Were they doing the right thing?
If by "right thing" you mean following the advice of artificial intelligence, then no.
Innocent people died because they were just following orders and making a living
>>14135091
Nope. A private military force doesn't have the right to interfere in global politics.
>>14135091
Only in hindsight.
>>14135091
Once they weren't relying on Veda anymore, yes. Opting to intervene on the Thrones was the turning point.
>>14135091
>fighting in a conflict to end conflict
Reminded me too much of what Durandal said in Destiny about fighting LOGOS.
>>14135293
>War to end war.
Yeah that usually doesn't work.
>>14135174
That sounds like any military anon. Most people are in it for the paycheck.
>>14135091
By the end, yes. Rejecting the actions of the Trinities was a turning point, as was all the shit they went through between seasons.
In terms of the group's composition, the impact of trading Neil for Lyle is often understated. Neil basically hated everyone and everything, he was just really good at hiding it most of the time. A lot of the times when they talked about the morality of their actions, Neil was the one to voice the belief that they were villains: it was only after his death that they started becoming heroes.
Even then, a lot of the good of what they did is in hindsight, and could have just as easily gone wrong.
>>14135338
Funny enough though, I remember Neil complaining when the enemy suits wouldn't stand still so he could just shoot their head units instead of being forced to kill them. Lyle never had such reservations.
>>14135091
No because CB's idea of "peace" was a gilded cage in which mankind does what they want how they want went they want to the whims of a computer working of some vague instructions and the ideas of a deadman.
No Freedom, No Choice, Only what CB thinks is right. Or else.
Christ you're talking about a orginization that was putting explosive collars around peoples necks to get them to do what they want. The less said
about the observation innovados kill switch shit the better.
The shit CB did in the name of peace was appalling
>>14135338
Not really no they left VEDA manipulating mankind just with themselves calling the shots.
A benevolent dictatorship is still a dictatorship and the so called heros gave not one fuck about anything other than what they
wanted themselves all the while claiming they were doing it for others..
>>14135324
Look up the sidestories the only thing CB resembled was a religious cult worshiping Aeolia's ideals.
Scrape away the fancy super tech and all you have is a buch of psychos born n' raised without the ability to think or do anything other than follow Aeolia's dream.
>>14135538
>Scrape away the fancy super tech and all you have is a buch of psychos born n' raised without the ability to think or do anything other than follow Aeolia's dream.
Do you honestly, HONESTLY believe that an organization who makes the Exia would be evil? Is such a thing even possible?
>>14135609
Considering the bomb collars to force unwilling people into serving them and the unwitting Innovado spies with kill switches that go off when
they get too old and someone may notice them not aging slower than humans?
Yeah i do.
>>14135609
Exia has no integrity. The Flag Fighters were the pilots you were supposed to respect.
They did the right thing by unifying the world, but accidentally did it in a way that allowed Ribbons to take everything over and install the A-LAWS. Also, Celestial Being itself is very rocky. Our ship of protagonists were not taking lethal shots more than going lethal. The same cannot be said for Trinity, who were also technically Celestial Being, massacring everyone in their way, even innocents.
>>14135669
Unifying the world by manipulating it against its will? Yeah that sounds great.
Whats that you like something CB doesn't well thats too bad looks like it's a free bomb collar for you.
>>14135685
Considering that if they hadn't, the planet would have been destroyed by the ayys had they not, I'd say yeah.
>>14135617
Well, okay then. To be fair, CB also made Raphael, and you'd have to be pretty evil to create those robot pants.
Ok, re: Bomb Collar. It has absolutely no bearing on the show's events and CB's presentation therein.
It's basically the equivalent of fanfic in terms of how it affects the overall narrative.
If you want to not come off like a sperg, you should talk about how Ribbons had orders to kill everyone that just had the misfortune of witnessing O Gundam.
>>14135698
You mean the aliens that noone knew about untill the movie and before that were just another one of Aeolia's endless theories? Do remember CB's plan
for aliens didn't want to talk to them was to fuck off and leave the rest of mankind to rot originally.
>>14135707
Doesn't matter the side stories are part of it and were use specifialy to expand on CB's background.
Ribbon's orders were nothing in comparison to what they pulled with the Innovado observation units.
Artifical humans bred as spies never knowing VEDA was using them like fucking gopro's then before it becomes obvious they age slower than other humans "POP" dead in the name of Aeolia and CB's secrecy. Also the ones
who get awaken'd and just instantly discover what they are and become loyal to CB when VEDA sends the signal.
And you thought it was the pixie dust that brainwashed people.
>>14135730
They literally aren't people.
That's a non issue.
>>14135698
the ayy lmaos were probably attracted by the equipment and research going on in the jupiter ship, so without aeolia plans they probably wouldn't notice earth.
>>14135799
So because they were made and not born it doesn't matter if CB kills them off whenever to keep a secret.
All for a good cause huh?
>>14135712
I suppose the question is are we talking about old CB or new CB. Old CB is everything up until S2 and new CB is post S1. Old did a lot of shady shit, even now I'm not sure what the end goal is if it wasn't unite the world to prepare for ayys. New CB is essentially the Ptolemaios plus a bunch of R&D nerds who were trying to take out the corrupt government iirc.
>>14135091
the only thing they did wrong wasnot petting setsuna's fluffy hair
>>14135819
Again while they took out Ribbons and his lackeys they left VEDA manipulating mankind which considering how
much shit was done by the born and raised culties under it's orders... Yeah thats not really that good.
>>14135833
>manipulating mankind
I assumed they were more using it as like a guide. At any time they could chose to take it's advice or not.
>>14135799
If they have a human-like level of awareness and intelligence, can feel pain, emotions and etc. etc., I think the actually wrong thing to do would be to not treat them humanely because "lol not REAL people".
>>14135899
>can feel pain, emotions
Glib facsimiles of those notions is all the Innovades have.
Tieria just got redpilled with sapience when he lost contact with Veda
Nice work of fiction Anon.
Plenty of Innovades with personalities aside from Tieria and he didn't magically gain one later on he already had it.
>>@14135920
Just extensions of a supercomputer.
Prove me wrong.
I wonder how Setsuna would react if he ended up in G Gundam, where people come to an understanding by fighting each other with Gundams.
>>14136047
He'd cry because it would be Gundam gore. I has to be like dogfighting for him.
>this thread being full of filthy A-Laws sympathizers
Absolutely disgusting.
>>14135538
They believed in Aeolia's dream. They fought for what they believed, that makes them the same as other humans.
So, was Celestial Being supposed to be morally ambiguous? Reading the responses in this tread, I'm starting to question whether or not I got the wrong message from the writers of 00.
I know some series like SEED Destiny wanted you to favor one side, but I liked 00 because it didn't try to push that Celestial Being is good until the second season.
>>14135523
Their goal was creating peace. Give the size of their forces they couldnt do it by subjugating everyone. Instead they became a formidable enemy making the rest of the world ally to defeat them.
The only manipulation Veda did was faciliate an energy crisis in order for the de-nuclerization of Earth to happen and for the solar energy system and orbital elevator to be built. Sure the energy crisis incited wars but that's no different than what world leaders did, Aeolia's plan at least benefited humanity.
There is freedom and choice. Veda did not completely control mankind. If only it facilitated some events for the good of mankind, even in the end the ESF has access to Veda for assistance.
>>14136167
Yes, they are. They were a terrorist group after all.
The goals and ideals were for the benefit oh mankind but they ways werent "good".
S2 has them fighting against a corrupted unified world government which is clearly the evil. Other groups hate it and fight it for their own goals, CB fights it for their own goals as well, maybe even to correct the situation as it was their actions that created it. Katharon and CB at the beginning was a "The enemy of my enemy is my friend" type of relationship.
>>14136167
The main CB team is meant to be morally ambiguous, yes. The rest of the world wasn't entirely sure if they were terrorists or just radicals, since they only intervened in active firefights and refused to attack civilian targets. Allelujah saving the freefalling capsule added to this.
Public opinion of CB turned sour after the Trinities took the stage, which was their point as well. By creating an enemy in CB, the world would unite to fight against them, while also wiping out the threat of CB going rogue so Ribbons could hijack Veda and control the world. Obviously, CB didn't perish, but still remained public enemies as the not-Titans were established to prevent another group like CB from popping up again.
I guess once CB demonstrated the A-LAWS' corruption and mass murder, and uncovered the Innovades' conspiracy and stamped both out, public opinion rapidly shifted on them into them being the actual guardian angel force they claimed they were trying to be. Access to Veda afterwards to verify all this and the new government tired of war probably helped in this.
>>14136167
About as ambiguous as Tekkadan really
>>14136167
They're supposed to be more morally ambiguous at first, less as they start working to fix their mistakes, and then by the time of the movie they're basically only nominally enemies of the state, as in practice not too many people are actually all that interested in catching them anymore. Part of this is facilitated by the new government's own propaganda: in order to save face about everything that happened in S2, they more or less made the whole A-LAWS thing out to be an attempted coup and CB as the heroes who helped save the day.
A big theme of the show as a whole is that people can change, and part of that is CB's members starting out as a bunch of rejects, outcasts, and otherwise shitty people, and gradually becoming better than they used to be.
>>14135091
I really don't think the morally ambiguous thing of Season 1 holds up.
They were the objective villains of the story.
IMO it's the same situation as Kira from Death Note. Blatantly evil character that uses whatever reasoning he can to justify himself. However, Kira only got worse as time went on. CB at least got better and realized their early actions were pretty stupid post season 2.
I took a political science with a few animu nerds in college around the time season 1 was airing and the divided between people who had international relations experience and those who didn't was actually quite amazing. (The international politics students all hated the show in the first season)
>>14136396
>I took a political science with a few animu nerds in college around the time season 1 was airing and the divided between people who had international relations experience and those who didn't was actually quite amazing. (The international politics students all hated the show in the first season)
Storytime? This sounds interesting.
>>14136426
Basically they all argued (successfully IMO) that CB were basically terrorists or non-state actors that were no different that the crazies in WACO.
I don't remember the full argument, but they walked me thru step by step why their actions in season 1 would actually have a destabilizing effect on countries. The whole "the world will band together to stop us" idea actually wouldn't work and it would lead to massive Geo-political destabilization.
>>14135091
No, they were depicted to have killed far too many regular state forces (who were just doing their jobs protecting freedom) and not enough sandniggers and muslim niggers.
>>14136485
Reddit please, stick to your falseflagging on /pol/.
>>14135617
>side story shit
Not canon.
>>14135913
>Glib facsimiles
Go back to /tv/ faggot
>>14135091
No, they had no idea how the world functioned at all and were operating on incredibly juvenile and simplistic morality out of butthurt from their own pasts. The end of season 1 where they start getting BTFO left and right and was the high point of the series and the world felt interesting for a bit. Left me wondering how they would solve all the tension. Then aliens hiveminded everyone into being friendly lol problem solved :)
>>14135091
Yes, might makes right.
>>14136396
>They were the objective villains of the story.
>IMO it's the same situation as Kira from Death Note. Blatantly evil character that uses whatever reasoning he can to justify himself.
I don't really want to get into arguments the Internet has already gone over for decades, buy your views of morality seem pretty simplistic if you can't see any ambiguity in either situation.
>>14135091
Basically they didn't changed history at all. Look after the ELS war, a new war arose against Oldtypes and Innovades.
Still they have the most powerful gundams that you can have so fuck yeah!!!
>>14135091
Yes and no. Changing the world was necessary but the way they went about it (at least initially) was very clearly in the wrong. The individuals themselves (the Meisters and Ptolemy crew) were good though, as evidenced by their actions from the later half of S1 to the end of 00.
>>14135091
>Were they doing the right thing?
The end goal was noble enough. The difference between CB and the various countries/economic blocks is the goal they want to achieve. Both use violence when necessary. Countries use it to further their agenda, and they don't care wether they're killing civilians or not. They do it to gain more power, more resources, etc... CB doesn't give a shit about power, resources. They care about achieving a unified world that's ready to meet the challenge of space colonisation/exploration with all that entails for humanity.
>>14135617
>Considering the bomb collars to force unwilling people into serving them and the unwitting Innovado spies with kill switches that go off whenthey get too old and someone may notice them not aging slower than humans?Yeah i do.
Are you sure you watched Gundam 00 ? Because from your rantings it's pretty obvious you didn't. Side material is side material. If you want to make a judgment on CB you have to base yourself on what's depicted in the anime. And neither in season 1 nor season 2 do we ever see the Gundam meisters equiped with explosive collars. Not once.
Furthermore when talking about CB we have to keep in mind there are several competing forces at work. Aeolia Schenberg designed a plan in 3 phases. CB was one part of the plan, the other were the innovades and future innovators. It's the innovades that perverted Aeolia's plan for humanity. When you talk about humanity serving the innovades, that is not Aeolia Schenberg's plan. That is innovades run amok. It happens with artificial humans. CB and Tiera (an innovade) recognised this subversion and dealt with it. So no, CB was not ok with subjugating humanity at all. If you think the contrary well you simply haven't understood one damn thing of Gundam 00.
To recap what I remember of CB's plans and events from later in the series
>CB wants to forge peace through forcing everyone to stop fighting large scale wars
>but the actual goal was to unite the world against a common threat to advance technology super fast
>Old A.I dude in cryo freeze gets killed
>this unlocks his back up plan of Trans Am for CB to help further their plans somehow
>humanity advances but then it's revealed that this was all because A.I dude predicted the Ayy Lmao's being a threat to earth
Was this the extent of the plans laid out in that show?
>>14138571
No. The plan was to achieve world peace through three stages of development.
The first: Consolidate the world into three large geographic power blocs through the orbital elevators that caused nations to form tight alliances based around where they got energy from. The Solar Wars took place during this time period.
The second: unite those three power blocs by facing them with a threat that required unprecedented military cooperation, eventually bringing about unification into a Federation that would serve as a one world government. This is what Celestial Being exists to do: they irritate the power blocs into focusing on trying to capture them while acting in a manner that forces them to cooperate in order to do it. The Trinities and GN-Xs are a hijacking of this part of the plan: the goal was for it to take much, much longer to capture CB. Ribbons made more aggressive use of Veda to help ensure the formation of the Federation anyway, only with himself as its secret puppetmaster. The ideal outcome would have been for the united army to capture the four Gundams after many years and develop GN technology from them.
The third: use of GN Particles on an enormous scale would cause humanity to develop quantum brainwaves, something that could already be done in limited fashion via supersoldier programs. Innovators solve the fundamental flaw of Newtypes in that you don't have to be born special to become one. Everyone can have that power, there are no have-nots after long enough. Innovation, of course, is not a cure-all: Ali and Lyle got a look at each other and all they did was keep trying to kill each other, and the Innovades were assholes even though they had those powers too. But in an already unified society, that empathy lets future generations keep people like Ali or Andrei from coming about in the first place.
If we were to take all the side stories as rock-solid canon and all, it becomes pretty undeniable that CB was filled with psychos and that could, by extension, potentially paint Aeolia as a genius who happened to be either a closet madman or naive as fuck. Obviously, that's not how the series wants to portray him(at least not in such an extreme manner), so do you guys think his portrayal could be saved somehow?
Would it have helped if the story was to add some sort of inner dispute in CB itself over exactly what Aeolia meant with his plans and a power struggle between groups with different interpretations? It'd kind of make Aeolia seem like less of an evil fucker to the audience and CB would look like a more human and flawed group with good people and bad people rather than just a bunch of cutting-edge cult terrorists. Would that restore the ambiguous morality of 00?
I dunno, I'm just rambling here.
>>14138737
The end result would be a society prepared for the challenges of living in space and communicating with alien cultures that might be too powerful to defeat through strength of arms. The ELS happened to exemplify this: in combat they were absolutely unbeatable. Even the Full Saber would have lost. They're an extreme example, but really just about any civilization so advanced it could fly between the stars would curbstomp us. Trying to blast them with big guns isn't a viable plan. We have to hope they come in peace, and be able to return that sentiment. If they come for war, we're fucked, which is a good reason to colonize so we have more than just one planet.
>>14135226
Why not?
>>14135226
>>14141634
OP has a point. This attitude about the right of actual states to interfere in global politics is somewhat arbitrary, considering the lengths every single one of them is willing to go to in order to get ahead. We disdain non-state actors in real life, but then they've all been extremist terrorists that mostly target civilians or mercenary forces out for money.
It's one of those "for the greater good" things. They do bad things "for the greater good," and whether they're right is based on whether an individual believes that the ends justify the means. People can provide counterarguments to the actions CB does in the name of peace, so while their actions did lead to a better tomorrow, whether or not they were right is all a matter of opinion.
I like to think 00 was made as an open criticism of Kira's arc in Destiny. He didn't want to get involved early on, believing the world would work itself out. Then Destiny happened and Kira ends up going "If anyone tries to start a fight from now on, I'm going to end it." He and Lacus are going to use their positions in ZAFT to police the world in the name of peace, and the show treats it like "Wow. They've really gotten their shit together. Peace is at hand."
But the show also dismisses any criticisms of the character, instead romanticizing him. I can't count how many SEED-fanboys I've seen who think ZAFT soldiers would instantly forgive Kira because he let them live and only kills when he needs to. We see in 00 the people trying to stop CB in season 1 noting they only kill when they need too, and they don't give a shit about this because they think CB needs to be stopped.
00 examined what Kira became in s1, showing the mess what such a simple morality would do. S2 was there to grow CB into real heroes as they dealt with the consequences of their actions and even then, they weren't 100% forgiven. At the end, officially they're still being hunted and the Federation will step in if they start doing armed interventions again. They're not leading the world like the SEED cast.
>>14135617
Side material has Fon Spaak.
As such I consider it non-canon.
>>14135091
Yes they did the right thing.
The eradication of war through war wasn't really their long-game in the first place.
In the short run, yeah, they're terrible.
However in the end, humanity as a whole benefited from their interference.
That said, if they exited irl right now, I would be cheering them the fuck on.
>>14142766
Side material also has bullshit Marina getting married to Setsuna after being turned young again. Completely missing the point of their relationship in the show.
>>14138746
And if Aliens came along and got offended by CB's pixie dust space radio crap? Although this is the problem with CB in general everything they come up with is "Aeolia had a theory" crap with asumptions based on theories based
on yet more asumptions and theories.
CB was never justifyable because it was rotten to the core before the show even started. It's a 200 year old cult worshiping a deadman and listening
to a computer that tells them to do shit in the deadmans name. Ribbons points it out with Setsuna who was never intended as a meister which were actually ment to be gullible morons CB could use as scapegoats to dupe
the world into uniting.
>>14142766
True Fon was horrible.Literally Jesus Yamato mk2: EXETREME ASSHOLE EDITION!
>>14142786
That only works if they are uncorruptable- Oh wait they were corrupt from episode 1 so you except them manipulating you
form cradle to grave and hope they don't turn into assholes at some point?
Yeah i can see that ending well.
>>14142818
He's basically Ali as a protagonist.
People love Ali because he's a villain though.
>>14135091
I don't know if they were right, but they sure were a lesser evil compared with continuing with the ongoing war. At least they only targetted military targets to weaken their fighting force while the wars and experiments of the three superpowers caused civilian casualties and long term misery and overdependence of small countries that simply had to submit to the whims of the superpowers to get access to the new source of energy
>>14142814
>Ribbons points it out with Setsuna who was never intended as a meister
Just a moment. Humans are not destined to be Gundam meisters from birth. It doesn't work like that. Veda has final consent on who may be a Gundam pilot, but the obsevers can recomend people to join CB in various capacities. Setsuna was never destined from birth to pilot a Gundam, but then nobody else was. It's like saying Sumeraghi was always destined to be a tactical forecaster for CB. Of course not. She was enlisted in CB after she quit the AEU army because of the error she made resulting in the death of many soldiers. She was recomended to Veda and the computer accepted. Had she stayed in the AEU army Veda might have chosen another guy/gal to take on the role of tactician. Setsuna as a child soldier impressed Ribbons so much that he spared his life on the battlefield. And later recomended Setsuna to Veda. This is not Gundam Destiny.
>>14142831
But that's not what happened. You're talking hypotheticals. In the end humanity benefited.
True Ribbons took control, but then he got his ass kicked. That's what happened. The End. Plus corruption was taken into account by Aeolia if you didn't notice.
More importantly though, why are you so mad? Are you Wackmodder by chance?
>>14142839
I haven't read the side-stuff, but as far as I know from what I've heard, he's a mary-sue. Which Ali isn't.
There was some bullshit about Spaak being a better pilot that Innovator Setsuna from the Extreme Vs manga.
That tells me enough about the person in charge of writing the side stories.
>>14142814
The point of Quantum brainwaves is that it is a universal language, transferring what the other person feels and knows directly.
>>14142814
>And if Aliens came along and got offended by CB's pixie dust space radio crap
Well without said pixie dust, humanity would've been doomed anyway.
Plus that wouldn't make sense. Quantum brainwaves just allows sentient beings to communicate on a non-verbal level. That's it.
Getting offended by that would be the equivalent of getting angry at people around you for no reason.
>Aeolia had a theory crap
Yeah. A proven theory that worked.
>It's a 200 year old cult worshiping a deadman and listening
So I guess all Christians are evil huh.
Not to mention CB's purpose was to elevate humanity to new heights, so that when it went out into space, we wouldn't try to kill everything we see (and prevent humanity from killing itself before we got the chance to venture out into space).
Nothing evil about that.
Did you even watch the show or did you just get anal blasted when you read the summary.
You're not an IBO fag are you?
>>14142844
What are you waffling on about i never implied any destined from birth crap.
CB's recruitment is mostly inhouse from the cultbaby families however they also recruit outsiders if they meet the requirements and have a suitible psyche profile.
That's how they find candidates and Veda gives the final ok. This is how Sumeragi, most of the meisters etc were picked.
However you also have situations when they can't find a person with the right mindset only the skills at which point they either wait untill they can find a better candidate or if it's urgent/they can't find an alternative they just do what they did with Fon and Marlene. Slap a bomb collar on em and enforce loyalty.
>>14142860
I was answering >>14142786 about cheering a CB group on if it existed IRL a group like that is only good untill it's not and since it's run by humans who are flawed, vicious, deceitful, violent by nature corruption is inevitable.
Hell S1 makes it quite clear CB was as corrupt as any banana republic and assuming it could never be corrupt again is the height of arrogance.
>>14142866
I'd explain the difference between understanding and aggreeing with something but that's an old done to death
plothole when it came to the QB stuff.
>>14142892
Never said they were all evil i said you can't call a group behaving like CB good nor can you assume it'll be uncorruptable period
when the show itself makes it clear they can and are corrupt.
>>14142904
Oh ok, so you're just a cynic who didn't even watch the show.
Fuck off
>>14142909
You said CB wasn't justifiable because it was rotten to its core when in reality is was just a splinter faction that took control late in CB's existence.
Also by stating they weren't justifiable you deny all the benefit humanity as a whole (big picture) gained from their existence.
They didn't worship Aeolia, they joined because their ideals coincided with his. Did you see any photographs of his face hanging around the Ptolemy?
The crew didn't even bring him up that much during the show.
>>14142904
>I'd explain the difference between understanding and agreeing with something but that's an old done to death
That's somewhat the point. You understand on the lowest "complexity" level that you have to agree. It's how the ELS were pacified. They "understood" that assimilating humans they kill them. That translates to their hive mind as essentially killing their whole species, termination of existence.
Sure they may come across a species which disregards the concept of death. Maybe they'll find another common concept to connect over. Maybe they'll find nothing and maybe that will lead to conflict but at that point everything that can be done to avoid conflict has been done.
Aeolia Schenberg was basically an infinitely better version of Veidt from The Watchmen.
Rather than saving humanity from a single potential incident of nuclear devastation, Aeolia thought farther ahead, and saved humanity from ever starting such a conflict ever again (or at least lowered the possibility by a lot). He literally made everyone evolve, granting them the gift of telepathic empathy.
>>14142866
That's just dumb. In fact that's the biggest bullshit element in the 00 setting. There is no reason to think that Quantum Brainwaves is the universal language if uninnovaded humans can't understand it. It's basically like the guy that invented esperanto thinks it's the universal language.. If the entire setting of 00 has been set around finding a "spore" or "corpse" at Jupiter wherefrom the entire GN pixie dust science has been reverse engineered in preparation for the arrival of the main swarm then it would have made sense.
>>14143066
Fine, i didnt write it quite well. Quantum brainwaves will allow someone who can use them to be able to understand and talk to anyone and everyone.
>>14143066
>if uninnovaded humans can't understand it
What are you talking about.
There were multiple times that uninnovated humans were able to communicate or empathize via gn particles.
Did you even watch the show?
Please just stop already.
I wasn't a huge fan of S2 either, but most of the detractors in this thread are straight up retarded.
>>14143066
Unmodified humans can receive quantum brainwave messages and do on multiple occassions. Innovation grants the ability to broadcast them, but everything can receive them.
>>14143092
Most are probably parroting shitposts from when the show came out. Gundam 00 wasn't perfect, but it was an overall fun show with bigger ideas than it could manage sometimes.
>>14143152
>Most are probably parroting shitposts from when the show came out. Gundam 00 wasn't perfect, but it was an overall fun show with bigger ideas than it could manage sometimes.
To be honest I like Gundam 00, seasons 1 and 2. But I thought the film was just not necessary. The series should have ended right after season 2 and leave the rest to the imagination of the viewer.
On the grand scheme of things I think Gundam 00 was one of the most ambitious Gundams series ever attempted. It wasn't silly, it had an intelligent story, a well thought out worldbuilding, the characters were varied and some of the action sequences were absolutely superb. I still cannot get out of mind the assault on the first orbital laser.
Gundam 00 shows that we don't need to be forever shackled to the UC and Zeon wankfestery. The downside is that you need a planetary alignment to get Sunrise to write another good Gundam series. Doing a UC series in the form of ovas, ovas transformed into tv series is quick and dirty but it will never achieve the epicness of stories that are just good from the start.
>>14143090
>>14143104
GN particle enabled communication is pretty much an "innovated" human. That's pretty much the entire point about Setsuna being the first innovator and how the rest of mankind follow suit. I wasn't talking abotu the CB created "Innovade"
>>14142967
Very succinct and severely underrated response.
