>capitalism causes some people to live on low wages
>socialism causes famines that kill tens of millions
>>67202194
Okay this is really really bad left wing propaganda.
Capitalism is always in crisis, 100%.
This has to be the case.
But this being bad is propaganda because capitalism is a dynamic system that moves from crisis to equilibrium to crisis to equilibrium over and over again.
it's a dynamic oscillating system.
Our system isn't broken at all. People just BITCH too much and our morals and drive are becoming lower on average. Being born in the west and success is like a horny cock and horny vagina, its too easy, just don't be a fuck, save money, and stay productive in general.
>>67202194
Capitalism is so terrible, I mean, what fucking joke of economic model don't assure that everyone will live on pure gold mansions?
Says the faggot who blows every paycheck on friday and then demands people who save their money to hand it over
>>67204567
>>67204379
>>67204227
this is simple people talking about little folk stuff.
capitalism is beautiful. capitalism is literally a complex dynamical system like entropy.
>>67203596
Capitalism itself is inherently left wing as it can not exist and function without concepts introduced by the advent of leftist paradigms such as individual property rights for all citizens coupled with (normally) inalienable citizenship...
Not that anybody on here actually cares about nuances of the dichotomies they reduce to soundbytes.
But yeah, the observation that capitalism is in crisis, or even determining that it is the cause of crisis is not an intrinsically left-wing statement whatsoever.
You'd actually have to see the reasoning involved to make such a declaration.
If you cared about truth and clarity, that is.
>>67205015
the simple sheep do not care about how anything work, but knowing how something works lets you lead.
capitalism can exist without property rights. capitalism doesn't emerge because of rights, rather it emerges because fruits of labour can be separated from labour itself. As long as this exist, value flows.
>>67202194
>>67204379
who the fuck said we need to live in gold mansions retard.
How many more millions have to die before socialists realize that you need a large autocratic state in order to have a planned economy and large autocratic states always abuse their power because they are not accountable to their people.
>>67205409
but this pyramid is dynamic and rulers themselves support an inverted pyramid too. the rulers are nothing but singular nodes amongst a sea of nodes, and value/capital flows. it's circulating. it always has to circulate.
>>67205409
Worst post ever
>>67205503
Second worst post ever
>>67205503
then what do you want? that everybody should live in Mud huts and the gulag?
>>67202194
>X has problems
>Y has more so you can't criticize X
>>67205552
when china collapse. the dream of a managed economy will be ruined. Putin's economic policy is an attempt to do what china has done in terms of control and reducing 'foreign' influence but....
those targets, those 5 year plans. party leaders who can take folks heads off. the lowly economist will fudge numbers if targets aren't met and man, all that fudging, that will show the world you can't do a planned economy, even partially so.
today china is only able to be where it is because it was given permission to distort the global economy by clinton and gwb.
>>67205789
Canadians also fucked and distorted our economy. We chased for that easy black gold. Meh, serves us right.
All you need to know about socialism.
>>67204740
>knows what entropy means
DEFINITELY
Idealistic meritocratic free market syndicalism > libertarian capitalism (inc anti monopoly) > non Marxist socialism > Marxist socialism pretending not to be Marxist > balls out Marxism "don't you dare hire white men" redistribute everything even associated to wealth and teach white men a lesson in what it's like to be oppressed
And to finish, people from the entire spectrum exist and exert power in some way, sometimes on yours truly. I disagree, its not capitalism causing the current problem, it wasn't capitalism that decided everyone in American should be a home owner (08), it wasn't capitalism that fully fucked academia by promoting left wing programs that rarely teach job skills (coming student debt crisis), it was Marxism finding its way through everything.
Because we lost the cold war and now THEY are blaming capitalism for shit they caused.
>>67205348
>capitalism can exist without property rights
No it can't, there would be no reason for capitalism to exist, opportunity would always be static with an impassable ceiling, usually held in place by the crown.
Citation: The entirety of human history before the revolutions of the 1700's.
>capitalism doesn't emerge because of rights
Nobody said that. Cut that shit out, we could have had a decent conversation.
>>67205608
With Capitalism, today there are 60 persons as rich as half of the world. Not much else to say.
>>67206426
Congratulations to those 60 persons who are so successful, I guess. I honestly don't understand why people throw up this meme, you blame people for making money?
Yeah. Capitalism is rapidly "winning" us right into an epic, Eco-apocalypse. In the meantime we can enjoy all of the genocide, racism, poverty, imperialism, and exploitation capitalism requires and promotes in order to generate profits and gadgets for (mostly) Amerikans and European consumers. Capitalism has our (white Euros and 'Merikans) backs, though. While we wait for capitalism to completely destroy the earth, we can read John Green's shallow, pretentious, vapid, sexist, and heteronormative YT trash books to distract us from all of this. ENJOY
>>67206585
most of them don't even work for it,
people of wealth are usually born into it
and then wealth begets wealth
>>67206585
Congratulation you're official retarded. Nothing more to say and have a nice day.
>mfw people are upholding economic values near me
>>67205015
>Capitalism itself is inherently left wing as it can not exist and function without concepts introduced by the advent of leftist paradigms such as individual property rights for all citizens coupled with (normally) inalienable citizenship...
>leftist paradigms
And who said that these rights need to be forced by a monopolistic state?
Maggie said it best https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t37Oy8dD-U4
>>67206722
Well, communist china is the most polluted shithole on earth, so better start telling alternatives.
>>67206764
Even if that's true, why does it matter? Are you so jealous of those 60 people that you want to change the world's economic system? With capitalism I can study on my own, make my own living however I want, and with hard work make it wherever I want, anyone can. If you say otherwise you are lazy and trying to find excuses for your own failure.
>>67206792
Post another funny picture!
>>67207093
China have a real communist economy... Please don't make me laugh.
>>67206764
What's your solution to being born into wealth? Would you not want to be able to provide the best living standards for your children? If you're not allowed to provide better living standards for your children why would anyone work? I don't get this argument.
>capitalism causes some people to live on low wages
>socialism causes famines that kill tens of millions
Kinda backed yourself into a corner there, haven't you, OP?
>>67207313
Command economy then?
They're the most openly Marxist nation and they openly pollute the most and produce horrible tourists.
>>67207322
Capitalism doesn't cause low wages anyways.
Socialism- system that has worked for the last 100 years in europe and has created a more higher educated freer society there
>>67202194
Russia and China had famines for centuries before the socialists ended them. How do you feel about 45 million Americans using food stamps?
You can either hate capitalism or understand the laws of economics.
THIS IS A MOVEMENT! THE REGRESSIVE LEFT WILL FAIL. WE WILL NEVER SURRENDER TO THEIR VIOLENCE. TRUMP IS WHAT THE WORLD NEEDS, RIGHT NOW!!!!!!!!!
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=a3n45oqSwOI
>>67207694
You can either accept socialism and understand the concept of reality. Nothing is infinite. capitalism pigs don't understand this.
>>67207295
>With capitalism I can study on my own, make my own living however I want, and with hard work make it wherever I want, anyone can.
>implying you can't do that in societies with socialist policies
You know it would be easier to achieve those things in where university and healthcare is free/subsidized?
In a purely capitalistic society, if you want to succeed, you're going to need money. No amounts of effort and hard work will allow you to build a multimillion dollar company without either luck or money.
>>67207321
it's just that his argument is that people work hard to become rich and successful, whereas in a lot of the cases people are just born rich already and just have to not screw up to continue being wealthy.
>hurr durr capitalism is or is in crisis
LIFE is in constant crisis.
Or... you have any suggestion on systems that don't have crisis? Or systems with less crisis than capitalism?
>>67207880
>>67207630
You're going to run out of other people's money. You still have a lot because you don't need a strong military. And what's the cost of your socialist nanny state? Importing sandniggers that are destroying your nation because you think they'll work, but just abuse your welfare state? Your state trying to control the people through social engineering like Denmark did with an obesity tax?
>>67205409
>>67205608
>>67206426
>>67206585
>>67206792
>>67207295
I just realized how fucking amazing this place is when I get to witness an anon from Denmark and and an anon from Singapore argue over capitalism. It's just so mesmerizing, cause this wouldn't be able to happen 10 years ago.
>>67207964
No, it's much easier to achieve it in a capitalist society where half of what I make isn't getting leached by niggers who don't want to work
>No amounts of effort and hard work will allow you to build a multimillion dollar company without either luck or money.
Who needs a multimillion dollar company to have a good living and nice family? Although hard work and effort is required to make one
>>67208349
no, you only notice the money being taken away from you when you're living past the reasonable standard and are beginning to live in excess.
besides that, wouldn't it be nice if everyone could live in comfortably with a nice family from the get go? instead of everyone struggling to climb out of the lower class?
>>67208163
Too much capitalism and you have people starving in the streets with nothing being done" - no, what you have is a very small minority getting most/all the wealth, and masses of people taking any job they can find (no matter how low the pay), because they don't want to starve to death. Look at today's third world countries...look at 'the west' during the birth of modern capitalism, the Industrial Revolution (where factory owners made huge profit, while those lucky enough to work in the factory were paid next to nothing)! PLENTY OF WORK is/was being done...but the generated wealth just funneled to the rich minority. Many people say this (ie. "We need to strike a balance between the two..."), but it's very clear that one system is much MUCH more logical and fair than the other. Remember, humanity lived in tribal 'communes' for the first 90% of our species existence...we're mentally hard wired to be social and work together.
>>67208714
A lot of the shit companies get away with is because government tries to interfere and make things worse.
>Industrial Revolution (where factory owners made huge profit, while those lucky enough to work in the factory were paid next to nothing)!
Socialists are very myopic when it comes to history. What was it like before this? Was it any better? We've improved through capitalism. It's like when people say that capitalism causes child labor even though the time period before already had it. It was eliminated through capitalism.
>>67209348
>We've improved through capitalism
Marx himself admitted capitalism was progressive. Nobody denies it's better than feudalism. But it's ultimately just another stage in human progress.
>>67208663
Of course I don't notice it when we don't have lower and middle class income tax here. If everyone lived comfortably from start, people would not know the value of putting in their own effort, which I think is important to healthy economy. It's why westerners don't get jobs anymore and just wait for their government checks.
>>67208714
Why is the west so stagnant and unemployed? Full employment and people actually working is much more important than income equality. It doesn't matter if it's fair, it actually works and grows things.
