Okay niggers time to teach you how an economy grows. An economy is the wealth of a nation, combined with the production/consumption of goods and services. Economies grow through entrepreneurship. Almost explicitly. Production and consumption. Your business guy gets a loan, starts a business, and produces by providing good or service. He hires people to operate his capital, pays them. These people take their income and buy shit from other businesses. This, over time, leads to expansion of the businesses, which means more hiring, which means more production, etc.
This virtuous cycle will continue to grow the economy. We've never seen any sort of ceiling because any truly capitalist nation succumbs to socialism before it can reach its potential. Gubment can't grow the economy except by shrinking itself and getting out of the way of entrepreneurs. Socialists get rekt. Pic slightly relevant.
>muh invisible hand
entrepreneurship can't grow where there are monopolies. look at how facebook and google are absorbing smaller firms
>Your business guy gets a loan, starts a business, and produces by providing good or service
You skipped out on the best part. For every business that makes it 10 fail within three years paying the bank back a fuckload of of interest over the next god knows how long meanwhile conglomerates get bailed out by the same person who's business failed.
>>70091511
>>70091307
Niggers, this isn't a capitalism debate. This is understanding an economy. Economies grow by having more producers and consumers. Both of these come from businesses. Businesses produce, consumers only consume because of the income they earn working for a business.
>>70091307
I consider my self a supporter of capitalism honestly, but the risk of monopilization really worries me. I can't wholly have faith in the invisible hand because free-market capitalism is too rationalistic: it doesn't take into account human's capacity to do irrational things and intentionally destroy one another. I would argue that it too only works perfectly in theory akin to socialism, HOWEVER it is way more grounded in reality and is actually sustainable, unlike socialism.
I would really only support capitalism at the end of the day, but moderation is something to be upheld, and sadly it seems the government is the only thing that can uphold the law. Honor system doesn't do shit when trillions of dollars are in flux.
Everything in the world is entirely too corruptible.
>>70091668
Gay shit. Monopolies can't be maintained absent state power. Without the gubment forcing people out of competition, the incentive to break ranks and undercut the monopoly makes it too easy to break up said monopoly.
>>70091142
>"Socialists get rekt"
>posts image of crypto-Marxist kike
kill urself
>>70091142
>this is how economy works
>pic related (Milton Jewman)
>a guy with an economic theory that had no entrepreneurs in it
>>70092093
>>70092145
Not seeing anything other than shitpost. Just nitpicking my only economics-related macro.
>>70092093
I never heard of the guy before, but I completely agree with this and OP image.
Can you redpill me on him? Not all Jews are part of the lobby, you know. Or maybe in Murika they are?
>>70093310
There's not much to red pill. The man was a visionary and his books are /pol/ required reading.
Start with Free To Choose.
>>70093310
>>70093477
He's right, not much for redpill. Friedman was a Nobel economist who was of the Austrian school of economics, generally favoring free market capitalism. His vids on YouTube show him effortlessly schooling niggers on history and how capitalism is gr8.
Entrepreneurship my friend.
>>70093310
He was the founder of Monetarism, a theory that's discarded today.
>>70093656
Milton Friedman's theories had no entrepreneurs in it.
>>70093310
he backs the same policies as every jew ever. From Ricardo to present day, kike economists always solemnly chant, it's "Goyim, open borders pls," and "Goyim, no tariff now", and "Goyim, free trade".
this is not surprising, as they are a race of nation-hopping merchants. their way of life is built on being able to slip in and out of as many nations as possible, as quickly as possible, and bringing their wares to market in as many nations as possible, paying as little % in exchange for the right to market their goods there as possible.
jew policies are great for jews, but they are destructive of the middle class - if you are in the ethnic majority of your nation, kikes seek to liquidate your middle class, and turn you into proletariat.
Friedman is the least obnoxious jew economist, and blue pill republicans love holding him up as a token, but the policies he repped are toxic to you and your nation, unless you are a jew.
>>70093754
Of course it is. Jews in governments don't want to let go of them delicious shekels.
>>70093477
>required reading
for niggers and kikes, maybe
>>70093656
>Nobel prize
king nigger got one of these as a participation trophy, kind of takes the shine off it (if you are a thinking man, that is)
>>70093886
haha this is pretty funny seeing as Milton disliked Karl Marx and his theories.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DYeYPcougmA
>>70091142
You only forgot the part in which the guys getting the loans are the friends of politicians and bankers while the common folk can't get one even to buy a house
>muh free market
>muh economy is everything
>muh fuck the poor
Borrow Money to make money to spend money to make money. Pyramid scheme
>>70093886
That is partially true, but the fact is, free economies do better than regulated ones. As Serbian economists put it: there is no brain smarter than the market.
For example, the reason why the US became so great was because the government didn't interfere with economy, so the economy grew. The reason why they're going to shit is because kikes in the government shove their kike fingers in every pore of the system, hoping to make more money off of it.
No, here's the truth about the Jews: they're not THAT much better at making money than the rest of us, so in a perfectly free market that they can't interfere with, they would be pretty well off due to their cunning and unity, but they would never be able to come to the tippy top, simply because they're HEAVILY OUTNUMBERED. But the way for a 1% minority to become rulers of the world is to control the global economy, but CONVINCE the world that it's free, in spite of constant government interventionism.
And that's the only thing the Jews are stellar at: convincing. 99% of them are leftist shills and they are strongly opposed to such radical free market related ideas like this fine gentleman seems to have, but they successfully convinced even the people who hate them, that that's exactly what they support.
Don't fall for Jew tricks, my good man, and keep fighting the good fight.
>>70094254
This is the part where they pretend that they and their economist heroes don't support that.
>>70094122
He may scoff at the name Karl Marx, or at the names of Marx's theories, but at rock bottom, they both advocate the same thing: race blind ideology.
Nations are made up of men, and it is the racial composition of those men that determine what kind of society they will have. If it's Indo-Europeans, you will have an advanced nation. If it's niggers in africa, there will be problems.
Kikes always preach some type of gospel, some type of primitive universalism that says a human is a human, people are all the same, and if we adopt the same political or religious outlook, it will be like a magic spell that binds us all together and transforms something into a utopia. It's all bullshit.
Race is the limiting factor. If stupid people outbreed the good genetic stock, racial degeneration sets in and you are bound for another dark ages, no matter what "values" are preached in the pulpit or the school or whatever.
>>70091736
Unless the field has an extremely low barrier to entry, it's not realistic to simply "break ranks and undercut."
>>70094254
>common folk won't get any loans
This is false in any truly capitalist country, if there is profit to be made then a capitalist will do it. Now if the risk involved is too damn high to ensure he gets at least his investment back, because you're a crackdealer and don't have a stable job, then he would refuse.
>>70094262
> Lacking fundemental understandment of a pyramid scheme.
The stuff the people buy is useless, money isn't useless.
>>70094833
Jews see themselves as chosen people. It's written in their book and they never lose the thought of treating the rest of the world as their kettle.
They build a strawmen of hate every single time. Judging someone on factors they can't change is stupid. Noone wants to just hate ugly people, they were born this way, it's not their fault.
Every good argument against degeneracy will then be shouted down as "DAS RAZISM". They think people are a blank sheet and anything can be written on them, so telling them everything is equal and good will automatically make them equal. That niggers will just stop being more violent than white men. That women are just as capable in technical jobs or leading positions. That will lead to a downfall and the people are paving this way with their good intentions of a better, peaceful world.
>>70091142
>Implying the economy can grow infinitely
That is what has caused the rapefugee problem.
>>70096398
> That is what has caused the rapefugee problem.
How?
And no, economy is bond on things like resources and therefore there is a limit. Nonethenless, it can grow more and more and we are far away from a limit yet.
>>70098704
Native population birth rates are below replacement levels because we're overpopulated as fuck and nobody wants kids, so kikes import mudslimes who will have 10 children.
And OP described the capitalism as an ever-growing economy, so what happens when we reach the limit?
>>70098704
>How?
Native European population isn't increasing so big business is pushing for more and more immigration as replacements.
>>70094610
Stop right there.
>US became so great...
Because they were, in past, almost ethnically homogeneous nation living on an empty continent which was sparsely populated (they killed off natives) and abundant with resources.
>Don't fall for Jew tricks
You just fell for what you call ''Jew tricks'' you dumb ass.
>>70098704
The whole rationale for mass immigration is that as economies advance the birthrate falls, when the birthrate falls enough GDP drops
immigration is a "solution" to the inevitable drop in GDP of developed nations. without the need for unrestrained growth we wouldn't have our current unrestrained migration problem
>>70099389
Exactly. Yet dummies here are too blind to understand that system is the problem, not some mythical conspiracies and cabals.
They see the problem but they are too stuck in memes to understand what's behind it.
>gets a loan
>>70099270
>>70099389
Nah, the immigration is more of a short-time solution to take another loan from the Rothschild dynasty to build public housing and keep the people working, produce shit for leechers that they pay for with your taxes.
The birthrate is at 1.4 in Germany, it should be raised by 50% hopefully, but just importing useless analphabets won't fix anything for the elder.
Germany just introduced a minimum wage in 2014, they fucked the school system, so only rich people will be able to afford a decent education for their kids through expensive tuition or private schools, the best refugees can hope for is becoming second to the turks and the worst scenario is becoming the french niggers selling you faked watches in shady corners.
>>70091307
intellectual property requires a state to enforce
unless you can keep a trade secret, a secret, the market is going to improve your idea
>>70092093
divide and conquer
dorner sheds a tear
>>70093886
>>70094833
you are pretty retarded brother
the only thing our massive welfare state has done is ensure nonwhites have power they otherwise would not have
building a wall is a solution to protect our welfare state but without it the only people coming across the border are those that could survive without a welfare state
>>70091142
>loans
>quote from Friedman
Hey goy the economy depends on us investing in entrepreneurs, give shekels so the economy stays stable.
>>70091307
No monopoly has ever survived without government support.
>>70102260
That's because monopolies have always been able to purchase government support.
>>70102065
nigger, the illegal spics who cross the border, per capita, take the biggest share of welfare.
it's like you say, but backwards - without the wall, the only people coming across the border are those that could survive without a welfare state, faggot.
kill yourself, kike, you worthless piece of slime. Where the fuck do you think you are?
Fucking great thread. I'm learning a shitload. New to the board but quickly finding this time of day is best for serious discussion. Lurking more...
>>70102260
what government support has google received?
>>70102979
>*those that can't survive without a welfare state
fixed
>>70102436
bifurcation fallacy http://www.logicalfallacies.info/presumption/false-dilemma/
>Goyim, either we must be allowed to cheat and steal from you under doctrine of Laissez Faire, where you government you constituted to protect you from us just stands by and does nothing, OR you must reject the very principle of government
>Goyim, it's either heads we win, or tails you lose - get it? we are g-d's chosen, goyim - don't question it
>>70091609
That is true in a society where there is no financial capital. Financial Capital is a hole new type of capital, that is why the current system doesn't work anymore because people still think that the world economy is still ruled by the same rules as it did 150 years ago.
>dat redpill friedman moment
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RWsx1X8PV_A
>>70102436
>talks up "Laissez Faire" as the only alternative to chaos
>has a hook nose
every fucking time
>"imagine the shekels, goyim!"
it's just so fucking obvious, mordecai. get a new schtick, brother.
>>70103029
>what government support has google received?
what really?
>>70093656
>Friedman
>Austrian
Pick one. He called the Austrian school a "cult".
>>70103029
Look up the "Highlands Forum". Track from there.
>>70104514
>>70105636
Thank you both, for the information. I consider switching to some GNU/Linux shit, even if I enjoyed my time with Windows 7
>>70091142
>our business guy gets a loan
You forgot the part about bank creating infinite amount of money out of thin air and then charging interest for it.
>>70091142
The problem with free-marketism is that the end result will always be monopolies and concentration of more and more money in fewer and fewer hands.
>>70091511
> Some businesses fail
>"Oy vey capitalism is so unfair"
>>70093656
>Austrian
Not in your wildest dreams. He shares only superficial similarities with Austrians.
>>70108215
Please explain how government intervention in the economy in any way prevents the development of monopolies more efficiently than the free-market.
>>70093310
>Can you redpill me on him?
not much to redpill.
friedman is basically DUDE FREE MARKET LMAO incarnate. his answer to literally every problem is to reduce government regulation.
trusting him on social issues or matters of national security would be a disaster, but when it comes to business and economics, he's one of the best.
his lectures are available on youtupe, go check them out. pretty enjoyable to listen to.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=77fdRWpV_-4
>>70108756
how would friedman handle the situation around the panama papers?
>>70108433
How about international agreement to outlaw tax havens? Decent start? If we weren't livng in this age of unreason then the super-rich could be taxxed more progressively. Without places like the BVI they'd be forced to be open about their accounts and could face a wealth tax.
Current laws are meant to prevent monopolies. The guy I replied to was proposing less gov intervention, presumably including scrapping rules against monopolies.
>>70109084
if he were still alive he'd probably conclude that getting rid of taxes altogether would eliminate the need for complex international tax evasion schemes altogether, and thus propose lower taxes and less regulations. as he did with fucking everything.
>>70109244
> How about international agreement to outlaw tax havens?
No. Not a decent start. That does fuck all about monopolies which is what my question was about. What does taxing the rich have to do with monopolies? And why should we tax the rich "more progressively". It's their money, not our money and i am not a communist so why would i want to take an unfair percentage of their money away from them?
>>70109400
A simpler tax system that wouldn't even open these loopholes seems reasonable. In the end it's a complete joke to just open free trade with a tax haven.
Friedman seemed really smart, on what issues was he wrong?
>>70109674
The second bit of my post dealt with monoploies and also highlighted how your entire position relative to my comment was irrelevant. But crack on like you've made an argument lad.
>And why should we tax the rich "more progressively"
Because they are getting progressively richer, helped along by the fact that they write our fucking tax laws.
>It's their money
Like the billions they took in bonuses since 2008? You remember, that 2008 when they were bailed out by the taxpayer. And lets think a little deeper about this. Can you remember why we had to bail them out? In your opinion this was a result of over-regulation right?
>>70110618
Jesus christ. Listen to this 16 year old socialist bullshit you are saying.
> they write our fucking tax laws
> the billions they took in bonuses since 2008
Not all rich people made their money in malicious ways. It's capitalism, people get rich. Get over it. The taxes on the rich are too high already just like the taxes on the poor and middle-class are too high. Rich pepole have just as much right to their money as everyone else, they aren't a piggy bank for the state to spend on whatever shit they want.
>>70110618
>The second bit of my post dealt with monoploies
Yeah i know. And the first half was irrelevant bullshit.
>>70110618
the bailout was mostly paid back, if we wouldn't have bailed out the banks, lots of people would've lost not only their jobs, but all their savings.
>>70110880
Taxing poorer people less isn't fair, but it's a good way to ensure poorer people can spend more money to make a good contribution to society.
If poor people would have a 35% tax, they would have to start at much higher-paying jobs to simply survive without government assistence.
But I would never raise taxes over 50%.
>>70091142
>Gubment can't grow the economy except by shrinking itself
Roads
>>70110880
>calls me 16
>is unrionically free-marketeer
>probably condemns neo-liberalism cause he thinks it is something to do with SJW
Holy shit it's fucking true.
Oh and you don't think the people who help billionaires avoid tax write our tax laws? Shows how depressingly little you know.
> 'Big four' accountants 'use knowledge of Treasury to help rich avoid tax'
http://www.theguardian.com/business/2013/apr/26/accountancy-firms-knowledge-treasury-avoid-tax
Now on you go lad. Keep being a little FMIDF faggot and dismiss the above based on the source. It really can't make you look any dafter at this stage.
>>70111351
Bailouts are just one aspect of the government subsidised business that some of you exalt. All you shits complaining about regulation seem to ignore the fact that large corporations suck up billions in tax a year cause they pay so shitty.
>>70111516
He argues that people would come together to invest into roads or that companies would build them, just like companies built railroads. In the end, government building stuff results in the people in charge of getting the project done will ask their friends to build the stuff, resulting in heavy delays, cost explosion and more. When the company doing the work doesn't have to perform better than any other company, the company has no motivation to use more than their minimal resources to get the work done.
Infrastructur is the only thing that people usually easily disagree about with Friedman.
>>70091307
t. Ahmet Roach
>>70112303
>government building stuff results in the people in charge of getting the project done will ask their friends to build the stuff
Only if you have a shitty government. Most modern countries have assloads of laws to stop that shit from happening. Gotta have public records of who picked the contractor and why. Gotta declare conflicts of interest in advance, just like in a corporate environment. It doesn't always work out, but it's much better than trying to have pull private roads.
Roads and railways are also pretty much impossible without eminent domain style laws. Also need government for planning and zoning.
I agree government should be as small as possible, but a government needs a reasonable amount of stuff. People who say "smaller the better no matter what" for governments are retards.
