Been seeing this meme floating around facebook from the berniebots. Myself being a trekkie, I must address one extremely glaring flaw in their assumption.
There was a technology in Star Trek that made their version of "socialism" possible: Replication.
The ability to take matter and convert it into tangible items like food, clothing, or shelter at virtually no cost (well, at least not what WE consider "cost") would indeed make socialism possible.
However this is 2016. We do not have this kind of technology. With the advancement of 3D printing I would say something like Star Trek replication may become a reality 1 or 200 years down the road, but certainly not in our lifetimes.
Until then you will never be entitled to the product of someone else's labor, and therefore socialism will always fail.
That's because Gene Roddenberry was a hardcore socialist and believed a lot of borderline fascist things about the police and military.
He invented a magic box that made currency obsolete, along with all economic labels like 'socialist'.
>>69175023
Peole confuse libertarians with anarchists.
>>69176401
*People
>>69175023
There was still private property in star trek.
The finances were utter bullshit desu.
>>69175023
if the replicator is a technology made possible, what is left for humans to acheive since they have already gotten all the things they want
>>69175023
It's been pointed out here before, and First Contact made the point best, warp drive was invented by a guy interested in fame and fortune, not lofty idealism.
>>69175023
Anyone who thinks Star Trek is cooler than Mad Max is a gigantic faggot anyways.
I WILL RIDE ETERNAL IN VALHALLA!
>>69175023
Fixed that for you op
>>69177110
lol'd
Still need to money to buy an antique baseball card.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wx5I7uEEEYo
>>69176837
Yeah, every Star Trek episode is just people sitting around bored because they have everything they've ever wanted.
You're a fucking retard.
Didnt replicator technology kill off like 95% of the world's population because they didnt want to do anything but fuck around with whatever they wanted? The remaining people on the actual ships and shit are the people who stuck it out and had higher ambitions like to Make Earth Great Again.
>>69177110
Pfft. There are no Muslims in the future.
>>69176837
Common misconception. The Federation is not a post scarcity society, it's just that they've reached a level of development where the average joe has access to so much material resources that they hardly want for anything. The concept of property and money of some form still exists though, kirk owns a house which he remembers selling in generations, picard has his family chateau and Sisko has a family restaurant or some shit. basically people barter for the things they desire.
>>69177199
will you get a job and explore space if youve gotten all the things you need in life?
the replicator replicates everything, cars, houses, latest tech, the best food in the world at literally no cost.
youre a fucking retard.
>>69176916
even marx admits that socialism wouldn't be possible without capitalism
>>69177572
>basically people barter for the things they desire.
Which makes no sense, of course, considering barter has no benefits over digital money.
>>69177680
>Getting to explore the universe and answer the big questions.
No I'm fine right here in my house watching tv and eating replicator steaks
>>69177680
Yes because it could be fun and would be useful to society.
>>69177416
The pretty much never directly give a population count for Earth in any series. It can be inferred that the population is ~9 billion during TNG, the number of borg drones in an alternate timeline.
>>69177572
why would anyone own a restaurant if anyone can clone the dish they wanted using the replicator?
you could assume people go to restaurants in star trek for the purpose of socializing or tradition but then again, an empty, no owner restaurant with a replicator can do it just fine.
>>69175023
>>69175582
>implying technology won't eventually move us to a post-scarcity society
>>69175023
Trek isn't even "socialist" because the government doesn't own the means of production.
The whole socialist/communist end of the economic spectrum would be rendered useless in a post-scarcity society because you don't fucking need to collectivize resources when they're basically unlimited. Star Trek is the ancap utopia.
>meanwhile, in a fascist society
>>69176916
Warp drive was invented by people from the future, his rocket didn't actually have a warp drive before
>>69178296
That was indeed the wrong photo.
>>69178259
>government owning means of production = socialism
When will this meme end. Everything is not government property, but either public or personal private property. Private property does not exist.
>>69177680
You're the one that asked "what do humans have left to do in a resource abundant society" when decades of film from a single TV series has answered that question, let alone other Sci-Fi material or just thinking for five god damn minutes.
Unlimited resources can't earn you prestige. Unlimited resources can't earn you friends and lovers. Unlimited resources can't give you beachfront property in Malaysia (if such property is worth anything in your shithole of a country). Unlimited resources can't teach you to paint, play an instrument, or otherwise better yourself.
Maybe you would sit around being a fat, lazy fuck but to claim that humanity has nothing left to do once we get unlimited resources is the dumbest thing I've heard all week.
>Captain Picard's family owns a grape vineyard
>"""socialist"""
There's literally a fucking magic box. And there's still money in the form of gold and latinum.
>>69178305
The fuck are you talking about, have you ever even watched first contact? The reason the Vulcans found them was the WARP signature.
>>69175023
Didn't have replicators in TOS. Gas yourself, faggot.
>>69175023
>libertarianism means anarchism
>>69177680
People wont grow up with material values as they have everything they want.
Personal achievement determines ones status and standing within society.
This is the idea, it looks good on paper, however IMO there would have to be some sort of extreme eugenics or genetic engineering to make this possible.
>>69177892
>what are federation credits?
Uhura buys a tribble using credits. People outside the federation economy access it through use of this credit system. Transactions within the federation economy are so insignificant as to not warrant it. Say sisko wants to sell his bar and buy an exelsior class ship - not going to happen. But if he wants to trade for a more modest vessel then that's probably realistic.
>>69176401
people confuse anarchism with post-apocalyptic chaos
>>69178516
you seem to be doing something with your life with all the abundance of materials you can get living in whatever cucked of a state youre living in.
i wonder what is it other than posting Trump will make anime real again and ordering pocket pussies online?
>>69178208
people that want to experience food done the in the old ways and luddites like Picard's brother
>>69178622
Have you ever seen a plot with time travel involved?
It happened because people from the future made it happen, it's a circular event
>>69178208
Novelty and nostalgia
>>69178305
I think a re-watch is in order. Historically, the warp flight happens without interference. They only make sure it happens again because the site is attacked and the timing is crucial for first contact to commence.
>>69178208
Because people want to experience something real that has been grown and then prepared by human hands. Like an art form
>>69177110
/thread
>>69178233
>he thinks that anytime soon humans will have the technology to end "scarcity" ie. fucking entropy
if you had more then 20 billion people with first world living conditions in our solar system we'd go right back to devouring metals and fighting over strategic assets before spreading like a cancer to other areas of space
>>69178781
Yes, but that's only the case because the rocket got shot. He invented it, and then the rocket got shot, and then they came back and helped him. Also, notice how before they made it to the past, the planet was a Borg planet?
>>69178208
>people go to restaurants in star trek for the purpose of socializing or tradition
Pretty sure that's exactly why the crew went to Guinan's bar in TNG. She was more therapist than bartender.
>>69178781
like riding around in horse carriages and using land lines?
>>69178259
It's not post scarcity though. After the battle of wolf 359 and the destruction of a large proportion of the federation fleet there was a ship shortage. Ships take time to produce, personnel take time to recruit and train. Basically the underlying economics become more time and energy based.
>>69179241
>like riding around in horse carriages and using land lines?
You joke, but people do this in first world nations.
>>69179131
>tfw you realise bartenders were always therapists
>>69178913
Necessity is the mother of invention, I think you'd fine we'd go out and mine other planets if we had to.
>>69179506
That isn't post scarcity though anon, there is no magic utopia were man solves entropy anytime soon.
That's literally the challenge of existence itself, the whole universe is slowly dying.
Even with 30 billion humans and colonies on a bunch of planets, we'd still have resource limitations.
>>69178774
>there is a difference between anarchy and post-apocalyptic chaos
?
The argument of "why do people still run restaurants" & whatnot is very simple: MOST people still want something to do.
There are thousands of millionaires & billionaires around the globe who could literally stop working and want for nothing for the rest of their lives... yet they continue working.
If had a millions of dollars to throw around I wouldn't just sit on my ass jerking off all day, I'd still do *something*. I likely wouldn't "work", per se, but I'd engage in a hobby that interests me. Technology interests me, and I've often thought of opening a "computer museum" someday if I have the means.
>>69175023
Star Trek's universe didn't become what it was through socialism
It only became one in the era of the next generation with the advent of matter replicators which made the economy of the federation post scarcity.
There was still capitalism in TOS.
>>69179506
Now you have 100 billion people in first world conditions devouring metals and fighting over strategic resources only it takes 10 years to do anything because all your metals are on far away comets. Good job.
Post-scarcity is a myth.
Space jews
>>69175023
implying you wouldn't want this.
>>69179362
So what if it's not truly post-scarcity? If you have the technology to meet your entire society's basic needs, who fucking needs an economic system based on collectivization of resources?
>>69179915
We don't need to solve entropy. we just have to produce enough to meet our demands, which are not as unlimited as some economists make out to be.
>>69180349
Who said the resources are collectivised? They might just be prioritised by an AI
>>69180030
You're still under the assumption that efficiency and sustainability won't improve over time.
>>69177450
The Dominion are basically Muslims
>we are but peaceful shapeshifters and yet we are discriminated againALLAHUAKKBAR
>>69180447
>meet demands
You'd be better off with global facism giving people the bare minimum, because your average person wants it all.
There isn't enough rare metal in our entire planet for iphones for current population, imagine just a few billion more gobbling up entire asteroid belts and other solar bodies.
Then the other thing is in space, a radical change in human environments as we create artificial living conditions, you have no clue how this might change our birth rate.
If we have the growth rate the third world has now, we'd use up the entire solar system in maybe a century and a half.
>>69180447
>which are not as unlimited as some economists make out to be.
Oh great and omniscient god, please tell me what I do and don't demand. As long as a single person feels that he doesn't have enough time in one day and as long as single person covets Picard's vineyards there will be scarcity -- time and space will always be scarce.
>>69180547
Now you have 1000 billion people yadda yadda yadda. You're just pushing it back and back and back but you can never reach post-scarcity.
>>69180938
>glass is half empty guy
Yeah everything could be shit. A bloo bloo abloo bloo bloo
>>69180515
Congratulations, that's collectivization, just with something sci-fi to manage it. Socialism is still useless when you have a magic box to produce everything you could ever need.
>>69180158
>implying you wouldn't want this badboy.
>>69175023
Thank you for posting this
>>69181313
But they don't have that in star trek
>>69175023
>Until then you will never be entitled to the product of someone else's labor
But I am entitled to it though. And I enjoy it. Stay mad. :^)
>>69180938
>nothing is going to become more efficient or more stable
>everything is going to be shit cuz I'm a pessimist
>>69181073
If you push it back to the end of the universe, I'd say you win.
>>69175023
You know who else bases their reality off of science fiction?
Scientologists.
>>69181165
Yes, recognizing that there are only so many rocks in the galaxy is a shining example of pessimism. The true optimist would believe in magical fairy technology that would provide us with unlimited resources.
>>69181165
Dude, I'm not trying to be nihilistic, I'm just trying to point out you wont solve something like scarcity anytime soon.
You move most of man into space, then we no longer have the issues we have now with living spaces, and it would be hard as hell for people to be kept prisoner by governments or oppressed, because its SPACE and you can move around much easier then you can on a planet.
You could carve constructs out of asteroids and hollow them into cylinders, and make environments like earth that could hold a few billion, and then just mine resources with drones.
It would be a golden age for an extended period, however eventually we'd hit scarcity and have the same issues all over again.
It's dangerous to promise people any sort of paradise, but I'm not trying to discourage moving to a brighter future.
Just be realistic.
>>69181530
>If you push it back to the end of the universe, I'd say you win.
So you admit you're wrong. A society that must constantly struggle to find new resources and more efficiently exploit old ones is not a post-scarce society.
The federation was a self governing alliance of world. . . . Funded by the member worlds. It's space nato. They had a swank retirement package and some corruption that'd make the world bank's panties drop.
>>69181798
It is if no one must go without. If everyone can get what they want, I'd say its post scarcity.
>>69181613
what know what I like moar than lamborghini's?
knawwledge
>>69181768
I think by that time we would hardly be recognised as human.
>>69182219
>permanently meeting the needs of an endlessly expanding population unbound to planetary bodies
>>69180750
The Dominion = Abrahemic religions
Founders = Jews
Vorta = Christians
Jem'Hadar = Muslims
>>69181613
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singularitarianism
Not saying I believe, but of all the beliefs out there, it's probably the most likely to be true, eventually.
>>69181617
That guy's an idiot, but so is the other guy. the whole concept of Replicator technology is that it makes energy the only resource that matters. You could turn the last shit you took into either a shiny new iPhone or a 5-star steak dinner, dealer's choice.
Sort of like how they're turning a thread about the necessity of socialism in an effectively post-scarcity society into a thread about how sci-fi doesn't real, and not even doing a very good job of it.
>>69182318
I understood the reference
>>69182219
And if everyone wanted to not work, they would quickly run out of resources and die just like in today's society. In a post-scarce society, no would have to produce resources.
But fuck it. Let's say you somehow invent a technology that creates unlimited matter and unlimited energy. I'll even say that it produces things instantaneously. Even with this technology, we would _still_ not be living in a post scarce society. That matter and energy would still need to be transported, which takes scarce time. It would still need to be stored, which takes space (and yes, outer space is big but saying it's fine because plenty of room in space is like it's fine because there's plenty of room in the Alaskan wilderness).
I want to live on Miami beach along with billions of other people. I want to sip real wine instead of artificially replicated wine (real wine has "gravitas"). I want to be near my friends and family but they're halfway across the galaxy. If your definition of post-scarcity is "everyone can get what they want" then five seconds of thinking would show this will never be possible.
>>69181768
By the time we hit a scarcity in space we wouldn't be humans and the universe would be pretty fucking dark.
That's a good couple hundred billion years from now.
>>69181530
>If you push it back to the end of the universe, I'd say you win.
Exponential grows m8. In space scale times living organisms fill their boundaries instantly.
>>69183104
Star trek replicators don't work like that either.
>>69181530
Society and warfare in Star Trek make no sense period.
The transporter room ALONE snaps current understanding of 'individual rights' over its knee and tosses them the side, all because they didn't want to have to film a shuttle scene for every episode.
Post-moralist societies like the Borg have zero reason to not just press Print 20x SuperSoldier/SuicideBomb whenever they want to beam in. Planetary assaults will just look like this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cbZq2MPYHoY
Hell, even IF the enemy has shields you'd see weird ass shit like ships, beaming in other ships, beaming in other ships beaming in other ships, once their own reactors come online.
>>69183379
>And if everyone wanted to not work, they would quickly run out of resources and die just like in today's society. In a post-scarce society, no would have to produce resources.
>What is automation
besides that, there will always be people who enjoy working
>>69178394
The first was more accurate tbqhfam
>>69183412
Consider how quickly we'd burn out a single solar system, and how hard travel from system to system will be as we have yet to even master our OWN system, scarcity will be a problem within 200 years of colonizing our own solar system.
When we spread to other systems it will then be alleviated for a while depending how much we spread.
Just do basic math, more people, means that the resources you need gets large and large hyper rapidly, so when you begin to take multiple solar systems, you're going to slowly make the collective costs of resources for mankind explode.
There is likely to be a time were human descendants crack open entire planets just to make cellphones and shit and don't even settle them.
>>69182802
Bajor = Israel
Cardassia = Arabia
Vorta = Chinese
Dominion = NWO
Founders = ?
Jem'Hadar = Blackwater
Federation = The West
Klingon = Africans
Romulus = Russia
Vulkan = Germany
Gimme a coffee. NAO!
>Y-y-yes, Master. Please specify system of origin preparation method any any accoutrements or temperature adjustments
>>69183599
>>What is automation
Something that eventually needs to be replaced by finding new resources, which are scarce and will always be scarce.
But way to ignore the entire second half of my post. Please respond to >>69180941 and >>69183599.
>>69183973
Meant >>69183379
>>69183819
Do you have any idea how fucking massive space is?
Once you get past the solar system, which is packed with enough resources to last us a thousand or so years, definitely more. Then we'd have millions of years to colonize our Galaxy, not to mention the random stars in the universe, globulars that are full of fucking stars and other cool things.
Go and play Space Engine. You'll get a good idea about how massive our Universe is.
>>69175023
Bernborgs trying to shill for assimilation, disregard
>>69183842
Federation= USA
>>69184362
I'm aware how big it is anon, are YOU aware how long it takes to get around?
Are you aware that if everyone currently alive had an iphone we'd have to strip mine all the rare metals on the planet and we wouldn't have enough?
When we leave earth, 9 billion people becomes 20, then 50, then 120, then 500, and so on.
We're going to chew shit up fucking fast.
And we'll be stuck going slowly from system to system for the first while.
>>69180941
You can't demand more than you can use. By saying our wants are unlimited, economists contradict this fact.
>>69183571
that's exactly how Star Trek replicators work. They use transporter technology to convert matter into other forms by rebuilding it at a subatomic level. So as long as you've got sufficient energy and waste matter, you can make anything.
>>69184403
Oh god... I´d got that image of thousands of "refugees welcome" cucks welcoming borg drones.
>They are humans under all that metal
>Dont let the nanites fool you
>Muh strong society
>Muh equality for all
>They dont want to harm anybody
>They are mistreated everywhere
>>69184709
You're implying that the solar technology won't advance with humanity. We humans are extremely good at engineering and even by the time we conquer the Solar System, microchips will be as big as OP's penis. all jokes aside, as we grow, our resources need for cell phones would dramatically increase, along with many other technologies as they become easier and easier to produce and manufacture.
Look how much we advanced in the last 200 years or the last ten years. Soon your cellphone and the entirety of your gaming PC will be in a microchip embedded into your skull.
>>69183842
>Germany thinking they are the Vulcans
You are literally the Romulans.
>stomp around in your boots shouting all the time
>mein sciences und kultur und kloaking mechanisms
>lose every single fight you are involved in
>>69185331
True, but metals are going to burned up more in construction.
None corrosive metal is going to be the valuable resource besides water in space, space ships coated in that wont rust when they land in oxygen rich environments.
>>69184822
>You can't demand more than you can use.
Which is why billionaires who earn more money than they could possibly spend don't exist. You're retarded, we've established this.
Once again, you're taking the role of the great messiah and telling everyone "No, you don't _really_ want that". You are saying that, for everyone single possible personality, they can achieve some level of material wealth after which they will demand literally nothing. They will not want more hours in a day, they will not want more friends than they currently have, they will not want to live in the same location as someone else, they will not want to own things simply for the sake of owning things (like the millions of stamp collectors and such -- items that could not possibly be replicated because being unique gives them value).
By your very own definition that you gave here
>If everyone can get what they want, I'd say its post scarcity.
you are admitting that post-scarcity is impossible. Would you like to revise your definition so you don't look so stupid?
>>69177110
for socialism to work, everyone has to be unified, people will never be unified while non-whites exist
>>69184709
That's bullshit, there are already 96 mobile phones for every 100 people and we are still mining with most predictions stating that we have at least another 20 years before we dry up the economically viable reserves.
>>69185568
It'll be a matter beyond our time anon. I have hope the next generation will do it.
For now, we'll do what we can.
>I have to go to bed
>>69184596
Federation = USA
Ferengi = Italian Mob
Marquis = Mossad
Founders = Illuminati
Borg = North Korea
Q Continuum = Quantum Mechanics
>>69185498
Neelix = Japan
>>69179968
This. Even the federation had to do business with other cultures. They eather traded goods (dilithium crystals, gold plated latinum, etc), or services (protecting the bajoran wormhole, or fledgling societies or whatever). They still needed to trade. And even the capitalist that was unthawed in TNG ripped apart picards self righteous arguments by explaining that social status is it's own currency in their world.
Human nature doesn't allow for a utopia. The best you can do is set up a system that is hard to corrupt, wait for it to fail anyway, slit throats, and start over.
>>69186080
Kes = German woman
>>69186762
Forgot pic
>>69177019
>>69186762
Kes = Waifu
>>69175023
>be entitled to the product of someone else's labor
I'm afraid your words perfectly substantiate revisionism and the distortion of fundamental aspects of the current economic model. If anything, wage-workers alienate their forces in a dynamic of crescent expropriation of what they produce, in other words, under the submission unto the capital, those who do not abundantly dispose of it are faded to sell themselves for subsistence and thus perpetuate the ever growing accumulation of capital by a select few through the appropriation of the products of the worker's labor. The capital itself is more than entitled to the fruit of the labor from the hard workers: the capital steals it from them by the sheer force of surplus-value which is maintained by an hegemonic conscience that pacifically bends down non-proprietaries of the means of production to the organic chain of wage slavery.
First world birth rates are are no longer at a level to replace themselves. Once the rest of the world has our same level of quality of life their birth rates will drop too. That is probably what the great filter is. Aliens no longer want the aggravation of raising little alien babies so they eventually just die out once the last one dies of an accident.
>>69187668
Kes after she was kidnapped by Joeph Fritzl
>>69187668
>>69187890
>mental illness
Just sad. Hopefully she gets the help she needs.
>>69187890
KIDDING
>>69179506
i want my 400 billion universes
>but you don't need that. we can provide everyone everything they NEED with technology
how do you think breadlines got started? they eventually would get what was dictated as "need"
market demand is insatiable, and you've got to come around to understanding that it really is the best way to drive innovation. no demand = stagnation.
>>69187771
Even though the first world does experience rapidly diminishing birth rates, it will never cause a substantial decline of the current population and neither will it dramatically change its complexion and predominant traits. To think otherwise is to be rabidly delusional. Besides, this is a phenomenon caused primarily by urbanisation and the changes in the work force, it's not strictly due to the quality of life but for how the production chain sways the population in it. It's also fundamental to consider how the proliferation of contraceptives and the longing to accumulate wealth play major roles in this process. Thus, even the countries from the south already experience it.
>>69188319
Inb4 he responds to you but not me.
>>69175023
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8MUVGTdXkzk
>>69188134
You can clearly see here that this is a fantasy from Neelix.
He wants her to be sick so he can take care of her.
People forget what made the future Star Trek universe possible was massive destruction at first. There was a eugenics war and WWIII that destroyed most of humanity before all the tech and space travel happened.
Star Trek was socialist in a way and was about diversity but it was never in your face. There were no dindus or SJW trash preaching about muh equality. Also, it was about people doing right and wanting to better themselves. But even with all of that and technology it still showed human flaws and that's made it interesting.
>>69188605
>Germans "taking care" of "sick people"
>>69178296
>>69178394
>>69178913
>20 billion people with first world conditions
>solar system
Theoretically, the asteroid belt has enough resources alone to provide for more than 1 trillion. You're really underestimating how much there is in space.
Tea. Early Grey. Hot.
>>69189563
>Gas
seems logical
>>69176401
That's because libertarians confuse themselves with anarchists
>>69178233
It won't. Our technological society is headed for a collapse. Scarcity will become worse as overpopulation becomes more serious, and in the end we will live like savages (again).
>>69190169
Better than progressives running the show, at least.
>trying to make a rational argument based upon FICTION
wew, lad
>>69190314
True. At least we'll be savage humans, instead of subhuman creatures running on hormone supplements and SSRIs.
>>69178394
>>69178296
top fucking kek
>>69175023
Oh shit I know it's bad to talk tech on here. The people behind a lot of this tech at MIT are specifically trying to make replicator. Neil said that we set a 20 year course and advance 3 years every year along that path.
> circuits and plastic
> plastics metal circuits
> protein and fat
> sugar and shit
> ABS because muh MakerBot
> metal sinter
Cell phone from muh Maker soon.
>it's a "teenager references Idiocracy as a horrifying inevitability of American culture to sound intellectual" episode
>>69175023
You still can't find a way to allocate resources in a socialist society. There's a reason the Soviets were using 60 year old Sear's catalogs
>>69190751
Looks like you're the first one to mention that movie, actually. It has nothing to do with the technological collapse I was talking about.
>>69189919
>Early Grey
>>69175023
Don't you need infinite resources for capitalism and socialism to work?
>>69178208
Skill and culture. In ST people complain about replicated food all the time. It's still some digital shit. Restaurants and other direct experiences are part of an Experience Economy that even 300 years from now replicators can't fully copy.
> and dat hot Orion waitress wit three boobs from all the radiation.
> man the torpedo
>>69190751
We're already living in it, just that our nigger is a giant pussy but still retarded and needs a teleprompter to deliver a speech.
>>69178913
Yeah, no. Only 20 billion humans spread through the Solar System with reasonable upcoming tech? We'd all be kings, queens and young gods.
>>69191408
And they're still free.
>>69178296
>>69178394
I would be okay with a fascist state that provided FOUR SCOOPS A DAY
>>69175023
So we wuz space travelers and shiet?
>>69191131
Oh I wasn't referring to you, just a general thing that annoys me
![qn16907a[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/wJlnN62.jpg "qn16907a[1].jpg")
>>69192064
Indeed. Pic related: real socialist space craft(N1)
>>69191726
Eh? There is always some kind of economy in human/sentient interactions.
> TANSTAAFL
> Gas Grass or Ass you pay
> expecting everyone to have skills
>>69180158
Honestly, I would sell both my nuts and everything I own to have a Pursuit Special
>>69175023
Ask them to explain the Klingon empire
>>69192248
Wanna me make fun of your look-we-made-reusable-spacecraft-which-is-ALMOST-cost-effective?
