discuss
I love these gifs
>>357018
>>357018
>bce
>>357027
>religion of peace
They early expansion of islam wasn't to convert people. They didn't force conversion, just require a tax otherwise unlike christian expansion into an area.
They just did some typical secular styled taking over cause thats what people did.
No, I don't think it's a religion of peace in any case.
>>356971
The Emperor should rule over Earth as Christ rules over Heaven.
>>356971
>The Roman Empire was ultimately brought down by a 21-year-old Turk
>>357166
>implying the Byzentine empire was the Roman Empire.
>>357360
>Eastern Roman Empire
>autists a thousand years later say it wasn't roman
>Make peace with long-time Persian rivals
>Dirty Turks completely annex Persians and half of Empire
>End times brought by generic flag bastards
>>356971
I forgets, what were the green bits at the end?
>>357948
After the crusaders sacked Constantinople Byzantine aristocrats formed several successor states
>>356971
I saw this just the other day and I'm having a hard time accepting it. I just don't understand to what extent an political entity back in that era could claim to exert simultaneous control over territories as distant as Portugal, Egypt, Britain, Iran, etc. I mean to what extent was all that territory really "theirs?" What kind of presence did they really have there? What amount and manner of control/authority did they assert? I mean an Emperor couldn't even have personally seen too much of "his" Empire in his lifetime.
>>357948
Byzantine (i.e. Eastern Roman) Empire? Unless you're talking about the future divisions among the green thing then idk.
>>357166
>imblying its not the crusaders that brought down the ERE
turks were just vultures chewing on a corpse anon
>>358004
>future
I meant 'further' but oh well.
>>356971
What went wrong?
>>358028
multiculturalism
>>358028
Corruption, hyper-inflation, outside enemies becoming stronger and more organized.
>>358032
Rome had always been multicultural from the second it incorporated Etruscans, other Latins, and Greeks on the peninsula.
>>358032
riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight, a giant empire HAS to be multicultural because they simply dont have the manpower to hold all that clay, executing Stilicho was sure very multicultural of Flavius
also, the ability to quickly adapt and absorb foreign ideas is what made rome so good in the first place, look at scutum and gladius are Iberian, and the ERE was quick to introduce its own eastern styled cataphracts and later on horse archers when they saw the effectiveness
>>358032
An empire is by the very definition multicultural.
>>357945
wow you're dumb
>>358028
The seeds of the empire's destruction were planted by the man who gave it it's military and by the man who made it an empire.
No succession system, no proper control of the dubiously loyal legions, no proper solution to economic depression, all problems no one was willing to fix.
>>358028
Population hollowed out by plague meant fewer Romans to fill the armies and fewer people paying taxes. Nomadic tribes forcing the mass movement of people to invade Roman territory.
With the Western Roman empire, there was the Plague of Cyprian+ Vandals and Goths moving in, being pushed west by the Huns.
Later, there was the plague of Justinian+ the movement west by the Lombards and the Slavs, pushed their by the Avars. They nearly survived the damage caused by these two, on top of constant war with the Sassanids, but then the Arabs took their richest and most productive provinces - Egypt and the Fertile Crescent.
They'd manage to bitterly hold on until the Turkish people moved into Anatolia, and they'd finally be killed by traitorous Venetians sacking Constantinople during the 4th Crusade.
The tiny bits of Greece that remained were eventually finished off by the Turks, but at that point they were already dead.
>>357166
The Roman Empire never died.
>>357072
>just require a tax
Also: Considering that Islam was at the time really the religion of the Arabian aristocratic upper-class, the tax was much more of a little privilege for the Muslims, as opposed to a form of religious oppression.
>>357072
>They early expansion of islam wasn't to convert people. They didn't force conversion, just require a tax otherwise unlike christian expansion into an area.
>"I do not foresee a good future for you and your nation save your acceptance of my terms and your submission to me. There was a time when your country ruled half the world, but now see how your sun has set. On all fronts your armies have been defeated and your nation is condemned to extinction. I point out to you the path whereby you might escape this fate. Namely, that you begin worshipping the one god, the unique deity, the only god who created all that is. I bring you his message.
Order your nation to cease the false worship of fire and to join us, that they may join the truth.Worship Allah the creator of the world. Worship Allah and accept Islam as the path of salvation. End now your polytheistic ways and become Muslims that you may accept Allah-u-Akbar as your savior. This is the only way of securing your own survival and the peace of your Persians. You will do this if you know what is good for you and for your Persians. Submission is your only option. Allah u Akbar." (Caliph Umar)
>>357934
not that guy but m8 they were pretty much greek
>>358611
Didn't the Emperors still view themselves as the successor to the Romans? Like how the Mongol Yuan and Manchu Qing viewed themselves as the successors to the Han dynasties.
Turks are literally the worst thing that has ever happened
>>358633
So did the Ottomans and the Germans.
>>358633
Βασιλεὺς kαὶ Καῖσαρ τῶν Ῥωμαίων
>>358651
And Russia
>>358759
And England. And, arguably, France. And possibly Spain. And definitely Italy.
>>357934
>Sultanate of Rum
>autists a thousand years later say it wasn't roman
>Holy Roman Empire
>autists a thousand years later say it wasn't roman
>>359064
>Islamic State
>autists right now say it isn't Islamic
kek
>>359067
>Republic of Macedonia
>autists right now say it isn't Macedonian
![[WhyNot] Denpa Teki na Kanojo - 02 [BD 720p AAC][97BACDCC].mkv_snapshot_41.31_[2015.10.09_21.21.54].png](https://i.imgur.com/Tsg4KiM.jpg "[WhyNot] Denpa Teki na Kanojo - 02 [BD 720p AAC][97BACDCC].mkv_snapshot_41.31_[2015.10.09_21.21.54].png")
>>356971
>405
>>359064
>Holy Roman Empire
>implying it was holy
>implying it was Roman
>implying it was an empire
>>359139
God that show is awful.
>>358163
>traitorous Venetians sacking Constantinople
It's funny because if anything it was the ERE to betray Venice, by pogroming its at least nominal vassal and refusing to pay debts and inviting its main rivals (Genoa and Pisa) to take its place as byzantine moneylender-in-chief. Not to mention that the venetians were actually trying to prevent the actual sack of the city, and they were the only troops not to disperse and loot the city, staying under Dandolo's control throughout the sack and protecting their area from the franks' wanton destruction.
But yeah, keep thinking that the byzs were martyrs and they still were a viable power at that point, that just so happened to be brought down by a puny city state and its army of undisciplined mercs.
>>357031
Problem, Christian?
>>358163
This >>359414
Fucking Perfidious Hellenon I tell you. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0r376MkZwLI
The Byzantine Empire deserved to go down by that point. All the rebellions, uprisings, and civil wars only served to aid the Arabs and Turks in taking it over.
>>359190
>Greek Empire in Constantinople
>Roman
See >>358715
>White man crowned by His Holiness the Pope, inheritor of the Western Roman tradition and imperial prerogative
>not Roman Emperor
k
>>358607
>Caliph Umar
>dissing the same dude that lifted the Christian ban on barring Jews entry into Jerusalem
>>359442
>1294
This is what you get for blobbing too big.
>>359442
Keep posting Map Gifs, anons, pls
>>359607
I don't get why people see the division of the Mongol Empire into individual Khanates as a failure. Ruling the complete Mongol Empire from one location would have been very impractical and the Khanates were still part of a larger Mongol civilization to some small extent, more so than 4 unrelated empires would have been.
>>359685
Well from that point of view the fall of the WRE wasn't a failure either, since roman-germanic kingdoms were still romanized as fuck and remained part of the roman-christian civilization.
Reality is that the breaking into khanates might not have been a failure of mongol civilization, but surely it was the failure of the mongol empire.
>>359735
>Well from that point of view the fall of the WRE wasn't a failure either, since roman-germanic kingdoms were still romanized as fuck and remained part of the roman-christian civilization.
The Mongol Empire wasn't forcibly conquered by non-Mongols. All the powerful people in the Mongol Empire stayed powerful. It was just a decentralization of authority. It's not a failure if it's all part of the plan.
>>359760
Well no, I can't agree. The mongol empire ceased to exist the moment it split into four totally independent khanates. It doesn't quite matter that it wasn't conquered. It's the same with Rome: you can't really talk of roman empire when you have two independent pieces stopping just short of attacking each others and actively pursuing policies damaging the other to preserve oneself.
>>357018
What does BCE and CE mean?
>>358611
And the Romans were half-greek. In that case, the Romans were mongrels
>>359779
I'm not saying you should refer to all four khanates as a singular Mongol Empire. I'm saying it wasn't a failure to decentralize authority into the individual khanates. It was the only practical decision to maintain as much Mongol authority over the various regions as possible. That is very different than what happened to the WRE.
>>359789
Before Common Era and Common Era
basically non-religious versions of BC and AD
>>359799
Thanks lad.
>>359789
I'm surprised you were never taught this. I guess everyone has to start somewhere though when learning about history.
Before Common Era and Common Era. It's the same thing as BC and AD.
>>359812
I knew BC and AD but never saw BCE CE in school but I went to Catholic soon so maybe that explains it.
>>359799
>non-religious versions
Kek yes because to say that a very specific religious event marks the beginning of the world's "common" era is much less religious than saying "this is how much time passed since arbitrary event x". The concept of "common era" is a hilarious failure when it comes to removing eurocentric/christian bias, it actually gives more importance to it than the actual christian religious calendar.
>>359853
I'm detecting the slightest degree of butthurt, anon. Shall I fetch the salve?
>>359868
Don't bother with the salve, just explain to me where you see the butthurt.
>>358633
Not sucessors, but the roman empire itself. For them, the empire never fell, they just lost provinces.
>>359853
I agree with you it is pretty stupid and pointless desu BC and AD work fine
>>356971
The weak must fear the stronk!
>>359796
Not him, but all the khanates but one lasted only aprox. a century after this separation. The one that survived was in serious decline. Not to mention that the khanates used this brief time of life to fight each other.
If the separation was not a failure, it was the start of one.
>>359874
A lot of people get bottom befuddled over the topic. It makes sense why a largely non-Christian world wouldn't want to use a bunch of latiny and Christiany terms that they don't even understand. Common Era is simple. Some anons get butthurt about it because they see the world as a war of cultures and the now well established use of BCE and CE as a huge blow to their culture and the lord their god.
>>359939
That's a silly way to look at it. That's like saying scoring a goal is the start of failure for a team that will inevitably lose. Goals are what forestall defeat, not the cause of it. They made the right decision in breaking up the Empire.
>>359960
>They made the right decision in breaking up the Empire.
Nobody wanted to fucking break it up.
And those Khanates weren't like East/West Rome, they saw each other as rivals fucking fought each other typical of Steppe Nomads.
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toluid_Civil_War
There was no greater plan in ensuring "mongol rule gets spread out." The component khans just got greedy.
>>358611
Romans were pretty much Greek.
>>360898
And Greeks are pretty much who?
>>360985
why was there no fighting for like 7 months after the invasions of poland?
>>360985
I cry everytime.
>>356971
what happened at 630? for west rome to loose all that land? who invaded exactly or was it rebellion?
>>362303
was all sasanian empire fault
>>359433
It's such a douchy thing.
>I'm going to try and look like I'm taking a stand, but actually doing so is too hard, so I'll continue to use the system I want to make a stand against, but change it the tiniest iota
>>360985
appeasement?
>>362303
Islam became a powerful force in the world.
>>360985
>TAUSEND
>JAHRE
>REICH
>>359971
>saw each other as rivals fucking fought each other typical of Steppe Nomads.
Except the yuan and ilkhanate those were friendly.
>>357018
china dynasties sound cool as fuck
which one should i read about?
>>364121
T'ang
Degeneracy n shit.
>>364121
You should read about everyone one of them really. Though my favorites are the Han, Tang, Song, Ming and the Qing.
Tang being the most based.
