What the Fuck?! (CCA)
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You are currently reading a thread in /m/ - Mecha
Hey I just started watching Char's Counterattack and uhhh.. what the fuck happened?Why is Char all of a sudden such a cunt?
He was so fucking reasonable and cool in Zeta, but now he wants to freeze the earth? Did he get brain damage when Haman whooped him in Zeta? I feel like there was a season of character development that is just... missing.
What the fuck?!
The mobile suits look beautiful tho, and I cant wait to watch the rest.
Char wasn't in Zeta, that was Quattro.
>>14122197
>Char
>Zeta
What?
>>14122197
>He was so fucking reasonable and cool in Zeta, but now he wants to freeze the earth?
Did you not pay attention? Zeta spent its entire run trying to force the viewer to realize that the Quattro persona was just another mask.
Char was always a petty, small-minded, revenge-driven pathetic excuse for a human being. He just spent most of Zeta in denial about it.
Tomino's a hack, and fans can't get enough of the Char/Amuro "rivalry".
Basically like Gundam itself, people can never move on.
>>14122197
This is a shit thread.
Please sage.
>>14122243
and the fifty IBO IZ BAD GUIS threads aren't? fuck off
>>14122218
>>14122230
No No I mean the second half of zeta where Quattro disappears and is replaced by Char.
>>14122238
But he wasnt a psychopath, sure he was petty and emotional, but there is a fine line between telling Haman to suck a dick during a diplomatic meeting, and asteroid-nuking the earth!
>>14122274
New to /m/ much?
>>14122276
>tfw browsed 4chin for 6 years
>tfw have only been browsing /m/ for 6 months
I get the Quattro joke though
>>14122197
It's not at all out of character. Go watch his speech at Dakar again. Zeta was him trying to give Amuro's point of view a chance; He gave humanity an opportunity to change on its own, and it didn't. By the time Char's Counterattack starts, it's the same old status quo. He decides that humanity won't change voluntarily and sets about to force change himself.
>>14122311
I really hate that picture. You know the context of that last frame is Char remembering Lalah's death, right?
>Why is Char all of a sudden such a cunt?
>all of a sudden
>>14122311
I guess you're right. The evidence is there, but I guess I focused more on him and Kamille bro'ing down and less on his hatred for earth in Zeta.
I really liked Kamille as a character and protag :^(
>Amuro, I'm already a demon
>>14122331
Char corrupted Kamille
>The people who need to be eliminated are those whose souls are weighed down by gravity!
>>14122343
Kamille a PURE!
>However! Even that cause doesn't justify the killing of so many people!
>>14122197
Char was always a cunt, him being Quattro was him just wanting to be a soldier, then he became leader of AEUG and had to deal with everyone elses bullshit, especially Reccoa's and Haman's. He gave humanity time and it didn't change fast enough for him, so CCA is a last ditch attempt at forcing people off Earth, literally.
>>14122274
Why are you deflecting with "other people made shit threads, so I should make them too"
Also, you could have at least shown the courtesy to crop out the kiss anime logo and the video player.
That being said, I think Char makes sense if you read between the lines and fill in the gaps a little.
He acted nice while in the AEUG because its what got him ahead. At the time, the AEUG seemed like the best way to get people moving off of earth as per daddys ideals. By the end of Grypps and Neo Zeon though, AEUG is dead. Char decides that shit's just taking way too long so he comes up with a plan to force humanity off because shit's taking too long.
>>14122197
>what the fuck happened?
Casval gets through life by pretending to be whatever he thinks the people around him want him to be. In MSG that meant pretending to be Char "The Red Comet" Aznable. In Zeta that meant pretending to be Quadrapussy until he got pressured into pretending to be Zeon Zum Deikun Jr at Dakar. In CCA it meant pretending to be Char Aznable, Son of Deikun. He wasn't really trying to carry out his father's legacy, he was just being the "Hero of Zeon" that everyone around him wanted him to be.
Even back in MSG he seemed "resonable and cool" when he wasn't shooting defenseless old men in a sandstorm in the middle of a desert. His behavior in Zeta isn't really any different than his behavior in MSG except that he's run out of Zabis to murder.
>>14122274
>But he wasnt a psychopath
That's where you fucked up anon. Don't let the Quattro guise fool you. There is nothing under that mask.
CCA is much easier to swallow once you realize Char is nothing more than an empty shell. After Kamille gets his just deserts Char loses all hopes. Wanting to conduct one final act of revenge against Amuro and the EF for Lalah, that's where CCA starts off.
>>14122397
>After Kamille gets his just deserts
Get ye gone, Scirocco ghost!
>>14122397
>After Kamille gets his just deserts
Living happily ever after with a Chinese girlfriend?
>>14122331
Yeah, totally makes sense from the last things Char said in Zeta
>>14122417
>the last things Char said in Zeta
Pretty sure the last thing Char said in Zeta was "You can't use your funnels in here!" when he was fighting Haman inside that ship that was about to blow up.
>>14122311
>Zeta was him trying to give Amuro's point of view a chance; He gave humanity an opportunity to change on its own, and it didn't
What view? That humans were killing the Earth? That humans can only achieve peace and understanding if they move to outer space? That Zeon was right all along?
All of those theories were proven to just be naive and idealist.
>>14122426
I think you are missing the point.
>>14122383
Well...My shit thread is leading to a discussion!
and I bet you're mad that I am watching the dub version too! Ha Ha Ha
>You can't use your logic in here!
>>14122397
>CCA is much easier to swallow once you realize Char is nothing more than an empty shell.
This is shamefully true. Char is for all intents and purposes is really three characters between 0079, Zeta, and CCA. He just changes hats depending on the role the story needs him to be.
>>14122197
>kissanime
get fug
>>14122519
Or he's just a manipulative sociopath who will do whatever it takes to accomplish his agenda such as backstabbing his best friend.
>>14122417
Char spends the majority of the show talking about how he's a warrior and how great it is to be murdering people in his giant robot. Like, Tomino isn't even subtle about it at all. He's all wrapped up about newtypes because he's only ever been beaten by them.
>>14122495
Missing the point
You could have easily turned your shit thread into an even better thread if you just took five minutes out of your time.
I actually liked Zetas dub a fair bit.
>>14122417
haman and sirocco call him on this being bullshit though, turns out they were right.
>>14122197
>Why is Char all of a sudden such a cunt?
ahahahaha
>>14122318
but its impossible for char to remember lalah without thinking of amuro. he had feelings for her, sure, but he also wanted to use her as a weapon so spacenoids would win the war and usher in the newtype era. he can't help but blame amuro both for killing lalah and for stealing her love away from him, and this combined with his desire for all humans to leave earth and live in spacenoid harmony is the entire reason for CCA in the first place. I've convinced myself that lalah and amuro had more to do with Char's plan to drop axis on earth than any of his highfalutin language about nature and mother earth, even if that is a constant theme in the gundam universe.
Oh look it's another "I didn't watch TV Zeta why is Char the bad guy now" thread.
Saged.
>>14124889
Fuck off Titan scum, I did watch tv zeta.
I guess i got fooled by quattro though, cause i really liked him in zeta and felt like char could really be a good guy.
This thread remind me of the ending of the Zeta Gundam game, i don't think is canon anyway.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQMz7YHPIiI
>>14125137
that ending actually does a good job of making the jump from zeta to CCA character development-wise
>>14125189
Not really, because it places a lot of the impetus of that change in attitude on Kamille and his loss, which makes no sense.
Even if he'd actually been around to realize Kamille was hurt (he wasn't), he'd have realized he got better long before that if he gave the least bit of a shit about Kamille (he didn't). Not to mention that Kamille was hurt by another spacenoid and there's no real reason to take that kind of attitude or that bias against Earth because of it. Especially when he already has perfectly good reason even discounting the death of Lalah in the Federation being just as bad in ZZ as they were in Zeta.
>>14122197
>>14122290
>>14122331
>kissanime
Wew
>>14122413
>ZZ
>>14122197
>Why is Char all of a sudden such a cunt?
>He was so fucking reasonable and cool in Zeta
You got played, son.
>make villian likable to people who won't read between the lines
>later remind people villian is an irredeemable dickhead
>>14122438
No, the view that humans can change. Char's meteor fiasco happened because he was convinced that, despite his efforts, people were not going to change unless he forced them to. Amuro, however, wanted to wait until humanity was ready.
The old Zeta Video game had a great scene that really dives home the point with Char.
and I found it.
https://youtu.be/KQMz7YHPIiI
It's not technically official, but it fills the gap nicely.
![[EG]Turn-A_Gundam_BD_44(1080p_10bit[EFEC6C59].mkv_snapshot_06.39_[2016.03.16_19.21.42].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/2T0ULnS.jpg "[EG]Turn-A_Gundam_BD_44(1080p_10bit[EFEC6C59].mkv_snapshot_06.39_[2016.03.16_19.21.42].jpg")
>>14122495
Not to sound like a Tomino character but fuck off children aren't allowed here. It's shameful how many people responded earnestly.
>>14125759
>you're just a stupid adult! What would you know?!
On the disapointing side, I'm 19 and not actually a child. But on a board about discussing japanese childrens cartoons, im not ashamed of acting immature.
You should really relax and not get worked up over threads like this. Im glad that this lead to actual discussion and not people bitching about G-reco and IBO. char is an interestingly written character (good or bad) and deserves discussion.
>>14125716
Did they really put Mineva under Char's guardianship? Lol
>>14125899
It's fan-fiction from a video game and not official, so not really.
>>14125888
You type like a pouty child.
>im not ashamed of acting immature
You really should be. Not only of just being an immature manchild as opposed to a mature sophisticated manchild, but with watching your fucking anime on a streaming site.
>Im glad that this lead to actual discussion
This is the exact same discussion we have whenever some special needs child watches CCA for the first time and has to have Char's entire basic character explained to him. Congrats Newfag on not even bothering to lurk for a month.
>>14125888
We've had a bazillion discussions about Chars character.
>>14125933
>le streaming is bad meme
Bro calm down. Also i lurked for a month before posting... 5 months ago.
You keep projecting and all it is doing is making me laugh at you more.
Chill out
>>14125888
>I'm 19 and not actually a child
lol
if you can't drink you're not an adult.
>>14125981
>can't
Choose your words carefully.
>>14125946
Not the anon you've been talking to but 6 months still means you're incredibly new here, which is evident in your posting. Maybe you should have been paying attention during your time here. You're the only one being laughed at.
>>14122197
CCA is bad and representative of everything wrong with this crap franchise
>>14126074
You are bad and representative of everything wrong with /m/.
>>14126045
Ok, my bad.
Fuck every one of you faggots that make this thread every other day. Pay the fuck attention.
It's only hard to believe if you think Char had, at all, a reforming/positive view of earthnoids during/after Zeta. It's clear he didn't. Char wanted to try to find change through the youth and not through Zeon. When the youth (kamille) got fucked up, he went back to basically the only thing he knew, which was leading Zeon.
It's not so hard to believe, you just have to believe Char is a fucking nuanced character, or something. He still has all those crazy ass extremist views from MSG, he's just a man trying to escape the gravity of his own destiny, where it turns out clearly that he cannot
>>14126112
>When the youth (kamille) got fucked up, he went back to basically the only thing he knew, which was leading Zeon.
But someone in the thread already pointed out that's complete horseshit.
>>14125981
Drinking is pointless anyway, and a waste of money.
>cuckchan /m/ STILL has threads with newfags going "hurr y char evil nao" while watching CCA
>>14122197
>He was so reasonable in Zeta
>>14122197
Char watched the AEUG be absorbed into the EFF, and the migration he mad his big speech about didn't happen. Combine that with his already fragile state of mind and his relentless attitude towards achieving his goals and the possibility of mild hypoxia, and you get CCA char.
Char started as a dick, turned a new leaf, and then became impatient and embittered.
>>14126600
All his pupil who represented the good and power for change youth held was turned into a vegetable
Char got redpilled.
>>14126112
> He still has all those crazy ass extremist views from MSG
What extremist views? He doesn't mention any in MSG at all, or in Zeta till Dakar.
>>14127076
>death to the Zabis
>>14127109
That isn't an extremist view. It's a personal goal and not in the least extreme in the then UC environment.
>>14122197
>Why is Char all of a sudden such a cunt?
The way I see it is that Char is a victim of terrible writing. His evolution as character between 0079, Zeta, and CCA is so disjointed that it feels like he's really a different person in each story: The mysterious maverick, the rebel outlaw, and the noble leader. As the audience we are meant to accept that Char is actually honorable and virtuous. However if you look at certain actions he takes throughout his history throughout the series you he does things that are he's selfish, short-sighted, petulant, self-rationalizing, back-stabbing, homicidal, genocidal, and egomaniacal. There's even an in-universe rumour that he's a pedophile.
All this because of lazy, shitty writing.
>>14127109
>>14127281
This is another inconsistency with Char as a character. He commits to a revenge plan that he should kill all Zabi. He makes sure the patriarch of the family is dead and goes out of his way to wipe out an entire generation of Zabi family members.
Why does he let Mineva live?
>>14127325
Even Char couldn't bring himself to kill a literal child who had nothing to do with it. He could kill Garma cause Garma was a full grown adult and he could rationalize that somewhat as him being part of the family legacy and an unfortunate victim. He couldn't do it for Mineva though. Alternately he couldn't get away with a character assassinating a child yet. He got away with accidental death a few times later (like Ideon and F91), but deliberate killing is another matter.
>>14127325
Mineva was a babby who dindu nuffin
You can see that she's been indoctrinated and lead by Haman and co. Perhaps Char felt sorry for her. Mineva is just as much a victim of the Zabis as he is.
>>14127330
Haman wouldn't get her hands on her till sometime after 0079. Which is probably why Char is so mad at her, cause she's made Mineva a part of that Zabi mindset and legacy despite his mercy. The fact he suspects she's drug some lookalike in to the matter can't have helped.
Mineva turning out to not want to be part of the Zabi legacy is probably one of the few vindications he really had in life, and something he'd be proud to see if he were around.
>>14124932
But he IS a good guy. Well, his intentions are. He just lost faith in humanity but still he wants humanity to evolve and understand each other.
Maybe he acts like a cunt in CCA, yeah. But his intentions remained the same in 0079, Zeta and CCA, and those are good intentions all along.
>>14127398
> 0079: Fuck the Zabis. Later, fuck Amuro
> Zeta: Fuck the Titans. Later, everyone should be newtype
> CCA: Fuck Earth, and maybe Amuro too
> his intentions remained the same
>>14127401
The biggest is his sudden complete reversal on compassion. He suddenly thinks that he should make Earth uninhabitable and somehow the spacenoids are automatically good people, instead of believing there to be some good in people despite their station in life.
>>14127401
char has some interesting sentiments
>>14127401
They do. From the start he wanted humanity to go to space and break free from gravity. Rewatch Zeta and you'll see it.
Well, more than "his ideal" it was his father's ideal, so the idea was already in 0079.
>>14128080
He didn't have them in 0079 though. So it's not consistent. Them being his Dad's doesn't make them his.
Wow, people are still replying to my thread. Cool beans
So i have started watching the Unicorn OVA's and full frontal is a CHAR, but is he the char? He has the same scar as char but the real char should have blown up in rentry at the end of CCA
How did he escape? Or if it is some crazy newtype magic, how the fuck does it work?
>>14128103
Maybe finish watching it before asking questions?
>>14128107
Ok.
It's really good so far; this animation quality is insane.
>>14127318
>The mysterious maverick, the rebel outlaw, and the noble leader. As the audience we are meant to accept that Char is actually honorable and virtuous.
That's the whole point. Char has always been a giant cunt who manipulates others to meet his goals. He wears a mask both literally and figuratively. When the situation changes, he changes his "mask" and plays a different role to meet his own ends.
>>14122197
>He was so fucking reasonable and cool in Zeta
Char was and always had been a petty dick bag that used big words to fool people and himself into believing he had a greater cause
In 0079 he is killing the zabi out of revenge, despite not even being that close to his father and abandoning his sister to do so (who he barely tries to stop getting killed later). Later he gives that all up cause he has huge mother issues which lalah filled, but the Amuro took away
Zeta he acts like he cares about newtypes and spacenoids, but is all for experiments that make fucked up cyber newtypes and really just wanted to undermine Haman
In CCA he is willing to fuck up the earth worse than anyone else cause spacenoids, but really he just wanted to fight Amuro cause he was still not over Lalah but have fuck all left at this point.
>>14128190
>budgets makes it good
fuck off
>>14122417
>Zeta last ep with him on a stage trying to expose grand sounding shit
How do people still struggle with the whole Char is constantly faking shit and is actually petty thing?
Also no one ever seems to notice that Char only uses newtypes as tools, never trying to form this grand bollocks future. The only one who ever did was Bright in ZZ who let the kids decide for themselves what to do
>>14128288
>being good makes it good
no u
pic related is something from a low budget show for you.
Banagher and Riddhe are actually likable characters despite their flaws and waifu-itis too.
They really did verbatim copy amuro when they made banagher tho.
>>14128556
Banana is shit.
>>14127401
> 0079: We need to get people off earth and fulfill my fathers ideals. Also, Fuck the Zabis, Fuck Amuro.
> Zeta: We need to get people off earth and fulfill my fathers ideals. Also, Fuck the Titans, Fuck Haman and her Zabi Revivalism.
> CCA: We need to get people off earth and fulfill my fathers ideals. Also, Fuck Earth, the Feds, and Amuro too.
His bigger plans remained the same since the end of 0079 when he starts focusing on his fathers ideals. It just so happens that Char is a kind of petty guy who lets his personal feelings get in the way of these goals, like when he gave Amuro the psycho-frame.
>>14128755
>petty guy who lets his personal feelings get in the way of these goals
They personal feelings ARE his goals, he just uses grander ideals to justify them but will switch plans on a dime and just find a way to justify it to himself
>>14126741
Underrated.
>>14128755
He never had his father's ideals as a goal in 0079. Putting it there is just plain inaccurate. His only goals were revenge and then later killing Amuro.
>>14128823
Except he did. When they meet in the Texas colony he brings up his father's death and how the Zabis twisted Degwin's newtype philosophy to mean that the spacenoids are above the Earthnoids and don't have to obey the Earth. But Char's own conclusion is that all oldtypes must be destroyed and Sayla accuses him of wanting to create a world ruled by newtypes. Char's only rebuttal is that he just wants to let newtypes live as newtypes, but we already get an idea of what that entails since he thinks the old will be destroyed.
>>14128940
Him mentioning it once doesn't make it a goal or intention.
>>14122417
Ah yes, no ever acts on a stage.
>>14128956
He talks about it again with Amuro in their hand to hand battle after last shooting. It comes in very late in the show - but it is there.
>>14130648
Ah yes, no-one one ever tells the truth because they're on a stage.
>>14130656
I think you missed the point anon. It doesn't matter if he mentioned it once or twice (or thrice or whatever), he never had it as a goal. His only real goals in 0079 were killing the Zabis and later Amuro. He might have believed his dad was right, but if he didn't act on that belief it is neither a goal or an intention.
Even then you still have odd sentiments like >>14128067 that contradict it and give the idea he thinks ALL newtypes deserve death. That probably isn't what he meant, but the wording (or translation) is ambiguous.
>>14132400
What if Quattro was just a guy pretending to be Char pretending to be someone else.
>>14128243
But what remains when you strip the masks away?
Nothing. Char doesn't actually exist.
>>14128556
IBO has a very large budget. It's just that the animators don't (and shouldn't) give a shit about ensuring perfection on a distant character running for a split second. I guarantee that most people didn't notice that until someone screencapped it.
And I could give a shit about IBO.
>>14128311
I think the way it really happened is that Char DID stop being petty at one point in Zeta (although there is still a personal struggle), but after that series ends he turned into an impatient madman.
>>14132662
>IBO has a very large budget. It's just that the animators don't (and shouldn't) give a shit about ensuring perfection on a distant character running for a split second. I guarantee that most people didn't notice that until someone screencapped it. And I could give a shit about IBO.
Large budget my ass. Quality was all over the place. Not only in the gundam fight scenes, in the characters with little detail even in close ups and especially the backgrounds. Simplistic, monotonous and devoid of life to the extreme. Jesus man, even G-Recko had better evironomental art than IBO.
Lets not mince words. IBO was Sunrise's quick dirty series. They didn't invest jack shit into it. I'm watching again Gundam 00 again and there is simply no contest at all. If IBO had a large budget than Gundam 00 had what ? A film like budget ?
>>14132672
Well, let's see the events:
Kamille becomes a vegetable, your pseudo-son is brain-dead (he got better, but you didn't pay attention to that fact)
AEUG is gutted. Federation is busy purging the shit out of Titans holdouts.
Federation escapes Dublin colony drop in private jets, no fucks given to other civilians. No Federation regular military to gun down Neo Zeon forces forcing people to stay in Dublin. Fuck.
Minerva Zabi is still brainwashed or a double. Either way, fuck Haman.
Neo Zeon only crumbles when you trick the clone of Ghiren Zabi into betraying Haman, earning another kill on the Zabi vengeance.
Yeah, he might as well pull a rebellion if he thinks nothing really matters anymore.
>>14132709
> pseudo-son
You don't actually believe that, do you?
>>14132719
Student, or whatever. Point is, Char seemed to actually give a damn about Kamille, even after the breakdown when Kamille beat him.
>>14132740
He like Kamille. He liked a lot of people. He still betrayed them ir walked away because it's only a superficial relationships and he doesn't actually care about those people at the end of the day. Which is why he not only didn't realise Kamille was hurt, he never even stuck around to see if he was okay after fighting Scirocco.
>>14132750
That interpretation could be correct, Char was really good at running away from responsibility.
Frankly though, I think Char might have suffered a bit from dropped plotlines in ZZ, like Mashymere did. Both of them showed up in the first opening, Judeau yelling at Char in Quattro costume and Mashy standing next to the ZZ crew like he joined them.
According to something I read on Mechatalk, CCA got greenlit during ZZ's production, meaning Tomino scrapped Char's plot from ZZ. Which leads to the question of whether he was stabbing Haman in place of Glemy, dropping Axis, or both.
>>14132778
http://pastebin.com/0SkxGTUt
He worked under Haman as a double agent and then killed her. I would take Zeta Part II over ZZ and CCA any day of the week.
Char almost definitely suffered from dropped plot lines. He even suffered them from 0079, where originally he was supposed to help Gihren become sole Zabi survivor and essentially win, but realize he had helped him too late by focusing so much on Amuro and so help Amuro kill him in the full but much more mundane plot of 0079 than what we got. He turned out to be the most popular character in 0079, so Zeta made him a good guy and he was originally going to only become an anti-hero who helped Judau but then CCA got made and that too went out the window.
The conclusion drawn from what we got though is that Kamille was never more than a friend, that he was happy to walk away from him and the A.E.U.G. when he got what he wanted (no more Titans) and that while he liked Kamille, he never knew of his health problems and wouldn't have really cared if he had.
>>14132709
>Minerva
GOD DAMMIT STOP THIS.
THERE IS NO 'R' IN MINEVA.
I DON'T CARE IF YOU THINK IT *SHOULD* BE THERE, IT'S NOT IN THE FUCKING KATAKANA.
>>14122197
only retards think this.
what did he mean by this?
>>14132863
>being this triggered when somebody mentions Mirneva.
Chill out, bro. You don't want to die a friendless virgin, do you?
