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How important is the Old Testament for Christians /pol/?
>>56714947
The old testament does not matter at all, except for the one section in which god says the laws are for all mankind, not just the Israelite. That section being the 10 commandments.
The old testament is non-binding to Christians. For example, anyone who quotes Leviticus for why gays are bad and says they are christian, means they have not understood the entire purpose of Jesus.
Christians formed a new sacrament with Christ.
>>56714947
A background for the New Testament. It gives a good understanding of Israelite society and just how radical Jesus was in its context.
A lot of the rules were changed by Jesus, but people who inherently dislike the Old Testament generally don't understand much about Christianity and have probably never even read it.
>>56714947
Depends on what denomination and theology.
According to the Catholic Catechism, it's mostly for fluff. Like 90%.
The Early Church had a schism over it, with essentially one side saying "Old Testament is total bullshit" and one side saying "Yeah but you need it to understand the New Testament"
For the most part it's irrelevant to Catholicism except for the doctrine of Original Sin and the Ten Commandments.
everything in the Old Testament is God's word. all scripture is profitable for doctrine. the law is perfect. the only parts that are not relevant now, are the parts that were specifically done away with in the New Testament (dietary laws, the sabbath, ceremonial laws)
None of it was changed by Jesus. Whatever changes were made by Paul, and he's not the most credible source. The book of the Revelation warns about him and his followers.
>>56715675
>Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
jesus didn't do away any laws.
>>56714947
It's fine to read it, but it does not apply to Christians. Jesus made a new deal with God, so it's perfectly fine to eat shellfish and 4 legged birds and wear cotton jeans with an wool sweater if you so choose to.
>>56715526
>a schism
gnostics have never been regarded as christians.
it's a better read that the NT
>>56714947
Not important.
It's all about the New Testament.
Pretty much as important as the New Testament. Jesus did not abolish the Law, but intensified it. Be wary of replacement theology and new covenant heretics.
>>56715852
He didn't do away with any laws he fulfilled them and therefore they became obsolete
>>56715689
>The book of the Revelation warns about him and his followers.
Where?
>>56715852
he did away with the dietary laws, the sabbath, and the ceremonial laws
>>56716103
it's important for context. for example, new testament's "as it was in the days of noah, so shall be when son of man comes" part of matthew/luke directs you all the way back to genesis and book of enoch to learn how it really was during those times.
>>56716441
why would he do away with sabbath? to allow satan/sun worship to become the new worship day, or for everyone to fall right into satanic rituals like christmas or easter?
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>>56714947
>How important is the Old Testament for Christians /pol/?
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLapIcULLvvedXjciEM2cngaxcjxjM0AiU
>>56716224
the term,replacement theology is just a Jewish strawman
Israel = believers on Christ, whether Jew or Gentile. no one is claiming Gentiles have replaced physical Israel... even in the Old Testament, physical Israel was only God's people when they had faith in God.
>>56715675
>document contrived by humans
>word of god
>>56716703
>he still thinks purely in 3 dimensions, rejecting anything his puny carnal mind can't comprehend or rationalize.
>>56714947
the Old Testament is included in the bible for historical reasons, but as a Christian you just need to be familiar with some Old Testament stories and the New Testament.
The OT is a history of and laws of the Jews. As Jesus extended salvation to gentiles as well, those laws do not apply to us.
The NT also reads a lot better. It reads like a modern person wrote it, and is very clever in its situations, descriptions and arguments.
I think that's the primary lesson I'd take away. Jesus does not want man to be hidebound by legalistic (i.e. jewish) ramblings, but rather use our god given sense to draw wisdom from the world. In that way the Old Testament should be honored, but it does not contain the secret of life.
>>56716103
>>56716452
Old Testament is much more important than that. Jesus often quotes the Old Testament just as he says he "fulfilled the law" the law had to be written to be fulfilled. Furthermore the law and the stories like Nehemiah, Jonah, and Daniel, each show that the law is impossible to follow and that we need a savior [spoiler]JESUS![/spoiler]. In books like Ecclesiastes Solomon also shows how pointless and depressing life is without a savior
>>56716824
>doesnt treat what people wrote thousands of years ago as absolute
>must be athiest
>>56717209
didn't say you were atheist, just that you think like a carnal materialist, assuming the bible was just a book imagined and written by a bunch of humans, because the alternative is too outlandish.
>>56715138
This is 100% incorrect.
While it is true that we have a new covenant, the old covenant is a type for the new covenant. Together they reveal the balance between grace and law.
Also the prophecies, history, psalms, etc are incredibly valuable.
People like to use the Jews slaughtering their enemies as "proof" that God USED to be OK with slaughter and vengeance but they really have no idea what the purpose of that was...
Christians aren't even a thing anymore. There are so many denominations and separate belief systems that they have become new religions.
>>56717517
not on meth it is
>>56715906
But that's not even close to the point. There's so much more in the old testament that still applies
>>56716596
Israel =\= christian. There's no portion of the Bible that refers to Christians as Israel. Israel is exclusive to the Jewish people and is a race, not a creed so there can be christian Jews.
Modern preachers often make this mistake when preachjng the word and their congregation believes incorrectly. This is mostly the case when reading the prophets or anything regarding blessings for Israel
Very important, but it must be viewed through the lens of the New Testament.
completely irrelevant
>>56714947
The main reason the ot is even in modern bibles is because a lot of its prophecy revolves around jesus, and because a fair amount of the history included is verifiable and generally believed to have happened.
As far as how christians should believe and behave, the book that is paramount is the nt, the ot has no influence, none, zero, regarding christians and their expected behavior.
Its my opinon that the ot is for the jews and the nt is for the christians, and that the nt is the only book bible believing christians should be concerned with, beyond the academic matters of what happened and where that you find in the ot.
>>56714947
You absolutely need it for the context, otherwise hardly anything makes sense.
>>56716554
He celebrate mass on Sunday because Jesus rose on the third day.
not at all lmao
>>56715906
>>God made a new deal with himself.
top kek.
>>56714947
Traditions of Christian communities > Actual sayings in the Old Testament.
>>56719506
that's an excuse to worship on satan's day though. it's not the name that counts, but the customs and timing.
just like 25th december is nimrod's birthday and the day of winter solstice/"solar rebirth", the customs of tree covered in shiny crap and presents comes from babylon, while santa claus is a thinly veiled satan who steals all the attention during christmas.
another one, easter which worships ishtar, also known as semiramis, nimrod's wife, mother of tammuz, reincarnated nimrod, or reborn sun god, likened to lucifer in the bible. the main focus of that day is bunnies and eggs. where did that come from?
modern christianity is full of concealed sun worship, no wonder it's called mystery babylon. all of its customs originated in babylon and spread all over the world from there, roman empire which added those into christianity included.
>>56719984
>satan's day
Polan what even is that?
>>56720209
sun worship. nimrod was the self appointed sun god. he was also the original antichrist, and he will be the last one as well.
it's even called the sun day. day of the sun. day when sun is to be worshipped by pagans.
>>56714947
Ecclesiastes is the best book of the Bible. Fact.
>>56720209
Christians don't worship the sun Polan. They worship God.
Why do Muslims claim the Bible was rewritten many times?
>>56717669
The Cliff Notes of Christianity.
Moses's Covenant^1 with God was the Old Covenant^1 paving the way for the New Covenant^1.
Matthew 5:17;
Hebrews 9, Hebrews 9:15;
>What is the New Covenant^1?
Eternal Life Though Jesus Christ the Son of God.
>How does one partake of the New Covenant^1?
Jesus says be Baptized.
John 3:1-22, John 3:5, John 3:22;
Jesus says Eat of His Flesh and Drink His blood.
Matthew 26:17-29, Mathews 26:26-28;
Mark 14:12-25, Mark 14:22-24;
Luke 22:7-28, Luke 22:17-20;
John 6:35-71, John 6:48-58, John 6:53;
Don't be like the unbelievers in:
John 6:66
Paul, one of Christ's Apostles says
These two simple acts join us in the Body of Christ, The Communion of Saints, His Church.
1 Corinthians 12:13;
He does also warn us, don't consume Christ if you are unworthy.
1 Corinthians 11:23-29, 1 Corinthians 11:28-29;
Don't worry Jesus knows this because he Taught Paul this. Here is how you become worthy.
Seek Confessions through The Holy Spirit, but you can't do this alone.
John 20:19-23, John 20:21-23;
Follow Christ's Teaching or you can't be washed in His blood.
1 John 1:5-10,1 John 1:6-7;
1)in the greek manuscripts the words used are:
>διkαιώματα λατρείας,
>dikaiōmata latreias
>"Regulations of Worship"
Testament or Covenant are good colloquial equivalent.
>Testament (In biblical use)
>3rd Definition OED
A covenantor dispensation.
The TL;DR of Christianity
Baptism
Repent your Sins in the presence of an πρεσβύτερος, Presbyter:Priest/Elder.
Consume Christ.
>>56714947
It's basically Star Wars I, II, and III.
It's a lot better if you look at it as the history of Jesus's lineage. It really blows your mind to see the grand scheme of things, where God basically says "Nope don't marry this woman, I need you to travel 100 miles to meet another woman so your great great great great grandchild can give birth to Jesus Christ".
>>56720718
on sun worship day.
it's the time that matters for rituals, not the name. sunday is the designated day to celebrate sun. christmas is the designated time to celebrate antichrist's birth. easter is the designated time to celebrate antichrist's mother, the babylonian harlot and fertility goddess.
god specifically said that sabbath is his day since it represents the finished creation. not sunday.
jesus didn't come to say "guys, you can forget about sabbath now. i want you to observe another day that has no meaning for god, but has a whole lot for the goyim pagans!"
>>56714947
It is ABSOLUTELY important.
Be strong and courageous. Do not be afraid or terrified because of them, for the LORD your God goes with you; he will never leave you nor forsake you."
Deuteronomy 31:6
MUST READ FOR ALL
>>56721567
>on sun worship day
What? What "sun worship day" Polan?
>>56721567
It's God worship day - that it happens (if it even does) to coincide with some other cultist's "holy" day is irrelevant.
>>56719984
We are simply reappropriating these pagan holidays for Christ. Just because they fall on the same day or even incorporate some ancient pagan tradition, doesn't mean it is done in the same spirit as they did it.
For truly I tell you, UNTIL HEAVEN AND EARTH DISAPPEAR, not the smallest letter, NOT THE LEAST STROKE OF THE PEN, will BY ANY MEANS disappear from the Law
>>56720718
What is Liturgical East?
>>56721790
Yes indeed. It is important to examine *why* that is the case though, and why we still keep record of the old laws.
>>56714947
The three uses of the Law are:
Curb - Through fear of punishment, the Law keeps the sinful nature of both Christians and non-Christians under check. This does not stop sin, since the sin is already committed when the heart desires to do what is wrong, yet it does stop the open outbreak of sin that will do even further damage.
Mirror - The Law serves as a perfect reflection of what God created the human heart and life to be. It shows anyone who compares his/her life to God's requirement for perfection that he/she is sinful.
Guide - This use of the law that applies only to Christians. The law becomes the believer's helper. Empowered by the gospel truth of forgiveness and righteousness in Christ, the believer's new self eagerly desires to live to please the Triune God.
>>56721792
If they worship the sun, they're not Christians, or else if they are they are severely misguided ones.
>>56721754
sabbath is god worship day.
>>56721696
sunday. sun day. day of the sun. the day on which ancient romans worshipped their pagan gods before constantine appropriated christianity and changed its worship day to sunday so he could easily convince his pagan friends to join in and pay him tribute.
>>56721778
that's not how this works, although i guess goyim will buy into it and think that just because it's called CHRISTmas it still celebrates the real deal, not an antichrist.
it's called deception. satan's finest work. deceive the masses to think they still worship the real deal while in reality they're blaspheming. that's how he plans to deceive the whole world.
christmas is done in the spirit of greed and gluttony. all it lacks is the orgies the holiday had before, though those were happening regularly in the vatican until after middle ages ended.
according to the bible jesus was born in late summer/early autumn, not dead of winter.
>>56722489
>sabbath is god worship day
Which is Sunday. Day 7 in a seven day cycle of days. All the way from Genesis.
>>56722563
sabbath starts at the friday evening and lasts until saturday evening. you're applying pagan way of observing time to an ancient culture which saw sunday as the first day of the week.
why do you think the "friday night is the time for degeneracy" meme is so strong in the usa? it's literally desecrating god's day, and plays right into the synagogue of satan's agenda of damning the entire population to hell.
>>56722866
>sabbath starts at the friday evening
You're telling me there had been a > 3000 year unbroken chain of perfect temporally kept "sabbaths", and that Friday was that day? Are you *really* making that claim Polan?
>>56721567
Christians are supposed to walk in the footsteps of Jesus.
Jesus followed the Law, held the Sabbath and so on. The fact that He did not keep the Sabbath on at least one occassion simply means that He had authority over it, but it is never said that He abolished it by doing so.
In the Epistles and Acts, it is also implied that the new gentile Christians should learn about the Law as it is taught in synagogues and possibly follow it.
Modern day "Christians" do not even keep the essentials as told by the Apostles, specifically the blood, meat sacrificed to idols and from strangled animals parts (sexual immorality is ambiguous, we cannot truly know if someone is a degenerate behind closed doors), because normal meat from normal livestock is not slaughtered in a kosher way and thus breaks at least one of these essentials.
Christians should therefore follow these essentials, eat kosher meat and gradually move on to fully obeying the Law, to the best of their ability.
It's important as a reminder for "this is what Jews actually believe."
>>56722489
Let's be clear, you cannot stop the coming of the Antichrist. Only delay it.
>>56723153
friday night to saturday night. so most of saturday.
most of original israelites died, went into slavery or converted to islam out of fear.
white ashkenazi khazar "jews" don't count, they're eurasian goyim who follow talmud and kabbalah.
>>56723561
nobody's talking about stopping him, he will be born whether people worship him or not. once he's born and starts performing miracles, even more will worship him.
what needs to be stopped is people voluntarily damning themselves through ignorance and customs of man because they make them feel good.
Mostly for context and history. Jews themselves don't relate to it all that much for religion. Most of its laws were abandoned, superseded by new ones, with a new Covenant.
Many Christians read poetic stories as truth, like the Book of Job. It's a poem, put together in the Torah next to other poetic books like the psalms or the song of songs. All experts agree it was written as a poem and read as one for centuries. Just like we read Dante's epic poem, nobody assumes it really happened or that God said those very things. Too many Christians lack the knowledge of the Book.
It's a rich book, the Bible, but you need to study it if you're going to read it at all.
Christians really only need the NT when it comes to the meat of it, but even that is secondary. The first Christians didn't have a Bible or Christian texts for quite some time. It comes second.
>>56723941
I'll make the same post again.
You're telling me there had been a > 3000 year unbroken chain of perfect temporally kept "sabbaths", and that Friday was that day? Are you *really* making that claim Polan?
>>56724156
saturday. where did you get the entire friday from? friday night is when it starts, but that quickly turns into saturday (people go to sleep at night), most of which is the actual sabbath.
i wasn't in israel to see if they all kept it perfectly or not. otherwise i could cite jesus from first hand sources and my own notes/recordings of his messages without roman corruption.
as with any population some probably did keep it, some didn't. many likely chose to ignore god's laws, which ended up costing israelites their country, freedom and in many cases very lives. they were probably no better than current americans in that.
god doesn't like it when his chosen people say "nah, forget it, pig just tastes too good, i'll go eat some bacon, then commit adultery with shlomo's hot wife and kill goldberg who lent me money so i don't have to pay him usury and keep all the shekels"
>>56714947
It's the story of the fall of man and being reconciled to God.
>creation
>fall of man
>law of God first covenant
>God's law can't be kept perfectly by man
>prophecy of a new covenant
>Enter Jesus
>Jesus lived perfect which completes law
>Death to pay for our sins
>blood to cover our sins
>Ressurection to defeat death
>Reconciled to God.
It's all important. Plus that's where all the best stories are.
>>56724982
>i wasn't in israel to see if they all kept it perfectly or not
I'll tell you now the Biblical assumption has always been that they haven't, and that what day you *actually* hold the sabbath on is irrelevant so long as you keep the sabbath as sacred on the seventh day out of seven days.
its as important as the new testament. the bulk of the knowledge about God comes from there. The new testament makes no sense without the old.
>in b4 the old testament does not apply anymore
retards, thats what people that dont know the bible would say just avoid dealing with the tougher subjects. I accept all the old testament as still valid today. There are just a few things that are not valid any more, like the feasts, animal sacrifices, and ordinances, and that is because Jesus was the last sacrifice.
