
>Keyensian
>Neo-Classical
HOLY BALLS YOU'RE GOING ALL OUT ON THIS ONE!
>>70880724
It's a bad thing unless you're a kike living off rent seeking and squeezing ht economy until it's dead.
>>70880825
Krugman is a neoclassical shill for wall street
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoclassical_economics
>>70879538
This is great. Then it would seem to me that the increasing misery in the USA is because of Kikes causing and exploiting structural issues in the system. Rather than feeling more free over time, the average person is either under more pressure or he's already completely dependent on the government.
>>70880677
enlighten me
>>70880816
I probably don't, yeah. If I don't agree you, it must be because I'm either a shill or really a dumb person.
>>70880963
They operate under the Universal Commercial Code. This allows for what's called infinite rehypothication.
Would you like a book about it?
>>70880609
>healthcare itself is a giant debt bubble
What the fuck are you talking about? In the Austrian sense? There are a variety of reasons healthcare costs have risen, and regardless of why, a person who receives health benefits should be said to receive compensation equal to the value of the care they receive from their employer, or as much as the employer pays. The US dollar is over-valued IMO. Does that detract from its relevance in measuring income?
>you really are too dumb to live
>you are such a dumb pawn
Why do you have such a hostile attitude? Are you trying to assert how smart you are? Because I can tell you're not that smart. You haven't adequately addressed any of my counter-points.
>manipulate people
who? Retards who don't know how to read a LOG graph? LOG graphs are advantageous in showing growth anyway.
>>70880800
Real hourly wages, as measured in pre-tax pre-transfer dollar units, have decreased. So fucking what? That's not the only way people make money.
>>70881087
You should, considering the naval force you once were.
>>70876890
Pretty much this. This is why I laugh when I hear these fucktard politicians and their "advisors" spouting the STEM meme as a means to employ blue-collar workers in the "new economy".
>Hurr we a service and technology economy now!
Good luck getting both Eustice and Sha'aniquah a STEM degree. Hell they couldn't cut 2 years at ITT Tech for an "Electronics Technology" certificate.
Long story short, the US is going to start collapsing under its own weight in the next 30 years. Look forward to a consistent 20-30% unemployment (which is 40-50% real unemployment) with 40-50% tax rates on the middle class.
It was a good run. Start planning your exit strategy. The kikes sure are.
>>70880861
So, you say banks deserve no compensation for their activity? You say what banks do is useless and nobody is willing to pay them for their service?
>>70881171
I once had a Jew in the family (ended in a divorce)
You wouldn't believe the litany of execuses.
>>70880925
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Krugman
are you seriously this retarted? Here let me guide you through the link because you might get lost or dick stuck in ceiling fan.
>step one: Highlight the link provided by left clicking and passing over the link.
>step two: ctrl+c
>step three: open new tab
>step four: left click on the clear top white bar
>step five: ctrl+v and then press enter
>step six: find school of tradition in the link
>step seven: ???
>step eight: fell like a fucking retard
seriously, who ties your shoes? You are obviously not paying them enough and they deserve a severe pay raise to deal with your level of economic retardation.
>>70881108
>rehypothication
What you said has nothing to do with capital requirements.
You can tell me about the book, if you want. It's always interesting to know one's source.
>>70877561
>Le trade deficit is bad meme
Yep, you're a delusional retard with 0 background in economics.
>>70880365
>>70880609
Also, even when you don't account for healthcare, real median wage growth in the next-most expansive metric was measured to be 29.4%, compared to 36.7%.
>>70881454
>What you said has nothing to do with capital requirements.
What I said eliminates capital requirements.
>>70880943
why do you think most jews try to implant themselves into banks closely linked to the US Fed? To gain access to special privileged loans that purposely cause a bailout situation for more tax free government money.
>>70881156
Our countries' history is irrelevant to this discussion.
>>70881541
No, it doesn't. Check the composition of Tier 1 and Tier 2 capital.
>>70881555
You sir are a based /pol/lack.
>>70881559
>>70881722
You probably don't belong to your country.
>>70881128
>There are a variety of reasons healthcare costs have risen,
There's one reason. Increased debt and price gouging through corporate collusion
>So fucking what?
Maybe if you're a rent seeking jewish wall street billionaire it doesn't matter, if you work for a living it does. Debt and housing prices actually matter for real people
>>70881171
They get free money from the FED and lend it out at interest
they do literally nothing productive.
>>70881445
"New Keynesian" makes him a neoclassical shill
>>70881535
>0 background in economics
people with a background in economics got us the 2008 crisis. You are a cancer in society
>don't account for healthcare
a price bubble
>real median wage growth
declined
>>70881555
Triple nickle of pure truth
Many factors. Deregulating of wall street, decline of unionization and outsourcing are the main causes.
>>70881830
>the FED and lend it out at interest
wait who pays the interest
>>70872942
It's not so much that, but women entered the workforce because wages were declining. A household just couldn't work on one income in the 80s.
>>70881830
1: his school of tradition is Keyensian
2: I do not believe you understand what "Neo-Classical Economics" is
3: Retake Economics 200 (Intro to Economics), 201 (Intro to Micro Economics), & 202 (Intro to Macro Economics)
Because all you are doing now is "No it's not because I said so," you have no argument.
>>70882143
Should I link the propaganda again?
>>70881790
Irrelevant.
>>70881830
And banks have no additional costs in their activity? Check the annual report of a bank. Even if banks had no profit, there would still be interest.
Nobody gives a shit I hope you all stay poor
>>70882285
>You probably don't beloIng to your country.
>Irrelevant.
>>70882204
Okay. I like knowledge.
>>70881830
>There's one reason. Increased debt and price gouging through corporate collusion
No, there are others, too. For example, baby boomers are started to get to the dying age. This means that there is more competition for health care. Here are some others. Your absolute inability to account for these drives a hole through how seriously anyone can take you. http://www.mcgrathinsurance.com/node/50
>"New Keynesian" makes him a neoclassical shill
Yes, advocating for a trillion dollar coin and a ridiculously large fiscal stimulus every year sure is shilling for the neoclassical fags.
>people with a background in economics got us the 2008 crisis. You are a cancer in society
Okay, I will stop pretending to take you seriously. You have never walked into an econ classroom and are 100% unqualified to have anything to say about economic policy.
>a price bubble
You didn't address my point:
>a person who receives health benefits should be said to receive compensation equal to the value of the care they receive from their employer, or as much as the employer pays
>declined
Only if you measure it in a very specific way, which doesn't accurately measure what people are getting paid. http://www.nber.org/papers/w17164.pdf
You complain about my LOG graph misrepresenting info, and now you can't even read my posts, wherein I present real data?
You are wrong about everything you have posted about so far, and will probably continue to be wrong for such a long time because you are so unlearned in the ways of reason.
>>70882446
Tell me what you want.
>>70882299
>nobody gives a shit
>except everybody who lives in America
You do realize that unless you were at the very tip of the pyramid, you are worse off, right? Even the 90%-95% of Americans are worse off under the current economy.
>>70882597
Tell me why women caused the wage gap. I want to know more.
>>70882612
I make around $300k/yr - I'm good.
>>70870762
it's only gonna get worse as robots take the place of cheap human labor.
>>70882400
Borders are meaningless. As things stand, if I wanted I could be living in France, Sweden, Mozambique, the US or Singapore by 2017 if I wanted. Do you really think I care about borders?
>>70872292
>Stephen Friedman is married to Barbara Benioff, chairwoman of the board of governors of Hebrew Union College. The couple live on Fifth Avenue in Manhattan, and have three children: two daughters, Susan and Caroline, and a son, David Benioff. Benioff, who goes by his mother’s maiden name, is a writer, screenwriter and creator of Game of Thrones
>>70882834
wrote if i wanted twice, meh
>>70882675
I would suggest looking into the SDS.
>>70882725
>>70882612
There's something to the Don's cock's point. A lot of the shitty stats about the American economy only really apply to mexicans and niggers. White America, economically at least, is doing better than the rest of the world, with the exception perhaps of Switzerland and a variety of micronations.
>>70882776
>more productive
>worse
Communism 101
>>70882916
Bingo. Nobody fucking cares about the beaners and the niggers. White poor are even doing far better than them.
>>70882725
Maybe so, but you should be earning way more. A 6 figure job is quite an achievement, but if things kept going as they did in the middle of the century, your 300k of annual labor would be much higher.
>>70882995
>more productive with no workers to earn wages to buy thing made by robots
the whole thing collapses with something drastic happening
>>70870762
Automation and other technological advances made productivity go up with significantly less effort from the workers.
>>70882916
They only look well off. The truth is that keeping us poor will generate DEBT! JEWISH BANKERS LOVE TO KEEP US IN DEBT!!!
>>70870762
FREE MARKET FUCK YEA
>>70883186
I see no real solution besides a basic income. People aren't going to starve, they're going to vote.
>>70883099
My nigga, I work maybe 20 hours a week.
>>70883215
>JEWISH BANKERS LOVE TO KEEP US IN DEBT!!!
YEAH! WHICH IS WHY THEY HAVE IMPLEMENTED NEGATIVE INTEREST RATES...!
>>70870762
Machines have increased productivity without needing more workers
Wages are not the only form of employment compensation. You have benefits and pension plans as well.
Go back to rhoddit
>>70883320
Where are you seeing negative rates aside for Japan and a couple of shitcuck Eurotrash countries?
>>70883281
So you agree with the oligarch solution of bread and circus on some fundamental level that is how basic income is understood.
>>70883281
Either that or Luddite wars.
>>70871026
oh no goy, mass immigration is about LOVE
we should be taking cues from King Leaf and force everyone to take all the homeless dogs and cats into their houses. 10 minimum animals and then we would solve world hunger. Don't be a fucking BIGOT.
feels the bern 2015
>>70883186
...are you saying, the automated robots just put the money under their mattresses? Doesn't anyone own them?
>>70883281
>basic income
utterly retarded. Do you realize how unproductive many people would become?
That being said, a negative income tax would be nice.
>>70883090
You know it, Don!
What is going to happen in 10 years when every truck driver and taxi driver loses their job and gets replaced by auto-driving cars?
Even the desperate people making last resort money with Uber will be screwed.
Is there a way to absorb these millions of jobless people into other areas?
>This thread
JIDF SHILLS BTFO
>>70883581
Kill yourself desu senpai
>>70883320
FED gives low interest rates to wall street
higher interest rates are charged for goys
>>70883530
If you have a army or robots making widgets and nobody to buy them, where dose your money to operate the robots come from?
>>70882143
Its a self fulfilling prophecy just like immigration. I'm not saying unemancipate them but this outcome basically assassinates the one paycheck family.
>>70870762
Again, about this graph. It is flawed because it deflates productivity with producer prices, which is correct, but it deflates wages with consumer prices. At a first glance, this seems right, as workers buy stuff at consumer prices. The issue is that they receive at producer prices. If you look at a similar series where wages were deflated using producer prices, you would see both series growing hand in hand.
What this graph actually shows is that consumer prices for the median worker have increased more than the prices of the things he produces. This is also an important issue, but it is being framed in a completely misleading way.
>>70883546
>What is going to happen in 10 years when every truck driver and taxi driver loses their job and gets replaced by auto-driving cars?
>What is going to happen when our 85% agrarian workforce is replaced by modern agriculture? Where are they going to get their jobs? We need a central planning agency, quick!
>>70883372
positive i - positive inflation (higher than i) = negative r
neoliberal capitalism. /pol/ can't take the redpill on this one, too much libertardian influence.
the destruction of labor unions, largely abandoning keynesian macroeconomic policies that caused much-higher growth rates in the 50s and 60s, declining government investment in R&D. more privatizations.
reaganism and thatcherism, and the related phenomena across the developed world, destroyed the golden age of capitalism which existed 1945-1973 and was caused by strong unions, high government spending on productive programs and keynesian macroeconomic policy. the right-wing economic arrangements that replaced it have caused much lower growth, lower productivity, higher unemployment, stagnant wages.
>>70883750
Liberals being misleading? What a shock.
