Can we all agree that Okawara is the WORST Jap mecha designer ever?
>>11949270
>>11949270
gonna need more examples before I can pass judgement. Okawara is in the running, though.
No.
Because he has done so many designs and contributed so much to the genre. Odds are that there is at least one mecha you like that was designed by him. He did more than Gundam.
>>11949294
If Okawara designed the scopedog then that means it's officially shit now.
>>11949294
This. While I might even go so far as to say that the majority of Okawara's designs are bad he's done so much stuff that he still has more good designs than most other mecha designers.
![psp21_kunio1[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/ziKcTbk.jpg "psp21_kunio1[1].jpg")
>>11949294
It bothers me when people say that Okawara can't make good designs anymore.
Look, there's only so many RX-78-2-based Gundams you can churn out. His non-Gundam designs look as good as ever. I think Okawara's biggest strength lies in things that don't have full humanoid proportions, like the Vifam mecha and Votom's Scopedogs and other assorted ATs.
His lineart also sucks, his stuff always looks better when drawn by pretty much anybody but him. He does some nice watercolours though.
>>11949270
I've thought about this a lot. The answer is no.
He's certainly not the best, indeed he's nowhere near the best. However, he is a GOOD mecha designer. And, it's worth mentioning he was the first mecha designer.
Okawara's problem is that he's a bad draftsman; his designs invariably look better when drawn or animated by other people.
Pic related: a lovely CG rendition of what is, unbelievably enough, an Okawara design.
He's an excellent gimmick-creator. (For example, the Buster Gundam's two guns on their support arms that can work in tandem, or connected in two different ways.) This means he's great for designing things that are made into toys and model kits.
I don't think he has a ton of experience with actual mechanical/engineering drawings, and he falls short on "true" machinelike detail. Those articulated arms that support the Buster Gundam's weapons? Minimally detailed -- just rectangles. An afterthought. Katoki, Izubuchi, Miyatake, Akutsu, and virtually any other mecha designer would have actually put at least some modicum of thought and detail into those things.
>>11949270
Nah, that goes to NEW Nagano. Okawara is merely mediocre.
>>11949270
yes
yes we can
>>11949373
>And, it's worth mentioning he was the first mecha designer.
Are you fucking serious? Nagai is closer to the "first" than Okawara and even he isn't it.
>>11949270
Man, is that his take on the Turn A? I like it.
Fuck, I like basically any variation n the design
...especially any version that gets rid of the goddamn yellow.
>>11949373
>Pic related: a horrible CG rendition of what is, unsurprisingly, a horrible Okawara design.
>>11949270
People are finally taking their nostalgia googles off?
>>11949383
Oh come on, the Gothicmades aren't THAT bad. They're just extremely out of context with the FSS universe. They work pretty well as their own entities.
That design would make a great boss for Dark Souls or Final Fantasy.
>>11949383
>Okawara is merely mediocre.
This this thisthis this
Okawara is...like Sunrise. Utterly mediocre. He is just as likely to crap out a shitter as he is to pop out a masterpiece
He is the standard by which other mech designers are measured
Not perfect, not shit. Right in the middle.
>>11949431
Fuck you.
>>11949421
FUUUUCK YOOOU.
>>11949389
To be fair, it was better than the Destiny.
>>11949421
G-g-g-g-go fuck yourself
>>11949270
No.
>>11949431
>People are finally taking their nostalgia googles off?
Sorry m8, looks like they haven't
>>11949439
>>11949447
I'm not really seeing many bad designs here. Meh drawings, but not bad designs.
ITT: butthurt okawara fags
>>11949475
More like butthurt haters.
>>11949628
>More like butthurt haters.
Nice try okawarafag, join you butthurt friends:
>>11949439
>>11949447
>>11949453
>>11949639
I'm not even invested in this. I just hate using the hyberbole of "worst mecha designer ever" when we all know there's some retard rolling some ugly shit out on pixiv or something.
>>11949689
>we all know there's some retard rolling some ugly shit out on pixiv or something.
Check the thread, none one posted ugly fan arts
I know, it's hard to believe, but that's how okawara is
>>11949393
>Are you fucking serious? Nagai is closer to the "first" than Okawara and even he isn't it.
Kunio Okawara was the first person to hold the title of Mecha Designer.
That was his title for his work on Gatchaman, the first show to have a staff member titled a Mecha Designer.
Gatchaman's first episode aired October 1st, 1972.
Mazinger Z's first publication was October 2nd, 1972. (And it had no officially-titled "Mecha Designer" anyway.)
No matter how you slice it, Okawara was the first person to officially be a "Mecha Designer."
Now, if you want to talk about who was the first mecha designer MINUS any such title, we'd probably have to go back into ancient, pre-Christian history.
>>11949421
The G-Savior is one of those rare instances where Okawara's line art actually looks BETTER than the animated rendition. To wit, >>11949447
>>11949433
This guy gets it.
>>11950536
>>11949433
Gothicmades are perfectly good designs as anything other than piloted mecha, so you're right there.
>>11949294
The Scopedog may be a nice design, but it's poorly drawn.
>>11950590
That's every Okawara line art. He's a bad artist.
To me his designs are 50/50, the guy just can't draw lineart.
>>11950584
>>11950541
>>11949433
Without any context I would imagine the Gothicmades being something like ceramic golems rising from the sand. Kind of like those Rahxephon baddies.I also want to pretend that they do more than just teleport and shoot lasers like the manga.
Okawara is the father of modern mecha and defined the 'real robot' genre and continues to be the standard by which 'real robots' are measured. His proportions and perspective in line art are terrible however he's often able to get across a terrific sense of dynamism and motion in his paintings. He got to the top because he's not only incredibly prolific but also very effective at visualizing concepts that can be executed by others such as animators and toy-makers. He's the first and greatest 'real robot' concept artist that ever lived. The 'real robot' genre as we recognize it today wouldn't exist without the work of Okawara. Yes he is a terrible line artist but he doesn't have to be a great line artist to perform his primary job of visual conceptualization.
>>11950695
This, he's terrible artist but great designer
Give his design to someone else and they'll bring the real potential out of it.
Ignore OP, post Okawara.
While we're at it, can people stop shittalking Katoki?
He's a fantastic designer.
>>11949433
I dunno, I know nothing about FSS' context and that looks pretty bad to me.
>>11950761
>>11949270
Agree
>>11949270
Sure if in the same act we can also agree that the story was above average for the franchise.
>>11949270
His illustration sucks, but you can't design the thought-out transforming mechanism of the Zeta Gundam and be the worst mecha designer. The anime dumbs it down, but how it transforms is well thought-out.
>>11950761
Nope. For me he's just as mediocre as Okawara. The only really good designs he did were honestly the Virtual-On and Gundam Sentinel designs.
>>11949270
He used to be good, but something horrible seems to have happened to him around 2000. He hasn't produced a consistently good set of mecha designs since his work on GGG/Final.I always preferred Kawamori anyway.
He designed Yatterwan, how can he be anything but the greatest mecha designer?
>>11951351
Zeta Gundam was Kazumi Fujita.
>>11951426
I can't bring myself to like Kawamori's super robots. He always draws them with the same proportions, tiny torsos, regular legs and oragutan arms. Kawamori Dangaioh is just as bad as Aquarion and the Nirvash when it comes to that, but you have Obari draw it and suddenly it's one of my favourite mecha designs ever.
There's no one in the business who draws better aircraft though.
>>11951983
To each his own, I guess. I love Solar Aquarion and both versions of Dangaioh.
I do think his more real-oriented designs tend to be more fun, though.
>>11951413
>Nope. For me he's just as mediocre as Okawara
hahaha no
this should be enough to tell you who's the shit artist
>>11952422
I agree the one on the right looks better.
>>11952528
That's because you got shit taste okawarafag
>>11952422
Yep, definitely the better designer alright.
>>11952588
Unicorn had GOD-TIER mecha designs
>>11949270
Okawara designs are amazing, the problem is his Lineart which looks stale as fuck
>>11951978
Yes but the technical transformation was by Okawara.
>>11949270
>>11949276
/m/ is full of hipsters who don't like anything that is popularly accepted. That why they shit on Okawara, and Katoki, but jerk themselves raw over Nagano's designs that are either emaciated and overly liney, or bulbous tumor ridden monsters.
>>11949270
>Can we all agree that
First sign of a troll.
>>11952905
>/m/ is full of hipsters who don't like anything that is popularly accepted
It's the opposite, it's full of circlejerkers who can't take negative critizism
>>11952606
This suit is amazing
>>11953363
Wrong suit
>>11953389
The Sazabi and Sinanju are literally aesthetically perfect
Debate me nerds
>>11951413
>>11952528
Samefag detected
>>11952769
>>11952528
>I agree the one on the right looks better.
So you admit that Katoki is the superior artist, huh?
>>11952422
>>11953747
You want my opinion? Here is my opinion
> get Okawara to get the basic design
> have Katoki flesh it out
There, instant fangasm
>>11953776
But Katoki does Okawara fixes only because Bandai asks him too. He has to fix his designs because of his linearts (also that pic is an unfair comparison, since that's Katoki's rx-78-2, not the fixed one)
Katoki can also do his own designs, and damn they're awesome:
>Sentinel
>Stardust
>Victory
>Endless Waltz
>Unicorn
>SRW
>>11949373
It still looks like shit.
>>11949421
Not surprising since this was always shit.
>>11949431
Nope. Though good eye pointing out how garbage Layzner looks.
>>11950529
He could be an unfrozen caveman lawyer who lucked into the job, and his designs would still suck.
>>11950590
Scopedog is a horrible design because Okawara designed it to be.
>>11950705
>Polish a turd
>It's still a turd
>>11953776
Or you could fire both and just hire some scab like Obari to make something better than either of them.
>>11953929
>Endless Waltz
And all the OZ suits from the series.
>>11952905
>Nagano's designs that are either emaciated and overly liney, or bulbous tumor ridden monsters.
That doesn't sound anything like Nagano.
>>11953962
>Or you could fire both and just hire some scab like Obari to make something better than either of them.
>Obari
>A mecha designer
>>11952905
But I like Katoki.
>>11953268
This is true.
>>11953929
But Katoki need a leash at times and create a design that make shit for toys
Okawara know the good balance between realistic and toyeticI like both of them anyway
>>11954232
I left him out of titles where he didn't design Gundams, he also worked on G (and X, but I'm not so sure of that)
>>11954350
>But Katoki need a leash at times and create a design that make shit for toys
I don't understand. Are you saying that Bandai limits his creativity so that his designs can be made into toys?
>>11954350
Why would you want toys of robots anyway?
>>11954363
No. As an artist who wants to get into concepting one day, I totally get what he means. Katoki loves details. He adores them. He crams as many of them in as he can at times. However, more =/= better. When you go shitcrazy with details, you tend to loose any distinguishing features in the mess.
>>11954806
Not the guy you're talking to, but Okawara isn't exactly known for clean designs either.
>>11953406
Sinanju looks like a korean mmorpg late game armor set with all the pointy bits and stupid details.
>>11954350
>>11954350
>>11954350
No you dumb fuck. Katoki is a great designer because his designs make good plamo and toys.
All of Katoki's quirk you hate like Long legs and small torso, are there to stabilize the plamo standing. Also his designs have great silhouttes. Even Kotobukiya with their awful plamo technology can't mess up kits made from Katoki designs
Also he wouldnt be the chief engineer in Bandai Plamo Dept if he cant design shit for toys.
>>11955281
>All of Katoki's quirk you hate like Long legs and small torso
>Implying I hate it
Calm your tits, you fucking autist
>>11955281
>are there to stabilize the plamo standing
>implying
Unicorn can't even bend his fucking knee 90°.
Most of them can't kneel because the thigh to shin ratio is all fucked up.
>>11955292
Are people back to liking Katoki? Last year all I read was how Katoki was shit compared to Oka wars. God you people are fickle losers.
>>11955281
>All of Katoki's quirk you hate like Long legs and small torso, are there to stabilize the plamo standing.
This is literally the most retarded statement I have ever heard about Katoki. I like his designs, but you're lying to yourself if you think all his designs translate well to toy or model form.
>>11955353
It's almost like we're all a bunch of individuals with individual tastes!
>>11954787
Because some of us want to admire designs in 3D form. Doesn't have to be a toy, but something that looks like it can exist outside of paper.
>>11954336
>>11955124
That's a big backpack
>>11955911
>shurouga
MAI NIGGA
>>11955911
Okay, can you list at least 3 other original Obari designs? Cause if we're going by that, even Takeshi Honda is more of a mecha designer than Obari.
>>11951413
>Katoki
>just as mediocre as Okawara
Wow man. I just... I dunno. What the hell mecha designers DO you like? Sheezus.
>>11951978
Pretty much every mecha designer under the sun worked on the Zeta Gundam. Okawara, Nagano, Fujita... I can tell you right now that Okawara's transformation ideas are not the final ones used. Elements, perhaps, but overall? No. Hell no.
>>11951983
>There's no one in the business who draws better aircraft though.
There's no one in the business who draws better aircraft?! Ummm... disagreement. Kawamori. And many others too.
>>11951983
>but you have Obari draw it and suddenly it's one of my favourite mecha designs ever.
Obari drew/animated tons of Okawara super robots for the Yuusha series. And they looked awesome. Because Obari roolz.
>>11953747
I have no idea at all how you can look at the Okawara Gundam and say it looks better than the Katoki Gundam. I mean... what planet am I on??
inb4 anyone points out that Yas really finalized the Gundam
>>11956007
D.D Battlemover from BGC
Vector Versus from D-1 Devastator
Dragon Fang from Platinum Hugen Ordian
suck it!!!
I have this to ask: What would have happened had Okawara designed for Code Geass and Cross Ange (i.e, how would Lancelot or Vilkiss look like had Okawara designed them)?
>>11949270
Please don't be disrespectful to the pioneers.
Without him, other mecha designers' styles may not even exist.
It is true that his contemporary designs aren't great, but he should be praised for his designs in the 70s , 80s and early 90s.
>>11955353
I think both are shit and should stop doing art altogether.
>>11955366
> something that looks like it can exist outside of paper.
>Posts some pointy skinny nightmare that's physically impossible
Gr8 b8 m8.
>>11955911
3edgy5me
>>11956046
He's still a scab though.
>>11956155
Stout and ugly looking duh.
>>11949270
What's up with stances Okawara does for his designs? They look lazy in the most ironic way possible.
>>11956295
Okawara was Gaia Avatar fag before there even was a Gaia.
>>11956155
>What would have happened had Okawara designed for Code Geass
Are you sure Okawara DIDN'T design for Code Geass?
>>11956495
Actually it was Kenji Teraoka who designed them. Same dude who did some designs for IGPX, Ghost in the Shell, A/Z, Gundam 00, AGE, and VOTOMS:Case Irvine.
>>11949270
yes but syd mier is a fucking overrated hack as well
>>11956295
Reference art for animators must be like that because they have to be able to watch it and understand what the damn robot looks like.
Most Okawara stuff is reference art.
>>11956033
I'm talking about Kawamori.
>>11956007
Detonator Orgun, both Archetype and Human versions. OG Compatikaiser and it's upgrade.
>>11951995
>more real-oriented designs tend to be more fun
Agreed.
Assault Type Aquarion > Solar Aquarion
>>11955281
>long legs
>stabilise the plamo
It doesn't even make sense.
You keep your center of mass down to stabilise it when it stands, not raise it with long legs.
>>11956554
I assume you mean Syd Mead, unless you mean Sid Meier the game developer for some reason.
I mean come on if you're gonna call someone an overrated hack, at least get their name right.
>>11956885
Civ is literally the same shit game over and over again.
>>11956890
That game is /m/ as fuck though
captcha: mpity
/m/ pity indeed, captcha.
>Kunio Okawara
>bad
>>11956885
Sid Meier isn't even a dev anymore.
Pretty much all his games only have his name on the cover but nothing more.
>>11956923
Okay amend my statement with *former then.
Never played civ so *Shrug* I was just taken aback as to who he meant, seeing as insulting one in this thread, would make no sense. Unless Sid Meier designs Mecha I haven't seen yet.
>>11950761
Eh, I think Katoki usually oversimplifies his designs and his proportions are too uniform. Everything looks built off the same frame. I love the Crossbone Gundam, but I have to admit it's a fairly plain design riding on the gimmicks from the F91.
>>11956878
>You keep your center of mass down to stabilise it when it stands, not raise it with long legs.
This nigga gets it
>>11956997
>>11956878
Since we're going for the humanoid shape, we can't mess with the proportions too much.
The small torso makes sense, you reduce the weight there by making the torso smaller, it shifts the center of mass down, thus making the plamo more stable.
Then, instead of making the legs long, you keep em more or less proportional, or even slightly shorter, now that's a stable design.
Unless the legs are insect-like legs, long legs that bends to spread out the weight across a larger area while keeping the body low.
>>11956495
>Are you sure Okawara DIDN'T design for Code Geass?
He didn't work there. Other people did, including the same designer guy who is doing G-Reco and worked on King Gainer.
>>11956591
>Reference art for animators must be like that because they have to be able to watch it and understand what the damn robot looks like.
UTTER BULLSHIT argument. Virtually every other mecha designer draws their mechs in a more pleasing stance, and their animators manage to do their jobs just fine.
>Most Okawara stuff is reference art.
Yeah, just like every other mecha designer's stuff. THINK, man!
>>11956897
Best comment ever
>>11956971
>Eh, I think Katoki usually oversimplifies his designs
o_0 You're insane.
>and his proportions are too uniform.
This was true before he worked on G-Gundam. Katoki definitely learned some tricks for working with Okawara, including using different proportions. Everything looks built off the same frame.
>I love the Crossbone Gundam, but I have to admit it's a fairly plain design riding on the gimmicks from the F91.
It is a muted by highly effective design. As for "riding on the gimmicks from the F91"... this is a kooky statement. Other than the opening face it really doesn't use any of the F91's gimmicks, and any visual similarities to the F91 are there for a reason -- the Crossbone is the F97. It's descended from the F91!
Katoki is a godlike designer, haters have no brains. (He does sometimes make the legs a bit too long though.)
>>11950739
mfw Zean was rocking the Kamina glasses 30 years before they were a thing
Pretty sure all mecha designers are shit.
>>11956971
>I love the Crossbone Gundam, but I have to admit it's a fairly plain design riding on the gimmicks from the F91.
But the Crossbone Gundam was designed by Hasegawa, Katoki simply fixed it
>>11949270
That's not how you spell Go Nagai.
>>11957635
Oh boy, you better be prepared to say such things here
>>11956181
>Please don't be disrespectful to the pioneers.
>Without him, other mecha designers' styles may not even exist.
Influential =/= good.
>>11957708
but the reason it influenced future designers is because it's good.
>>11957369
Everyone knows Katoki COULD be a good designers. Even /m/ enjoyed his Wing grunts, V gundam and Sentinel designs in general. It's the fact that his recent stuff that shows next to no effort other than slapping on more panels, LEGS and how his fans buy them up like the best thing since slice bread that make people hate him. It's really his shitty fans' fault.
>>11957720
>It's the fact that his recent stuff that shows next to no effort
Unicorn would like a word with you
>>11957716
No, it was because it was one of the first. Okawara basically popularized the "real robot" aesthetic because he was the first to do it.
>>11957720
>It's really his shitty fans' fault.
No, it's Bandai's fault for slapping his name onto everything. Even the recent Hi-Nu ver Ka should have never been called such since it's exactly the same as Izubuchi's lineart.
>>11957720
>It's really his shitty fans' fault.
Nope, it's Bandai's fault, you idiot.
>>11957720
Well, I'm a Katoki fan and I found the designs from Unicorn to be shit, just like the series itself, but that's mostly Sunrise's/Bandai's fault.
>>11957869
>Even the recent Hi-Nu ver Ka should have never been called such since it's exactly the same as Izubuchi's lineart.
To be fair it was because Katoki did give it direct supervision as usual
>>11958429
He did the same with the MG Turn A. And it was never labelled as "ver Ka".
>>11958475
But MG Turn A is the first right?
>>11958482
So? There are plenty of kits that have the ver Ka moniker that were the first MG's of their designs. Even 2.0 MG's don't need to have Katoki's name on them, like the Strike RM. They could have just called it the Hi-Nu Lineart Version or something.
But Katoki's name sells, so....
>>11957591
>But the Crossbone Gundam was designed by Hasegawa, Katoki simply fixed it
I'm actually not so sure that's true. I think it might be the reverse; Katoki designed it, Hasegawa rendered it for manga. Not sure. Quite the chicken and the egg question.
>>11957720
>Everyone knows Katoki COULD be a good designers. Even /m/ enjoyed his Wing grunts, V gundam and Sentinel designs in general. It's the fact that his recent stuff that shows next to no effort other than slapping on more panels, LEGS and how his fans buy them up like the best thing since slice bread that make people hate him. It's really his shitty fans' fault.
You are just silly. He is a great designer; one of the best. Adding more panels = detailing up existing designs. He's been tasked with revisiting old designs a lot. You think the RX-93 v.KA sucks or something? Are you bonkers? Yes, he makes legs a bit too long sometimes, I agree. But come on, you really think that the ReZel, Kshatriya, Jesta, Geara-Zulu, WildWurger, R-1/2/3, etc etc etc are bad. You are... you... you are just silly.
>>11957780
I'll make whatever faces I want, buddy.
>>11957863
>Okawara basically popularized the "real robot" aesthetic because he was the first to do it.
Considering that Tomino is the one who came up with the idea for the Real Robot subgenre, and that Yas was really the guy who gave us the Zaku's signature look, I wouldn't actually credit Okawara with that quite as much as you're doing. He's still a huge pioneer though.
>>11957869
>Even the recent Hi-Nu ver Ka should have never been called such since it's exactly the same as Izubuchi's lineart.
But Izubuchi did that ugly-ass retread of the Hi-Nu that just wasn't the Hi-Nu. Katoki went back to the original design and restored it to its former glory. And then some. Thank him!
>>11958539
The rough outline was by Hasegawa, Katoki flesh it out, then Hasegawa rounded it to be used in the Manga
>>11957871
>>>11957720
>>It's really his shitty fans' fault.
>Nope, it's Bandai's fault, you idiot.
No no, it's YOUR fault, idiot.
>>11958263
>I'm a Katoki fan and I found the designs from Unicorn to be shit
Wow. I do not get you, dude.
>>11958536
>But Katoki's name sells, so....
You're confused. You think people will buy a model kit JUST because Katoki's name is on it? If I made a new MG of, say, the Gundam MkII, but made it crappy, with poor posability and inaccurate colors and missing some parts, but put Katoki's name on it, it would sell well?
The Hi-Nu had "Ver.KA" on it because Katoki changed the Hi-Nu from what Izubuchi had most recently given us (the crappy first MG Hi-Nu). Figure it out, you dolt.
>>11958553
Geara Zulu is awful. It's the worst parts of both the Geara Doga and old Zakus rolled together, and it looks gangly and awkward.
>>11958606
>>11958622
>Geara Zulu is awful.
>>11958622
> hating Geara Zulu
I like Doga better but you're just full of shit
>>11958622
Gera Zulu is awful because it's shitty nazi pandering.
>>11957869
>Even the recent Hi-Nu ver Ka should have never been called such since it's exactly the same as Izubuchi's lineart.
>>11958536
>They could have just called it the Hi-Nu Lineart Version or something.
>But Katoki's name sells, so....
Sigh... I thought we already settled this /m/
It has the Ver Ka label because Bandai gives him total freedom in his design of the kit. That's why the Nu had psychoframe, that's why the Hi-Nu stayed true to Izubuchi's original design, and that's why he designed the FIRST master grade of the RX-78-2 and then made another under his label
It's Bandai's way of saying "do whatever the fuck you want, we trust you"
But that kinda backfired when Izubuchi did it...
>>11959295
So if Ka doesn't stand for Katoki, what does it stand for?
>>11959310
Did you even read my post?
Here, I'll quote it for you
>It has the Ver Ka label because Bandai gives him (Katoki) total freedom in his design of the kit.
>>11958585
It's funny that you say that because most old-school Gundam fans think Katoki literally raped the Nu and Sazabi with his "clusterfuckish overgimmicked" reinterpretation.
As for the old Hi-Nu MG, it wasn't bad by any means, just different. You can't compare it with the ver Ka because it's a very different design altogether.
>>11959295
>It has the Ver Ka label because Bandai gives him total freedom in his design of the kit. That's why the Nu had psychoframe, that's why the Hi-Nu stayed true to Izubuchi's original design, and that's why he designed the FIRST master grade of the RX-78-2 and then made another under his label
You seem a bit confused. Katoki was in charge of the lineart and early conceptual designs of both the HGUC and MG lines. He didn't outright design the kits like he did with ver Ka's. Also, ver ka was a new label at the time, and Katoki's personal reinterpretation of the RX-78-2 using better technology.
>It's Bandai's way of saying "do whatever the fuck you want, we trust you"
But that kinda backfired when Izubuchi did it...
I sincerely doubt Bandai DIDN'T tell Katoki to make it look like Izubuchi's design. They knew that many people complained about the older Hi-Nu for not looking like the lineart. Why do you think there are so many Hi-Nu resin kits out there? The point is, like with the Turn A, Katoki designed the kit to look like the original lineart. It is not his personal reinterpretation like the rest of the Ver Ka's. That's like me asking someone to re-draw the Mona-Lisa to look exactly like the original, but sell it under their name instead of Da Vinci's.
Also, Izubuchi's only involvement with the old MG Hi-Nu was the lineart. He's not a mechanical engineer or drafter like Katoki or BEE-Craft.
>>11959409
>You seem a bit confused. Katoki was in charge of the lineart and early conceptual designs of both the HGUC and MG lines. He didn't outright design the kits like he did with ver Ka's.
Sorry, I meant that he is completely free to do the conceptual design of the kit. No mecha designer is involved in the actual development of the kit.
>and Katoki's personal reinterpretation of the RX-78-2 using better technology
That's why is has its label, because it's his own redesign, not just a fix like the old MG
>I sincerely doubt Bandai DIDN'T tell Katoki to make it look like Izubuchi's design.
>many people complained about the older Hi-Nu for not looking like the lineart.
And one of those is Katoki himself. He wanted to make it closer to the original design as much as Bandai, that's why they gave the design to him
>like with the Turn A, Katoki designed the kit to look like the original lineart. It is not his personal reinterpretation like the rest of the Ver Ka's. That's like me asking someone to re-draw the Mona-Lisa to look exactly like the original, but sell it under their name instead of Da Vinci's.
But only because that was his work, he wasn't involved in anything other than adapting it's proportions. Think it like a restoration of an old painting. He actually made his own rendition of the Turn A (not included into his MG line)
>Also, Izubuchi's only involvement with the old MG Hi-Nu was the lineart.
It's the same involvement Katoki gets with its label, that's why Bandai accepted the retcon.
ITT:
>Okawara VS Katoki
Both are overrated and suck.
>Obari
Autistic scab that works dirt cheap and pumps out crayon drawings.
>Teraoka
Guy who does designs for a lot of the newer mecha shows. All of them shit.
>>11959591
And of course you can do better, right anon?
>>11959591
>everything you like sucks
>everything that's new is shit
pssh...nothing personnel, kid
>>11959606
>>11959619
Ignore that faggot, he's been shitposting in the entire thread for a while now.
>>11959624
We can't ignore him, he's too edgy for us!
>>11958577
Unicorn designs are average at best. Over-detailed yet uninspired and sometimes even non-sensical. The sliding armor gimick didn't save the first MG Unicorn from being a generally poor kit with next to no articulation. Katoki even in his own words "forgot" to put in the head vulcans in the novel version and were only added back in the OVA model. That's how much Katoki cares for the Unicorn designs.
>>11959606
Actually I rather enjoy Teraoka's work. It's more like the SHOWS he does designs for are shit. Anybody who did work on A/Z and VVV did what they could for that paycheck, but I still feel bad that they had to sign on to those things.
>>11959640
>Unicorn designs are average at best. Over-detailed yet uninspired and sometimes even non-sensical.
Shit taste incoming
>The sliding armor gimick didn't save the first MG Unicorn from being a generally poor kit with next to no articulation
That's because he didn't design it with a kit in mind.
>>11959640
>Katoki even in his own words "forgot" to put in the head vulcans in the novel version and were only added back in the OVA model. That's how much Katoki cares for the Unicorn designs.
This is one of the most retarded logic fallacies I've ever come across on /m/. Unicorn has a lot more going for it than some fucking vulcans.
Also, when the fuck does the kit's engineering have to do with its actual design? You think Obari gives a fuck about how his stretched designs work as toys?
>>11959619
>>11959624
>>11959635
Why are you talking to yourself?
I really like Katoki's non-Gundam stuff. Pic very related.
Okay but for real Akitaka is the best
>>11950761
>can people stop shittalking
Sorry mate. Ain't ever gonna happen
>>11959591
>>11959640
>Unicorn designs are average at best.
You're retarded.
>Over-detailed yet uninspired and sometimes even non-sensical.
Seriously, you're retarded.
>The sliding armor gimick didn't save the first MG Unicorn from being a generally poor kit with next to no articulation. Katoki even in his own words "forgot" to put in the head vulcans in the novel version and were only added back in the OVA model. That's how much Katoki cares for the Unicorn designs.
Have you ever made a mistake? Yes? Then shut your fetal-alchohol-syndrome-having face.
>>11959644
Fuck you. Good shows, good mecha.
>>11959970
>Okay but for real Akitaka is the best
Designer of the Full Armor ZZ and the Gundam Mark V (among many others)
Indeed, he doth speak truly.
>>11949373
I like that
does anyone have the designs he did for the G-Breaker games, cause both his Twitter and Instagram accounts that had them have vanished off the internet and I can't find them anywhere else
>>11949406
Yep, the lines flow much better and the crotchpit doesn't look tacked-on like it does in the official art. As drawn the proportions are a little boxy but that's some something that's common fixed in the translation from his concept art.
>>11960413
>>11960413
>does anyone have the designs he did for the G-Breaker games,
Yeah, here you go. Good stuff:
https://www.mediafire.com/?yw9l4vw4n5n2kd4
>cause both his Twitter and Instagram accounts that had them have vanished off the internet and I can't find them anywhere else
http://instagram.com/kunio_okawara
http://instagram.com/kunio_okawara
>>11960716
thank you, those are some of my favorite designs of his
>>11959661
>>11959707
>>11960236
Butthurt because you bought 22 versions of a design that Katoki doesn't give a shit about and just milk to death?
>>11960838
I wish there were more than 22 versions. :^)
Speaking of Okawara: Is it true he designed the Gespensts and the Sunrise Eiyuutan original mecha?
>>11961141
Okawara designed the original Gespensts, along with the R-Series mechs and the SRX.
>>11961294
I thought the R-Series and SRX are Katoki?
>>11959707
>You think Obari gives a fuck about how his stretched designs work as toys?
https://twitter.com/G1_BARI/status/552400037914116100
Yes, yes he does. Companies ask him to supervise toy productions often.
>>11961294
>Okawara designed the original Gespensts, along with the R-Series mechs and the SRX.
Okawara designed the Gespenst. Not every variation we've seen, but the original definitely.
R-1, R-2, R-3, R-Gun, SRX, WildWurger, Huckebeins are Katoki
Grungusts and the dragon/tiger types are Miyatake
>>11961141
>Sunrise Eiyuutan original mecha?
Hmmmm... trying to remember them. I don't think he did. If they're the ones I remember, those were Junya Ishigaki.
>>11961360
THIS. I mean, for fuck's sake, a mecha designer's job is to make things that look cool and can be turned into kits/toys. Anyone who thinks a mecha designer isn't concerned with such things is just talking out their butt. Or talking about Nagano, though even in that case I'm not wholly convinced.
You want mecha designers who were NOT thinking about toy creation when they made their mecha? Look at Marvel's artists in the 60s and 70s. The original Iron Man and the Sentinels and such were definitely, definitely not made with toy design in mind.
>>11961376
>THIS. I mean, for fuck's sake, a mecha designer's job is to make things that look cool and can be turned into kits/toys.
Tell that to Kawamori.
Tell that to Izubuchi.
Tell that to Kobayashi.
Tell that to Fujita.
Tell that to Shinkawa.
Tell that to Fujioka.
Tell that to Koyama.
Tell that to Ni0.
Tell that ESPECIALLY to Nagano.
And those are only the less obscure designers.
A mecha designer's job isn't to make something that could have easily been turned into a toy, it's something that can be ANIMATED without too much difficulty. Most 80's mecha shows haven't even had decent or accurate onscreen toy or model representations (outside of Garage Kits) until less than a decade ago, like Dunbine. If it's not animated and for some manga or LN, they make it even more complex. Whether or not any of those can be made as toys depends on how much fans like the design or how physically possible it is to render in 3D form. And only recently has toy technology caught up with some ancient 80's designs.
Obari doesn't give a fuck about toys. He's an animator first and foremost. The Dragonar designs have existed for a long time now, and it speaks volumes that only NOW we actually get decent onscreen representations.
>nobody cares about their toys
[citation needed]
>>11962295
Yep, Kawamori totally thought about toys when he designed this.
But why should I even bother when I'm replying to a newfag who can't even quote properly.
>>11962365
>>11962417
That has shit proportions, tons of paint, and can't transform. Unlike the lineart.
What was your point?
>>11962510
>That has shit proportions, tons of paint, and can't transform
So did old gunplas, what's your point?
>>11962559
It's a failure as a toy and a model. Same with most old Gunpla.
If you're content with your kits looking like that though, more power to you.
>>11962562
So Bandai was a failure through out the 80s?
>>11957635
What a shit robot my pic is exceedingly better
>>11962610
Every toy company was due to the tech at the time. There wasn't a single "accurate" representation of the lineart for any design. A perfect transformation model for the Zeta Gundam didn't exist until a decade after the anime ended.
Mecha designers don't design things with toys in mind. The only thing they can do is make a design look gimmicky, colorful, and easy to animate. This is meant to appeal to the kids watching it so that they like the character enough to want to buy the toy of it, no matter how ugly or inaccurate it is. Which doesn't necessarily mean said design will translate well to toy form.
>>11962622
That wasn't even designed by Nagai you fucking idiot.
>>11957635
That wasn't designed by Nagai anyway.
Did you know there's such a thing as a mechanical toy designer? You know, people like Tsuyoshi Nonaka who did the Soul of Chogokin line?
Oh that's right, you didn't, because you're fucking retarded.
>>11962785
>responding to b8
>actually butthurt
>>11962749
Never said it was you fucking faggot
>>11962817
Nice backpedaling, sperglord.
>>11963057
Damn, I can't wait for Katoki to fix these
>>11962746
>Mecha designers don't design things with toys in mind.
>The only thing they can do is make a design look gimmicky, colorful, and easy to animate.
Yes they do all that not to have them turned into toys right.
>>11963101
>>11963088
>MHs
>HMs
>Brains
>Rick Dias
>Hyaku Shiki
>Qubeley
>Schells
>LMFAO all this is shit guise Gothicmades are my true masterpieces XXXDDDD
I know your pain, anons.
He hasn't divorced Maria, at least.
>>11963124
Yep. They do that to sell the image to the audience.
You actually think they intended to make a perfect transformation Zeta Gundam toy all the way back in 1985? You're fucking retarded.
>>11962859
Takes one to know one kid
>>11963088
>Gothicmades
>bricks
Um... Gothicmades may be ugly or busy or gawky or inconsistent-with-MHs or whatever, but they ain't bricks.
>>11963068
I'm not sure he's going to. I wish he would, but from what little I've seen, the MSs in the animation are pretty damn accurate to Okawara's vomitous retreads.
>>11963065
The kooky thing about the Gravion mecha is they totally follow the format of the Yuusha Series mecha, yet Takara never had any plans to make toys of them. AFAIK.
They sure looked awesome when they were animated by Obari though. Mmmmmmmm
>>11963242
Great comeback, now get back to your basic Geometry class you underage faggot.
>>11963088
>Gothicmades are garbage.
More like Nagano's manga is garbage. The action scenes in FSS weren't exactly well-drawn either. He's doing himself a favor by not drawing them.
>>11963088
>Gothicmades are garbage.
Your mother is garbage.
>>11963258
>in the animation
>implying Origin's MS will be hand drawn
Also he will fix them, don't forget that MGs are supervised by him
>>11949278
Here's one of his lesser known designs
What I've learned from this thread:
Mika Akitaka sucks
Junichi Akutsu/Bee-Craft sucks
Hiroshi Ando
Kenta Aoki sucks
Shinji Aramaki sucks
Artmic sucks
Don Figueroa sucks
Daisei Fujii sucks
Kenki Fujioka sucks
Kazumi Fujita sucks
Hitoshi Fukuchi sucks
M Ganzy sucks
Adi Granov sucks
Hiroyuki Hataike sucks
Kamemaru Hitoshi sucks
Hirofumi Ichikawa sucks
Junya Ishigaki sucks
Ken Ishikawa sucks
Yutaka Izubuchi sucks
Alex Jaeger sucks
Hideki Kakinuma sucks
Kazuma Kaneko sucks
Hajime Katoki sucks
Shoji Kawamori sucks
Makoto Kobayashi sucks
Kazuhisa Kondo sucks
Ralph McQuarrie sucks
Syd Mead sucks
Alex Milne sucks
Kazutaka Miyatake sucks
Yasuhiro Moriki sucks
Junichi Moriya sucks
Go Nagai sucks
Mamoru Nagano sucks
Tsuyoshi Nonaka/PLEX sucks
Josh Nizzi sucks
Masami Obari sucks
Hiroshi Ogawa sucks
Koichi Ohata sucks
Kunio Okawara sucks
Junji Okubo sucks
Hirotoshi Okura sucks
Siji Ono sucks
Takashi Ono sucks
Mitsuru Oowa sucks
Ben Proctor sucks
Kazue Saito sucks
Hirotoshi Sano sucks
Masamune Shirow sucks
Ken-ichi Sonoda sucks
Masahisa Suzuki sucks
Yoshitake Taniguchi sucks
Kimitoshi Yamane sucks
Takayuki Yanase sucks
Ley Yumeno sucks
I'm sure there are other mecha designers who suck, but it's a start.
>>11963448
>implying Origin's MS will be hand drawn
I never implied that in any way. CG animation is still animation. And have you looked at The Origin's previews? The Zaku and the Guntank look exactly like those Okawara drawings. No Katoki touches to be seen.
>>11963480
Zaku was co-designed by Yas. Arguably, almost wholly designed by Yas.
>>11963567
please don't post autistic things like this
>>11963843
please don't be silly
>>11963593
>Zaku was co-designed by Yas. Arguably, almost wholly designed by Yas.
Sauce or I call bullshit.
>>11964364
>Sauce or I call bullshit.
All you need to do is look at the development artwork and it's clear as day. But, I will search for an online source for you. Stay tuned.
Fact: Okawara's work on the original MS Gundam series was a defining moment for mecha -- his engineering approach was a huge departure from most of the fanciful giant robot designs that came before. He set a new standard that was (and remains) very influential...and Bandai owes much of their fortune to his making mecha TRULY mechanical. He did all the hard groundwork for the awesome eye-candy that has followed.
>>11963268
Well that was the point wasn't it? Obari made a name for himself working on the Braves franchise, the franchise died after Gaogaigar so he and his studio made their own version.
>>11965692
Even though it was Dougram (followed by Xabungle, then Macross, and then Votoms) that really cemented the Real Robot style... Yes, Gundam was definitely the transition point. And they were all Okawara anyway, so hey.
>>11966295
>Macross
>Okawara
>>11965279
Wow, what a shit design that is
>>11967009
Yep, Hackawarafags are that delusional.
>>11967328
watch Layzner newfag.
i liek robbots
>>11963218
Except they did because macross was successful and transformable toys was already a thing in the 80s, despite having poor quality due to technology. Gunpla actually saved Gundam from its poor rating. Plain zaku was a popular design, despite having no actual character ties becuase of its militaristic design, which appeals to nerds of that era who were usually into military models. The show got a chance because the toys did well. Your newfaggotry is showing, Retard.
>>11967685
I know that is from Layzer you faggot, that doesn't make it any less shittier
>>11969402
>alldatshittaste
Actually I believe it was a three-way collab between Tomino, Okawara, and Yas if I recall; though Yas did at least help out with at least one of 0079's MS in some way. I heard he contributed to the Dom's final design by giving it the bulk it's known for(the original Okawara lineart looked pretty thin). And going into late UC, he was the F91's original designer.
>>11969687
meant for >>11963593
>>11969612
You should really take your nostalgia googles anon, because that design is horrible. You're the one with the shit taste
>>11969378
>macross was successful and transformable toys was already a thing in the 80s
>despite having poor quality due to technology.
Way to backpedal. Macross may have been one of the first to start the transformation craze, but the Valkyries weren't made with toys in mind. The whole series was originally meant to be a Gundam parody, not a toy commercial.
Also, adding gimmicks =/= making them with a toy in mind. The Zeta transformed because it was the fad at the time. Kids and Otaku liked that shit, and gave the show views because of it. It associated itself with Macross like that to increase its own popularity. I won't deny that Gundam is typically meant to be a toy commercial, but when designers add gimmicks that CAN'T physically be mimicked in toy form, then that goes to show that they didn't design it with toys in mind. It's about animation and character appeal first and foremost, and THAT was what sold the shitty toys of the 80's, not any sort of design compromise.
>Gunpla actually saved Gundam from its poor rating.
Nope, it was the compilation movies that made Gundam popular. Nothing saved MSG's cancellation, not even the Gunpla being sold with it at the time.
>which appeals to nerds of that era who were usually into military models
[citation needed]
>Your newfaggotry is showing, Retard.
Speak for yourself, assblasted babby.
>>11967328
>>11967685
>>11969402
I don't think that's from Layzner. I think's the Gwei from Dragonar.
>>11970150
>>I don't think that's from Layzner. I think's that's the Gwei from Dragonar.
Fixed
>>11970150
If that isn't a Skullgunner I don't know what is.
>>11970158
autismo much?
