Well?
>>69341917
It's called inflation
Because things can have several factor. You're welcome, 8 year old OP.
The whole raising the minimum wage increase the prices is pushed by the Jew to stop people from wanting more money.
You can't be fucking serious asking that question...
Minimum wage increases accelerate inflation. Inflation raises prices. Other things other than inflation raise prices.
/thread
>>69342035
>to be this economically illiterate
>>69341917
>picture of a woman
>everything is linear
>cant into economics
it checks out lads
>>69342035
Wanting more money is fine. Voting for it parasitic.
>>69342085
>Shlomo Goldberg refused to give me a raise, thank god he did otherwise the price of stuff would have gone up!
GOOD GOYIM
Come work for me and we'll see what we can arrange for you.
you seriously can't be this stupid can you? Its inflation, see first post
>>69342059
>/threading your own post
oh honey.... im... so embarrassed for you...
>>69341917
LOL
Good point actually. First time I've seen the concept brought up here. Definitely food for thought.
>>69341917
>what is inflation
>what is QE
>what is 0% interest rates
Here's your reply
>>69342059
I'm all for self threading but my God man, other people already said what you fucking said.
>>69341917
Prices go up for some things and down for others.
It's about need over want.
The American minimum wage is like $7.25. If you think more than doubling it to $15 will have no effect on the price of pretty much everything you're fucking retarded.
>>69342085
>>69342160
Obviously it will increase prices to some degree.
The question is, will the rise in prices/lay-offs completely cancel out the gains made by increasing minimum wage?
I don't think it's hard to see that it wouldn't cancel out and that lower class Americans would benefit significantly. Wouldn't be bad having a whole section of this country with a little bit of new disposable income.
>>69341917
More government handouts, leading to increased demand for goods. This wouldn't have happened if spending power was actually backed by production.
Prices go up bc people keep showing that they're willing to pay more for the same products. It has less to do with inflation and more with consumerism. People would rather spend all their money on crap than not spend it and save it for later
>>69342344
Income not disposable income.
>>69342344
Increasing the minimum wage only increases overall GDP by 1.25% so the economic benefit is not a good argument. It has only to do with "fairness"
>>69342344
now i do see what you mean, but the initial impact would destroy small business, hundreds of thousands of minimum wage job would be dropped, on top of price raises
>>69341917
massive national debt maybe?
budget deficits everywhere?
aggressive taxes?
shitty economics.
go learn something.
fuck your maymays
>>69342363
See man, you're the type of person who would tell a social democrat to read an economics book, but you're so obviously wrong about an easy topic. The fed is constantly injecting money into the economy directly causing inflation. People willing to pay more bills for the same thing is an effect of inflation of the money supply.
>>69342497
Well this isn't about GDP, this is about making sure more of that money is in the hands of the poorest Americans. Wouldn't be bad having more people off welfare either.
Okay memes aside.
I do believe that raising the minimum wage will just cause companies to adjust prices and we're back at square one, effectively making the entire thing pointless.
However, and this is very important, does that mean that a certain percentage of the population MUST live below the poverty line? Is that an unchangable, inevitable consequence of a capitalistic economic system?
Because if that is the case, then the system itself has failed and we need a new system.
In a hypothetical situation, where no one makes any stupid mistakes in a society, some people would still have to be cashiers, waiters and other shit jobs. If it is not possible to pay those a living wage and it is not possible to not have those jobs, then the only consequence is that some people are doomed to not be able to make ends meet and have a living wage.
I thought about this a lot recently, as it seems to be an unsolvable dilemma.
>>69341917
>things are bad so lets make them even worse lolol
>>69342533
I guess all the business that price their goods have a little calculator that shows exactly what their product should cost based on inflation so they can offer a fair price. You've clearly never worked for a business before.
Businesses charge as much money as they possibly can for a product. If people are willing to pay more then they will charge more. This is business 101 - a product is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it
>>69341917
Because raising the minimum wage isn't the only reason that increases prices.
Minimum wage raise accelerates the price increase.
>>69341917
HURR LE DURR XDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD CHECKMATE RIGHT WINGERS
>>69342713
Literally nothing I said contradicts this.
The minimum wage should be abolished and the government should instead guarantee a universal basic income of $15,000 a year. All additional income you get your job is taxed at 50% until you make more than $30,000 a year, at which point the government pushes you off the teat at no net loss of income to you.
That way businesses don't HAVE to pay minimum wage, but they had better offer something of value if they want workers. Tuition financing, on-the-job certification, serious potential for advancement, free daycare, dental or vision plans.
Anything that isn't just "here's a paycheck you have 7 months until we fire you to maintain artificial turnover".
>>69342612
>it is not possible to not have those jobs
Yes it is. If nobody wants those jobs they will not exist, lmao Germany.
>>69342533
That's because a controlled slow inflation is better than the alternatives, mainly a chaotic deflation.
This shit has a purpose.
>>69341917
The minimum wage went up in October to £6.70 and will go up to £7.20 in April retard.
I work part time so get some housing benefit. Our firm put our wage to £7.20 up in January.
The £10 a week extra I got was deducted from my housing benefit when I had a review last month.
No surprise there. better than being on the dole though. That has been frozen for a while and will be for a few more years.
>>69342591
GDP is a direct measure of buying power and individual average wealth. You clearly know nothing about economics. What my statement means is that any increase in GDP is offset or even overcome by rising prices. Look at my other reply to you, businesses will charge whatever they can get away with. Get a job.
>>69342612
The poverty line is based on population. If less people are below the line, the line is raised.
However, the main issue here is that there's more money being spent, which raises prices that are based on the entire supply of money.
>>69342795
Right but where would the government get that 15,000$ from?
>>69342813
I didn't say it didn't have a purpose, no need to get defensive. I'm just saying that the cause of inflation is the fed, and increased prices is a symptom.
>>69342795
FUCK OFF COMMIE
But if the ECB is currently struggling to get inflation to a "Healthy" 2% and is therefore printing money and buying up debt isn't it more effective to raise minimum wages in the EU?
>>69341917
>>69341917
i had a discussion with a leftist millennial a couple weeks ago where he was saying that inflation isn't a big deal because wages also go up at the same time and that "there's enough money in the system" etc, etc.
i asked him to consider that while that may be true, my savings aren't going up as fast as inflation and there in lies the problem. he gave me a puzzled look, as if to ask "what are savings?"
it served as a decent point. if you don't care about saving money long-term, then inflation is just fine, and most of the youth today spend every dollar that passes through their wallets.
>>69341917
>What is inflation?
>What is supply and demand?
>What is more technology being aggregated to products?
>What are commodity prices?
>What is the international economy in general?
>>69341917
>How come prices have continued to go up even though the minimum wage hasn't been raised in years
Irrelevant, since the standard of living has gone way up - access to food, water, shelter, technology, knowledge, and choices
while cost of living - yes I'm talking pound for pound, you can get more for less- has gone down, and global wages have gone up?
I am typing on a device that can store massive quantities of data, access a worldwide network of knowledge and real-time chatter, and that can transmit data and waves to devices I want it to.
>>69342612
You gotta define the poverty line first.
Developed countries and developing countries aren't subject to the same poverty line. Developing countries often apply a poverty line of e.g. $ 2 per day, while developed countries use another model.
It could vary, but I believe it's something like if you have less than 50 % of the average daily income per capita in your country, you are poor.
Applying this model it's obvious that there will always be some people who are poor; mathematically speaking, it's inevitable. But it doesn't necessarily mean that the system is flawed.
If we assume
>p -> q
We cannot deduce
>!p -> !q
You can construct a truth table to see that.
>>69342975
Your brain already does truth tables automatically lmao.
>>69341917
How come when things don't sell, the prices go down?
>>69342818
Dude you really are fucking retarded. The GDP of a country doesn't directly tell you how that money is distributed. I'm saying this would be about the distribution of that money, not how much the country makes as a whole. You said it would be offset by rising prices when you've clearly shown you don't understand economics. Rising prices are a symptom of inflation caused by the fed. Finally, I have a job. I don't go in until 2.
>>69342932
>putting your savings on money and not stuff like gold, canned food, ammo, fuel, basically anything that retains value
>>69341917
In 1964 the minimum wage was $1.25.
In 1964 the cost of 1 silver ounce was $1.29
In 1964 the melting value of 5 quarters (your minimum wage) was $1.29 (with copper calculated in few cents more)
---
In 2016 the minimum wage is $8.10
In 2016 the cost of 1 silver ounce is $15
In 2016 the melting value of 32 quarters (your minimum wage) is $0.97
--
Here is the link for the Coinage act of 1965, Nixon later later suspended the convertability of dollars to gold in 1971 making the dollar a fully fledged fiat currency.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coinage_Act_of_1965
http://vm136.lib.berkeley.edu/BANC/ROHO/projects/debt/terminationgolddollar.html
--
TL:DR You could sweep floors and wash dishes for 20 hours a week in 1960 and earn $1,300 dollars a month when converted to today.
Yay I love the federal reserve and inflation XD raise the minimum wage XD I've never opened an economics book XD
>>69341917
cause as long as some people are ok with cutting down on vacations, hobby, sports, going to concert etc etc then there is no reason to stop increasing price since they will be ok with buying an apple for 1€ when it was .05c 5year ago (wild exageration for the exemple)
Also there are some things you cant cut remove like paying electricity, rent etc etc so those can keep increasing as long as enought people still have money saved or are able to save money.
the greed knows no boundaries
>>69342150
>getting a raise us the same as government mandating a raise to an arbitrary amount that isn't reflective of the worth of your labor
Wew laddy>>69342344
Yes the majority of studies including one done by the extremely right wing San Francisco Federal reserve showed that minimum wage increases cause a spike in unemployment for young and low skill workers who become priced entirely out of the job market.
This shouldn't be a surprise to anyone because if you read the history of minimum wage laws you'd know that they were originally designed (both here and in apartheid South Africa) from the ground up to force low skill black workers out of the job market to protect more expensive white Union labor.
>>69342816
Only for over 25s
>>69342805
Ye because a society without garbage workers, street cleaners, sewers maintainers, etc. works so well
There is literally no person who WANTS to do those jobs, apart from some lunatics I bet. Automation might solve this in the future, but we're still decades off from this becoming widespread enough to replace human labor in those fields. And even if it did, you now have millions of people who don't have a job anymore, further making it necessary to think of a solution.
>>69342855
The poverty line is based on living costs actually, which might have some influence from population, but not a lot.
It is a fact that some jobs don't pay enough to get you above the poverty line, even if you work full time.
>>69342972
I mean we pretty much know already that poor people are an inevitable consequence of capitalism. Without poor people as a contrast, no material wealth has any meaning.
The question though is if some people being below the poverty line and/or a living income despite working full time is inevitable. And if the jobs that are affected by this are mandatory to be filled by society.
Because if that's the case, we're basically accepting unsustainable jobs as a cost of our society.
>>69342875
Close the carried interest loophole
Raise the capital gains tax to the same rate as income
Tax overseas income to eliminate the abuse of overseas havens
>>69343185
Oh and ending welfare and unemployment social programs
>>69343181
>Ye because a society without garbage workers, street cleaners, sewers maintainers, etc. works so well
It's not a matter of expectations or preference. A garbage society will be FORCED to happen, if nobody wants to clean it.
>There is literally no person who WANTS to do those jobs
People who need the money do.
no matter how much time i spend here it still baffles me: why are people here generally so retarded they are always trying to find a single simple cause of every complex problem?
somebody asks why there's constant inflation and the answers are, among others:
>niggers
>feminists
>socialism
>>69343153
So if any increase in minimum wage is a net loss or does nothing, why does every modern developed nation on Earth have a minimum wage in some form or another?
>>69341917
I'd be for raising the minimum wage if they removed the welfare state first.
>>69342344
Pretty much this.
>>69343180
Don't care. I'm 49 kek.
>>69343306
fucking commies
>>69343185
>>69343268
But where would the government get their taxes from if nobody is working since the government is paying them 15,000$ yearly?
People don't work if there is no pressure on them to work in order to survive. Once your parents die and your safety blanket goes away you will know this pressure.
>>69343274
Alright Mr. Sheckelburg, I know this is a hard concept to understand for you, but if both:
>It is required that someone do the job
>The job doesn't pay enough to sustain your life
is true, then something is fucking wrong with the system. No ifs or buts.
>>69343132
Yeah but I want more money though.
>>69343370
Well fuck you then you boomer piece of shit I hope you rot in an understaffed underfunded care home
>>69343306
>why does every modern developed nation on Earth have a minimum wage in some form or another
I don't think that's true, but in the case of the US, it's because of unions.
>>69343079
>he's going to retire and live off his cache of bullets, SPAM, and expired gasoline
>>69342612
People think we can just keep rotating teenagers through those jobs while they're on their way up to "real work", but it's not feasible because now there's so many people that labor is devalued and there aren't enough useful jobs. There's too much of the population that simply isn't necessary to keep things running so capitalism isn't working now.
>>69343431
>>It is required that someone do the job
Why? Would the universe break down if there's garbage in the streets? Is there some hidden law of nature that dictates that we must have a clean society, and if people stopped cleaning up then magical forces of karma will conspire to change that reality?
>>69343433
That's fine I understand. I'm just saying the purchasing power in 1964 of the minimum wage is nearly double what it is today because of the coinage act and gold convertibility being dropped. That's minimum wage worst case scenario, I'm sure you have some kind of skill that would make much more than that at that time.
>>69342344
The thing is that some work that is paid minimum wage currently isn't worth doing if the wage is raised.
Sure, some people will benefit from it, hospitals always need to be cleaned and so forth. But in for some work raising minimum wage means that job disappears (restaurant stops using waitresses etc.) or people get paid to do less hours and if they want to earn more they have to work under the table for extra. It also incentivizes automatisation, since the unit cost of labor rises, while the marginal benefit necessarily doesn't.
Productivity doesn't come out of thin air if someone says so. If it's difficult to live on the wages, the government should look for ways to increase human capital to increase productivity and therefore incentivize paying more wages and/or look for ways to decrease cost of living and bare necessities.
>>69343381
No, it's because without it we would have a third world underclass which causes a bunch of problems by itself. If you don't think a government set minimum wage isn't set largely to prevent wages from going below that line you're a fucking idiot.
>>69343454
Yes it is, they either have a minimum wage or they have some kind of bargaining system for workers built into the state. It's because in developed nations we don't want a class of third world poverty shitting our country up.
>>69341917
Just because raising the minimum wage increases prices doesn't mean that it is the only factor. Nobody is claiming that raising the minimum wage is the sole reason for price increases.
Your an idiot
>>69342591
>>69343068
>calls someone retarded
>believes 15 min wage will get people off welfare
I'm sure :^)
>>69343132
Yeah central banking is cancer
>>69343420
The people whom this would affect, who make minimum wage ALREADY don't pay any taxes. In most cases they pay negative taxes.
>>69343621
I did not say 15 but feel free to strawman. It's clear you don't have the brainpower to stand up in an actual argument.
>>69343452
I'm GenX actually.
Our firm does pay under 25's £7.20 though.
>>69342243
/thread
Ever since the Fed took on the "dual mandate" of both managing inflation (i.e., get ~2% annual loss of value of money, forever) AND trying to boost employment, monetary policy has been a complete mess race to the bottom.
Cheap debt minimizes risk to individuals but massively increases systemic risk of misallocation of resources.
> dot-com crash
> housing bubble burst
> coming soon: student debt/college degree bubble burst
>>69343527
In 10 years, when you're an adult, you'll propably read about the few times garbage workers went on a strike.
They literally caused society to stop functioning within DAYS. So yes, it is a law of the western modern world that garbage workers are mandatory. It is mandatory that someone does this job, period.
By the way, those strikes are the reason why garbage workers are paid well. The system worked in that case, because the consequences of someone not doing this job are catastrophic.
I wonder though because they are paid well enough, is some other fields or jobs now worse off to "compensate". In other words, what would happen if all jobs paid to sustain your life?
>>69343653
This would affect everyone, including those that make over 30k, because they now have the option to stop working which they didn't have before, and many will choose to go that route, reducing overall productivity.
>>69343181
>The poverty line is based on living costs actually,
But pays no mind to living STANDARDS
The poorest people today live better than the middle class a couple generations ago, and better than the rich of a century ago, and better than the royalty of 300 years ago.
>>69342116
Dont forget
>Americans against the Republican party.
>>69341917
If P=>Q and Q, then how come ~P?
>>69343728
You are literally a retard, Germany. If people don't want to do a job, then nobody will do it. The only reason we have garbage men is because there's demand for it. There are many theoretical jobs that do not exist because nobody cares enough about them to pay enough for anyone to be willing to do them. There is no such thing as a job that is "required" to be done, only jobs that people WANT to be done, learn the difference.
>>69343505
This might be the bandaid solution, but what people are basically saying is that it's fine to exploit teenagers for cheap labor.
But already now we have many adults doing those jobs, because they can't get into "real work" anymore. As you correctly noticed, the value of "real work" has degraded substantially over the years and now there is more competition for the few scarce decent jobs that it is inevitable that not everyone makes it into those.
There simply isn't enough jobs to even fully employ every person, let alone fully employ them in "real" jobs.
But this loops back to the question: Is this inevitable or is this caused by some management and politics mistakes?
>>69342059
>1.3 percent inflation
>>69343842
>The poorest people today live better than the middle class a couple generations ago,
By what measure anon?
>>69343677
>"I didn't say 15!!!"
Lmao anything higher than that would be even shittier which is why no one proposes it. So, without buzzwords and meme debate words how about you actually say what min wage would be best?
>>69341917
If A causes an increase in B how come B is still increasing even if A is not?
Because, maybe, just maybe, A isn't the only variable that causes B to go up.
>>69342243
>>69343696
In reality there has been essentially been no inflation; wages and other goods have even in some circumstance DECREASED in value not gone up. There's been a massive increase in the money supply and essentially no inflation in the cost of consumer goods.
Financial assets, real-estate and insurance is the only things you're seeing inflating and that's because of commercial bank credit creation not money creation by a central bank. This isn't about monetary policy (which doesn't create debt obligations) but private bank credit creation with interest attached to inflate asset prices.
>>69343916
You're blatantly wrong actually. Mandatory jobs is why the government makes those exist, if no company or corporation does.
It's literally called working for the government.
Tax workers for example. There is no economical reason for any company to provide those jobs. It's the government that creates these jobs because, get it, it is REQUIRED that someone does it as taxes are the primary way a government finances its projects.
There are tons of jobs that are required to exist for a society to function.
>>69343973
I didn't say higher either, I think 10-11 maybe even 12 is perfectly reasonable. Places in the US have it around there anyway. Hell UPS pays box stackers 10 bucks an hour.
>>69343842
>The poorest people today live better than the middle class a couple generations ago
Muh capitalism!
>>69343922
It is likely a mix of both overpopulation and terrible management and political decisions
>>69343935
Is this adjusted for inflation, standards of living and does it factor in the jobless?
Because if you fire the bottom half of poor people, of cours the rest of them look better off.
>Don't trust statistics that you didn't forge yourself
>>69344194
Yes it's adjusted for inflation.
>>69344061
There is literally nothing in this world that is mandatory you child. Every job exists because of laws of supply and demand. If you want someone to eat shit and are willing to pay them a high enough sum of money that they'd agree to eat shit, then the two of you created a new job, shit-eating. You use words like mandatory and required without understanding that everything in this world is the result of forces of nature.
>>69344194
>>69342344
>rise in prices/lay-offs
>gains made by increasing minimum wage
That there are those negatives at all excludes any benefit. So workers below the new min. wage get laid off or, don't forget, cut hours, but they don't have that happen and get new disposable income?
>>69343922
>There simply isn't enough jobs to even fully employ every person, let alone fully employ them in "real" jobs.
That's bullshit, I would hire people to do all kinds of things for me but I don't have the cash.
Employment has a lot to do with wealth distribution.
In reality the wealthy want to invest their cash in financial and real-estate assets trying to get something for noting by inflating asset prices instead of employing people. The "job creates" don't actually want to create jobs because it's more risky than putting your money into assets that will give you a safe return.
>>69344194
>>69344194
>>69342344
>I DONT KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT THE ECONOMY
The immediate effect would be a huge stock crash every major corporation that hires peons would take a yuge hit investors would be selling their shares and investing in foreign markets. Next the corporations will either automate to circumvent labor laws, or begin corporate flight (made more likely by sanders outrageous tax plan for businesses) end result is hyper inflation in common goods, displacement of low class workers, increase in the burden of the working class. To top this off your retirement funds are useless because of the newly introduced transaction tax and your 401k is based off low risk bonds in the stock market which has tanked from the commie jew. The middle class will be destroyed, the rich will lose huge amounts of wealth, many will stop working entirely and go back to "muh free collage" anyone who has a job will be fucked royally. I havent even gotten into his health care plans or his other tax policies and already America is in complete poverty.
>>69343181
Assuming there is a market economy where prices are determined by supply and demand, you could imagine 2 scenarios playing out:
1. Increasing wages for the lower classes means that demand for goods rises. Accordingly, so does the prices, effectively just decreasing the value of the money, setting the lower classes back to scratch.
2. In a functioning market economy based on a principle of ressource allocation, consumers purchase their products from the manufacturer who is the most efficient, i.e. the manufacturer producing the most goods, at the highest quality at the lowest cost. The more consumers purchase from this good manufacturer (in practice there would be more competing against each other), the better off society as a whole is; the ressources are allocated to those who are best at managing the ressources ensuring cheap products for consumers. In this scenario, poverty - in the sense you describe - wouldn't be a consequence of capitalism/market economy. Provded that it's done properly of course
>>69343842
I hate it when people complain about energy costs. When interviewed on TV they are usually sitting with 10 lights in each room on, central heating, TV in every room on, computers etc.
When I were a lad we had a coal fire and a 40 watt light bulb. There were 3 channels on TV that finished at midnight. No heating in the bedroom so in winter had a hot water bottle. Good times.
>>69344120
I feel as if I'm being trolled here.
>10-11 will get people off welfare
I wasn't even attacking your higher min wage meme. I was attacking your assertion that it would stop people from using welfare.
>>69342745
wow, what a convincing counter-argument
>>69344358
We've raised minimum wage higher than it is now you mongoloid
>>69344293
>>69344311
>>69344356
Yea that's what I feared, this "everyone is better off today" meme is really bad.
Did trickle down economics fail?
>>69344474
No it worked exactly as planned, average Americans got fucked over and the rich tripled their wealth.
>>69341917
Inflation through increased money supply OP, ever heard of it?
>>69344369
>1. Increasing wages for the lower classes means that demand for goods rises. Accordingly, so does the prices, effectively just decreasing the value of the money, setting the lower classes back to scratch.
Just regulate prices of basic necessities ;)))))
>>69341917
Wow, turns out prices can go up through other ways than increase of minimum wage.
What is this shit bait? Does anyone unironically believe prices not to go up with a "free" increase of purchasing power anyways?
>>69344369
You are right in one way, but wrong in the other.
The second example you describe requires the absolute ideal consumer, that never makes mistakes, always acts objectively, always has all the information about all products and competition.
In short: The mathematical perfect consumer.
But that person of course doesn't exist in real life. And while I don't condone rewarding people for doing stupid shit, have you seen modern advertising recently that's intentionally designed to trick you?
Ever since companies figured out that it's cheaper and easier to PRETEND to be a high quality product, than to ACTUALLY be a high quality product, shit has been going down the drain.
>>69344369
An increase in the minimum wage would just decrease overhead expenses for business by giving companies less money to pay for rent and interest payments. It would bankrupt businesses that couldn't pay their obligations initially and just result in a change in ownership and new enterprises entering the market to replace the old. It would end up having little to no effect on most prices and this has been empirically proven every time wages have gone up in recent history.
>>69343733
People have that option now. Any worker can quit and move back in with the parents, or find a roommate. They can get on welfare and unemployment to subsist on social payments. But they don't, because they want to work. Their careers are fulfilling them in ways that getting paid by the govt to sit around wouldn't.
Are there people that would relish the chance to quit their jobs so they can live off the govt watching netflix and playing video games all day? Yeah, there are. They're the lazy and unambitious ones who never succeeded and never got the lucrative jobs you're saying people will quit. They aren't going to suddenly stop caring - they never cared in the first place, and many of them are doing exactly what you say they will already.
The people who make more than 30k are the ones for whom barely surviving and wasting away in leisure wasn't good enough. They're the motivated ones who went out and achieved, and will continue to achieve regardless of the nature of the safety net below them.
I don't agree with your apparently belief that EVERYONE is secretly a layabout who would give up their families' lifestyles, their two cars and three bedroom houses.
>>69344427
>population is bigger
>unemployment is higher
>more businesses and worse Economy
>IT DUH SAME BRUH
hey kill yourself.
Not to mention that small businesses would be destroyed, they have slightly more time to switch over to the 15$ rate but how would they keep their workers in a competitive market?
>>69341917
Raising the minimum wage doesn't increase prices. In order for this to happen, Aggregate demand would have to increase (i.e. workers have more money to spend and total demand increases as a consequence of the income effect.
Although this does happen to workers who keep their job after the minimum wage is raised, raising the minimum wage is effectively a price floor in the market for labor and there will be unemployment created by such a price floor.
1. prices haven't gone up for many things, like gasoline.
2. prices will go up even more if you raise wages, regardless.
economically illiterate libs BTFO
>>69342059
There is absolutely no relationship between the minimum wage and inflation. There's not even a mechanism anywhere in economic literature by which the minimum wage could influence inflation. The minimum wage is a price floor, and there is only thing a price floor could do: increase unemployment or fail to increase unemployment.
The argument that a minimum wage hike will increase unemployment is based on the (very true and pretty much proven) assertion that in a free market at equilibrium, a price floor above the current market price will increase supply and reduce demand - creating a bunch of "extra" production that never gets used. I.e. a bunch of extra laborers that go unemployed.
The argument that a minimum wage hike will fail to increase unemployment is based on the observation that the above argument hinges on the market being a free market at equilibrium, and that modern labor markets do not appear to be sufficiently competitive to truly be free markets nor do they appear to be at equilibrium, meaning the price floor could fail to increase unemployment because employers are already paying below what they would pay in a free market at equilibrium.
>hurrr durrr if turning up the heater makes the room warmer why does the room get hotter during summer when the heater is off???!!!??!
>>69344875
>Not to mention that small businesses would be destroyed, they have slightly more time to switch over to the 15$ rate but how would they keep their workers in a competitive market?
The ensuring decrease in their overhead expenses, businesses as a whole would collectively end up having less cash on hand to pay their rent and interest payments since it would be shifted to labour.
>>69341917
>I have no concept of economics
Why are liberals illiterate? I thought they were supposed to be better educated than us conservatives.
This is like saying "If cyanide kills people how come people are dying anyways?"
>>69344875
Not advocating 15, get your shit together. The economy is not worse now because of higher minimum wage especially when it's been dropping since the 80's or so.
>>69342502
The owners can spare more and not even feel it
>>69345097
Found Mr. Goldberg.
>>69344760
>Any worker can quit and move back in with the parents
Not if he has no parents.
>They can get on welfare and unemployment to subsist on social payments
In my country there has to be something wrong with your health in order to collect social security. There are a great deal of wellfare recipients in the US, they don't want to work, because they don't have to, and you're forced to pay for them, eroding your so called american dream.
>The people who make more than 30k are the ones for whom barely surviving and wasting away in leisure wasn't good enough. They're the motivated ones who went out and achieved, and will continue to achieve regardless of the nature of the safety net below them.
That's a very delusional view of the middle class. People work harder because they want a better lifestyle, not because they're motivated to make the best out of themselves and achieve perfection. As soon as you start taxing the shit out of the middle class you will significantly increase the amount of wellfare recipients.
>>69342035
No, it's pushed by the simple fact that automation has made employers get more work for less and there is a point at which the job a human does is no longer worth the wage you "mandate" a position is minimally worth. You either replace the job with automation, reduce the number of employees and make the existing ones do more work, or get out of the shitty field you're in and go do something more profitable.
McDonalds is putting these kiosks in their restaurants to replace cashiers. Carl's Jr's CEO wants an entirely automated restaurant.
Toll bridges are going completely cashless. There are bridges near me that read your toll tag if you have one, and a camera takes a picture of your license plate and mails a bill if you don't. All the toll booth workers laid off.
Olive Garden (Chilis, Applebees, etc.) are putting tablets on their tables that allow you to order food and drink, play games, and pay for your meal. 5-6 servers get replaced with one person who runs orders from the kitchen/bar. Olive garden is so happy with the cost savings in the trial areas (and customer satisfaction) that they are expanding them nationwide.
Stating that a job is worth something does not make it so. Smaller employers will cut hours/positions, and larger employers will figure out how to replace workers with technology that will do their job for less. One or two guys might get jobs programming/building/fixing the machines for every hundred people you lay off.
Pic related are at Seattle McDonalds restaurants late 2015 onwards, and the minimum wage hike to $15 hasn't even taken effect yet (starts in 2017 for largest employers, smallest get hit with it in 2021). California now wants the same and the impact is going to be brutal on the lowest paid, least talented people in the workforce.
>>69344599
Then it wouldn't be a market economy/capitalism now would it? Certainly not in its pure form.
>>69344663
No, it doesn't, unfortunately. But in the long run advertisements that intentionally misguide consumers don't even benefit the companies whose products are promoted. Have you heard about the 'market for lemons'-theory? Essentially it explains how business' taking advantage of the assymetric distribution of information between the business and the customer actively erode the trust in the market, eventually making the market completely unattactrive for both buyers and sellers.
Ideally, in the long run, a market would regulate itself without external interference. Obviously, law makers should facilitate a system built on trust by making laws that oblige sellers to be loyal towards the buyer and provide a certain amount of information, but generally such a system would encourage consumers to actively commit themselves to pay more attention to the products they buy and what business' are behind them, so what they won't be scammed.
The argument that the ideal consumer doesn't exist is a valid point, but current systems certainly don't incentivize consumers to be "ideal" either. This is probably a matter of personal belief, but if some people are notoriously uninformed and unaware of how to spend their money and never asks themselves why they might effectivize their spending don't they in some sense deserve to be poor? At least I don't think that the system is necessarily flawed because of this.
>>69341917
If i get fucked in the ass, i scream. How come, if i scream, i dont get a cock up my ass? Mysterious...
>>69345516
It already isn't a free market because you're forcing minimum wages.
>>69344753
True, and could be the 3rd scenario, but I don't think it's incompatible with what I wrote
>>69341917
its called inflation you huge homosexual
the minimum wage might not have been raised, but there has been more money printed and inserted into the market
imagine tomorrow everybody on the country was gifted 1 000 000 dollars
do you think ipods will still cost $100? no you faggot, they would now cost 1 000 000 000 in that scenario
>source: i live in the only country in the planet that had a superhyperinflation in its history
>>69345097
Sandberg is saying 15$ is the new min wage. Come on now kikestein, the economy is worse is the point, increasing minimum wage during the golden age makes sense and wont harm companies, in a RECESSION it will. The circunstances are different.
ontop of that sandberg plans to increase taxes by 4.5k (income tax alone) for minimum wagers. Its out of the oven into the easybake. Realize that you and him are both retarded and dont know anything about the economy. Stay out when adults talk
>>69345749
>>source: i live in the only country in the planet that had a superhyperinflation in its history
Didn't zimbabwe have 11,200,000% inflation in a single month in 2008?
>>69341917
Inflation. Regulation.
Lots of prices have gone down. Mostly where the government holds less power such as tech or non-insurance medical (lasik and plastic surgery).
>>69345478
man ive seen this copypasta several times now
im not upset by any means, seeing it is just evidence that pol is talking about the minimum wage meme too fucking much
>>69341917
>Inflation
>More government regulations which lead to increased cost of goods
>>69345236
Who said anything about taxing the shit out of the middle class?
http://ctj.org/pdf/offshoreshell2015.pdf
According to this study last year, over $620 billion potential taxes are hidden away in overseas havens by the Fortune 500 companies.
http://www.cato.org/publications/policy-analysis/american-welfare-state-how-we-spend-nearly-$1-trillion-year-fighting-poverty-fail
That's $668 billion that the govt will save by ending the programs made redundant by a universal income
http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/taxfacts/displayafact.cfm?Docid=161
In 2007, the government collected $137 billion in capital gains taxes. Increasing it to the same level as income tax would easily net another $100 billion
All the ways I've mentioned to finance a universal income hit the rich - in particular, they disproportionately affect the corporations and ultra-rich that abuse loopholes to shift their tax burden onto the middle class. I don't know where you got the idea I was advocating for some kind of monumental tax hike on the middle class.
>People work harder because they want a better lifestyle, not because they're motivated to make the best out of themselves and achieve perfection.
That's a perfectly reasonable, if more cynical assessment of the middle class, but you're just saying the same thing I am.
That better lifestyle they want so badly is not going to be theirs if they drop out of their careers and rely on what barely tops the poverty line in income from the government.
>>69341975
So minimum wage shouldn't be adjusted to inflation?
>>69345478
That automation was going to happen regardless, can't wait to see /pol/s head spin when they implement a basic income(which will have to happen as automation ramps up)
Also no studies every show large job losses from minimum wage, you can google this yourself. Either small job losses than an increase in jobs due to higher spending (people who make less spend more of their disposable income) or just straight job increases, all this information is easily googleable. Also the Jew is the one trying to keep minimum wage low so they can scrape more off the top. Is /pol/ really this blind? Ceos wages have skyrocketed while your average workers has stagnated for the past 2 decades, you're all getting fucked over and youre smiling about it.
>>69341917
TARP, QE1, QE2, Operation Twist and QE3. Plus all the other BS that CBs have done world wide.
But that in no way negates the fact that higher wages means higher costs for businesses to operate.
Simple is the cretin who thinks that it is not possible for there to be multiple routes to higher prices.
>>69346480
Search 4plebs. It's not pasta, just me (same anon) making the same point). I don't copy/paste it.
>>69346803
Basic income is an inevitability given the current course of things. As far as recent history goes, huge increases have not been the norm lately, and most areas that have passed a fifteen dollar minimum wage (E.g. Seattle) don't actually have it in effect at this moment, so it's impossible to fully measure.
>>69345516
America was never fully captilist as it's blatantly leads to ogilarchy, wish people wouldn't be so retarded and use the parts of economic models that work together
>>69345844
ours was worse
wikipedia it
>>69346600
There shouldn't be a minimum wage.
>>69346803
>That automation was going to happen regardless, can't wait to see /pol/s head spin when they implement a basic income(which will have to happen as automation ramps up)
This too
Automation is going to make for an exponential increase in productivity over the next 50 years.
It's also going to make 2 out of every 5 American workers obsolete, and there's going to be blood in the streets if companies funnel their enormous profits into CEO salaries instead of providing for the laid-off millions
>>69346600
no, that will only exacerbate the issue. What the government should try and do is lower inflation and control it. Honestly that's what most people want their money to actually have bang for their buck.
>>69341917
Because prices increase as a result of supply and demand.
Shit's more expensive, because you retards want so much of it, so supply stays the same while demand continues to increase. When you increase the minimum wage, the cost of labour goes up, while supply stays the same, and demand continues to grow, accelerating the increase of prices
>>69342903
If you want to go down that road, read "Value, Price, and Profit" by Marx. It literally answers this same question.
>>69341917
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affirming_the_consequent
Its called the FEDERAL RESERVE. It lowers the interest rate on money it lends to big banks. Then the big banks lend the money out at way higher rates, raking in buku bucks.
The more money the big banks lend, the faster the inflation rate goes up.
Right now we are living in a period of
"HYPER-STAGFLATION".
Google it...
>>69343935
If you read my posts, I said nominal costs and incomes are irrelevant in the face of living standards.
>By what measure anon
Nutrition, longevity, access to medicine, access to technology, diversity of choice, expanded ability to live and work wherever one pleases (e.g. farming advances, telecommuting, auto ,aviation and private rail advances etc).
LINK THE MINIMUM WAGE TO INFLATION
PRICES RISE = WAGE GOES UP
>>69341917
Inflation. What causes inflation? Additional money being added into the total money supply. The more money the government spends, the more money it prints. This in turn devalue the currency causing inflation.
How to reduce inflation?
Abolish minimum wage (this will lead to deflation), go back to the gold standard (with the gold standard inflation is nearly impossible), reduce government reach and government spending.
Its called the FEDERAL RESERVE. It lowers the interest rate on money it lends to big banks. Then the big banks lend the money out at way higher rates, raking in buku bucks.
The more money the big banks lend, the faster the inflation rate goes up.
Right now we are living in a period of
"HYPER-STAGFLATION".
Google it... now
>>69341917
Minimum wage needs to be tide to living expense index if the country that you live in they are paying their debts with you hard work by increasing the inflatio.
Inflatio is the way that Countries pay back the intrest on their debts to Central Banks. Why do you think that for example ECB´s only target is to keep inflation in 2 %. Because larger inflation would upset people and make them angry but with 2 % people wont notice.
And yes I am aware that inflatio in Eurozone is around zero ATM but when oil prices start to go up again inflatio will rise and maybe a lot over 2 % because ECB has been buing government debts via pumping 60 billion euros in to the system every month since last april.
>>69347622
Also, reform of the federal reserve.
>>69344474
>everyone is better off today" meme is really bad.
But it's objectively true by almost every metric.
What does it matter if you don't have as much share of total wealth as your ansectors- a purely quantitative analysis- when thanks to the current system you live a far better life then they have- qualitatively.
You have more good, better education, better tech, greater access to clients and employers overseas, and can traverse the world faster than ever before, and all that for far cheaper.
>>69346803
>can't wait to see /pol/s head spin when they implement a basic income(which will have to happen as automation ramps up)
A basic income is literally impossible, you can't just create free money for everyone, and you can never recoup the cost of a basic income through taxation
I can't tell if this is a 'make fun of women' thread or if OP just doesn't understand economics.
The dollar has been devalued by means of an increased money supply, without increased production. Therefore, prices have 'gone up'; I like looking at it as the dollar as 'gone down' this is inflation.
>>69344970
In regards to wage rates: this anon is spot on.
>>69341917
> minimum wage is the only thing that affects price level
Holy shit. I've heard retarded things before but this definitely takes the cake.
>>69347827
This. If you contrast the rich and poor what really is the difference?
People on welfare have an iPhone, Xbox, a house/apartment, brand name clothes, food, TV, computer etc...
Also, if minimum wage isn't enough to survive on, then how come some people survive on it?
>>69347827
What a load of bullshit. Lemme rephrase what you jus said...
"Hey, a bunch of smart people made life better since the last time your ass got robbed by us jews" Sounds about right?
>>69342745
>the equivalent of raising white flag
>>69348091
>people having more money than you is robbery
>>69348073
>Also, if minimum wage isn't enough to survive on, then how come some people survive on it?
Because the majority of people are retarded. Not literally of course, but economically. They can't balance a budget to save their lives and have no idea of the distinction between mandatory and discretionary spending.
I make about minimum wage (literally a few pence above) and I get by fine, even with rent, gas, electricity, car insurance, tax, petrol, internet and food. My mandatory spending is about 70% of my income, which I'm well aware is shit, but it gives me plenty of spending cash for take out and motorcycle parts
>>69343696
>student debt bubble
How is that a bubble? It's not backed by any security like the housing crisis so the only people it affects are the dumdums that defaulted on their loans.
>>69341917
Minimum wage has been going up in the u.s. and the prices of food and houseing goes way up everytime
>>69347920
>you can't just create free money for everyone, and you can never recoup the cost of a basic income through taxation
https://research.hks.harvard.edu/publications/getFile.aspx?Id=923
We apparently managed to create over a trillion a year in "free money" for the Iraq War, why can't we do it for the poor?
>>69347827
If I don't need that money, then why does someone else deserve it?
>>69348298
No, you created over a trillion a year in debt to pay for the Iraq war, and while your debt is greater than your GDP it gets harder and harder to actually get loans
>>69344970
>There is absolutely no relationship between the minimum wage and inflation.
this guy gets it. I don't understand why so many on /pol/ seem to think that somehow a raise in the minimum wage (which few people earn) is going to increase prices throughout the economy
>>69348254
The UK minimum wage is about 50% higher than the USA minimum wage
You also get by on your own. Some people have families they have to provide for.
>>69348510
This. Eve stickers at Walmart make more than minimum wage. 10.50 an hour starting out.
>>69341917
>>If X is true, then how come Y? Checkmate Z.
/thread
>>69344970
You're retarded if you think there's no relationship between minimum wage and inflation. It's very simple. Almost every industry depends on minimum wage. And as much as everybody likes to pretend that there's a huge profit margin for every company. So that bit of lost money from the raising of minimum wage is made up by increasing the price of their goods.
And of course there hasn't been enough increase in minimum wage to account for all of inflation, because there are multiple reasons for inflation and multiple causes.
Why do you think minimum wage will have no effect on price?
>>69348673
Even stockers. Auto corrects a hell of a drug.
>>69348627
>The UK minimum wage is about 50% higher than the USA minimum wage
Cost of living is also about 80% higher, pound for pound you yanks are better off than I am.
As for the family question, there's child support and such that grants extra money to those that have dependants, but it again largely comes down to a question of economic literacy. When you can't put food on the table for little Muhamad cause you're paying £70 a month for his iPhone bill, you need to reevaluate your spending
ITT: people oblivious of economics.
>>69344474
>trickle down economics
how to spot a retard
>>69342932
Buy gold you fucking moron. It won't lose value. Or do some investing that keeps your savings growing. Even if slowly.
>>69341917
If shitting the bed makes your sheets dirty, then how come I still need to wash my sheets even though I haven't shat the bed in weeks?
Is it really that difficult to understand one outcome having multiple causes?
>>69348715
Companies typically pass the cost onto labor (i.e. cutting people and downsizing) not consumers.
>>69348260
a degree may not be fungible between individuals, but what's been happening the last few decades is in every other way a bubble.
> service costs rise
> debt offerings for said service expand
> prices rise more to match available purchasing funding
> ...
the big problem is that degrees have begun to cost people significantly more than they're really worth, but skewed public perception of value and an expansion of total debt past $1T have prevented demand from falling to more justifiable levels.
Peopl like Bern-Outs don't understand that by "making college free" they're just going to drive costs up and value down even closer to the breaking point.
>>69344970
I have a masters degree in econ and your wrong. If you think a nationwide increase in the price of labor effects the price level of different states in different ways, then I advise you to go back to macroecon 101.
>>69348091>>69348091
>What a load of bullshit.
I can buy an entire wardrobe for the cost of a suit in the 20s.
I can have hearing, cooling, refrigeration, and cooking appliances for what would have amounted to the cost of one of those years prior.
I have a 4-phone plan for less than the cost of the original cell phone and several computers for far cheaper than What took to purchase and maintain the ENIAC
>Hey, a bunch of smart people made life better since the last time your ass got robbed
The USSR had a "bunch of smart people". Capitalism's production and distribution model allowed for increased quantity of goods and services, competition, and prices driving down toward 0.
>>69348627
>You also get by on your own. Some people have families they have to provide for.
Translation: People have to subsidize others who had children they could not afford.
>>69349081
>>the big problem is that degrees have begun to cost people significantly more than they're really worth
I question that. Most employers are older gen and are impressed with degrees even in useless fields such as philosophy.
>>69349408
It's not always children. Some people have to take care of their parents or siblings, or those of their spouse.
If your mom lost everything, would you scoff at "subsidizing" her too?
>>69348914
There becomes a point to where you simply can't cut more labor. At a mcdonalds for example:
You have a person making the burgers in the back, a person taking care of the frys, a drive thru person, and the person taking orders up front.
Where in that do you see a possibility for cutting workers? You could cut 1 maybe, greatly impacting the efficiency at the place, but it's not realistic. At some point, the prices have to go up
>>69349081
In fairness, college, as it is, is a ridiculous and inefficient. If the government radically changed how it worked (got rid of useless degrees, inefficiencies, etc.) and introduced incentives to save, you could bring the cost down. Of course, I'm pretty sure most bernouts just support blank checks which would make it worse.
>>69348806
That.
>>69349744
It depends on the industry, but many would probably go out of business. Increasing prices is very bad and doesn't necessarily lead to higher revenue.
>>69349744
Are you kidding?
Machines can cook and assemble burgers and fries.
Touchscreen kiosks can take drive-thru orders and counter orders.
You could run a McDonalds with only one person to grease the wheels and take complaints as necessary.
>>69341917
affirming the consequent. it's a fallacy in formal logic, and this is an example.
>>69349600
the problem is that unless those sentiments are shared both globally, things will break.
if other labor markets have less wasteful biases, production will shift geographically.
western society will implode sooner or later, considering that our young adults are wasting upwards of a decade producing nothing, learning far too little of value, acquiring massive debt, and not even starting families and having kids.
>>69349765
it starts in at least high school, which is not exactly cheap when you start looking at how much local, state, and federal taxes go into them per-pupil.
>>69349865
>Not understanding "trickle-down" is a term used to criticize supply-side economics
He's not a very smart guy, is he?
>>69350359
>if other labor markets have less wasteful biases, production will shift geographically.
It already has. Wages minimum or otherwise in the western world have fallen and will continue to fall and wages in china india and some countries in south america will continue to rise until an equilibrium is reached, and there's nothing anyone can do to stop outside of nuking or barring trade with china, but the merchant will never allow this.
>>69350359
>and not even starting families and having kids.
We're in a massive labor glut. People squirting out dozens of kids are part of the problem.
If anything we should be discouraging having kids.
>>69350788
(the merchant is a Jewish god)
>>69349735
>It's not always children. Some people have to take care of their parents or siblings, or those of their spouse.
You and I both know that's a red herring argument.
"About 4 out 10 children were born to unwed mothers.1 Nearly two-thirds are born to mothers under the age of 30.2"
" Today 1 in 4 children under the age of 18 — a total of about 17.4 million — are being raised without a father4 and nearly half (45%) live below the poverty line.5"
" 37 percent of single-parent families lack self-sufficiency (and are officially poor) compared with 7 percent of married-couple families."
Poor sexual and parenting decisions make up a considerable portion of tranfer payments.
"If your mom lost everything, would you scoff at "subsidizing" her too?"
Well my mother, as did my father, came to this country with nothing and worked like mad to out down payments on houses each before marrying each other.
My father admittedly was in Medicare in his last years, but that's a system he paid into more than he got out of -albeit a broken one .
If my mother has her house burned down , dementia creeps in, and arthritis goes into overdrive, I would not be affected by a minimum wage increase- as I make a decent living- but even if I was not that's akin to the question
>Is stealing to survive ethical?
It's still theft, albeit the their is biased in the matter.
>>69349910
Yes it does depend on the industry. A grocery store might be able to handle it. But what about a small store? If they are now having to hemorrhage money due to increased wages, where do they earn more money?
Like you said, many places will go out of business, people will lose their jobs. So rather than making any money, they will be making $0 an hour.
>>69349928
Oh yeah, I know automation will come in. But that will be even worse than raising prices. The unemployment will start to rise very fast. The minimum here in California is $10 an hour, and they're about to pass laws to increase it to $15.
But look, this isn't only fucking around with people making minimum wage. My girlfriend for example is making $20 an hour, for a job she went to college to be able to do. When she got the job, she was making $12 above minimum wage, now she's making $10 above minimum wage, next year she will be making $5. Is that fair to her or anybody that worked hard for their career? Now she's just barely over minimum when she used to be making more than double
>>69350917
unless you can control the number of african, indians, and chinese being born, western populations will have minimal impacts on labor oversupply.
>>69343079
Those things are also completely reliant upon the market for each and every good. If you need to sell gold that stuff when the entire world just struck gold then you're screwed.
>>69343306
All rich countries got rich when there wasn't a minimum wage.
>>69351258
Are you a globalist?
Protectionism will make foreign populations irrelevant to USA's labor supply
>>69347139
>I am economically illiterate , the post .
You know the manipulation of the interest rates by the federal reserve is the whole reason the business cycle even exists , right ?
>>69352769
I'm not a globalist, but I'm not exactly a staunch protectionist either, and I don't see how the US could substantially tighten import controls at this point without causing a global depression.
>>69353206
Why should the US care about causing a global depression? The bigger problem is how to pass such protectionist laws and not get assassinated by google's robot hitmen.
>>69341917
its called illegal immigration and moving companys oversea
>>69341917
It's called inflation you fucking Britbong cucklord. You obviously don't know how to economics.
>>69350754
"Trickle-down" is a buzzword used by leftists to criticize any kind of economic policy they don't like regardless of whether or not it is related to supply side economics.
>>69354251
But why havent wages followed inflation?
>>69341917
It is caused by the government printing too much money.
Inflation.
Milton Friedman explains:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jE7zxo61Xc8
>>69341917
If all squares are rectangles, why aren't all rectangles squares?
CHECKMATE, CONSERVASHITS!
>>69346600
this is what brazil is doing, but it makes the inflation even higher
>>69356891
Not true.
Wages only "chase" higher prices.
Inflation is caused by bad monetary policy. Watch the video by Milton Friedman.
>>69355686
Fucking love Milton desu, wish he was still around to drink liberal tears. He'd probably be banned from most cuck universities these days though
>>69341917
It's because wages honestly have nothing to do with prices. Companies charge what consumers will pay. If their costs go up they have layoffs. If their costs go down, they pocket the extra profit.
Why does Nike charge $250 for a shoe that costs them $3 to make? Because that's what you'll pay.
If we had a true capitalist economy where companies actually had competition that pressured to keep prices down then minimum wage would certainly affect the price of goods. But we don't. We have a bloated corporate welfare state that doesn't allow large companies to fail for their incompetence.
>>69357395
Who do you think his modern living equivalent is?
Although I don't like de Grasse Tyson, many associate him with Carl Sagan. Who is Friedman's clone?
>>69357874
Correct. If wages go up, labour is simply replaced with capital (substitution effect.)
Inflation is caused by printing too much money (bad monetary policy.)
>>69341917
> be small local business
>barely get by, but make enough to stay in business and stay happy
> minimum wage suddenly goes up $7
>lose money
>close business
>everyone you employed is out of a job
Muh minimim wayge
You could raise the federal wage a bit. $15/hr is a stupid target for the whole country and will probably put people on the street.
Either get the states to raise wages or choose a reasonable number like $10 or $11.
