get it, fags?
>>69550984
Yes. I get it, the problem is the people that middles in between. For example, instead of a bigger teddy bear it could perfectly be a smelly old dick. I say this as a Traditionalist Roman Catholic.
Reality is not as simple, although the fundamentals are clear, bro.
>>69550984
is that a pedophile trying to entice a young girl into his van?
getting real sick of these age of consent laws
What if I prefer the smaller teddy?
Is this Mohamad and Aisha?
Isn't it kind of materialistic for God to imply that bigger is necessarily better? I mean I can't think of a single instance where that is necessarily true.
>>69551518
Not one instance.
>>69551518
I guess it represents happiness overall, not an actual, literal teddy bear, my autistic friend.
>>69551476
You cannot draw muhamed you broke infidel pay debnts
>>69551549
Indeed, a considerable amount of time has passed since my last post and I'm still having a hard time coming up with a situation in which bigger is better.
>>69550984
what i don't understand is if god has all this power, then why sit around and not use it. like if i was a god and i was competing for followers between many other separate religions, i would just show up in a very public place, solve everyone's problems, and say "I'm god believe in me". my religion would instantly win the argument of which one is right.
>>69551800
He's not competing for followers
>>69551927
why not though, if more people follow your religion then more people will follow your rules, aka the 10 commandments.
something something rewards something kingdom of heaven
>>69550984
SHE LOVE HER BEAR
SHE DON'T WANT ANOTHER
FUCK OF JESUS
Till when you white people will keep denying ?
>>69551665
More Jews in the gas chamber as opposed to less?
>>69551800
>i was competing for followers between many other separate religions
That's a common missconception. All religions follow the same God and all have share certain degree of truth. That's according to Catholicism which is the religion I personally follow, though. But I think anyone can agree that at least all divisions inside Christianism, Judaism, Islam, the ancient Philosophers, etc., all follow the same God.
Even ancient polytheist religions are somewhat rooted in the same truths, since an intuitive perception of God doesn't necessaraly include its Unity and Unicity.
There's certian sects of protestantism that may suggest that people would go to Hell if they're born in the wrong part of the world with the wrong "theology" but in the History of religion this hasnt actually been the case. Religion is a medium not an end for God's purposes.
>>69552023
So? God is content. He doesn't need public approval
Following the rules out of fear rather than out of love means nothing
>>69550984
I do. :)
>>69550984
The fuck you gonna do with that big giant ass thing? It's unnecessary.
>>69550984
Bad analogy. A bigger teddy bear isn't nessecarily better, and it definitely won't have any of the sentimental value that the girl's teddy bear has.
>>69552130
I like how this says nikka because the redditor who thought this would be funny was too afraid to write nigga
Jesus has the face of God? I doubt it
I get it, she should drop the one she loves for the flashy one just sot robes man can have his power trip.
>>69552188
Wouldn't that be bigger jews in the gas chambers as opposed to smaller jews? Else the picture would have had to depict him planning to give her two teddy bears in trade of one.
>>69551476
>being happy with what you've got is wrong
>>69550984
>get it, fags?
>Teddybear handstitched by favorite grandma and given to you before she died
>lmao here's a bigger one I bought at K-Mart convert you little spic
>>69552130
what ticks me off is not "nikka" or qui-gon jinn image, but that they think jerusalem is in africa. What the fuk?
>>69552275
isn't that why hell takes in non-believers though? to get people to convert?
That is Jesus, dumb soccer nigger.
>>69552479
we wuz jews n shit niggoy
>>69550984
Can you shop this making her suck his cock?
>>69552250
ah that makes sense actually, alot of religions share the same beliefs to some extent. thanks for clearing that up
>>69550984
But "God" doles out misery to a lot of undeserving people, people get born with horrible crippling illnesses or develop cancers (and no not all cancers are lifestyle cause some are genetic)
You can pray and have faith and do everything right and still have a premature baby with failing organs that dies miserably.
It's hard to have faith that God is "good" when there's so much random misery.
If God was really fair and benevolent, wouldn't at least the NATURAL sources of misery not be there? Wouldn't God do something to help with that suffering?
That makes no sense to me.
I think either God is callous to our suffering and doesn't give a shit, or he's powerless to do anything about it, or he doesn't exist at all.
I'm not sure what I believe but I know I don't believe in a kind benevolent all powerful loving God.
No such being could abide such suffering in his supposed favored creations that he loves.
>>69552417
Abdul. This is a Christian/Catholic thread. Not a Islam thread.
>>69552516
No. Hell just means spending eternity separated from God. It's not a punishment but rather a state you choose when you neglect God
>>69550984
Yes.
The kike has already tricked someone else to give a much larger teddy to him so he thinks that manipulating this goym to give her smaller one to him is going to be a walk in the park.
>>69552663
>ouldn't God do something to help with that suffering?
Like take them to heaven?
Can you split up your post? I think it deserves a more eloquent reply but I don't know where to start
>>69552672
very funny but dont be disingenuous my arab friend. you of all people should know that muslims think the good part of existence starts in the afterlife so not being happy what you've got in the living world is a muslim axiom
>>69550984
Basically Jesus won't do anything for you unless you do something for him. you need to prove yourself worthy even if he doesn't need what you have.
So learn something from him lads. Don't let useless people into your countries that only want free shit and give nothing in return.
>>69552882
Why subject them to the misery in the first place? Why subject the family to that torture too? There's no sense in it.
They're not going to get a "better" Heaven than someone who has never truly suffered in their life and lived a long fruitful life
It's just randomly "hey you've won the sweepstakes for a fruitful life on earth AND if you practice Christianity you'll go to Heaven" and "Oh... sorry, you lost the drawing, you get to suffer a short miserable life with an extremely painful death caused by a congenital disease that you, nor anyone else can do anything about, you'll get to go to heaven because humans have determined that there's an age of accountability and it wouldn't sit well with their conscious if I also cast you into hell to torture you ETERNALLY .. but it's going to be the same heaven as you would have gotten if you won the sweepstakes.. well.. have fun being in excruciating pain! Your mom better not choose to abort you either, I REALLY want to see pain in its purest form manifested in you, see you in a few months fucker.
.. there's just no justice in that.
>>69550984
Yeah, I get it. It says, "Religion is the opiate of the masses." Don't worry. God will surely reward you for your lifetime of arduous sacrifice to your superiors once you expire.
>>69550984
Big stuffed animals are shit thb senpai.
They're bulky to carry and can't fit well in backpacks or suitcases.
Small stuffed animal master race.
>>69553424
>God will surely reward you for your lifetime of arduous sacrifice to your superiors once you expire.
It's not a trade off "I behave good and I gets heaven in return". God's commandments are the guideline as how to live as his creation and they are just as useful for non-believers as they are for believers. You need to stop listening to prots or strawmans
>>69551800
I hesitate to post anything, because my walk with God has been hard lately but I will suck it up and try.
Jesus said that the signs will follow those who believe.
Not that we will follow signs and believe.
>>69552663
I struggle with this too. Everyone does.
It's even harder for me since I've had a few experiences with God and I know He's real.
Even more frustrating is knowing that sometimes...very rarely...much too rarely...He does intervene.
Really not sure if I should post this on /pol/ but if it touches one person, then I guess it was worth it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xkBS51qm3Iw
>>69553267
But Anon, muh God! muh contrarianism! YOu've got to believe and follow outdated and illogical systems of belief because it's mainstream to be atheist now and I HATE being part of the mainstream!
>>69553661
I lean towards "God exists, but does not care and does not intervene"
Still not quite the God that is taught in Christianity.
>>69553267
>Why subject them to the misery in the first place?
Cancer is just cell mutation gone wrong. It's a byproduct of evolution and not evil in and off itself. It's causes aren't fully disclosed yet. Sorry for that stupid answer I'm struggling to make a consistent point for all your objections. One question after another please
>They're not going to get a "better" Heaven than someone who has never truly suffered in their life and lived a long fruitful life
Heaven is already perfect. Why would it matter for the cancer child if someone else goes to heaven without having suffered on earth as much?
>>69554200
Why give some people more blessings than others? Why give some people who don't deserve it suffering?
>>69553600
I listen to my own heart, which tells me to respect the civilized, and let any claims of supposed mystic wisdom fall on deaf ears. I will not judge anybody less simply because they are religious but it's irrelevant to me so they better have more to bring to the table than that. I lived by the following as a youngster and it was a huge mistake.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turning_the_other_cheek
>>69553993
I lean towards He doesn't care but does intervene sometimes.
Perhaps for some unfathomable ulterior motive.
Or maybe He does love us. I hope.
>>69550984
>I prefer OLD HAGS
fuck off grandpa
>>69554554
RARE
A
R
E
>>69554336
>Why give some people more blessings than others?
Because it helps the cause? I don't know the details. You need to separate the spiritual world from the biological in your thinking.
The justice served is that good people will get reconnected with their father in heaven
fuck you jesus. that small bear is what she loves. don't be a nigger.
>>69552359
A bigger gas chamber with which to gass more Jews. Fuck.
>>69554336
Sorry that I can't give a proper answer. Hopefully some other anon can jump in. I personally take comfort in knowing that God knows, wants to and is able to (DOES) intervene when it's just and purposeful. I see how that answer is unfullfilling for someone with doubts about God in the first place though.
If you roll up the question from that end though you'll never get a proper answer as the purpose of the material world is not to prevent any pain and suffering.
>>69554797
and bad people too if they accept Jesus, even at the last minute. That's the other thing that stinks of bullshit.
>>69555419
>and bad people too
No
>if they accept Jesus
If they realize what they did is wrong and genuinely regret what they did wishing to undo it how are they still evil?
>>69555344
what Irks me is that people are quick to give God credit for good things that happen, claiming he intervened on their behalf, but never blame God for bad things that happen as a failure to intervene.
Yeah I'm sure God helped that bland actress win some stupid statue at an award ceremony but let that kid die of bone cancer at 4.
To me it's impossible to have an intervening God, that is fair, in the world we live in.
Either he does intervene and he's a FUCKING ASSHOLE which if anything would make me want Satan to be right, for the sole purpose of finding a way to hurt God, If I knew for sure that that was God's true nature I would want nothing more out of my existence than to find a way to inflict suffering on God. He would deserve it. He'd be completely undeserving of worship or devotion and fully deserving of all Mankind's scorn.
Or.. he doesn't intervene. He's a bit callous, but at least then he's fair.
>>69554554
>I listen to my own heart
The heart is deceitful above all things, and is desperately wicked; who can know it?
Jeremiah 17:9
>>69555690
He doesn't intervene (mostly) to those who haven't repented. like you.
>>69555792
He doesn't intervene for many who do repent either.
I don't think he intervenes at all.
If he does his priorities on who he helps is completely fucked up.
Even Heaven makes no sense , the Heaven/Hell dogma would separate families and loved ones for all eternity.
Would you truly be in bliss in heaven if you knew your Children were in eternal torture for all eternity?
Even just the punishment of ETERNAL. TORTURE. Is completely overblown for a supposedly infinitely forgiving and loving deity.
>>69555690
>Yeah I'm sure God helped that bland actress win some stupid statue at an award ceremony but let that kid die of bone cancer at 4.
You shouldn't take Hollywood actresses who just use religion as a pr move as a proper sauce for exegesis.
>which if anything would make me want Satan to be right, for the sole purpose of finding a way to hurt God
Again your problem is that you complain about a strawman God based on things you've been told by non-christians.
>He would deserve it. He'd be completely undeserving of worship or devotion and fully deserving of all Mankind's scorn.
Oh you're just a shitposter? Sorry for trying
>>69556009
>punishment of ETERNAL. TORTURE
Once again. Stop complaining about misunderstood things.
Everybody abandon troll thread
saged
>>69556009
Not eternal torture, eternal, true death. Torture/repentance only lasts until the last judgement.
>>69556339
>>69556240
>when I can't argue out of something I'll pretend it isn't true
>>69556184
No I'm quite honest, not shitposting.
If God does intervene he has pretty shit priority about when and who he intervenes with, making him an unjust "God"
It boils down to the logic problem of "if God cannot get rid of evil and does want to get rid of evil, then he is niether benevolent nor omnipotent, then how is he God?"
>>69554336
Why not?
Earthly sufferings and hardships are ephemeral. They only serve to make you stronger. The more you suffer, the more hardships you overcome the stronger your soul gets, you'll grow in character, become a better, stronger person.
Compared to eternal life, the tribulations are restricted to your earthly presence.
You need vaccination against illness, you need suffering and need to be able to accept defeats and make sacrifices to become a better person.
God doesn't want us to be his pets and lead sheltered lives. He wants us to grow, to become more powerful. He sent his Son to the world to die and through death and sacrificing himself for the creation overcome and overpower death.
Christians should imitate Christ and grow in body, mind and spirit alike.
>>69556493
I am an atheist as well, but this has to be the fittest argument against God I have ever witnessed.
>>69550984
What is this trying to convey?
>>69556493
>It boils down to the logic problem of [...]
It really doesn't since we were talking about pain not caused by evil but natural sources like cancer. At least understand the atheist talking points before you shitpost about them on /pol/
>>69556619
You don't get stronger when you die of bone cancer before you even go to school.
>>69556636
I'm not an atheist, I'm agnostic. like I said earlier, I do lean towards the existence of a creator of some sorts but I have very strong doubts that he is benevolent or intervenes.
>>69556437
Where does it say in the Scripture: "eternal torture"?
Tell me if I'm wrong, but the canon ends with the last judgement and the coming of the Kingdom of God to this realm, the New Jerusalem.
Those who belong to the Lamb will live with him in the divine presence and those who aren't worthy will perish.
There will be no more need for evil or imperfect when the work of the creation and salvation is gone.
>>69550984
Is this about pedophilia in the Catholic Church?
>>69556701
But the people around you will. You get to check out early, and those around you suffer for losing a child and it teaches them an important lesson.
It would be meaningless to conquer death if death wouldn't be a problem.
>>69556688
well I'm quoting a logic problem involving God and in that logic problem they use the word evil. In fact the logic problem is called "the Problem of Evil"
The postulates are:
>If an omnipotent and benevolent God exists, then evil does not exist.
>Evil does exist
>Therefore an Omnipotent and benevolent God cannot exist.
Then you furthermore break it down into these statements:
>God exists
>God is omnipotent and benevolent
>A benevolent God would want to prevent evil
>An omnipotent God could prevent evil
>If God can prevent evil but does not want to, then he is Omnipotent but not benevolent and evil exists because he allows it
>If God wants to prevent evil but cannot, then he is benevolent but not Omnipotent, and evil exists because he cannot stop it.
>If God doesn't want to prevent evil and cannot prevent evil, then he is neither Benevolent nor Omnipotent, then how is he God?
you don't apply the logic of earth with God. He's in heaven while you're on earth. His spirit lives, but yours is dead.
repent or don't repent. that's all.
>>69551665
Muh dick
>>69551423
Yeah, why keep secrets at all? And why does he need to bribe us to get our love? That can't be seen as love in any genuine sense.
>>69551927
Have you read the bible?
>>69550984
I don't think this idea is really biblical.
>>69557200
This logical problem just has nothing to do with what we were talking about. Besides it has been debunked a gazillion times
This argument doesn't follow the rules of logic
>A benevolent God would want to prevent evil
Not necessarily as the right to free will trumps the wish to prevent all evil. The goal of this world isn't to prevent all evil that's what heaven is for.
>>69557362
Its not love and never was. "serve me or die/burn in hell(depending on your flavor)" is not a choice, its not free will, its an ultimatum. And you christ cucks all just go along not realizing god is actually the devil tricking you into thinking hes god.
>>69552130
What pisses me off is the hair.
Jesus had blonde hair,"White like wool"
WHITE LIKE WOOL DOESNT MEAN NAPPY AND TWISTED LIKE WOOL YOU RETARDED NIGGERS
>>69557333
The stance that I am taking is that God is omnipotent but not benevolent. He created both good and evil and tolerates evil, suffering, and sin.
That would make God more neutral and callous than the bible would teach.
Along with omnipotence is omniscience. in the bible, God is proclaimed to know all things, even the outcome of all future decisions (which kind of undermines free will). God creates a tree of knowledge of Good and Evil, telling mankind he cannot eat the fruit from that tree, fully knowing that they will, and still has the gall to punish not only Adam and Eve, but all of their future children for that one sin. In Christianity, every person born is already condemned by sin even if they did not personally commit it. It was a choice God posed to man that he already knew the outcome of, so if he was truly benevolent and knew that it'd happen, why would he pose that choice? If he was truly benevolent, why would he extend the responsibility to all humans rather than just the ones who actually made the choice?
A benevolent God is a logical fallacy.
A neutral God is at least possible.
>>69554969
There we go.
>>69557537
Is it really free will if God already knows how you will make every decision of your entire life? In creating you he has already known whether you are condemned or in the book of life.
>>69557708
Way to distort scripture. You are no better than the niggers that do the same.
The accounts of him having skin that glowed like melted metal in a furnace and hair as white as wool is in a spiritual vision given to the apostle John.
Don't try to turn this into a race thing.
>>69550984
>and if you don't trust me you'll burn forever
why would he do such a horrible thing?
>>69550984
You have to give up something small, to get something big?
>>69557885
>Is it really free will if God already knows how you will make every decision of your entire life?
Yes why not?
>>69550984
I GET IT!
If I cut off my dick and give it to god, he will endow me with a large African penis. Maybe Bruce Jenner knew this!
>omg
>>69558016
That is so unbelievable like OMG I will cut off my puny 7.5 inch Australian cock and god will give me a godly 12 inches. Maybe then my wife will let me fuck her!
>>69557994
if he knows it, then it is predetermined, so there is no free will
>>69558089
"No."
>>69558089
Knowing the outcome doesn't mean that the choices along the way weren't free.
>>69558016
>>69558083
(You)
>>69557771
God literally has no obligation about you while you're on earth. you'll still age, rot and die.
the problem is --afterwards--. after your physical death, it is your SOUL that will "perish".
>>69558177
Who would want an eternal soul? An absolute end is all I desire.
Nah its more a case of a man telling you to give up what you have now and do what he says because he knows that if you do good things will happen when you die
>>69557994
If I present you with a choice and I already know how you'll choose, it's not really your choice, it's my choice in presenting you with the illusion of choice.
The only way it's free will is if I present you a choice and you make a choice completely independently with me not knowing the outcome.
If I were to place an open beer in front of you on a hot day, knowing that you will take it and drink it, that's not really your choice, but it was my choice to offer you the drink. If I was to want to give you a consequence for drinking the beer, like it was flat and disgusting, and I know you will take it and drink it, then I have made a choice by offering it, and you are just stuck with the consequence of my choice, and have a bad taste in your mouth. If I don't want you to have that consequence, I don't offer it to you, that's my choice. The only way it's really free will is if I offer it, and you decline, leaving me surprised in your choice.
If I'm not omniscient, I can offer you choices and you can make choices and we both have free will. If I know everything, you don't have free will.
>>69551266
first post best post.
>made me tear up as i realize how much humanity can fuck things up.
>>69558148
yeah it does
that's actually exactly what it means
I honestly don't know how to make this any more clear, because it's such an obvious thing
>>69558236
that's not your prerogative to call.
>>69558369
Take a 100 level Philosophy unit and you will understand everything wrong with what you just wrote.
>>69550984
Why would I exchange a bear I like and have sentimental attachment to?
>>69558177
If he was truly benevolent, he wouldn't want you to age, rot, and die, and would take steps to prevent it.
But he doesn't, so he's not benevolent.
>>69558369
>If I present you with a choice and I already know how you'll choose, it's not really your choice, it's my choice in presenting you with the illusion of choice.
You're either trolling or retarded. See: >>69558148
I already know what my little nephew will choose if I ask him whether he wants pizza or brown rice for dinner that doesn't mean I don't give him the choice. Will leave this troll thread for better now
>>69558530
>I already know what my little nephew will choose if I ask him whether he wants pizza or brown rice for dinner that doesn't mean I don't give him the choice
retard
you don't know what someone will choose
you're just making a guess based on experiece
fucking moron
>>69550984
Holy fuck Jesus is a dick, hes so fucking greedy he wants the bear God gave him and the bear the little girl has.
>>69558516
well, start blaming your parents then. they were selfish enough to have sex and bring you into this world full of pain and suffering.
your parents, but not God.
>>69558384
Saying that one of the oldest unsolved philosophical debates is obvious shows you haven't fully grasped the concept.
>>69556857
I guess here. Good point it's scant. So why did my religious educators stress Hell so much to me as a kid?
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Luke+16%3A19-31&version=NIV
>>69558472
Philosophy between humans doesn't involve omniscience, because we're not omniscient.
I don't know what you'll choose, I can offer you a beer and you can say "ya, na you're a cunt" and walk away.
So I make a choice to offer, you make a choice to decline.
But if I knew 100% sure what you would choose to do, then it is also 100% my choice. If I wanted you to have the beer I would offer it, and you would take it. If I didn't want you to have the beer I wouldn't offer it, so you wouldn't have it.
Without omniscience I can want you to have the beer and you still wouldn't have it as a result of your choice.
>>69558790
With Omniscience you could get the beer to him without having to offering it to him directly if you knwo that'd end in refusal.
>>69558530
in that case if you're assuming your nephew will "choose" Pizza, then YOU have chosen Pizza by offering that "choice"
>>69558592
That was a hypothetical example of omniscience at a basic level to make it easier to understand.
You're attacking a straw man.
No wonder your country is cucked.
>>69550984
Awfully convenient that we only find out if the magic jew is keeping his bargain after we die.
>>69558715
nothing is unsolved about this
there exists no god, therefore the question doesn't even make sense
no being exists that know the outcome of an event
therefore there is no evidence to say that events are predetermined
>>69558890
>That was a hypothetical example of omniscience
no it wasn't
you guessing what your brother is gonna pick has nothing to do with omniscience
>You're attacking a straw man.
it's not a strawman
>>69558954
OMFG PASCALS WAGER Y TAEK CHANCES YO
>>69558790
You are literally trying to have your cake and eat it.
Omniscience is a concept, not an entity, so
>then it is also 100% my choice
is incorrect as your actions are also predicted.
A better argument would be from Eternalism.
>>69559050
Thinking omniscience is the only argument against free will also shows your lack of understanding. See Eternalism.
>>69559172
You'll have better odds playing the roulette wheel at Vegas than winning Pascal's wager honestly.
>>69559338
I didn't say that we have free will
I only said that if someone else knows what someone will do, that person has no free will
>>69551518
Pretty god is vain enough to think he can win you over with a teddy bear
>>69559107
He literally said
>and i already know how you'll choose
You ignoring this and attacking whether his example has enough omniscience is the definition of straw man, as well as ignoring the principle of charity. Most philosophical arguments can be destroyed if you choose to ignore what your opponent is actually saying.
I suggest you take an actual class rather than read a few wikipedia entries.
>>69551800
Some bullshit about wanting his creations to have free will, it doesn't make sense because Christians keep rambling about 'his plan' it's like trying to play a chess game but all your pieces have complete free will
>>69559453
You said
>omniscient being does not exist
>therefore there is no evidence that the event is predetermined
I said
>Omniscience isn't the only evidence for determinism.
Maybe lost in translation
>>69559609
geez
it wasn't a hypothetical example of omniscience
he was talking about knowing what his brother will choose if he asks him whether he wants pizza or brown rice, because duh... why would he ever pick brown rice, when pizza is so much better?
that has nothing to do with omniscience, he was arguing from a position where he "knows" what his brother would pick cause he knows what he likes
that's like me saying, I know the favourite color of my mother, therefore, events are not predetermined, you silly goose
no person actually knows what their brother is gonna pick to eat
if you do know, actually know, without a shadow of a doubt, and not just guessing, which isn't possible anyway, then that would mean that events were predetermined, or at least that your brother has no free will
you can't know whether someone will make a certain decision unless they have no free will and someone or something else makes the decision for them, or if you read his mind the moment he makes the decision in his brain... which would really be mind.reading and not omniscience
if someone, anyone, whetther god or anyone else, knows what will happen in the future, then events are predetermined
There was a boy who was enjoying his relaxing slice of heaven (pic related), but one day the 3Dserpent enticed him about how his life on heaven sucks and that there's many thing he could have done in the 3D world. He has then committed the most foolish thing he could have ever done, which was to step away from his heaven. At first, everything was fine and dandy but now he is currently under constant pressure and bitching and drama from all the 3dpds around him.
But still, he can rejoice to the fact that Heaven is forgiving to those who accept their mistakes, repent, turn his back from the 3DPD world and seek heaven. For He has said: Seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness and all these things will be given unto you.
>>69560376
>if someone, anyone, whether god or anyone else, knows what will happen in the future, then events are predetermined
I don't think predetermined is the same as not having free will.
Free will is having the potential to choose two different actions. A person by virtue of a fantastic brain and perhaps consciousness has the ability internally manipulate their response to a decision.
If you see choice as being a fork in the road, free will is the ability to walk down either road. Predetermination is the ability to look at what path the person chose and delete it, so that it looks like there was never a fork in the road.
A computer program lacks these forks, and therefore has no free will.
Humans have these forks and therefore have free will.
>>69562236
sure there is a difference in those terms, but what I'm saying is is that if somebody knows what will happen, then events are predetermined, and if events are predetermined, you can't have free will
>>69556938
What lesson are you supposed to learn from your young child dying from a horrible painful disease? Moreover, what sort of powerful God chouses to teach lessons through the unbearable suffering and pain of an innocent child? Not to mention, what sort of lessons are imparted to, say, an entire village of people wiped out, raped and burned and tortured to death, by a roving band of dickheads? Are the rest of us supposed to somehow learn from that?
what the fuck happened to the design of the site
did I incur god's wrath?
>>69563060
tammie schneider lol
april fools?
>>69562916
What if the "omniscient entity" merely knows the result to every possible choice and fork. It doesn't know what others will choose, but does know what will happen as a result of every choice. If you want to be le ebin many worlds quantum interpretation, the omniscient can see/know every world in there.
>>69552681
and then the yhwh, yahweh, jehovah, or I AM, a self centered, selfish spirit is the expression of that separation.
I AM. not WE ARE. he is separate. he already is in hell. that's why he's goading ancient jews around to murder other tribes, enslave them and overall be dicks, while treating them as his slaves.
old testament's god is a god of separation, strife and deception. new testament's god is a god of brotherhood, unity and truth. in unaltered gnostic texts old testament's god is the devil, false creator of matter. new testament's god is the source of all creation, creator of spirits, 'devil' yhwh included.
opposite beings.
>>69563362
then it's not omniscient
>>69550984
Yes. The lesson is that if Jesus approaches you and asks you to do something you listen. Right? That's the right answer, right? Because I'm wondering why anybody would bother saying this.
Couple of things related to posts here.
The earth is our dominion, we are in charge here. God will help you and direct you if you ask him to. If you don't, your on your own.
Good and evil, what are they? Good is right,evil is wrong. God is benevolent to man, if he wasn't we wouldn't exist.
God being good does what is right for man. God always does what is right. What is the right thing is not always the nice thing, it may cause suffering, but it is the right thing.
Understand what we are, we are creatures of change, every breath we take changes the world. Some of the decisions we make change it more, but are they the right changes.
>>69563362
>doesn't know
>omniscient
Unless you're omnipotent, pick 1
>>69563958
get out of here with your god, fag
>>69564116
Naw. Why is kek going to change me into a redditer.
>>69550984
Yes I'm sure Jesus has never stood idly by while his followers were slaughtered by heathens.
>>69551266
>removed 7 books that weren't approved by the cannons of dort
>>69562916
What you're essentially saying is that once an action has happened (when the action is in the past) it cannot happen any other way. Which is true. I voted for Merkel the whore in the past, and that is unchangeable.
But future events still have their options, I can vote for Hitler or Merkel in the future.
An omniscient being must stand at the end of the timeline or the end of time. All it can see is the past. In that way, everyone is omniscient of a simple choice when it is viewed from the future.
I would argue that an omniscient being can't exist anywhere other than the end of time, otherwise it wouldn't be omniscient.
Thereby the future cannot be known to it, only the past.
>>69550984
/pol/tards want to be a priest now
>>69566412
makes sense
I would agree with that
>>69557200
consider the following:
>god (more like creator. god is an authoritarian term) was alone
>he created spirits in his image, but without his knowledge or experience, since he wanted companions, not clones/servants/slaves
>he wanted them to grow individually, so that there would be more like him, but not identical to him
>he set up universal laws of action > reaction to teach them
>the spirits, when blank are nearly thoughtless, so they had to "evolve" through various stages, such as gaining sentience, gaining instincts, gaining emotions, gaining compassion, gaining intellect, unity with others etc
>suffering exists to hone spirits with fire, like steel that gains properties when heated, it's the universal law extending over lifetimes
>those who suffer do it to purify their spirit, especially for some past life transgressions like killing fellow men in a pointless war, especially war of aggression or elite-sponsored false "war"
>eventually a time comes when the spirits have gained enough experience to shift, or collectively "evolve" to a higher plane.
>in this process the spirits are being sanctified, going back to god
>at this point the ones who are about to collectively shift start going through "great tribulation", to purify them to perfection before they're taken away
>hatred towards them becomes common, as means to inflict that purification
ancient annunaki may have been that. previous dominant race that gained tons of experience and was about to shift up, so they went through shit to remove all remaining impurities, and after they left they were collectively remembered as evil gods.
whites go through similar shit today, from blacks, semites, chinese, muslims. after white genocide is complete, we too will be remembered as evil.
>>69553267
What you are talking about is not what is in the bible but the american version of karma which is utter nonsense. Unfortunately for you your country was founded and continues to be filled with total morons that literally believe an allegorical history of the world that was never even meant to be believed by children, i.e. the Old Testament, and accord it the same infallibility as the actual word of God in the New Testament. If you want to know what is in the bible then read the bible. God doesn't make rich people rich and poor people poor or sick people sick, you know how that happens; hard work, intelligence, opportunities, environmental factors etc. God does what is in His nature and part of that is He never burglarises the human will, also Jesus clearly states it is all but impossible for a person born in wealth to live a good life and enter Heaven, but these people weren't predestined to fail, they have the same opportunities to be good as everyone else. God already saved your soul, there's nothing else guaranteed except that the world by its nature is full of suffering and that you will sin and be sinned against because of free will.
And free will would be impossible in the conditions you demand of existence, a finite number of infallible and perfect automata that neither are born nor can die with no cells to reproduce or mutate would have to be created, incapable of creation or independent action. I assume that's what you would prefer, as would anyone scared of freedom or failure.
>>69551266
>this is what catholicucks believe
>>69551423
Then you go to hell duh
