You don't seriously support net neutrality, do you?
Who /cruzmissile/ here?
Are Canadians allowed to be president now? We should have read NAFTA closer.
>>53277079
>not wanting obamacare for the internet
>>53277079
oh look another politician sperging nonsense with no facts or research to back up his claims; Is badmouthing things and hoping that'll plant the idea in peoples minds that. 'because someone said bad things about it, it must be true' the only way these people can get any attention anymore?
>>53277328
Who needs facts to back up claims when you're paid to said what the lobby tells you.
What is wrong with ISPs not being able to give one website preferential treatment over the other? What is wrong with all websites being treated equally?
>>53277518
>All websites are equal
>There is no proof of superior and inferior websites existing
>Wanting Obamacare (more like Shitcare amirite?) on the Internet.
>Choking on the bluepill this hard
Hola reddito
Net neutrality wouldn't even need to be a thing if the ISPs weren't colluding with the state to create local monopolies.
>>53277518
It's hurting the market and doesn't give customers choice over which product get.
It also forces people to pay for things they don't need.
>supporting state run ISP that encourage price fixing.
>>53277594
>It's hurting the market and doesn't give customers choice over which product get.
People in many areas only have one ISP to choose from. In those areas, prices are high due to lack of competition where the ISP has free reign to do whatever they want and the customer has no choice but to comply silently.
>>53277518
Nothing.
Everything's wrong with the opposite actually.
ISPs can blackmail companies into paying to have a better treatment and not get slowed down.
ISPs can decide what news/informations to deliver to their customers by slowing down the connection to some resources while maintaining unthrottled connections to others.
>>53277560
>this level of retardation
>this level of lobby dicksucking
What are you even doing on /g/?
You do realize that without net neutrality a site like 4chan would be the first to be throttled to hell since there is no big ads company profiting from it, right?
>>53277594
I wish i could get a discount for disabling any access to fagbook and all the social normie shit.
>>53277594
You do realize that without net neutrality ISP can fuck their customers any way they want and all you said is actually in favour of net neutrality?
>It also forces people to pay for things they don't need
How has this anything to do with net neutrality?
>>53277621
>he doesn't want faster netflix speeds
>he doesn't want slower 4chan speeds so he can leave this shithole
>he doesn't want faster porn speeds
>he wants huffingtonpost to have "same" speeds as his CP sites
get a load of this shithead
>>53277641
that would be pretty great honestly
Aren't you worried that this is the kind of shit they'll eventually use to kill file sharing?
I don't result know much about this issue, but isn't it akin to someone charging money for certain books at a library just because they're more popular?
>letting ISPs arbitrarily set up toll gates around other businesses will result in more competition
This guy is a complete sleazeball, it's no wonder he can't even get along with other republicans
>>53277656
tbqhwyf
they're going to kill file sharing regardless of NN or whatever other shit comes up
it's only a matter of time before we have to literally scan our fingerprint to access files that have been exclusively stated to only work with our fingerprint
>>53277654
>netflix
cuck
>porn
>paying for porn
>>53277673
>paying for porn
nigger we're talking about download and/or website access not explicitly about pay4porn sites lmao
>>53277654
fag
>>53277656
ISPs have no interest in filesharing. It benefits them, in fact.
The only precedent that needs to be set is to make ISPs absolutely unaccountable for the traffic they transmit. This means no logs, no tracking and no metadata.
This will probably never happen under an authoritarian regime such as the Republicans or Democrats.
>>53277689
hi jamal what's up
>>53277654
It's not about what I want.
It's about what is right.
My wanting faster speed for x and not caring about slower speed for y can clash with another guy wanting faster speed for y and slower for x.
You have to account for everyone.
Arbitrary deciding who deserves more internet is wrong, regardless of what they decide.
>>53277641
You do realize that you would have to pay more to un-throttle some website you care, and not pay less since website you don't care are throttled, right?
>>53277621
[spoiler]I was spretending to be a /pol/turd cruzbot, lad[/spoiler]
>>53277725
But what if people want the choice? Why are you against people personalizing their usage?
>>53277079
>"Obamacare for the Internet"
lol wut
These conservacucks are getting pretty desperate.
>>53277753
lmao the past month they've nonstop been raging against trump, literally using any and all buzzwords to get people to vote for the establishment. It's only a matter of time before they start calling trump himself Obamacare.
What does Hillary think about net neutrality?
>>53277787
Hillary doesn't think. She looks at how net neutrality polls and crunches the numbers and comes to whatever conclusion is most suitable.
I really would like to hear why people are against NN.
Why aren't these people also against regulations that prohibit local governments from rolling out their own wires/service ?
>>53277753
Because its all about how you word things..
like take for example the estate tax, it literally only applies to amounts in the millions but call it a "death tax" and then you got the proles voting against it
>>53277737
But that's what you're against, you troll. By removing net neutrality, you basically suppress the diversification of web pages, thus limiting peoples choices, as new websites with little influence get less bandwidth and/or extra charges, making content creation harder for people other than those who pay protection money to the ISP.
>>53277831
Protection money is just a boogeyman.
>>53277787
hold up lemme search her emails
>>53277654
>faster Netflix speeds
Actually its more like paying extra so they dont throttle Netflix
>>53277857
hot
>>53277560
>authoritarian == leftist
fuck off, retard.
>>53277881
hi authoritarian leftist
>>53277594
A public ISP actually isn't a bad idea at all. Many of them have capless gigabit internet, something many private companies don't even want to go for.
>Chattanooga's super-fast publicly owned Internet
http://money.cnn.com/2014/05/20/technology/innovation/chattanooga-internet/
>City-run ISP makes 10Gbps available to all residents and businesses
http://arstechnica.com/business/2015/09/city-run-isp-makes-10gbps-available-to-all-residents-and-businesses/
>101 US Cities Have Pledged to Secure High Speed Internet
https://motherboard.vice.com/read/101-us-cities-have-pledged-to-build-their-own-gigabit-networks
>Where broadband is a utility, 100Mbps costs just $40 a month
http://arstechnica.com/business/2015/08/how-a-small-city-offers-60-gigabit-fiber-with-no-taxpayer-subsidies/
Meanwhile, in corporate land...
>No need for speed: Cable industry opposes 25Mbps broadband definition
http://arstechnica.com/business/2015/01/no-need-for-speed-cable-industry-opposes-25mbps-broadband-definition/
>AT&T and Verizon say 10Mbps is too fast for “broadband,” 4Mbps is enough
http://arstechnica.com/business/2014/09/att-and-verizon-say-10mbps-is-too-fast-for-broadband-4mbps-is-enough/
>Frontier CEO: 6 Mbps Just Fine For Most People
https://www.dslreports.com/shownews/Frontier-CEO-6-Mbps-Just-Fine-For-Most-People-124357
Reminder that Ted Cruz is partially responsible for having the US govt "shutdown" and having the US' credit rating downgraded.
>>53277889
>meanwhile in corporate land
>leaves out google fiber
ho ho ho
>>53277079
>ISPs cucking software companies
no thanks.
>Obamacare for the Internet
>>53277909
Google Fiber is not that bad, but it is not available everywhere and cable ISPs are fighting tooth and nail to keep them out so they can continue charging users higher prices for slower capped internet and never improve.
>>53277258
Good goy
>>53277909
Not available in my city nor do they have any plans to ever come.
>>53277518
No one said about websites themselves being equal.
What NN is about is access to these sites being equal.
>What is wrong with ISPs not being able to give one website preferential treatment over the other?
The problem is that who ever has deeper pockets can make sure their competitor never gets off the ground.
Imagine if wallyworld paid ISPs (or struck some deal) to make sure its streaming service was flawless and netflix because it lacks the resources can't pay for that.
A more likely outcome would be something with wireless data caps, what if FB partners up with carriers and says access to its site will be free for all users, everything else people need to pay money for out of their own pockets. How is a competitor supposed to compete against that ? you could easily crush any fledgling company like that.
>>53277737
I'm all for giving people the choice. That's why I am in favour net neutrality.
With no neutrality what makes you think that people would have the choice?
ISP would have the choice, not the customers, as it always is.
They could speed the connections to the service that pay their blackmail, while crushing the speed to sites that can't afford it like 4chan.
Or even sites that the ISP arbitrarily decides is not worth.
Neutrality ensures that you have the same possibilty of watching shota hentai or a political debate. Thus, more choice.
>>53277935
>>53277909
http://www.lightwaveonline.com/articles/2016/02/at-t-sues-city-of-louisville-over-google-fiber-pole-attachment-rules.html
>>53277935
>not that bad
It's pretty damn great. Now if only the market was actually fair and google (or anyone like them who wanted to achieve the same) didn't have to go through a shitload of government obstacles + giant ISPs just to lay down some framework.
>>53277950
it's ok anon im sure you're loved by someone somewhere...
>>53277621
So you're saying I would get back the last6 years I've spent on here? Shit I'm in
>>53277889
Do you need that speed or uncapped bandwidth? no.
Meanwhile tax dollars are wasted on a company that will never have to turn a profit, just so you can download warez and CP.
Here's a quick net neutrality guide:
ISPs don't want it ergo it's a good idea.
>>53277904
Based. I'm voting for him now
>>53277986
realistically tax dollars are literally the worst system in existence, wholly ineffective, completely unsustainable.
>tfw you will never get to abolish taxes as they currently are
>allow people to opt into things that actually impact them
>ie if you take pub transit, you pay a tax for such, but no actual transit fare to get on
>>53277989
hidey ho reddito
>>53277079
Net Neutrality essentially says that a the internet is a utility and allows the government to impose regulations on it. So choice is an illusion, either the companies get to decide, or the government gets to decide. At least with a company you can vote with your wallet, when the government is in charge you have no say.
>>53277594
>What's wrong with letting people set up turnpikes on public roads?
Of course I am for state sponsored and run ISPs. The private sector is dogshit when it comes to infrastructure. Not to say competition shouldn't be allowed, though.
>>53277986
todays power users are tomorrows average family
anyways NN isn't about the speed at which your ISP provides to you, its about access to websites/services.
>>53277986
Do you need glass on your windows?
Do you need hot running water?
Do you need tasty food?
>>53278030
Honestly thinking that the government wouldn't restrict access to information once the internet was classified as a utility.
>>53278014
what are you talking about ? it seems like you're trying to argue a completely different point.
>>53278020
competition in a statesponsored (not just regulated!) industry doesn't make sense
to be effective, the state needs total control over the industry, and thus any actual competition would be on another level
>>53278013
Figuratively you are a faggot.
>>53277986
>Do you need that speed or uncapped bandwidth? no.
Who do you think you are and why do you think you can tell other people what they need? Maybe he uses netflix, that shit eats up bandwidth like nothing else. It's like 1/3rd of the US' bandwidth consumption by itself IIRC
>>53277847
>no one with absolute power would ever abuse it for profit.
>>53278045
Then classify it as a right. Put it in the fucking constitution.
>this thread
I don't know who is baiting who anymore.
>>53278051
Project less.
>>53278060
put CP in the fucking constitution
>>53278059
>so let's give absolute power over to the state
>>53278034
desu I agree with the pic
or at least limit them to tracks
>>53278045
I think thats too much slippery slope right there.
anyways we are talking about equal access to sites not which sites are illegal/bad/whatever.
NN is not about making sure sites stay online or taking down the bad ones, its simply to make sure that no site/business has preferential treatment over another one.
Let consumers pick the winners, not companies with deep wallets.
>>53277977
Nobody will give those back, and you know it.
I'm sorry.
>>53277986
My "uncapped" bandwidth is 6Mb/s
Yes, I need it all.
Also where the hell did you get the idea that NN means that the state is an ISP payed with taxes?
NN is a law that impose that current ISP have to grant the same speed to all sites without putting up roadblocks on the roads to certain locations.
NN is for letting the internet continue to function as it is now.
Maybe I'm starting to understand why morons are so afraid of NN, because they have no idea of what it is and base their opinions on uninformed biased crap spouted by some politician paid from lobbies.
>>53277986
>need
Authoritarian price gouger spotted
>>53278079
With NN the state wouldn't have absolute power, the state wouldn't own the wires. The state would have the power to settle disputes between different entities same as before but there's an expectation that all businesses would be treated the same way regardless of who they are.
>>53278090
>spouts uninformed biased crap spouted by tech lobbies
>gets mad others do the same but with ISP lobbies
loving
every
laugh
>>53278105
NN isn't the point of discussion in what I was referencing actually. I was focusing on those who believe a state owned & ran industry is actually beneficial.
NN is fine.
>>53278102
Is that you Heaven?
did goot let you into /j/ again, or is your linkedin embellished with another moderator status?
>>53278107
NN is the status quo anon. It's how the internet functioned from the earliest times on telephone wires all the way up to now basically. What the ISPs want and what Ted Cruz and the other republicans are pushing for is changing that so ISPs can set up tolls
>>53278113
I agree the federal government shouldn't be in the business of running an ISP, but what about local governments?
>>53278062
I don't think too many people are actually baiting.
Libertarians really do hate their freedoms and want to become isp cucks.
>>53278161
we can't have that.. too much competition, besides people only want 5-10mbit internet and are OK with it
>>53277079
in a regular market he'd be right, but currently the state has set up ISP monopolies in many areas because they're fucking retarded. Handing over all that power to the ISP is ridiculous. Net neutrality is a necessary evil until comcast gets broken up
>>53278161
Personally, I'm not even OK with that because my local government are absolute crooks and fuck up anything and everything. How the fuck do you even fuck up basic energy? Well my local government has.
What we currently have is unsatisfactory as well, a handful of companies that control internet access and pricing, with huge barriers of entry. Overall, I suppose if push comes to shove, I'm OK with local governments controlling the wires, with a basic internet service (ie no unlimited data or insane speeds, but is a given), and easy entry for businesses to gain access to the wires and resell them - whether that's Mom&Pop shops or Google.
>>53278192
>state has set up ISP monopolies in many areas because they're fucking retarded.
thank you based lobbyists
>>53278050
In America, we have public roads and toll roads. We have Social Security and Retirement funds. We have public school and private school.
Government ISPs should be set up as non profits, providing an affordable baseline standard with NN, no data caps, etc. Private companies would be allowed to eschew these principles, with the challenge of creating a service more alluring. This way, you can try your retard Non Neutral policy without causing any actual harm.
>le govt is bad meme
>>53278114
Kek. I saged a consumer tech thread, and I just wanted that OP to know. I forgot to clear the name field after though.
>>53278215
>roads
>the gov cant even bother fixing up roads when it's the most simple task
>social security and retirement
>he isn't aware of le boomer crisis gov is freaking out about constantly
>schools
>he is unaware of how shit and incomplete education is
Thanks for making my point for me - when gov gets too involved, they fuck everything right up.
>>53277560
god i hate obamacare
people litearlly refuse my insurance because i got it from healthcare.gov
like why force me to pay $250 a month for insurance i cannot ever use
good fucking idea
>>53278203
A couple similar systems was implemented near where I live, both have has a history of mismanagement. One is still operating but the other smaller one ended up being sold to Google.
>>53277079
Oh how cute! He still thinks he has a shot at beating The Donald. It's good to have aspirations, no matter how delusional they are. That's what's great about America. Even illegal immigrants like Teddy "the Wetback" Cruz can come here and feel like they belong and can usurp our highest political offices. For now anyway. The Donald is going to build a nice wall to keep these terrorist low-lives the fuck out. I guess Cruz will wish he'd chosen to serve Jesus instead of the Pope, or Mohammad, or whoever it is that his kind worships. God bless America.
>>53278247
not american, but is that even legal ?
I was under the impression obamacare basically made everyone get health insurance, but didn't actually provide any themselves, just subsidies and such.
>>53278246
>when gov gets too involved, they fuck everything right up.
so why is the state of internet speeds so shit right now ? what government involvement can be blamed for that ?
>>53278255
Yeah mismanagement is a huge factor. Kind of a shame too how even the most basic of things that we think should be easy enough to handle, are so mismanaged. Has google utilized that infrastructure in your area or have they just kept it for personal/private use now?
>>53278279
Yeah actually. They're complacent in letting ISPs price fix.
>>53278279
Internet infrastructure is to some extent a natural monopoly because the barrier to entry is so high. So you end up with companies carving out regional monopolies because of lack of interest in moving into markets that already have competition.
>>53278246
>when gov gets too involved, they fuck everything right up.
Which is why Netflix or any other website doesn't have to pay special fees to access a "fast lane" anymore. What a calamity.
>>53278247
no, people refuse medicare because they don't pay much, not normal insurance unless you have a fucking hmo or something stupid
>>53277079
How much does Comcast pay you to suck their dick?
>>53278308
In this case I was talking about UTOPIA and iProvo fiber, iProvo being the one sold to Google and now provides fiber service.
>>53277236
Anyone can be President if you:
1. Lived in the US for the full 18 years prior to running
2. Are 35 years or older
3. Are a natural citizen, which unfortunately he is because his mother is American.
>>53278327
Netflix actually does currently pay special fees to ISPs though...
>>53278279
The ISPs lobbied hard to get their monopoly set up.
The reason the government can't be trusted is because corporations have bought the government, however, this doesn't mean that no government is the answer.
Without government interference corporations would just make themselves into monopolies regardless. This whole thing is 'but now we have to spend MORE money on lobbying politicians to write parts of the laws so we can do what we want anyway'
>>53278246
You forget that before the government offered those services, most people couldn't afford to travel, couldn't get an education beyond simple arithmetic, and moved in with their children in their old age (not that that is really a bad thing).
Government regulation is what makes a middle class, you dip.
>>53278247
no one is forcing you. you just don't get a tax break for healthcare if you don't have healthcare. you can look at it as a fine for not having healthcare but in the end it's the same thing. you can save money by not having healthcare if you want, the break/fine is still cheaper than "paying for insurance you cannot ever use" (which is bullshit but I'll play along)
>>53278308
>complacent
wait, what ?
So what you're saying.. is too much government is bad.. but now the government isn't doing anything.. so thats bad too ?
>>53278316
I understand your point and I agree with what you said, but it doesn't answer the second question about what has government done to make it so shit ? because the first anon was trying to make the point that government intervention is what fucks everything up.
>>53278382
The middle class is dead, get over it.
>>53278386
Siding with ISPs is NOT "doing nothing". They're taking a side, they have been taking sides this entire time.
>>53278260
>yfw you swim across the St. Louis river to become president, only to be cucked by a meme
Captcha: rivers
>>53278386
Well in the case of natural monopolies the government usually has some sort of pricing controls put in place, but I don't know if thats a realistic solution in this case. In some instances local governments are lobbied by ISPs to stop competition.
One specific instance of this brings me back to UTOPIA which our local ISP lobbied against, saying they would roll out better internet service if the city didn't join the project, so we ended up with the most populated city in the metropolitan area being excluded from fiber rollout. In hindsight with the management issues they've had it may have been a blessing in disguise, but at the time it reeked of corruption.
>>53277889
Our local isp, the only one in the area besides satellite, has been rolling out fiber optic. Regular cable net with 15d1u is $50 no caps.
>>53278215
>Government ISPs should be set up as non profits, providing an affordable baseline standard with NN, no data caps, etc. Private companies would be allowed to eschew these principles, with the challenge of creating a service more alluring. This way, you can try your retard Non Neutral policy without causing any actual harm.
Actually not a bad idea for comprimise.
>>53278113
>I was focusing on those who believe a state owned & ran industry is actually beneficial.
It depends on the industry, frankly.
Health Care being a topic of major debate, I personally believe it's better for THE CITIZENRY that it's not run as a completely for-profit enterprise, like virtually every first world country does it, using the single-payer system. In Canada doctors and medical companies still make money, and the people are afforded a good standard of health care for a relatively inexpensive cost.
>>53278167
>Libertarians really do hate their freedoms and want to become isp cucks.
Mostly Libertarians are retards who believe that they can just 'vote with their dollar' against any big company that starts doing things they don't like, in the post-government-regulars world. Which is easier said than done. And that's not even getting into the ones who think living in a corporate oligarchy is a good thing.
murricans begging to be cucked again. nothing to see here, move along.
It's amusing that while Americans keep toting they are free and they live in a free country, absolutely everything has ridiculous conditions and people are so used to being fucked in the ass by companies and corporations that they will actually support braindead ideas like breaking net neutrality.
>But mah netflix could be faster!
Why can't you just hope for ALL of your internet to be fast? Sure I get it, if you live in the sticks, you might not have a fast landline, but can't you opt for a fast LTE connection? That's what they successfully use in remote locations in desolate Northern Europe. Download speeds up to 100 Mb/s, latency below 50ms.
>But that's expensive
So would be your non-neutral internet. First they might offer you like $10 below what you pay now, but later on they will make "improvements to the infrastructure" or some bullshit like that, all of the sudden the price hikes up by $30 but you're still stuck with a prioritized internet connection. ISPs aren't looking for your best interest, they will attempt to gouge you every chance they get. If you let them have their way, you will end up with some overly stupified service-only internet, you get an ISP approved browser with a few buttons like netflix and whatever the fuck normies pay for. Facebook gold. That will probably be a thing once all the normies get shilled by American ISPs.
There is absolutely no chance a prioritized internet would work how all the idealists think it would. It would just mean more advertisements, and with IPv6 coming, everyone will have a non-recycled IP-address. That means if you use something to bypass or block ads, your ISP will get notified and they will charge you $100 for breaking conditions, which, by no doubt will be set like that.
I enjoy my European internet more. I can torrent without really worrying about getting consequences, my privacy is respected and I don't even pay too much for it.
>>53277518
it's my hobby to make lists ranking things from best to worst
eg foods, races, websites, programming languages, races, animals...
>>53277079
#AllWebsiteMatter
tfw don't care about politics and have never and will never vote in an election
>>53279259
tfw Donald Trump becomes president and implements internet killswitch
>>53278385
you get fine like 2.5% of your income or some shit this year
$3000 a year is cheaper than $9000 a year (which yes you will be required to pay, it doesnt just come out of your taxes and they ignore the rest)
the nearest doctor that would see me with the plan i had was about 200 miles away i shit you fucking not
>>53277560
>literally being this retarded
It's not about "all websites are equal"
It's about how ACCESS to all websites should be treated equally.
Not to mention that I, as a customer, am already paying for the internet. And having all of my favorite websites get throttled and slowed down because they didn't or couldn't pay the premium bandwidth fees is unfair to ME. THE CUSTOMER who's paid for a fiber optic connection, and expects a speedy internet experience.
(fuck, trying to type with a bandaid on one of your fingers is a pain in the ass).
>>53278267
i get fined $9000 next year if i don't have health insurance
i only make 35K a year, you get fined 2.5% of your income
you have to have it for a minimum of 9 months out of the year
>>53278333
obamacare isnt medicare
two completely different things
>>53279296
Let's be real here - if that happened what of real value would be lost?
Anything of value is stored at universities and they have their own networks
>>53278180
>and are OK paying $80 for it
>>53279328
I feel bad that you make more money than me while thinking $9000 is 2.5% of 35k
some ISP already have monopolies and abuse them, why would Americans willingly give them more power over your connection
you'd have to be a cuck of cosmic magnitudes
>>53279328
i wasn't talking about fines and it being illegal, i was talking about them refusing your insurance
You guys should have gotten universal health care long time ago
>>53279358
somehow
my dumbass has been doing percentage math wrong for a long time
fuck
i'm sure something's not working right at the last company i worked for now
whatever
I know it's bait, but it's good bait.
The government is expected to try and turn internet to TV. Few easily controlled channels of information.
You have absolutely no motivation to go along.
You only have to lose.
>>53279386
You can't compel a private citizen to perform labor for you. We wrote laws against that more than a century ago.
If we want to make doctors into government employees, that's a whole other can of worms that will require reforming the way universities work, as medical school would need to be paid for through tax revenues or we would never have enough doctors if all they get is government paygrades.
>>53279506
I don't think anyone is proposing making doctors government employees.
I thought I was on pol for a second
>>53278350
There has been no Supreme Court decision on "Natural Born Citizen". If he is elected, someone could try to sue him out of office.
>>53278406
It doesn't have to be. If we just eradicate the colored and give unions teeth again.
>>53277847
Oh yeah? I guess that case where comcast fucked netflix over was just a boogeyman, too?
http://qz.com/256586/the-inside-story-of-how-netflix-came-to-pay-comcast-for-internet-traffic/
>>53277769
Cruz already beat you to it. Last night he gave a butthurt speech about how he was going to keep on fighting no matter what, because Trump is exactly like Obama--hates Jesus, hates the second amendment, hates the constitution, loves Obamacare, loves illegal immigrants, wants to force you to be gay...It's just fucking horrible, but luckily he's going to continue being a lolcow and fighting the good fight, like the delusional faggot he is.
Trump may make a shitty president, but the man is a fucking hero. He's the reason Ted Cruz, and Jeb Bush will never be president. He's very likely the reason Hillary won't ever be either. This country should be thanking him for this. I don't care what your politics are, he's already done you a tremendous service.
>>53277079
Why the fuck wouldn't I? I just love getting a fraction of my downspeed because I'm streaming a video
>>53278350
I'd like to point out that, if 3 is accurate, then Obama's presidency would remain legitimate if he had been born in Kenya.
Funny how so much of the country changed their opinion of what a "natural born US citizen" means.
>>53279701
>Scalia was someone who believed "natural born citizen" meant being born in the US.
>people still believe it was natural causes
