Why is the US still using a century-old machine gun in frontline use? Aren't there better or more modernized .50 cal weapons that could sync with apps or be improved with tactical accessories?
>>29560262
They've tried on more than one occasion to replace it, but what's been fielded has not been as reliable for durable.
Generally the aim is the get a lighter weapon, but since it's only fielded on vehicles or from fixed positions, it's generally not that big of a deal to save 20-30 pounds on it since someone doesn't have to carry it.
That being said, it still sucks ass to ruck with one.
>>29560262
>Aren't there better...
No
If it ain't broke don't spend money fixing it.
>>29560262
Because it's good
>>29560262
The closest thing is the Russian Kord but, you know, Russia. That and the M2 still works, so, yeah. Replacing several millions of those is not easy. Updating it. sure, and they've done that.
don't you mean "Why is the entire western world still using a century-old machine gun in frontline use?"
Because its a god damn fantastic heavy machine gun that's why. The Russians have gone through so many because they've had so many problems with them.
>>29560262
They already waste enough money on shit that doesnt need to be replaced.
>>29560262
If you think that's weird, consider that Boeing has a contract to support AIM-9 Sidewinders (introduced in 1956) until 2055.
>>29560262
>improved with tactical accessories?
>>(you)
Gunned down thousands of germans, good enough for me
>>29560362
doesn't missile fuel degrade over time? how do you fire a 60 year old missile with 60 year old fuel/warhead
Shit aint broke
>>29560362
Technology isn't progressing anymore...
That being said modern AIM-9's are barely comparable to the ones of old
>>29560262
It's because they found out that .50 MGs+ammo weren't worth the weight for infantry to carry. Lightened .50s have sucktastic cyclic rates and if they're going to stay mounted/fixed why bother with weight savings.
The biggest problem with the M2 is that most in circulation are worn the fuck out.
>>29560262
got a better one up your sleeve ?
if it aint broke dont fuck with it
>>29560262
There actually was a project to improve it but the new design had more problems then improvements. Such as not shooting with the night scope. I only know this because my dad was the pm for it.
>>29560408
>360 degree LOBL
>not progressing
>>29560362
Good enough for most targets
>>29560262
Because it just werks.
>>29560262
Because it's pretty good. They updated it with some new features that were missing and it just werks. Most western doctrines use it mounted anyway so there is no doctrinal need for a new one.
At least it's an american design. The m60 is an fg42 ripoff. 240bravo and 249 are belgian. M9 an italian gun with strong p38 influences... The modern american military's most modern american gun is from the 60s if you don't count minor use stuff like the barret light 50
>>29560769
Literally every modern western machine gun borrows from the MG42 and FG42 in some way.
>>29560769
the f22 sabre is a direct copy of a german design
All american designs are copies.Even the m2 flamethrower in ww2 was a copy of germany's
>>29560262
>>29560262
>sync with apps
Terrible plan, you've just given your 50 Cal an electronic attack vector with no real positive trade off
>be improved with tactical accessories
It's been improved to the level reasonably required for its modern uses. Honestly it just works reliably and there's not much it needs.
>>29560389
Supporting =/= Maintaining
are you retarded?
>>29560362
>>29560362
>>29560362
Good. If they tried to build one from the ground up it would end up like the f-35.
>Missile.exe has stopped working
>>29560262
It still does it's job, no point replacing something that works.
>>29560262
because the M2 works just fine. plus we have so many that a project to replace them would be insane.
also, that's kinda the best design for a air-cooled, belt-fed .50 caliber machine gun.
minigun eats through ammo and battery too fast, mk19 is grenades only and that's not always what you want, M2 it is.
>>29560262
they still update it slightly. shortly before I got out, my unit got some new barrels that didn't need to be headspaced/timed (in emergency situations, it was still recommended that we did so). But it's a good gun that'll take down anything that doesn't have an inch of steel armor on it, and fire every time you press the butterfly
>>29562909
sounds like the M2E2 upgrade, funnily enough the M2 was the last MG in US service to need headspacing when you swapped barrels out.
did any of the M2s have any form of safety other than "don't hit the fucking trigger" and the using spent brass to jam the butterfly trick?
Apparently not, OP.
>>29562967
Is it weird that this gave me feels?
>>29560262
Because they haven't found something that offers an advantage over it that's worth the cost of replacing it.
Also, nothing's really matched the reliability of the action.
>>29564375
It would be weird if it didn't.
>>29562967
Holy shit I was the 2210 Sirius anon :D made my night that someone found that cap-worthy
We're going to be humping that fucker into space.
>>29560262
We will still be using this thing when we are conquering other planets. There is nothing worth replacing it with. The M2A1 is about as close as a weapon system can get to perfection.
>>29560262
because it was design by this son of a bitch
>>29565110
This. Unless we can come up with something that does the 50's job better than a 50, we will continue to use the m2 for ages to come.
>>29565790
die prick.
>>29565802
Shut up and ruck, faggot.
>>29565790
>>29565405
Funny story, one of the models of the the Heavy Stubber in Warhammer 40,000 is a M2HB, according to old canon.
So the Imperium of Man is STILL using this thing to kill Xenos 38,000 years from now.
>>29565910
>M2 ma duce
>removing Xenos in the 41st millennium
>>29560427
this we had one in iraq in 06 that had been in circulation since 1942...still worked without a problem so at least it was built to last
>>29560262
Works cheaper, better, or longer than attempted replacements. That being said they did upgrade the barrel to be prehead spaced and finally kinda got the kinks worked out recently
>>29560262
No.
>>29562909
Still need to time it but not needing to headspace it was fucking amazing
>>29565910
>>29566415
That's hilarious.
Wonder if the Orks treat it as a collectors Dakka?
>>29565910
>the Imperial Guard is locked in a stalemate with a Tyranid hive on a planet on the outermost fringes of the Imperium
>half of the M2 gunnery teams are washed away by a glob of acid-breath artillery
>the Tyranids are about to break through the Imperial lines
>a Warp Storm washes over the planet, filling the battlefield with the risen spirits of the dead
>the Imperial Guard's trenches are filled with the ghosts of American GIs
>they shuffle over to the Ma Deuces, reload, and open fire on the screaming horde
>"Gee I knew the Krauts were ugly, Frank, but this is ridiculous."
>"Shut up and keep feeding that ammo, Bill. We can't let the old guy in the chair down."
>A nearby Commissar overhears the ghosts, screams "THE EMPEROR PROTECTS!", and rallies the living and the dead to hold the line for at least another day
>>29567144
die motherfucker die
>>29561248
Shit son all credit goes to china. Everybody use Chinese gunpowder. All firearms are derrivitives of Chinese engineering.
>>29567464
You die first.
>>29567464
Burst timing at its finest
Even grim darkness in the 41st Millennium, it still removes.
>>29560282
My back hurts just thinking about that
wasn't there one anon who said that he did his weapon quals on the M2 freehand?
>>29566780
That's cool as fuck desu
>>29560429
Thanks for your expert opinion on the matter based on your extensive experience, eurofaggot
>>29566780
>getting to use a M2 that probably removed a lot of kraut and jap
>tfw a gun is more badass than you will ever be
why should I live
>>29568147
Dam, I can't believe I didn't notice the heavy stubber was a browning.
>>29560301
>what's the F35
>>29567144
>the old guy in the chair
God damn that was a good read. Legion of the Damned Doughboys when
>>29568309
An aircraft that can dance circles around the competition is a bit different from a gun with no real improvements in the ability to put lead downrange.
>>29565910
What's bullshit is that you can throw a heavy stubber on anything for five points, but the bits for heavy stubbers only cone in chimera boxes.
>>29560262
>Aren't there better or more modernized
No
the M2 was designed for .50BMG, what better gun than it to sling said .50 downrange?
plus you can't really optimize it, it's the final evolution of belt fed high caliber guns.
>>29568496
>what better gun to sling .50 downrange?
Four of them strapped together.
>>29568527
fair enough.
It uses a great cartridge for ranged stationary MG use with soft vehicle AP properties. What's not to love about based Browning?
>tfw the browning will be used forever and the only major change left is magnetic assistance to the point that the bullets speed is almost high enough they break apart in the air
>tfw probably won't happen for 100 years
>>29568566
I forgot
>tfw muh gauss
>>29567122
Orks wouldn't know QUALITY ENGINEERING if it shot them in the head.
They'd collect them merely because they can actually feel the recoil off of one.
>>29568566
what would that be, the M2A3?
the last time the M2 was updated was the 90s to lock in the headspace and timing.
>>29568309
Honestly, I don't know what they were thinking with the F-35. We only got about two dozen of them so I guess it wasn't that good.
>>29560301
>what is the army's quest for a new handgun
That being said, the M2 is still perfect.
>>29560769
All the non-meme guns in service today are pretty old, or are updated variants of old guns.
>>29568597
likely m2a3 or a4
I'm sure they will find some way to improve / make things more convenient with it
>>29568275
Lol, he called you out and you cried like a little bitch.
>>29568275
half the planet uses them
the other half uses russian guns
Austria uses the M2 as well
we like it
as does half the planet
>>29560262
Because it's still the best there is.
And that's m1919 machinegun, not m2.
>>29568676
can't tell if bait or just retardation.
that is the M2HB, the 1919 is 30-06 and much smaller and looks totally different
Because better machineguns aren't worth retooling factories.
It's like why couldn't the B-24 replace the B-17 completely.
Because while it was better, it was not good enough to justify retooling all factories.
>>29568685
Actually you're right...
Is it a replica though? It's smaller than I remember it.
>>29568698
probably the angle, as there's no M2 replicas minus the rubber ducks.
she's still the big bitch everyone loves remembers.
>>29567542
Amazing how they had gunpowder for so much longer than Europeans but the Chinese made virtually no advances in forearm technology.
Almost all artillery and firearm innovations were made by Europeans.
>>29568527
>Quadcannon!
>I do not have patience for this!
>>29560262
Be more subtle next time OP, 2/10
>>29568705
I know right? I mean our forearm technology is so advanced, we can masturbate with our left hands, how amazing is that?
>>29560262
What was the name of that guy that sniped gooks in vietnam with it?
>>29560427
Actually from what i heard most of the more worn well used ones tend to run better compared to newer ones
>>29568731
carlos hathcock
>>29568725
As little as their dicks are I guess they never had a need to evolve such technology.
>>29568286
>insert /k/ screencaps about M2s on Mars here
>>29568742
pffft hadcock
Its actually being replaced. no more headspace timing problems. New version was just approved a few months ago.
>>29560262
>>tactical accessories
What, do you think people are gonna be clearing rooms with a .50bmg if they put a handgrip and flashlight on it?
>>29569034
>he doesn't have a gucci af LaRue M2 to post in /m2g/
>>29568650
It is almost like technology builds upon itself.
Oh
wait.
>>29569039
>>29569034
>3, 2, 1, BREACH!
>the door flies in
>i shoulder my cqb M2 and start spraying
>the CHUCHUCHU fills our ears
>3 people are dead
>well, enough parts to make 3 as they are scattered and splattered around the room
>there are 1 foot holes in the wall
>repeat for the next 4 houses
>get back in humvee and mount m2 to the turret
>life is good
>>29562949
Right before I got out I went to an EIB course. Bolo'd the M2 range because it was the first time I saw one with a safety, and I was frantically looking for the HS/T gauges. They gave me a redo after explaining it was a new model.
>>29568920
What's it called?
>M2A8E45Mod.2016c
No one really gives a shit about small arms.
>>29568705
Yeah 'cause Colt, Browning, Maxim (wasn't made a british subject until 1900), Henry, Winchester, Eliaphet Remington, Smith, and Wesson weren't born in the USA.
>>29568264
All of my units gunners had to.......but we lacked T/E>>29568275
>>29568458
>F35 shills still in damage control
>>29560262
Because if it ain't broke don't fix it, and also there are newer models that have easier barrel replacement but the guns that are trying to replace it aren't near as cheap or easy to use
>>29568476
You can use heavy guns from any other company or cast your own in resin using silicone molds. I'm pretty sure that was half the point back in the Rogue Trader days.
>>29560262
The real reason is it's good enough. You could get a certain amount of improvement through various other designs, but it's not really worth the cost of replacement for what you'd get out of it.
And, now that you don't have to adjust headspace and timing every damn time you change the barrel, there's even less reason to change.
>>29572960
You would get a substantial improvement
and putting 100 year old .50cals on modern tanks is fucking idiot, they need grenade launchers & autocannons
>>29573013
Not really, and there are reasons why not everything is an autocannon, mostly to due with size and weight restrictions with the ammunition. .50 BMG is a good round for defensive purposes, especially in a CROWS mount. If you need something exploded, use the cannon. If there's an RPG team in a window, then the CROWS M2 can definitely come in handy.
>>29573013
HMGs, autocannon and grenade launchers all fill different roles.
If it ain't broke...
>>29560262
>It's not broke, but I still want to fix it
kill yourself, OP.
>>29560769
>240bravo
The 240 is based on the BAR, Browning's design influence on FN lasted a long time after he died.
>>29568286
>repatriating equipment from warzones
No, that M2 sat in a state guard armory stateside until someone tripped over it
>>29568735
This is truth, when the shit's worn out, it cycles faster. Obviously not intended but it happens.
> source: I loved killing shitskins before the shitskin in chief pulled us out
>>29568527
>you will never shoot into a Chinese human wave attack with a quad fifty
Fun story though, some American generals or something toured Dien Bien Phu and told the French how effective they were in Korea, the French put some in and used them to great effect against the Viet Minh.
>>29560282
It takes 5 people at minimum to carry a M2, tripod, ammo and spare barrel.
>>29560262
yay this thread again
>>29560262
>Aren't there better or more modernized .50 cal weapons
They tried to make better, more modern .50s to replace M2. Spoiler; they sucked absolute ass.
>>29568710
>Let's go carshopping
>I'll make my own path!
>>29573013
>they need grenade launchers & autocannons
Nationstates plz go
DShK isn't any better.
>>29562967
>B52H
>not B52M or something
>>29560262
>Aren't there better or more modernized .50 cal weapons that could sync with apps or be improved with tactical accessories?
Yes there are far superior alternatives, mainly the Russia Kord, however USA procurement is completely fucked nowadays.
>>29568527
and put them on a truck
death on wheels
>>29573106
>>29574072
The American military has always been more lightly armed compared to their contemporaries anyway. Fucking Russia always goes full retarded with everything by slapping some missiles and a 30mm on anything that moves.
>>29574562
>DShK
>what is the NSV or Kord
>>29574803
lighter, for the same performance. yet we don't know what the durability and reliability is like.
>>29574678
Hahahahaha nope. M2 still works better than any Russian heavy machine gun.
>>29560262
Ok so if you take a M2 and helicopter mount it, it becomes the GAU-18 essentially. The air force ordered a ton of GAU-21s (same gun, upgraded internals to give 1000-1100 rpm) but the guy who bought it didn't realize we can't mount it because the mounts are incompatible. Soon though. Having shot both the GAU-2C (minigun) and the GAU-18, I would take the 18 any day. Mk211 rounds will fuck up anything short of heavy armor. Its too easy and durable to give up, like an Alabama prostitute
>>29574488
You're free to leave the website at any time anon :^)
>>29575195
silly newfag
b-b-because it kicks ass! i dont care that it was used by my grandpa,its vintage and COOL rucking with it is a g-g-good workout too! its awesome i swear!
>>29574803
Is it the NSV or the Kord that has a fucking pull start like a chainsaw to chamber a round?
>>29575586
It is cool though, even if it's heavy as absolute fuck.
If you're in a position where you need to ruck the M2, tripod, barrels, and ammo all by yourself then you have fucked up somewhere.
Try using a Mk.19 which is heavier and also fucking jams all the time because it's finger fucked by mentally retarded sea monkeys.
>>29577713
MK19 is lighter, unloaded.
>>29577748
I meant loaded. Moving one on the tripod is fucking retarded hard.
>>29565910
>So the Imperium of Man is STILL using this thing to kill Xenos 38,000 years from now.
Dude the Imperium still uses the fucking 1911 design.
>>29569034
>>29569103
>>29569103
>>29569103
>>29569103
Posting Ma in a Ma thread.
Every time I'm near one, I love how they make everything else just fade away.
>>29577965
>Posting Ma in a Ma thread.
>>29577965
>Posting Ma in a Ma thread.
>>29577990
>>29577965
>everything else fade away
Because you can't hear anything.
>>29562632
They have tried at least twice and, just as you say, f-35
>>29574785
GPS and radios kill more shit skins than any amount of anmo you can carry.
>>29560769
Knowledge is cumulative fuckass. Technology builds on technology. Very rarely is a an idea completely new and stand alone.
>>29567144
Damm, I hate goosebumps in the morning
>>29560262
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jwu3ivAJ68U
They exist, but they aren't American.
>>29568566
Major change is the Exacto system, and diamond-like-carbon coatings. Laser guided bullets with barrels that don't wear.
>>29560427
>The biggest problem with the M2 is that most in circulation are worn the fuck out.
http://www.army.mil/article/150794/Making_the_old_like_new/
>>29571345
>Boeing shill still mad that his plane was a piece of shit
>>29568705
About the time China figured out gunpowder, it became a fairly homogeneous Empire. Conflict within China all but stopped and the enemies they fought were less advanced.
By contrast, Europe was made up of dozens of kingdoms which were constantly at war with each other and were invaded by outsiders for a good 1k years. Constant warfare forced technological innovation forward. Firearms came along for the ride.
Institutional inertia and the Ma Deuce is just good enough that any replacement would have to offer pretty crazy improvements befre we throw all of those M2s ino surplus. There ar ebeter HMGs these days, but nothing better enough for the Army to ditch the old thing.
Though thank god for them finally introducing the M2A1 a couple years back. The new flash suppressor is really useful and it was about 50 or so years beyond schedule for the old thing to finally get a manual safety for he trigger block and a fixed headspace and timing so you don't have to fuck around with that stuff (and risk the gun blowing up into your face if you get it wrong) every time you do maintenance.
>>29560262
it's an excellent weapon and nothing truly better deserving the change has come across
all the shit you want on it are just toys, the thing does what is supposed to do pretty damn well
Not broken, don't fix it
>>29568597
That wasn't in the 90s. That was in 2010. The project in the 90's got thrashed by budget reductions and then revived again in 2008 or so and actually worked out that time.
>>29574737
>a truck
>not a toyota hilux
for shame, anon.
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=5c3_1358295157
