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I want to write something like a composition of ten or more poems, whose themes might be insanity, erotic love, horror, pleasure, instinct, death and obscure atmospheres. I'm already at a good point, but I want more.
So can you tell me books or works related to these themes?
>>7753893
maybe... nah.. you're not ready.
You might want to try reading (or watching) a few absurdist plays as their surrealism in an attempt to represent existential struggle is often disturbing and reminiscent of madness (circular conversations, imagery of reality starting to blur into the struggles of the perceivers mind).
Eg Life without me by Daniel Keene
>>7753918
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPjvsd-9DC0&ab_channel=CroesyDrama
this is cool too.
I'm so sick of Daenerys and Tyrion getting all the intention, even amongst book fans.
Theon is, in my opinion, the best and most tragic character in the entire A Song of Ice and Fire series.
He goes from being an arrogant Prince in the first and second books to being a broken and tortured man in the fifth book. I don't think enough people understand the complexity of his character enough, especially show fans, but book ones too.
It actually makes me angry how many people dismiss his character as being nothing more than a bad person. They tend to view him as being very one-dimensional, where he is anything but. He's actually one of the most fleshed out and well developed characters in the entire series.
Yes, he's a horrible human being in the second book, and even to a certain extent in the fifth one, but he develops and grows so much. It's hard not to feel sympathetic for him once you know his backstory and the torture he eventually goes through.
What do the fans of A Song of Ice and Fire here think of Theon?
And this is unrelated to literature, but the actor who plays him on the show is, in my opinion, the best actor on the show.
man who gives a shit
Bookfags tend to agree he's one of the best characters
>genre fiction
>complex character
Good one. You almost had me for a second.
Is there even such a thing as retrowave books?
I fell in love with the genre of music and it sucked me right in. I'd love to be able to also read works of the same vein.
Any suggestions appreciated.
>>7753288
Oh shit bump
>>7753288
Have you read any 80s Cyberpunk? I think at that point it lacked enough self-awareness for what you are after.
Maybe you could call Ready Player One an ironic callback to that era but it's complete garbage.
How would a romanticized modern USA look like in the future literature ?
Well our first step is in electing Trump president.
I'm going to write a book on this now, thanks for the idea
>>7753072
godspeed
How do I get re-started with writing? It gave me a lot of joy when I was young, but I stopped doing it in my first college attempt. I think I stopped when I started reading/writing a lot of I guess "experimental" stuff like Beckett, Pynchon, and my writing was reflecting a lot of that, lost in its own cleverness and self-awareness, completely unable to tell a story because of how simple and pointless it felt to do so. I think the second thing that stopped me was realizing that unless I was completely writing only for myself, I was always evaluating my writing as if I was showing it off to someone. And if I fought against, I found there was no point to it besides this pandering. Even writing for myself, I'd think about how my future self would see it.
Even now, I'm already changing my mind on wanting to write again. What do you think I should do about this? Just skip it? Force myself to write a story? A novel? A blog? Sorry for the shitty post.
I have the same problem.
Ego-death would be a solution, since no-one cares for my writing, anyway, so why should I care?
What do you want to do with your writing?
>>7752990
Reading my favorite authors and more experimental authors (obviously that last part didn't work for you) makes me want to write. I love seeing how many directions a writer can go with the written word because it reminds me that I'm in a creative process, not a slog to an arbitrary goal.
What are the best books to help me understand poetry better? I basically know nothing about devices, forms, verse, and why certain poems are spaced out the way that they are, and go by intuition. Should I actually study this stuff, or is it unnecessary?
Just read. A bunch of faggots here will tell you to get books to hold your hand and they'll recommend Stephen Frye or some shit.
Just get an Anthology like the Norton or the Bloom and read a bunch from each era, then go from there.
>>7753002
Eh, Stephen's book is ok if you want to start practicing poetry. OP gave no indication he wants to practice, just read.
And in that case, yea, you might as well just read an casually look up different forms.
I found Poetic Designs by Stephen Adams very helpful when I was learning how to read poetry. The most important thing is learning meter and scansion. After that, knowing some schemes n tropes is good too, but all you really need to read is poetry.
Can I get some recommendations on books regarding cinema (creation, appreciation, criticism, philosophy of)?
So far, the list I made looks like this.
Cahiers du cinéma
What is cinema - André Bazin
S/Z - Roland Barthes
An introduction to the structural analysis of narratives - Roland Barthes
Signs and meaning in the cinema - Peter Wollen
Narrative discourse - Gerard Genette
Art as technique - Viktor Shlovsky
Morphology of the folk tale - Vladimir Propp
The hero with a thousand faces - Joseph Campbell
Narrative fiction: Contemporary Poetics - Rimmon Kenan
I intend to start with What is Cinema but afterwards I'm not sure in what order to attack it though. Pointers regarding that would be appreciated as well.
Thank you
Just read Petronius and get erectile dysfunction
How about some books that are like 8 1/2?
Sculpting in Time by Andrie Tarkovskii.
Do people usually like a bestiary at the end/beginning of a fantasy novel?
I want to definitely write a bestiary, but idk if I should add it into the book or just keep it as a reference for myself. (Bad memory when it comes to specifics)
You'll get better answers if you ask /tg/, chum.
I love appendices, but only if they answer more questions than they raise.
>>7750907
That kind of stuff is usually only released separately as a supplementary thing for diehard fans of big franchises.
Go ahead and do it, I know Scott Bakker always includes a summary of the history and a Dramatis Personae at the end of each book.
So /lit/, now that the dust has settled, what is Stephen King's BEST work? I'd definitely say either 11/22/63 or pic related.
What do you think is the best or scariest Stephen King book?
>>7750394
Hearty kek.
Let's have a screenwriting thread.
What are you currently working on? Reading anything that's being influential?
>>7740166
What is the best script ever written?
>Movies SHOW… and then TELL. A true movie is likely to be 60% to 80% comprehensible if the dialogue is in a foreign language.
>PROPS are the director’s key to the design of ‘incidental business’: unspoken suggestions for behavior that can prevent ‘Theatricality.’
>A character in isolation is hard to make dramatic. Drama usually involves CONFLICT. If the conflict is internal, then the dramatist needs to personify it through the clash with other individuals.
>Self pity in a character does not evoke sympathy.
>BEWARE OF SYMPATHY between characters. That is the END of drama.
>BEWARE OF FLASHBACKS, DREAM SEQUENCES and VISIONS. In narrative/dramatic material these tend to weaken the dramatic tension. They are more suited to ‘lyric’ material.
Student films come in three sizes: TOO LONG, MUCH TOO LONG and VERY MUCH TOO LONG.
>If it can be cut out, then CUT IT OUT. Everything non-essential that you can eliminate strengthens what’s left.
>Exposition is BORING unless it is in the context of some present dramatic tension or crisis. So start with an action that creates tension, then provide the exposition in terms of the present developments.
>The start of your story is usually the consequence of some BACKSTORY, i.e. the impetus for progression in your narrative is likely to be rooted in previous events – often rehearsals of what will happen in your plot.
>Coincidence may mean exposition is in the wrong place, i.e. if you establish the too-convenient circumstances before they become dramatically necessary, then we feel no sense of coincidence. Use coincidence to get characters into trouble, not out of trouble.
>PASSIVITY is a capital crime in drama.
>A character who is dramatically interesting is intelligent enough to THINK AHEAD. He or she has not only thought out present intentions, but has foreseen reactions and possible obstacles. Intelligent characters anticipate and have counter moves prepared.
>NARRATIVE DRIVE: the end of a scene should include a clear pointer as to what the next scene is going to be.
>Ambiguity does not mean lack of clarity. Ambiguity may be intriguing when it consists of alternative meanings, each of them clear.
>>7740216
>‘Comedy is hard’ (last words of Edmund Kean). Comedy plays best in the mastershot. Comic structure is simply dramatic structure but MORE SO: neater, shorter, faster. Don’t attempt comedy until you are really expert in structuring dramatic material.
>The role of the ANTAGONIST may have more to do with the structure of the plot than the character of the PROTAGONIST. When you are stuck for a third act, think through your situations from the point of view of whichever characters OPPOSE the protagonist’s will.
>If you’ve got a Beginning, but you don’t yet have an end, then you’re mistaken. You don’t have the right Beginning.
>In movies, what is SAID may make little impression – unless it comes as a comment or explanation of what we have seen happening.
>What is happening NOW is apt to be less dramatically interesting than what may or may not HAPPEN NEXT.
>What happens just before the END of your story defines the CENTRAL THEME, the SPINE of the plot, the POINT OF VIEW and the best POINT OF ATTACK.
>Make sure you’re chosen the correct point of attack. Common flaw: tension begins to grip too late. Perhaps the story has to start at a later point and earlier action should be ‘fed in’ during later sequences.
>What happens at the end may often be both a surprise to the audience and the author, and at the same time, in retrospect, absolutely inevitable.
>Character progression: when you’ve thought out what kind of character your protagonist will be at the end, start him or her as the opposite kind of person at the Beginning, e.g. Oedipus who starts out arrogant and ends up humiliated, Hamlet who is indecisive at the start and ends up heroic.
>Most stories with a strong plot are built on the tension of CAUSE AND EFFECT. Each incident is like a domino that topples forward to collide with the next in a sequence which holds the audience in a grip of anticipation. ‘So, what happens next?’ Each scene presents a small crisis that as it is revolved produces a new uncertainty.
>DRAMA IS EXPECTATION MINGLED WITH UNCERTAINTY.
>A SHOOTING SCRIPT IS NOT A SCREENPLAY. The beginning screenwriter should be discouraged from trying to invent stories in screenplay format.
>A FOIL CHARACTER is a figure invented to ask the questions to which the audience wants answers (asking the question may be more important than getting the answer.)
>NEGATIVE ACTION (something not happening) needs to be dramatised in positive action terms. You show something starting to happen which then is stopped.
>TWO ELEMENTS OF SUSPENSE ARE HALF AS SUSPENSEFUL AS ONE. Aristotle’s principle of unity means that one dramatic tension should dominate. All others are subordinate to it.
>CONFRONTATION SCENE is the obligatory scene that the audience feels it has been promised and the absence of which may reasonably be disappointing.
>What you leave out is as important as what you leave in.
>Screenplays are STRUCTURE, STRUCTURE, STRUCTURE.
im looking for literature that deals with the exploration of outer and inner violence (hopefully on mundane, contemporary settings), the abuse of the bourgeois without repercussions (something like salo), the overwhelming evilness on the world, etc. doesnt need to be a novel, philosophical work will do too. gonna leave some plot summaries from m haneke movies so you know what i mean.
>The film chronicles the last years of the European family, which consists of Georg, an engineer; his wife Anna, an optician; and their young daughter, Eva. They lead routine urban middle-class lives, with hopes of escaping to Australia to start a new life, but suddenly decide to destroy themselves without any apparent reason
>The plot of the film involves two young men who hold a family hostage and torture them with sadistic games.
>Using their social status and harsh punishments, a baron (Ulrich Tukur), a doctor (Rainer Bock) and a pastor (Burghart Klaussner) rule over a small German village.
>>7753949
Phenomenology of Spirit
>>7753949
have you seen Eden Lake, or High Tension yet? if not, you should. anyway, get some therapy.
>>7753953
how inaccessible is this
>>7753956
ive heard of both but seen none since i actively dislike 99% of the horror genre. i dont like these topics being treated like a clown that you can exploit for satisfaction. theyre also very detached from reality in purpose because theyre meant to entertaint, and i want something grounded with some sort of lecture intended
Hey /lit/ do you have any tips on making a book or a scene tense? Or is this something that you need to build up throughout the story?
Make a countdown :)
works every time! like a charm
add desert eagles
Its all about context, buildup and foreshadowing, study the movies with lots of tension for examples
Tbrh you wont find too much good advice here, because most people on /lit/ cant write a decent plot to save their lives. They compensate with prose wankery and pretend theyre too good for it.
Faulkner and then McCarthy
Fante and then Bukowski
Pynchon and then DFW
Joyce and then ????
>>7753713
Me.
Pound
Woolf, probably.
I'm going by X > Y, here.
Are there any books that quite clearly explain how it is one properly interprets the contents of a novel?
i would, but it transcends the meaning/unmeaning dichotomy.
>>7753682
Fuck that.
Just feel it
We all like to claim we live the literary lifestyle, devoid of any sort of arrogance or need for approval, quietly engaging in the life of contemplation that was much hyped by all those Greekz and Romanz.
But really, to what extent can you overcome desires present in your cognition (fame, power, etc) that have its root in evolutionary psychology?
Of course, some of them are more or less impossible to overcome I suppose (like hunger and thirst) but what about the rest?
Are Buddhists by and large deluded folk who actually satisfy their evolutionary need for pride and power by feeling like a part of a larger "enlightened" whole. I know a lot of Pali Buddhist texts really push the idea that monks are somehow "superior" to other people, now naturally, the Buddha would not dictate that his monks feel pride, but the fact is their "greatness" compared to the non-enlightened is noted. There are suttas that explicitly warn against monks who are in the bidness just for the fame, testifying that there are at least some famous monks who practice for a sense of pride.
Additionally, it seems that when meditation programmes are compared to other forms of group therapy (effectively controlling for factors such as "feeling a part of a community" and "reducing isolation") meditation itself is not that significantly effective.
In other words, it seems that even most meditation programmes (which are the ones that really stress inner-peace and solitude) seem to benefit users by satisfying their evolutionary need to be a part of a community.
Even the Buddha in Pali texts has stated the importance of having friends and companions (not spouses) in the community.
http://archinte.jamanetwork.com/article.aspx?articleid=1809754
http://www.tricycle.com/blog/don%E2%80%99t-believe-hype
http://www.tricycle.com/blog/meditation-nation
TL;DR: Can the solitary literary lifestyle ever be satisfying or are we too wired to want to be rich and famous?
>>7753473
Here is the general way i live
>I speak to those i am required to speak to
>I am friendly to an extent
>I don't get close to other people, it's not my style
>The only person i talk to properly is my girlfriend
>Other than her, i find it fairly easy to live a life of solitude, i just need her and no one else really
I never got the 'Part of a community' sort of thing, i never really liked being part of something like that, solitude has always suited me better
As for fame, i'd hate it. Power? I just have no interest.
Tl;dr i don't want to be rich and famous i just want to be /comfy/ with my girlfriend and i am
>>7753491
>Tl;dr i don't want to be rich and famous i just want to be /comfy/ with my girlfriend and i am
How adorable anon, I hope things don't end as badly for you as they do for most young-adults who derive a great amount of satisfaction from their loved ones.
>>7753473
you lay your troll in /lit/ too ?
>>>/sci/7893852
![MED41[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/lGUWlsO.jpg "MED41[1]")
