Hey /intl/ what would the world be like without the USA, historically, technologically, and socially?
I feel like the USA and the way it developed had a big impact on the way the rest of the world grew, almost as if we would all be living under kings and queens in pre 1900 conditions using guns barely better then the first Lebel rifle. I know things would continue without the USA, but it was a big part of our modern history.
Where would Asia be for that matter?
World peace and a Mars colony.
We would still be in the middle age right ? Btw god bless america
>>61891352
No skyscrapers ( William Le Baron Jenney )
No modern agraculture (John Deere)
No Television ( Philo Farnsworth )
No Films (Eadweard Muybridge [worked in america], Thomas Edison,
No radio stations or police radio ( Charles Herrold, Bayonne, New Jersey police department )
>Two way radio at all might not have existed if WWII never happened
No modern weaponry or tactics (Christopher Miner Spencer, John Browning, Samuel Colt, Smith & Wesson, Richard J Gatling )
No phones ( Alexander Graham Bell )
No Internet or computers ( The US government supported both of these, but wouldn't exist, ARPANET )
No Electricity (Thomas edison, and Nikoloa Tesla who lived and died in new york)
No Mass produced well working cars beyond that of any form of steam powered wagon on wheels ( George Brayton, Henry Ford )
NO MEMES (Moot)
No vidya ( Thomas T. Goldsmith Jr. )
>>61891420
no we'd still be in the industrial revolution.
There'd have been a much more civil unrest and wars in Europe unless there'd been a place to dump umemployed young people.
That's pretty much what some of the Middle East and Africa are doing now and they're still more or less at war.
>>61891420
Europe couldn't invent shit without trying to have the church or crown crush them.
>>61891547
>le evil anti-science church
>>>r/atheism
Yuorpoors would have killed each other for another few hundred years then the world would be pretty similar to what it is today.
>>61891470
also soda, pizza, and well all the good tasting food. a fish head, and cow intestine in a pie isn't good food yuropoor.
>>61891567
>If I turn it into a meme, it didn't happen for centuries
>>61891547
Most puritans left Europe to found your country in the new world.
>>61891402
This.
>>61891669
they then died off or the next generation of some of them simply grew new and bretty gud beliefs.
Seriously the founding fathers were pretty enlightened fellows, Deism is pretty cool.. "God is nature and doesn't really get involved in shit"
>>61891630
But we fucked whites so hard they're crying to this day
>>61891352
>>61891352
in all seriousness
if it wasn't the USA it would have been another cuntry
you're not special
no people are
We'd be far far better off without your country bullying everyone and hogging everything to yourselves
worldwide german empire followed by communist revolution
>>61896676
>bullying everyone
Lol cry more zika monkey
>>61896676
Thats an outrage!
Why, we give more in foreign aid than any other country on earth. We are the most benevolent superpower the earth has ever seen
>>61891538
This.
>>61891547
American retarded arrogance.
>>61896810
Hardly.
There are plenty of studies pointing out Germany would've probably lost even without a successful D-day
>>61896875
This.
Have you SEEN the size of our military?
If Putin or Xi or Mugabe or Castro or whomever had our military power theyd be annexing motherfuckers till San Gennaro.
>>61896910
What the fuck has Australia invented? The fridge? Very extensive list
>>61896868
You're gonna have to try harder than that if you want to rustle my jimmies
>>61896875
Not really. Your "foreign aid" is normally used as means for power projection in whatever place you want to dick around or gather resources/intel
You are, for instance, the major cause for the whole middle eastern problems we're currently facing thanks to what Iv mentioned above
It's just that as an american your opinion is biased towards the whole super hero complex mentality, which is a shame
>>61897004
Boomerangs
>>61895184
Thats what I mean though, if the people who inhabited it were the natives up until today, sure some Europeans could live there, just as much as a few scientists live in Antarctica.
>>61897035
Blah blah blah.
Bottom lime, we give out more foreign aid than anyone. How much forein aid does russia amd china give out?
>middle east
>americas fault
Mossadegh would disagree. You want Britain and France for than one, friendo. They started the entire shit
>>61897035
>its an "America is evil" episode
If we were really that bad youd be speaking better english than you do
>>61897035
When something like a tsunami happens somewhere like India or Japan, whose navy is the first to the scene?
>>61891547
>>61891660
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Catholic_scientists
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Roman_Catholic_cleric-scientists
>>61897035
>aid
for you
>>61897143
That doesn't make any sense
>>61897189
It means we would have annexed you.
Also,
>biting the hand that feeds you
Poor form, Joao
>>61897150
Well, in the Sri Lankan tsunami, India showed up within hours, not that it really matters to anything.
>>61897004
the two way radio, although it was improved during WWII by multiple countries.
http://vocaroo.com/i/s1ER2bpELb0O
>>61897292
Wow breaking news, the country directly bordering and most familiar of neighbors arrives first
>>61897160
for jew
and African countries that are trying to climb out from the pit that European imperialism put them in.
>>61897275
Notice how you and your countrymen are the ONLY ones supporting OP's cause.
You are the guys who at one hand feigned friendship while plotting overtake our country back in the cold war. You do this kind of covetous shit all the time and worse than all, you trully think you're some sort of hot shit paragon of justice because you tossed some meager amount of gifts
I'm not saying your country is outright evil or anything like that because superpowers have always abused their power. What makes you guys worst than, say the Mongolian empire, is that you have global range
>>61897469
Thanks for proving my point that you're not special then. I just replied to your post.
>>61897482
>>61897626
Also, we're at the very least 90 years in and those countries are still in the apex of poverty
>>61897482
>all this foreign aid
what the hell are we paying them for?
>>61897893
ego boost I suppose
>>61897626
I don't have a cause only a claim that the US was a big part of our modern world.
>>61897893
They are our proxy to fight in the middle east.
>>61891547
>One faggot with a telescope has an argument with the church that has pioneered science and education for centuries and continues to do so today ruined their whole image.
Fucking Galileo meme, the Catholic church has done more for Humanity than America ever could.
>>61897951
Your claim is that you guys represent a mostly positive big part of our modern world.
At the very least that's the message your posts have been conveying so far in this thread.
Memes aside the Soviet Union probably would have easily fucked up Europe and taken over after WW2 but on the other hand the Europeans might have gotten together and prevented this, a federalized Europe has been a concept since WW2 and the Soviet Union would be a good reason to do so.
Other than that the Middle east would probably be better off.
Black people would probably remain a myth in smaller European countries like they were in Ireland twenty years ago.
>>61897626
Seems to me you have a fundamental misunderstanding of the purpose and function of countries. If you think ANY country does anything out of some misguided sense of altruism you're sadly mistaken. Sure we have interests like every other country. Of course we look out for our well being first. Do we do dirty shit sometimes? Yes, because thats a prerequisite of being on the global stage period.
What I'm saying is that we're the best of most possible superpower countries because at least we make an attempt to do the charitable humanitarian thing. Other countries would just annex everyone
>>61891707
If you consider starvation of the masses and tyrannical rule from "ZUH MUZAHLAND" peace.
>>61898118
We send aid to starving countries and starve countries with AIDS.
>>61898118
I propose you to go around asking everyone else who isn't American about this "best of most possible superpower countries" thing of yours and come back here posting the results for us to see. It's going to be amusing.
Having interests is one thing. Reaching out with one hand while making everyone's lives miserable, ending up screwing up whole populations is a completely different monster.
For instance in Europe: You guys helped yourselves from their misfortunes amidst the war
I don't have a very positive view about the guys I'm about to mention but just for the sake of comparison regarding this one issue I wanna tackle: The best possible superpower is probably going to be China in about 20 years when it's expected for them to overtake you in the global field mostly because they don't seem to be hypocrites and don't give a fuck trying to "help" others, dicking around foreign policies
World wars would still happen every 30 years or so.
>>61891402
>pretending that america hasn't been the biggest publisher/founder/instigator of radical science projects for the last 100 years
Yes, the western world has definitely helped, but the shoulders are all american (Re:giants).
It really doesn't matter that they 'moved' to america, as they moved for funding and to commiserate with the other greatest minds - look to chess and math in the 1900s to see why other countries would not have been able to support such a large diverse scientific community (RE:money)
>>61897158
by ascending strength, here are your best arguments,
>here are scientists who were forced to identify as catholic
>some very smart people identified with the predominate ideology
>the middle ages did not persecute new opinions contrary to the ideas of the church because these people made it to the history books
>>61898416
Honestly I agree with this Brazilian. I can't think of a good US foreign policy decision in the past 100 years
>>61896868
> economic warfare (tariffs, undercutting, int'n buyouts, price-holds/ product available for free for 'x' time)
> buy the government
> force a coup
Yeeeeeeeeee, america has held the world back and amassed a ton of wealth in the process, but centralising wealth allowed for ludicrous spending in R&D, centralised expertise ( big projects ), and led to brain-drain/brain-gain for america... so it's likely the R&D pace would have been comparable... the cost of research is always high (re: cutting edge)
>>61898562
US foreign policy very much resembles the other hegemonies (read about the french-UK black ops against america in the Suez canal crisis).
The dutch recently showed us that countries are willing to buy and sell corporate information.
The world has always been the same, and america has simply been richest longest and wants to maintain it.
>>61898630
At least the UK had the sense to advocate what would make British people stronger and what would be best for Britain. The USA seems to do that for Israel instead.
>>61897992
>the Catholic church has done more for Humanity than America ever could.
Yes, like removing countless irish from this earth and burying them in shit where they belong
Yet another big empire that gets the juicy parts of the cake.
It didn't HAVE to be you, you just happened to be the ones with power after the industrial revolution, and it couldn't have been Europe because they dun goofed with all those wars.
>>61898815
why wasn't it colombia
>>61898874
We dun goofed too with internal wars ever since our independence and division after division of our territory so that's that.
>>61897992
>Near middle east tier oppression, and imperialism, also mass greed of all the wealth all for personally gain.
>Better then the country that has been one of the main nations defeating some of the most vile evil monsters of these centuries, but then also stopping the other nations from tearing apart the crippled nation. Have you never heard of Woodrow Wilson's Fourteen Points, or Paris Peace Treaties.
We've pioneered some of the biggest steps in both science and medicine.
We were the first to reach not only the sky, but beyond that all the way moon and even mars, We cut travel between east and west through the Panama Cana in half, Created the Trans-Oceanic Cable Communication, Founded nuclear power as a usable energy, We even cured polio.
The Catholic church only caused mass murder of Muslims and all of south america that still effects us today. the Spanish inquisition wasn't exactly a good thing.
>>61898562
Just because you don't know shit about history, doesn't make your claim correct.
>>61898910
>tfw no gran colombia superpower
>>61891352
World Peace.
>>61891470
You're operating under the assumption that no country would have ever stumbled across any of those inventions.
>>61891547
>>61898951
>the Spanish inquisition wasn't exactly a good thing
This is how I can detect you're not worth wasting any time.
>>61898990
I don't feel sad about it anymore. But i still miss Panama (fucking gringos de mierda), and we should take back some jungle from the hues.
Perhaps if we pull our shit together we can join an union with Ecuador and Panama. Venezuela can choke on dick and die.
>>61891470
Also you're listing people who aren't American? Alexander graham bell was Scottish and lived here in Canada.
>>61891547
>>61898996
They may have, but clearly without the US it could have been delayed for decades, why do you think Nikolai telsa, or Eadweard Muybrige moved to the US before claiming their inventions when they could have done such with Serbia or the UK respectively?
>>61899057
He lived in canada during the summer, but worked in and for the US..
This image is purely false, I mean you'd have to be retarded to believe that Leonard Kleinrock was a British man who worked in MIT of the UK.
Seriously you know how many people claim inventions during before and after other people? It doesn't matter what you scribble on a piece of paper, it matters what you can create, and Alexander G bell created a working telephone for patent and business of the US, not canada, scotland, UK, or any other nation
>>61899098
Nice meme friendo
>if I show him pictures of a book that has nothing to do with anywhere outside of europe and is mostly referencing points before the United states even existed then he'll have to know he is wrong.
>>61899057
Ever single person on that list either worked in, became a citizen of, or was born in the united states.
>Thomas Edison and Samuel Colt aren't americans
>Americans trying to take credit for European ingenuity and invention
Embarrassing.
>>61899271
A Scot living in Canada who occasionally takes a trip down to Boston to work does not make it American no matter how much you want it too be.
>>61899318
That image was published in a book by the university of Pennsylvania. America is largely irrelevant in the achievement community by comparison.
>>61899425
>No proof
>He still thinks that makes them American
Fat idiot burger. Also nowhere in this image does it say Thomas Edison and Samuel colt aren't American.
>>61899581
But in almost every source he is considered an american inventor, not Canadian or Scottish.
Who cares where he was born, or if he had a summer house in Canada? I spend a summer at my aunts in San Francisco before becoming a senior in high school doesn't mean I graduated from San Francisco.
>>61899581
My proof is researching information on those inventions before actually posting, each of those inventions were created by improved, and or perfected by people of united states citizenship.
>>61891352
I don't have anything against America or Americans, but if you want my honest opinion:
I think the western world would be much better off without American influence as it is today, at least culturally anyway. America has massive cultural influence on the rest of the world, however it also seems to be some of the most degrading to society. Your country's music for example is popular all over Europe, however a lot of it is trashy pop about going to the club and popping dat pussay, or nigger music about fucking hoes and glorifying violence. Video related is a perfect example of this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JJn03xJ29Vs
The lyrics, glorifying materialistic desire, bragging about monetary gain and ignoring criticism by 'not caring bout dem haters' are popular themes within a lot of American music. The original version having over 700 million views on Youtube, it's fair to say this song has reached a large number of people and can be considered fairly representative of this kind of music.
>>61899581
You claimed that I was listing people who were not american, but all of those people had american citizenship..
Also
>>61899484
>>61899581
>>61899971
>A LEAF
I'm sure American sources credit him as an American inventor even though he was born in Scotland and Lived in Canada lmao. Sounds a little desperate.
>My proof is researching information on those inventions before actually posting, each of those inventions were created by improved, and or perfected by people of united states citizenship.
So you're not going to back up those claims?
>>61900090
Meant for
>>61899971
>>61900041
More than a Few had Canadian citizenship too. Are we KANGS too?
>>61898996
Then are you operating on the assumption that other countries would have?
American free market economics really supported innovation for a time, and during that time the world began to be shaped by these inventions. I know of no other state that had a similar thing happen to such a degree.
>>61900037
I guess you are correct, but most of that is only modern pop culture of the last decade and a half not actual culture.
>>61900090
I don't want to list proof every single person. it wouldn't take long for (you) to look up info on the names I posted.
>>61900157
More than a few had UK citizen ships not exactly Canadian.
Aww, poor butthurt euros. Maybe you'd be better off under the rule of soviet russia?
>>61891547
>Le church meem
>>61900301
Ah so alleviating yourself of responsibility with the old "You can look it up yourself". We both know why you can't be bothered, because most have zero interaction with America.
>>61891352
that's a fuckton of history that would be changed.
it might have ended in nuclear holocaust, might have ended in eternal peace and space colonies. point is nobody knows.
>>61900389
All of them lived and created their inventions in the US, most also studied in the US.
World without America? Euros still control Africa, most of Asia, and the Western Hemisphere as colonies.
>>61899057
>>61899098
Internet: I didn't know that Massachusetts was in the UK. ARPANet and the NPL Network came from the same US/UK design team, and the modern Internet if anything owes more to ARPANet than the NPL Network.
Clement Adler never flew 300 meters before the Wright brothers, none of his proto-aircraft flew as long or as far as the Wright Flyer. Historical note: many French sources called bullshit on the Wright brothers after news came out about their achievement.
Space Travel: The first liquid-fueled rocket was invented by American Robert Goddard. Without that invention space travel as we know it would have been impossible.
Computers: the ABC and ENIAC, US inventions, were the first digital computers.
Telephone: Alexander Graham Bell invented the first practical telephone. Much like with the computer this was the standard for the designs that followed it.
Automobile: Automobile was definitely not a US invention (modern automobiles were invented by the German Karl Benz), but Henry Ford invented the first car that was more than just a plaything for the wealthy. Ford's production methods also set a new standard for the industry.
Movies: Thomas Edison did the electromechanical design for the kinetograph, created in 1891.
The others I've never heard credible Americans claim they were inventions. 1/10 attempt at trolling.
this is the most butthurt europoor thing ever
>SOME GUY WROTE ABOUT AN INVENTION LIKE THIS BEFORE SO AMERICA DIDNT MAKE IT CHECK MATE!
Anyone who seriously claims the Wright Bros didnt invent the airplane is retarded. No one gives a shit about some gay glider.
>>61899098
>the GOAT polygon is literally HRE + Denmark and England
DEUS fucking VULT
>>61900597
Actually that is pretty accurate, america was one of the only places with enough power and morality for all to stop Europe from cutting china and using it for their own colonizing and thieving ways.
With america Europe continued to fairly trade with the Asian continent instead of plunder and pillage it. America is very similar to rome in that aspect, and many others.
>>61901166
huh?
I'm glad we get to spend our money on education and health care cos the murricans spend all theirs on defence
Thanks for keeping us safe murrica
without US there is no BLM riot every month
>>61901880
Y-you're welcome
>tfw a contractor with no insurance to get treatment to help me with my anxiety and depression
>>61891352
Russian still win WW2
>>61901932
they also suffered the worst in terms of damages..
>>61891470
>No skyscrapers ( William Le Baron Jenney )
wish this world existed
Without the USA decolonisation would never have happened.
>>61891352
Lol dude, this thread is just presentation on how arrogant and dumb americans are, even the americans on /int/, your dad must be like superdumb
What would the world without the Netherlands look like?
>no capitalism and stock markets so everyone would be poor
>bacteria would never have been discovered so everyone would still die at 40
>no modern republics, like France, and freedom of speech, as we were the first modern country to question the divine right of kings and were a safe haven for critical thinkers
>no USA as we supplied the arms for the USA for their independence war
>The British wouldn't have had their glorious revolution and their golden age
>Japan would never had western teachings so they would be as shit as china
>>61903316
that would be shit, if the US didn't have an impact on population, although it probably did we would have nowhere for new buildings but out deeper into forests, luckily automobiles might not exist because Henry ford would have never been able to invent a cheap and easy to produce car for the common man.
>>61903358
this would also be shit
>>61903386
That is just my opinion man, as an american I think the US was very involved in the rest of the world, just as you might think Slovakia is a very important country.
>>61903488
Netherlands was really important and is often overlooked imo
>>61903514
Before we existed the Salian Franks came from here who founded France and the Holy Roman Empire.
>>61903504
cities are a cancer
the bigger the most cancerous
>>61903488
wow, really? I never knew the Netherlands was so involved in our world today, I would have guess France was the one to do most of those things.
>>61903534
London, paris, rome, and florance still existed without skyscrapers.
>>61903561
yes and they are far less cancerous than new york, LA or chicago
>>61891352
So, without the US, we would have seen most of the same technological advancements come about. Science is discovered, not invented. So, maybe some deviation would have happened based on where and when things got invented.
The US was founded on enlightenment-era ideals of democracy, which were rooted in France. We would have probably seen a French Revolution at some point, although it would probably have come a bit later, since the French crown wouldn't have put itself into debt funding the revolution. The American colonies weren't incredibly important to the UK beyond a strategic "fuck you" to the French in Canada, and the Spaniards in Florida/the rest.
So, we still get the French Revolution and therefore the Napoleonic Wars. This means we still probably see German unification and Italian unification. Germany still would feel the need to prove itself on the world stage, so we'd probably see WWI happen again. American troops weren't really vital to the war ending, they were more like icing on the cake once the shitfest went down. Sort of like your bros inviting you to a party as it's winding down because there's still some girls to pick up there.
So, WWI happens and we'd still see a shitty treaty. We may or may not have seen the League of Nations, but they were largely irrelevant. Russia still goes Communist in all likelyhood.
The interesting part of the world to look at now is the Pacific. Japan did not open up until the US forced it to. So, there are two paths that part of the world could have taken: either Japan opened up her ports and started rapid westernization, or they stayed isolationist and fell to foreign influence. For sake of being interesting, let's assume they westernized. They would have still taken Korea and gotten a few islands from Germany during WWI. They wouldn't have been opposed in their expansion across the Pacific, because the US was their main opposition. This means they got access to the resources they needed un-opposed.
>>61903488
I feel like capitalism in at least a basic form would have shown up sooner or later without you.
I can't disagree with this theoretically, but that was in the 1600s, why were people still dying until WW1 of such things?
>no modern republics...
Really? peasants were stupid huh, seriously no one though "maybe this guy has a bit too much power, just to be killing other people at the snap of a finger"
>no usa
I thought that was the french who mostly supplied training and weaponry
>Glorious revolution, and golden age
wait why?
>japan
wait why?
>>61903678
At this point, Russia would still own Alaska, since they only gave it to the US as a "fuck you" to the UK, who had been eyeballing that territory since their last war. They had hoped to draw the US and UK into conflict, but since that couldn't have happened, they still had that land. That land was part of Japan's plan to be an empire controlling the Pacific.
So, WWII probably goes slightly differently. Same shit happens, Germany is pissed at the shitty, one-sided treaty the allies put in, so Hitler and the Nazis probably rise. They have their war, push the brits back the UK, and get into their war with Russia.
Now, at this point, Japan has been eyeballing Alaska. So, naturally, they get into a more open conflict with Russia than they did at the initial stages of the war. This weakens Russia severely, as it was the armies garrisoned in Siberia who were called in to turn the tide at Stalingrad. Now Russia is fighting a two-front war, but Germany and Japan are only fighting on one front (since the UK can't do shit at this point).
So, two possibilities: Allies win or Axis wins.
If Russia manages to keep its shit together, Communism wins and becomes the rule everywhere except the UK maybe. Europe becomes overrun by the Red hordes, as does Japan and all of Asia.
If the Axis wins, Germany has its own deal in Europe and most of Asia, Japan has their empire in southeast Asia, and Italy has reformed the Roman empire, minus the Germanic and French territories.
Most of the same technologies would still exist, like antibiotics, rocketry, computers, etc. Democracy would probably be seen as a failed experiment in government, like fascism and communism are seen today. We probably would have gone to the moon, maybe many of the same postwar events would have happened due to tensions between the Axis possibly causing a cold war.
>>61900037
You do realize that without America pushing Germany from the west in WWII, that the Soviets would have just "liberated" the rest of Europe, instead of stopping in Germany right?
European culture would have been unrecognizable. There would have been no other superpower to oppose the Soviets and maintain a balance of power.
>How could you even survive without us, a European colony whose history is punctuated by unwanted disruptions to human progress and peace
>>61903678
But without the US and if WWII happened how would Russia survive through the end of WWII, and during this WWII what would happen to japan, and australia?
In fact if WWII does happen who would come out on top? would it be Russia, and Russia not only gains the ability to create atomic bombs but also starts a cold war with the rest of Europe and actually ends up a dominate nation turning the whole western world into a single communist union, maybe Nazi Germany would not have lost, or the UK would take over the US's spot of being one of the only super powers left in the world, even though the US was way larger, stronger, and economically sounder then the UK by the end of WW2.
>>61903988
A Stalinist bleek communist world... Holy hell that is some spooky ass Orwellian shit right there.
>>61904004
You do know the US has historically be one of the few places advocating for peace, and equality between not only European nations, but also the whole world.
The whole Asian content might just look like a giant India or even worse if it the US didn't exist to stop European dick waving.
>>61903804
>>Glorious revolution, and golden age
>wait why?
He's talking about William III of England aka the Prince of Orange who was from the Netherlands. Extremely relevant too the UK but far from being the cause of their golden age.
>>61903804
>I feel like capitalism in at least a basic form would have shown up sooner or later without you.
Well, foreign countries have always copied our systems.
Even if you look at the discovery of liberal policies by foreign powers. A lot early philosophers who wrote about societies, capitalism and republican ideas used to live in the Netherlands or deal with us before writing about it. Like John Locke and Descartes. And of course John Adams who was ambassador here when he worked on the works for your constitution. Our Act of Abjuration resembles the American deceleration of independence. Your government model resembles our old one your houses and states who are in charge of everything that hasn't been decided on a federal level.
>Really? peasants were stupid huh, seriously no one though "maybe this guy has a bit too much power, just to be killing other people at the snap of a finger"
Because going against Kings who ruled by the divine grace of God goes against Jesus it's teachings. You underestimate the power of religion.
>I thought that was the french who mostly supplied training and weaponry
No, we had fought a global war against the British to be able to supply you with weapons.
>Britain protested bitterly against the continuous trade between the United Colonies and St. Eustatius. In 1778, Lord Stormont claimed in Parliament that, "if Sint Eustatius had sunk into the sea three years before, the United Kingdom would already have dealt with George Washington". Nearly half of all American Revolutionary military supplies were obtained through St. Eustatius. Nearly all American communications to Europe first passed through the island. The trade between St. Eustatius and the United States was the main reason for the Fourth Anglo-Dutch War,1780-1784.
>wait why?
Because we invaded England with an army twice the size of the Spanish armada, took London and overthrew the Catholic king. Put a Dutch King in charge who moved to London with industry and navy.
>>61903804
>wait why?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rangaku
>>61903845
but that sounds terrible, on one side we say goodbye to most of what we consider our constitution rights like freedom of speech and religion, on the other side we say goodbye to our human rights and become an animal farm to work away and die for "the motherland" and apparently on both sides we still risk nuclear annihilation. Maybe just maybe everyone dies in some kind of total war, and the "meek" native Americans inherit the world.. not really likely at all, but it would be a neat ending to a shitty world.
>>61898416
Are you retarded or trolling
China? Enjoy censorship of everything they dont like and chinese armies rolling through cities.
You already see what theyre doing in tthe south china sea
>>61904018
Russia would have won WWII with or without the US. They broke the Wehrmacht's back at Stalingrad, and spent the next three years pushing to Berlin without fail. They had the manpower and industry to overwhelm the Germans, and eventually the Italians (but that's not saying much, since they couldn't even defeat Greece without Germany bailing them out).
There wouldn't be a "rest of Europe" if the US wasn't there to intervene; France, the Netherlands, Austria, Italy, etc. would have all been liberated by the Soviets. The only reason the Soviets stopped in Germany was there was nothing left to conquer.
There would have been puppet governments in the rest of Europe, and communist revolutions all over the world with little to no opposition.
>maybe Nazi Germany would not have lost
Germany lost the war the second they invaded Russia. They just did not have the resources to take and hold that much land without nuclear weapons, which neither Germany nor Russia were developing by the end of the war.
>the UK would take over the US's spot of being one of the only super powers left in the world
They couldn't even hold back the Germans with French help, and almost lost their entire army at Dunkirk. They might have maintained sovereignty if Stalin was feeling kind, but there is no chance they could have rose to the superpower status of the US.
>>61904342
It's not really a "shitty" world, just a different world. Democracy and freedom of speech are very new concepts, and we have good opinions of them only because we grew up in an environment where they're valued. Compared to our standard of living, it would be shitty, but compared to what had been the standard of living for most of human history, the Communist superstate that would have been formed in the absence of US intervention would have been pretty par for the course.
Most of America's inventions were inevitable at the pace progress was going in Europe, without America there would be alot less resources around, without America we wouldn't have movies around at the same scale as we do right now and without America Germans would've won WW1
Britain created the modern world with the industrial revolution - America refined it in the 20th century.
Prior to the 20th century the US was more or less irrelevant in world affairs. I really think America overestimate their own significance. Before you took the Phillipines you had no overseas colonies and were very vocal about non-interventionism.
>>61891352
better
The USA wouldn't have had the Roosevelts to beat up evil Nazi's and the Bushes to beat up terrorists.
>>61904557
American financial support and arms were far more important than their late military intervention though. The allies couldn't produce enough weaponry without the US
>>61904601
>Before you took the Phillipines you had no overseas colonies
Let me tell you the story of a country named Liberia...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberia#Early_settlement
>>61904601
America's rise to power could've rivaled any of the big European Empires at their peak, the population, industry and resources that the Empires had all over the world are concnetrated in one landmass
>>61898630
>read about the french-UK black ops against america in the Suez canal crisis
you mean the one where america betrayed Nato and her allies?
>18th century colony
>Impact
hahahahahahaHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
You are so delusional
Without the Netherlands you wouldn't have Santa Claus.
>>61904716
There wouldn't have been much of an impact on the world in the 17th, 18th, or 19th centuries, but there would certainly have been an influence in the 20th century during WWII. Without the US to assist in pushing Germany from the West, the Soviets would have just overran the rest of Europe and set up puppet states.
>>61904716
>Second largest nation in mass, and largest in terms of economic power, also the home of many discoverers, and creators of many things we claim as important.
Would the world really miss Sweden though?
>>61904749
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinterklaas#Sinterklaas_as_a_source_for_Santa_Claus
>>61904749
NO :(
>>61904806
>and creators of many things we claim as important
school shootings, cardboard houses and deep-fried cola?
>In the English and later British colonies of North America, and later in the United States, British and Dutch versions of the gift-giver merged further. For example, in Washington Irving's History of New York (1809), Sinterklaas was Americanized into "Santa Claus" (a name first used in the American press in 1773)[25] but lost his bishop's apparel, and was at first pictured as a thick-bellied Dutch sailor with a pipe in a green winter coat
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Santa_Claus
Dutch sailor with a pipe ho ho ho. :^)
>>61904637
Not an official colony though lad. There were Confederate Southerners that founded another slave settlement in Brazil after the emancipation proclamation, but the US government certainly didn't endorse it.
>>61904786
Well its another kettle of fish without the US involved in the war at all. I don't know if the Nazis could have been entirely defeated by just Britain and the USSR, especially without the US playing its huge role on the Pacific front defeating their Japanese allies.
As the Italian suggested, Germany's chances in WW1 would have been much higher if the US wasn't available to send resources and arms to the allies.
>>61904786
Humanity as a whole is still the same, but with a few more nazis running around. Who gives a fuck. Everything past industrialization has been inevitable.
>>61904806
Probably, Europe would still be a zealous shithole like the middle east without the treaty of westphalia.
>>61904749
No man as generous as Santa could possibly be Dutch
>>61904749
So santa claus is some kind of flying dutch man?
>>61904864
Yeah, also the internet and 4chan.. Have fun living in your expensive 300 year old stone and brick house anon.
>>61904889
>Who gives a fuck. Everything past industrialization has been inevitable.
[citation needed]
You know the horse of Sinterklaas is called Amerigo.
Named after Amerigo Vespucci, which America derives it's name from.
America literally has the same name as the horse of Santa Claus. ayyy lmao
>>61904962
>internet
berners-lee
>4chan
american version of a japanese invention
>>61899581
I'd read about Canadians complaining about the company Bell before online. I had always assumed just assumed Alexander Graham Bell had stayed in the UK. It makes so much more sense now.
>>61904889
The Soviets were communist, not Nazis. Look at how much they fucked up Eastern Europe.
>>61905029
The Internet is American, but the publicly accessible information space synonymous with the "internet" (world wide web) is British.
>>61904876
The Soviets were destinted to defeat Germany, regardless of American involvement, which only helped prolong the UK's survival and prevent the Soviets from expanding beyond Europe.
There probably wouldn't have been a Pacific War without the US; Japan would have just been able to expand unopposed and would be a real superpower now. If anything, they would be the ones preventing the Soviets from totally overtaking the world.
>>61905048
You're perspective is hilariously small. Like humanity would cease to function if one war was lost.
We'd just have more wars, hell we might have been more technologically advanced by now as a result.
>>61905084
Humanity wouldn't cease to function, but Europe would certainly be vastly different than we know today, culturally *and* politically, if the Soviets had control over it.
>>61905110
And in 200 years?
I know you're basically brainwashed but America is but a passing breeze in the pages of humanity. Try Rome or ancient Greece, whose way of life has and will remain with us until our last days. Agriculture, civilization, industrialization, that's basically it.
You have ten seconds to point out the historical figure who America got it's name from..
10.. 9.. 8.. 7..
>>61905029
But who would show japan the internet in the first place?
Also what the hell is the world wide web? I seriously don't understand how HTTP or WWW helped create the internet beyond what ARPANET already created.
Did he invent the programming language of the internet, or just brand the name of the internet? (which btw no one says world wide web or even web anymore really)
>>61905174
amerigo vespucci some drunk guido that explored shit
>Hey /intl/ what would the world be like without the USA, historically, technologically, and socially?
There's huge Mexico in its place.
About as rich and influential as USA, because you can screw that geography.
>>61905152
but america is more powerful and has achieved a lot more then Rome has in an equal amount of time, I'm sure if we last as long as Rome has, we will have trumped them, sure we may not any savage neighboring nations to pacify and modernize, but we have the fucking moon and mars, and that is a little bit harder then tribalistic nords and Englishmen, and franks.
>>61905409
>can't even beat viets
>thinks he's hot shit
>>61905409
I'm pretty sure civilizing the western world is a bigger than deal a technological revolution.
>>61905469
>>can't even beat viets
https://markcurtis.wordpress.com/2007/02/01/britains-secret-support-for-us-aggression-the-vietnam-war/
Neither could you
>>61905537
*bigger deal than a technological revolution
>>61905556
we never went to war with them paco.
>>61891470
The television was invented in 1926 by Scottish inventor John Logie Baird you spastic
Alexander Graham Bell was also Scottish and didn't even live in the USA
>>61905537
I mean Romans created aqueducts and sewer systems, roads, concrete, books, accounting, the calendar, the latin alfabet, our laws, soap and what not.
Like Americans pulled the most weight with the creation of the internet, Romans also revolutionized communications. Without the Romans most Germanics, especially the Dutch, would be illiterate.
>>61905574
Well iirc the Congress never voted a declaration of war so technically the US never went to war in Vietnam.
>>61905537
>dealing with humans with a bad mind set and no interest in anything that doesn't directly involve them profiting, or appeasing any of their gods.
>Turning a whole other planet from a red sandy pile of inanimate rocks, into a livable breathable world full of water and green plant life.
>>61905612
He lived in boston, and worked at Boston university
>>61905612
Have you seen what John Logie actually built? It's just a big metal and glass box that does nothing! Farnsworth created a electronic device able to show images, and I mean real images, not just shapes of light.
Whites would still rule the world
>>61905759
Congress also desided to pull out of the war we "weren't fighting" so we never lost, just sort of packed up and left while we were ahead, and we were really ahead.
>>61905842
>he thinks he'll colonize Mars before the Netherlands does
Mars One is still going.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mars_One
>>61905867
So mass racism would still exist? that is good how?
>>61905885
Nasa get on your shit, actually I've heard of a ton of private companies doing the same thing both here in the US and everywhere else, never heard from them again.
>>61905874
>we completely failed in our objective
>that's still a win right?
>>61905941
Well, they say the proof of concept mission will be in 2020. We'll see what happens.
http://www.mars-one.com/mission/roadmap
>>61905842
>He lived in boston, and worked at Boston university
Temporarily. He lived in Canada, went to work in boston for short while while coming back to his homestead here, then after he moved back to Canada and eventually died here. He was Scottish regardless, Canadians and Americans don't get to claim him.
>>61905409
This has too be b8
>>61905612
also Graham Bell was a hack and a fraud, Meucci invented the telephone
>>61905612
Wrong
"Bell was a British subject throughout his early life in Scotland and later in Canada until 1882, when he became a naturalized citizen of the United States"
>>61906267
Your emitting the fact he still held Canadian citizenship and died in Nova Scotia
>>61906071
Mars One will never get the funding as Dutch media tycoons pulled out of the funding negotiations.
>>61906102
>Invented a sewer in 300 years
vs
>Went to moon
>Created the atom bomb
>Harnessed nuclear fusion for power
>Harnessed electricity
>Lightbulb
>Flight
>found black holes and all sorts of things with the Hubble Space Telescope
>Landed on mars and comets
>>61906205
He was a Italian american living in new york, and created his device in new york, and died in new york, also I don't think Meucci's device was two way like bells.
>>61906303
He never invented the telephone for or inside of Nova Scotia though, he wasn't working with any Canadian business men while trying to market and patent his telephone.
>>61906303
I was refuting the notion that Bell didn't live in the USA. Which is clearly wrong.
>Born in Scotland
>Learned at the University of Edinburgh and the University of College London
>Spent most of his time in Canada
>Ranked the 57th greatest Briton of all time
>Yet still Americans call him an American inventor
>>61906344
Your right, his finest moments were when he was working abroad in America. This means nothing. His first laboratory and workshop was here in Canada. Also irrelevant to the fact he was a Scottish inventor.
>>61906383
And Hitler was the leader of Austria not Germany right?
>>61906475
>Equating the two
Subtle difference. One was an official chancellor of Germany, the other was a Scottish man who invented great things in America then got the fuck out of there and lived in Canada. Can we call him a Canadian inventor now?
>>61891547
creationism museum tier
>>61906469
I mean what does it say on every website or history book about him?
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=was+alexander+graham+bell+an+american
>>61906593
>Scottish-born American inventor
What a cop out. Nice try, Americans. Nice try. Nice way to steal glory from others and slap an American brand on them.
When you take their capabilities into account, it makes the USA by far the most benevolent empire to date. They may have fucked up many times but in the long run in the big picture they did more good than evil.
Then again I'm from Kosovo and might be biased.
>>61895184
The siviet union would have take usa place
>>61906832
Nice flag
>>61906344
he wasn't italo-american, he was already old wen he went to the US.
also
« H. Res. 269
In the House of Representatives, U.S.,
June 11, 2002.
[...]Whereas, having exhausted most of his life's savings in pursuing his work, Meucci was unable to commercialize his invention, though he demonstrated his invention in 1860 and had a description of it published in New York's Italian language newspaper; Whereas Meucci never learned English well enough to navigate the complex American business community;
Whereas Meucci was unable to raise sufficient funds to pay his way throug hellothe patent application process, and thus had to settle for a caveat, a one year renewable notice of an impending patent, which was first filed on December 28, 1871;
Whereas Meucci later learned that the Western Union affiliate laboratory reportedly lost his working models, and Meucci, who at this point was living on public assistance, was unable to renew the caveat after 1874;
Whereas in March 1876, Alexander Graham Bell, who conducted experiments in the same laboratory where Meucci's materials had been stored, was granted a patent and was thereafter credited with inventing the telephone;
Whereas on January 13, 1887, the Government of the United States moved to annul the patent issued to Bell on the grounds of fraud and misrepresentation, a case that the Supreme Court found viable and remanded for trial;
Whereas Meucci died in October 1889, the Bell patent expired in January 1893, and the case was discontinued as moot without ever reaching the underlying issue of the true inventor of the telephone entitled to the patent; and
Whereas if Meucci had been able to pay the $275 fee to maintain the caveat after 1874, no patent could have been issued to Bell
Now, therefore, be it
Resolved, That it is the sense of the House of Representatives that the life and achievements of Antonio Meucci should be recognized, and his work in the invention of the telephone should be acknowledged. »
>>61891470
lmao, and whos to say nothing of these would have been invented without USA?
fuck off burgers :DD
