I might catch some hate for this, but I think people should stop recommending .22lr to new shooters forever.
I feel that by doing so youre forcing them into learning all kinds of bad habits and misinformation, while simultaneously letting them get accustomed to the lack of recoil of any other firearms. All guns that fire .22lr differ from any other gun so wildly that you can hardly compare them.
.22lr more designed for children to handle but personally I would never give a gun to someone under 18.
Perhaps what's worse is that instead of recommending something simple like an inexpensive polymer 9mm or a hammerless revolver, a lot of /k/ recommends milsurp and 10/22s for new shooters. I can't stress enough why this is the worst thing /k/ can do for new shooters, since what you are essentially doing is introducing the newbie into gun CULTURE, and not into responsible firearm ownership like it should be. By doing this, you essentially waste their money and time by having them buy a 10/22 or something instead of investing their (more than likely) limited funds on something practical that they can use to defend themselves right out the door. I see this happen a lot with foreigners and women who come to people for advice about guns and it saddens me every time I see some fudd or mall ninja do exactly what I described.
If I were to start getting someone into shooting I would let them try 9mm or .38 because of the low recoil and availability of the round. .22lr is getting harder and more expensive to find compared to other ammo as well. In addition, .22lr is mostly used for varmints and pest, something your average person won't deal with personally and would rather have an exterminator take care of.
Please /k/, we all know what .22lr is good for and when we should use it, but its time as an introductory round has come and gone. Do every new shooter a favor and just start them off on modern firearms.
.22lr is the only remaining rimfire round in any kind of common use. It's like recommending someone in the 1890s to start on a black powder Colt from the 1850s.
Are you saying not to recommend it to buy as a first gun?
Or not to use it to start out someone who owns no guns and asked to go shooting with you?
>>30360452
Have fun with that flinch.
>>30360521
>5.56
>flinch
>>30360537
I have one word for you:
>kuntzman
>>30360452
>you essentially waste their money and time by having them buy a 10/22
I could own a conex full of firearms and I would still feel incomplete without a 10/22. How can an inexpensive to purchase, inexpensive to shoot, easy to use, and fun to have rifle ever be a waste of time and money?
>>30360550
He should have had the gun pointing the other way when he pulled the trigger.
>>30360452
rounds larger than .22LR have been proven to give new shooters temporary PTSD
Is any collection complete without at least one 22LR rifle? I mean, if someone came to me looking for a single rifle or handgun to do as many things as possible, I wouldn't recommend the round - but if you're going to have several, a 22LR is a great addition to the fleet. It's not that hard to find around here, a little more expensive than it used to be but still way cheaper than anything else..
>>30360537
I mean, if your nose is on the charging handle.
>>30360452
The appleseed project disagrees...
>>30360452
>I would never give a gun to someone under 18
Nope. Stopped reading there. Learning how to safely use and maintain a gun as a child with your family makes for some of the best childhood memories possible, and getting an early start on something will do a lot for the end result of your ability as an adult.
I had a .22 mk3 and a glock 19, and I sold them both. they felt like shit and I might as well be paying money to use a stapler. The cartridge has no authority. Only had them four about eight months each.
Now I only own big revolver cartridges like 357, 44, 454 and a 308 rifle.
I agree with you OP, not only in the practicality of the weapons, but the fun factor that will keep them coming back for it.
I think of it a bit like when a kid wants to get into guitar. Its stupid to get him started with a boring looking squire in black and white or an acoustic guitar, he's going to get bored of it. Let him get the silly shapes and crazy colors he wants, and its something that just by looking at it, he's gonna want to pick it up.
Giving someone a 22 is just asking them to get bored of shooting,
as for the flinch, that goes away with practice.
What I did for myself and my brother, was to load already fired rounds in my revolvers, alongside live rounds, and just fired them not knowing which one was life, that gets rid of your flinch, and you can tell when its gone too.
>>30360500
>>30360452
>>30360625
>>30360650
I think .22 is the best cartridge to start on, when teaching a new or young shooter.
That being said, i would recommend someone's first purchase to be a compact carry pistol, an AR15 or a Shotgun. Because one should really buy defence guns before fun guns.
>I would never give a gun to someone under 18
Are you retarded?
>>30360452
>letting them get accustomed to the lack of recoil of any other firearms
That's literally the point. You need to become accustomed to proper firearm handling and shooting technique before you become accustomed to recoil because that makes it far easier to become accustomed to the recoil. You learn from the bottom up. It's like learning proper driving techniques before teaching someone to drive at high speed.
>introducing the newbie into gun CULTURE, and not into responsible firearm ownership like it should be
Gun culture IS responsible firearm ownership. I don't know why you would present them as if they are dichotomies or in any way separated, because they aren't. I don't even understand what you're trying to say here.
>.22lr is getting harder and more expensive to find compared to other ammo as well
It's still easier to find and cheaper than the vast majority of cartridges in existence and will continue to be so for the foreseeable future.
>.22lr is mostly used for varmints and pest, something your average person won't deal with personally
That's just a stupid argument. Training and plinking is a legitimate use of a cartridge in itself; you don't need to plan to actually use that round to kill things to be able to make use of it. I don't plan on personally conquering Europe and eradicating the undesirable races of the world any time soon but I can still enjoy shooting 8mm mauser.
None of your arguments have any shred of sense to them. I'm not sure if I've just been trolled or if you are actually that stupid. I fear the latter more than the former.
>>30360770
/thread
let it die boys
>>30360452
>22lr is getting harder and more expensive to find compared to other ammo
Name one caliber that's cheaper than .22. Go on, I'll wait. By the way, PSA's having a sale on the stuff for about $0.08 a round and SGAmmo has a bunch in stock, even if it is more expensive.
>>30360815
>$0.08 a round
>$14 shipping
>>30360625
>Learning how to safely use and maintain a gun as a child with your family makes for some of the best childhood memories possible
>tfw one of your earliest memories is absentmindedly pointing my (unloaded) rifle at my dad's head
>tfw still remember his look of mixed fear/disappointment/anger
Feels bad man. That look on his face still haunts me and keeps me vigilant of where I'm pointing my firearm.
>>30360835
Jokes on you I get nearly 80% off Fedex with my works GFE/GFP account, that's right what you pay for ground/home delivery can use to get overnight.
Only thing is I have to special request an outer box to conceal the fact that 1000s of bullets are flowing into my workplace
>>30360866
>remember being a kid toying with guns
>unloading 22 revolver for a safety check, all the ammo falls on the couch
>spin the barrel and was gonna dryfire.
>think it wouldn't hurt to safety check again like everyone always gets anal about
>there was still a round in the cylinder
Every since then I always double, and triple check, smack the ejector rod for revolvers, and put the magazine at a safe distance, lock the slide and finger the gun to make sure there are no rounds in there.
>>30360895
>dryfiring a rimfire cartridge
replying to myself because I know its coming. I learned that was wrong too.
>>30360452
I started shooting 9mm and have always stuck by 9mm as my caliber of choice. I shot a .22 once and the only reason I finished out the mag was because I didn't want to be rude to the owner. It just felt like a loud pellet gun to me.
The only real draw to me in terms of .22lr is how inexpensive they are. Been thinking about getting a PPK and am really on the fence about whether I should buy the .22lr for ~$350 or spend twice as much for the .308. It would only be for the range and not as a CCW, so it doesn't matter as much to me, but there's still a very loud part of me that's saying to myself "just pay a little more for the larger caliber or you'll regret it."
>>30360452
>but personally I would never give a gun to someone under 18.
I learned to shoot at 5 years old
By the time I was 8, I was shooting clays at 50 yards all day long
>>30360835
10 Boxes = Free shipping. And if you're buying less than that, you're already doing it wrong.
>>30360576
I get it
.22's are cheap and as a beginner gun allow you to learn the basics of marksmanship and gun safety.
>wall of text for what amounts to
>IDS 2016 GUIS CUM AWN
yeah, nah. until the day 50 rounds of .22 costs costs more than 50 9x19, it'll remain the best for introducing new shooters and yes, teaching children.
Most people are not specialelitedeltaoperators.
A .22 is a good way to practice shooting moving targets.
I have shown many people how to shoot with a .22 instead of a "real caliber because it doesn't intimidate them.
>>30360452
I just went shooting today and my 10/22 was my favorite to shoot honestly. Yeah its kind of a guilty pleasure but fuck you.
>>30360895
>Spin the barrel
Thats how you do the rifling in place, yes?
>>30361819
No, that's how you beat them with a hallway.
>>30360452
Even after months of getting into shooting I never realized I had a flinch/anticipitation problem until I bought a 22lr gun which helped alot. The fact that somehow a lighter recoil gun develops bad habits is literal retardation especially considering even dry firing (no recoil) is legitimately encouraged to form good shooting habits
Also if you ever plan to take someone new to shooting a 22 is a must have. Almost everyone I took always went back to the 22 that were offput by 9mm even out of a full size gun, which honestly is understandable for a brand new shooter thats never touched a gun before their whole life
Tldr op talks out of his ass and gives shit advice
.22 is also a great round for innawoods survival. Same weight/space as 50 9mm/.223 is 500 .22, and doesn't vaporize small game.
>been shooting for 10 years
>own 14 firearms
>never shot a .22lr
what did I miss?
>>30361826
A good four-bulb lamp will beat a hallway any day.
>>30362705
If denim can stop a .22, i'm sure it will stop any lamp
>>30360452
Agreed OP. I think the .22 as an intro gun is one of the most embedded pieces of fuddlore still around.
For a rifle I think it's best to start someone on a small caliber like .223. The gun itself is easier to load, less likely to jam, has a more visible effect on a target, is louder, and still has minimal recoil. Overall a much more fun and realistic introduction into firearms.
>>30362799
Dubs confirm
I've been shooting since I was 12 and I was not a huge fan of .22 from the start
For me personally a lot of the fun of shooting guns comes from the recoil and power of the gun
.22 definitely has a place, I'm not trying to hate on it, but for someone who is buying their first gun and will presumably only have that single gun to shoot for some time, I wouldn't recommend .22
OP here
>>30360500
both. teaching someone with 9mm or 5.56 is better in my opinion simply because the rounds are commonly seen and used in media around them and they are easy with recoil. It will give a more relatable impression of guns if you familiarize them with guns they see all the time (ARs, Glocks, AKs, etc).
>>30360557
It can be a waste because most adults in this day and age would benefit more from investing money in self defense first. Also, most people can learn marksmanship and safety practices from using small calibers like 9mm.
>>30360625
>>30361469
>>30360696
So you learned to shoot before 18. Good for you, but most people wouldn't dare let a kid handle a gun for obvious reasons. There are already plenty of cases where a kid kills their parent or themselves, so whether you like my opinion or not it happens to still seem like a bad idea.
>>30360770
1. Recoil is a part of firing any gun. .22lr cheats you out of that experience. So actually it's more like learning how to drive with a bicycle.
2. Wrong. Gun safety is exactly that, safety. Gun Culture is the shared beliefs and ideas between all the community of people that LOVE guns and not just use them for work or defense. You get all kinds of undesirables mixed in and alienate the rest of the country because of them. They hurt the image of the responsible gun owner and recommend stupid things like buying a mosin or a 10/22 first.
Also, as much as I hatebto say this, please don't try to pass off training with a 10/22 as a valuable skill either. Most people don't see it as such and take the arrogant and misguided view that they can just make a makeshift bow like their favorite movie or videogame character and just hunt varmints that way. I know it's stupid but people these days don't even know where stores get meat and other food like eggs.
>>30360890
Not everyone has or wants that or other special deals. Hard to imagine, I know.
>>30362672
bb gun
>>30360452
Your a fuck. Go away...
>>30360576
Agreed this guy next to my lane had his girl shooting a 40 cal for her first shoot and she freaked out after she shot it so I let her shoot my .22 Browing Buckmark and she loved it and was enjoying it more so I would say plinkers are good for people that don't have a allot of experience shooting and it's less likely to scare ppl away from guns in general...
>>30362928
>for obvious reasons
Kids aren't dumb, teach them proper safety and start them on something small. My little sister was pretty apprehensive until we got her on a pellet gun shooting cans in our backyard and practicing gun safety with it. Eventually we moved up to a 10/22 and she liked it too. She tried an SKS later and enjoyed making some watermelons explode. Teach them to treat guns with respect and not fear and don't give them more than they can handle.
>>30362928
>but most people wouldn't dare let a kid handle a gun for obvious reasons
They're fucking idiots and poor parents? I can't tell if this is bait or you're just retarded.
>>30364696
>>30363604
It's my opinion
It's too bad I'm right however because kids shouldn't use guns in any situation besides the worst emergencies like if the parents are incapacitated.
>>30365761
that's not how opinions work you asshat
>>30360452
How you would teach adult swining, if said adult have no experiance with it?
>>30365761
So you don't think that if children have to defend themselves and their injured parents they should be forced to do it with no training or experience whatsoever? Why do you want them to fail?
I know god damn 8 year old girls who have fun shooting an M1 carbine, its an entirely healthy and fun hobby.
>le 22 can't kill maymay
Stopping power is a fudd meme
Smells like summer to me lads.
Sage grows in all fields.
>>30360650
>Giving someone a 22 is just asking them to get bored of shooting
guys i only shoot rounds for grown-ups
>>30362928
>most people wouldn't dare let a kid handle a gun for obvious reasons
what
>obvious reasons
even in my fascist anti-gun country you can take kids to range
>>30361393
.380
>>30360452
>obvious bait is obvious
>If not bait OP is just an idiot
6/10 got me to reply
