Were the Russians really terrible in WW2 and in during the Soviet Union?
>>796515
Their leadership was at first. Too much politics.
Once they turned that around they shit-kicked Germany in record time.
>>796515
Up until the battle of moscow, yeah.
Awful leaders and they were materially unprepared for the war.
Sometimes there were 2 men for each gun (Leningrad being the most notable example)
>>796542
Stalin learned to go hands off and let his generals work on their own, and this lead to the Red Army getting better as the war went on.
Hitler learned to control more and more of the military's operation, and this lead to the Wehrmacht getting worse as the war went on.
>>796563
Pretty much. I recall reading that Stalin even surprised the NKVD by dropping the power of political officers to let field officers work better.
>>796548
wasn't that a myth?
Terrible as in nasty or terrible as incompetent.
Stalin was paranoid that he'd be overthrown any minute, from the time he gained power. A powerful military was a threat to him, since they could just have a coup. So he had most of his officers shot. This led to a massive decline in the quality of the Red Army, in terms of leadership, readiness, training, etc. Which was fine with him, as it made coups all the harder.
It wasn't so fine when the Germans invaded, and predictably the Germans steamrolled over the Soviet Union. But they rallied. They beat the German "master race," and then steamrolled them backwards all the way into Germany. It's true that it came with huge casualties, but again that was Stalin working to his advantage.
So I'd say that right there is good evidence that they weren't terrible at being incompetent, but yeah, terrible as in nasty.
I'd disagree that Stalin was hands off later in the war. He was still hyperparanoid and had his political agents everywhere in his Army. He had just found commanding officers who were totally loyal to him and would have never attempted a coup, and he had a structure in place that he could have had them executed if any of them so much looked at him crosseyed.
>>796797
Grossly exaggerated at any rate. The beginning of the war was very poorly prepared for and there were shortages of everything, from guns to radios to food to vehicles. Though the way you listen to it from American tv shows and movies you'd think they spent the entire war that way.
>>796548
call of duty and enemy at the gates was not a documentary.
>>796844
>Pretty everything here
Also the Germans were logistically outnumbered and outgunned after the defeat at Stalingrad.
The USSR could have won the war blindfolded after Stalingrad and Germany's loss of oil fields in Africa to the Western Allies.
Other than that, yeah the Soviet soldiers were hastily trained and good generals were scarce after Stalin's purges.
>>796919
>and Germany's loss of oil fields in Africa to the Western Allies.
Are you retarded? North Africa produced 0 oil in the time frame of WW2. Even one of Rommel's more grandiose claims, to seize Iraq and Iran and use their oil, wouldn't have produced all that much, and would be hard to ship through the Indian Ocean.
Germany's primary oil source in WW2 was Romania, and pretty much everything that Ploesti couldn't cover was made up for by synthetics.
North Africa had considerable strategic importance, but oil wasn't why.
>>796797
They had more than enough rifles but weren't organized or deployed for the invasion. They lacked ammunition, powder, explosives though, Zhukov wrote that American ammunition was the most important aspect of Lend Lease.
Stalin purging the military before (and even during) the German invasion did more damage than lack of supply.
>>796849
>Though the way you listen to it from American tv shows and movies you'd think they spent the entire war that way.
Almost all of the misinformation and deprecation re: the Eastern Front is a direct result of Soviet records being censored and intentionally made unavailable in the West. In all official American publications made directly after the war make the scale of the Eastern Front clear. The only information available for decades were German sources, naturally our perspective is warped, just not because of ethnocentrism.
>>796849
Damn lying Americans.
>>796797
yes if by that you mean 'they took X guys and gave them X/2 rifles and just sent them towards the enemy and this happened regularly'
not if by that you mean 'sometimes units were not supplied properly because suddenly there were german tanks rolling into town what is going on ivan we still have not received our equipment have we oh god'
>>796548
>Sometimes there were 2 men for each gun
>I get my history from call of duty games
I dont care what anyone says, the first few WW2 CoD games were great
>>796515
They were, until the German general in Stalingrad was assassinated by two Soviet survivors of a failed charge. This shifted the balance.
