Is this seriously the worst language ever conceived?
Or is it just my imagination that websites have been getting slower and slower for the past couple of years.
if websites do it correctly then only the initial load should be slow, the rest should only be API calls which should be very fast and lightweight.
100% of javascript is unnecessary
>>52081369
>slower and slower
to a fucking crawl sometimes
>>52081399
>only the initial load
initial load of unnecessary shite that usually detracts from the intractability
>>52081399
I'm not a smart man. But shouldn't that initial load be asynchronous, i.e. unnoticeable in the background?
>>52081416
I am not counting any ads or other shitty scripts.
Initial load as in their MVC framework.
Around 1.3MB or so of JS/images/fonts etc on the inital load.
The next calls can be less than a kilobyte depending on content.
>>52081437
a lot of modern pages render with javascript, so the framework needs to load first to be able to display/do anything.
PHP is worse. ES6 and 7 are actually somewhat decent. Use Typescript and you have a good language.
The worst parts of it are cross browser inconsistencies, legacy browsers not supporting certain things and the fact that most web APIs are ridiculously poorly designed, but that is not the fault of JavaScript.
>>52081369
JS is okay i guess
i just don't like the JS-for-everything approach a lot of sites now use. using a couple of ajax APIs to fetch data is good, but rendering the whole page in JS sucks.
>>52081551
it's the best thing ever.
>>52081515
>a lot of modern pages render with javascript, so the framework needs to load first to be able to display/do anything.
This is pretty much why Node is starting to dominate in the backend. Yes, of course there are amateurs who think that learning 2 different languages is hard and that's why they choose Node. However, people who use Facebook's react or Google's Angular 2, want to pre-render their components on the server, so the initial page isn't blank until the server downloads all the assets and executes all the scripts, which takes forever.
websites have been getting slower but that's more because of shitty web development than due to javascript itself. javascript is actually very fast (it's the fastest interpreted language, and it's about half as fast as C++).
the problem is javascript is a pain in the ass to use. a lot of web developers rely on frameworks and libraries that make it easier to use, but are slower.
Javascript is an okay language. Some really stupid design decisions are in there but basically every language has that.
>>52081573
The line of thinking that learning two languages to do webdev is too hard boggles my fucking mind. How do they interface with the database? Orm only, you make me write a query and I scream?
>>52081597
nosql :^)
>>52081606
Basically this and the ORM only approach.
>>52081551
I switched from firefox to chrome because depending on noscripts to increase internet speed made me look like an autist somewhere around 2011.
>>52081606
FUCK YOU
>>52081515
>Around 1.3MB or so of JS/images/fonts etc on the inital load.
>Around 1.3MB or so of JS/images/fonts etc on the inital load.
>Around 1.3MB or so of JS/images/fonts etc on the inital load.
Web is dead, kill me now.
The language it self isn't that bad, not great but it works. How JavaScript developers use it has massive problems. Layer after layer of abstraction to 'render' a page with absolutely no benefit. All their doing is dynamically creating a document every time someone views it because they are fucking morons who have never heard of a cache.
>>52081399
In theory but not in use.
>>52081524
>PHP is worse.
No. JavaScript is on the same tier as php. After I check out PHP 7 it may be on a worse tier.
>>52081573
Which has absolutely nothing to do with node.
>>52081592
>it's the fastest interpreted language
I thought that was lua.
>>52081369
>muh bootstrap
>muh angular
>muh ember
>muh framework dot io garbage
this is why it's shit
try to resize your browser on "modern" websites and you'll see how bad the HipJSter trend is.
JavaScript suffers from "shit developers writing shit code read by shittier developers blaming shit code on the language." Same with Java, which actually has a lot of potential to be an elegant language, but has a few messy libraries.
C is actually the worst at this, with developers who use the most cryptic variable names and spam underscores everywhere or use macros instead of inlines, but no one ever dares to blame the language.
C# avoids this by having a neat standard library and not being taught at unis, basically anyone using it is a veteran coder, thus people are actually deluded enough to believe C# is a better language than Java, despite having only a few extras.
>>52082462
>I thought that was lua.
I find that hard to believe since all you need is a good JIT to make any language interpreted. Is Lua faster than, say, SBCL?
>>52081524
>ES6 decent
No it isn't. They added the Class keyword but they omitted to add private methods. WHAT IS THE FUCKING POINT OF A CLASS IF YOU CANT HAVE PRIVATES god damn it just fucking kill yourself JS fags it goes against the definition of a class you fucking pathetic piece of retarded shit
>PHP is worse
Nigger just STFU. JS is nowhere near as good as PHP. See above. Also PHP7 is pretty fast. Inb4 Pajeet.
>>52081524
>>52082892
Also
>ES7
They somewhat replaced/enhanced array.indexOf with array.includes. They didn't name it .contains or .has but fucking INCLUDES. I wish people writing this shit would just kill themself. This is proof niggers are actually participating in this piece of shit language.
>>52082992
there's a ES7 already?
what the fuck give us a fucking break
>>52082997
It's like 4 or 5 retarded functions added it to so far, nothing major
>>52083090
ok nice
>>52082827
>basically anyone using it is a veteran coder,
Just started coding C# as my first language some months ago and it's not that hard tbqh.
>>52083573
No... Programming in general isn't hard if you're that kind of person.
Most people start with Java (android), python or JavaScript (web) though. Python makes it difficult to write bad code and JavaScript and Java have "that" problem. C# is uncommon to start in, because idiots actually think it's "boring", but companies always ask for it and only hire people with 5+ experience. You can put two and two together.
In reality every language newer than C99 can not be honestly described as difficult.
Want a challenging language? Sorry, why aren't you using assembler? Even then you can almost write ARM as C code, if a beautiful assembler language could exist.... Although in reality it's just benefiting from all the hindsight of PIC, atmel and x86.
>>52083753
I like C# because compared to Javascript it seems more orderly(?)
I like to type float, int, bool etc. instead of just var because it makes it easier for me to see what I am doing and it pleases my autism.
>>52082997
TC39 allows for incremental releases of JS features.
In general, new methods get approved immediately.
>>52082462
No, PHP is far worse and always will be.
At least javascript has well defined APIs, PHP is all over the fucking place and makes no sense.
Not to mention all the fucking annoying quirks that shouldn't exist (string "0" evaluates to false while any other nonempty string evaluates to true, etc)
>>52081369
CLIENT SIDE ADVERTISING, MARKETING AND NSA GRADE TRACKING FRAMEWORK
there are a million ways to this better than what we have
I fucking hate js
>>52085775
>At least javascript has well defined APIs
>>52085775
I never said PHP was good, just that JavaScript is probably worse. But considering your reaction, I'm now sure that is worse. In fact its probably the worst programming language ever made. You have literally wasted your time with some meme tier kiddy level scripting language when you could have been using a real language like intercal.
Yes, it makes slow frameworks and puts unnecessary strain on the client, especially mobile.
Can someone make a /wdg/?
>>52085775
Anonymous
12/27/15(Sun)10:28:42 No.52085775
>>52082462 (You)
>No, PHP is far worse and always will be.
JavaScript is the new PHP so how can it be worse than itself?
>At least javascript has well defined APIs,
Well defined you say?
>PHP is all over the fucking place and makes no sense.
You can't understand it?
>Not to mention all the fucking annoying quirks that shouldn't exist
Are you talking about JavaScript or PHP here?
> (string "0" evaluates to false while any other nonempty string evaluates to true
Are you talking about JavaScript or PHP here?
>>52086524
Wow, the vodka and cranberry juice did
its job. That was all a reply to this >>52085775 homosexual.
>>52085775
>justifying Javascript's faults by listing PHP as worse
>>52081369
>Or is it just my imagination that websites have been getting slower and slower for the past couple of years.
That's because of offsite scripts, not Javascript in general.
>>52086923
Yeah but it's still JS.
>>52088863
Just because shitty devs use the language in ways it isn't supposed to be used and clearly doesn't work well (massive bloated frameworks that do useless shit like rendering your entire fucking page) instead of using it for shit that it works with like lightweight dom manipulation and interaction with the user.
>>52088863
>>52089125
Doesn't make the language itself bad.
JS isn't fast when compared to some other languages which becomes even more noticeable when you're loading the massive multiple MB frameworks over a slow mobile connection and use the site on an old device that doesn't really have enough power to run the massive framework, especially if they have multiple tabs open.
>>52089125
I'm sorry but it does. Languages constantly evolve, not just because of developers but by the people who use it. Frameworks, libraries, modules are all part of the language. It's the same reason companies still use C++ for video game development, because every single shit has already been done before and there are libraries for EVERYTHING. It plays a huge part in how a language is conceived and worked with. But as usual the Javascript defense force is in full power today I guess.
