why do brits seem to have such a hard-on for the romans/roman empire?
Because they were never fully romanized and are aware of what they missed.
If you don't have a hard on for the roman empire you're not white
>>52412355
If you don't accept Ottoman Empire as the Third Roman Empire you're not white
>>52411781
It's the only foreign empire we were ever part of
Only ones who managed to conquer God's island.
>>52412666
Inshallah, they won't be the last :^)
>>52412666
>>52412625
>
>>52412666
>>52412625
>>52411781
Also, my personal opinion is that the Roman Empire gave Brits a sense that they were part of something bigger, and this changed the British outlook forever. Since the last Roman legions left, Britain has been an outward-looking place when before it was quite insular.
Initially the awareness of the outside was for defensive needs (norse and norman invasions), then it was about affecting the continent in the medieval period (esp. 100 years war), then it was about the New World (first British Empire), then it was about the rest of the world (second British Empire) and today the UK's global outlook continues to be stronger than ever.
>>52412857
That wasn't an empire it was a kingdom
>>52412355
People in the baltics don't and they're the whitest in europe.
>>52412860
Poland was an ally 2bh
>>52411781
Simple. It's the closest brits have ever been to civilized
coz it's gr8 m8
>>52413048
That's why you're yellow my friend
>>52411781
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TQwGTe_MueM
muh dik
>>52412571
>implying Finland isn't the true heir of the Roman Empire
britains was part of the roman empire? for how long?
>>52413151
Singapore knows what's up
How can anyone not have a hard on for the Roman empire?
I just think it's a shame the Italians take credit for it 2bh
>>52411781
it was shit and overrated. based germans did nothing wrong.
>>52413167
How the hell did you not know that? Never heard of Hadrians Wall either? Also to answer your question ad 43 to 409 or 410
>>52413222
>based germans did nothing wrong.
>germans
>>52413216
feels good man
I get a hard on at the idea Romans went on to influence the entire world long after the collapse of the empire. Four of it's former regions went on to collectively conquer >95% of the world, while still heavily influenced by their Roman history themselves. Muh dik
Who with me?
>>52413167
>dumbtugal
>>52413222
Germans didn't do anything wrong until 2015.
>>52413216
i find this really annoying too
i hate country roleplaying in discussion but italians take it to a new level by roleplaying as a different race of people that once occupied the same land that they now live on
>>52413307
>95%
>>52413225
no, never heard of that wall too, I thought england was germanic, barbaric like germany
>>52413322
at least they're not austrians
>>52413341
England then was celtic. The anglo-saxons came in the 5th century.
>>52413307
But Britain became very different to the Roman Empire in most aspects
Common Law instead of Civil Law
Liberal not Authoritarian
Parliamentary democracy
Driven by commerce and trade, not a lust for territorial conquest
Because alot of parallels later on were drawn between it and the British empire which like Russia saw themselves as heirs to Rome's legacy.
>>52413378
and the french after those?
>>52413330
W/e. Other than Russia and Eastern Europe it's pretty much true. Granted that's not 95% but it's still really high considering most of Russia is uninhabitable.
Also before anyone mentions China let's not pretend they weren't the bitches of the colonial powers.
>>52413432
Are you kidding me right now? The Norman invasion happened in 1066
>>52413322
>i hate country roleplaying in discussion
Americans are by far the most annoying in that aspect tbqh.
I've seen Americans call the UK "the old man" and shit like that so many fucking times.
>>52413478
The "dad" thing makes me cringe so much
>>52413458
Northern/Eastern Europe? Russia (like you mentioned) and some parts of Asia? The parts of africa and americas that were under German/Swedish/etc. control?
>>52413464
>>52413464
after anglos then, I was right :)
why are english called anglo-saxons sometimes? and never roman or celtic?
>>52413464
It's still 'after', though
>>52413341
They were still mostly Germanic during the occupation, but there was a significant amount of Latinisation, especially in the east.
>>52413503
sorry about that, pops
>>52413322
>different race of people
nice meme
and you know what I find amusing as shit?
that everyone gets to roleplay except us, because people are so butthurt and jelly that they can't contain themselves
>we wuz global empire
>das rite!
>we wuz conquistadores
>das rite!
>we wuz mehmet II
>das rite!
>we wuz napoleon
>das rite!
>we wuz caesar
>oy vey!!
>>52413524
Because they identify with the anglo-saxons who conquered England (and gave it its name, angles --> england)? And the Romans didn't really leave much of a genetic imprint on Britain, and I guess they're not called celts to differentiate them from the Welsh, Cornish, Irish etc.
>>52413517
Yeah sorry I meant to say Europe not eastern Europe.
Other than some exeptions like Abyssinia, Siam etc virtually all was controlled by those four between them. Most German colonies were handed over as well. The only major exeptions were China and Japan, but it's clear if they wanted China they could have taken it by the anglo-franco wars they got crushed in. The only reason Japan was able to modernize was from help by the British and USA.
>>52411781
desu I sometimes wonder what would happen if North Africa remained latinised...
Anatolia and Greece too
>>52413432
Yes
here, a quick sum up of the history of Britain for you
>???/-50
empty wasteland
>-50/~400
occupied by italians
>~400/~1000
occupied by germans
>~1000/~1900
occupied by the french
>~1900/present day
occupied by americans
>>52413524
Because Celtic culture got pushed out to the fringes of the UK and Anglo/Norman culture became the norm in England plus there's the old meme that the whole of England or at least the south east was replaced genetically by Anglo Saxons which is probably true.
>>52413592
The people on the bottom row don't look anything like the people on the top row though. And the text in that picture doesn't really say anything about you being Romans (not saying that I give a shit either way, just that the pic is shit proofs)
>>52413648
Oh and obviously some Indonesia which was taken by the dutch. Forgot about them 2bh.
Belgium congo as well. I think that's all.
>>52413652
>Anatolia and Greece too
>>52413503
Back to the nursing home dad
>>52413658
>occupied by americans
kek
what is the region that suffered bigger latinization outside Italy?
>>52413700
He says quite clearly that Italians didn't just appear out of nowhere and that the population is basically the same as Roman times, which is what people get mad as fuck here for.
Pics aren't there for pairwise comparison.
>>52413698
Actually I seem to recall that the anglo-saxon genetic influence wasn't nearly as high as people liked to think according to some research.
>>52413706
Persia?
>>52411781
Because it's their dream to control all of Europe.
>>52413773
Gaul and Iberia
>>52413802
We are the ONLY European country which doesn't have this dream
when did the first humans arrived in the biritsh isles?
>>52413773
Iberian peninsula and France, but France lost (replaced) some of it due to the Franks.
>>52413825
Okay?
>>52413773
Outside Italy? Certainly, Gallia and Hispania.
Africa (the province, not the continent) did develop a Romance language of their own that was (allegedly) spoken until the 12th century, so you could argue it was pretty Romanised. AFAIK Carthage, Sitifis and Hippo were all quite fully Latinised.
>>52413833
They probably weren't isles, they were connected to the mainland through Doggerland.
I might not be correct, though.
WE WUZ CELTS N SHIT
>>52413833
In 50bc when the Roman landed
>>52413885
Yes fine thanks, and you?
>>52413790
Yeah that's why I said its a bit memey, there was influence but seeing as there's no mass graves required for replacement they probably just integrated like the Normans in France.
>>52413897
>>52413897
bullshit
>>52413790
As far as I remember, it's up to 30%, which is not that low after all.
>>52413897
He said "humans", not "Romans".
Remember Boudica of the Iceni? She couldn't have been Roman.
>Literally the only country in Europe not to be ruled by some guy claiming to be an Augustus, Caesar, Kaiser, Tsar etc
>>52413791
Iran has been occupied by Anglo forces, and multiple governments toppled by the British. They were more or less conquered since the British got what they wanted (rights to all Iranian oil) until the revolution.
>>52414036
You mean before 1979/1959?
I don't know much about that time period, so I'll have to trust you.
Wikipedia does say that Iran/Persia has been the oldest (de jure, I guess) independent country, though.
>>52413834
But the Franks were West Low Germanic, not Celtic like the Gauls (We wuz conquerors n sheet). As far as I know, the actual Frankish influence on France was minimal, they still speak Romance today instead of a Franconian language (Dutch or West Central German)
why is the irish language dead? what is gaelic? what is protestantism?
>>52414098
Yeah before 1979. British legally owned all oil in Iran at one point.
ITT: envoius spawn ofthe germanigger tribes dissing on the true masterrace
>>52414124
He's saying France lost some Romanisation due to the Franks.
>>52414159
Gaelic is Manx, Scottish and Irish. Insular Celtic.
Irish is nearly dead because of the propagation of English.
Protestantism is heresy.
Why the unrelated questions, Barbosa?
>>52414159
>>52414234
>Protestantism is heresy
Excellent post. I never knew Singapore was so based.
Daily reminder:
>Augustus created for the first time an administrative region called Italia with inhabitants called "Italicus populus", stretching from the Alps to Sicily: for this reason historians like Emilio Gentile called him Father of Italians.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italians#Roman_era
ancient italians = modern italians' forefathers
>>52411781
Romans were the supreme race, if they didn't conquer western europe we would still be Africa tier. Who wouldn't have a hard on for them.
>>52414159
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Famine_(Ireland)
>The Famine gave considerable impetus to the shift from Irish to English as the language of the majority. Those most gravely affected by the Famine were mostly in Irish-speaking districts, and those districts also supplied most of the emigrants. Awareness of the cultural loss provided a spur to the work of Irish language activists in Ireland, Britain, America, and Australia, resulting in the foundation of such organisations as the Gaelic League.
>>52414296
7% of the population is Catholic desu
>>52412625
And still, didn't even get all of us.
>>52414310
>one goy says that Augustus is the father of Italians
>THIS MEANS WE WUZ ROMANS AND SHIET
>>52414310
>>52414318
>Africans get conquered by superior people
>Complain non-stop despite being objectively better off
>Europeans get conquered by superior people
>Acknowledge said conquerers brought them out of the stone age
kek 2bh
>>52414019
>we wuz celts/romans/angles/saxons/normans/english/british and shit
>>52412666
>stopped northwards by a bunch of blue barbarians
>conquered what were essentially Welshmen without their longbows. No Anglo Saxons, let alone Normans.
Romans were cool but their conquering of half of Britain is unremarkable especially in light of their other accomplishments.
>>52414372
More than that the most important thing is that the core of the Roman army, the legions, which were the key of Rome's dominance, during the height of Rome, were required to be citizen, and since at those times the very vast bulk of citizens were from Italy, due to Augustus granting them this right, this makes the Roman army 'Italian'.
This before everything went to shit and dindu nuffins started to be the majority of the army of course.
>>52414372
Read the previous sentence you spastic retard.
''Ancient Rome'' was an ancient italian civilization, same as the Minoans, Mycaeneans, Spartans and Macedonians being part of ''Ancient Greece''.
>>52411781
We dont care about the roman empire?
>The Etruscan civilization reached its peak about the 7th century, but by 509 BC, when the Romans overthrew their Etruscan monarchs, its control in Italy was on the wane. By 350 BC, after a series of wars with both Greeks and Etruscans, the Latins, with Rome as their capital, gained the ascendancy by 272 BC, and they managed to unite the entire Italian peninsula.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italians#Roman_era
Italy was the first land to become romanized and it's the land on which the roman civilization arose. Trying to separate ''Ancient Rome'' with Italy is pathetic.
>>52414498
this
>>52414372
>goy
singaporean jew detected
>>52414521
>''Ancient Rome'' was an ancient italian civilization
Purely geographically.
Italy literally got conquered by Arabs, Lombards, Goths, the French, etc so many times after the fall of Rome, I wouldn't be surprised if they hardly contain any remaining Roman genes.
Every fucking civilisation gets diluted after invasions, it's fucking stupid to say Italians are Romans. Unless you mean something else and I misunderstood you.
guys, don't give them serious answers. They know the truth already. Just meme and laugh at them
>>52414720
how wrong can one person be?
>>52414781
It's literally the same as saying the Inuits were an ancient canadian civilization
>>52413833
After the ice age.
>>52414720
You're talking as if Italy became de-latinized, which it didn't.
ancient italians = modern italians' forefathers and not amount of memeing will change this fact
''Ancient Rome'' = ancient italian civilization
Deal with it.
>it's fucking stupid to say Italians are Romans
Who the fuck said this? The only roman italians today are the italians from Rome but this doesn't change the fact that the ancient italians became fully romanized and that those ancient romans from the italian peninsula = modern italians' forefathers.
Once again, deal with it or kill yourself.
>>52414720
>Italy literally got conquered by Arabs
stopped reading right there
2/10 apply yourself
>>52414836
No it isn't you imbecile. Once again:
>Augustus created for the first time an administrative region called Italia with inhabitants called "Italicus populus", stretching from the Alps to Sicily: for this reason historians like Emilio Gentile called him Father of Italians.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italians#Roman_era
Minoans, Mycaeneans, Spartans, Macedonians etc. = ancient greeks
Etruscans and Romans = ancient italians
Deal with it.
>>52414884
>ancient italians = modern italians' forefathers
I agree with that. Point is, while Italians have Roman forefathers, most probably also have many non-Roman forefathers.
If what you're meaning to say is that Romans were the ancestors of modern Italians, I can't argue with that.
>>52414896
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emirate_of_Sicily
>inb4 Sicily is not Italy!!!!!!!
>>52414975
>Sicily is not Italy
Yes, Sicily is an island and doesn't represent all of Italy.
Also, Sicily got reconquered by Normans, so by your logic Sicily is Scandinavian?
Why are people saying the Italians do not come from Roman civilisation?
The Roman people did not just disappear when the barbarians took over the empire, they were still the vast majority of the populace. Hence why the Romance languages continued as an example.
>>52414935
>Italian peninsula sees western powers carving up the world for themselves
>Realizes if they want a piece of the pie they need to unify together
>Appeal to a sense of national pride in order to unite the states
>Names the country after the most famous Roman Emperor because WE WUZ ROMANS AND SHIT
That's literally all there is to your link. Italians were not Roman lol.
>>52415011
>>Sicily is not Italy
>Yes
Che cazzo stai dicendo?? La Sicilia e la Sardegna = isole italiane
Basta con sti maymays di merda.
>>52415011
>doesn't represent all of Italy
It's still part of Italy, and the people of Sicily are politically Italians.
>Sicily is Scandinavian
Nope. Sicilians are Sicilians. The Normans mixed with the local population, as did other conquerors.
I'm trying to say that Italians aren't identical to Romans and thus it's stupid to say "le Italians are Romans!!!!". I'm not denying that Italians have Roman ancestors, or that Romans mysteriously disappeared.
>>52415087
>literally talking out of his ass
The romans from the italian peninsula were ancient italians. It's time to deal with it pal.
>>52415119
Ethnically man, there's a separation. Conquering a piece of land, especially when separated, doesn't magically turn the entire population into the conqueror, otherwise most of Europe would be full of half-wops, half-this, half-that.
>>52411781
Because admiration for empire and colonialism is in our blood, but the Roman empire had nothing to do with us so we can romanticise it without getting white-guilted by left wing faggots like our own empire.
Also the Roman empire brought great civilisation to Britain, and areas it never reached are still slightly backwards and behind to this day. There's a cultural difference between the south of England, and the North / Scotland.
Going to Bath or Cambridge is quite beautiful. Going to the North is all "muh mines" "muh pastry"
>>52415189
Fuck off southerner. We have seen London.
>>52415178
The Romans were ancient Italians.
Greek colonists were also ancient Italians.
As were Lombards, and Ostrogoths, and other tribes.
The Romans were ancient Italians, but Italians aren't modern Romans.
>>52415138
>I'm trying to say that Italians aren't identical to Romans and thus it's stupid to say "le Italians are Romans!!!!"
your opinion means nothing against genetics and history, see >>52413592
pro-tip: romans conquering gaul didn't turn every frenchmen into a legionary wop
it's millions of people against some thousands
it's the elite that gets replaced, it has always been like that, even with the moors
>>52415119
Come te la passi a lavare i piatti in Cucknada, frocetto?
>fugge all'estero
>shitposta su internet quanto gli Italiani siano Romani
maximum terrone spotted
>>52415273
...so """"""genetics"""""" and """""""history""""""" say that the modern-day Italian is equivalent, and identical, to the ancient Roman inhabitant of Italia?
>>52415269
>Italians aren't modern Romans
See
>>52414884
>The only roman italians today are the italians from Rome
>>52415273
By that definition, only Rome has the right to claim roman heritage because the rest of "italia" got conquered and later given citizenship. >Surely conquerors have no cultural or genetic impact on the conquered.
what a stupid argument.
>>52415354
Very much, like 98%.
No single state in the world is completely 100% identical to its past, every region gets some input during thousands of years of history.
>>52415374
>The only roman italians today are the italians from Rome
Literally doesn't make any sense. Try harder.
>>52415273
This, mass immigration that actually changes the genetics of the population is a rare phenomenon in history and only becomes more common from the 16th century onwards, eg. America. In the ancient world it was a case of killing the elite and taking over the peasants.
As an example, Britain.
>The Romans, Vikings and Normans may have ruled or invaded the British for hundreds of years, but they left barely a trace on our DNA, the first detailed study of the genetics of British people has revealed.
>The analysis shows that the Anglo-Saxons were the only conquering force, around 400-500 AD, to substantially alter the country’s genetic makeup, with most white British people now owing almost 30% of their DNA to the ancestors of modern-day Germans.
http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/mar/18/genetic-study-30-percent-white-british-dna-german-ancestry
>>52415416
Didn't recognise the meme?
Where'd that 98% come from?
>>52415343
>lavare i piatti
'no'
>fugge
'no'
>quanto gli Italiani siano Romani
'no' vedi >>52415374
>terrone
'no'
WE /his/ NOW
>>52415417
>Literally doesn't make any sense
Are you not aware that the city of Rome still exists and is still inhabited you shit for brains?
The only romans today = italians from Rome
>>52415390
literally desperate aren't we?
I'm just defending my right to roleplay like everyone else, otherwise let's just stop altogether instead of going with the special pleading for us.
Anyway, the army is what makes an empire and the Roman army was Italian, as a whole not just from Rome.
>>52415458
should be in the previous pic
>>52415515
So that's what you mean.
How does that prove anything? Constantinople exists today, and isn't inhabited by Greegs.
>>52415544
But no one should be allowed to roleplay as their country, it's fucking cancer.
>Catholics will defend this
>>52415612
Eh that's another story, it can be fun at times, I'm just arguing certain misconceptions like Romans magically disappearing despite history telling us that populations usually never get heavily displaced, especially in a fortress-country like Italy where heavy movements of people in and out are made hard by the med sea and the alps.
>>52415602
>comparing the history of the city of Rome to Constantinople's
>>52413020
>Implications
>>52415602
m8 you do know that the literal dictionary definition for "romans" = "a native, inhabitant, or citizen of ancient or modern Rome", right?
>>52415835
>>52413020
>>52411781
>tfw 100% Romano-British ubermensch with big brown cock and green eyes
I live to curbstomp pasty Celts and Saxons.
>>52415870
I wasn't trying to argue semantics, when I used "Romans" I was referring to ancient Romans.
Seeing >>52413592 it's pretty convincing, though. I'll have to do more research.
>>52415820
I don't even know what you're getting at, but if it's semantics, I don't want to take part.
>>52415971
Your blabbering is worthless.
ancient italians (including the ancient romans who completely romanized Italy) = modern italians' forefathers
That's reality.
If you keep trying to argue against it it just means that you're trying to be obnoxious and annoying.
>>52412860
Technically they didn't conquer England, got it through succession
>>52416049
I agreed with that back in my earlier post. >>52414975
Did you not catch that?
>>52416104
Then what are you arguing about?
>>52416130
Italian genetic makeup, which I've been (mostly) proven wrong on.
>>52416192
>Italian genetic makeup
does not in any way shape or form go against the statement (fact) that the ancient italian romans are modern italians' forefathers and that ''Ancient Rome'' was an ancient italian civilization.
>>52415971
Constantinople was ravaged by the Ottomans who established themselves there since then. Rome started almost from scratch in terms of population after the fall of the WRE, it was likely repopulated by locals and other Italics since we haven't had massive amounts of people moving here.
>>52416192
>>52416236
pic also related
>>52416236
>If you keep trying to argue against it it just means that you're trying to be obnoxious and annoying.
You're just being obnoxious and annoying now, I thought everything's settled by now.
>>52416280
People use selections of words to try to "prove" languages are related. I've seen people do it with Zuni and Japanese, or Basque and random Caucasian languages.
In this case, Italian is undoubtedly related to vulgar Latin, but in order to prove it's the most related you've got to compare both lexical similarity and mutual intelligibility of both languages over those of Latin and other Romance languages. Which I cannot find a source for in a short time.
>>52416236
No one cares about lingistic or cultural roots. We're talking about genetics here.
>>52416433
I can read classical latin texts and naturally sound fluent. Vulgar latin also looks like a typical italian dialect extremely close to actual italian. These words >>52416280 are not cherrypicked.
>>52416528
>le anecdotal evidence
All I want is some percentages. I'm not denying Italian isn't the closest language to vulgar Latin, nor am I affirming that.
>>52416502
>We're talking about genetics here.
Genetics are irrelevant and you seem unaware of the fact that many romans weren't of ''pure roman ancestry'' (whatever that means) and that several emperors were also of foreign ancestry.
Nice try using ''genetics'' to separate Italy from Ancient Rome, but it doesn't work.
>>52416587
>"A 1949 study by Italian-American linguist Mario Pei, analyzing the degree of difference from a language's parent (Latin, in the case of Romance languages) by comparing phonology, inflection, syntax, vocabulary, and intonation, indicated the following percentages (the higher the percentage, the greater the distance from Latin):[4] Sardinian 8%, Italian 12%, Spanish 20%, Romanian 23.5%, Occitan 25%, Portuguese 31%, and French 44%."
>>52411781
we wuz romans n shiet
>>52416844
Sardinian, then. Italian's certainly the closest major language, but I always had a gut feeling that one of the small ones would be closer.
>>52416284
>>52413773
Iberia, Gaul, parts of North Africa, Dacia, and certain areas of the Levant
>>52415189
Leftists on the BBC website used the Roman empire as an example of why Britain especially London was always multicultural
>>52416650
>genetics are irrelevant
t. Abdul al-Romani
People living in southern and central England today typically share about 40% of their DNA with the French, 11% with the Danes and 9% with the Belgians, the study of more than 2,000 people found. The French contribution was not linked to the Norman invasion of 1066, however, but a previously unknown wave of migration to Britain some time after then end of the last Ice Age nearly 10,000 years ago.
Prof Peter Donnelly, director of the Wellcome Trust Centre for Human Genetics at the University of Oxford, who co-led the research, said: “It has long been known that human populations differ genetically, but never before have we been able to observe such exquisite and fascinating detail.”
The study found that people’s ancestral contributions varied considerably across Britain, with people from areas of Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland emerging as separate genetic clusters, providing a scientific basis to the idea of regional identity for the first time
>>52417308
>culture is genetic
t. cultureless kuknadian with no understanding of ancient roman history
>>52417564
I literally told you we weren't talking about culture, we're talking about genetics Achmed
