For any military fags out there-- can you explain how an f-16 piloted by a TURK shot down an su-24?
Also, if an f-16 flown by a Turk can down a Russian su-24 that easily, why the hell is the US spending almost a trillion dollars on f-22s and f-35s when it appears the f-16 works just fine, other than to put money in the pockets of the Jews who own these military-industrial companies?
SU-24s are ground attack aircraft... Not a fighter. If it was an Su-27 things would have been a bit different.
>>56751934
believe it or not operating military aircraft is not as difficult as it seems.
Id argue that ww1 and ww2 pilots like the redbarron were much more skilled considering the equipment they used.
nowadays a computer does 99.9% of the work for you
Also, I recall reading a report that was leaked detailing how an f-16 consistently beat the f-35 in dogfights. Why the hell are we here in the US still the only civilized nation where if you can't afford your health insurance, you drop dead? We play world police while there IS NO MORE White middle class, White females aren't having kids bc families need 2 income households, and in general the jew continues to destroy western society. Thank you, merchant. You are my greatest ally.
>>56751934
How did an unescorted light bomber without armament and unaware it was in a fight get shot down by one of the best fighters in the world in a surprise attack? I'm not sure at all.
Not military fag or justifying the F-35 crazy expenses but here is my take
Su-24 was flying back after a bombing run or focusing on ground targets, F-16 shot a missile in the back of the plane.
Russian pilots probably didn't see it coming, the wings of the airplane aren't swept when it's falling.
It's like saying you don't need to develop a new assault rifle because shooting with a musket while he was playing candy crush on his phone.
>>56752242
Confirmed retard
t. US Navy fighter pilot VFA-41
>>56752098
So it has no air-to-air capability? It can't even throw out out those metallic pieces of flak to confuse missiles or have some type of jamming mechanism? IDK, just would have thought Soviet jets would be far superior to anything the turks could field (even though it's a Us built aircraft)
>>56752244
Thats like complaining that the us army is worthless becaure they suck at jousting
Noone dogfights, one of you is dead across the horizon
>>56751934
>su-24
Simple, the SU-24 is a bomber aircraft. It isn't designed to do dogfights and attack other planes, and most likely has minimal defense systems.
>>56752554
Fighters are anti-aircraft, generally you have to compromise and when planning a mission to bomb durkas, you don't account for an f-16 shoving one up your ass.
>>56751934
It was a surprise attack from what the pilots believed to be a neutral country.
>>56752242
This is definitely true, as seen in the fact that females are even able to operate as pilots. If you're at all interested in military aircraft, look up Hans-Ulrich Rudel. "Rudel flew 2,530 combat missions claiming a total of 2,000 targets destroyed; including 800 vehicles, 519 tanks, 150 artillery pieces, 70 landing craft, nine aircraft, four armored trains, several bridges, a destroyer, two cruisers, and the Soviet battleship Marat." He is known for his personal motto "only he is lost who has given himself up for lost" after one seemingly miraculous escape from the Soviet Red beast where he ran barefoot through the snow and crossed rivers, avoided dogs tracking him, and somehow made it 25+ miles in the snow. He finished the way flying with one leg, and he "surrendered" to the americans by landing on an airstrip in the West and locking the hand break in such a way as to make the aircraft unable to ever fly again and thus clogging up the runway for day. He was heavily involved in the design of the a-10 warthog. His biography was released by US publishers once the cold war kicked into high gear and they wanted to teach the masses that the Reds were the real enemy. the word "hero" is so overused, but this guy really fit the description in every sense.
>>56752242
OH yeah you know cause now days Jets takes a fucking Jedi to pilot
retard
>>56752713
I admitted from outset I have a very basic knowledge of military aircraft, thus the reason I asked the question and directed it at "military fags" who would know...
/k/ here.
>For any military fags out there-- can you explain how an f-16 piloted by a TURK shot down an su-24?
F-16s fire radar air-to-air missiles of the ASRAAM type. Those can take down a target several hundreds of kilometers away. I haven't looked at it yet but they might have fired infrared/semi-active radar air-to-air missiles like the 91M2. Regardless, an air-to-air missile works like a grenade. it gets very close to its target then blows up, sending fragments everywhere and therefore fucking up wings, cockpit, fuselage, etc. The Russian plane has no way to defend itself except try to avoid the missiles with flares and manuvers.
>Also, if an f-16 flown by a Turk can down a Russian su-24 that easily, why the hell is the US spending almost a trillion dollars on f-22s and f-35s when it appears the f-16 works just fine, other than to put money in the pockets of the Jews who own these military-industrial companies?
Because the SU-24 is an old Russian plane. It has already been replaced by many other ground attack aircraft. So the US needs to keep up as well. Besides it's always good to keep technology gap wide. And the US still uses F-16s regardless. And F-22s are meant to intercept aircraft like a SU27PU. So yeah.
>>56751934
Air superiority fighter > Bomber. Bombers do not have the maneuverability or appropriate ordinance for a dogfight.
>>56753158
>and Americans will believe this story of course
No wonder propaganda is so effective in there
>>56751934
Pilot training + AWACs > Fighter capability
Every Fucking time. How do so called military fags not understand this.
>>56752242
This is not true. Computers don't make decisions. Have you ever seen a Dogfight footage from the 2003 war?
>>56752244
That is simply impossible. The F-16 has outdated everything. All except fame for the F-35 is better. Please provide source and I'll show you how its bullshit.
>>56752372
Basically this.
>>56752421
>"Russian pilots probably didn't see it coming, the wings of the airplane aren't swept when it's falling."
>What is radar
>>56752554
No. And no.
>>56752991
It wasn't. There's a thing called radar that can detect aircraft coming at your direction before you get blown up.
>>56751934
Turks attacked from behind without any warning.
also this:
>>56752098
>>56753254
>asraam
Kek
>>56753351
The SU-24 is not a bomber. This is a bomber.
>>56752877 Fighters are anti-aircraft, generally you have to compromise and when planning a mission to bomb durkas, you don't account for an f-16 shoving one up your ass.
This doesn't make sense to me, bc Ergodan (who is a Salafist trying to turn Turkey back into a theocracy---which I really don't care, but keep it out of Europe_ has been warning in the press he was going to pull something like this. I'd REALLY like to see the Turks get kicked out of Nato on their fuucking Turk asses, who have been facilitating all of this. Great tape going around where the Turk coast guard is letting a group of turks pass to greece, until he realizes there is a Sky camera crew aboard and then makes a cursory effort of firing a pistol into the air and just sort of half-ass follows them until they are in greek waters. I CANNOT understand why Europe can't put a few PT boats in the water betweenGreece and Turkey and just fucking stop this shit now. Merkel is a fucking trait who should be tried as such and hanged.
![14038718570_938ab6412b_b[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/W1UlemJ.jpg "14038718570_938ab6412b_b[1].jpg")
>>56751934
F16 block 50+ is a good aircraft. Even by modern standards it's not outdated by any means unlike the SU-24. The F16 has undergone extensive modernization to keep it up to date and it's a great aircraft for the price. With proper support it could compete with modern Russian fights.
Russia doesn't even equip the "newest" model SU-24 with any type of IR MAWs which is part of why it got BTFO. Guy probably didn't even realize he'd been fired on until he was hit.
>>56752554
Very likely it was killed with an AIM9 in which case the typical ECM package on a flank is not of much use.
Every SU-24 the Russians have in service is at least 20 years old. Most are 30 years old or more.
>>56753655
>Bomber.
It has a fucking ACMI pod on the pylon. It is completely capable of Air to Air, it is a multi role aircraft.
F-111 (FIGHTER-111)
>arm chair commanders and professional flight simulator pilots discussing anything about military aircraft and combat
Yeah, nah, I'm not even going to go here.
Fuck you.
Fuck this.
Fuck that.
Saged, hidden.
I'm leaving.
This is not a good bye.
Some of you fags are insufferable.
>>56753380and Americans will believe this story of course
And American will believe this propaganda...Nip, did you miss the fact that he was a GERMAN? How the hell would it have been in the interests in the West to promote false propaganda about a GERMAN pilot??? Take your head out of your ass.
>>56752551
dont be mad, its not your fault that 99% of the control surfaces are handled by a computer. or the fact that you have a targeting computer which locks on to enemy signal, or the fact that you have a missile that seeks out the target once fired.
you really dont have to be taking any of this personally. i think what you do is difficult, just not as impossible as its made out to seem by the main stream media
>>56753655
>The Sukhoi Su-24 (NATO reporting name: Fencer) is a supersonic, all-weather bomber aircraft developed in the Soviet Union.
>all-weather bomber
>bomber
>it was being used to drop bombs on Al-Nusra and the Free Syrian Army
>gets shot down by a fighter
>>56751934
Because the Su-24 is made to drop bombs on groud targets not air combat, not to mention it's old. F-16 is old too but it's a multirole fighter.
>>56752551
Confirmed WSO
Because slavs once again have been overestimated thanks to their military propaganda machine that makes COD kids believe they could stage a actual military invasion of the US and Europe.
Just a few month ago Russia and it's trolls were boasting how Su-24's had some super secret electronic suite that could disable electronics on enemy vehicles and jam enemy missiles attacks, now it looks like the got shot of the sky by some turk f-16, not even american, with what looks like using any counter measures deployed against it, fucking embarrassing.
Considering the SU-24s are flying with Walmart quality GPS systems... I can understand why they went right into Turkey.
>>56753655
F111's are obsolete mate.
Now we have faggy super hornets
>>56753973
>Just a few month ago Russia and it's trolls were boasting how Su-24's had some super secret electronic suite that could disable electronics on enemy vehicles and jam enemy missiles attacks
They were talking about the Su-34, ignorant redneck.
Su-24 is Russia's cheap ground attack aircraft.
>>56753937
Well, given how Ergodan had been Saber rattling, this is the fault of the Russian command for not giving the bombers escorts. I'm sure they've changed this now, but they should have realized Ergodan has a record as a Salafist psychopath and would be looking for a chance to do this.Christ's sake, just look at how the savages acted during the "moment of silence" of the Paris attacks. I hope the Russians make him pay dearly.
Fuck russia. I'm glad the turks blew up that plane. Those fuckers regularly fly into our territory as well, glad somepne is finally standing up to those fuckers.
>>56753539
>This is not true. Computers don't make decisions.
>not knowing ANYTHING about autopilot or computer aided surface control
>sees shitskin flag whos country barely can fly a kite
What probably happened was the F-16s had their radar off and were guided by a ground radar to the target. They then shot a heatseeking missile which gives no warning.
So all the SU-24 sees on its radar warning receiver is the Turkish ground radar in search mode like every other day then bam, sidewinder out of nowhere. The only way to detect it is if you see the smoke trail.
>>56754161
This to be honest. They do this to us all the time.
>>56752098
Russia's airforce is mostly dogshit rusting soviet garbage. Old F-16s are more than enough to take down everything they have except maybe SU-35s. But they only have 35 of those, and of those 35 only half are working at any given time.
The SU-24 does have counter measures, but they don't work vs modern made US missiles.
Also, the average Turkish fighter pilot has double the number of flight hours and sorties as the current average Russian pilot. Over the last decade, the Russian Air Force really suffered in training due to their lagging economy and military cuts. It's only recently they have begun to reinvest in their military, and it's going to take them time to catch up again.
>>56754027
The ones used in Syria are the Su-24M2. Already equipped with GLONASS.
>Next modernization of Su-24M introduced in 2000 with the “Sukhoi” program and in 1999 with the “Gefest” program. The modernized planes are equipped with new equipment and systems. As a result, they get new capabilities and improved combat efficiency, including new navigation system (SVP-24), new weapons control system, new HUD (ILS-31, like in Su-27SM or KAI-24) and expanding list of usable munitions (Kh-31A/P, Kh-59MK, KAB-500S). The last batch of the Sukhoi was delivered to the Russian VVS in 2009.[38] Modernization continues with the program “Gefest”. All frontline bombers Su-24 in the Central Military District received new sighting and navigation systems SVP-24 in 2013.[39]
These Su-24s from using 70's tech would only be used in extreme situations.
>>56754081
stop being an idiot you fucking monkey.
go look up the black sea incident they claimed happened, it was a su-24.
>>56752244
> dogfighting
IT'S 2015 PEOPLE!!!
BVR
V
R
>>56754161
>being a swede
>condemning foreigners that fly into your territory but embracing them when they walk into it.
>true kek was had, mohammad
If Russia attacks Turkey, we are then at war with Russia, correct?
>>56754445
>IT IS THE _______ YEAR!
>>56754486
Russia already said they won't. If Russia fires at a Turkish jet while it's in Syrian airspace, we don't give a fuck. Only if they go into Turkish airspace and fire at them there.
>>56753380
>>and Americans will believe this story of course
No wonder propaganda is so effective in there
Waiting for answer, Nip. Why the hell would it be in american interests to promote the exploits of a GERMAN pilot if they were not true? If anything, the man's life has been UNDER-publicized bc he was a German. After al he did in his military career (described above), went on to write a successful book and is the reason we have the A-10 Warthog today. He helped the designers figure out how to put a slow aircraft with amazing protection for the pilot (called "the bathtub") that could get as much fire on target as possible and made it a true "tank-killer," responsible for more tactical damage than any other aircraft in both Iraq wars. Hans-Ulrich Rudolph was a genius. that is not debatable.
>>56754370
There hasn't been a single picture of video of SU-24M2s flying in Syria, they are all SU-24Ms.
I don't believe Putin would risk using expensive war materials on shitskins.
>>56751934
Hello Pierre.
ahaha russians are faggots
>>56754646
Is this implying that I'm French? If you're going to troll, at least have a clear aim and do it cleverly rather than just shitposts you walking abortion.
>>56754632
He is using the absolute minimum for bombing kebabs. Why would you use expensive planes when old junk does the exact same job just as good? They barely have any AA.
>>56754632
Yeah there is a very good chance this SU-24 had a non functional radio/GPS system.
>>56754602
You can't read! .. The Germans did the propaganda.. Fucking Nigger.
>>56754476
What do you know - it's not like anybody wants to immigrate onto an island full outcasts, murders and rapists
>>56753539
>>What is radar
>What is shitty radar
Radar isn't fucking magic, and I'm betting the radar suite on this su24 was old as fuck.
>>56751934
Russian pilot was flying drunk, as all of them do.
>>56754709
>ahaha russians are faggots
You, Turkscum, dob't quite seem to "get" that Russians aren't bound by the same PC handcuffs the Jews put on us in the West. They'll have no problem cutting off your heads, raping your women in front of you, and then using your mongrel children for target practice. Keep in mind, when the Russians catch "pirates," they handcuff them to their ship and then use it for target practice. You're going to find out very soon you're not dealing with westerners who have castrated by Jewish political correctness. The Russians will fight you scum just as barbarically as you scum fight.
>>56754709
:)
>>56753254
dont all these jets have proximity sensors and radars to detect incoming missiles? the turkish jet must've been damn close to not give them a little room to try and maneuver
>>56751934
>how did a fighter shoot down a bomber
It's a fucking mystery OP
>>56751934
Because the pilot thought he wasn't at war with the Turks.
>>56752551
>t.
Back to Krautchan with you, faggot
>>56754954
>You can't read! .. The Germans did the propaganda.. Fucking Nigger.
LMAO, we have a REAL genius here! Yes, bc wikipedia is KNOWN for reprinting "Nazi Propaganda." And the fact that Rudolg was integral to designing the A-10 warthog? More "Nazi propaganda." Talk about a fucking braindead kike. You take the cake. Shame it wasn't you stuffed into the ocean rather than the cake, but you take it nonetheless...
>>56754486
Holy shit you're stupid.
>>56755099>
>how did a fighter shoot down a bomber
It's a fucking mystery OP
I defer to your deep expertise. Since your mongrel people have a massive civil war every ~20 years or so that requires all types of foreign aircraft flying over your shithole country, I'm sure you are quite well-versed in this subject.
Gotta love how WW3 will be shot in HD.
>>56755099
>It's a fucking mystery OP
In the civilized world where people dob't still draw their way from a fucking well, believe it not we aren't accustomed to fighters/bombers flying above our homes bc we can't keep from fucking filling mass graves with our neighbors every few years.
>>56755465
It looks awesome because it looks all shitty and rusty
>>56755016
Russia should start giving their pilots meth, just like the US air force does.
>>56754222
That's true In any way looks like it was snek attack from behind.
>>56755465
Beaner, when will Mexico be sending it's carriers out to project power into this conflict? If Mexico did have warships, it would be the only case of the NATIVES having to worry about having their pockets picketed rather than the other way around.
>>56755444
Are You Fucking kidding me mate!? How?
>>56755456
As you should, without going into the technical details the fighter fired a rocker and it hit the bomber in the tail
>>56755703
Because they are being used unlike your orange F-16s.
Platypus time.
>>56751934
>why the hell is the US spending almost a trillion dollars on f-22s and f-35s when it appears the f-16 works just fine, other than to put money in the pockets of the Jews who own these military-industrial companies?
you literally answered your own question dumbfuck.
>>56753158
thats the biggest bullshit ive read all year.
>>56755038
Intelligent American ? I'm shocked .. Any way Keep It this way.
>>56755741
Fucking how!? He didn't notice the missile lock and the loud flashing red lights and alarms!? Remember at the beginning of top gun, the Russians had that pilot in missile lock and that American pilot was fucking freaking out even though they weren't gonna fire at him.
>>56755805
Jokes on you, I'm too white to be a bean. LOOK AT ME WITH GOOFY BACK IN 1993.
Shitposting aside, never. We don't have enough nachos to fuel our skiffs all the way across the atlantic.
>>56755741
that would make sense. Imagine the poor bastard, after going through that, slowly descending to the ground as "Turkmen" shoot at him, a target suspended in midair? Like Dr. Scheuer kept saying, it's time to hit their damns, cell phone towers, and electric power plants. Put them in dark, take away their internet and leave them with no water to drink. And for Obongo to not immediately camden Turkey...I used to think it was just a meme, but starting to believe the fucker really is a muslim.
Know how many hundreds of millions his quaint visit to his homeland of Kenya cost, bc they had to have 8-10 helicopters in the air at a time with Delta Force snipers? Even Dr. Scheuer supports trump. I've decided to actively support him. Everyone I respect, from Dr. Scheuer to Dr. Macdonald, now say Trump is our last hope. He has my support..
>>56756049
That was radar lock. If you launch a missile from up close and have it rely only on infrared homing without lighting him up with your radar, there is no way for the guy to tell he is about to get roasted.
>>56751934
They got it with AIM-9X
Look what that thing is capable of:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4g4_jzqBJnA
It could be Su-30 instead of Su-24 and it wouldn't change shit.
This is why people say that days of dogfighting are over.
>>56755860
That colour makes me moist fampai
>>56756212
Actually, the really modern planes like Rafale or Typhoon do have warning systems against heat seekers.
But Su-24 sure as hell is no Rafale.
>>56756212
But that would still mean they basically let the Turks getting a shooting solution on them in the first place. Why would they Fucking do that!?
>>56756285
So this missile is the equivalent of Katyn massacre, inevitable.
>>56755851
Yeah dickbag, got that part. But the bigger issue is that for a month now--not sure if you get this kinda news bc your internet probably only works when the power is on once a month, and when it isn't on you have to wait for Petar the Donkey Jockey to drive his donkey over the hills to get you the news. This threat has been there since Russia got involved, so it comes as a chock that Russia would send a bomber up anywhere near Turk airspace without any sort of defense mechanisms to prevent this kind of thing, whether by throwing up flak or by radar jamming, etc.. In any event, with the S-400 on the group in turkey now, it's a pretty safe pe they won't pull it again, put have to feel for the guy. Horrible way to die, floating down to earth with no way to find cover as these sand niggers basically use you for target practice.
>>56755851
>looks at pic
Mig 21 is based
>radar is basically fueled by vodka and it's shit
But hey it can carry a nuke and around it's time it was good and fast
>>56756504
Most people they won't be sucker punched.
>>56756285
>This is why people say that days of dogfighting are over.
Pretty sure the same people said the same thing during Veitnam
>>56751934
Attacking undefended bombers is a chicken shoot. I've read interviews with WW2 pilots where they felt it was little better than murder, but you do it anyway because it's war.
>>56756117
Oh, I believe you probably are White. Having visited Mexico and known some wealthy ones, they are as White as I am and hare the native mestizos so much they import negroes from the Caribbean to work as their servants and in their country clubs. The top ~5% of Mexican society is almost entirely White, with about 1/5th of those being jews. And fucking america is stupid enough to take in all your trash that send you send us as your elites laugh at us the whole time, which is why we NEED Trump and the wall.
>>56756504
>Be rtb from fighting rag heads
>Has to search for a f16 beyond visual range
Whut?
>>56751934
Russian technology is absolute garbage and hasn't been relevant since the 80s. Leave it to video games and the internet to make 'muh mudder Russia XD' a maymay and mislead people about their "technology" (death traps).
>>56756607
>This threat has been there since Russia got involved
A friendly nation shooting down one of your airplanes?
No that's quite new
>>56756285
Yeah, more I'm reading about it, you have a point. The really shameful part is the US both sold the Turk scum this plane and also TRAINED the fuckers in how to use it. the cold war is OVER--- we need these Turk fuckers OUT of NATO!
>>56756717
Vietnam was half a century ago.
Planes no longer use guns against each other. Only gun kills in the last 25 years were A-10 shooting down helicopters.
Even in Ethiopia-Eritrea war all kills were missile kills.
Thrust vectoring exists to evade missiles better. Not to dogfight like some people think.
CUM HISTORIA
>>56755860
>that sleek profile
unf
>>56756430
Wonder how they do that considering heat seeking is passive. Detect missiles by radar?
>>56756504
Turkey was a friendly country, why not let them close? And here's a couple of versions:
-Turks didn't actually warn them/they didn't hear the warnings/were on a different freq/whatever.
-They didn't know/think they were crossing any borders or they didn't actually cross any.
-They let themselves get shot as arranged by Putin and Erdogan.
-They thought the Turks were approaching for escort which would be the reaction of any sane country - see US and Russian encroachment planes pilots becoming friends and actually knowing each others on a face-to-face basis.
Make of it what you will.
>>56757165
JEWISH PHYSICS
>>56751934
>point in the general direction of the Russian shitbox
>"missile away" in Turkish
>Yavnik and Gopzkak forget to dump the flares
>plane is killed
>>56757062
> A friendly nation shooting down one of your airplanes?
Would you like me to find you links? The turks had been bitching since Russia got involved that they were "violating their airspace." I specifically recall the whole thing bc the site antiwar.com did a big thing on how it could lead to WW 3. So, let's go find the article to show the Croatian who is about a month behind in thenews that this has been an issue since the Russians came into the whole thing.
>>56757442
Turks are mad because Russia is killing their terrorists who bring cheap oil.
The only way to be free from ISIS is to destroy Turkey and Saudi Arabia.
>>56752098
this
the f-16 is also an amazing legacy fighter, considerably more modern too
>>56757062
>A friendly nation shooting down one of your >airplanes? No that's quite new
Here you go, friend. Oct.. 6th from the Guardian. Turkey "cannot endure" Russian violations of their airspace: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/oct/06/nato-chief-jens-stoltenberg-russia-turkish-airspace-violations-syria
The pilots probably just sucked.
>>56757165
This Polskie knows his shit
Dogfights more or less don't exist anymore, it's all cache drops and recon now
>>56753826
The F-117 was given the F designation too. Often countries will do shit like that to confuse enemies as to the purpose of a secret aircraft. So when the Ruskies first heard of the F-117 they would assume a fighter and prepare to counter such a fighter instead of planning to counter a bomber.
>>56757618
Your point?
Of course Turkey is going to protest if it's airspace is violated, nobody expected them to shoot down a plane because it spent 17 seconds in their airspace
>>56757347
You can detect them with things like SPECTRA. Just google it.
>>56757062
>No that's quite new
Now that you've been shown beyond any doubt not to have any clue what you're talking about, you'll leave the thread. But next time, remember, you're not as clever as you seem to think. As your punishment, repeat 10 times: "I am not clever. I will learn fro my betters."
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/oct/06/nato-chief-jens-stoltenberg-russia-turkish-airspace-violations-syria
>>56757848
You seem extremely butmad and are posting like a retard, constantly doubling your replies, you Serb diaspora or something?
>>56751934
Turkey's a NATO country, and has the second largest military in NATO. It has most of the nice American toys like very precise a2a missiles. Fire and forget missiles mean turk stupidity is largely mitigated. They also had 2 F-16s attacking the SU-24
SU-24s are also not designed for a2a combat, and long range a2a combat in general these days is whoever locks first.
>>56757589
It does not really matter. Modern missiles are devastating. Without electronic warfare protection you are just waiting to get blown up.
>>56757773
LMAO, nothing worse that an asshole revealed to BE an asshole STILL not accepting that he's been shown to be wrong. Knowing Ergodan, what exactly do you take "CANNOT ENDURE RUSSIAN VIOLATIONS.." to mean? Whether the russians were in "their" airspace or not, who knows. We all know that the Turks have their own agenda in that region as far as the Kurds, cleaning out the scum from their nation and sending them to Europe, trying to blackmail their way into the EU, etc... And ANYONE acts surprised that the Turks actually shot down a Russian aircraft, knowing they could then hide behind their NATO membership that they should be stripped of?
>>56758003
What about putting more armor on the planes?
>>56757848
Turkbabs prefer to down a Russian jet instead of cooperating in border operations.
Turkbabs prefer to make an enemy out of Russia instead securing the border regions from terrorists.
This is what it boils down to. You can't avoid flying into somebody elses airspace once in a while during such missions. Turks are just total assholes.
>>56757940
No, I just despise Croat scum acting like they know more than they do, and then when they are proven to be unequivocally wrong, rather than simply admit as much, they STILL try to weasel their way out like a Jew and STILL insist that they are right.
>>56758001
>Turkey's a NATO country, and has the second largest military in NATO.
An army is only as good as its soldiers. Turks are ROTE idiot robots just like arabs. It doesn't mean much.
>>56751934
Because the F16 is superior to the su-24.
>>56754486
If russia fires into Turkey, yes, if Russia shoots down a Turkish jet in Syrian Airspace? No.
We're only obligated by NATO's charter if Turkey is attacked while defending herself.
>>56758100
Completely pointless. You can't put enough without turning it into a brick.
Much better to reduce RCS and heat signature and install things like Khibiny or SPECTRA.
But even then all the enemy need to do is launch 3-4 missiles in a sequence and you are fucked.
Modern fighters can easily carry 12 missiles.
>>56758326
>We're only obligated by NATO's charter if Turkey is attacked while defending herself.
Even then, I highly doubt NATO would do anything relevant.
>>56758108
Well, all very good points. The SECOND LARGEST military in Nato, and yet they refuse to do a fucking thing about ISIS despite them being right at their border. Instead, they help expedite shipping the scum to Europe and try to blackmail their way into the EU. May be an American, but anyone who has roots in a particular Euro nation will agree with me...there's something almost biological where one just feels truly "at home" when he is in the environment where his ancestors evolved for tens of thousands of years. I would never have joined the military to fight for Israel in the mideast, but would def. join the military (event the French Foreign legion) if I knew I'd be used to push the kebabs out of France.
>mfw
>>56751934
Step A: Target SU-24 in Syrian territory with a heat seeker from 15 kilometers away low at its 6 o'clock..
Step B: Pull trigger.
Step C: Watch it go down.
Step D: Watch pilots safely eject.
Step E: Shoot pilots with automatic weapons as they descend while shouting "Aloha Snackbar."
Step F: Be shitskin Mudslime.
Rinse and repeat.
>>56758415
Nobody likes Turks. We only tolerate them in NATO because they have a crazy important strategic position.
And everybody knows they do shit about ISIS because fuckers are killing Kurds for them.
>>56758227
>fire and forget missiles mean turk stupidity is largely mitigated
>>56758173
>>56758075
The fuck is your major malfunction? You made the thread asking "How did a turk f-16 shoot down an su-24" and as dozens of people have pointed out the SU-24 is a bomber, so on that front you showcased your stupidity.
Then you tried to move the goalposts.
Yes Turkey already issued protest because the Russian planes, that are conducting the bombing runs, tend to sometimes slip into their airspace for short periods of time. But Russia and Turkey were friendly countries and normally when an airplane violates your airspace you escort it out, you don't shoot it down after 10 seconds. On top of it all America and the EU have mellowed out in regards to Russia after the Paris attacks, with France directly assisting the bombing runs.
So what the fuck is your problem?
>>56757773
If its airspace is violated while Russia is removing terrorists in Syria, why would Turkey complain?
Oh wait, Turkey is supporting terrorists in Syria.
Yeah....
>>56757347
Perhaps this was part of the plan all along. Russia gets super mad about this plane shooting, which has the effect of forcing Turkey not to shoot down Syrian planes, because of their inability to distinguish between Syrian and Russian aircraft.
It's essentially destroying and reversing Turkey's prospects of a no fly zone, and turning it into a no Turkey zone.
>>56758421
>takes 2 f-16s and the entire country's combined radar to backstab a shitty 60s bomber
>turks still proud
Su-24 is a ground attack aircraft
Is not state of the art Stealth fighter
Is similar to f-111
>>56758415
>they refuse to do a fucking thing about ISIS
They even refuse to do something about people supplying terrorist factions using the Turkish/Syrian border. Sure they snatch up some dumb fuck now and then, but nothing concrete. They silently allow it.
It's the reason why Russia is bombing border targets in the first place.
>>56758421
Turk, ever read the Washington Irving short story that describes the moment when Queen Isabella had the cross raised upon the last mudslide holdout hideout in Spain? IT was done just as the sun was nearing it's high point in the sky, and the people cheered and cried out to the virigin Mary in thanks for the victory. Get ready bc soon we'll be raised the cross over Hagia Sophia again after we have it reconsecrated by the archbishop of Constantinople. MANY of us are ready to do whatever must be done to achieve this. You turk scum are only good at fighting when you have a knife and your enemy is without a weapon. We WILL reclaim Hagia Sophia, and scrape off all the muslim lettering shit to reveal the fresco paintings...Deus Vult!
>>56753539
>not believing the f-35 is shit
USairforcefag here and i can tell you the ranking over all is
1.F-22
2.F-15
3.F-16
20. F-35
http://thediplomat.com/2015/07/f-35-loses-dogfight-to-fighter-jet-from-the-1980s/
its just not ready to be what it has claimed it to be
>>56757784
That is quite cool. Basically an infrared sensor, a heat seeker of your own.
>>56755939
Apparently those are official luftwaffe figures, he was a stuka pilot, still holds the world record for number of combat missions flown.
He was shot down/forced to land 32 times lel
>>56758537
Then why have an army when you can just load up with missiles?
>>56758540
douchebag, the only one with the problem here is YOU, as you sit and quote from "full metal jacket" and pretending you know about actual military matters. Even given its role as a bomber, with all the prior warnings issued by the turks (as YOU were shown), it's hard to believe the Russians had no counter measures in place. Now be careful about posting too much bc your internet dialup connection might run out of credits.
>>56758741
tl;dr
>>56758684
stay kuk
>>56758409
We actually have to, or if we're proven to bow out of our military treaties even when there's no legalese way to justify it, we lose all credibility, all our allies lose faith in us, NATO falls apart, and we probably economically collapse because the dollar is basically only valuable because people believe it is.
If we do nothing, we're finished, if we do something? well, it can escalate to us both being finished but it can also de-escalate before any use of nuclear weapons.
>>56757165
There haven't been many dogfights with lots of participants who had parity with one another since the Vietnam war.
If things got hot in Syria it would be so easy to commit fratricide that pilots would have to get within BVR to verify targets.
Once there you have a chance for gun kills.
I don't think guns are obsolete yet.
After half a dozen turns with one another jets are well within gun kill scope.
>>56758741
Deus vult brother.
>>56758776
Lockheed promised 9G agility and 50 degree AOA. So far it's limited to 6G and 20 degrees.
It'll probably never be a good dogfighter or interceptor.
But it's going to be a great bomb truck and with low RCS it's going to be good at BVR while AIM-9X makes it passable for WVR.
And F-35B is superior to Harriers it's replacing in everything. Far superior.
>>56758908
>>56758891
Good question
>>56758908
Haha I like you, rock on turkey, fuck them russkies up
>>56755939
>thats the biggest bullshit ive read all year.
LMAO, I missed this one. you fucking retard. Those ARE his official numbers, recognized by ALL SIDES. He is recognized by ALL as the most decorated, most prolific of the war. IF his record were "Nazi propaganda," do you really think wikipedia would be publishing it? Jesus christ, no matter how many assholes I meet in /pol/, there's always one to fucking top it...
Look him up, jerk off: Hans Ulrich Rudolf. another fun fact is that during his burial, the German Airfare secretly diverted a few planes to do a flyover, but covered their ass by claiming it was a "routine exercise." :)
>>56758409
We have to. Otherwise NATO will be worthless.
And USA won't let it's pet alliance to fall apart.
Not like it matters. Russia can't invade Turkey.
>>56758905
Thats what doesn't make sense.
If the Su-24 knew they where about to be attacked, why no evasive action? Why not deploy flares/chaffs?
Surely they would notice if they are locked on by a targeting radar? Sure IR missile is probably the culprit here but still.
If the Russians picked up the multiple warnings from Turkey they would have taken some kind of evasive action.
Even looking at the Turkish radar maps they released it seems the aircraft kept to its course until it went down.
Not saying the turks didn't send any message it is possible they did, but the russians for whatever reason doesn't seem to have registered it.
>>56758669
>inability to distinguish between Syrian and Russian aircraft
Unwillingness you mean. Because there was a direct phone line set up from day one between our respective MODs so it was a matter of
ring-ring
>yes, this is Ivan
We're about to shoot a plane here, is it one of yours
>where?
X lat, Y long, Z alt, N heading
>hold on
>yeah, shit it's one of ours, just let us divert the moron lest he flies any deeper into Turkey
OR
>nope, not one of ours, fuck him up
But not a single ring-ring was heard, ever.
>>56759287
>Not like it matters. Russia can't invade Turkey.
They bait them into coming into Syria though. Which is nice because kebab will totally fall for such things.
>>56759067
but we dont need (or want i guess) another bomb truck or harrier, what we ordered was exactly ehat you just said it will never be good at, a dogfighter and interceptor, which means it is a failure
Did you guys what hysteria is now in the Russian media about this attack aircraft was shot down ...
>>56759368
Su-24 has a 6G limit. AIM-9X can pull 50G maneuvers. I'm not even sure if Su-24 have IR warning system.
There was nothing they could do.
>>56759456
Enlighten us
>>56759109
Okay fuck obama but i really like this picture
>>56756924
>Russian technology is absolute garbage
And that's why muh technological patriot cannot destroy single Scarab A missle/
Also
>dat t-34 picture
>implying burgers can into tanks
Should I post Sherman or Abrams, burning after single 70th ATGM?
>>56759409
Everybody except Lockheed defense force knows that.
But they keep saying that WVR is no longer important. Which is complete bullshit and they know that. This is why they are quickly developing that new mini missile. F-35 will be able to carry 32 of them and fire in swarms.
But NATO has 200 F-22's, 500 Typhoons and 200 Rafales. We will do fine in A2A anyways.
>>56756504
Would you expect a neutral country to fry you without warning? I wouldn't.
>>56758976
Guns are extremely obsolete. Comparing an AIM-9X or AIM-120D to an AIM-4 or first gen AIM-9 is like comparing a daniel defense AR-15 to a musket with how much missiles tech has advanced so quickly. Missile tech has advanced incredibly quickly because it's basically been based off computational power, which has been advanced exponentially. Modern missiles are fucking scary. The best you can do against an AIM-120D is to do a split-S and full burner away from it. Best you can do against an AIM-9X is pop off so many flares that it blinds the seeker. Previous flares have zero effect on it.
>>56758001
source?
>>56759512
>AIM-9X
Im not sure about the IR warning on Su-24s in Syria either.
But doesn't it smell fishy to you that we are supposed to believe the russian crew got the warnings. Then simply ignored all warnings and went along their planned route at cruising altitude and heading when they have a fighter jet behind them threatening to fire?
Id expect any aircrew in the world to at least have some sense of wanting to survive.
>>56759553
It is unlikely that you will be able to see the Russian television broadcast.
But yesterday, most of the time in the news releases of federal channels was devoted to this incident. And of course the newspapers, too, did not escape the attention downed aircraft.
>>56759008
Deus Vult. If you have time, here's a great book by Washington Irving who went to stay in Spain for a summer. My favorite short story is on where he imagines the final surrender of the Moors to Queen Isabella. It's so vivid and coveys such a sense of triumphalism, will almost bring you to tears: http://www.online-literature.com/irving/3677/
>>56759730
US and Russia need to meet up for a small scale conventional war in siberia, just to settle all the bants for a few years
>>56759880
I don't watch national news on TV. It's mostly anti-Russian lies anyway.
desu senpai
>>56751934
It's a lot easier to shoot down an aircraft when the pilots aren't on alert. The Russians had no reason to believe they would be targeted.
>>56756285
I actually find it kind of interesting that these air to air missiles don't have that much explosive power. LIke, they're specifically designed to cripple the aircraft and shoot it down, but not blow it up entirely or kill the pilots on impact, but rather damage the aircraft so that it can't fly and the pilots have to eject, giving them a chance (unless savages shoot them screaming Allah Snackbar)
Is it just seen that crippling the aircraft is the priority and the pilot is effectively harmless without his Jet and ordinance so it's neutralized without having to kill? Or is it just a limitation of the air to air missiles needing to be small, light, and fast?
>>56759887
Thanks, I'll read it.
>>56759967
>>56759880
Link to watching Russia 1 news shows.
tv-novosti.ru/segodnya/rossiya
>>56759730
Let's be fair. Russian tech was garbage for over a decade.
It got better now but it's still quite a bit behind the west.
>>56759368
>If the Su-24 knew they where about to be attacked, why no evasive action? Why not deploy flares/chaffs?
Thank you, this is what doesn't make sense to me. It it were done in coordination with ground radar, then it's much more believable for me. The fact is that Russians MUST have had intelligence that the Turks were looking to pull something like this. If it was in the Guardian, you can bet the FSB knew.
>>56758227
turkish military strength rely on its warmongering people
country's stability (erdogan has been there for years and will be so)
military exercises with nato countries
officer quality
always ready attitude
and it's big budget on military (also gotta thank usa for some of this)
turkic stronk, prepare your anus.
>>56759368
I'd say they probably didn't even get any RWR spikes. F-16 was guided by ground crew and at 10 aprox. 10 miles (obviously fucking varies at different things) you can make visual ID and lock, the missile, since it is IR AIM9 the pilot has no warning. Spoofing IR missiles is incredibly easy if you see them. Spotting them is the issue.
Now if we take into consideration that the F-16 did indeed maintain radar lock on the Su-24, it would still be just a spike on its RWR. No missile launch warning was issued due to the IR sensor of the missile.
>If the Russians picked up the multiple warnings from Turkey they would have taken some kind of evasive action.
The fact that the Su24 was extending when the splash occured away from turkish border/jet speaks volumes I believe.
It is like shooting someone who is running from you in the back.
Here have a Flanker
>>56760066
I'm pretty sure those were just practice models without full warhead.
>>56760150
mah nigga
i like dat
>>56759967
See the propaganda of the Russian military actions in Syria, too tiring. In fact, most Russians do not care whether or not the aircraft was shot down. The main thing to pay wages on time and enough money to live on.
Jets are regularly scrambled a few miles from my house in the north of Scotland to intercept pesky Russians dancing too close to UK airspace. Why the fuck do they do this all the time? I realize it doesn't have the real element of danger when they do it, but is this all it is? Just fucking about to test response times and shit? That's a fucking expensive way to pass the time.
>>56759512
If they knew about the launch, they had a chance of trashing the missile. I'm very sure they had no idea.
>>56760274
well I mean even in real dogfighting combat situations where jets are hit by SAM's or Air to Air missiles, it's always talked about that the pilot survived the impact, but had to eject, it's never "the pilot was blown up" it's always "the pilot was shot down", and either rescued or captured, if he's killed it's through some act after ejecting.
Btw if you guys saw the interview with the surviving pilot, anyone else notice he is literally holding a piece of paper and reading from it?
>>56754278
>yellow 4's plane is that .5 plane
top lel
>>56759967
go take care of wooden shoes and i need some cheese nigger
wörk wörk or we will steamroll you like Blitzkrieg
ITT: armchair military scientists
>>56760547
gibs fahrad zuruck wurst nigger
>>56760079
>Let's be fair. Russian tech was garbage for over a decade.
Of course, any technology is garbage in comprasion with horses, now, you can return to suck anoth black dick.
Also, this garbage launch Poland into space.
>>56760449
Well there is a difference here. this was supposedly over Turkish airspace. The UK usually intercepts Russian aircraft when they enter Britains exclusive economic zone. Which is 200 nautical miles out. And frankly the russians are legally allowed to fly there.
>>56759767
WVR will always be important, as long as terrain plays role in the conflict. It's really easy to get into WVR combat when maneouvering in mountains.
>>56760481
Flares don't really work against latest missiles and with Su-24 you won't outrun nor evade a missile of this class.
>>56760150
>Turkish military strength rely on its warmongering people
Nigger, please. The only thing you bastards excel at is cutting the throats of prisoners who have their hands tied behind their backs. You haven't fought ANY sort of serious conflict in a century. All you bastards do is chase poor Greeks (REAL Greeks) out of the city than has been their homeland for the the last 1,700 years. Do you REALLY think you fuckers would have a chance against Americans, who have been at war for 15 straight years? OR the Russians, who have been dealing with Cheche scum for even longer? You bastards would get OWNED. And your asses are on the way out of NATO (no longer needed nor wanted) and then russia will REALLY fuck you up. Russia from the East, the new Holy Roman Empire from the West, this time including the US? Deus Vult. Hagia Sophia WILL be reconsecrated and all that hideous Arabic writing removed and our frescos carefully restored.
>>56755444
but turkey is a NATO member
>>56760715
Woh woh woh
>1 700 years
Not even that much. First incursions is 11th century
>>56760727
>but turkey is a NATO member
Russia attacks Turkey. Turkey cries in arms of NATO.
NATO solely exists out of US and Turkey. Problem solved.
>>56760727
NATO is a defensive alliance. You aren't obliged to go to war if another member attacks a third party.
Or that is my understanding.
>>56760621
u will not believe it by they are building so many bicycle streets right now
its a fuckin mess and i hate it
but i think also they are making streets larger so tanks will fit again
>>56760684
Yeah man, I realize that. I'm just curious about why they do it again and again (both parties). It just seems like unnecessary use of time and money.
>>56760715
This triggers the kebab
>>56759767
i agree 100% polbro
do you know so much just from personal research? or do you work with aircraft?
>>56760498
Many pilots are killed upon missile impact.
The video you replied to here >>56760066 was a vid of missiles without warheads. They do missiles without warheads because if it misses, they can reuse the drone. It is also cheaper to shoot a missile without the warhead. It also shows how much more deadly the AIM-9X would be if it doesn't need that good of guidance but just something in proximity since that video is with high tech decoys being use. Modern jets are fucked against highly maneuverable off-bore missiles.
>>56760715
It is ridiculous. Russian politicians will not destroy their business with Turkey. No war will not. They are too greedy for that. I just think that most Westerners unfamiliar with the term "small victorious war". Browse the Russian-Japanese war. The war that would distract people from the real problems such as corruption.
>>56760498
Well, this is not hard to figure out. Pilots survive even in "real" dogfights because the missiles are heatseeking and thus lock onto the engines. Given the speeds at which the plane is moving, not hard to really figure out that the engines are taken out. It's in the opposing sides interest to try to get as much of the plane as possible to survive so as much of the avionics as possible remain to be analyzed and to attempt reverse engineering.
>>56760715
kek
u forgot 1920 when they fucked westerners asses
>>56760715
sshhhh, together we'll be great again.
>>56760342
>implying your not turk shit diaspora in germany
Hilter would have gassed you gypsy
>>56751934
TURK PRESS BUTAN
WHITE ENGINEERING TAKES OVER
>>56760902
Testing response times.
Back in the day it wasn't uncommon to find Soviet embassy staff with stopwatches waiting at airbases in Sweden already when the Soviet aircrafts took off.
They time and see how fast things happen, among other things.
Its also good practice for crews and demonstrates military capability
>>56760700
I'm gonna need source on that.
>>56760814
You have no clue what you're talking about. Constantine made that city the capital of the Roman empire in 330AD. IT had been a Greek city even before then. Greek Christians kept a moderately substantial presence there until the pogrom of 1951 by the Turks.
>>56760700
I mean Its not that I dont believe you, but if you have some stats I would welcome them
>>56760274
During the NATO aggression on SRY, one of our planes was struck by two missiles and the pilot managed to land the aircraft.
Did it survive? Yes.
Was the aircraft able to continue the fight? No.
Was it used in further action? No.
No need to KABOOM enemy aircraft if you can render them useless with a much cheaper, and lighter missile.
>>56761009
>In December 1997, Erdoğan recited a poem in Siirt from a work written by Ziya Gökalp, a pan-Turkish activist of the early 20th century.[46] His recitation included verses translated as "The mosques are our barracks, the domes our helmets, the minarets our bayonets and the faithful our soldiers...."[32] which are not in the original version of the poem. Erdoğan said the poem had been approved by the education ministry to be published in textbooks.[47] Under article 312/2 of the Turkish penal code his recitation was regarded as an incitement to violence and religious or racial hatred.[5] He was given a ten-month prison sentence of which he served four months, from 24 March 1999 to 27 July 1999.[48] Due to his conviction, Erdoğan was forced to give up his mayoral position. The conviction also stipulated a political ban, which prevented him from participating in parliamentary elections.
fuck off kebab, you're leader is a jihadi, and probably so are you
>>56760987
>missiles are heatseeking and thus lock onto the engines
This hasn't been true for decades. I've said it in other threads and I will say it again, it disappoints me how much /pol/ doesn't know about military hardware. Fucking retards. Modern seekers lock onto shapes, not heat blobs. That's why modern flares are designed to blind IR missiles, not distract them.
>>56760986
From What I understand, the Turks are fucking the Russians out of oil money by getting oil on the cheap from ISIS that they SHOULD be buying from Russia. I see no reason why Russia has any reason to retain even semi-cordial relations with Turkey.
>>56761133
And Rome became basically a Greek empire with Emperor Herclius in the Early 600-eds. Both Rome and Greece are considered Hellenetic no?
The Turkic people only started coming into Anatolia in the 11th century. While basically turking their way with the Greeks who lived there.
Turks should be glassed or sent back to the plains of central asia from whence they came.
>>56761010
there is no Hitler anymore so pls
turks in germany are way conservative than turks in turkey
they came 1960/70 and Industry needed them so they had to stay most of them here comin from Eastern turkey, my granddad was born near to armenia, his father in georgia
Patriot turks and germans are kinda same: backwards conservative and don't want changes in their lives but it will happen
>>56761009
thank you based putin
purge the heretics from constantinople and restore the orthodoxy
>>56761185
said canadian, whose president is literally son of a whore.
10/10 i'd prefer an islamist or extreme christian or extreme jew over son of a whore.
>>56761382
Heraclius, obviously. Sorry shitty keyboard.
>>56753254
An ASRAAM isn't travelling hundreds of kms dickhead. More like 50km.
Also it's an IR missile so you're saying they fired an IR missile or maybe an IR missile.
Also unless the Su-24 had a MAWS droplet doppler fitted (I suspect not) then it wouldn't have known it was even coming.
>>56751934
How did a multi role fighter take down a bomber?
Next thread, folks
>>56761133
constantinopel will be Muslim again, not under taghut erdogan regime
>>56761182
Most missiles work by exploding near the plane, not hitting it. Especially the long range ones with lower maneuverability.
AIM-9X actually hits the plane. With a 9.5kg warhead. It won't make you explode like in games. It shreds you like a shotgun.
>>56760999
LMAO, you mean "Galepoli?" Where Churchill got drunk and sent hundreds of thousands of men needlessly to their death bc he had NO CLUE that the topography there was absolutely impenetrable and that the position could literally have been held by men shooting bows and arrows? I always get a laugh out of how Aussies/Kiwis celebrate ANZAC day, like it was some great heroic....yes, the men were brave, but Churchill just pissed their lives away by insisting (against all advice) on an attack where the geography made a frontal assault from the sea literally impossible. It's often said, Churchill was made into the "great man" he was by hitler. Were it not for Hitler, Churchill would have been remembered as a buffoon who got lot of men killed.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2uh4yMAx2UA
to all nerds who say fighter pilots don't do anything, watch this.
>>56761260
I am a simple man in the street and tell what I see. Pile of Russian for 20 years used to travel to Turkey to rest. Between Turkey and Russia is building a gas pipeline (as against Gazprom in Russia is difficult to do something), between Turkey and Russia is large enough turnover. And Turkey is NATO. War will not.There may be several acts of terrorism and sabotage.
Russia has a few modern pieces of equipment that aren't that inferior to NATO... and lots of shit-tier equipment.
>>56761429
I'd take a tranny who's been blacked over a jihadi any day
>>56761429
this
>>56761168
Recent tests show that flares have about 5% chance of seducing modern seekers.
>>56755097
Most modern fighter/strike aircraft will have a MAWS system often integrated as part of a ESM/ECM suite.
>>56761520
BTW, did you know that the Shitskins, fighting in much better positions, on their homeland, probably lost more, or at least the same amount of soldiers?
>>56761429
you seem mad enough to kill there, turkman
>>56761255
Don't buy it. You're talking about a 1964 Russian plane against a 1976 (?) plane from the american arsenal. Do you really think the Turks spend the money (or for that matter, are allowed access to) the best of what americans have available for the f-16? Only the Jews get those. I'd bet a substantial amount of money to was a heat-seeking missile.
ITT
people who know nothing of military hardware other than what they read over the internet arguing over military hardware.
you're all dumb.
>>56761526
THATS AN AMERICAN FIGHTER PILOT, BUD
NOT SOME TURKEK >>56761068
>>56761526
Have something more recent:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oGuWadoTgkE
Yes, it's a lot of work.
>>56761009
kek
greasy turk
>>56751934
We trained the turk
>>56761618
oh look, its a syrian who made it to the promised land
feels goodman?
>>56761382
Yes, basically. In fact, right up until the fall of Constantinople, in medieval archives, you'll see Constantinople simply referred to as "Rome/Roman Empire" There was no differentiation made until after the turks sacked the city.
>>56761505
You missed the whole point of my post:
there is no need to make the warhead bigger when a smaller one will do the job.
>>56761663
OFC they know
they absolutely adore their martyrs Abd they put their own interests over foreign interests
turkey should be an small country without Istanbul/Bosporus just a small landstrip at black sea
but they fucked the english Australian Italien greek russian and Armenien fuckers out of turkey
>>56761788
Speak for yourself.
I'm an AV techie on Eurofighter Typhoon (go on take the piss)
>>56761009
thanks sultan erdogan
>>56761866
Yup, also "Byzantine Empire" is actually a much later name for the late Roman Empire. If I remember correctly it was some scolar in the 17th century who basically came up with it
>>56761572
don't take things for granted friend. Recall that right up until the start of WW 1, Czar Nicholas and his cousin, Kaiser Wilhelm had on ongoing game of chess they played by mail that had been going for well over a decade. One of the reason I admire Putin i because sometimes he just goes with his nationalistic passions and damn the economic consequences.
>>56761863
born and raised nigger
finally some akhis comin
