I've been told that the bench press is not actually the most effective movement for building hypertrophy in the chest, and that it works more your shoulders and triceps
What would you replace it with?
>>36835129
try benching 2 plaets for 12 reps and see for yourself
OH wait, you cant lol
you dont need to replace it.
its a fine exercise.
keep doing it and add some dips or flies or someshit to help with the chest.
>>36835139
What would the amount of weight have to do with anything you fucking casual
>>36835129
Nothing, bench press is the best. You got trolled
Step 1: get hook piercings in your nipples.
Step 2: attach weights to hooks.
Step 3: flex chest muscles 10-12 reps
Or you can recognize all chest exercises will hit your arms as well. Hands ae what you grab things with and they are attached to the arms.
>>36835158
This has to be one of the dumbest things I've ever read.
>>36835158
More tonage moved is more work. More work requires more muscle fibers, more muscle fibers used means more muscle fibers that need repaired. More muscle fibers repaired is more gains.
>>36835220
That's completely subjective to the individual's strength you moron
>>36835190
sounds like that torture device from saw
Although i love binch press, my chest honestly seems to look most asthetic after incline dumbell presses.
dumbbell pullovers are the most slept on chest movement
Overrated exercise hijacked by idiots who hurt themselves doing more weight they can handle for 1-3 reps.
Dips, push ups, dumbell flys(good form) and you can skip the bench easily and avoid the gay bromance that occurs around it.
>>36835129
A correctly performed bench press is almost assuredly the "best" mass-builder for chest. The problem is that lots of people do not bench correctly, nor do they ever make an effort to learn to do so.
>>36835129
Cable flies isolate chest really well
>>36835490
>what do you bench, man?
>oh well I can currently do weighted dips with 100 pounds plus my bodyweight of course for seven reps
The truth is that bench hits as much lats as it does hit pecs.
Fit doesnt know shit
>>36835736
Aw man, it would totally suck to have big lats. Bench a shit. I'll stick to fries from now on.
>>36835129
If it hits delts and triceps more than chest you're doing it wrong
>>36835848
you would stick to fries you fat piece of shit
go be fat on the bench press and maybe your fat titties and fat face will go away fatty
>>36835251
Which is why you should do SS first
D U M B B E L L B E N C H P R E S S
>>36835736
Is there any truth to this pic or is it more bro science.
>>36835220
if I benched the bar enough so I'm doing the same amount of work as someone benching 2pl8 for 12 reps would I get the same gains?
>>36835989
No, you'd be doing cardio.
>>36835984
yeah all they all hit the muscles they say they do,
you would know this of you actually lifted tho
>>36835989
but we are doing the same amount of work
>>36835984
I do lift I was asking more about the Pull muscle thing but thanks for being a snarky cunt
>>36836034
You're not activating the same number of muscle fibers as he is if your bench isn't as strong as his. Also if you're using the bar your rep range is going to hit levels where it's aerobic instead of anearobic and you won't make the same kind of gains mass-wise.
>>36835563
Cable flies work your bis and tris more than your chest
>>36835129
dumbbell presses. twist to supinated at end each time. destroys your chesticles.
>>36835158
confirmed not gonna make it
>>36836095
>twist to supinate and end of each rep
Great way to tear your labrum/rotator cuff you fucking idiot. Don't post advice unless u actually know how to workout fucker
>>36836134
you won't tear your rotator you dumb fuck. well, you might, since you're obviously a pussfag.
>>36836178
It must be tough being this stupid
Almost every body builder uses bench press as their main lift.
Ofcourse it would be dumb to not do accessories
>>36836320
gazillion links on dumbbell press w/ twist. look it up. really not sur how you'd tear your rotator unless you're you...
>>36835597
>Stating that weighted dips with 100 pounds added isn't more impressive than a 2pl8 bench
>unironically
Filthy casual
>>36836034
muscles respond to different challenges in different ways.
also, whoever told you that benching isn't the best way to add mass to the best isn't someone you should be taking any advice from at all because he clearly knows nothing about programming bench presses or performing them correctly.
>>36836572
This. Look at anyone with a big bench and they will have a big chest. Sure you can do more for it too, but bench is the staple compound lift that should come first and foremost
how do I min/max my gains what is best spec for chest hypertrophy?
/plg/ here, I have a huge chest, I bench three times a week. I do some bullshit flyes and dips here and there but never consistently.
>>36836517
dips with 100 pounds is easy as fuck, and dips isnt as popular as bench. Its what that anon is talking about
Because almost everybody just lies down on the bench and starts pressing, and they dont tuck their shoulder blades in. Therefore, you dont get much chestactivation.
Do heavy benching with tucked shoulder blades, add some incline db presses and youre set.
>>36836074
What the fuck kinda cable flys are you doing nigger?
>>36838053
you're*
>>36835516
>A correctly performed _______ is almost assuredly the "best" mass-builder for ______. The problem is that lots of people do not ______ correctly, nor do they ever make an effort to learn to do so.
Are you new here?
>>36835490
/thread
>>36835385
I'm having a bitch feeling the stretch when doing it.
I feel it in my triceps more than my chest.
Hell I don't feel in my chest, closest to my chest that I feel it is the seratus.
>>36838053
Thisssssss
>>36836594
>Look at anyone with a big bench and they will have a big chest
correlation =/= causation
>>36839457
Dyel
>>36835129
Welsch, E. A., Bird, M., & Mayhew, J. L. (2005). Electromyographic activity of the pectoralis major and anterior deltoid muscles during three upper-body lifts. The Journal of Strength & Conditioning Research, 19(2), 449-452.
"Based on the current EMG results, it seems that barbell and dumbbell bench presses may be used interchangeably to introduce variation to weight-training programs without reduction of muscle activation or negative transfer effects (1). Conversely, dumbbell flys might not be a lift that should be viewed as a primary exercise to target either the pectoralis major or anterior deltoid muscles, since this lift produced the shortest relative time of activation"
>>36839623
You're welcome habibis
>>36835129
The bench press can be a great exercise for two reasons:
1) It involves a huge amount of total muscle and that makes it easy to keep making progress. The more total weight you can handle through a decent range of motion, the better the exercise is as an overall mass-builder. The bench press is outstanding in this regard.
2) It lends itself well to low rep work. That means it's a good exercise for training maximal strength - something that's very impractical to do with the push-up for example.
The bench press can be a shitty exercise for two reasons:
1) It doesn't allow you to move your arms in in front of your body. What this means is that you cannot physically shorten the pectoralis major as much as would be ideal. In other words, it's impossible to get an optimal contraction.
2) It's not a very safe exercise. Although good form and structural balance play a big part, the fact of the matter is that many, many people begin to experience shoulder issues from benching.
Even if you do have great form, frequently pressing very heavy weights is simply going to beat up your shoulders and elbows. It's inevitable.
The heavy weights also take a greater toll on your CNS, compromising systemic recovery if you overdo it.
The bench press is an amazing exercise and will enable you go build good mass in your pecs and in many other places. But you don't want to bench press heavy 3 times a week; it's too stressful, on body and mind, and there'd be parts of your pecs that wouldn't get sufficiently stimulated.
Keep the bench press in your routine but always keep in mind its strengths and weaknesses. Like any other exercise it's a tool and you should use it for what it's good for and nothing else. If you're looking to add some extra work for your pecs, more bench pressing isn't the answer (it can work, but there are far better options). I recommend push-ups on rings (focus on getting a good stretch and try to come in so close that your biceps almost "kiss eachother").
>>36835984
Saved
When I get fatigued on bench my right arm slows down before the lockout and locks out after the left one. I've also noticed when I do a double bicep flex in the mirror that my right delt is smaller than my left.
Are these related?
>>36839623
>dumbbell flys might not be a lift that should be viewed as a primary exercise to target either the pectoralis major or anterior deltoid muscles, since this lift produced the shortest relative time of activation"
What about cable flies? They give you more activation since the cables are constantly pulling with tension, right?
>>36835158
has to be bait
>>36839802
start jacking off with your right hand
>>36840358
But I've already done that for like a decade
>>36839646
you dont even mention the dumbbell press fucker
>>36835984
what a joke
>>36840484
There are a lot of exercises that I don't mention. Dumbbell presses are fine. They're a lot like the barbell press though - a bit safer and a potentially greater ROM, but all in all very similar exercises.
Probably the best exercise are good old weighted dips, but they require so much shoulder mobility that it's not a good exercise to recommend to the average guy.
>>36835129
Bench Press is the best for chest development but that doesn't mean it's not great to throw in an isolation or two. According to this chart Pec Deck/Fly Machine and Cable Crossover would be the best options.
My chest day is as follows:
>Bench Press
OHP
Dips
>Pec Fly Machine
Upright Rows
Overhead Triceps Extensions
>>36835251
lol what
>>36835984
saved
>>36835139
>2 plaets
how much is this in kg?
>>36836397
Good, keep doing it dumbfuck
>>36840673
80kg
>>36835158
>What would the amount of weight have to do with anything you fucking casual
>you fucking casual
Spot the DYEL.
>>36839646
>Talks about bench snapping shoulders
> recommends push-ups on rings
>>36835129
Do paused bench rather than touch and go for epic chest gains and prove everyone who told you that wrong
>>36840771
100 you mongeloid
>>36840345
I don't know but they sure as fuck feel a lot better and more effective.
>>36836397
Why the fuck would you supinate your hands to engage more your chest muscles? Just squeeze towards the middle if you want maxmimum chest contraction, supinated grip doesnt do shit about that.
>>36840833
Supine/reverse grip pressing is supposedly more effective for upper chest than incline pressing with a normal grip.
>>36839646
Great post, thanks bro. I will be quoting you to my friends in the future
Benching is awesome for a lot of reasons. You keep it in your routine no matter what. If you want to add volume for pec hypertrophy and growth (you probably should), use hammer strength press after your bench sets. You can then finish your workout off with cable flies.
If your chest is REALLY lagging, do this routine twice a week. If your diet is solid, growth is guaranteed.
>>36836397
i can feel my joints clicking just doing it with an empty arm in front of me, and i've got good mobility
enjoy your trip to snap city faggot
>>36836397
This is really fucking dumb. "Twisting" like that externally rotates the shoulder, effectively lengthening the pectoralis major rather than shortening it as you would want to do. In other words, you get a worse contraction. This is an objective fact.
>>36835984
>best exercises for delts
>mentions front delt heavy exercises
>nothing that hits the rear delts
pretty good if you want rolled shoulders. should be modified to add facepulls or lying lat raises
>>36840932
oh never mind it has bent over raises
>>36839646
1) It involves a huge amount of total muscle and that makes it easy to keep making progress. The more total weight you can handle through a decent range of motion, the better the exercise is as an overall mass-builder. The bench press is outstanding in this regard.
It doesnt. Overall, even a pushup has far more total muscle activation in your body than the bench press.
>2) It lends itself well to low rep work. That means it's a good exercise for training maximal strength - something that's very impractical to do with the push-up for example.
The contrary, out of all the major big lifts (OHP, deads, squats, etc), the bench press is the one that entails the more risk if you want to work on the low rep/high weight range because there is just no way for you to safely bail out a failed rep if you are alone. It's the only barbell exercise in which you can actually die from a failed rep.
>2) It's not a very safe exercise. Although good form and structural balance play a big part, the fact of the matter is that many, many people begin to experience shoulder issues from benching.
Even if you do have great form, frequently pressing very heavy weights is simply going to beat up your shoulders and elbows. It's inevitable.
The heavy weights also take a greater toll on your CNS, compromising systemic recovery if you overdo it.
Not only that, but it promotes shitty among the shittiest shoulder mechanics as you need to keep your scapulae held together (retracted) through the entire movement instead of moving freely as they should whenever you move your arms. No other lift has you forcing your scapulae to be immobile through the duration of the exercise.
I dont know where exactly it was put among the major lifts, but the bench press should be an auxilliary exercise for the chest as much as the incline or dubbell flyes are. It has no place in between the main lifts.
>>36840957
>a pushup has far more total muscle activation in your body than the bench press.
Yes and as you can see from further down my post I'm actually a big fan of push-ups. However you're missing the point, which was in the 2nd part of that sentence: "The more total weight you can handle through a decent range of motion, the better the exercise is as an overall mass-builder."
>the bench press is the one that entails the more risk if you want to work on the low rep/high weight range because there is just no way for you to safely bail out a failed rep if you are alone
Don't spread this nonsense, you scare people for no reason. Listen, I've been lifting on my own for years and the number of times I've failed a bench press can be counted on one hand (OK, maybe two hands). None of these times were I even close to actually getting hurt. Worst case scenario is the roll of shame. The fact is that the bench press is excellent for training maximal strength, regardless of whether you're scared of it or not.
>>36835984
>muscles can not push they can only pull
>goodbye quads, tris, calves ...
>to hell with PPL
>>36841019
I didn't read the graphic but I assume they're talking about the fact muscles contract, pulling on a joint. Yes your body can push, but it accomplishes this by squeezing (pulling) muscles against a joint. Next you're going to tell me that sailboats can't sail into the wind.
>>36841007
Keep doing your holy bench press and increasing the weight, dude. You'll regret it when you end up with horrible shoulders due to bad shoulder mechanics and imbalances or even worse a pectoral tear.
>>36841035
It says exactly that in the graphic. The anon you replied to is just retarded
>>36841050
You are too stupid to function
>>36840591
Let's see a pic w/ time stamp
>>36841050
>You'll regret it when you end up with horrible shoulders
Did you even read my post? I'm well aware of the toll it takes on the shoulders.
>>36841070
Nice argument.
>>36841129
What you have listed as the main reasons why it wrecks your shoulders is incorrect.
>>36840591
what kind of stupid combination is this just do and oldschool bodybuilding exersize chest and back
>>36841157
>What you have listed as the main reasons why it wrecks your shoulders is incorrect.
I'm confused now. What did I list and what was wrong about it?
>>36840521
thats why you practice
>>36841192
>2) It's not a very safe exercise. Although good form and structural balance play a big part, the fact of the matter is that many, many people begin to experience shoulder issues from benching.
>Even if you do have great form, frequently pressing very heavy weights is simply going to beat up your shoulders and elbows. It's inevitable.
>The heavy weights also take a greater toll on your CNS, compromising systemic recovery if you overdo it.
These arent the real reasons why it is horrible for your shoulders, I have already say why it wrecks them in my first response. The toll they take on your cns is negligible if compared to any compound for legs or even the press.
>>36841050
>Keep doing your holy bench press and increasing the weight, dude. You'll regret it when you end up with horrible shoulders due to bad shoulder mechanics and imbalances or even worse a pectoral tear.
>M-muh shoulders meme
>M-muh imbalances
Then do some rows?
>>36841290
Do you even biomechanics? Both rows and bench press work your shoulders in retraction.
You keep your shoulder blades retracted to bench press, ideally during the entire lift; and you also retract your shoulder blades during the concentic phase when you row. This leads to imbalances as you dont actually work the proper antagonist/agonist muscles.
>>36841267
I don't know, I think we're splitting hairs at this point. I agree that the pinned down scapulae is part of the problem, but that's what I mean when I say that you need good form; you need to perform the exercise in a certain way to account for the fact that your shoulder blades are kept pinned down. If done right, it's not a problem safetywise.
But like I said, even if we assume that proper form is being used, the very act of pressing heavy ass weights frequently will beat up the joints. Frequent overhead pressing leads to this as well if you aren't smart about it.
As for the CNS, of course leg work is harder, but my original intent was to compare chest exercises. And as far as chest exercises go, the barbell bench press is the most CNS intensive.
But you know, all in all I think we're pretty much in agreement.
>>36841290
>>36841326
I've found that power snatches and behind-the-neck presses are some of the best choices to balance out bench pressing. Although obviously these (especially the BTN press) isn't something you should be doing unless you have the prerequisite shoulder mobility.
>>36841326
>Do you even biomechanics? Both rows and bench press work your shoulders in retraction.
Holy shit you're stupid.
>You keep your shoulder blades retracted to bench press, ideally during the entire lift; and you also retract your shoulder blades during the concentic phase when you row. This leads to imbalances as you dont actually work the proper antagonist/agonist muscles.
Stupid as fuck. Too much benching pulls your shoulders forward, rowing pulls them backwards.
>>36841374
Holy fuck. you sir win the prize as the most ignorant post of the year on /fit/.
Please, dude. Just shut up if you dont have a clue what you are talking about.
>>36841393
>Holy fuck. you sir win the prize as the most ignorant post of the year on /fit/.
>
>Please, dude. Just shut up if you dont have a clue what you are talking about.
Go tip your fedora elsewhere fucktard.
The reason someone gets shoulder imbalances is because the chest muscles and the lats pulls the shoulders forwards. Rows doesn't target lats but muscles like the rhomboids who pulls your shoulders backwards
>>36835597
>>36837156
I bench 295 and struggle with doing weighted 80lbs dips for 5 reps.. For me (200 lbs bw) I wish I could do 100 for 7.
As a natty bodybuilder, I've discovered that there is no 100% true thing for every body when it comes to muscle growth. Differences in bodies such as proportion of different bones, slight differences in where tendons sit on the bones, different athletic backgrounds, etc make a significant difference in what training works best for you.
As for me, I find the best chest hypertrophy for me comes from incline bench press to 90°.
On top of that I also do incline dumbbell flyes with light weight, slow movement, squeeze at the top and reasonably high volume, and pec deck. Those three exercises over a period of about 8 months made me see some serious growth in my chest.
>>36841169
did you have a seizure grandpa?
>>36841454
>lats pull shoulders forward
>Rows not targeting lats
I'm out guys was good before this fag came along
>>36841326
>you also retract your shoulder blades during the concentic phase when you row
Yes, this is the entire point of doing rows.
>>36841771
not him but
rows hit your lats but they dont "target" them, you do rows for you scapular retractors mostly
>>36835158
Has a point but doesnt at the same time
>>36841835
The point is that you are only training your shoulder retractor muscles in both the bench press and rows instead of an even training of both protractor and retractor muscles. I dont know if i'm expressing myself incorrectly or if this concept is that difficult to grasp for some people.
Dumbbell press, obviously
Do it with a slightly truncated range of motion to avoid engaging your tris
Is this milk okay for cutting weight? It's 0.9%
Per 100grams:
40kcal
0.9g fats
4.6g carbs
1.0g fibers
3.2g protein
??
>>36841888
So do some pushups as prehab or a warm-up once or twice a week and you're set. Benching just isn't that dangerous, hip and back injuries seem way more common for powerlifters than pec or shoulder injuries.
>>36840930
>>36840905
>>36840704
you're something special, friend.
fyi:http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16095407
have fun remaining a pussyboi
>>36835158
Why did everyone imply that this guy was wrong in any way?
>Hi, my name's George Leeman and I'm just wondering if you have any tips on how to increase hypertrophy in my che
>LOL FAG, TRY BENCHING 2 PLAETS FOR 12 REPS AND YOU'LL KNOW
Someone who can bench 2 plates for 12 reps could still be doing more efficient work for chest hypertrophy, so >>36835139 really was a retarded and meaningless statement.
>>36841686
ayyy your routine is shit breh but if its working its cool
>>36843363
First of all that is one study. Secondly you can't just take those results at face value like that. Thirdly, you can't apply those results to the dumbbell press with a twisting motion.
>>36844148
jesus, look up reverse grip bench press. it actually has less stress on shoulders. the twist has you move "across" the pectoralis over the press.
and you're right, just one study. give me one that shows it'll tear the labrum/rotator cuff.
>>36835984
this is garbage. dont see pull ups or deadlifts anywhere.
>weighted dips
>>36835516
Mah man, you can place even more stress on chest if you pause for a second or two on chest. Since I began to do mostly paused reps, most of tension went to my chest.
Strangely I never felt shoulders working on bench, everything goes to tris and chest. Could it be due my monkey arms?
>>36835129
incline bench and decline bench
>>36845949
yeah, or squats
