So are Bernie and his supporters even aware that raising the minimum wage will also increase the cost of living?
not every single thing will increase. overall minimum wage increase will improve the standard of living
>>69753132
And a ton of people can enjoy that improved standard of living while being unemployed because of let-offs due to the increased minimum wage.
Bernie supporter here
I don't support the increase to 15 personally, but what would be the harm in moving it to something like 10?
>>69753383
Not much I'd assume. But I think that the US should adopt minimum wages relative to the cost of living. In more expensive places to live, the minimum wage is higher, while cheaper places to live is, of course cheaper.
>>69753383
>>69753132
And how is a min. wage hike better than some deflation?
>>69753267
This whole "we can't improve things because it may hurt some so let's let things just spiral out of control and do nothing" is such shitty thinking. We need to start thinking of ways to start minimizing the need for -everyone- to have a job or things are gonna get real shitty in 20 years.
>>69753383
>but what would be the harm in moving it to something like 10?
I live in Washington where it's 9.47 and that feels like fucking nothing.
>>69753880
So that people working on the minimum wage won't be eating cat food at the end of the day.
>>69753795
I agree that'd be a pretty good idea
>>69753880
fucking lel is that pic real?
>>69753985
Are you advocating for a raise or against it
Raising the minimum wage does result in basic goods becoming more expensive. In the end it will not do much for the poor, but can potentially make things much worse for the middle class, while leaving the uppermost classes untouched.
E.g. will result in a shitstorm with Bernie's tax plan in the classes (I don't count gibsmedats as a class, given they are leeches and nothing else.)
>>69753008
Nuh uh. Bernie said some dude (who I researched, Huffington Post said he was a world famous economist so it's probably true and he's definitely right) told him it would be chill because the billionaires would be paying for it.
>>69753795
We already do that
>>69754044
Looks like you didn't check the logical fallacy image on the /pol/ front page
raising the minimum wage will pretty much kill USA outside of urban areas
liberals are completely unaware that areas outside of cities even exist though
in the vast majority of USA, you can live fine on minimum wage. Yes, it's too low to live in LA or NYC. But maybe you should take that as a hint and not live there?
>>69754279
That's a hyperbole, not a logical fallacy
>>69754397
Really? It looks like the Appeal to Emotion fallacy
By the way, has anyone looked in to these 'economists/financial experts' that signed off on this?
https://berniesanders.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/Wall-St-Letter-1.pdf
>>69753132
The minimum wage in the 50s was much lower and everything cost less because of it, a lot of people except for the most marginalized minorities, lived better then.
>>69753008
They do, but they believe in the snake oil so much that you'll always have a snake oil salesman to sell it.
>>69753008
I don't buy that. Employees will have more disposable income, they will be more able to pay for food and rent, less likely to rely on government aid, less likely to go broke.
Free market is very important, but at the same time, you have to enforce some kind of basic standard of pay and review it. And this is for the LOWEST paying jobs. You shouldn't punish people for staying in work.
>>69754044
Nah senpai, I don't mean start burning your cash. I just want it to take a slow turn.
Right now the last thing we need is another collapse
the cost of living has been going up while wages stagnate. On top of that historically minimum wage increases have not been offset by similar raises in costs of living.
I don't agree with raising the minimum wage but your argument against it is retarded and not based in fact.
>>69754064
Advocating for a raise. Rent here for a decent apartment (I'm not even in a main city) is at least 600 bucks for a one bedroom. 500 if you want to live in a crime shithole.
>>69754451
It isn't because his actual argument is that "so minimum wage workers don't have to resort to low quality living standards"
I'm not saying his argument is perfectly sound, it just isn't fallacious
>>69754608
they go up because raw materials prices have gone up retard
Same question I ask every time one of these threads pops up.
What mechanism is in place to assure that the higher wages come from company profit/executive pay and not increases in the price of goods or lowering the number of persons employed?
You have 1 dollar. The goods I sell are 50 cents. The wage increases and now you have 2 dollars. I must make up for the increased wage, so I increase the cost of goods by 1 dollar.
Meaning when you buy the good, you still have 50 cents at the end of the day. How are you better off?
How about those that had 2 dollars before the wage increase? They had 1.50 left over after buying the goods before the wage increase. Now they have 50 cents. Are they better off?
>>69754608
>that pic
Anon pls
That implies that raising the minimum wage is the only cause of an increased living cost.
You're not looking at the decrease of company profit, so they will have to lay off workers to pay for the increased wages.
Less productivity, less profit.
Shittier economy.
>>69754608
Employees will have more while employers will have less. Raising the price of labor will result in inflation and loss of jobs.
>>69753909
It's the fact that you're trying to do something that's fucking everything up.
Did you know that in Soviet Russia, government bureaucrats had some 2.4 million prices to set? How much more complicated do you think our economy is than that?
Central planning is not possible. People simply aren't smart enough and government isn't fast enough.
If you let people be as free as safely possible, they will all be able to act immediately in their own interest. This will create the most efficient system possible. Monopolies will not be possible now that the insane burden of government regulation stops smaller competitors from going out of business.
I could go on and on but it's easier if you just read a book.
>>69754608
why don't we just raise the minimum wage to $50 an hour then?
>>69753008
Do Bernie and his supports realize that deporting all of the illegal immigrants and clamping down on our border security would cause wages to rise naturally? Of course not, Bernie and his supporters are all brain-dead fucking retards. It always makes me laugh when I see them advocating for the mass unregulated immigration of millions of low-skilled individuals and then complaining when they can't make a living whilst working low-skilled jobs. You can't have your cake and eat it too.
>>69754608
>Flag
Ahhhhhhh, Makes sense now.
>>69754064
Don't know, reverse search it.
>>69753008
>bernie supporters
>aware
lmao
Is it true that women entering the workforce is the cause of job scarcity? atm candidates are competing with one another for job, the way I hear it, in the past it was much more common for companies to be directly or indirectly competing over applicants.
>>69754915
>>69754927
Did either of you read my post fully? Workers will have more income, and workers are also customers. The money won't disappear into thin air, it goes directly back into the market. It also takes the strain off social services.
>>69755079
Because it would be an unreasonable wage for an entry level job, obviously. Ironically that would be a big corporations' dream - only they could afford paying that.
>>69755079
This. If the >raise wages so everyone has more money to spend meme is true, then imposing a $1000/hr minimum wage should make the economy boom and virtually eradicate poverty. As everyone can immediately see, this is not the case. There is no magic wage minimum that doesn't feature the negative consequences of its imposition.
To quote a Bernie supporters: "But they'll be happy for a little while!"
I didn't decide to waste any more time with that person.
>>69755631
If people are generally wealthier and companies have to pay more to employees, prices increase as well no?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jku0bQ9VVGI
>>69755631
>unreasonable wage for an entry level job, obviously.
That's not why it wouldn't work. There is no such thing as a "reasonable wage or price". There is only the equilibrium wage, the wage that people agree on in a given context (whether in a specific company or all such positions across the industry). What happens when you raise the wage above the equilibrium is a decrease in available jobs, hours, benefits, or training, or an increase in the price of goods, or a combination of all those things. This is an inescapable economic reality that cannot be wished away with good intentions. TANSTAAFL.
>>69755631
>It also takes the strain off social services.
Sure does. Now you no longer qualify for food stamps or housing assistance as well as not seeing a actual financial benefit.
>>69754608
Prices have continued to go up because Europe and America aren't as competitive on the global market as they once were.
>>69753132
Wrong, it just allows yourself to be taxed more heavily.
>>69754891
HA, HA, HA, now I collect higher sales tax from stupid consumers.
You could make the minimum wage a million dollars an hour, it wouldn't matter. A gallon of milk will be 400k, a loaf of bread 250k, and a new car a few trillion.
Minimum wage ISN'T the core issue here.
>>69754064
>>69754687
Seattlefag here. I live in a very average neighborhood and rent on my one bedroom condo is considered very reasonable at $1125/month. Downtown is considerably higher than that. $15/hour isn't even really a living wage around here.
>>69755631
Increasing minimum wage does lower the value of the currency.
Think about your average mcfucks. How many people are in there working and multiply that by 15. That's how much money that company would have to make just to pay for the employees.
So say 6 people working for 15 an hour that's 90 dollars in a single hour that the company would have to make after paying for all the stuff needed to make the burgers and shit, which will go up in price most likely too since the people processing those premade fries and burger patties need 15 an hour suddenly.
That right there cuts profit margins even more.
Now since Mcfucks cannot afford to pay those 6 employees even if it's rush hour they have to cut some people. Those people now go fully on unemployment, which comes out of everyone's wallets.
You can forget about anyone making more money than others from working at mcfucks for a decade too. They just cannot afford that shit.
The only way they could sustain those profit margins is to increase prices of those burgers by a fuckload. Increasing prices of those burgers is going to be just like inflation.
Any liquid money out there(Which is mainly poor people) will be worth less, while people with money in assets(Well off people) will generally stay about the same value.
If you truly want those minimum wage employees to get more out of their paychecks then you need to create more business from different business owners.
If there's 4 different mcfucks, 4 different tacos, 4 different subways then they will have to compete with each other for that business. There will be more demand for the mcfucks worker since more places are around so they can get paid more.
Since they are competing with those other businesses they will have to make their burgers cheaper, which actually increases the value of the dollar.
The best way to help the economy is to make more businesses economically viable
Doubling the minimum wage is to commit sudoku on the economy.
>>69753008
the cost of living has increased regardless of wage
>>69755175
do sanders haters realize that the drug cartels and monsanto keep mexico unstable and destroys jobs and by legalizing marijuana it will take money away from the cartels and put back in to u.s. citizens' respective state/local economies, and that taxing monsanto will defund them so mexico can kick them out so the small farmers can survive again?? do sanders haters realize that by helping stabilizing mexico then mexicans will go back home?
>>69753008
Bernie supporter here, blame and kill white race
>>69753008
>...raising the minimum wage will also increase the cost of living?
Economics 102 failure.
>>69764075
>Increasing minimum wage does lower the value of the currency
Hahahahahah
Idiot.
#mexicanlivesdon'tmatter
