https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YUXwDMqjC-A
Where were you when libertarianism and the free market triumphed over the economically illiterate socialist?
>>69553407
I assume Rand does not take private insurers' cash. On the basis of it being slavery and all. Just like his buddy Ayn who took security on her deathbed
>>69553407
This is why Rand Paul is a fool and no one, literally no one, takes him seriously.
>>69553480
yep
>>69553407
>libertarians
>>69553407
Oh and by the way, where is that triumph?
Bernie still running, Manlet is nowhere.
Meanwhile I live in a nation state with public healthcare and no one is conscripted. There is no threat of violence. People just get healthcare.
You are a deluded autist
>>69553480
another zinger from upside-down land
>>69553407
>dat bish in the back having her mind broken by the Rand Rant
>>69553721
Rand gets that look a lot He mistakes it for inspiration.
>>69553666
your healthcare is nowhere near as good as someone in the US who pays for their own. If you get most cancers in this world, the #1 indicator of surviving it is living in the US.
>>69553407
selling_recreational_nukes.jpg
>>69553457
How else was she supposed to get the money the government took from her back?
>>69553771
keep telling yourself that.
also - just checking - nope - still no conscription of doctors or medical staff.
>>69553823
Do you know what sane people with fucking brains in their head do? Give it back either explicitly or by not cashing it. After you take massive dumps in everybody else's boat she doesn't need to talk about everybody else. Regardless of whether or not she has no friends
>>69553407
Rand sounds like a crazyman unless you already are well informed on libertarian positions. Not good for his image, this.
>>69553666
You don't have ~40% of your population consisting of niggers and beaners leaching off the system.
>>69553913
Jesus, what in the fuck are you blabbering about?
>>69553832
and yet your local waiting times are six months to see a physician
>>69553407
Free health care guys dont want to force physicians to perform. They want to force people to give away their money to pay the physicians.
Everyone is being robbed.
>>69554029
Tell me, Ringo. Wtf confuses you there, exactly?
>fucking commies are taking muh freedoms
Rand cannot express himself efficiently
>>69554100
Oh the ironing
If you refuse to treat a patient, absolutely nothing is going to happen to you, except you may lose your job, which is not equivalent with pointing a gun to your head or slavery. And it wouldn't even be unpaid labor, doctors are paid regardless of who the fuck they treat.
The only point you could make is that the hospital owner/chief of medicine is enslaved, everything else is nonsense.
>>69553407
HOLY SHIT!?!?!
Is that what all the other 1st world countries healthcare is like?
Fuck that is terrible.
It is just like how free speech is a right. All reporters have to report what I say because it is my right.
>>69553407
If /pol/ wanted to BTFO Berniebros forever all they'd have to do is run GG-style hitpieces on them accusing their hatred of Clinton to be rooted in misogyny, as well as toxic male culture clouding their vision and only allowing a paradigm where white men are president. Imagine, Berntards hit with their own medicine.
>>69553407
>implying free healthcare means doctors don't get paid
>implying any doctor, including rand, give a shit where the money comes from
Does Rand turn away patients with Medicare? Didn't think so.
>>69554237
>implying any healthcare is free
why the fuck do you care about that old jew anyway
he's not getting the nomination
focus on shillary
>>69554048
do americoon lolbertardians have to resort to just making things up because they have no real evidence?
>>69554282
How much has the chronically homeless alcoholic indigent indigenous person paid here in taxes for that literally free healthcare. Eh?
>>69553407
Rand is a Jew puppet, if the kikes pulling his strings don't want Bernard that means they want to use goyim to destroy everything and keep their hands unsoiled in the eyes of the public
Fuck
>>69553407
Rand is right though.
When a government healthcare system exists, and attempts to compete with private healthcare in quality, and without any further interference, it will fail
See, centralised healthcare is shitty. I should know.
Salaries are shitty and budgets get siphoned off to friends, managers and outside consulting agencies, as well as "Private-public investment" programs which balloon every billion in assets and materials, into 5 billion of debt and growing.
So when there's private healthcare which can tempt doctors away with good salaries, the supply of doctors IN the system will wither away, because they don't want to stay.
Eventually, you have to either raise taxes, or force doctors into the system through forcing them to spend however much of their career in the system before they're allowed to go elsewhere. Or make it so that doctors must be approved by certain bodies, and that only certain approved hospitals can hire them. This happens in the UK.
>>69554317
Our healthcare system is shit brah. Far from ideal
>>69554330
Just as much as anyone should: nothing.
>>69554367
Wrong
>>69554386
Right. But he's all like, typically: IT'S NEVER NOT FREE AND I'M TOTALLY NOT A RACIST
>>69554367
After all, under Bernie's America, you can't turn someone away.
You must be treated.
So there must be a doctor.
>>69553480
Fuck off, his logic is sound.
Your shitposting has gotten weak in your old age
>>69554428
Like it is right now. Ahh.
Rand's argument is fucking retarded and brain cancered betong belief. It's not slavery because they get paid still rofl
Its a SERVICE not slavery. This is why nobody can take the fucking GOP seriously, they are low IQ religious nuts.
>>69554375
But I've nevver had to wait more than 3 hours to see a publically funded doctor let alone 6 months.
>>69554396
>Took him 30 seconds to post
>Didn't even read
I know your currency is reaching Australian levels of worthless but do you guys really need to drop down to their level socially too?
>>69554480
I'm tired
>>69554069
Aaand he's gone
>>69554453
Emergency treatments only you fucking nigger.
But hey, Canucks can't understand what makes a good leader, not a big surprise you can't understand bigger issues
>>69554218
No Hans, you just eat into any savings until your forced to sell your home and belongings so your family doesn't starve.
That's what happens after authoritarian govts blacklist professionals for the "good of the people"
>>69553407
What's with that down-syndrome patient behind him?
>>69554552
You should have said as much during your first at-bat. You'll get 'em next time, Slugger
>>69554421
Wait, you arent a racist? What are you even doing here, nigger lover?
Furthermore, of course "free" healthcare isnt free if the taxpayer pays for it.
He's right. Saying you have the right to somebody else's work is SLAVERY.
fucking retard libshits
>>69553771
>tfw got free heart surgery within weeks of being diagnosed with my illness.
FREE!
>>69553407
The point Rand is trying to make, rather inelegantly, is that free, government-supplied healthcare would change our entire system. The only way it can be successful and not sink our economy further is if it has staffing.
Doctors are not construction workers, you can't just hire more of them. You would have to either incentivize them to work for the government (with competitive salaries that would put us more in debt) or force them, under threat of fines or possibly jailtime if they refuse. Effectively, that's slavery.
Sanders asking this woman if she feels like a slave offered Rand a perfect opportunity for a rebuttal: she loves her job. He should have asked her how she would feel if she was forced to leave her job because they needed her in a different state (as is the case with military personnel). Most doctors in America love their jobs, because they can work for the hospitals they CHOOSE and earn their high salaries to pay off their school loans.
Now, this doesn't address the insane issues with our healthcare system or health insurance. No presidential candidate has come out and said: Everything's great! But creating free healthcare requires a work force which happens to be skilled. You can hire more cops, more soldiers, more trash collectors based on need. Those same people cannot be doctors.
>>69554469
Slaves before get paid, fed, housed, get overtime bonus and have holidays.
>>69554601
How much taxes did that guy pay
>>69554588
Ooga booga! Me no slave! Rand slave. Booga
Free Healthcare is great. Fucking libtards are retarded.
>>69553620 (You)
>>69554614
>Effectively, that's slavery.
Not if you go with option one you fucking retard.
>Most doctors in America love their jobs
>source: my ass
>>69553407
>you'd let people die diseased or wounded simply because "REEEEEEE A PRECEDENT EXISTED WHERE I WAS PAID MORE"
smdh
Only priveleged whites have such a thought process this steeped in personal gain lmao
>>69554396
Good argument 2016 man
>>69553913
>This post
What the fuck are you talking about
>>69554711
>>69554738
Simultaneously retarded. Talk more! Talk less!
>>69554469
You clearly don't understand that rights by their nature cannot be denied. If you say something is a right, you better have a strong argument. The whole 'but were rich' thing is a joke, and not compelling to your average American
>>69554705
I doubt you are in any profession, just based of this post
>>69553407
>"Im a physician, that means you have a right to come to my house and conscript me, means you believe in slavery"
I cringed so fucking hard
>>69553407
>I will prevent disease whenever I can, for prevention is preferable to cure.
>I will remember that I remain a member of society, with special obligations to all my fellow human beings, those sound of mind and body as well as the infirm.
>If I do not violate this oath, may I enjoy life and art, respected while I live and remembered with affection thereafter. May I always act so as to preserve the finest traditions of my calling and may I long experience the joy of healing those who seek my help.
>>69554808
>well ur obviously dum
You sure owned me
>>69554646
Its not great for people like me who have to pay a bucket load in taxes and mandatory healthcare premiums and never use it. I am a healthy /fit/izen and I can afford to pay for any issues that would come up were I to have an accident.
I could use those ~5000 odd bucks a year much more effectively myself.
>>69554421
>>69554641
>>69554330
He paid nothing and is a cancer on society at large. the only medical services he should have gotten is sterilization.
>>69554612
AUSTRALIAN
>>69554868
Well crickey mate
>>69554808
>you better have a strong argument
Not having citizens dying from preventative disease isn't a strong argument?
There's nothing wrong with public healthcare. It doesn't have to replace private healthcare, only to coexist with it.
>>69553407
Objectivism is a weird filosophy
It's like nihilism, but only applied to the things libertarians don't like
I despise commies as much as anyone but Rand statements is comic.
>>69554897
But then all the good doctors go to shlomo's team for some reason
Sadly Rand has absolutely no knowledge of European and Singa-porean healthcare system.
So he made him look a bit of a fool out of himself here.
>>69554774
>Make a post talking about how Ayn Rand took social security
>Someone points out that she wouldn't have had to if the government never took it in the first place
>Make a response that has zero content, substance, or relevance
http://i.4cdn.org/wsg/1457053046691.webm
>>69554817
It's not incorrect. A privilege is something you can acquire for some value. A right is universal and intrinsic. You must enslave physicians, either subversively in their wages or outright, to accommodate an end of fulfilling the health care of all people as a "right."
>>69554971
You've lost it buddy
Rand should learn a bit more about international matters.
>>69553407
>>69554949
It's their right to.
>>69554984
Positive rights. Negative rights. Learn the difference
>>69554984
You ancaps are fucking retarded, nobody cares about your pseudo-intellectual sophistry
>>69555055
Well we do it better without patchwork quilts
>>69554897
>says the Romanifag who doesn't have to pay American taxes
>>69554817
>right to come to my house and conscript me, means you believe in slavery
What an idiot. I fucking love how modern doctors forgot their Hippocratic Oath they took and go shekel hunting with human lives.
If you ain't intrested in saving lives, study law instead and get squeeze shekels out of bullshit like your jewish comrades.
Yes you cocksucker, your priority is human health. You will work for "free" if it's absolutely necessary.
>>69555062
The point is that positive rights impose a positive duty on someone else that MUST be fulfilled. A duty to do something regardless if you want to or not is coercion.
>>69554896
>what is free lunch
Why should my liberties be infringed upon to pay for you or your ugly kids problems. I don't know you and I owe you nothing. I am in no contract to support you. If your so into providing for the needy then time stamp all your food pantry and UNICEF donations, but it still wouldn't be able to answer the question of why your entitled to other peoples wealth to pay for your healthcare issues
>>69555093
This. But nobody loses in today's society. You see. Rand has what's called "personal responsibility". Because he's a liar
>>69555089
>muh taxes
You can simply redirect funds from irrelevant shit such as gibsmedat.
>>69555132
No you have no point
>>69553407
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iPVKSiTmU8s
>kek
>simple statement
>retarded rambling
Rand BTFO himself. Why are libertarians so fucking retarded?
>>69553721
I need a to make a crop of that for my reaction folder if anyone has the original.
>>69555093
Hey dumbshit, we already do this. Emergency rooms don't turn people away in America. We fucking pay for fat beetus fucks and nignogs.
But if you want special treatment and a personal doctor who will see you whenever you want, you fucking pay for it. That has nothing to do with the hippocratic oath.
>>69555134
>liberties be infringed
?????
which liberty specifically is infringed by the government spending your tax dollars at their discretion?
>>69554469
But the reality is it's the tax payer that is enslaved to produce the funds that the health care professionals demand more and more of.
> Pro-active health advice and setting/maintaining a culture that limits the need of these services is the only viable option.
>>69555265
There's only 2 things in this world I cannot stand. People who are intolerant of other peoples cultures. And the Dutch
>>69553407
>universal healthcare means enslaving doctors
Am I missing something here?
>>69555053
>socialism runs out of OTHER PEOPLE'S MONEY
Why does this meme seem to persist amongst the right, it's almost as though they don't know what they're talking about
>oh wait.
>>69555393
nice bait australia
>>69553407
I watched it after it happened. It totally made me lose respect for him. Dumb ass Rand.
>>69555393
>Why does this meme seem to persist amongst the right, it's almost as though they don't know what they're talking about
Because it's true. Their fiscal policies stagnate the economy and can only be paid for by more taxes, which is not a permanent solution, especially if you desire more government spending. If you guys are going to make fun of libertarians, go ahead, but atleast stop using 4th grade insults
>>69553947
we have 25% asians cunt
>>69555393
Taxes arent other people's money now?
>>69555062
We know what positive rights are. And you should know that they cannot be sustained
>>69555549
>beaners and niggers
>the same as asians
You're gonna make me spit out my coffee, stop
>>69555170
FREE HEALTHCARE IS AN EXAMPLE OF GIBSMEDAT, MORON
IT'S NOT ABOUT PEOPLE LIVING OR DYING, JUST BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE UNIVERSAL HEALTHCARE DOESN'T MEAN WE LET POOR CHILDREN DIE.
IT'S ABOUT A NATION OF FAT FUCKS WANTING FREE INSULIN FOR THEIR BEETUS AND FREE VIAGRA FOR THEIR WIFE'S BOYFRIEND.
LEARN THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN HEALTH CARE AND THE RIGHT TO LIVE
>>69554864
"Its not great for people like me", well society doesn't revolve around you. This concept of individual liberty is one hell of a meme.
>>69555335
People are at liberty to enter into contracts with one another. Forcing doctors to comply with govt orders typically are an affront to personal liberties and rights. Researching cancer, funding hospitals, building medical equipment, staffing hospitals, supporting universities and med schools, maintaining infrastructure Ect...these are all costs on the American healthcare system paid for by those who use it. As soon as you open it up to people who cannot afford to use it at the expense of those who can, then quality goes DOWN. Most retards don't think past the macro though, they only get so far as "yeah free medicine and doctor visits sound nice" forgetting that much of the money that keeps the system afloat is not paid for by the sick, but by the healthy.
I'm not against Medicare and Medicaid. The old and disabled who are unable to provide for themselves and the state shouldn't be abandoned, but forcing American citizens (especially our doctors) to comply with crazy demands of the government will not yield us more doctors or better doctors
>>69553947
There are easily a percentage of the population that make up for it.
>>69555683
the problem with this is i live in a country with very little nignogs and brown people but 25% of melb is Asians and im here for uni and get to see all the shit they do to me nignog are not that bad but that's only exp i bet if i go live with them i hate them just as much as Asians point is take your pick in the end all you have is shit
>>69555235
These people were white so Bernie didn't feel the need to cuckold.
ITT: based Aussies and Burgers without Passports
>>69555691
Well, fuck lazy cunts who need other's help. And even if I wanted to help others, why should the government be involved?
And I cant even vacate the social contract. Even if I were to say, I dont pay into the system and I wont take anything out of it... I am not allowed to.
>>69555948
also i have been drinking sorry about the bad grammer
>>69556066
Well, niggers nig. It's a universal fact. What have you seen asians do? They are so gentle, where I live.
>>69553832
Fuck off bernie fag. Australia's health care system is absolute shit tier. You have ppl with brain tumors being sent home with a few aspirins
I've seen ppl with suspected heart attacks and ppl with blood clots forced out of beds by private hospital patients because the private hospital didn't want to pay for staff over the queens b'day weekend.
Inb4 "Priorities"
One private patient had a twisted ankle and another had a sore knee.
Faggots like you are the same dumb cunts who go on reddit shitting on the u.s over their 1%. While ignoring the fact the 1% here are just as privileged.
>>69554048
No. I can go see a doctor tomorrow. Probably wait about a half hour. It's the specialists that you have to wait 6 months to see
>>69556172
they mostly don't integrate this being the Chinese
go around boxhill cant read or order any thing looking for a job in the area requirement you have to speak asian stuff like that
>>69556284
Just use the words 'cunts' instead of ppl you fuckstick.
>>69553457
get the syrup out of your mouth before you try to speak. you're spouting moose shit all over the place eh?
The only way you can make a functioning public healthcare system is through high taxes.
t. Nordic system
>>69553913
Giving it back is exactly what happened. jesus fuck
>>69553407
This makes Rand Paul look like kind of a dick desu. And there's not "an implied threat of force",the doctors would just be paid with public funds, which is exactly what already happens with Medicare and Medicaid.
>>69556647
Wow, that's lame. It's not that easy to learn fucking Chinese for your job lol
>>69553947
finally someone admits the real reason america cant have nice things... hurry up and secede.
>>69553457
>>69553832
what happens if someone needs medical treatment and there's no doctor who wants to treat them?
Remember, healthcare is a RIGHT so the government must ensure they get treatment.
>>69554218
>losing your job for refusing service
>b..but we're free guise i promise
>>69554474
The 6 month figure is usually for more specific things that require a checkup (such as specialists), not minor things.
Healthcare systems in all countries with public healthcare is pretty shit, for many reasons, one of which include they're always underfunded and lack equipment.
It's viable as a general thing, but if you want real treatment the availability of private healthcare is necessary.
>>69556964
When services are "rights" they create a duty. Rand's point has nothing to do with it being paid for by taxpayers.
Refer to >>69555132
>>69557137
>and there's no doctor who wants to treat them
When would this ever happen? If the people can pay for it (which under a publicly funded healthcare system, they can) then what reason would there be for no doctor to want to treat them?
>>69557208
>When services are "rights" they create a duty
They're not a duty, though. The doctor can always just quit. The service being a "right" just means that it's publicly funded so everyone can afford it.
>>69553407
I'll never understand these taxation is slavery morons.
>>69557041
yea so if your looking for safety at least they wont try and fight you and be more civil about it but at least you don't have to worry about a black taking your job
who ever wins we lose
>>69554220
free speech doesn't rely on others acting on your behalf, but nice try che
>>69557235
>assuming public funds will always be able to support a world class healthcare system
And if there's a depression? Then what, public revenue goes to shit, and yet it's on the books that healthcare is a right, and now the federal govt must exhaust all funds on healthcare as opposed to roads to rebuild the country so business can resume. Because remember, free healthcare is somehow a right, but roads aren't
>>69557332
>an American flag
>can't understand why taxation without representation is wrong
Low energy and sad
>>69557332
Its pretty simple faggot
Taxation is the garnishment of your wages by a third party for their desired purposes.
Wages are the fruits of your time and exertion expenditures of labor.
Therefore, taxation is the forcible co-opting of the fruits of your labor to satisfy the needs of a third party.
Any more questions or do you just like being a fucking retard?
>>69557305
>They're not a duty, though. The doctor can always just quit.
It's a philosophical point. A right is something that MUST be given, it would be illegal for the government to not give me my rights. If you have a legal right to a service, that means that the service has to be provided to you. And if that service requires someone to provide it, then someone will have to provide it.
I'm not saying I ultimately agree with Rand, but his philosophical point is logical and works.
>>69557440
You can make this argument about any government program. Why choose healthcare? Why not foreign aid, subsidies for corn farmers, our oversized military, or the hundreds of billions of dollars wasted every year on idiotic and/or expired programs?
Socialists are beyond retarded and want everyone to be poor.
USA doesn't have anything close to a free market system.
What we need is a FREE MARKET in healthcare, we had it in the USA before, it can happen again.
We need this to spur INNOVATION and technology.
>>69553666
>There is no threat of violence.
>if you try to start your own healthcare firm without going through the state they will literally murder you
Kill yourself hypocrite.
>>69554469
The distinction between slavery and labor is voluntarism. That's why whenever brain-dead lefties drools "slave wages" they're being retarded but Rand's comparison is accurate.
>>69557679
Foreign aid is not a right
Subsidies are not a right
The military is not a right
You serious? This argument isn't about whether healthcare is good, it's whether it's a right
>>69555691
>well society doesn't revolve around you
Society doesn't revolve around YOU neither.
Stop stealing from society while pretending you're helping them.
>>69554228
who is this semen demon?
>>69553407
ouch
>>69553480
>>69553407
>American politics
Holy shit, this actually makes Bernie look comparatively sane, seeing as rand is supposedly a doctor and yet has no fundamental understanding of how a public health service works.
>>69555235
Wow, the left sure loves each other.
>>69557593
still makes no sense but whatever.
>>69557679
I just realized your comment was agreeing with me, at least I think. Idk I'm at the end of my shift and tired. Sorry for spazzing
>>69553620(You)
>>69557998
>monopolizing healthcare and shooting anyone who tries to start their own firm is good
Leftists deserve to be thrown out of helicopters.
TRUMP when?
>>69553480
Not even a good shitpost
0/10
>>69554896
>citizens can't get treatment for preventable disease
>source: my ass
>>69557137
That's not a natural right.
It's the same shit with Education . You have the right to education ,as in nobody can stop you from going to school. Nobody is stopping you from going to college if you pay the fees.
You have the work ,as in nobody can stop you from getting a job. It doesn't mean the employer must employ you if you're not fit for the position.
If your right to something implies that someone has to be forced to do it for you with no remuneration ,then something is wrong.
>>69553407
Why does he keep touching his nose?
>>69553480
Not everyone can have the best health care. That's physically impossible. Not everyone can have even "good" health care, by the standards of what Americans consider "good" health care.
>>69558106
He's stating that doctors become "slaves" in a public healthcare system, which is false, how is £100,000 a year slavery? They can always quit anyway. Also-A FUCKING LEAF
>>69553407
Oh god that statement is hilarious.
You american's never cease to amuse me
>>69557359
>who ever wins we lose
Modern western world in a nutshell, it'll get better, though. Give it time.
>>69558267
American health care isn't even as good as they claim. I've had to visit an american hospital once while abroad and the wait times were far longer there. Also the staff seemed to give far less fucks then they do in canada, but maybe it was just that hospital (but I doubt it).
>>69558274
>how is <salary> a year slavery?
Most slaves get provided shelter, food and water
>they can always quit
What if they ALL quit?
Is his argument of this slavery business based on the state essentially deciding his salary, or?
>>69558274
>He's stating that doctors become "slaves" in a public healthcare system
It's ABSOLUTELY true.
They are forced at the point of a gun to join the government healthcare monopoly, if they try to start their own firm they will be arrested, if they resist, shot.
If they don't like it, they have to go back to college to start another career.
>how is £100,000 a year slavery?
The wage they are given by their slavemasters doesn't matter.
Also, what if they wanted to make half of that because they wanted to help people and provide healthcare far better and faster than the sadistic "public" system.
Also, a FUCKING BRITKEK.
>>69558364
For 100k a year with a full benefits package I will gladly be someones slave.
The whole argument is silly though and we both know you're trolling.
>>69558162
Well, kermit, none of these "rights" are codified in law. They simply fall from the presumption of a free society: being that if something is not explicitly against the law, then it is legal.
If any of these things were a right, I would have to be given it on demand because that's how rights work, at least in ideologically consistent systems.
>>69558253
Only the nose knows
>>69558285
Please get out of my country you waste of flesh.
If you love democratic socialism so much, go to greece.
You economically illiterate retard.
>>69558353
If you've actually been through the healthcare system with a lifelong chronic disease like I have, you will know that they are careless psychopaths that care nothing except getting their next patient.
>>69558425
>I will
Others might not will it.
What if ALL doctors quit?
Healthcare is not a right and cannot be forced as a right. My rights end where yours begin.
If America had the population of two people and both of them were doctors, "healthcare is a right" would imply that the other doctor absolutely has to take care of the first, without freedom of choice. Unfortunately for Bernie, in America we have freedom of choice.
No public service that provides aid is a right.
>>69558274
so what if they quit? how is the basic human right upheld when the right requires a high skilled individual and no such willing individuals exist? Don't you have to turn to unwilling individuals? or do you simply abandon the right all together?
>>69553480
Shitpost discarded
>>69557874
also, this vid is four years old.
>>69558551
I know this is rands point and I disagree
In this circumstance you just accept that the government cannot protect or provide this right
In this situation, the government should invest in healthcare and create incentives
>>69558364
house slaves that wore nice clothes and lived in a mansion were still slaves my limey friend.
>>69558500
Like they did in canada?
I still remember the day when all the doctors quit and were rounded up and shot.
>>69554317
Go suck on that aboriginal cock you crave. Leave American politics to the grown-ups
>>69555053
It's not like Sanders is a "socialist".
Maybe slightly more economically left than Nixon, probably not.
Richard proposed a guaranteed minimum income (FAP), he didn't call it that. But it was a minimum income.
Then again, the difference seems to be ideological. Nobody would call Nixon a socialist. Pragmatic describes him.
Bernie on the other hand would probably support "left leaning" economic policies on the basis of his ideology
>>69558401
No, the fact that if healthcare is a right it means that doctors must work.
With healthcare being a right a doctor is simply unable to refuse requests, which is slavery
> on the state essentially deciding his salary
States are very generous to their salaries, the medical industry has lobbied extremely successfully so their wages are high and their competition from outside the USA is nigh-zero
The fact that a slave is paid generously doesn't mean he isn't a slave.
>>69553407
I'm RIGHT, in the middle - and even I think that is super contrived by Rand.
No, people will be doctors anyway - so then they'd just work at government hospitals.
>>69558492
Sorry your so salty but salt will get you no where. I'm guessing your chronic disease is something pretty pathetic too.
>>69558639
>an actual leaf
>>69558424
Maybe in fucking LEAF land, but in Britain private health care exists. Maybe you should look into not being fucking retards and allowing DUDE WEED LMAO OH WAIT NO WEED into power.
>>69558630
I know, that's what I was saying
>>69553407
>Comparing healthcare to slavery
Get out of here with your reactionary bullshit.
Gulag.
>>69558719
Do you know what I am saying?
>>69558401
>>69558754
he's saying this
>>69558551
The thing with libertarians is it's always people who were born rich with daddy's money and contacts, kicking the ladder down for anyone else. They're funded by billionaires to spout this horseshit so that their top taxes get dropped from 30% (effective 15%) down to a whopping 5% flat tax for everyone. Flat taxes disproportionally affect the poor, since someone making 15k a month paying 5% tax isn't going to go hungry, but someone making just enough to live on, you're taking 5% out of their kids mouthes. Not only that, but those poor people then need to pay out of their backside for services that would normally be covered by taxes. Again, someone making 300k a year isn't going to notice the bill when he needs to go to the doctor, but someone living paycheck to paycheck probably will notice that 3,000 dollar bill for getting an xray to see if a bone may or may not be broken.
Equating public service to slavey is something only a libertarian could do. Policemen are public servants (or atleast they are in the countries where they don't go around executing peoples dogs before executing the people), but are they slaves? Doctors are pretty well compensated for their work, and most of their educational expenses are written off or subsidised by the NHS over here. We get a bad wrap but I imagine the GP (or equivalent services) in New York can be just as bad as those in London. Anywhere else, I can ring up and have an appointment in the same day, I did just that 2 days ago (first time I've used the doctor/GP since I was 11).
Not to mention the fact that the libertarian position on health care isn't going to win any votes. The young don't want anything to do with it, and the old don't want to lose their medicaid/medicare.
Public health-care is shit for major operations. There's big waiting lists. I'm not a poor dole bludger and pay for private health insurance. I'm shocked Aussies here support bernie you socialist fucks. Fuck yourselves you blue pilled fucks
>>69558698
>Sorry your so salty but salt will get you no where.
Irrationality will get you nowhere as well.
>I'm guessing your chronic disease is something pretty pathetic too.
lmao, you really do have zero argument
You enjoy medical stagnation and society being forced to work much harder for a terrible healthcare monopoly.
You people need to be murdered, I swear.
>>69557858
Just some random kikebook attention whore
>>69558627
if the government cannot protect this right (which, by the way, is only because you don't like the consequences of how they would do it) then why is it a right at all? why isn't it just another entitlement? Saying its the government's job to ensure everyone has healthcare while at the same time saying they have a job not to do what's required to ensure every has healthcare is insane.
Government doesn't protect the right to life by sending everyone a "plz dont murder" check and hoping they stick with it. The government has to use force to protect rights, because as enlightened societies we have decided that rights are important enough to protect with force. Doing otherwise demeans the importance of rights in the first place.
>>69558708
>Britain private health care exists.
Oh "private" healthcare.
Tell me more about this "private" healthcare.
It exists here too and it isn't private at all.
>>69553407
that girl behind rand looks like a normal sized midget
>>69558899
The government isn't here to support your fiscal irresponsibility
>>69558929
shit health-care > no health-care expensive as fuck healthcare
>>69558899
It's not a public service.
It's a government healthcare MONOPOLY.
Say what things actually mean, then maybe you'd sound less retarded.
>>69558983
first the government only protects rights, it doesn't provide them
there are plenty of occasions upon which the government fails to protect rights, this doesn't mean we should get rid of them
what about police and military? are they slaves?
>>69559007
>normal sized midget
Can someone who speaks Australian translate this please.
>>69558899
I was born poor, worked 60 hours a week until I made enough to go to Uni and start my own business.
I am a libertarian because I dont want lazy cunts unwilling to put the same work in as I did, to profit from the fruit of my labour. Fuck poor people who are unwilling to work hard. Fuck the government and its excessive regulation.
The DUMBEST people in the world support government healthcare monopolies.
We need a system of free market healthcare.
Imagine paying very little for an operation, imagine if healthcare was extremely cheap and the quality increased every year.
Imagine we allowed medical innovation and there was an Elon Musk that focused on healthcare and developed artificial hearts and cancer cures.
It worked before.
>>69558899
>the rich are just rich as the result of winning a quiz show
Okay Nigel
>>69558899
hasty generalizations and retarded ad hominem seem to be trendy on the cobble streets of london
Nobody is dying in the street and nobody in the US is going without healthcare. If you have a problem you can go to the hospital and get it taken care regardless of income or ability to pay. Liberals like to pretend this isn't the case and they imply it in their arguments for socialized healthcare.
>>69558899
>The young don't want anything to do with it,
So you say, but the Netherlands has recently gotten 2 libertarian parties. And they overwhelmingly have young members. Meanwhile your filthy socialist parties are populated by the elderly and the insane (like antifa).
>low income Americans
>fattest demographic our species has ever seen
>"they're barely making ends meet!!1"
Liberals actually believe this
>>69558353
So have I, and it was FAR better than the NHS, and one of the Qt3. 14 nurses even said she loved my accent.
>>69559019
kekarino
>>69557189
Where would you not be fired for refusing to do you job?
It is not as if doctors aren't compensated for their work.
>>69559182
>So you say, but the Netherlands has recently gotten 2 libertarian parties.
source?
Healthcare being a right is a meme. A regulated private-healthcare system with potential guards against huge monopolies forming is top tier
>>69559056
Military is actually more like slaves than citizens (a big hyperbole I know but hear me out). They become Government Issue (G.I.) when they sign that contract. Can be hung for disobeying a command and do not have the same rights as citizens
>>69559081
But anon, how else will I be able to get a new xbox if I can't sell my link card for extra cash, I deserve an xbox it's my right!
>>69559056
>first the government only protects rights, it doesn't provide them
when did I say government provided rights? I said the government protects rights.
>there are plenty of occasions upon which the government fails to protect rights, this doesn't mean we should get rid of them
When is this?
>what about police and military? are they slaves?
Neither the police nor military are a right.
>>69559324
what if nobody signs the contract
Sorry for the wall of text, but I need the catharsis of typing this out after reading some of the idiotic bullshit some of you have posted.
As a physician, I 100% agree with Dr. Paul. He is speaking of the hypothetical "healthcare as a right" worst outcome.
There is tremendous sacrifice to becoming a physician (time being primary, but also financial, emotional, physical)... take away the incentives and you'll see the talent pool dry up. Yes, you'll still have doctors... just not with the same quality and dedication.
Before you raise the bullshit flag, it's already happening. I watched most of the "non-traditional" med students (eg, journalism major) and non-asian minority admissions burn out before they finished their second year. I also trained prior to the 80-hr work week limit. The post-80-hr medical students and residents are beyond worthless, they can't cope with the work load. One of our hospitalists told me the other day that they've had 3 new hires burn out because "it's too much work."
I've worked in two VA's - it's a fucking nightmare. We jokingly referred to our orders as "suggestions" and regularly had to bribe non-physician workers with cookies / etc to get a diagnostic test or task done immediately rather than when they felt like it.
And Britbongs, one of my former co-residents was formerly a resident in your system. She attested to the absolute nightmare of your system.
Canadians, your gov't is subsidizing physician salaries big time so they don't come to the USA... that's the only reason your system isn't absolute shit. Oh, and thanks for one of my colleagues, I really like him and you can't have him back.
>>69559324
>Europe
>Xbox
Not how that works
>>69557964
Goddammit. How do I stop the shitposting from my country?
Shitposting is supposed to be Australia's job...
>>69559382
no right can be protected without military or police or something similar
>>69553407
I do not like Beenie but Rand's argument implies that every single medical worker hates their job
>>69559270
Being able to deny service has everything to do with freedom.
Remember that christian bakery that was forced to make cakes for a gay wedding? Yeah, thats denying these people freedom of religion and freedom of choice.
Same applies to doctors. If you cant deny service (say to someone who fucked your wife) you have no freedom.
>>69558991
What is there to explain? It exists if you want to pay and get past the NHS queues. I don't know about leafland though.
>>69559025
It's good for minor shit like gp check ups or what's this rash. You should start small if you're going to implement health-care
>>69559439
You seen the sudoku rates for doctors m8?
>>69559450
So if these religious cult members want to, say, own a slave as per their cult book, that's okay because there's freedom of religion, right?
>>69559306
Google them. VNL: voor Nederland. Wants to abolish inheritance tax, install a flat tax, that sort of thing.
And the Libertarische partij. Which wants to remove the state.
The VNL has two seats in parliament and everything.
>>69553480
all these butthurt faggot lolbertarians. defending a broken healthcare system and banging their heads against australians who enjoy one of the best and cheapest.
Keep crying ham boys.
Keep getting cucked by a system that threw you overboard long ago.
>>69559503
>denying service equals enslaving someone
NO
>>69554437
How is it sound you dumb fat fuck? He would still have a choice to work for state healthcare or private healthcare, he would still have a choice to work for neither, he would still have a choice to work for both.
>>69559402
The United Kingdom's healthcare system is a joke. It's over burdened and we can't take the strain off through privatisation because it's a boogeyman over here.
I've lost friends to cancer because our healthcare system didn't find the problems fast enough and were told not to worry, my uncle died of pneumonia after being given a course of antibiotics and told to stay warm
>>69556284
You are a joke Steve. How did that Tony vote turn out for you?
>>69559394
We call that a draft, in Europe I believe it's called a conscription, the word rand uses
Guys press f5
>>69559402
Don't make the 14 year olds cry.
>>69559672
kek
>>69559610
Not if it's a 'right'. If all the doctors in the US said nah we're not going to do that then what the fuck would the government do? They'd say do this or we'll arrest you.
>>69559503
What a shitty false equivalency.
>>69559019
WE GOT A PROBLEM HERE.
REALITY PAGING DR RAND
>>69559670
why not a doctors draft
America is filthy rich, notorious for spending big bucks and literally wasting hundreds of billions on random countries..
Get rid of private sector, create a nationwide medical force and offer them 1.5 to 2 times their current salary and incentives or some kind of bonus. Inspire more people to be doctors, not online vidya game streamers. Not only does this make doctors happy but america could potentially value higher education and strive to be a really well paid doctor.
Last thing I want to say is lebron james and other NBA players make 10-20million a year for playing dunkball. Celebs and sports players make more than doctor's :^)
>>69559270
when you own your own business (as many doctors do).
You wouldn't know anything about being the master of your own destiny, would you my slave..... err, scandanavian friend?
>>69559460
Kek how retarded are you
First off they take a large portion of your income to pay for the system so it's almost pointless to go private.
Secondly since it's used as much, the price is expensive, if it was more widespread and the government monopoly got out of the way it would be much more cheaper and available.
Also the state regulates the shit out of it, doctors have to abide by almost every rule of health canada.
>>69559568
>defending a broken healthcare system
LMAO I literally posted pic related twice already in this thread.
Libertarians are strongly against the current healthcare system.
Kill yourself you dumb aussie piece of shit.
>who enjoy one of the best and cheapest.
That would be the Swiss and Singapore that have a semi private system.
Stay mad.
>>69559659
Fuck off and learn how the real world works you HSC fucktard.
>>69559767
7/10 nearly fell for it
>mfw april fools just started
>>69559316
the guard is removing state line restrictions on providers so you can shop across the entire country instead of only from a few available in your state.
Who the fuck will be knocking on his door for an eye exam? His hyperbole is deplorable
>>69559935
I just won't refresh this page,
>>69559999
We're all namefags
>>69559316
Why is almost everyone in the UK in favour of the NHS then? There aren't even mainstream parties that are for privatisation of it, because no one would vote for them.
Speaking as someone with a chronic disease, my treatment would cost tens of thousands if I lived in the US annually. Instead, it's free and I've had very positive experiences of the NHS. In fact, I've heard of many people in the US who have my condition who are effectively crippled because they lack treatment, whereas my life is essentially normal.
FUCK YOU GOOKMOOT
>>69559430
not true, in the past citizens worked together to carry out justice and defend the country.
Not saying that's a better solution than police and military, but (in america at least) all semblance of order would not break down just because the government loses its force.
>>69560095
>my treatment would cost tens of thousands
Why are Europeans unable to understand the concept of insurance though...
