What is the best sword in history?
>>847118
probably one made by a modern smith. metal work has really improved since they were practical weapons
>>847118
You mean 'favorite sword', right? Type XVIa
http://www.albion-swords.com/articles/oakeshott-typology.htm
>>847126
I once watched a one-hour documentary of a modern French guy hand-forging an entire sword with case.
Breddy cool.
Do you even have to ask?
the sword that has never been unsheathed
:^)
>>The Sword of Damocles.
>>847231
>everything is subjective
WE ALL KNOW
>>847184
OP's dick? not buying it desu
>>847179
Link?
>>847235
IMPROVE YOUR "READING COMPREHENSION".
The sword of Damocles
>>847183
probably the most overrated weapon in history.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XLWzH_1eZsc
really, there is no such thing as a "best sword", it depends on the situation (how much armor are people wearing, are they using it from horseback, is there a lot of room to navigate etc.) people's fighting style etc.
best against armor: probably late medieval longswords/greatswords (although swords are generally useless against advanced armor, better use specialised weapons like maces)
best cutting edge: middle eastern curved sword, like the ottoman kilij, or indian talwar
best for one on one duels: rapiers
those are all fairly long swords though, that become useless once you try to use them in a smaller room, or even a packed melee.
>>847273
I wish people would stop posting that video, he makes several mistakes. The rest of what you said I agree with though
The Ashbringer...
>>847231
I thought you were gone
Probably a gun.
Are we talking about one specific historical sword that was known to be carried by one man, or one class of sword?
>>847183
>>847598
>posting the doctored version
>>847237
Sheath was medieval slang for vagina so I think youve got this backwards buddy
>>847165
Good choice but OP said best which means he wants to be redirected to >>/k/ or that that he wants to know what sword(type) exeeded all other weapons in the past and or was ahead of its time.
Only iranian scimitars/shamirs used a steel as pure but their design limited them twards armored opponents whilst the legendary "ulberh+t" used a more primitive but against armored opponents vastly more efficient design. These were certainly some of the best swords ever forged under non industrial circumstances.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J6woycxQzA0
>>847183
Katanas are excluded OP asked for swords not weapons of mass destruction.
>>847604
>kek
>>847183
This. Rumour is that it would split a flow of water in two if it was placed in a river.
JOYEUSE
O
Y
E
U
S
E
malay pride
world wide
>>847655
SECONDED
>>847687
What advantages does the wavy-ness provide?
>>848802
I guess it lacerates. Dumb dagger though.
>>847118
>>848841
>>848854
feels good man
>>848802
None, the waves are simbolic and not for nothing premodern kriss are straight bladed. The waves symbolize mystic and rank stuff, like a teacher has 5 waves, a leader 13, etc.
Frostmourne
>>847118
The best sword type? One would in general argue a zweihander for armored and a rapier for unarmored combat.
Obviously specific situations favour specialized blades.
>>847118
>Nobody has mentioned uriels flaming sword yet
Shiggidy
>>848923
OP here, desu was thinking more individual swords but types are cool too, maybe especially zweihanders
So why can't we recreate damascus steel anymore? Or proper greek fire? And is it true damascus steel could cut and cleave stone without much issue?
I mean, that shit is ancient you'd think we could figure out how to do that with modern technology.
>>848802
It adds benefit where fighting because of the wavyness, you can glide alongside the opponents sword but he not easily alongside yours with his sword. You therefore control the movement of your swords, you can turn your sword to the flat side if you want to move it.
Hope this makes sense
Also the edge is lacerated and cuts better because of it. But this was irrelevant in the time period of the sword since everybody was in armor
![339px-DamaszenerKlinge[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/5Y1tKZs.jpg "339px-DamaszenerKlinge[1].jpg")
>>849018
>So why can't we recreate damascus steel anymore?
We can make damascus steel. Lots of artsy steelworkers use it for its aesthetic value.
>Or proper greek fire?
Because we don't actually know what it was, so we can't be sure that the things we use to reproduce its effects are actually the same compound as the original.
>And is it true damascus steel could cut and cleave stone without much issue?
Where did you even hear this?
>>849048
Well colour me stupid then. I don't know where I heard that but I remember that fact being pretty kickass if true.
Isn't Damascus steel incredibly durable and strong though?
>>849096
>Isn't Damascus steel incredibly durable and strong though?
Compared to iron? Yes. Mostly because the metalworking involved basically lowered the amount of impurities in the material and evened out the composition. Later Wootz and Toledan steel (which are also often called damascus because they look very similar) were also much above the curve compared to normal (for the time) steel because they accidentally raise the carbon amount and nitrate it.
Compared to modern materials it's a fucking joke obviously.
>>848802
In that example, not much intentionally.
In the case of the zweihanders Doppelsöldnaten used, the idea was that it could catch pikes better than a straight blade. As with your swordbreaker/swordcatcher daggers, it's questionable if this was reliable enough to be worth the forging.
If anyone has input do post it. My knowledge of pike and shot era specialist combatants/weaponry is limited.
>>847118
probably already covered, but it entirely depends on what it's going up against.
For sword versus sword combat, probably the rapier, unless the combatants are armored.
Now, a sword really is the wrong weapon to use against heavy armor, but you'd probably be safe with a zweihander or a similarly large weapon, just for the reach. I assume sword and board isn't an option, hence smaller weapons like the Yoroidōshi can't get close enough to work.
I'm not seeing any other options off the top of my head for dealing with armor. Swords really didn't come back as relevant weapons until pike and shot appeared and the amount of full armor on the field fell dramatically.
video very related.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hlIUrd7d1Q
>>849048
We can make steel that looks similar,, but we can't actually recreate Damascus Steel as it was made in the past.
Here's my personally favourite sword. I got a hard-on for old bronze weapons.
>best for dueling
Rapier
>best for general combat
Longsword
>most valuable sword
Joyeuse
>>850009
bronze blades are pretty
I forgot what its called, but it was some Ottoman sword. The sword was extremely flexible and could actually curve around shields and swords that were meant to block them. I guess they were similar to scimitars. Probably just a myth, but I heard they were banned from war by a council similar to the Geneva convention because the sword often caused limbs to be cut off or eyes getting poked out. Anyone know what I'm talking about?
Also, I hope everyone posting katanas are joking. They're one of the worst types of swords ever.
>>850092
Look at the shape of the tip in the second one, it changes to an evenly pointed tip, therefore doctored.
>>850055
You're not talking about Yataghans are you?
Forward-curving swords that gave lots of power on the chop?
Not sure about the curve around shields/swords bit, or the ban, but the romans had issues against the Celts and Carthaginians using similar forward-curving weapons because they can do a number on shields.
>>850092
The katana bent on impact with the longsword. For the broadcast episode, they showed the downswing with the katana, but then cut to a close up of a longsword breaking the longsword. This is why Deadliest Warrior should never be trusted on anything.
The first gif is real, the second one is a merge of the longsword and katana footage. You can see at the end where the sword recoils back up that it's a longsword because it's got a double-edged tip.
Work on your vision.
>>847267
I love you Rei. How is the Russian Phantom time stuff coming?
The khopesh and katana are underrated. The katana weighed 15 pounds, a shioad, due to its innefficient smelting process. That gives it extremely good armor piercing for its size due to kinetic energy. The kopesh, although expensive awkward to duel with, was excellent at battles.
>>850136
Comparing a modern katana to a long sword isnt a fair comparison anyway. the tachi swords popular at the time of the long sword would have been longer and thicker. it would not break as easily
>>850019
>not p++
You trying to save 4k on the cheaper dds?
If it's myth/history, then it's Durandal, Curtana or Joyeuse
If it's fantasy then it's stormbringer
>>849048
I distinctly remember seeing a documentary about Damascus steel and the crusaders or whoever was visiting the desert came back to England telling tales of the swords that could cut stone. Seems like exaggeration, no doubt they were good swords by comparison but still not stone cutters.
>>850009
Are there any other examples of bronze weapons that well preserved?
>>847118
Ak-47 of course
>inb4 it's not a sword
Neither is the katana
>>850251
If you're not going to contribute to the discussion at hand you may as well just piss off.
>>850230
Weapons from various tombs for sure. It's not bronze, but I know there were gold weapons in Tut's burial chamber.
>>850251
>>850230
I doubt it, though they seem to corrode less than early iron weapons.
The Goujian is only this well preserved because it was stuck in an airtight scabbard until they found it 2000 years later.
Probably something from the middle east. Not because of its inherent design, but due to that sweet, sweet damascus.
>>850277
a saber is also a sword
>>850277
>It's a hatchback, not a car
>>850292
>>850291
>>850299
In French there is a difference, I didn't know it didn't work that way in English
>>847687
>THAT FEEL WHEN YA BOO GET TWO MOVES A TURN
>>850330
All sabres are swords but not all swords are sabres.
>>850335
Ok, but in French a sabre is not a sword. I get it though, it's not the same in English
>>850346
It's cool. Just don't fuck up next time or there will be consequences.
>>850351
Kalshnikov is still better
>>850367
A kalashnikov isn't much good when I teleport behind you and slice it in half.
>>849048
Damascus Steel has never been recreated, idiot. Just a bunch of claimants claiming they can, but considering no writing concerning the actual making of it has ever been recovered (i.e. the exact chemical composition), we will never recreate Damascus steel.
>>850367
Kalashnikov loses to Stoner nine times out of ten.
>>850230
The Goujian Sword is unique because it was superfucking lucky
>Airtight scabbard
>Deoxygenated environment (actually, the tomb was underwater)
It was also a major find because it is most likely owned by King Goujian of the State of Yue, whose rivalry with King Fuchai of Wu was one of the highlight grudge matches of the Chinese Warring States period.
shiva's cock
Anduril tbchwy
>>850367
Add a bayonet and youve got yourself a sword comrade
>>850334
who is this curry cumslut
>>850009
D A M N
A
M
N
>>848854
>Government can't silent me.
And faith won't absolve your grammar.
>no one posted the truly best sword yet
What the fuck
>>847118
my dick
![Szczerbiec_Wawel_crop[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/a7AxT5m.jpg "Szczerbiec_Wawel_crop[1].jpg")
Why are there so few artifact swords out there? Surely powerful people must have had pimped out swords?
Pic related is the polish coronation sword, forged somewhere in east germany in the 1100's. While for much of its history it is a ceremonial sword it only becomes one in 1320 and was probably used as a weapon in the two centuries before that.
The pommel is riddled with arcane inscriptions and incantations such as "Fierce faith do the names of God Sedalai and Ebrehel inspire"
Nearly lost many times it was finally covertly shipped to canada in the days before WW2 and recovered in the fifties.
But why so few examples like this in the world? Especially since literature talks about famous named swords all the time.
>>853262
>Pre-saxon times
>Crossguard and round pommel
>>849023
I dunno, malay being mainly pirates and all didn't use that much armour, specially compared to Western Europe or even horse nomads. But I'm not an expert on it, I would wager they used mainly cloth when using armor tough, so slashing/slicing weapons were the main way to defeat it.
>>847606
Vagina means sheath in Latin
>>850136
>The celts.
The "celts" (and for that I mean you thing in the Gauls and they diaspora) used mainly longswords,long knives or spears, Makhairas /falcatas/Rhompaias were mainly a Greek/Iberian/Dacian thing.
>>853283
There would be the challenge of making it practical as well as aesthetically pleasing. Also a lot of swords would have just been lost or melted down over time.
>>847118
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Damascus_steel
>>847118
damascus steel, depending on if it actually existed or if some ottamanboo made it up a few hundreds years ago
>>850051
It's just so beautiful
>>850092
Does it really matter?
>>847277
Would you care to point out these mistakes for some of the less intellectually gifted people?
>>853283
>>853283
Because its pretty much like any other sword but with some worthless shit written on it
>>850008
I think I might go for a rondel if i was equiped with armor and facing someone with armor and sword.
But I gues a rondel is a dagger so it don't count.
>>847118
GLORIOUS NIPPON STEEL KATANA
CUT THROUGH ANYTHING
>>850181
That's probably a modern longsword aswell.
It's a shitshow and dosen't proove anything, either for- or against the katana.
>>850167
Or, instead of having a katana, you could just bring a spear. ye?
>>853290
Its magic.
No one said the Pen yet?
>>853283
Probably because, European culture at least, advanced past swords far earlier than most other cultures
>>856306
At least until WWI, and shortly after, there was still a lot of practical military saber systems. Even Patton developed a system of for the army.
Its telling however that as soon as people fully realized that Calvary just was not practical anymore they simply dropped training, and so only a few living systems of practical saber work remain, despite being taught within living memory
>>856146
>modern longsword
my understanding is that most modern long swords are simply reproductions of Renaissance long swords.
>>850265
Katana isn't a sword. It's a weapon of mass destruction, being folded over 9 quintillion times, the steel in the Katana is harder than steel, lighter than titanium, sharper than obsidian and scalpels combined, and never breaks. This allowes the user to defy any other weapon, whether it be bullets, another sword, machine gun barrels or even an atomic explosion, the Katana can split it.
Moses used a staff and gods power to break open the red sea?
WRONG
He was actually a Japanese emperor, using his trusted Katana to splice the red sea in half. This impact also caused Iceland and the mid oceanic Ridge to form.
The more you know
>>856351
>what is metallurgy and forging techniques
sure you could use period-accurate tools made from period-accurate ores refined through period-accurate methods to produce what is theoretically a period-accurate longsword, but that certainly is not "most" modern longswords
>>847277
you can have this instead
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jb3UobSZl34
>>856410
ok, bu there about the same weight and shape as what was used.
>>856076
Unlike what he implies at about 1:40, the katana was not rarely used, in terms of melee weapons you were about half as likely to die from a sword as a polearm. There was even a period were nodachi were popular shock weapons right along polearms
. Most casualties of course were from bows and later guns. That is only on the battlefield however, not day to day life in a violent period of history
he also implies that a modern katana is the same as one made in 1300. The truth is that not only did length changed over time, but forging techniques, cross section, and mounting changed radically over time. The sword was always altered with changing social conditions and improvements in metal working.
I mean he sounds like an angry hema guy whose pissed of because he hears so much on the katana on the internet. I usually like hema guys but when they go off on rants like this
I'm fond of cleaver falchions
>>856444
that means basically nothing if the chemical bonding in the sword is wrong, or worse, if the type of steel is different.
Let's put it this way:
for a great length of time swords were composed of very simple high carbon steel. As you make a blade longer, it needs to be flexible. Modern techniques mean you can add a set percent of chromium to the composition to give it that flexibility it needs. Renaissance smiths may have been guessing at the exact compositions at best. Modern steels have certainty.
the other thing is that depending on the chemical bonds, if two molecules of the wrong sort end up bonding with each other, the bond is weaker and the sword becomes more brittle. Forging techniques can correct for this, but better steel is just outright better.
>>856521
Well that just supports the notion that the test is stupid.
Though you generally have to pay extra for anything other than high carbon steel.
>>849018
Its ok anon I remember thinking this when I was 14 as well.
>>856545
there's more than one kind of high carbon steel. Some are good for weapons and some aren't. Most smiths you'll find at renaissance fairs making "authentic swords" just go to the local junk yard. Even then, that's modern steel and is still probably superior to those of the time period.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_blade_materials
>>856624
Most of the swords I see on sale are 1060-1090 carbon steel. for extra you can get things like spring steel, or deferentially hardened steel, or L6.
Laminated steel is available but expensive
>>856644
To choose which 10xx carbon steel, depends on the swords.
>>847259
As much as I want to say yes (being prophet's sword and whatnot), I don't really think having 2 points is practical
Also, he had a couple more swords. I think this oarticular ones got the rep because he gave it to Ali
>>847638
Pfff nothin personal kid but I parted an entire sea with this little apparatus.
>>854757
Of course it existed. This is not even debatable because there are remaining swords made of Damascus steel, which is essentially a crucible steel.
It's questionable whether it was superior to late medieval European steel though.
>>856865
Fucking mage classes.
>>849048
What you are talking about (as well as the blade in your picture) is not actual Damascus steel but pattern welded steel, which involves folding or twisting the material so that these sorts of patterns emerge. Pretty much all European swords of the early middle ages were pattern welded, since the bloomery iron they were made from was a rather unpredictable material with an inhomogeneous carbon distribution and all kinds of slag remainders that needed to be hammered out. Folding the metal was a homogenisation and purification process.
Damascus steel however, is not pattern welded. Damascus steel is a crucible steel. Due to letting it cool more slowly, it leads to long crystalline structures which form the pattern on the blades.
The swords of Ulfberht were supposedly also made from crucible steel which reached Europe through Viking trade routes along the Volga.
While we don't know the exact recipe to make Damascus steel - and it is rather questionable whether there was a singular recipe - we can recreate something that resembles it both in looks and material properties, which is more than enough to claim that Damascus steel is no mystery any more.
>>856672
the 2 points were used to disarm. It's a dueling sword, and in Arabia at the time, the common practice was to have 2 tribes face, and both sides bring out 1-5 of their best fighters, and the last side standing wins.
In all out brawls, you are right, spears and short swords were used instead.
>>856490
Do you have a source for your claims? I find
>in terms of melee weapons you were about half as likely to die from a sword as a polearm
>Most casualties of course were from bows
Hard to believe
>2 sided swords
literally beta tier and hand fedoras
real men use yatagan or kilij
This is such a stupid question
Which weapon is "best" is always situational
what weapons does your enemy use? what non-sword weapons do you use? what armour does your enemy wear, and yourself? what resources are available to you, and what is your production capacity? what terrain will you be fighting on? how large is your pool of manpower, how large is that under your command, how well trained are each? and the same for the enemy?
if one sword was best than whoever invented it would never invent a new sword, and that is obviously not what has happened
spear is superior 9 times out of 10 anyway
not even a question desu
>>847183
t. Sephiroth
>>850136
>For the broadcast episode, they showed the downswing with the katana, but then cut to a close up of a longsword breaking the longsword.
I thought that was just a 4chan troll. You'd think professional editors would be careful to leave out obvious giveaways like the tip.
>>847118
a meme sword, but i'd asume something like a Persian Shamshir( Scimitar) or Turkic Kilij. Best wielded by cavalry. The US marines still ceremonially carry the mamluke sword.
