Good morning /pol/
Media pundits and voices within the Republican Party are going hard against Trump. Their main argument against him is that he's not a true conservative. This doesn't hold up though because his positions on trade, immigration, health care and so-on are far more conservative than the main line positions within the Republican Party.
I know true conservatism isn't the real reason he's so heavily opposed. It's because Trump isn't within the system, he didn't go through any of the dogmatic channels, he didn't talk to the right people.
But this still raises the question, since so many seem to be so intolerant of fake conservatives...
What is conservatism?
I think asking all of these experts to define conservatism and then showing how Trump's positions are right in line with what conservatism is supposed to stand for.
Of course you'll hear back that Trump is con man or that he's just recently found his conservative views. But then ask whether Mitt was conservative.
Anyways.
What is conservatism? What are it's lynch pins?
>>68635407
Conservatism here means sucking the dicks of Israel and kike corporations, which necessitates free movement, the destruction of the middle class and corporate serfdom.
>tl;dr
Jews.
Supposedly, Conservatives take the Constitution at the literal, written meaning. Liberals want to 'interpret' the Constitution (in other words, play semantic games to make it mean what they want it to mean.)
As far as Trump goes, I see him as no more virtuous or evil as the rest of them. It's nice to see the establishment shaken - but is that really what's happening?
I personally think he'll be removed mid-process, and replaced by a Romey-type, so Clinton can win. But I'm being meta here.
I always viewed conservatism as being reserved and sticking to old techniques we knew worked with liberalism being trying new things that may or may not work
>>68635898
Well, that gets into the whole problem with allowing definitions to become nebulous and personal interpretations to replace literal definitions.
>>68635746
I'm not talking about the paper suits in DC. They've made it so you have to be a card carrying member of the We Stand With Israel Club to be a conservative.
I guess I'm asking... What is grass roots conservatism. Surely it's foundation would be in Christianity (at least in the US). Trump's policies are far more in line with grass roots conservatism than with the globalist/nation building brand of conservative that has taken over DC.
>>68635851
>I personally think he'll be removed mid-process, and replaced by a Romey-type, so Clinton can win. But I'm being meta here.
Perot dropped out mid race so anything is possible.
>>68635407
they are all full of shit. trump is the most conservative candidate running. libertarians, mormons, & democrat party refugees have hijacked the name "conservative".
>>68636095
But is that Conservatism or is it Republicanism (as per, the Republican party) Also, if one's stance with the Jews is the yardstick of one's Republican prowess, then what is the Democrat party, since it is comprised of many Jews?
>>68636095
But that's what they mean when they talk of conservatism.
You have to be 100% ready to sell of your country, whatever the cost or consequence.
"Conservatism" = Economic liberalism (including freedom of movement etc.), the actual questions of morality are wholly flexible.
>>68636230
Hey, think about it like this: If the Republicans want to distance themselves from the impending economic collapse, wouldn't it be better to allow Hillary one term in office to take the blame (even though both sides have brought this to us.)
>>68636316
Well, when it's strictly economic, in that sense, morality no longer exists - only profits.
>>68636269
I think this is because politics is playing to what the demographics may be in the future, not what they are now. R's want part of their base to be made up of Hispanics. Meanwhile, they sell out their current constituents.
Conservatism to me is like Clothes.
A conservative can own 1 jacket, a few pairs of slacks and ties. A good a pair of shoes and alternate them throughout the week.
A Liberal has to have different outfits with different shoes each day. Then have a different set of outfits that are different from the week before.
>>68636462
It's kind of the inverse of the Democratic assumption of the guaranteed Black vote. Kiss the Latino's asses, because they already have the WASP vote. Am I right?
>>68636269
Conservatism is the wrong ideology for the times. The Constitution has been ignored for at least a decade now. There is very little left to conserve.
We need 'restoration', that's what the reform party was about and that's why 'conservatism', being controlled opposition now, killed it.
>>68635407
He's not a real cuckservative, no
No policies on prepping the Globullists, he is a terrible cuck, oy
>>68636522
The conservative also paid for his own clothes, whereas the liberal expected the clothes for free.
>>68636352
I don't think either party really cares who wins the white house, as long as it isn't Trump.
Most of the policies lately come from bureaucracies. This is more convenient for them because they don't have to really answer to their voting record.
>>68636430
Well, that is what "Conservatism" means in contemporary parlance.
TRUE conservatives on the other hand, are what these very same people call reactionaries. The best example of a true conservative is for me, someone like Codreanu.
>>68636611
I'd vote for a Constitutional candidate, if more people took them seriously. Of course, no one would want to become isolationist and miss out on all that cheap foreign labor, interventionist profiteering, or meta-national, fiat currency-driven shell games to make a certain few rich on wars and market manipulation.
>>68636738
Honestly, this is where I get confused - people claim that a 'true conservative' is an extreme right-winger, but what is that, exactly? I've only seen the world move left-wards for 100 years (or more) What really is an extreme conservative?
>>68635407
>no true scotsman fallacy
how embarrassing that a bunch of corpulent old "men" have been reduced to throwing temper tantrums like a petulant brat
Liberty, in god we trust, e pluribus Unum. That is conservative
>>68635407
McCain was a true conservative?
Romney care Romney was a true conservative?
>>68635407
It goes from
>Conservatism
>Libertarianism
>Fascism
>Classical Republic
>>68637098
Well, kings used to lead their men in battle. Then, kings lead their soldiers from behind the ranks. Now, kings call drone strikes from 8,500 miles away. Maybe we can start making them go to the front again, so we can really see who's worth voting for?
>>68636611
Every election we hear back and forth about who's the guardian of the Constitution, yet "conservatives" have let it be subverted over and over.
So, is that the answer? A true conservative will follow the constitution to the letter?
Or is it more along the lines of God and Country?
I'm pretty far right, but hearing someone run a campaign based on protecting the constitution just sounds like empty words.
Don't get me wrong, I believe the constitution should be taken literally, but think the protection of our culture and country to be far more important and more conservative.
>>68637008
I think a true conservative will put culture, god, and country before other outside interests.
>>68637008
In the strictest sense, one that wishes to revert to pre-revolutionary values. Though we don't tend to call this a conservative anymore, instead using words like reactionary, traditionalist and sometimes even fascist.
>>68637331
Exactly - going back to the idea that Republicans are just as guilty of watering down our nation's value with allowing illegals in for cheap labor and/or bonus tax revenue. There's only one party in America, with numerous sock puppet candidates.
>Trump
>conservative
His economic policy is more leftist than Bernie's.
>>68637201
No. Don't get me wrong. I think Romney was a moral man, married to the same woman his whole life, nice family, etc. But he's a globalist, which kills his conservative cred.
>>68637514
So, do you mean Monarchy, or Tribalism? Personally, I'd choose the latter.
>>68635407
>What are it's lynch pins
being a globalist cuck
>>68637466
I'd put it in this order:
Faith
Culture
Nationalism
Any other order would lead to a form of Socialism.
>>68635407
Cuckservatism is dead. Why bother with something that's in history's rubbish bin? America First nationalism is that matters. MAGA
>>68637559
It's protectionist. It's not exactly free trade. But free trade has taken killed the wealth in this country. Is free trade worth it in this globalist environment?
>>68637745
Once again, is it Conservatism or Republicanism we are really taking about?
>>68635407
they're not conservative either
>>68637821
In all honesty, did we ever need to go outside of the US for goods? We have everything we need here. Is free trade a strategy towards eventually making the world reliant on America? If so, it's short-sighted, and probably won't work.
>>68637821
>It's protectionist. It's not exactly free trade.
Exactly. That's to the left of Bernie's policies. That's the kind of thing that you Americans ridicule France for while calling them commies. You cannot claim that Trump is conservative.
>>68637745
It's not dead yet. It's starting to crack, but powerful people want to hand on and the fight will get worse.
>>68638043
They could never win against individualists who understand the rights of each person out-weigh the needs of the state. If a nation's people are worthless, even the largest Empire becomes weak. Ask the Romans.
>>68637865
Conservatism is the ideology of the republican party. Republicanism in and of itself has nothing to do with it.
>>68637613
That would be some of the possible systems of governance, yes.
>>68638004
Nope, it is purely an ideological issue. The same happens with the EU.
>>68638025
That is only because conservatism has been distorted to necessitate economic liberalism.
Everything above or below this post is wrong.
Conservatism is a very simple idea, and so is Liberalism. I'm surprised most of you tried to make it deeper than it really is. If you really want the answer OP,
>Liberalism: More is more
>Conservatism: Less is more
>>68638025
France has protectionist trade policies?
This is a tangent, but this modern brand of capitalism isn't exactly a free market. Currency manipulation, tax policies, and cronyism isn't a free market.
A free market is a lot like an ecosystem. If left alone it will work itself out and every niche is filled.
>>68635407
why doesn't he have to fit into your social construct box?
>>68635407
>What is conservatism
Believes in
>Less Federal Government
>The Constitution
>Personal Responsibility
>>68638301
It is strange how the Law of the Strong, tempered with the impartial judgment of Mother Nature seemed to work well for thousands of years. I surmise a simple system is the most robust - hence why the so-called 'primitive' people had it so right for so long. Perhaps we're looking towards a corrective steer towards these old ways, once this current system collapses under it's grotesque girth?
>>68638246
>a nation's
Our elected are more worried about getting elected and keeping their donors happy. I'm not trying to sound cynical but I have no faith that DC really cares whether the US is a proud and strong nation.
As long as the economy grows at a steady 5% each year we're supposed to be happy.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NKkRDMil0bw
>>68638602
You have to admit, neither Democrats nor Republicans uphold these values.
>>68638438
Not my box. The TRUE conservatives in DC.
>>68635407
"conservative" now means establishment
>>68638859
I agree with you 100% on that. The question is, are we soon to be plunged into a Neo-feudal system, or will it all come crashing down, with our incompetent and mediocre leaders to be crushed with it?
>>68638957
I tend to agree - but liberals also establishment too. Both sides are really playing a game of "good cop, bad cop" with all of us.
>>68638907
All politicians on both sides are shit. The sad thing is we have to choose those who are less shitty than the rest....
>>68639465
Well, we could do that - or we can get angry enough to fight. Which, will never happen when people are fat, content and stupid.
>>68638957
Since the word conservatism is the word of choice in modern politics. I say, instead of coming up with a new word, we redefine it to mean, or better yet take it back to what it originally meant.
This
>>68638602
Or this
>>68637709
Or a mix of the two.
>>68635407
Nobody knows what Trumpie truly is. Just last year he was liberal.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rcUCLwWCihE
>>68639788
Which begs the question. Why are Mitt's conservative credentials not questioned by the establishment?
http://mittromneysflipflops.com/
>>68635407
Conservatism in America means 'having at least one position that is not left leaning'. Neoconservatives and the theocratic madmen they've been pandering to for decades have destroyed whatever conservatism meant past that.
