Why ISN'T /pol/ atheist?
This board is redpilled and spot on on many subjects, yet there are many people here who believe in God. It's so bizarre.
>>68670914
>I AM THE SMARTEST PERSON ON EARTH I KNOW EVERY THING I AM GOD I AM GOD MEEEEEEEEEE
Can we stop having those threads? Get out
>>68670914
>Le /pol/ is one le person
>>68670914
>athiest
>denying existence of a hod
>not being agnostic
it's like you're one of those fags who says, "lol dont u KNOW god dun exist!!!"
FAG
>>68670914
/pol/ is not a monolith.
/pol/ is largely supportive of atheism or apostolic christianity.
OP perhaps the restraints of religion are restrained
remove kebab
>>68670914
A few vocal shotposters does not a majority make, stop being stupid.
>>68670914
/pol/ is filled to the brim with sub 90 iq monkeys who follow religion based on its stance against other religions like Islam, or they simply do so because 'it's the white thing to do'
Basically, this board is full of knuckle dragging apes who can't see beyond memes and racial trends
>>68671397
This
Only logical stance is agnostic or theist
>>68670914
If liberals are atheist we must at least pretend to be christians.
>>68670914
I'm religious because God exists. Do you think I wouldnt rather be fucking 90 whores while doing coke? I can't deny what is true though.
Why is there something rather than nothing? All things that are themselves not the reason they exist have a cause. Matter don't create itself. If you follow the chain back to the beginning you discover that something perfect, infinite, immutable, etc, created all. This is what we call God. God is outside of time, "I AM" forever.
>>68670914
/pol is primarily agnostic/atheist. Every strawpoll says so.
Also, Religare just means to bind and hold.
The other descriptions are just some neckbeards who thinks he was clever by attempting to make everyone dumber through the spread of false information. Kind of ironic really/
>>68671809
How do you know God's existence is impossible to know one way or another? What necessitates that kind of view?
>>68671728
t. le enlightened brown man
>>68670914
>Live good life under common sense rules (no rape)
>Die a good respectable man
>No God, still lived good life
>Is a God, eternal soul saved and live awesome after-life too
>Be atheist that denies the existence of something they cannot prove does not exist because they want to be cool
>Live life without regard to consequences because "Hur dur no hell so I can do whatever"
>Is no God, still livd life like an unsuferable douche
>Is a God, get sent to hell for no good reason
Yeah I think my choice is obvious. Religious extremism (Muslims as an example) is universally bad. But living under this *crazy* notion that we should not rape or steal from other people is something you should be doing no matter if there is a God or not and there is no logical reason to denounce the potential existence of a higher power.
>>68671728
Thank you, Mexican Intellectual.
>>68671397
Agnostics are fags. They are atheist who want to avoid discussions about religion.
If you're not a theist, you're an atheist. Simple as that.
>>68672288
Thanks for proving my point ape
/pol/ here
I AM atheist, dummy
Atheism is awful. When you accept there is no god, you must also accept that there is no afterlife and death is final, as well as the fact that you, as a person, are insignificant to the world and the world is insignificant to the universe. There is no impetus to be a moral being other than societal norms of decency and there is no meaning to life. There is no impetus for ambition either because death will inevitably end anything that you will ever create.
It's miserable.
>>68672356
> Be christian
> Do almost whaterver the fuck I want cuz if I confess before God it will be ok. No suicide, though.
Christian morality at it's finest.
That image isn't even correct though, look up the etymology of religion. Even if it were correct, it is utter claptrap you would find on some teenage atheist's facebook, doesn't refute anything.
>>68670914
It is. I start Christian threads all the time to troll the dumb-shits.
>>68670914
i dont have a problem with atheist but fedora fags actually believe if religion didn't exist everyone would be a rocket scientist. Atheist broke the christian backbone which taught to rise above instinct "the 7 deadly sins" and have a family structure because rebelling against mom and dad is easier and safer then telling strange hostile muslims their religion is dogshit. Dumb people will always find something to believe in and fedorafags constantly deny this. The only problem i have with legit atheist is the justification of morality without a god.
>>68670914
/pol/ is atheist according to polls.
>>68672797
That's not how it works. That's not how any of it works
>>68670914
Give me a reason I shouldn't believe in God that doesn't get reduced by skepticism to being a non-objection.
>>68670914
fucking faggot posting retarded shit. thats fake as fuck ... you give atheism a bad name.
>>68671815
But then who created God?
>>68673014
Read this >>68672797
The 10 commandments are dog shit if every single one of them can be forgiven just by confessing.
Atheism is marxist degeneracy.
>>68673544
He has His reason for being within Himself. God has to be infinite, no beginning and no end.
>>68673544
what created the big bang
>>68672356
>Be atheist that denies the existence of something *Christians cannot prove exists because they want to be cool
Fixed that for you.
>>68670914
>implying that picture wholesomely supports atheism and not pure spiritualism, or both equally.
>>68671809
>>68671397
Do people actually not know this or do they want people to explain that atheism just means not BELIEVING in God, so you don't have to 100% rule out its existance, for the millionth time?
>not being at least some form of indo-european pagan
shaking my head familia
>>68670914
>Needing everyone to share your worldview
You sound even more dogmatic than we are
>>68673544
Considering our current understanding of the universe in general is:
"Well it was created out of nothing because muh probability impact explosion"
or
"it simply really, our universe came from the explosion of another universe that has always existed"
I don't think you atheist "science" type really have any ground to stand on when it comes to the origins of everything. Think about it. The literal explanation of the origins of the universe are the exact same explanations for a God.
>>68674147
Modern atheism means not believing in God's existence.
>>68673544
>who caused the uncaused
The poster said "All things that are themselves not the reason they exist have a cause". God has that, which is why we call God that. God isn't some anthropomorphic being inside or outside the cosmos.
>>68670914
Look at what's happened to every European country that's gone secular.
No thanks.
>>68672779
The meaning of life is to be yourself and to do whatever excites you the most.
You don't have to believe in ancient superstitions to find meaning in your life. So shut the fuck up.
>>68673744
That is not an answer to the question. Who created god? did god create god? did another god create god? did god evolve from millions of years of other chimp gods? you have no answer.
>>68673213
https://www.logicallyfallacious.com/tools/lp/Bo/LogicalFallacies/178/Unfalsifiability
>>68674356
And if I have a habit of murdering Bulgarians? Shall I just be myself and still live meaningfully
I used to respect Christians. I thought they were fine.
With what's happening now in the world I can't support Christians. Christians are scum. Pure scum.
>pope is seen as an authority figure for Christianity (even though he's Catholic, Christians don't care)
>insults Trump because he's brainwashed
>kisses immigrant feet
Kill yourselves, Christians.
I'd rather be a fedora trenchcoat wearer than accept Christians. We need a separate country for white right wing atheists.
>>68673975
>God does not exist because we cant see him. End of story I do not need proof
>God exists because look at this case where this woman that medically should never have been able to survive this goes against all science, recovers MIRACULOUSLY
Not saying it is ideal. But at least we have indirect proof. Atheists have nothing to go on.
In fact science itself very often shows that just because we cannot see or understand something that does not mean it does not exist! Just go read up on the flatlanders and understand why a higher being could very well be sitting next to you right now and you would never be able to comprehend his existence!
When science shows that for every answer we get, 10 more questions pop up, only an ignorant man would deny something because he himself has not directly observed it yet.
>>68674480
I told you, God is infinite. God is outside of time. God is the non-contingent ground of contingency. God is not something within the universe.
I don't know how to explain it in a way tgat you will understand.
>>68670914
Weebshit faggot.... stop embarrassing our shithole even further with your gypsy nigger bullshit.
>>68670914
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion#Etymology
>>68674629
You know what's also unfalsifiable? The claim that there is no God.
>>68674629
>Making unfalsifiable claims is a way to leave the realm of rational discourse, since unfalsifiable claims are often faith-based
So this proposition is outside the realm of logic, why are you trying to prove it wrong by logic? You're just saying "my framework by which I judge things doesn't apply to this specific question therefore it must be wrong".
If God is outside or beyond logic as we understand it it would make sense that we can't logically discuss the nature of his existence.
>>68675037
>trippfag opinioin
Trashman.jpg
>>68675037
Can you falsify that pope kisses Muslim feet?
>>68674757
These muslims seriously thinking about converting
Seriously thinking....
One one hand, 72 virgins.
On the other, an old man washes and tongues my dirty feet in this life.
Hmmmmm....
>>68674712
Nice straw man.
>>68670914
>atheism
Not even once.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VggFao85vTs
>>68675145
Him and >>68674322 this guy are the only tripfags worth listening to, trust me
>>68675151
Nope. You have to overcome Cartesian doubt in order to make a posteriori truth claims. Anything that isn't an a priori tautology is unfalsifiable unless you can do that.
>>68674799
>When science shows that for every answer we get, 10 more questions pop up
Yes, this has been repeatedly verified the world over. Every time we measure the CO2 in the atmosphere another 10 questions are created.
Every time Excel computes a statistical mean, exactly 10 queries come into existence in the /Temp folder.
Very strange, very interesting development.
>>68673598
Just the tone of that reeks of fedora faggotry, ugh.
Its the same shit that marriage which is suppose to be a union "blessed" by god that you're both suppose to be loyal to each other and focus your efforts on your family but marriage isn't even that anymore.
You have this conception that all you have to do is say your sorry and you're in heaven. You still get judged and although i don't know if its catholic of christian or both you go to purgatory and you still get burned alive for your sins but you wont stay there forever. And you swear as if a man can lie to god. I know "god doesn't exist" im just fucking saying confession isn't suppose to be taken lightly and your sins wont be forgiven unless you're utterly sorry and comprehend the consequences of it. Also if you've taken the step to talk to another man in a booth and told him all the horrid shit you done, which is stressful as fuck, its a step to showing you do want to improve yourself and stop supposedly since you don't even have to talk to anyone about it like a self help book where you write your goals and work on the smaller ones first. And im sure you know about the part about Jesus dying for our sins and shit.
>>68675192
It's called an example. I'm applying your general claim, not twisting it into something it does not imply
>>68670914
>there are three big religion in the world right now
>in total a couple of thousand religions existed thought out history
>"mine is the right one" that's what everyone believed
So let's say there is a intelligent subprime being what makes you believe that you're worshiping the right one?
Aside the flat earth
>>68674799
>God exists because look at this case where this woman that medically should never have been able to survive this goes against all science, recovers MIRACULOUSLY
And this MUST automatically mean that God did it? And you seriously believe that there couldn't possibly be any other explanation?
Well I say that a wizard's magical powers healed her, not God.
Idiot.
>>68670914
Agnosticism is the only reasonable position. Or assuming God is a metaphysical concept rather than a physical entity.
>>68675521
Nope, it was a straw man.
>>68675644
>"mine is the right one" that's what everyone believed
(Some) Roman pagans believed every people have their own gods that watch over them, so in that sense they are all correct. This whole "my religion is the right one" thing only began with Christianity and Abrahamic religions in general with universalist message (which is also the root of much of Marxist ideology, ironically)
>>68671272
Always do the opposite of what the jews say.
>>68672356
>all atheists are degenerate amoral edgelords.
you're in /pol/, you should know better.
p.s. Pascal's wager is shit and you should be ashamed of even considering that it's a good argument.
>>68675897
There may be yet things that are above reason
But that would require one to take a leap of faith: That only a God can justify reason
Since reason does not, and demonstrably cannot justify itself
>>68675897
I don't see why God couldn't manifest Himself in any way He pleased if God. A quality of God in almost every Biblical conception is omnipotence.
>>68676016
Nope, it was what I said it was :)
>>68676260
>There may be yet things that are above reason
Reason is merely a way to know if something exists. That's the point: even if God does exist, we have no way to know, and it's ridiculous to pretend we know.
>>68676282
I'm waiting for that.
>>68676872
Are you also waiting to witness an atom? I assume you believe in them even though you've never observed one and I doubt ever will.
>>68670914
>/pol/ is one person
>coming here directly from reddit
>Justifying the fedora meme
>>68671397
>>68671809
What's even the fucking difference? You're not praying, you're not going to church, you're not acting based on superstitions... Saying that something doesn't exist is the starting position when you don't have any evidence for its existence, you can always change your mind later if the evidence is enough.
>>68676872
How do you know we have no way of knowing? By reason, by observation?
How have you determined it is an absolute?
>>68671728
Oh shit a Mexican intellectual!
>>68676357
Except it wasn't.
>>68677208
>Except it was
Exactly what I'm saying ;^)
>>68671809
>Magic sky daddy
>Logical
>>68677079
People [idiots] think Agnosticism is a middle-man/mutually-exclusive. You'll find that the idiots who continue to parrot this falsity are intellectual-cowards who are too fearful to own their Atheism and would rather cower behind the veil of Agnosticism.
>>68677408
>>68677208
>>Magic sky daddy
Now this is a strawman
>>68670914
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=religion
You're full of shit.
>>68677548
Too many atheist youtube videos mate. I can hear them speaking through you
>>68677548
It's hard not to see Atheism as a cult when you say shit like this.
>arguing about religion
Pointless. Now, if someone does something fucked up and tries to hide behind a religious excuse, thats the shit that's fucked. I'm an atheist and I don't care if people are religious, good for them for finding what works for them. I've been to poorer latin american countries like Peru and seen what hope religion gives to these people. Me? I'm comfortable the way I am and when I die I'll just rot away under the ground.
Atheists who force their views are retarded. Religion and spirituality is personal, you have no idea what other people have been through.
>>68674275
>I don't know how the big bang works
>I still think everything came from nothing
>I still think that there was absolutely nothing before the big bang for certain
>I can't into infinity
>>68671397
You don't even know what agnostic means. Being agnostic is a statement of knowledge, not belief. There are agnostic theists and agnostic atheists. People who think it's some kind of "on the fence" stance that lies between atheism and theism are stupid
I was a cradle atheist.
Then I felt what those who have been raised in a religious family do: the comfort of a bedtime story where there's a power always watching out for you.
For me, that's Trump. Believe it or not, the man has inspired me to make significant positive changes in my life and I work every day to be worthy of his endorsement. (See what Arsenio Hall said in season 12.)
That's probably about as close to God as I'll ever get.
>>68673014
This.
I don't care if you are an atheist as long as you don't sprout memes about muh evil church.
>>68677942
Changed your ID haven't you? >>68677548
I can smell you brats
>>68671728
>sub 90 iq monkeys
>says the mexican
>>68677025
Well, I've done stuff with electricity that only makes sense if I assume atoms exist. And I don't see any other way an atomic bomb could work.
>>68677080
Two options: either we have no way to know yet, which is my opinion, or we stick to the Unknowable God style, which implies we'll never be able to understand him because he's god.
>>68670914
>>68671272
what if religion AND atheism are wrong and atheism is based on dogmatic belief which holds back the progress of consciousness?
>>68670914
religion is the glue of nations. It holds the nations together.
>atheism
This kils the nation
>>68679708
>either we have no way to know yet, which is my opinion
How do you know we have no way to know yet? (ad infinitum)
>we stick to the Unknowable God style, which implies we'll never be able to understand him because he's god.
We'll never be able to fully understand Him, but we may do so within our human capabilities
The only way out of this is axioms. You're using them without being conscious of your metaphysics*
I'm using them in my religion as well
*And if you're wondering why you aren't avoiding metaphysics, google "the philosophy of science" and compare to what the actual scientific method is
You'll notice a stark difference
>>68673014
FAMILY GUY NOW ADMITS EUROPE IS THE ONLY CIVILIZATION CAPABLE OF PROGRESSING SCIENCE
>>68670914
Western world under Christianity
>Colonize all the world
>Absolute power
Western world under atheism
>KEK KEK KEK KEK
>>68670914
About 10 years ago most smart posters didn't follow a religion; they were atheists or at worst agnostic.
A good number of them were pricks about it though, which led to the neckbeard fedora atheist meme and turned a lot of people back to religious, because it became less popular.
I think the tide is turning back the other way now.
>>68677880
>you know how does big bang work
>anyone in this thread is has actual physics knowledge aside from the meme popsci
I suggest reading this paper if you are mathematically literate and have a grasp on university tier physics. http://arxiv.org/abs/1404.1207
>you know how a model is formed
>you know that quantum foam is taken axiomatically
>you have a big enough concentration span to actually learn physics behind the current cosmological models
I am a physics grad and I am a Catholic. I have went through that edgelord phase during my early teens, but through philosophy ( stoicism and metaphysics especially ) and further research into the scientific models, the nature of our universe, the principle on which science operates ( I highly suggest reading Popper ,in fact read any "high profile" analytic philosopher, they are the last beacon of that profession ) I have concluded that theism can be very useful, helpful and fulfilling and, here comes the heretic part, a real answer to our basic scientific and metaphysical questions and quarrels.
And lets end this fucking meme that the modified Lemaitre model\Big Bang Model postulates a universe that comes into existence from nothing. WE DEFINE THE PARAMETERS AND THE AREA IN WHICH THE FLUCTUATIONS HAPPEN. I am sick and tired of edgelords spouting their bullshit, this seriously needs to stop.
>>68680634
>I think the tide is turning back the other way now.
Because the pope washes shitskin feet? Give me a break
It'll take more than that to make the whole of Christianity worse than what militant atheism does to a nation
>>68673014
>dark ages
EVERY FUCKING TIME.
DARK AGES DID NOT EQUAL REPRESSION DUE TO THE CHURCH.
THE CHURCH WAS QUINTESSENTIAL IN PRESERVING KNOWLEDGE DURING THAT PERIOD.
Taking religion literally is preposterous. Le magical sky wizard etc.
I am jealous of religious communities though.
It must be nice being part of a tight-knit community with like minded people who have good morals.
>>68674345
Fucking this.
>>68670914
This is false.
Germanic Paganism doesn't hold you back from anything.
You can literally do whatever you want, it's mostly just advice. Only backside is if you want to go to heaven you have to die in battle.
Wait, people actually believe in god on pol? I thought they were just throwing around dank memes
>>68670914
Same reason there are so many neo-nazis here, to rid /pol/ of any bit of credibility it may have
>>68670914
>holds back the progress of conscienceness
This is exactly what led to feminism
>>68670914
Because some people like to feel that there is a reason to life besides having children to continue the human species.
I'm not saying that theism is correct but I AM saying that as long as they aren't following a violent religion, why should we have a problem with them? Christian values are perfectly fine and preferable to many others.
>inb4 fedoralord comes in with quotes from the old testament
How many modern Christian societies are violent tribes?
It took so much for you to get here and then you turn around and slap evolution in the face by believing in something you can't even prove and isn't even needed.
>>68670914
Deism is a perfectly valid metaphysical belief. Biblical literalists should just kill themselves, though.
>>68682434
You'll never win with atheist mate. You're either pussies for following the New Testament, or barbarians because of the Old
It should be obvious by now that fedoras are fundamentally anti-Christian, regardless of what evidence you may or may not procure
>>68672356
But are people so stupid that they have to have religion giving them reason to not do bad things? What ever happened to just being a decent person? I was raised in the church and it gives you a good set of morals to live by but honestly it's nothing decent parents wouldn't tell you. Don't be an alcoholic, help others when you can, treat others the way you want to be treated, etc. These are all basic things that any human being should be able to comprehend on their own, anyone who needs religion to back this up is a cancer to society.
I don't think most modern organized religion is evil (although you could argue it was just a money grab hundreds of years ago) and I appreciate the good it promotes in certain communities, but I think it should all be taken metaphorically, not literally. It's not for everybody and atheists/agnostics and christians alike should respect each others views/lack of views and not try to shove their opinion down someones throat.
>>68672779
Eh, it isn't that bad. Being able to spite social norms and do degenerate things without beating yourself up over them is a plus.
>>68683328
here's a tip; you can't make money off people being 'decent'.
>>68677630
Straw man is misinterpreting an argument to make it easier to attack
God created Earth with Magic
God is our dad
Lives in heaven
Magic sky daddy
>>68679708
How electricity or bombs work can be explained in a literal infinite number of ways. You may not like those explanations, but they're explanations nonetheless.
>>68683371
>it isn't that bad
>Being able to spite social norms and do degenerate things without beating yourself up over them is a plus.
So basically bad is what you don't like, and good is the inverse
Cool then. Hopefully no one will disagree with you and do something about it
>>68673744
If it's possible for something to exist infinitely then why does the Universe need a creator?
>>68670914
I think most of the religious people here are of luke-warm faith and don't really like having to deal with a bunch of the nihilist bullshit that happens in the early atheist phase. Don't let the crusader larpers trick you into thinking they're the norm.
>>68680421
>How do you know we have no way to know yet?
Because we'd have found something already.
Scientists are constantly looking for the cause of everything. Every time something really weird pops up, we buzz over it for a while until it's fully understood; if we reach something that is simply unexplainable without the idea of God, we can start seriously pondering his existence.
>>68683708
And the existence of atoms is the best one: it's the one with the best chance to accurately predict events. For instance, you can think of electricity as a current and it'll give you results if you're fixing a house's electrical system, but when you need more precision, your equations won't give you a good result.
Ability to predict events is what differentiates theory and bullshit.
>>68670914
/pol/ has a very high rate of atheism
>>68684014
What makes it the best? What qualities make it "best"? It could just as easily be anything else, in which case that explanation would simply be *wrong*. You can't make predictions about the future due to the problem of induction - at least not ones that are consistent with the constraints of logic, so it can't be "best" by that measure.
>>68672779
>There is no impetus to be a moral being other than societal norms of decency and there is no meaning to life.
You choose your life's meaning; of course atheism allows you to be evil, but religion does as well, to some degree.
>There is no impetus for ambition either because death will inevitably end anything that you will ever create.
I've got 70~ years here and I want to have fun during them; besides, I'd like my sons to have a fun life as well, and that implies having morals and avoiding destruction.
>>68674801
So this god is more infinite then man but he makes man have less of an ability to see the infinite god. How am i a twat for asking who created god? you are the one claiming something exists outside the universe which is more powerful then any being that exists.
>>68683632
You've just changed the labels so that it sounds more funny
Thankfully, that doesn't to anything to it
https://www.logicallyfallacious.com/tools/lp/Bo/LogicalFallacies/42/Appeal_to_Ridicule
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G%C3%B6del's_incompleteness_theorems
>>68684281
>What makes it the best?
... I explain it right after I say it's the best.
And yes, you can predict. Simply deal with probability: count the amount of times your theory has predicted shit right against the times it's been wrong. That gives you a percentage. Higher percentage is a better theory.
Of course this implies you know your theory isn't a universal truth, it's just the one with less mistakes, that's the point of science. Best isn't Perfect.
>>68683847
Sort of, but no. It's that morality is relative. Christians may say something is bad, but they can't really prove that it is, so I'm going to make my own decisions. At least society can use logic and science to explain why certain things ought to be bad, but those explanations still rely on me sharing the same values as society, which I largely don't.
>>68684014
>Because we'd have found something already.
Not necessarily
>Scientists are constantly looking for the cause of everything. Every time something really weird pops up, we buzz over it for a while until it's fully understood
>fully understood
How can you ever fully understand something? Isn't it just putting arbitrary standards of evidence on it?
>if we reach something that is simply unexplainable without the idea of God, we can start seriously pondering his existence.
Have "we" not reached many unexplainable things? Do scientists already know everything there is to know?
>>68684332
You are not a twat but you might wanna dust out your math and read this >>68684499
The way that other fella puts it doesn't help either.
>>68684814
Like I said, I just hope one day someone with a different opinion than you doesn't just do what he wants to you
You won't be able to convince him through reason to do otherwise, that's for sure
>>68670914
>yet there are many people here who believe in God
Most of it is reactionary shitposting due to many libtards (the vocal ones) being atheist or supportive of mudslime immigration. The Templar shit is basically like hype for a war against it. It's a symbol/mascot to fight against Islamic invasion because of its past history (study the real crusades). Hence: "Deus Vult" shitposters.
I don't "fit in" with any of the current atheist groups because I'm a pro gun nationalist and I don't like any religion. Including the one responsible for Brussels and Paris. I'm for closed borders with minimal legal immigration.
>>68684878
>How can you ever fully understand something?
Refer to the stuff about predictability. God (or a God particle) would be completely unexplainable in that we wouldn't hit more than 50% predictability on its behavior (and that would be just by guessing).
>Many unexplainables
Of course not. We just keep studying them until we reach something.
But I digress. Is your point that since nothing is 100% understandable, then God exists? In that case I'm just saying that God is especially hard to track (or has been so far) so there's no point in thinking about him or deciding he does/doesn't exist until we get further ahead in the search for him. This is not incompatible with your objections.
>>68684759
You can't predict. This is because in order to make a prediction about the future, you have to justify it as follows - I predict x will happen in the future, because in the past x has tended to happen in the past. That's not valid reasoning.
It looks like this -
Data: In the past, regularities that have held in my experience have been found to hold in nature generally, or at least in the next instance.
Theory (=Uniformity of Nature): Therefore in general, if a regularity holds in my experience, it holds in nature generally, or at least in the next instance.
That's totally bunk reasoning - it doesn't work.
>>68670914
Religare means Rely
>>68685612
>it doesn't work
How do you operate a machine then? Am I to assume I cannot know whether I'll die if I touch a dead line when fixing a lughtbulb, even though I know every time I've done so, I've been fine?
Why do you eat if you don't know whether or not it'll calm your hunger? If expecting results based on your past experience were really as crazy as you make it sound, nobody would save up, buy long term, study, etc.
The fact that this very computer exists is enough to reject your logical juggling.
>>68686068
>Am I to assume I cannot know whether I'll die if I touch a dead line when fixing a lughtbulb
Yes; logic necessitates that. You may not *like* that, but unless you subscribe to some kind of belief that *NECESSITATES* uniformity in nature that's simply what you have to accept - you can't know.
I have a belief that *does* necessitate the uniformity of nature - namely God. But if you don't have God, you don't. You cannot justify predictive reasoning on only materialist/physicalist/empiricist axioms.
>>68685286
And for the record, most christfags are ok. Their religion and doctrine is insufferable bullshit, and I hate what it's done in terms of education, but you know what? The majority of them still want to MAGA and they won't cut your fucking head off for leaving the religion. They're not blowing places up, throwing acid in women's faces, and shooting people every other month. The most they'll do is annoy you about fuckin' Jesus for a while.
To compare them to the mudslimes is disgraceful. What in the fuck do they do nowadays? Complain about red Starbucks cups and deny some gays a fucking cake? Is that really on par with what happened in Brussels? Or what's happening in Sweden? Where women are afraid to leave their goddamn homes because of FICKI FICKI?
>>68685460
>Refer to the stuff about predictability. God (or a God particle) would be completely unexplainable in that we wouldn't hit more than 50% predictability on its behavior (and that would be just by guessing).
Hate to quote myself but >>Isn't it just putting arbitrary standards of evidence on it?
>Of course not. We just keep studying them until we reach something.
Really? What about all of these
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lists_of_unsolved_problems
>Is your point that since nothing is 100% understandable, then God exists?
Not "then" God exists. My point is that as it is demonstrable that neither logic nor science are absolute determinants of truths and falsities [by their own standards of use], we must make some axiomatic groundings to our philosophies and wordviews so that it is both in line with a moral human nature and with an epistemologically gnostic approach
>I am so smart, look at this Latin word on my picture
But that's wrong, you fucking retard.
Religare means "to tie sth. back; to bind sth.; to connect; to wrap something up."
Religion is furthermore derived from the word religio which means "consideration, [religious] worship, conscience, diligence."
I fucking hate pseudo-intellectuals abusing Latin.
>>68677811
I don't know about pointless........ these beliefs are all fucking primitive. Its also the fact that if you support a religion you support all its flaws
>Religion and spirituality is personal, you have no idea what other people have been through
This whole sentence triggers me like crazy. They're just stupid assholes bruh there's no reason to rose tint it
>>68686446
I think I just found my first respectable atheist on /pol/
God bless you anon, I wish more unbelievers were like you
>>68686446
You're like the opposite of this guy >>68686700
>>68673210
to you maybe
for most modern Christians this is exactly how it works and this is especially how it works for any "Christian" politician
>>68686384
Being unable to reach 100% predictability does not mean I can't trust a theory enough to put my life on it. Of course I don't know; maybe lightning will hit in that moment and I'll die. But a universe without complete order isn't necessarily in complete disorder. You live with some degree of certainty that eating will calm your hunger because it's always been so; you'd have to be insane to just sit down and stop eating because you don't know.
In the end, all of this is pointless because we simply don't have evidence that God exists (or doesn't), no matter how much we talk here. Believing in something that you can't see is more unreasonable that expecting the same results from the same actions, even if neither are 100% correct.
>>68686611
I don't see the point of your wiki, it's simply a list of problems people are still working on. As for the rest of your argument, we don't NEED to do shit. I can choose a moral scale, I can follow what society says is good (and this is basically enough for most people), or I can disregard those and suffer the consequences. Whether I believe in God or not doesn't matter; what matters is if he exists or not.
God is the final red pill.
>>68686994
Don't take that as me respecting the religion. I don't. I'm just not a commie loving libtard who shits on christianity but then looks the other way when mudslimes rape and kill en masse. I will never side with the liberal scum.
Another thing is that me and a Christian can debate the beliefs. We can exchange ideas and talk about it. Criticize them.
You don't have that choice in Islam unless its in a civilized country with laws and where they are a minority.
So yes, while I find many religious people to be insufferable and the doctrine itself to be shit, I'd rather live with christians than the filthy inhuman mudslimes.
>>68687329
>I don't see the point of your wiki,
Like I've said here >>68684878
>>Have "we" not reached many unexplainable things?
And I'm proving to you that there are such things. I don't know what "you" are working on anon, but so far you have not gotten anywhere near having all the answers
>>68687643
That's enough for me to respect you mate
Don't worry about it
>>68680634
This is why free speech is so important.
The best opinions are the ones that you don't agree with.
In a way militant atheists were acting as the meme version of missionaries.
Daily reminder that during a lucid dream you can conciously shape the world to your will. You can summon objects and beings, because the world you are in is your own mind. Is this god? Well yes... yes it is. Except its not the kind of god you worship, instead its actually being him.
>>68687329
No, you're not getting the weight of the problem. You can't predict anything from t1 to t2 *because you can't justify the reasoning* behind doing so. It is logically invalid - it doesn't work. It's the same as the following invalid reasoning in being invalid
p1: cats are cats
p2: dogs are dogs
---
c: cats are dogs
The conclusion does not follow from your premises.
>You live with some degree of certainty that eating will calm your hunger because it's always been so
It's always been so? Really? How do you establish that?
>we simply don't have evidence that God exists (or doesn't)
We similarly don't have necessary evidence of *anything else* beyond that there are something we'd call thoughts. Whatever your criteria of evidence is, I very highly doubt it is capable of standing up to skeptical scrutiny.
>>68687329
>I can follow what society says is good (and this is basically enough for most people), or I can disregard those and suffer the consequences
Wouldn't you rather progress far beyond that which a child does to morally reason?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lawrence_Kohlberg's_stages_of_moral_development#Pre-conventional
>>68683854
Because the universe is finite. Matter doesn't create itself. The universe has a beginning but matter is required.
>>68687779
Thanks.
MAGA.
>>68670914
athiesm is LITERALLY a jewish trick
Because atheists are the homosexual genderfluid cucks that /pol/ is a reaction to. The atheists who are redpilled are completely irrational
>>68683854
You've got to stop looking at God as a superhuman, this is a huge atheist misunderstanding.
>>68670914
Atheism is for retarded losers who don't even breed enough to continue their ideology.
>>68670914
I just don't care about religion because I feel like it wastes my time. Instead of going to church or praying I can just stay home and chill or do whatever.
The only red pilled religion is Odalism, prove me wrong,
>>68685217
Hopefully most people are afraid enough of legal punishment not to fuck other people over. You're right that there's no reasoning with someone like Ted Bundy, though. The world's a fucked up place.
>>68687915
so are you saying we are Gods imagination
>>68688162
matter has a finite history, if you go back to before 10^-32 seconds after the big bang, there is no matter (or the idea of matter doesn't make sense)
>>68687329
>Whether I believe in God or not doesn't matter; what matters is if he exists or not.
You'll have to take that on faith. See below for why it is necessary
>As for the rest of your argument, we don't NEED to do shit
We do, if we to want keep our sanity. You do it nonetheless, albeit unconsciously
You have different gods (scientism, positivism et cetera) you take axiomatically. You are just not aware of it
>>68684346
Atheists tend to have a low level understanding of the concept of God.
This is what happens when you are pumped full of shit-posts.
>>68688538
Doesn't that just reaffirm what I said about God being necessary to create matter?
>>68687662
They're not unexplainable. They're unexplainable *so far*. A shark's left ovary not working doesn't mean God exists, it means we've looked at it in 100 ways and found no way to explain it, but there are still many ways more. Maybe we need another kind of information receiver, like radio or polarized light, maybe it's related to a hormone we haven't found yet (almost every year a new hormone is found), who knows. This is what I mean by "we may not have the tools to know if God exists". If he does, we don't have the knowledge to find him.
>>68688050
I do get your problem, and I'm saying it's pointless because it takes you to logic and doesn't take reality into account.
>Really? How do you establish that?
As far as I've been alive, it's been so. Everybody says so, and they don't gain anything from lying. Extensive research says food gives you energy. Sure, this isn't 100% trustable, but it's enough to let me believe it.
>>68688074
I said you can, not you should
>>68688551
"We do it" doesn't mean "we need to". Prove we need to. See, now you're in the same position I'm in, and yet God still hasn't appeared around here.
>>68687272
If my neighbour dances around his back garden in a grass skirt before chopping off the head of a chicken and trying to read the future in its entrails I would say he was either a moron, or unstable.
And its not a straw man, chrisfags think that eating cookies and sprinkling water on their heads will ward off bad spirits. They're obviously geniuses
>>68688199
As a bisexual genderqueer atheist I resent this post. Check your cis privilege, shitlord.
>>68688523
I wish there were more uniting us than our bloody legal system
>>68670914
Because I'm Lutheran
>>68672797
i hope there is a secret special circle in hell for fags like you who sin just because 'all will be forgiven'
>>68688644
The concept of God is just word salad made up by Christfags to obfuscate metaphysical debates for anyone who doesn't subscribe to their bullshit
>>68688747
>reality doesn't conform to logic
You know, that may be the case, but I'd like you to think of a single case in which it doesn't. When is the last time you observed, or even conceived, a square circle?
>As far as I've been alive, it's been so
>Everybody says so
These "reasons" can be used to support *any* claim. Which is why they're not valid reasons.
>>68688747
i think the guy you were responding to brought up to problems with induction, which is what science is based on. According to Hume, induction will never lead to 100% certainty that something is true.
Also, we must also realize that science itself requires a leap of faith. Science is under the assumption the universe is intelligible, which is rather odd considering it started from an explosion, accidental or not. This is why religion and science aren't incompatible.
>>68688988
what if that's how it works, you see chads getting all the girls, with good jobs and being assholes
im here trying to be good and i ended up like a submissive cuck
crusade when?
>>68688747
>I said you can, not you should
I think we should. And I'm willing to work my life towards that end
Consensually of course
>>68688747
>"We do it" doesn't mean "we need to". Prove we need to.
Try not having faith in absolutely nothing. Literally, try it right now and see how long it can last
>See, now you're in the same position I'm in, and yet God still hasn't appeared around here.
There wouldn't be a point in faith if God would just show up here (John 20:29). In a way, He already is here, even if not empirically
He is here through our reason and our ability to have a decent conversation in the most unlikely of places
>>68689215
It's stronger than saying you can't be certain. It's that you can't even make predictions, since your justification for doing so is bullocks.
>>68688811
National identity, maybe? I hate America, but only because the goddamn Christfags try and exert cultural hegemony over everything. If America was a nationalist but secular democracy with a focus on education and scientific progress instead of Bibles, guns and waving our dicks around in the Mid East then I wouldn't have a problem with it.
>>68670914
Religion holds back progress, yes. But it also unifies and controls the masses, which is much more important, as we can see from current events.
>>68670914
Perhaps your ideas on 'God' are just very small. Lots of people have daddy-issues that they throw upon 'God'.
Queer.
>>68689251
this isnt /r9k/ i dont care about you being a loser
also i said i hope
>>68688529
Im not ruling it out... but what Im actually saying is that lucid dreaming is god power. Perfect that and you will have achieved far more than humanly possible. ie magic powers.
>>68689124
>I'd like you to think of a single case in which it doesn't
Your whole point so far has been that even if I did this, no theory would be right. I've been trying to avoid that whole "nothing makes sense" shit, because it's the easiest way to reach a nonconclusion (nothing, including God, exists nor does it not exist) and just stop thinking altogether.
>>68689363
I was just playing with the unknowable of that other guy. If we go by his train of thought, it's impossible to prove that I can't "not have faith".
>He is here through our reason...
There we go. God as an idea, rather than an entity. Common way to look at it that neatly avoids the problem of existence, and one I can see working even if I don't agree.
>>68688747
>They're not unexplainable.
How do you know? There must be limits to human things. Should science be treated as limitless as God?
The strength of your faith in the absoluteness of science is admirable, but I fear it's been largely misplaced
>>68674480
Whatever floats yer boat, though you risk conflict with Bulgarians and their supporters. Ask yourself if your hobby is worth the risk.
>>68689826
>Your whole point so far has been that even if I did this, no theory would be right
Well you'd find a reason to ignore logic more than you already do in insisting you can make predictions about future timestates despite logic telling you outright that you can't prima facie.
The point I'm trying to drive home is that if you have a love for empiricism and physicalism and base your reasonings on them then you're in direct opposition to logic, which is a problem since you rely on logic to reach *all your other conclusions* about the world.
>>68670914
I don't believe in God, but I do attend church and go through with the whole religious theater because it is a cultural and ethnic binding tool. Without it, your society comes apart.
>>68679983
Religion is like rubber cement. We need epoxy
>>68689826
>I was just playing with the unknowable of that other guy. If we go by his train of thought, it's impossible to prove that I can't "not have faith"
Try focusing on each discussion individually. Please do a literal thought experiment
See if you can stop yourself from having faith in anything, and let me know how it goes
>There we go. God as an idea, rather than an entity.
Why are an "idea" and "entity" mutually exclusive. He may as well be manifesting Himself through more abstract means than mere physical manifestation
> Common way to look at it that neatly avoids the problem of existence, and one I can see working even if I don't agree.
Existence is not necessarily empirical. And I urge you to empirically prove to me that it does
>>68689911
>There must be limits
How do you know? Because everything has a limit? How do you know that?
>>68690204
Let's go with the "nothing can be proven" theory, and with the "we need to believe in something". I can't prove anything, I can't hope for anything. However, of food I know that whenever I eat I feel full. Of animals, I know I can eat them, they bleed, they try to damage my body. Of God, I know people say he's around, but I can't see him, eat him, fuck him, nothing. What now? Do I believe in something that may not even exist, just because I need to believe in something?
Yes, I "believe" in science, simply because it's done more things than God, as far as I can tell. Of all the things I can put trust in (even if they're lies), God is the most untrustable.
>>68690509
*Empirically prove to me that it is [necessarily empirical]
>>68688180
How is it a jewish myth?
>>68687498
God is a suppository
>>68690601
In the same way you believe there are no limits
>>68690509
Simple. No matter how much I think of something, it won't affect reality at all. Thinking about the nature of bread won't make a piece of bread appear in front of me.
>>68690736
I didn't say I believe that.
>>68672570
VIVA CRISTO REY
>>68690601
Do you believe that knowledge can only be derived from empiricism?
>>68690848
>I didn't say I believe that.
You seem to be awfully sure in scientists' ability to discern all fact. It's only a matter of time until they do, correct?
Everything can be explained through science. There are no truly unanswerable questions. Only yet unanswerable
>>68670914
kek
>>68690683
he go up in yo ass
>>68690360
It's just as capable of driving people apart as it is bringing them together
>>68690601
I don't believe "nothing can be proven"; I don't think anything can be proven *given your axioms*.
In response to your thoughts, it's entirely plausible that everything you think you experience is happenstance, such that when you think you eat, there's a person who manipulates your memories to feel "full" upon doing so. A different person does this every time, just because they feel like it. You're trying to draw a necessary connection between what you believe you do and what you believe you feel when there's not necessarily one at all. It's the secret power of bread.
You already believe in things that may not even exist - atoms, apples, or your own damn arm. None of it need exist at all. You could be a brain in a vat, in which case everything you believe is necessarily wrong about the external world.
>>68689011
You sound like this Bernie loving 14 year old I know.
>>68690848
>Simple. No matter how much I think of something, it won't affect reality at all. Thinking about the nature of bread won't make a piece of bread appear in front of me.
What is this reality and how can we know it?
Is the nature of bread purely empirical? How did you tell?
>>68690928
I believe knowledge needs empiricism and logic to reach consensus. Purely using logic means jackshit if I don't find a reality that reflects my conclusions. Einstein's theories were garbage until we found that they held true more often than Newton's.
>>68691123
If God exists AND we'll at some point be able to see that, then we haven't and will. If we'll never be able to see his existence/nonexistence, what's the point in pretending we do?
>>68691522
You're trying to take me to the realm of impossibility of thought, where God's existence doesn't matter either.
>>68691425
necessarily wrong in a closed system* anyway.
But that's from a linguistic tokenism standpoint, which I don't think is particularly powerful reasoning itself.
>>68690848
>No matter how much I think of something, it won't affect reality at all.
psychologys want to have a talk with you
>>68690360
Same, the term is "Cultural Christian". I was raised Christian and even though I don't really believe all the theology I respect the religion and think it's necessary for the preservation of Western values.
Atheism:
>Muh Islam refugees
>Muh dindu nuffins
>Muh Gender Studies
So no,atheism is the ultimate blue pill.
>>68691836
When you decide to do something, you transform your thoughts into reality. Sitting down and thinking won't do more than spending the energy you use to formulate those abstractions.
>>68670914
Atheism is as blue pilled as you can get reducing to radical skepticism. Atheists are also the niggers of religion. They chimp out at anything to do with God even mentioning his name.
>>68670914
Atheist here.
Your picture is retarded OP.
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?allowed_in_frame=0&search=religion
>>68691425
Alright, my beliefs are flawed. Tell me yours. (Not a challenge, honest question)
What makes you think eating is good for you?
>>68691763
>If we'll never be able to see his existence/nonexistence, what's the point in pretending we do?
We don't know if we'll ever be able to truly connect with His existence, whatever the essence of it is
On top of being a theist I'm an agnostic, as are you. Only that I am a weak, not a strong agnostic
Look around you.
The lunatic fringe that is SJWs. Faggotry and aids everywhere. Losers shooting up schools for attention. And the news gives it to them. They broadcasting death daily.
Does it look like these people have any self control to you?
>>68692227
Atheism/agnosticism is the ultimate redpill the knowledge that you are just a animal that has one life to live on this small rock in the universe. Religion teaches that there is an invisible heaven and hell where souls go to after they die. And that god after millions of years sent a prophet/savior to save the world.
>>68670914
And it isn't "to thwart forward progress" (seeing as religious people have done pretty much everything important ever), it's to be constrained, as in by mortality and weakness compared to an omnipotent being, you fucking thracean peasant.
>>68692352
But it's pointless to assume he exists. If I base my beliefs in feeble assumptions that may become false at some point, you base your beliefs on literally nothing. On "well, he must exist!".
Or the atheist's "there's just no way he exists!".
>>68672356
Using pascal's wager should be grounds for an automatic ban.
>>68691763
>You're trying to take me to the realm of impossibility of thought, where God's existence doesn't matter either.
It is precisely when we take the axiom of God, that thought, and reason especially, become possible
See "the Argument from Reason" and how it relates to our discussion
>>68692296
God ensures a consistency between my experience and reality by his Truthfulness, such that when I eat and it seems to strengthen my body I can make real causal inferences between my observations.
I don't have to justify my inferences on perceived past time states and engage in faulty reasoning, since God makes sure there's congruence flat out.
Why do Atheists have funerals? There is literally no point in having one if you don't believe there is an afterlife.
>>68670914
Because Atheism is correlated with Autism.
>>68670914
Athiests are the same as faggots
Have you ever hung out when they gather? It's like a pride club except with irreligious fucks and a lot more smug
Redpilled and atheist here.
Just getting over my crippling depression caused by realizing that we'll never leave this planet because of the laws of physics.
Now I can't wait to kill myself.
>>68671809
>believing bad evidence is logical
>both atheism and theism are equally probable
Both wrong. It's much more likely that a deity in the Human traditional sense doesn't exist than that one does, just from simple observation. For instance, do you really think a group of mostly hairless apes, who have been barely civilized for 3,000 years is somehow able to divine the nature of the entity that created the entirety of the universe? Do you realize how insane that is?
>>68692737
>>68692727
That simply means there's a universal truth. How do you know? Faith? What makes you think a universe can't have a universal truth that does not have a consciousness, a mathematical constant that "makes sure there's congruence flat out"?
Is God simply the bandaid you put on flawed assumptions to pretend the cracks aren't there?
>>68670914
It is. If you're a Christian, and you visit this filthy board, you're a heathen. If you actually say you're a Christian on this board you're either being painfully ironic or you're just naive.
>>68692737
That's silly you're just adding an unnecessary middle man to believing in your own senses, and you're dependent on those same senses in order to have the capability to believe in the middle man in the first place.
>>68692840
Oh and they're mostly degenerates who openly accept degeneracy (like pride)
Really as a gay irreligious man who has hung out with both crowds in the past they have little to no difference in terms of thought
Plus they actively undermine society since they all are yuge proponents of critical theory
>>68692572
>But it's pointless to assume he exists
It is precisely at that point that the very idea of meaning starts logically following as well
>If I base my beliefs in feeble assumptions that may become false at some point, you base your beliefs on literally nothing. On "well, he must exist!".
Aren't all claims like this? The only exception to it are logical tautologies
And you don't need faith in logical tautologies
>Or the atheist's "there's just no way he exists!".
That is his axiom, but he is not aware of it
>>68674275
>Boiling the entire body of current scientific knowledge on the origin of the universe to a single poorly thought out sentence
>>68672779
>What is philosophy
Just because you don't believe in implausible fairy tales, doesn't mean life suddenly becomes meaningless
>>68693065
The universe isn't math mate
Math just can be used to describe the universe
>>68693276
You just fill the void with another ideology that's all
The irreligious society breeds sjws
>>68693253
Fine. Then we don't know, can't know, and no question matters, including God.
>>68693315
It was an example, I've been saying I don't know what the universal truth is because I have no way to know.
>>68693065
It's an axiom. It's a starting point of reasoning. I start from God, you start from something else. I find God is a great starting point because I don't end up with inconsistencies in my reasonings like empiricists or physicalists.
>How do you know?
I don't. I just choose that as what I'm going off of; ultimately because I want to. You may not have thought it through, but I'm confident you do exactly the same in your own belief structure.
I don't think the universe can't have universal truth without a conscious Creator - I'm a metaphysical realist and a rationalist. I just maintain my bet on that it does.
What's a flawed assumption I have?
>>68679901
It's not and it doesn't
>>68671397
>implying agnosticism and atheism are mutually exclusive
>implying there aren't agnostic theists
>>68693176
You need God to not have doubt in your own senses. Logic demands doubt without necessary connections between sensory experience and reality - which we don't have.
I'm not dependent on those senses - tabula rasa is absolutely silly.
>>68693558
Well my personal thoughts on the matter is that society needs religion and some form of truth more than you and your feelings don't need it
If you want to see the affects of an atheistic society look at Sweden
Although most modern religions are pretty fucking cucky too desu
>>68693065
>flawed
>assumptions
See >>68693253
You'll hit a wall eventually if you dare to question everything. That wall is the logical absurdity of a Godless universe
Eventually, you'll lay the groundwork
>>68694039
>Well my personal thoughts on the matter is that society needs religion and some form of truth more than you and your feelings don't need it
because...?
>>68693448
Is it better to face the world as it truly is, and craft new philosophies to face it, even if some of those inevitably may be harmful or incorrect, or is it better to cower in the reactionary religions of the past, which treat Human learning and logic as if it were actively evil, while simultaneously promulgating implausible stories?
>>68677702
Standard atheist logic, this is what any Christian has to deal with daily. Morons literally inventing things to try and ridicule religion. Thank you for actually doing your fucking research
>>68694142
cool reductio ad absurdum brah.
What's the matter? Couldn't even make it through apologetics 101
>>68694284
>he believes a burning bush talked to a 500-year-old jew
>>68693558
>Fine. Then we don't know, can't know, and no question matters, including God.
You would think so wouldn't you?
But it goes deeper than this
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-refuting_idea#Philosophical_skepticism
>>68694284
>Morons literally inventing things to try and prove their religion.
FTFY
