Fuck this road salt bullshit. I understand if hills are salted but why the hell are these retards flinging this shit around everywhere?
>>13878749
Because they are idiots. Road salt should be banned. Don't drive in the snow if you don't have winter tires. If you crash it's your problem.
Because people cannot drive according to the actual conditions and won't shell out money for proper tires
Be glad you get salt and not brine.
The brine is about 25x more corrosive. My 2011 Toyota looks like a 1985 underneath.
FUCK BRINE.
Sand and gravel is a good alternative but you'll have to change your front windshield every year or two if you live somewhere with a winter at least half the year.
>mfw they don't salt here
inb4 get winter tires, it's not worth the cost because we get maybe 4 days of actual snow a year but when we get it it turns straight to ice.
>>13878761
I thought Norway and Sweden don't even salt the roads and rely on the packed snowcover delivering grip? Apparently hard, compacted snow isn't nearly as much of an issue as thin, light snow with asphalt inbetween.
>>13878766
No, that's not an alternative. There's no real reason to treat roads when you can just buy the proper tires and not have to deal with paying for your 30,000+ dollar purchase to be destroyed well before its time.
>>13878770
>tfw 5 months of winter here.
be happy for those 4 days.
>>13878764
>>13878766
Isn't brine just seawater, or am I missing something?
And as a reply to both; the reason why we don't like salt is because it really isn't necessary. If you know how to drive in those conditons and your car is properly kitted then you will get around just fine. Run plows and scrapes to keep the road smooth and free of large amounts of snow, and run a light blanket of gravel if a road gets small portions of wet ice
>Live in Alberta
>No road salt
>Cars still rust to shit because lol7monthwinter
>>13878779
Brine is salinated water. Way worse than dry salt.
>>13878780
Something else is up there. Plain old snow shouldn't cause any noticeable rust on anything but unpainted surfaces.
>live in a place where it snows and the roads are salted
>bitch about it
Move or shut up.
>>13878775
It literally just wrecks front windshields and doesn't cause rust. We have pretty severe winters (already about a foot of snow) so it's better than nothing.
>>13878777
>tfw about 7-8 months of winter
>>13878785
But its "natural", not something they use to prevent ice or anything right? If so then thats the main difference; one can't be helped (unless you properly do a anti-corrosion coating under the car which is a good idea no matter what) while the other would be unnecessary if people were smart
>>13878749
Move south :)
>>13878779
The salt composition of brine is way worse than salt water.
Also salting/brining the roads is a major pollutant, and causes fish kills.
>>13878796
>hurr muh ten bazillion climates in muh murrika lel jus move!
You want Eurofags to move to a shithole like Italy or Greece?
>>13878800
Shit, where you from?
>>13878803
Would except Southern Europe is pretty poop compared to here. That would actually be move up North where there are so long roads and sparse population they don't even care about salting the roads and people just drive accordingly.
>>13878785
They use sand and gravel here, which will make a lot of nice pinholes in your paint that will turn into some awesome rust down the line.
>>13878817
Alberta. Way up in the north though. The climate difference between south and northern alberta can be staggering.
>>13878777
>>tfw 5 months of winter here.
>be happy for those 4 days.
Anon no, it gets cold as balls here. Just due to some weird ass shit with the mountains we get almost zero rain or snow.
>spray salt
>ruins your car
>spray sand
>ruins your car
>spray nothing and allow studded tires instead
>ruins the road slightly faster than usual
>OMG WE CAN'T SPEND TAX MONEY ON ACTUAL INFRASTRUCTURE LET'S RUIN EVERYONE'S CARS INSTEAD
>Canada
>Ontario
>usually get one major snowstorm a year in the southern parts
>retards still salt the fuck out of the roads
>after the snow melts it turns the roads to complete shit, fucking potholes everywhere
god I hate this place, and I like snow.
>>13878839
Damn, East coast here. We get shit on pretty bad too. Been thinking on moving west actually.
>>13878856
You don't even need studded tires anymore, the latest generation of studless tires are just that good.
If you drive anywhere you'll be on the actual road surface; get studless
If you drive somewhere you'll never really see the actual road surface and only be on snow and ice; get studs
>>13878856
Do you have any fucking idea how expensive it is to maintain roads, especially in the US? We have like triple the public roads per capita than the next highest country.
![slushy[1].gif](https://i.imgur.com/l5tkOIV.gif "slushy[1].gif")
>>13878774
In the far north they don't use salt since it gets too cold for it to have any effect, but here in the south they fling that shit all over the place. So annoying.
All it does is make the roads look like pic related, which means that if you stray even slightly out of the tracks in the road you start snow-planing (aquaplaning but a lot more common since it moves out of the way slower than water but has the same properties as water in terms of grip).
And when it does get cold enough (which happens fairly frequently recently due to "global warming") the wet surface in the tracks freezes and everyone gets fucked since they
a) expect the surface to be wet tarmac "like it was yesterday" and
b) don't know how to drive on ice/snow since they have to so rarely
>>13878856
Plastic studs don't ruin anything.
>>13878816
Sure. If enough of you move the place will gentrify.
>>13878801
>But its "natural", not something they use to prevent ice or anything right?
No, they use brine to prevent ice.
>>13878883
Ok, so it is something they actually use?
Does it provide any benefit compared to normal road salt?
>>13878800
>It literally just wrecks front windshields and doesn't cause rust.
OR, you can not use it and buy winter tires instead and nothing happens to your car.
>>13878886
Yes, you will see plows spraying a liquid. That is the brine. My guess is that the benefit is an even coating vs the salt crystals that will tend to localize melting of ice.
>>13878893
Sounds fucking terrible, mate
>>13878868
>You don't even need studded tires anymore, the latest generation of studless tires are just that good.
This is not true at all. Just look at test results from studless tyres vs. studded tyres in winter conditions. The difference even with only 50 km/h is 20 meters.
>>13878903
It's pretty terrible. You should see the scaling on the frame of a 15 year old truck with only 60,000 miles due to the salting here. It makes me angry because it would be pristine if I didn't live here.
>>13878890
Yeah sure, but unless everyone on the road does that it will still be dangerous to everyone if nothing gets done.
It's not a perfect world. Get past your delusions and accept that some things can't be ideal.
>>13878919
Nah, fuck you. I'm not going to accept the damage of my personal property and the environment because some fucktards want to be cheap and use garbage tires. Fine people for not having winter tires, problem solved.
>>13878926
>fine people because they can't afford a $500 set of tires every year
>>13878890
You do realize sand and gravel help people with winter tires out right? Even with proper tires I would rather have a bit of gravel and sand to aid my traction than just dive on glare ice under half a foot of snow at highway speeds.
Any where with a real winter people park their nice road cars inside until summer anyways.
>>13878934
>make poor people pay for rust proofing, repairs and buy new cars because the old ones rust to shit
>>13878926
I'd rather help out the one retard out of 10 if it means he won't kill other people trying to drive than have a clean windsheild on my winter vehicle.
>>13878911
Thats a question between maximising your braking distance and wether or not the tire is sufficient
On ice studded tires are still way superior, obviously - but when it comes to snow, asphalt, road noise and so on the best studless tires are equal or in some cases even better than the upper-tier studded tires
Here is a short sheet over the braking distance on snow, with the bold names being studded tires and the normal font names being studless
>>13878934
New tires every winter? How much do you plan on driving?
>>13878911
Please translate your moonspeak.
>>13878948
>How much do you plan on driving?
Daily reminder that the average US commute is something like 30-40 miles.
>>13878948
>Nokian not stronk
Does rust protection spray do anything if the bottom of your car is already starting to rust?
>>13878948
>New tires every winter? How much do you plan on driving?
Considering you're lucky to get 12k miles out of winter tires, they wouldn't last more than two, maybe three years for most Americans.
>>13878958
Friction tyre
Nordic friction tyre
Central European friction tyre
>>13878966
Nokian very strong and sex
(tire in question for Nokian were the 8's as bold text and the R2's as thin text)
This test was braking on ice
>>13878948
The difference is of course the biggest on ice but in winter especially in heavily traffic areas the snow gets compacted to ice and needs studded tyres to be roughed up enough for good grip. Also when the snow melts and re-freezes it just turns into a super slippery surface.
Most people don't live where there is only pristine snow on the road.
>>13878934
Yes. You can afford a car, you should be able to afford tires. You don't replace them every year, either.
>>13878941
If you're driving on ice, you need studs.
>>13878946
I'd rather fine them and give them points on their license for reckless driving.
>>13878974
My tires have a good 19 000 miles on them, and they are still good for another winter, upon which I'll replace them when next winter approaches as at that time they'll be over five years old
The only time I've heard about people wearing out their winters that badly are when they are running studded tires in the middle of the city or just generally abusing the tires by playing around with them instead of driving properly
>>13878979
Forgot to attach photo
>>13878974
Decent winter tires can do in excess of 5000 km per mm tread wear, and usually come with 9 mm tread stock. Even if you replace your tires at the recommended 4mm remaining tread instead of the legal 1.6 mm tread, that's 25k km or 15k miles. Unless you log tons of distance year round or your winters last half the year, you can drive a set for at least five years.
>>13879003
>My tires have a good 19 000 miles on them, and they are still good for another winter, upon which I'll replace them when next winter approaches as at that time they'll be over five years old
I'm just going off of what google is telling me.
>>13878983
If thats the condition then yes; studded tires are a great help and will perform the best, but you can't say that studless tires are just snake oil, they work damned well compared to their studded brethren outside of straigth ice, and even then they still perform more than well enough on those conditions for most people
My buddy runs Hakka R2's on his Merc and I run Hakka 7's on my own Merc, same model, same size on the tire. He can keep up just fine with me, no trouble at all and the tires would never lose their grip all of a sudden as long as he wasn't doing something retarded, at which point mine would also lose grip doing the same maneouver
Modern premium studless tires are damned good, and they definetly won't leave you stranded unless you're somehow trapped at the bottom inbetween two supersharp hills covered in black ice, and even then you'd probably be able to get going
>>13879024
And I'm going off from personal experience, buddies who work in a tire shop and consumer reports
>>13878863
I remember near the end of last winter it rained 4 days in a row with the temp averaging above 10 for those 4 days, and every day they'd lay salt down like it was the fucking ice apocolypsy or something.
>>13878934
> every year
Ya Na that's a one time expense every 3 years as long as you're not stupid and run them in the summer
Quebec manditates snow tires for winter.
>>13878801
It's as natural as pouring solid salt onto the roads.
It's pre-mixed water and salt and sprayed from tnker trucks with spray nozzles on the back.
This is what my truck looks like after driving from Potsdam NY to Belmont VT
I found rust behind my tail lights a few weeks ago.
>hold me /o/
>>13878779
It's not snow that's the problem. It's the ice, specifically black ice. Even with good snow tires, you can and will still slip on ice. The salt helps to melt ice and prevent it from forming.
>>13878774
Omg this. I live in Chicago, we get plowed and salted. Drove to Indiana to TireRack, that whole town is just compacted snow. So much win. And it was so much fun skidding around the industrial lots cause kept getting "lost" looking for Tire Rack
>>13878749
They mix it with grit here, and spread it thin.
However, it'll eat away at anything. I dumped a bag of salt in the freezer at work to keep the floor clear of ice, and it corroded the spring in my ballpoint pen. And I'm pretty sure it's eating the leather of my boots, too.
>>13878779
Its a magnesium compound in water. It is designed to stick, and boy does it.
I now park my winter beater over a sprinkler for an hour in the yard when I get home, if the roads are briny. Will also be getting WaxOyl all over.
Winter tires are a fucking meme. I bought them once, they're LITERALLY no different than the all season touring tires.
>>13880269
>somebody sold your dumb ass all-weathers as winter tires
maximum overlel'd
>>13880284
>le memes
no I bought legit winter tires and concluded that they're shit because they are
>>13878749
My Grand National only does 85. :(
>>13880306
I guarantee you that you bought some shit tier tires. You gotta get Blizzaks, Nokians, or X-Ice3s.
>>13880314
>literally just parroting what consumer reports says
dumb stupid got enjoy your placebo tires
prove to me with objective facts that winter tires are better than all seasons and not just a meme created by rubber companies to sell more tires
t. lives in an area with lake effect snow
I have lived in several different states, and the no salt states actually cleaned their roads properly and the salt states always sucked at getting snow off the road.
>>13880337
CO fag here. The main roads are almost always spotless but god help you inside a residential area.
>>13880344
This is common everywhere, they just can't risk damaging vehicles parked on the side of the road so they cannot be as aggressive as the main roads.
>>13878972
WaxOyl.
They will de-rust and coat everything in shit that will never rust. It's prolly not cheap though. I'm looking into it.
>>13879871
Learn how to drive for the conditions, then.
>>13880337
I hate salt as much as the next guy but wisconsin atleast is pretty damn good at clearing its roads.
let's discuss rust-proofing instead
>>13880933
No.
>>13880933
Or the lack of it. This is why Mazda 3s and Fords loose their value so rapidly in Finland.
Don't they use ash from the powerplants in eastern Europe instead of salt? I would imagine it would be hugely alkaline.
Just a random shot of a car in snowy conditions. Please carry on.
>>13880329
Oh boy he is going all out
>>13880933
It works
>>13880593
wisconsin bro knows where its at
At least here in the suburbs of Milwaukee they have the streets cleared before I even wake up and don't salt the roads 24/7
>>13880933
save your used motor oil
paint it on undercarriage during winter months
use a spray gun of some sort if you are a real pro
>>13880311
Wrong thread buddy.
>living on a dirt road
>>13878749
So your rear end doesn't break traction in turns.
>>13878863
Its not the salt that ruins the roads you fucktard. Water seeps into small cracks, feezes, expands, and breaks up the concrete
rwd lexus is350
what snow tires should i buy. I close friend told me he swapped his blizzaks after 2 days.
Are the continentals good?
>>13878934
>every year
Set of snow tires lasts a couple years because they only get used a few months a year, also extends the life of summer tires because they aren't being used year round
>>13879206
FUCKING VERMONT
>>13878959
Bullshit, I've always lived in the boonies and Ive almost never commuted that far. I'd believe 10 or 15 miles
>>13880480
Theres no driving for black ice, you can't see it when you're driving and theres no traction at all on it
>>13881035
>coal ash
Enjoy your heavy metal poisoning
>>13881634
Yes, there is. You need the right tires.
>>13881488
Their "Highways" are a joke
>>13878886
>>13878779
It's usually a mix of 23% rock salt (sodium chloride) and magnesium chloride and 71% water. The magnesium chloride is what will fuck cars up because it's way more corrosive than salt.
