Icom discontinued their iconic IC-R20 wideband handheld receiver with nothing in the pipeline to replace it. This receiver has been a mainstay of hams, radio enthusiasts, and even government agencies across the world since its introduction.
It was designed with low power consumption as a goal, and met this goal admirably. The receiver could be described as adequate, but nothing special. It didn't do any trunking, so if listening to the cops and fire department is your thing you're out of luck. The UI was byzantine at best, like all Japanese radios it was crippled because they let the engineers design the interface. The front end is as wide open as a barn door, but it does include a CW filter and another filter just mysteriously called 'filter' (it's for 5-7 KHz voice) so it's not the worst thing.
Consequently the receiver is easily overloaded even with the 'filters' activated (AF only I suspect?) and you have to always ride the manual RF gain control.
Despite all this, nobody else makes a radio receiver that's quite in this class. It was made with incredible engineering talent, included a host of features, and when properly set up for a given signal is usually very pleasant to listen to.
Is this it for the Japs? Have they given up? Is there no reason to make a dedicated hardware handheld wonder-receiver when everybody can plug a DV stick into their laptop? Whatever the reason is, I feel that we're witnessing the passing of an era.
Icom and Yaesu have been having a really hard time this past decade or so against Elecraft, who are busy stumping the Japs and Making Ham Radio Great Again.
It's better than the
>he fell for the *insert component* meme
>post your computer
>hey lookit my desktop
What happened to the old /g/? Where we'd talk about stuff that wasn't either a phone or a computer?
I'm sure I'll get by somehow.
>>53867267
what are your sdr recommendations?
>>53867267
It's not nearly the same thing though. I can run for days (with all the power saving jazz activated) on one battery, range 150 KHz to 3.2 GHz (your RTL-SDRs can only run as long as your laptop can and can't usually do HF at all without a transverter) and throw the thing around. It's durable and portable, which are two big things that it has over a pc-based solution. Also it has a AA battery holder so you could just run off those forever in a pinch.
As wide open as the IC-R20's front end is, there is at least a filter after the first IF even if it's wide. The DV sticks never have any filtering of any kind, they are just wide open to the whole RF spectrum coming in from the antenna.
The R-20 even has a spectrum monitor.
>>53867252
this all the way. why cant /g/ be more like /gd/ /po/ or /toy/ where they actually have legitimate discussions?
>>53867397
I own an Elecraft KX-3 / PX3 which has one of the best receivers ever made, but it's HF / 2m only and not 4 plebs.
Pretty neat stuff, I can plug in a USB keyboard and transmit in a variety of digital modes, 11+ watts (except 2m, 3w or so), but with the optional matching amp you get to 110 watts.
The PX3 is fun, you can also output the I/Q signal to your PC.
>>53867397
Buy cheap chinese crap, to start. You should be able to get up and running for $8-12.
Get better antennas later, when you know more about what you're doing.
>>53867436
No doubt. You're comparing a Yamaha to a Schwinn. You have your needs, I have mine.
>>53867479
because more than 10 people post here
>>53867528
more then 10 people post on those boards too. the only difference is instead of shitposting all day they actually do the hobbies
>>53867493
Well if your needs are met by the RTL-SDR that's fine, but my point was more that this is kind of a telling blow to the long Japanese microelectronic dominance over the rest of the world in the radio arena.
You can't just throw together an R-20 with off the shelf parts, and that's why nobody's replacing it. The era of **##*FULLY ENGINEERED*##** products is passing.
>>53867479
Tech people are self-aggrandizing shitbags. The stereotype exists for a reason.
>>53867563
*** at least the era of fully enginnered products FROM JAPAN is passing.
Radio's a cutting edge hobby and industry, believe it or not, and the fact that China's killing Japan on the low end, and the USA's killing them on the high end now, is something to watch.
Elecraft just came out with a new HF radio, but because they *FULLY ENGINEERED* their UI it looks identical to the old one.
Knobs are 10% fancier.
>>53867563
Or possibly fewer people give a shit about scanning radio frequencies when you can communicate more effectively over the internet.
Or shitty Chinese manufacturing is about to eat Japan's lunch again.
>>53867638
Except when there is no power or your local cell site is overloaded
>>53867198
I almost put out 600$ to import an no gap Icom R3 so I could watch whatever wireless video signals I could find. That was way back in 2008, and I never pulled the trigger on it.
Its probably pretty useless nowadays
>>53867638
>Or possibly fewer people give a shit about scanning radio frequencies when you can communicate more effectively over the internet.
No that can't be it, ham radio's been growing like crazy for a long time actually and there is a boom in DV stick based radio hobbyism.
>Or shitty Chinese manufacturing is about to eat Japan's lunch again.
This is part of it, the other part is that the Japanese have gone off on this nutty idea that ham radio HTs need to be internet enabled at the expense of battery life and usability.
Look at this monstrosity, too bad the battery life is horrid and the receiver kinda sucks but yay, it even has an optional digital camera. It's basically a computer dev board shoehorned into a radio and it sucks at everything.
So do you guys just shoot the shit over radio or is there a purpose to this? Whats a real world scenario where HAM is the best alternative?
>>53867692
I own an R3 as well, and I use it all the time. It's still quite useful, just not for watching broadcast TV.
Battery life is even better than the R-20 but it is less capable on HF for sure. Still a very unique product and very useful.
I've watched chopper video downlinks with it.
>>53867727
>So do you guys just shoot the shit over radio or is there a purpose to this?
Yes mainly shooting the shit about radios and antennas and stuff. But all kinds of topics come up, ham radio is the original 4chan.
>Whats a real world scenario where HAM is the best alternative?
Any disaster basically, most of the stupid government agencies have difficulty interoperating, the phone and internet goes down and nobody knows what's what, etc. Also I use it in my area because it's very mountainous and when I'm in the backcountry I can still manage to send and receive APRS messages so I can talk to the missus even if voice contact isn't possible.
Also yes we have our own satellites, sorry they're ham only but if you're a ham it's all free to use of course!
>>53867719
what about packet radio?
analogue is pig disgusting
>>53867817
Seems alright, and now that I think about it the disaster scenario makes a lot of sense
>>53867896
>what about packet radio?
What about it, works great, people are still using it all over, APRS is packet radio too. Shit my VX-8 works as a TNC.
>analogue is pig disgusting
That's dumb of you to say, analog's very efficient, the gear is much simpler, and it's a joy to use.
>not having a fully functioning radio set that fits inside an altoids tin and runs off a 9v battery for weeks
wew lad
>>53867614
>Radio's a cutting edge hobby and industry
what do you mean by this?
>>53867981
>what do you mean by this?
Some hams are into shit that most governments can't even into.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AS3fQtSKCTw
>>53867961
I just have zero interest in voice/video communication.
Accessing a BBS through the airwaves on the other hand I find neat
>>53867981
BTW, where do you even think radio technology comes from?
It all comes from hams and the prototypes are made in their garages.
>not shitposting by bouncing your own signals off the moon at back to your buddy on another continent
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0sNC9gyLFyc
>>53868042
>Accessing a BBS through the airwaves on the other hand I find neat
Well there are ham radio BBS's all over the world. Many products made by hams are available at low cost so you can live your airwave BBS dreams with a minimum of fuss, or you can dust off Grandpa's old Teletype machine and hook it to a 1970's era radio modem and do it the old fashioned way.
>>53868116
>KE0OG
does that nigga have a tutorial on this then?
fucking fantastic if so, I can't wait until I'm actually competent/licensed
>>53868160
Here's one that's complete with instructional video music!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Hm6omrVaeE
What's the price for one IC-R20 these days?
>>53867817
Are you from Wales by any chance?
>>53867198
We use icom, at the airport I work with to connect with pilots. I wonder what they are going to use now.
>>53867544
Well archfags too go around trying to fix their os everyday.
>>53868308
>Are you from Wales by any chance?
No. Oregon.
>>53868337
>We use icom, at the airport I work with to connect with pilots. I wonder what they are going to use now.
Icom's not going out of business, but they are discontinuing an iconic radio with no replacement in sight.
>>53868337
Don't pilots use AM?
>>53868079
radio is a mature technology. there is almost nothing new that is "coming".
>>53867252
HURR DURR DESKTOP THREAD
>riced linux tiling WM
>muh waifu
>>53867198
Thanks OP I'm learning a lot about radio now.
>>53868424
I would like some packet data improvements, Jabber/HAM radio integrations and whatnot. Also mobile phone OTG connectivity.
Imagine connecting your standard android smartphone via USB to a radio device, and sending out an encrypted message to a repeater? That would be awesome!
>>53867483
>Elecraft KX-3 / PX3
So sexy.
>>53867252
tHiS
>>53868506
couldn't you do it over headphone and microphone jack with low baud by doing the modulation in software?
>>53868610
Sounds like something worth putting on GitHub, but it would need to gain traction, just like Echolink:
http://www.echolink.org/
I literally know nothing about radios. Where can I learn about them?
>>53868717
http://www.kb6nu.com/study-guides/
best ham guides no questions asked. Well worth $16
>>53868245
How many people are able to connect to one BBS at the same time? Just one?
>>53868424
>radio is a mature technology.
Says who? Glassmaking has been around for millennia, there have been important advances even recently
>there is almost nothing new that is "coming".
It's impossible to make claims like that.
>>53869707
radio run on waves, those have been scientifically proved and tested. Nothing more can be sucked out of thin air.
>>53869740
>radio run on waves, those have been scientifically proved and tested. Nothing more can be sucked out of thin air.
>every technological advance is impossible and has always been because the physical fabric of the universe is the same now as it was in the past
See how crazy this sounds?
>>53867817
>ham radio is the original 4chan.
Dude, I can't believe how true this is. My friends and I were out at an airsoft game a few years back, using FRS/GRMS radios, and we somehow ended up on a channel where we were picking up a bunch of HAMs. They were on about all kinds of weird shit, and if you'd told me that it was a bunch of old guys reading /r9k/ out loud, I just about would have believed it.
>>53868297
They were like $500 new just a few weeks ago.
I'd imagine the price will go way up, when Yaesu discontinued their FT-897 the prices shot way up too, as it's also pretty unique.
I'm going to buy a few extra R-20 lithium batteries even though they are pricey. I'm still on the original battery I got with the unit back in like 2004 or something, and it still runs the thing for a full 2 days, so stock up now eh.
Also it's the last of the handheld form factor radios that will record (up to an hour?) too. This is extremely handy.
>>53868506
>and sending out an encrypted message to a repeater? That would be awesome
That's illegal, sorry.
Nonham detected. No encryption or code-talking allowed.
>>53869925
>500$
There's yer problem
>>53869941
I'm not HAM, but I did study to be one... yeah, sorry, I know all comms are open. But I was talking more in the range of a small open spectrum, like wifi, where shit like that would be allowed.
>>53868509
Yeah I have maxed out the unit. With the optional roofing filters, battery charger / holder / real-time clock, 2m board, internal tuner, px3, external matching amp and its tuner I'm in like $4000 or so.
I probably have $15000 worth of radio gear.
I'm all about the stealthy small rigs and physically small antennas and stuff.
>>53868473
Please go to eham.net and choose practice exams from the left sidebar, then choose the Technician exam and practice it until you can pass. It's pretty easy but you will have to learn some basic electronics like ohm's law and so on.
Then you go down to the local testing center with your $15 and get your license.
>>53869036
>How many people are able to connect to one BBS at the same time? Just one?
I *KNOW* there are TNC's which support multi-'line' operation on multiple frequencies with multiple transceivers at once, but other than knowing they exist I can't help you.
There is a packet radio mailing list and I'm sure they would be able to help you more than I. Sorry.
>>53869949
>There's yer problem
Why's this a problem?
It's cheap for what you get, at this point you can't even get anything like it any more.
>>53869975
Why even focus on the encryption? If you're doing anything non-ham that needs encrypting it's pretty much incidental, technically.
Think more of the possibility of being free from the fucking phone and broadband companies.
>>53869036
Depends on the hardware. With modern radio technology (FPGA/OFDM), you could easily design a system to support hundreds if not thousands of channels with a single transceiver. I doubt any hams are currently doing that though.
>>53869779
>>ham radio is the original 4chan.
>Dude, I can't believe how true this is.
Yep, check out the nudes circa the 1950s!
>My friends and I were out at an airsoft game a few years back, using FRS/GRMS radios, and we somehow ended up on a channel where we were picking up a bunch of HAMs. They were on about all kinds of weird shit, and if you'd told me that it was a bunch of old guys reading /r9k/ out loud, I just about would have believed it.
Youtube 14.313
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PdAywng8Xg
Sorry forgot image, real rtty porn.
Literally 4chan but over the airwaves.
>>53870125
>you could easily design a system to support hundreds if not thousands of channels with a single transceiver.
Maybe not easily.
>>53870151
topkek
How did they make that in the 50s?
>>53870185
This tech is very, VERY old anon.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hellschreiber
>>53870125
>you could easily design a system to support hundreds if not thousands of channels with a single transceiver
You'd probably run into a massive problem with bandwidth if you tried to cram that many people onto one channel.
>>53870404
Who said anything about multiple "people" on a single channel? I'm talking about using modern radio techniques (OFDM) to create a multi-channel system with FFT/IFFT. The bandwidth is determined by sample rate and the number of bins in the FFT.
>>53870449
I need to stop drinking.
>>53870470
>never stopped to think about how my 802.11N router jams 150Mbps into a single 40MHz channel wider than the majority of most ham communications.
>>53867397
If you have the money, get an AirSpy:
>24-1800 MHz coverage
>12-bit ADC
>10 MSPS IQ output (which means a 10 MHz view in realtime)
>highly stable clock(0.5 ppm)
So anyway 100 years on we think our memes are dank but even telegraph operators would key down and rag-chew when there was downtime.
This is why everybody came to them for the latest news. They were the first to hear it, perhaps a couple minutes or hours later, but still long before the papers or even the railroad or coach passengers could convey information.
Hams inherited a culture from telegraphers, because morse was the ONLY (real) mode for some time, and many telegraphers became hams themselves and vice versa thanks to Uncle Sam.
>>53870449
Currently the rate for HF is limited by law to 2400 symbols per second in the USA.
Soon it will be a 3 KHz bandwidth limit alone and you can start playing with HF radio modem magic wizardry.
>>53870530
>a single 40MHz channel
That's wider than the entire long-range capable HF / MF / LF bands combined though.
You have 3Khz.
>>53870544
>>24-1800 MHz coverage
>no HF coverage, no roofing filters
into the trash it goes
>>53871049
3khz per sub-carrier. So, lets say you start with a 24.576MHz wide channel and use FFT/IFFT to split that into 8192 sub-carrier channels. Of course you will have to use some of those sub-carriers for channel estimation (equalization), but you get the idea. With modern electronics, you can easily cover the ham bands with a single transceiver as I was pointing out. Have you looked at SDR receivers? How do you think they are able to receive and transmit on all ham channels simultaneously?
>>53869975
Whether you are allowed to use encryption or not on the wifi frequencies that overlap the ham bands depends on how you are using that spectrum.
Specifically, if your usage involves modified equipment, ERP greater than the normal legal limit for consumer wireless network equipment, spread spectrum broadcast or non-standard modulation then your broadcast falls under Part 97 rules and encryption would not be permitted.
Encryption is permitted only if your usage falls under part 15 which dictates much lower power limitations and requires part 15 compliant hardware that wasn't hacked together by some ham in their spare time.
>>53871279
stupid regulations
I WANT MY LIBERTARIAN DREAM, DAMN IT
>>53871395
Real libertarians achieve their dreams without worrying about regulations.
>>53871395
No, it's to keep abusive asshats from wrecking the only internationally accepted experimental radio spectrum available. There are mesh networking projects that dictate the use of ham spectrum for data transfer but encryption is not a requirement. Some of it is used for emergencies and other times for mutual testing of bench equipment. In practice its most often the latter.
The only time anyone should be blatantly fucking this up is if they're in a dire emergency and their only mode of communications is whatever is available short of smoke signals and homing pigeons.
>smoke signals and homing pigeons.
So, basically ham radio.
It's sounds like a piece of shit why should I care
>>53871175
>receive
yes
>and transmit on all ham channels simultaneously?
no
>>53871279
Yeah that's a neat trick that I love but Wifi is pretty short range even with high power.
>>53871762
>It's sounds like a piece of shit why should I care
It's great and the last of its kind for now.
>>53873572
Sure, "receiver" was typo. Should be transceiver. You can easily transmit on all ham channels simultaneously with even modest hardware these days using FPGA to do IFFT and D/A converter. Combine that with one of the other gifts staring hams in the face called CODEC2, and you would have something worth talking about.
>>53873705
>You can easily transmit on all ham channels simultaneously with even *easily*
see there's that word again
just no
Even if you can you don't usually want to.
>>53873705
Codec2 is cool, there's a real possibility there. It can be extended or improved hopefully in the future too.
>>53867397
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vPs8GBrjmrU
>>53873855
The multi-channel discussion began with someone asking if a wireless-based BBS could serve multiple clients over-the-air simultaneously. The answer is yes. It is probably beyond typical hams capability, but we all use OFDM and FDD every single day. Your cell phone and WiFi router does this to increase throughput and reduce multi-path issues. In the case of the BBS question, the sub-carriers could all carry different codec streams or even different individual modulations.
