Is mika a good gundam mc /m/?
No, he's not even a good anything mc, OP.
Better than most, but not great. He was interesting if only for seeming like an actual sociopathic mentally ill child soldier at least.
>>14404421
Setsuna didn't quite make the cut eh?
>>14404423
I get why people are fans of Setsuna but he just didn't work as a character for me. Like most AUs I didn't much care for 00.
I felt he was too one-dimensional to be a main character
>>14404349
No. I get that IBO is more about the cast as whole than a singular MC, but Mikazuki is just sort of there. He's questionably autistic with no real personal motives of his own.
>>14404349
Imo Orga is the MC, he gets more screentime and development
Kudelia was the MC of IBO
Orga, Mika, Tekkadan, their only job is to move Kudelia about so she can advance the plot.
>>14404430
It's the fluffy hair, and autism.
>>14404349
what would be a good MC for a Gundam Show?
>>14404637
Amuro
>>14404637
>>14404637
Char,but on the good guys side.
>>14404646
we already saw Char and works best as a mentor. No idea about Gaia Gear, but from what little I've read he's a different character.
>>14404349
wait what he was the mc??
>>14404676
You are joking, but a battle princess, who starts out as a pacifist, but then gradually becomes a warmonger mc is a reversal of Gundam cliche I'd like to see.
Sure, we already had this for villans, but for Mc would be more complicated because the character must remain in the middle between the ambiguous choices and a certain moral level.
>>14404646
I think he's interesting. As a character.
Good, especially as the assumed primary main (after all, the guy in the gendum is the face of the show), I'm not sure. The things that make him interesting ended up peeving off people here.
Mostly the KUDELIA SUGOI spiel, either it's Mikazuki's way of expressing how impressed he is by the idea that one can defeat their enemies through diplomacy rather than force, or it's the writers being hacks and making Mikazuki suck off Kudelia's clit for no good reason.
>>14404637
Lt. Grunty McGruntwank, Oldfag, Oldtype, Oldfashioned, white and grew up in an earth suburb, leading his unit of underachieving Literally Nobodies piloting their piece of shit GMs as part of the EF's Nothing Special Forces.
Finally a protag all of /m/ can relate with and project all of their insecurities and fears of mediocrity into.
>>14404728
Nooo! Lieutenant Burning, why did you have to die!? There could have been so many sequels.
>>14404719
>good guy
>>14404789
Shut up Ohgi.
>>14404789
Look, you want a Char, right? Lelouch was at least good enough to not Colony Drop everyone.
>>14404789
>good guy
Actually I agree. He was not a good guy, but he had at least a worthy objective and a sense of responsibility that made him likeable (to me, at last) despite his bullshit.
With Suzaku he did not deny his responsibility with Euphemia and he chose for himself an ignominious end when he could rule unchallenged.
I liked this edgy faggot.
>>14404836
I think the point was that Lelouch was still the bad guy despite being the protagonist, but he had some good qualities to balance it out and make him likable, while Suzaku was the opposite and an antagonist despite being a good guy, but had some bad shit to balance that out.
>>14404848
Except that Suzaku stopped any hope of being a good guy in any real way at the end of R1, being a willing participant in the invasion of the EU, he just liked to think he was.
Lelouch was much more morally ambiguous, having both good guy and bad guy traits. He generally acted for the sake of other people, but tended to get so caught up in himself that he doesn't necessarily do what's ideally best for other people. This doesn't make him a "good person", but Code Geass has extremely few good people. Schneizel, Charles, Cornelia, Ohgi, Tohdoh, Xingke, Kallen. All of them are capable of varying levels of deceit, betrayal and manipulation. Lelouch, at least, doesn't attack civilians, which largely puts him on the good guy side, while Suzaku cannot claim that.
>>14404910
>Except that Suzaku stopped any hope of being a good guy in any real way at the end of R1
bullshit. V.V. has gone specially from Suzaku to tell him that Zero had cursed Euphemy with his orders to kill all the Japanese. Suzaku had GOOD reason to be furious at the end of R1.
The problem of Suzaku is that, despite being a good guy, he made some bad choices (often not even for his fault, like the "live" order mega bomb) and the audiance considered him unlikable because he insisted to go against Zero glorious rebellion.
Unlike Pelouche he was not even particularly interesting as a character, and this certainly helped to make him more detested.
>>14404910
Well I only watched season one (when it was airing at that), so that would help explain my opinion. Season two was much changed from season one by my understanding though, and season one would have been much more intricately planned, so season one is probably more indicative of intended direction than season two.
>>14404910
>Lelouch was much more morally ambiguous
>Order a massacre of innocent children
>Pretty much everyone who came into contact with his lives a living hell
>Abandoned his army twice to leave them to die
>His entire stint Emperor
Ya know the show at no point hid the fact that what Lelouch was doing was morally wrong so if you're defending his actions you're in direct confrontation with what the show is telling you, it would have been better to make Lelouch a petty loser like Char to get people to realize that he's not suppose to be "cool".
>B-b-b-b-b-but he did it because he was doing what he thought was right
Yes what he thought was right not the morally just solution. Which makes no fucking sense for you to hamper down on Suzaku for doing the same thing only because he wasn't being a dick about it. >>14404910
>Lelouch, at least, doesn't attack civilians
Shirley's dad and virtually all those innocent Britannians during his Black Rebellion, he also mind controlled a bunch of people in the streets and drove a girl to the pit of insanity because she couldn't make a mark on a wall that her parents had to send her to an asylum. Ladies and Gents this is our "good guy".
>>14404430
He's my favorite gundam
>>14404942
No, I'm talking about the timeskip after the end of R1. Capturing Lelouch is not my concern. That's just expected. But by invading the EU, he went too far - he destroyed cities, conquered nations, and was party to the deaths of untold millions. Suzaku likes to think that he's a good guy, but he doesn't make a habit of doing anything good. He spares one woman in Shinjuku, but Clovis was going to kill her anyway - we can't even be sure she got away alive. Aside from her, Euphemia, and some of the Ashford crew, he doesn't try to save anyone.
Generally, supporting Britannia is a bad idea, too - Euphemia was the only one who didn't treat him as disposable - but as long as he worked for Euphemia, that wasn't an issue. But Charles invaded Japan, Schneizel had him hold down Zero while he bombarded them both, and Suzaku should have known that Clovis had Shinjuku shot up. Obviously, trying to become Knight of One was naive at best, and all but guaranteed to demand many terrible things. It was immoral, and unlikely.
The Fleija was kind of his fault - not because of the order, no one was expecting that - but because he willingly took a nuclear bomb into battle, with the intent of *not* using it. That was foolish, at best. Don't take city-busters into populated *allied* cities!
>>14404836
>With Suzaku he did not deny his responsibility with Euphemia and he chose for himself an ignominious end when he could rule unchallenged.
What the fuck are you talking about?
>>14404910
Lelouch was not morally ambigious. He did lots of heinous shit for petty reasons while Suzaku strive for a goal because he thought the opposite way wasn't worth pursuing. You don't see him laughing manically at the sight of soldiers dying. He was a solider if you're gonna take the actions of Britannia as his own feelings then you're retarded as shit.
>but Code Geass has extremely few good people. Schneizel, Charles, Cornelia, Ohgi, Tohdoh, Xingke, Kallen.
Schneizel the literal retard who thought the best bet for humanity was to hover a nuke over the world and to use it on anyone who blinks an eye?
Charles the man who made his children's lives a living hell, conquered most of the world and enslaved a nation and who utimately thought the best bet for humanity was for them to be one?
Cornelia the bitch who was all for Britannia's policies and assisted in their conquest for world domination?
Ohgi who betrayed the entire world for pussy?
Tohdoh who commited tons of heinous anti-protest acts during his stint in the JLF and
was in cohots with Suzaku's father's illegal underground dealings that ultimately lead to Japan being conqueroreds.
Xingke who supported a territorial regime and ultimately sided with terrorists once the Euanchs switch their allegiance?
Kallen the dumb bitch who supported the whims of a terrorist organization who was also responsible for the deaths of innocent civilians during her stint in the BK?
>Lelouch, at least, doesn't attack civilians, which largely puts him on the good guy side, while Suzaku cannot claim that.
But he didn't attack civilians unless trained soldiers count as civilians now. And using an incident that was literally out of his control and definitely reaching.
>>14404975
Innocent children? You mean the Geass assassin crew who casually controlled the mind of one of Lelouch's guys and made him shoot another? They're as innocent as Rolo.
The people who came into contact with Britannia live a living hell, too. Except with Britannia, that's intentional.
He abandoned his army once. Hard to make excuses for that. But they were fucked anyway, too. Capturing Cornelia was literally their only hope of success.
And we literally have no idea what he did as Emperor, except he was "the most terrible person ever", which is hard to believe when we have Charles and Schneizel, and he saved the world by kidnapping the UFN leaders, convincing Schneizel to fight, and stopping him from reaching space and firing Fleija on everyone. So, half of what he did is good, and the other half we never see. Did he kidnap people who talk bad about him? Well, there are rumors, so it must be true, right?
Shirley's dad died for reasons that make no sense. Narita had been evacuated. The only civilians left, as far as we were shown, were Clovis's Code R scientists. (Which we don't know Shirley's dad had any relation to, but the novels went and said he did.) Lelouch is, surprisingly, actually fairly innocent. Cornelia evacuated the city, and apparently, he trusted that.
"Drove a girl to the put of insanity"? IIRC, she just suffered sleep walking. "All those innocent Britannians during his Black Rebellion"? We never see any, Lelouch himself says not to harm the Ashford civilians. Any civilians that died would likely have been rioting Elevens reacting to Euphemia's massacre. Euphemia was his fault. The rioting is much harder to pin on him in any direct way.
>>14405022
>But by invading the EU, he went too far
Britannia was the one who invaded the EU not him.
>he destroyed cities, conquered nations, and was party to the deaths of untold millions
Where exactly in the show is this stated? His mark as the White Reaper was more in lines of his prowess in battle.
>>14405045
>What the fuck are you talking about?
The true, faggot. He could reveal that the Geass of Euphemia had been involuntary, instead he takes all responsibility with no excuses.
>>14405045
Heinous shit for "petty reasons"? So, being seconds away from getting executed for being a witness is "petty reasons"? And laughing about it because "holy shit, I'm not dead guys! Hahahah!" is not a good time to laugh? Killing Clovis for massacring civilians is "petty reasons"? Stopping the evil empire is "petty reasons"? Maybe you could include an actual example next time.
Are you stupid? I didn't call Schneizel and all "good people", I was using them as a series of bad people. I explicitly called them "capable of varying levels of deceit, betrayal and manipulation". READ FIRST. And thank you for making my point for me.
Trained soldiers? You think Suzaku attacking the EU didn't involve Suzaku attacking civilians and "quelling uprising and riots"? Or at the very least, standing by while Britannian grunts do that for them?
>>14405056
>They're as innocent as Rolo.
Except the show paints Rolo as a tragic soul who had known no such thing as human kindness before he met Lelouch. So yeah they're pretty blameless and Lelouch assulating them as revenge for shit he did just makes him even worse.
>The people who came into contact with Britannia live a living hell, too.
So Shirley was living in hell? Also pretty much by the end of the show everyone except a select few hated his guts so their lives weren't that much bad before they met him.
>And we literally have no idea what he did as Emperor,
His regime composed of "cleaning out" all Britannian conquered nations and taking care of all who opposed him as well as using his geass freely. The whole point of his regime was to make himself to be the worst ruler Britannia has ever known to make them forget about the Euphie incident and to make ZR's work, once again your fanfiction does not match up to what the show itself says.
>Shirley's dad died for reasons that make no sense
Whether it makes no sense is irrelevant since he was the cause of it
>Narita had been evacuated.
Nope. Shirely's dad wasn't the only causality in that
>"Drove a girl to the put of insanity"? IIRC, she just suffered sleep walking.
No the literally had to sent her away because she couldn't disobey the command.
>"All those innocent Britannians during his Black Rebellion"? We never see any
Yep those torn buildings and dead bodies means that everyone made it out of it okay
>Ashford
Yes just at Ashford not outside where everyone is out fighting.
>Any civilians that died would likely have been rioting Elevens reacting to Euphemia's massacre. Euphemia was his fault. The rioting is much harder to pin on him in any direct way.
Jesus fuck you're insane. First of all the battle didn't even take place where the Ruphie Incident took place, the streets weren;t empty they were still filled with people caught in the crossfire and HE ENDED STAGE 23 BY FIRING GAWAIN'S BEAM.
>>14404349
He's not very interesting
>>14405057
>Britannia was the one who invaded the EU not him.
Suzaku doesn't get to say he's innocent just because he was following orders. Most fair countries strongly disagree with the idea of following unlawful orders.
> Where exactly in the show is this stated? His mark as the White Reaper was more in lines of his prowess in battle.
What, you think that Suzaku fought KMFs, and that was it? Okay, Suzaku just stood by as other people fought the defenders desperate last stand at the gates of their homes. The Knights of the Round surely weren't even involved. That makes perfect sense.
>>14405102
>Suzaku doesn't get to say he's innocent just because he was following orders
And? The invasion of the EU was not his idea nor should he been for something Britannia was ready doing in the first season.
>Most fair countries strongly disagree with the idea of following unlawful orders.
Maybe in your make believe world were wars were fought fairly through bloodless duels.
>stuff
Right so you have no proof. The only record in show of Suzaku's actions while in the EU was in Turn 4 of R2 just fighting soldiers in fact nothing really is told of what transpired during that mission just that ot was an overwhelming defeat evem the second picture drama for R2 doesn't say anything.
>>14405078
Speak English because nothing you say makes sense.
>>14405090
>Except the show paints Rolo as a tragic soul who had known no such thing as human kindness before he met Lelouch. So yeah they're pretty blameless and Lelouch assulating them as revenge for shit he did just makes him even worse.
It also paints Rolo as a yandere mass murder. He's not innocent.
> So Shirley was living in hell? Also pretty much by the end of the show
I was referring to the Numbers. Millions of Numbers. And if we include the last 15 minutes of the series, sure, everyone hated Lelouch. Before that, though, Lelouch saved the world. Twice. That ending was terrible.
>His regime composed of
We don't even fucking know. I mean, seriously, that whole makes no fucking sense, and we don't see a single fucking thing of it. (Also, if we hold Lelouch responsible for it, we hold Suzaku responsible as well.)
> Whether it makes no sense is irrelevant since he was the cause of
> Nope. Shirely's dad wasn't the only causality in that
> Yep those torn buildings and dead bodies means that everyone made it out of it okay
They literally fucking show Narita being evacuated. Literally. It's empty. All possible precautions were taken.
> Jesus fuck you're insane. First of all the battle didn't even take place where the Ruphie Incident took place, the streets weren;t empty they were still filled with people caught in the crossfire and HE ENDED STAGE 23 BY FIRING GAWAIN'S BEAM.
The rioting Elevens like the ones who attacked Viletta. It happened ALL OVER JAPAN. Lelouch didn't even invade Tokyo until hours later, giving them the chance to evacuate everyone (though not for those reasons). There was a big standoff for at least six hours between Euphemia's rampage in the day, and the midnight timetable for screwing with Tokyo's funky plate system.
>>14405133
> The invasion of the EU was not his idea nor should he been for something Britannia was ready doing in the first season.
I'm sorry... Did you say Suzaku shouldn't have any responsibility for doing something that he knew the army he joined was doing when he signed up for it?
He totally should.
>Maybe in your make believe world were wars were fought fairly through bloodless duels.
In this one. Where war crimes are actually illegal, and we have treaties that prevent people from using certain weapons.
> Right so you have no proof.
There's no proof that civilians died in the Tokyo battle, either. If Suzaku can invade a nation without being responsible for attacking civilians, than Lelouch can invade a city without serious civilian casualties. Lelouch at least has the option of commanding people not to do that.
>>14405082
Except Lelouch's whole ambition is based on petty revenge the second part is you not reading since he laughs at the demise of other all the damn time >>14405082
>And thank you for making my point for me.
That your point is stupid and makes no sense to begin with? That you're a hypocrite and don't even realize it.
>Trained soldiers? You think Suzaku attacking the EU didn't involve Suzaku attacking civilians and "quelling uprising and riots"? Or at the very least, standing by while Britannian grunts do that for them?
So where in the show does it state he did this. Keep in mind he's a KoR, they don't quell riots nor attack civilians
>>14405141
>It also paints Rolo as a yandere mass murder.
Actually they don't. Or else they wouldn't have given him a better death scene than Shirely or they wouldn't have tried to paint his character as tragic than yandere so you're wrong in that regard.
>I was referring to the Numbers. Millions of Numbers
Yeah and they hated Lelouch as well. So what's your point?
>They literally fucking show Narita being evacuated. Literally
Wrong again.
>stuff
Also wrong
>>14405157
>That soldier just raped a civilain
>Okay everyone who joined the army should be main accountable for
This is how stupid you sound.
>Where war crimes are actually illegal
Except he never committed a war crime. What the hell is wrong with you? Watch the damn show instead of making shit up.
>There's no proof that civilians died in the Tokyo battle, either.
Actually there is.
> If Suzaku can invade a nation
Except he wasn't the only soldier or even the only KoR in the Eu at that time.
>than Lelouch can invade a city without serious civilian casualties.
Only in your fanfiction apparently.
Best thing about CG is that you look like a faggot regardless of which side you defend. Its not like most shows where there's clearly a right or wrong side since both the Japs and Brits are terrible people. I guess I can thank Okouichi's anti-nationlistic writing because they wind up being the most unlikable characters.
>>14405168
> Except Lelouch's whole ambition is based on petty revenge the second part is you not reading since he laughs at the demise of other all the damn time
The murder of his mother, mutilation of his sister, and the apparent attempted murder of himself and said sister by invading a nation where they're held hostage is "petty"? Shit, if that doesn't count, who knows what does.
Also, he generally sympathizes with the Japanese, though he's a self-centered siscon, so it's not that obvious. He's not just doing it for himself, and those villages of slaughtered Japanese people were probably a strong motivator.
> That your point is stupid and makes no sense to begin with? That you're a hypocrite and don't even realize it.
No. That while Lelouch is far from innocent, he's not out and out evil. R1 Lelouch is a selfish revenge driven jerk that's not completely evil like most of his contemporaries... Like OYW Char. R2 Lelouch generally works with other people to make their lives happier, even if that's not his ultimate goal, like Zeta Char.
And the last 15 minutes throw all that out the window for a stupid final confrontation that doesn't make nearly enough sense while he does terrible shit for no goddamn reason, like CCA Char.
>Keep in mind he's a KoR, they don't quell riots nor attack civilians
Yeah, they just assault their own bases. No, sure, KoR just spearhead massive invasions on behalf of the Emperor.
Also, the vampire guy totally does.
>>14405210
Unless you're an Americunt because MUH FREEDOMS the Elevens were the least liked characters in the series.
>>14405185
> Or else they wouldn't have given him a better death scene than Shirely
He murders Shirley. The death scene is to screw with Lelouch's head, but murdering Shirley clearly shows that he cannot be integrated into society. There is no way you can defend ignoring people who do that sort of thing.
Using that same logic, they give Lelouch a better death scene than Shirley. Clearly, Lelouch is innocent, and tragically misunderstood.
> Yeah and they hated Lelouch as well. So what's your point?
Hated him they did, yet he's the one who dismantled the Numbers system and allowed them to be free and equal citizens of the Empire. Then, he killed the person they hated most.
>Wrong again.
They literally did. They cut to it. It's an actual scene in the first Narita invasion episode. It's an empty city, there's some Britannian soldiers in a truck going around with loudspeakers telling everyone to get out of the city.
Pretending it didn't happen doesn't help.
>>14405224
No, they're the least liked characters in America, too.
>>14404640
>Amuro
>>14405199
> The army is invading it's 18th country!
> I'd never invade anyone! That's terrible! *joins that army*
That is what I actually said.
> Except he never committed a war crime. What the hell is wrong with you? Watch the damn show instead of making shit up.
I didn't make anything up. He didn't commit a war crime. He did, however, invade a nation, and you're saying he doesn't have any responsibility for doing so.
> Actually there is.
Like... what?
> Only in your fanfiction apparently.
No, in Code Geass. Because that's how anime works! ^_^
>>14404349
I legitimately like that he's a sociopath.
Too bad he couldn't carry his shitty show.
>>14405278
I don't think he's a sociopath, but yeah, IBO is a bad show and he's not remotely enough to carry it. I think Setsuna did the same archetype better, though even he got bad during season two.
>>14405219
His ambition id nothing but petty revenge even stated so in show and it doesn't help your case that it turns up for naught because his parents staged the whole thing so he was literaly being an edgelord for no reason.
>Also, he generally sympathizes with the Japanese
That doesn't happen until R2. In the first season he was largely apathetic of them and saw that they were put into their own situation die to their own hubris and the reason why they're like that is because they're too afraid to stand up. He hates the JLF and the BK was nothing more than pawns to him until the very end. Suzaku actually did give a shit about the Japanese and that was the whole point of becoming an honary Britannian in the process knowing that he would be branded as traitor regardless if his actions meant something in the end.
>>14405219
>R1 Lelouch is a selfish revenge driven jerk that's not completely evil like most of his contemporaries... Like OYW Char.
Char is outright evil in 0079 and he doesn't get nearly as much sympathy until Zeta and is a complete loser in CCA. Lelouch is just an edgelord in R1, someone who thinks the world is wrong and only he has the ambition to change it. While Char just wanted revenge against the Zabis Lelouch wanted to end Britannia as a whole.
>And the last 15 minutes throw all that out the window
No it doesn't Code Geass was about two fucked up people who could have been happy if their ambitions didn't shortsighted them to what was truly important now in order to make amends their only option was to make themselves even more miserable in the process. Lelouch didn't care what people thought of him so whether he goes down in history as the worst tyrant history doesn't phase him. Suzaku thought his only salvation was in punishment hence why he became a soldier in an attempt to die in battle because it would have meant his life meant something. In the twist of all twists both characters wind up in opposite spectrum of where they started.
>>14404715
AGE did this already.
>>14405219
Lelouch is dead unable to witness the world he created for his sister and Suzaku lives on as Zero the symbol of justice and the man who killed his lover until he dies.
>Yeah, they just assault their own bases. No, sure, KoR just spearhead massive invasions on behalf of the Emperor.
Still moving goalposts with no evidence.
>Also, the vampire guy totally does.
We don't know shit about what he does during the war.
>>14405239
>There is no way you can defend ignoring people who do that sort of thing.
And here you are defending Lelouch the guy who has more blood on his hands than anyone/
>yet he's the one who dismantled the Numbers system and allowed them to be free and equal citizens of the Empire.
And? You seem to miss the fact that they hated him for being a tyrant and his death meant that they were finally free hence they crowd cheering Zero when he died.
>stuff
Yeah..nice fanfiction
>>14405274
>Joining the army means you're actually responsible for invading the couuntries
That's even stupider
>He did, however, invade a nation
Britannia invaded the EU retard
>Like... what?
Literally when they go into details of what transpired during the Black Rebellion they mention causalities on both sides
> ^_^
Ironic shit posting is still shitposting
>>14405278
As entertaining as Mika was to watch in the beginning of IBO, you can only drag the edge for so long before it gets stale/boring. Unfortunately the writers don't seem to know what they want to do with him, and as a consequence he hardly develops throughout the course of the first season.
>>14405334
> Still moving goalposts with no evidence.
What do you even want? Suzaku goes an invades a country. How the fuck is anyone going to paint him as innocent? He's not.
> And here you are defending Lelouch the guy who has more blood on his hands than anyone/
More blood than Charles and Schneizel? Hardly.
Also, like Rolo and the geass assassins, Lelouch is dead, and there are a lot of reasons people would want him dead, both good and bad. There's no hypocrisy here.
>And? You seem to miss the fact that they hated him for being a tyrant and his death meant that they were finally free hence they crowd cheering Zero when he died.
Except they were really doing exactly as Lelouch wanted. They hated him... But did he kill their families? Did Lelouch do anything to them, or was he running a huge misinformation campaign? We dunno. You're just saying they hated him, so he must be evil. It doesn't work that way. That's not proof of anything.
>>14405345
>That's even stupider
He's responsible for his own actions. He decided to help Britannia do exactly what he knew Britannia was doing. He bears some responsibility. What's stupid about it?
>>14405316
No it doesn't Code Geass was about two fucked up people who could have been happy if their ambitions didn't shortsighted them to what was truly important now in order to make amends their only option was to make themselves even more miserable in the process. Lelouch didn't care what people thought of him so whether he goes down in history as the worst tyrant history doesn't phase him. Suzaku thought his only salvation was in punishment hence why he became a soldier in an attempt to die in battle because it would have meant his life meant something. In the twist of all twists both characters wind up in opposite spectrum of where they started.
True. Mostly, anyway... Lelouch had a messiah/martyr complex the whole series, so not a huge lot has changed there.
> That doesn't happen until R2.
Not true. R2 did even less, actually. The big example is the talk he has with C.C. (that gets blended with Suzaku's similar speech to Euphemia) shows that he realizes that the world sucks, and he wants to make it just a little bit better. (IIRC, it finished on "the fighting will stop when there is only one winner", with the implication that they were backing two different intended winners.) He has very selfish personal motives, but he clearly understands how the world is for other people, and he intends to achieve both of these things at the same time.
>>14405045
Schneizel was never good. That's had to argue, and Cornelia was a bad guy who cared for her sister, but still a villain.
I don't hate Suzaku, but you're incorrectly implying that the Black Knights as an organization were evil or didn't have a right to resist an armed occupation by a foreign power.
>>14405082
Who did Kallen betray, deceive or manipulate?
>>14405102
Indeed. You're expected to disobey unlawful orders in most real armies these days.
>>14406256
Lelouch
>>14406252
>but you're incorrectly implying that the Black Knights as an organization were evil or didn't have a right to resist an armed occupation by a foreign power.
The BK were terrorist bitch. And they were above killing innocent civilians either or betraying most of the world as well.
>>14406257
Go be stupid somewhere else
>>14405199
Suzaku followed orders to kill surrendering soldiers on that JLF boat. He briefly protested, but didn't stop.
>>14405396
>He's responsible for his own actions.
Right and those actions don';t correlate with Britannia. Why is that so fucking hard for you to understand? Or you gonna blame him for the other areas Britannia conquered that he had no involvement in?
>>14406270
No he didn't.
>>14406263
The line between resistance and terrorism is not very thick. Even George Washington was considered a terrorist by the British.
>>14406263
>Lelouch
Hardly.
>>14405367
>Suzaku goes an invades a country
I have to wonder if people who seriously watch this show have brain damage? Britannia invaded the EU not Suzaku.
>>14405367
>More blood than Charles and Schneizel? Hardly.
Show says you're wrong. Lelouch was known as the worst tyrant in human history so he spilled more blood than both of them.
>Except they were really doing exactly as Lelouch wanted
So what? People hated his ass all the same the point was that people who knew him personally and understood his decision were devastated at his while everyone else cheered.
>But did he kill their families?
He killed a lot of people
>Did Lelouch do anything to them, or was he running a huge misinformation campaign?
Well in his little charade he did take over an orbital nuke machine and took the official leaders of the world hostage, needless to say it didn't fucking matter if he freed the areas if all it managed to do was piss off more people and its not exactly free when your governor is a magic wielding tyrant that can get anyone who disagrees with him killed on the fly by taking control of his mind.
>>14405396
>The big example is the talk he has with C.C.
That had nothing to do with the Japanese itself but the world as a whole, Lelouch already said what he had to say in regards to the conflict in the Refrain episode and we can see throughout R1 that he saw the BK as nothing but pawns hence why he abandoned them in the season finale, he turned a leaf in R2 when he realized that the world doesn't run around Nunnally.
>>14406287
>the use of violence and intimidation in the pursuit of political aims.
The BK were very much terrorist not a resistance group. The JLF outright took people hostage as well.
>>14406292
>Hardly
That's why she tried to kill him?
>>14405210
I can't believe how much time I wasted on animesuki making arguments until I realize that the point of the show was that both leads were one of the same and that the Japs were shit in the end. Its funny to see people making the same arguments to this day.
>>14405224
Nobody fucking cared about the Elevens they just liked Lelouch or rather his fanbase was quick to change sides at the tip of a hat. If you seriously took Code Geass' philosophy garbage at face value then you really have been watching too much anime.
>>14406305
She was manipulated by Lelouch into opposing him, because he needed someone who could fake "killing" Suzaku for ZR.
>>14404349
He could have been replaced by an auto-pilot Barbatos AI that does nothing but fight, and the show would literally be no different aside from no shitty harem focus.
>>14406323
>manipulated
She was just a dumb bitch
>>14406319
That doesn't mean they wanted Britannia and Suzaku to win. Code Geass ended with Lelouch destroying Britannia's hegemony and allowing the Japanese to claim victory.
>>14406335
>Code Geass ended with Lelouch destroying Britannia's hegemony and allowing the Japanese to claim victory.
>Britannia still exists
>Japan no longer has Mt. Fuji
>>14406341
Japan is now free
Mt. Fuji's resources were used as a reason for the war in the Code Geass world
Britannia is no longer the world's leading superpower and can't invade anyone.
>>14406335
What Code Geass have you been watching? Code Geass ended with Britannia destroying all its opposing forces and then Lelouch and Suzaku staging an assassination so that Nunnally could rule it.
>>14406335
>allowing the Japanese to claim victory.
What? They didn't do anything. They bit the hand that fed them and got decimated in the process. Britannia still very much exists but not as a force of power and dominance but as one to spread peace. Its another form of dramatic irony when Lelouch winded up giving the very nation he said he would destroy a better tomorrow.
>>14406347
Japan is only free due to the Britannia's self-destroying regime. They were largely worthless and didn't do anything.
Mt.Fuji's destruction is suppose to be symbolic since it was their last reign of power they had before Lelouch destroyed it.
Britannia still very much exists and you keep dancing round that
>>14404349
No
He barely appears in the show for solid chunks, he doesn't grow, he factors very little into the story outside of he pilots stuff, he doesn't care about the plot, he cares about other characters but never really shows it, he only ever had one cool plan in battle and everyone sucks his dick for no reason
>>14406335
>Code Geass ended with Lelouch destroying Britannia's hegemony and allowing the Japanese to claim victory.
Right. So a nationalistic oligarchy that was an economic hegemon and pissed off the world gets invaded and crushed and made into subhumans. They flail helplessly for the sake of futile pride until a BAKA GAIJIN comes and actually molds their energies into something useful. They then abandon their leader, and he has to off himself in order to save them. And the best part is that at the end of it all, they think they're awesome but didn't learn a single thing from it, wholly ignorant of the lies that let them hang onto their jingoistic fervor. Japan hardly came off looking decent in Geass and they certainly didn't win either.
>>14404349
The only reason I even got the impression he was anything more than a bland side character was being prominent in promo material.
He's not a good character in general.
>>14406351
Lelouch set Britannia up to fail without him. He already freed the Areas and nobody else has a Geass that could keep the soldiers enslaved. Do you think Britannia isn't going to be restricted in world affairs after his fall?
>>14406359
Those who were being paraded around by Emperor Lelouch and freed by Zero will likely be celebrated for having opposed the empire. So the UFN/Japanese/non-Britannians will write history in their favor.
>>14406367
That's kind of true, although those who at last realized the truth about Lelouch will give him some credit in private,
>>14404715
Kudelia may have been shit but she was more of an MC with far more focus than Who.
>>14404349
At first I liked the idea of his character, but overall didn’t like him as main character never really developed and was kind of annoying, yet everyone loved him in the show, kind of liked Orga better but he was also wasted potential
>>14406347
>Britannia is no longer the world's leading superpower and can't invade anyone.
This is an irrelevant point to bring up since the only people who would have cared about this are already dead.
>>14406452
>Lelouch set Britannia up to fail without him.
Which is why he left them with the smartest person in the world to assist them?
>Do you think Britannia isn't going to be restricted in world affairs after his fall?
From the epilogue that doesn't seem to be the case at all. Nunnally is off it about making peace negotiations with the rest of the nations.
Lelouch only "destroyed" Charles' Britannia but the empire itself still remains and not with the assistance of Japan.
>it's a "/m/ discusses LotGH for babies" episode
>>14406509
pretty much what i was going to post.
also code gayass was a mistake.
>>14404642
I'd love a woman as a Gundam MC and no, 0080 doesn't count.
>>14406509
>happy mika and orga and they're not celebrating death
What is this
We have this thread 3 times a week.
>>14406776
i demand proof
>Mika thread
>turns into Code Geass thread
He's a murder machine
He has killed as many as Uso in half the time
>>14406802
fucking cgfags can't keep it down
>>14406807
>guarenteed replies
Nope
>>14406802
IBO is such shit even code geass is more interesting to talk about and that's saying something.
>>14406802
There's no other answer to OP's question beyond "no" so the thread had to get something to talk about.
>>14406826
is ibo that bad? i just watched the first ep so i can't really tell
>>14406840
It's good for a couple episodes, not fantastic but has potential. Once the space arc hits it goes waaaaaaay down hill. It comes out of the slow pacing slump but never redeems itself. Animation is awful, exposition never stops, characters barely develop (and happens in the most retarded ways), story overall is bad.
But if you can find enjoyment in it, good for you. Don't expect anyone else to agree, though.
>>14406826
No, I skimmed those posts. It's all two guys having a sperg fest while the rest of us actually talk about the thread topic.
>>14406840
IBO is fine, it's not a MASTERPIECE but it's not terrible.
The animation goes bad at some points but maintains a decent quality for the most part.
The space arc was lame to watch as it aired, but it's easy enough to handle now that the season is over.
The season finale was pretty good, I'm looking forward to S2 and hoping they remedy the few problems I've got.
>>14406840
It depends. It's a show that looks fine from a casual glance, with reactions to that ranging from it's great to unremarkable, but falls apart when you closely examine it.
Personally, 6/10 after the first season. Buildup with poor payoff, bloated generic cast, and the story is a prolonged escort mission. People keep saying it's gritty because of how the protagonists do whatever it takes to win, but things keep magically going their way and the show doesn't act like they're monsters for doing those kinds of things. In fact, they end up being called knights and heroes. Poorly executed show all around.
>>14404349
Lil nigga based as fuck he'd kill Kira and take his girl.
>>14406974
They are gritty in the sense they are foul mannered and the least likely you would expect to be knights and heroes. Even the interview mentions that, their tone is very "coarse" compared to Gjallarhorn's cast and Kudelia's.
>>14406915
>The season finale was pretty good
My favorite part was how no one died making Ein out to be an even worthless character than he already was.
>>14404349
orphas is a horrible gundam show. The only good part was first two episodes
>>14407217
So, the whole show's definition of gritty is that the heroes aren't the type you'd expect to be heroes? That's so fucking cliche it hurts. And they fail in that regard (sans Mikazuki) because they come off as generic anime kids intended to be likable.
>>14406840
First season definitely could've been better. Space arc dragged on longer than it needed to.
I don't anticipate the second season being a huge improvement, but I guess we'll find out.
>>14404349
He's better than Heero and Setsuna at least so far.
Orga was the one that actually got all the development and hardships.
Mika only gets top billing because he rides the Gundam.
>>14404637
Amuro, Kamille, Garrod, Loran, Shinn, Setsuna, and Bellri.
>>14408640
>Amuro
>>14408640
>no Domon
Fag alert.
>>14408429
>development and hardships.
No Orga didn't. He spends most of the show doing the exact same thing, throwing the whole crew at a problem and shouting to make it work and never having to learn from failure as plans go so well. Then the show pretends shit hits the fan cause one guy died, now they must take the dangerous road of......throwing everyone at a problem, shouting and not losing anyone else
>>14408809
>and not losing anyone else
I think you mean not losing any more named characters
>>14408820
Did they lose anyone past Biscuit? I guess they might have lost one of those tanks but it never gets brought up so in the end it still does fuck all for Orga's development
>>14404349
He rarely feels like a main character if at all. If anything he often just comes across as Orga's top lackey who just happens to pilot a Gundam.
>>14408834
they lost a bunch of no names
>>14409436
No Names and god nearly the entire Non Human Debris MW force and the Graze. So if they lost the battle it was the end of Tekkadan as they dont have an effective fighting force.
Also Akihiro, Shino and Mika took a lot of physical damage and Akihiro nearly died from AV feedback fending off the entire MS force
>>14411760
And the two qts from the harem ship can't forget em
>>14407374
Better than what most mecha leads has to offer. They dont spout talks of pacifism and philosophy for once. That is the job of a politician and established guys like Naze. They are essentially ZZ and Freeden Crew with more military training.
When was the last time we saw Roybea go to a whorehouse or a bar to pick up women?
>>14411801
>Better than what most mecha leads has to offer.
No
>They dont spout talks of pacifism and philosophy for once.
Really? Most of Orga's dialogue is him spouting that nonsense to the Human Debris also MUH FAMILY
>>14411939
>No
Yes
>Really? Most of Orga's dialogue is him spouting that nonsense to the Human Debris also MUH FAMILY
Either pay more attention next time or stick to A/Z.
the fact he uses a big dumb club is enough to be a good mc
My second favorite Gundam MC right behind Judy Ashta
>>14404349
Hes a poor mans Setsuna or Heero that panders to the Nothin Personnel audience. Orga on the other hand is cool
>>14418148
I should add, that I don't think he works as the MC without the rest of the cast. Obviously Orga, but since a lot of the people in this show are wusses, he's a good counter to their bitch-ness
>>14404349
>3 days ago
What the fuck, I thought this thread has been up for three months.
>>14404349
He's a great MC. It's such a same that EVER OTHER CHARACTER in this show is ABSOLUTE SHIT. I FUCKING HATED THEM ALL SO MUCH.
Plus the fights sucked. Great mecha designs but you never really got to see them fight.
I only watched the first four episodes, but I think that's a little too long for the main character to not show a single feeling.
Not to mention all the girls having crushes on him and him being the best pilot straight away. For reasons they explained, of course, but that doesn't make it less boring and Mary Sue-ey.
He felt more like he should have been the semi-perfect rival that motivates the protagonist. I just couldn't get attached to him in the slightest.
>inb4 I'm shat on for criticizing him without watching the whole series.
If I can't get even slightly invested in the protagonist that far in, why continue? Biscuit and Kudelia at least got me that far, but man, Mikazuki PERSONALLY killed the show for me.
>>14418456
his only job is to kill niggas tho
can't be a stu
Mika isn't good.
Mika isn't Gundam.
Mika isn't the main character.
>>14418482
He's cool, handsome, the best pilot, badly written, and everyone loves him. That's reminiscent enough of a bad self-insert to warrant the Stu tag, to me.
>>14418526
Self insert characters are more interesting than Mika though.
>>14418530
They are when they're bad enough to find funny, or at least show emotions.
I could see Mika as a self insert of someone who like Gundam for the fights/robots/waifus and nothing else.
>>14404349
He's a tool for the plot to use.
Yet the cast treats him very dramatically and lovingly.
He's a fucking paradox.
Like the scene when he's coming down from Orbit and everyone's crying, like there was ever any chance he was going to die. It felt disingenuous.
The really decent stuff with him is jammed early on, his interaction with Crank was enough to sell the show, but it's gets less and less towards the middle when they rely on the "Kudelia is so amazing" stuff.
Then at the end when he calls out Orga on his shit, and basically rationalizes out that he knows he's just a tool to facilitate the people he cares for, it gets better.
He kind of diverges from the path similar characters like Setsuna or Sousuke took.
I really hope they do more with him in Season 2, they have interesting setup with the whole "selling your soul to a demon" deal.
Maybe Orga will get called out for treating him as a trump card, or maybe he'll learn to have some agency of his own, or some more self preservation. It'd he;p to diverge him from Guts who he has a bit too much overlap with.
>>14418624
Simple. Kill off Orga.
Now Mika needs to think on his own.
>>14418657
This would work as a climax.
Like let Orga develop further with Merribit, and then in a crucial moment have him cement his ideals by sacrificing himself.
Have him give Mika some final command, and then close out.
>what is a Byronic hero
c'mon bros, get /lit/
Mika is a classic example of this kind of character; he's aloof, pragmatic to the core and driven by self-made principles. He's not one-dimensional, he's an archetype. That said, he's a character driven by ACTION rather than PSYCHOLOGY. His dialogue is used sparsely to soften him or endear him, not to reconcile his actions. It meshes well with IBO's motif of chivalry and knights.
What really fleshes out his character is the dynamic he has with Orga, who I'll argue is deuteragonist by virtue of his own admission. Mikas fielty to Orga; Orga's faith in Mika. That dynamic/structure is central to IBO
>>14418657
>>14418685
To be honest, we could lose Mika. One could argue that the Barbatos is the hero more-so than Mika, Mika is the replaceable tool. Have Mika die, have Orga go back under the knife for quadrupple allota vagina while Merribet cries impotently about the risks, and then Orga pilots the Barbatos alongside Not-Guts and the newcomer who is totally not Gaelio in a mask.
The only people who would recognize Gaelio are Mika, who'd be dead; Biscuit, who is dead; the twins & grandma, who are on Mars; Kudelia, who is on Earth; and McGillis, who'll be busy with Gjallarhorn.
IBO needs to take a GoT perspective on mortality. Time to clear the board and then add some new characters. Except for Gali Gali, because he is IBO's one true hero.
>>14419050
>IBO needs to take a GoT perspective on mortality
No fuck western shits
>>14418935
>What really fleshes out his character is the dynamic he has with Orga
So he's not fleshed out at all since their dynamic is barely given any focus
>>14419050
You're a fucking idiot.
Make barbatos self aware them kill mika
>>14419050
I haven't cringed this hard since forever good God.
I like how this started as a thread about Mika and then one post turned it into a shitwar about Code Geass... /m/ is truly doing gods work.
>>14419182
and went back to mika
>>14404349
Mikazuki is an abysmal Gundam MC.
>>14419192
They'll find something else unrelated to shitpost about give it enough time.
>>14418935
>That said, he's a character driven by ACTION rather than PSYCHOLOGY.
They have to do anything with this for it to mean anything. He is flat, dull and uninterested of everything around him despite apparently but rarely at best never showing it. And then it is never complex, just oh I like Atra I guess. There is never any negative consequence from what he does and how he acts. He doesn't seem knightly or unknightly
>What really fleshes out his character is the dynamic he has with Orga
Which amounts to about 5 scenes in the entire show, only two of which are kinda important. One where we learns he wants a farm, this was a decent one. The other he just goes lets keep doing exactly what we are doing, which would have weight if they didn't have minimal casualties and completed all of their goals.
>>14419182
well that's like every thread on 4chan you newfag
>>14419364
IBO is an ensemble piece where even ancillary characters get detailed backgrounds and flashbacks. What you criticize as 'flat' is actually an attempt by the writers to focus on the cast as opposed to the usual one-man show formula gundam tends to have.
The audience and even most of the characters already know who Mika is and not to fuck with him the moment they meet him. It's kind of a meta device. Mika is underwritten to let the huge cast of characters shine through. He's an illiterate would-be farmer who basically becomes a knight. It's an archetype pretty played out by now, and it's interesting how IBO uses that angle to tell a better story.
>>14419407
I had this in my mind in a while now nice to see someone put it into words better than I could.
However I also think this attempt backfired because the cast is more bloated than it needed to be and a few characters could stand to be merged or just cut off entirely with no actual repercussion to the plot.
As it is you do get a good sense of the relationship between the group but not much else.
>>14419407
>IBO is an ensemble piece where even ancillary characters get detailed backgrounds and flashbacks. What you criticize as 'flat' is actually an attempt by the writers to focus on the cast as opposed to the usual one-man show formula gundam tends to have.
yet none of them were any good.
