Did the "The Rape of Nanking," really happen?
>>18844
only japs think that it didnt happen
>>18844
Yes, it did. It's a little tricky to calculate numbers on it because all the Japanese records on it were burned towards the very end of the war, but it certainly occurred and 40-300k citizens died, depending on who you believe.
>>18844
Go home Shinzo Abe.
And you can take Hiroshima with you.
>>18844
On what pretext that isn't Japanese propaganda would you assume it wasn't?
>>18844
Yes, and the Japanese still haven't really owned up to it. Not that that really matters, humanity is brutal in general, but still.
>>1
>>19036
They've apologized a bunch of times. Look it up.
I don't see the point in denying it. It's not like China is asking for money or anything, they just want an apology.
>>19203
The current PM of Japan: Shinzo Abe's grandfather was an accused war criminal (who was let out) and ran some shady financial shit in Northern China (he is also infamous for being the most unpopular PM in Japan's history). And Abe has basically has said that to him rehabilitating these guys is his personal quest (he also underplays the issue with Korea comfort women in a guy he supposedly wrote).
I believe it did but the death toll and severity were exaggerated by China for political purposes.
>>18844
Why is this allowed but not holocaust denial?
>>18844
>Did the "The Rape of Nanking," really happen?
No. It was acutely the rape of don king.
>>20121
Lol, I'm going to love the Armenian genocide threads and see which side the mods take.
The Rape of Nanking did not occur; it's a fiction. The initial conquests of Japan in China consisted of small skirmishes and "incidents" which led to acquisitions of territories and cities. China at this point wasn't even a country; the two dominant forces for the Nationalists and the Communists; those two forces only had nominal power, with most authority in the hands of local warlords.
The Japanese were primarily acquiring territory from those local warlords (most notably in the case of Manchuria). PRC (Nationalists) and CCP (Chinese Communist Party) were also conquering territories from these warlords and extending there power *in the same ways as the Japanese*.
Japan did not initiate full-scale war with China; this was the doing of the PRC. The PRC got really butthurt when Japan took Beijing and it's port city. At this point Japan was done with its acquisitions in China and was going to focus its efforts in a potential war with the USSR.
So the PRC started conflicts (war was not declared until years into the conflict because neither side wanted foreign involvement) and Japan then immediately went on the offensive in Shanghei. Japan had boasted that they could take Shanghei in three days and the whole of China in three months; this was quickly shown not to be the case and it took three months to take Shanghei. The government in Tokyo actually did not want full-scale conflict with China and they were unable to stop the Imperial Japanese Army at this point which was determined for conflict in China after initiation of conflict by Chiang Kei Shrek.
>>18844
I am amazed that Japan gets away with denying it so much. They're surpassing Turkey with that shit.
>>20210
The Japanese thne pushed inland past Shanghai outpacing the Chinese to Nanking. The PRC planned an all out resistance and stubbornly refused to surrender. In Nanking, the Chinese used their best infantry, few armored vehicles, and artillery to wage significance resistance against the Japanese. It therefore took a much larger toll on Japan than expected and required strenuous effort. The Japanese were forced during this conflict to attack Chinese infrastructure as well as civilian targets. What's more, the chickenshit Chinamen after losing in battle would put on civilian clothes and mix in with the normal refugees of war, making distinguishments between civilian and foe difficult.
Civilian property and lives were taken because of deliberate actions by the Chinese. There is, however, zero evidence of coordinated rapes by the Imperial Japanese Army. Rape was officially sanctioned to the contrary. Voluntary whores and brothels aren't even relevant here.
The Chinese also engaged in the barbaric medieval practice of scorched earth, in which Chinese forces deliberately destroyed agriculture, broke damns for flooding, and destroyed industrial assets. The Japanese countered this with the Three Alls policy.
The actions by Japan were comporable to those taken by the belligerent Chinese and most certainly necessary to end the conflict and bring peace. The Chinese are responsible for all the immense suffering. All that Japan wanted out of its Chinese colonies were natural resources such as rice, logging, coal, and labor. You don't need the whole of China in order to provide for that; however the Chinese made such a war necessary by initiating conflict with Japan.
>>18844
Yes, but it was not genocide.
>>20318
No one ever said it was. Genocide is the deliberate extermination of a people. Nanking was just a massacre in one city.
>>20121
Because Holocoast denial is meme history, only Japs deny Nanking.
>>20121
>>18844
You should ask An Hiro
Did the Holodomor (deliberate starvation of Ukrainians) really happen?
http://sputniknews.com/politics/20150809/1025560345.html
http://sputniknews.com/politics/20151019/1028730561/holodomor-hoax-invented-hitler-west.html
With respect to the Japanese only a few right wing crazies still try to claim it didn't happen.
A part of me wishes that we could have nationality markers a la /int/ so that we could have all of the cutlural biases out in the open, but than I remember that it would devolve into /int/ shitposting. Still, it would be helpful in a thread like this I'll say that much.
>>18844
One the greatest contribution the Nip have done to mankind.
>>18844
Yes. Some in Japan still maintain it was fabricated by the Chinese government, but there's a good deal of evidence that at least 10k non-combatants died.
>>21728
This tbqh.
>>20121
>>20234
Please Japan, don't turn into slavs. You're better than that.
>>21643
You do realise /int/ is infested with proxies?
>>20121
Because Holocaust Denial is banned because Storm Faggots won't stop discussing their outmoded theory at length.
This thread exists just so that you can bitch about how you can't pander holocaust denial.
>>20121
Holocaust was a literal genocide that's why.
Reminder that there is LITERALLY no solid evidence it happened
>>19203
Apologies work different in confucian/East Asian societies.
Japan has apologised, but they keep getting hounded for more and more apologies, and the more they give the more concessions will be demanded (usually geopolitical).
It's not like an apology in the West, where one nation will apologise to the other(s) and that will by and large be the end of it. An apology in East Asia is the start of something different.
>>18844
No
>>19203
>It's not like China is asking for money or anything, they just want an apology
This is funny, because the Nanking massacre was an attack on the Kuomintang, the Chinese nationalists, the ENEMY of the Chinese communists.
Why would the Chinese communists want an apology for something that was beneficial to them?
>>22214
On top of that, the hounding and demands for constant apologies that Japan perceives is the result of the stunted civil society in the rest of Asia.
China, Vietnam, and until VERY recently Korea and Taiwan aren't/weren't able to freely discuss what happened during the war, or have any meaningful dialog with the Japanese.
A comparison to Europe is useful here. The issue of German war guilt is essentially settled and comfortable in Western Europe. Nobody cares, and society is capable of having sensible, mature dialog about it.
But in Eastern Europe, and parts of East Germany, the situation is still fucked, and still boils to the surface at random times, because the past was held hostage by totalitarian regimes.
Understand that in Korea until relatively recently, it could be illegal to discuss comfort women (could be, because it depends on the mood of the KCIA officer strapping a car battery to your testicles).
This is also why compared to Europe, East Asia hasn't even begun to examine their roles in Japanese crimes. Which is a shame, because all the people involved will be dead by the time we can talk about it.
>>22340
They didn't for much of the Mao period since he had hoped to cleave Japan away from the Western Sphere (Japan had labor unions and a large communist party following the American occupation). He actually cites your reason for why an apology wasn't needed. It's only his current day successors who are in need of legitimacy (income gaps and greater inequality aren't very legitimizing) who are playing the nationalism card.
>>22475
This is very true man. Probably the most informative post here.
>>21137
>6 million
There's that number again
>>18844
NO it didn't typical gook demand false hirsotry.
>>19067
Since there is no archive, would anyone mind telling me what was the first post?
>>23590
no
"no" was the first post. Made by someone from France when flags were still up. Didn't get a screenie of it though.
>>19094
Have they? ...maybe I was thinking of unit 731..
>>18844
This is as bad as holocaust denialism.
I can't fathom why though, racist anti-Semitism is surely a stronger motivation than GLORIOUS NIPPON.
As a Japanese person, I know it did happen. All kids are taught about Nanking massacre in middle schools. Of course there are some people who deny it. In many cases, they are extreme right wing shit heads.
But we apologized for the past war crimes for many times and the criminals involved were executed. We paid compensation and both China and Korea received it. We've never had any war since 1945. What do you want for us any more? It's happened far before I was born.
>>23799
Well if the school system tells you it, it must be true.
>>23799
You still have to apologize and compensate for comfort women.
>>23866
>>23774
The Japanese are pretty racist too.
>>23911
Comfort women were whores, they got paid.
>>23911
Maybe the US military should also apologise for comfort women considering they used them more
>>23911
korean here, I don't know why tf japanese has to apolosize for what their earlier generations did, and why all the koreans and chinese are still butthurt about it in 2015
for what I know korean and chinese governments are baiting people to be pissed off against japs so they won't care much about how they fuck up. This is why shits like dakeshima and senkaku islands disputes are happening. result? schools teach kids to discriminate and hate other race.
>>24057
>>24186
Cause the generation that did it never apologized or were slow to apologize, of course the future generations get the burden of apologizing,
>>20210
Why are you calling the KMT the PRC?
>>22475
underrated post
