Reminder that open borders and free trade is good for the economy. If you disagree, you are either economically illiterate or a statist bootlicker.
Also dividing people by race or nationality is a form of collectivism not unlike socialism.
>>68190753
>open borders and free trade is good
Remember to sage and hide lolbertardian threads. They are raceless liberals in disguise and have an iq of 70 at the most.
but we have a welfare state
>>68190753
Oh yeah, free trade really worked for us well up here. A lot of our manufacturing jobs got shipped out of country, even to the US. Americans are stealing our jobs.
>>68190753
>implying that shitskins won't start pouring into your country once you open the borders and that they won't eventually use their votes to grant themselves access to your money
A libertarian society needs to be racially aware or at least nationalist. Unfortunately nationalist/racial awareness are not libertarian ideas.
>>68190753
Fuck Open borders but the free trade is good
>>68191367
Free trade is fine as long as our work isn't outsourced so much that our people cannot find jobs. Trade without any restrictions is a mistake.
Can you lolbertarian edgelords stop implying that this board wants anything to do with your shitty ideology. You keeps making these threads acting like /pol/ isn't inherently national socialist and wants nothing to do with your anarchy fantasies.
>>68192762
/pol/ is libertarian territory. Socialists need to get the fuck out.
>>68192847
Sorry, m8. r/politicallyincorrect is Bernie territory.
>>68191598
>free trade is fine as long as my feelings aren't hurt because I don't understand why outsourcing is beneficial to the economy and provides more & better jobs to the economy
>>68192762
fascism is a joke
>>68190992
What if welfare is gotten rid of and borders are too?
>>68193193
>m-muh companies need 2 be put b4 da peeple
>a-ami an edgy jew yet xDDDD
>>68193335
>2
>da
>peeople
>xDDDD
Fuck off to redddit and kill yourself, cancerous underageb&.
>>68193404
Says the person following an ideology made for 13 year old edgy faggots.
>OP
>>68193489
When did I say that I follow a given ideology? I called you out on your incompetent faggotry. I didn't say whether or not I agree with the anon that you replied to.
>>68193335
>he doesn't know that outsourcing eventually benefits the people by allocating resources more efficiently instead of wasting them on artificially created barriers
>>68190753
Enslaving you and locking you inside a factory to churn out product is also good for the spreadsheet of numbers also known as "the economy".
Does that make it a good thing?
>>68190753
Kill yourself
>>68193800
>>68193972
Being a nationalist who believes in a strong community and doesn't worship money like a god make him a Jew....
>>68192847
I'm sorry to piss that pork you're eating, Tyrone, but /pol/ is Islamic Communism territory.
>>68193684
>he thinks having an iphone made by enslaving rajeet overseas for a low price is better than being able to afford a home and raise a family
>don't le tread on me x)))
>muh textbooks and professors told me free trade is good
>I don't understand the difference between theory and practice
>>68190753
Shit like this is why I jumped off the libertarianism bandwagon. The autistic pretense that the market matter more than culture and ways of life is a non-starter in the real world.
>>68194521
Free trade always seems good when have a job.
>>68190753
Reminder making the same thread night after night proves you're either a retard or a shill. If you disagree, you are either a retard or a shill.
>>68190753
Okay Shlomo
>>68190753
Libertarianism that isn't nationalist libertarianism is for trash people and autists. Grow up.
>>68190753
There is more to life than an economy though, such as maintaining a national identity.
Becoming a slogging slum due to the culture of other people, and basically having your genepool killed offed isn't worth all magic monopoly money in the world, let alone gold.
>>68190753
Free trade is good, if you end up having a proficit. Also, free trade should work in both ways. Otherwise, it's neither 'free' nor 'trade', it's just robbery.
>>68194579
Indeed. Remember when the white collar workers were laughing at the working class because "dey took our jerbs". We'll the shoes on the other foot now with many IT workers and other white collar jobs.
They laughed when it wasn't their jobs being taken. Their bubble is starting to burst though, and I can't lie it's kind of enjoyable to see
>>68190753
Completely free trade doesn't work when you have semi-communist countries like China and India that artificially keep their labor costs low through regulation so they can compete on uneven ground with developed countries.
>>68194418
Its not just iphones you cuck, it effects literally everything in some way. You can't see the connections because you're twelve and retarded but I'll put it in simple terms for you using the example that you provided
>iphones are cheaper
>people are now buying more iphones
>more people are needed to sell iphones, more people get hired
>people want more apps
>basically fucking anyone who knows how to code can make an iphone app
>people develop and sell apps for the iphone
>marketers and artists are hired to shill for the iphone and its apps
>etc etc etc now more people are employed, do easier work, and can afford a house and more luxury items. You also don't have to worry about poorfags, poverty, and overpopulation in China because Jingaling can now move past working on a farm to sustain themselves and won't have to have 12 kids to help work it
>>68195511
>you can own a home by working a service sector job selling iPhones
Lay off the drugs my man
Yes goyim, it's good for you to have to compete with two billion Asians who bred their own self worth into oblivion via overpopulation!
What's good for GDP and China doesn't mean shit if that money isn't reaching lower class Americans, shitstain. That logic only works if there's other work opened up for Americans to do instead, which doesn't happen to most industries anymore. Almost every basic need can be automated or outsourced now, leaving a service sector economy that's already making up jobs like HR to keep people busy doing nothing. All the proponents of free trade and immigration want is for American wages to decline until we reach an equilibrium with the irresponsible parts of the world where work is moved. And that equilibrium is not enough to support the quality of life we're accustomed to. The only people that benefit from this are poor countries that need whites to come and hire them, and the business owners who do so.
>>68195511
You forgot the fact that a large amount of those jobs created will also be outsourced.
And don't sit here and try to argue that a bunch of faggots sitting in their basement can make an an app that can generate decent revenue. That only happens on rare occasions.
SKILLED jobs is the key word here, lolbertardian. The jobs that people can live off of need to stay in the country.
>>68190753
If you agree you are utterly disconnected from reality and have to ignore 30 years of evidence and experience in the western world.
You lolbertarians are just as bad as the communists.
>b-but it hasn't REALLY been tried! This time we'll get it right I s-swear!
>>68196306
Notice commies and lolberts love anarchy.
Two peas in a pod
>>68195702
>implying you can't
If you work full time and don't live in fucking Los Angeles or Seattle, you can. I've seen mortgages in my area that I could have afforded right after highschool working as a full time fast food fag, even though all the houses here are expensive as fuck because of the large navy presence.
>>68195954
Again, missing the connections.
>And don't sit here and try to argue that a bunch of faggots sitting in their basement can make an an app that can generate decent revenue
Lmao nigger people used to (and still sorta do) fucking make bank developing websites in their undies with basic programming knowledge, and there are plenty of businesses dedicated to contract coding
Free trade is probably the only thing that most economists can agree on. The only people who dislike it are socialist/marxist economists and the plebs who believe populists like Sanders and Trump
>>68190753
>open borders
Yeah, let's have Paco, Dâm Son, and PingNongDong come into our country and drive down the value our labor by diluting the workforce with their minimum wage skillsets
>free trade
Just fuck my economy up, senpai
>>68196594
>getting a full time service job
>getting a service job to give you more than 30 hrs a week(not including managers)
>living off a service job
You're showing your disconnection from reality
closed borders and free trade and both god tier be a libertarian nationalist
The economy can grow and the general population still be utterly butt fucked financially.
Just because it's good for the economy doesn't make it good for the entire country.
Free trade has worked in some places and failed tremendously in others. Humans will always exploit the least resistance towards greed if they can get away with it, expecting ethical behavior just results in extreme disparity of wealth.
Don't expect humans to "do the right thing", we will stab each other in the back and fuck each other into the earth if we don't check and balance one another.
>>68195954
>>68196306
Do you grow your own food?
Do you fetch your own water?
Do you build your own car?
Do you build your own house?
Do you make your own clothes?
No, someone does it for you, and you pay for it so you can focus on doing things that are more beneficial for you. People make money off of doing your shit, and you have extra time to make more money or have more fun. Free trade is the same exact thing, just on a larger scale
>>68196594
Are you seriously this delusional?
I'm honestly asking if you're just trolling or if you seriously believe what you're typing.
>>68196594
Only reason they agree on it is because it's good for GDP and good for business. It isn't good at all for the working class unless you unironically believe lower wages and less jobs are worth it for cheaper toys.
>>68196905
But what about the people who don't have jobs? What about the people who can't find jobs because illegals have clogged up the system and will work for a fraction of what an American will ?
>>68190753
>Reminder that open borders and free trade is good for the economy.
But not good for the people.
>>68196905
I want people IN MY COUNTRY to do it so that they can actually get a job.
>>68191598
>Free trade is fine as long as our work isn't outsourced so much that our people cannot find jobs
> so much that our people cannot find jobs
Free trade is nothing back a lack of tariffs and penalties which encourage domestic production and discourage the use of foreign labor/importation.
Free trade essentially is good for the shareholders, executives, and bottom line, but bad for the people who need a paycheck to pay their mortgage and buy groceries.
I would also assume that free trade is good for developing economies where labor is cheap because it will raise the tax base and GDP if foreign money is coming in to the country in the form of wages, where it eventually goes to the government in the form of tax revenue.
Oh, and many third world countries are heavily indebted to international financial institutions, which are controlled by globalists. Who is free trade good for again?
>tfw you're a libertarian and have to pretend to know something about history or economics
>>68196880
>getting a service job to give you more than 30 hrs a week(not including managers)
Lmao a dude almost got fired from my work because he was getting too many overtime hours and got pissy when they stopped letting him take as much. There are hours to be found, you just have to make yourself be valuable to the company (ie get a manager/leader job or know every aspect of your job).
>>68197110
>What about the people who can't find jobs because illegals have clogged up the system and will work for a fraction of what an American will
That's why you have to get rid of minimum wage and most/all labor laws. Americans would work for those wages, they just aren't allowed to, assuming Americans would want to do that work in the first place(which they probably don't). Also, illegals haven't clogged up jobs, that's just right wing rhetoric to shift blame from the corporatism that they push towards Pablo because he will paint your house for $5 an hour
>>68197091
>>68197237
>good for business
more business = more competition = lower prices = more employers
>people IN MY COUNTRY
Again with the
>BUT MUH FEELINGS
bullshit, nationalists are as bad as liberals. kek
>>68190753
>>68197694
>>68197694
why not?
>>68197487
>I would also assume that free trade is good for developing economies where labor is cheap because it will raise the tax base and GDP if foreign money is coming in to the country in the form of wages, where it eventually goes to the government in the form of tax revenue.
It's a mixed bag. A lot of those countries go into a lot of debt to provide infrastructure for those companies and give them all sorts of incentives to stay there.
>>68190753
trumpfags have no idea of the implication of an autarchy
>>68197880
>>68197610
Are you retareded?
More business in this case means more employment for FOREIGNERS.
I'm glad you decided to show your true jewish colors by implying that doing what's best for our own people is just feelings.
No people, no nation, no accountability, just
>muh EEE KHON O MEE
Yeah fuck borders and law and shieeet just let everyone in
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LPjzfGChGlE
>>68190753
>open borders and free trade is good
>>68198054
>>68190753
Open borders and free trade are only good if you don't have a welfare state or barriers to entry along with manipulative trading partners. I'm a libertarian too but I'm at least realistic about it.
>>68198152
>>68198165
The existence of a welfare state does not change much. Mass migrations into America happened before we had a welfare system.
>y
>>68198245
>>68191367
Free trade only works when its between equally (or almost equally) markets
otherwise it turns into NAFTA or whatever, where its just international corps exploiting cheap labor is poor countries to sell massively marked up products to wealthier consumers
>>68198165
Also, it's almost impossible to have a real discussion on here about any other political ideology. You'll get the typical surge of edgelord """"Natsoc"""" autists shitposting your thread to death.
>>68198355
>>68198398
>>68198278
So? That doesn't change the fact that mass migrations with a welfare state isn't a good idea. You'll attract lazy niggers that just want to mooch.
>>68190753
>Reminder that open borders and free trade is good for the economy.
It's only good for the economy if you don't have a welfare state, which every western nation has to one degree or another. Libertarian scholars consistently say that immigration should be prevented until the welfare state is entirely abolished.
>>68190753
>>68190921
>>68191221
>>68191287
>>68197694
>>68197880
>>68198054
>>68198146
>>68198152
>>68198186
>>68198245
>>68198355
>>68198379
>>68198398
>>68198419
>>68198443
>>68198477
>>68198536
>>68198551
>>68198587
OP
I used to be an open borders libertarian like you.
Why don't we release ALL prisoners in the USA and let them into the labour force?
Economic production would increase riiigghht?
It's not worth a little bit of extra economic production to have a bunch of insane murderous psychopaths(rapefugees and illegals).
>>68197610
You're basically implying that the economy can support an unlimited number of people while employing all of them and supplying them with wages just as good as if there was a labor shortage, and everyone knows that's bullshit. Human input is no longer the primary source of value and there are far fewer places for people to go when put out of work than back when they were forced off their farms and into factories.
When you shove more people into the labor market you will oversaturate it, just like anything else. Labor is supply and demand and labor shortages have frankly always been the best way to force companies to provide for their workers.
>>68198278
Because America had labor shortages making it extremely lucrative to come here. It still is for some people, but only because they have different standards of what's good than we do.
>>68198615
OK so there is no mooching but there would still be millions of shitskins in your country. How is that a good thing?
>>68198054
>>68198136
>>68198146
>>68198152
>>68198186
>>68198245
>>68198355
>>68198379
>>68198398
>>68198419
>>68198443
>>68198477
>>68198536
>>68198551
Literally not an argument.
>>68198720
Not making an argument. Just posting cute sneks.
>>68198685
Bad shitskins would not be able to survive in the country since they actually have to work. How is having good shitskins in the country a bad thing?
The country is no different then a shared private possession, shareholders should decide via referendum
>>68198720
>>68198770
Same.
I've blown my load though.
>>68198800
There is no such thing as a "good" non-european in a western country, especially if there are lots of them in one place.
>>68198867
>blown my load
Hot.
>>68198922
In other words, just because you say so and it hurts your delicate sensibilities. Ok.
>>68198867
You're sick.
>>68190753
An economy can "grow" and still have high unemployment, so while what you're saying is true it is also too simple.
>>68199013
Even under libertarian standards thus isn't true. We have a massive welfare state.
I really really really like these images
>>68199013
>millions of non-natives invade your country so that they can work
>use their numbers to weild influence in local politics
>eventually start changing your country to suit their cultural needs
>suddenly your country isn't really your country anymore
That's how it works. Libertarianism is a white boy thing. Non-whites will get rid of it as soon as they have enough influence to do so.
>>68199051
>7JeAsJeb
>JeAsJeb
>JewAsJeb
>Jew as Jeb
>>68199055
Don't tread on me.
>>68198908
I chuckled.
>>68199221
>millions of non-natives invade
Wouldn't happen because there is no way a labor shortage like this would be happen. Even if millions were to come in, they would be forced to conform to the host nation since the government isn't mandating the natives accommodate them. That means they'll necessarily have values that align with society.
>influence in local politics
The government is basically just there for show, what exactly are they going to force it to do even if they have shared ideals that they want to push and even if they come in significant numbers?
>changing country to suit cultural needs
Can't because government isn't involved in that. Again, they could practice their culture but they can;t enforce anything therefore they will assimilate as a general rule. Since you're only going to get the ones that actually succeed to stay and these people are the ones that assimilate flawlessly most of the time, there'll be no issues with that.
Well, it depends. The logic in traditional arguments is that what is good for the economy is good for everyone.
The problem is more and more persons only have value through their labor, and opening borders simply deflates labor prices.
>But this will reduce the cost of goods
Yes, it does reduce the cost of goods, but we now live in an age where there is simply a large part of the population that is simply unemployable.
>>68190753
>Reminder that open borders and free trade is good for the economy.
yes, generally, but not all immigrants are equal, why should we take in people who are going to be dependent on welfare, or people that will seek to change our system? protecting ones boarders is an integral part of our national defense. There is no point of having a system of governance that is ideologically pure but inherently self destructive, because we will take in anyone.
>>68198650
I agree, and I'm a fan of Hoppe, but if the welfare state (minimum wage, welfare benefits, state schools, public health care, public property etc.) were all abolished, immigration would be at much smaller levels, and would not cause such cultural damage since it would be dictated by supply and demand. Mass immigration is what is harmful to civil society and Western culture. At moderate levels it gives us cheap clothes tailors and cleaners, which I'm all for. Also what about our top universities? They would pretty quickly cease being world class institutions if we stopped letting the Indians and Chinese in.
>>68200012
>if we stopped letting the Indians and Chinese in.
You do realize that most of them are there solely because they pay 5 times what normal students pay right? It has nothing to do with the quality of their work.
>>68200012
I'm okay with gooks and poos in loos.
>>68199607
I was unhappy with this creation, so I cleaned it up a little.
>>68200012
>libertarians let in immigrants and/or have pre-existing minority populations
>minorities have double the birth rate of natives
>eventually minorities and leftists form majority and vote in socialist programs
>libtards have their property confiscated by the state
>>68199694
Not when their standards are far lower than the natives, retard. They'll accept worse treatment and come in droves because it's still better than a failed state ruled by crime. But always, always too stupid and proud to admit that it's their own culture and polices that created such an environment, so they repeat it here. That is the hispanic takeover of America. That is the muslim takeover of Europe. You worship the dollar, but they have other drives in life.
Libertarianism is for people who want the lower classes slaving away like chinks, nothing more.
>>68200118
Of course I'm talking about the research fellows and professors, not students.
>>68200351
No matter how much better things are here than they are over there, they will not be able to survive here without a job and if they're contributing there will be no issue. We're arguing about the hypothetical situation here, stop comparing it to the situation we have now. the two aren't comparable. You really aren't providing any counters, but rambling.
>>68190753
>take away state borders for healthcare providers
>all healthcare providers move to a state with little regulation (aka Delaware)
>healthcare companies can now deny coverage to customers across the country based on loose rules in new state
>>68200253
>eventually minorities and leftists form majority and vote in socialist programs
>implying Libertarian support democracy
You could make the exact same argument about poor natives.
>>68200679
>We're arguing about the hypothetical situation here, please don't use evidence to support your claims
Libertarianism in a nutshell.
>>68200153
>>68200833
Yes, because states around today are so libertarian, right? The situations we have now are caused by excessive government intervention via welfare and social programs along with social interventions like affirmative action. That's why you're seeing the kind of negative immigration you are. If you want to argue the value of a libertarian system, you have to do so in hypothetical situations because nothing we have now resembles it. If you aren't going to do that then you really aren't arguing against libertarianism, just the system we have now. Learn to debate.
>>68201085
You have zero persuasive arguments for how to implement and maintain a libertarian society in a country where even the natives desire a modicum of security and regulation from the government on their behalf BECAUSE THOSE NATIVES ENACTED THEM IN THE FIRST PLACE, SHITHEAD.
The only way to make America unattractive to poor shitskins is to workplaces look like theirs. That's what globalism is. Equilibrium.
if i was a mexican american, or perhaps african american, I would also be a libertarian.
Alas I am european and so I an a national socialist, naturally.
>>68201496
>I'm white so that means I should be dependent on the government
Your logic makes no sense.
>>68201430
Go back and read my posts. You seem to be having trouble with your reading or you just keep saying the same thing because you fundamentally do not understand. The flow of immigrants into the country will not be massive precisely because immigration will happen only when there is a supply shortage of labor, which is rarely the case in most countries anymore. If there are no jobs to be had in the country, immigrants cannot come in because there is no government benefits to sustain them until they can find work. So your entire argument just falls flat since it assumes that immigrants will somehow come and force natives to accept conditions that they don't have to even though even though the natives have all of the advantages. It also assumes that immigrants will continue to live here despite there being no employment for them, how would they do that if there are not government benefits to sustain them? Explain these things to me and don't refer to situations that happen today because, like I told you, the system is not libertarian and you are effectively just arguing against the current system and not this hypothetical. You seem to have trouble with basic logic, so I might be asking too much.
>>68201796
None of it makes sense. If whites are superior, they would outcompete everyone and thus libertarianism would be the best system for them. Apparently this guy thinks that whites needs the government to coddle them. So much for the master race.
>>68202114
Our immigrants ARE working, dumbass, they pushed natives out of work to get their jobs. Most of Obama's "job recovery" when to them. That doesn't make them valuable members of society. It doesn't mean they aren't transforming the south culturally and politically. And it's not just unskilled labor, they outbreed the natives and send their kids to free schools. Or are you gonna annihilate subsidized education too?
No nations are on equal footing to begin with. Mexico and Central America are riddled with crime and corruption(their own doing) leaving them with poor opportunities.
I don't know if you're just too stupid to understand, or being deliberately misleading because you're too wealthy to give a fuck about the rest of the country or its future, but Americans should not be expected to compete with populations that bred themselves into irrelevance(China, India) or destroyed their own countries(drug cartels) and seek to repeat the process here. Labor is supply and demand. It is not coddling to refuse to low our own quality of life just because they're willing to accept less, you fucking kike.
>>68198720
Also not an argument tho
>>68200764
>implying Libertarian support democracy
Congratulations on addressing the problem of leftists simply voting more welfare for themselves, but now you've painted yourself into a corner. What system of government protects personal liberty?
>defending open borders while there is still a welfare state going on
I hate liberteens
BUILD A WALL
>>68205428
Exactly, it makes so fucking sense.
I like some socialist policies, but it's completely futile with open borders, yet I see it all the time here on the left.
>>68205583
Libertarians must understand that immigration is a government program. Immigrants use more welfare, and consistently vote for more of it.
Open borders only work if unproductive people are not rewarded for being unproductive.
>>68190753
Stop fucking pretending your a libertarian, we do not want open fucking borders, we still want there to be a small government that enforces contract rights and maintains a border
>>68190753
>sacrificing national soveriginity, cultural identity, the self determination of your own people is good because it makes the rich globalist jews richer.
Fuck off you globalist shill.
The sooner your ilk gets slaughtered, the better.
