who /keto/ here?
I'm thinking about switching over to this diet.
>sit on your ass all day and do nothing but lift
>stay lean
Sounds good to me. Can I do this shit for the rest of my life?
>>36605980
>Keto isn't a board
>You're a faggot
>Your info is incorrect
>You're even being a faggot wrong
>>36606789
t. sperglord
just tell me about keto
it's well known you don't do high level activity cardio wise on this shit
>>36605980
Avacado is high in carbs.
>>36605980
>there are people literally so retarded they don't know what a keto diet even is
>those people actually post on /fit/
See, /fit/? These are the retards you attract with your nonsense. People like OP should be banned outright. Then again it's a miracle they can even breathe on their own with their level of intellect.
>>36607399
>Avacado is high in carbs
A whole avocado has about 15 carbs, 10 of which are fiber
>>36608321
Since you clearly know a lot more than OP why don't you explain it rather than menstruate all over the thread?
>>36605980
No, you basically use keto to lose some excess body fat, then return to a maintenance diet to stay at decent looking bf%.
>>36609245
I know I'm coming across as a regard but how does a high fat diet give you a low bf%?
>>36605980
>Can I do this shit for the rest of my life?
Yeah - depending on how clean you eat and the quality of your food it can easily be longer than average.
>sit on your ass all day and do nothing but lift
>stay lean
Not gonna happen. On a traditional keto diet you're only getting 20% of your calories from protein - not enough to build muscle or maintain on a severe deficit.
Going over maintenance will still cause you to gain weight - though at a slower rate then fucking your cut with carbs/sugar.
If you want to do it for life, look into a cycling ketogenic diet. It's 6 days keto/1 day refeed where you bulk on carbs to restore glycogen.
>>36609278
The theory goes that keto restructures your metabolism to consume ketones (which is what happens to fats in your body before they can be used for energy). There is an additional benefit of weakening the draw of insulin that transports carbs into fat tissue. There is some pretty solid theory behind it, although there are a lot of intricacies about it (Glucogenesis is one - high protein on the onset pushes your lives to do a different type of flip - taking proteins and turning them into glucose to be consumed for energy- a really shitty pathway)
I'm not exactly keto but I'm on pretty low carbs on this cut. Don't count but they range anywhere from 30-60 a day. 1900 cal
Pros: feel tight
Look leaner because low carbs is diuretic as fuck. I hold way less water. Facial aesthetics look better because of this
Actually pretty filling. Don't get mad carb cravings like I do when low calorie but still eating carbs.
Cons: feel tired sometimes
Sometimes have to dig hard as fuck at the gym. Some low carb days with big muscles like back or legs feel like the hardest workout ever
Less veins :(
Look smaller and flat
Some of the best foods are carbs
Pros: feeling lean
>>36606789
>Keto isn't a board
Haha haha haha haha haha
>>>/new/
>>36609383
Cutting carbs is retarded and you just explained why
If you only wouldve dropped the shit carbs sources and replaced them with fruit you would get all of the pros and none of the cons
>5% carbs
>>36605980
>75% fat
how can you eat so much fat? are you drinking a glass of olive oil or something?
Keto isn't magic, it just makes you way less hungry. Good for people who keep fucking up on their cut because they can't control themselves, like me.
Big con is you always have to prepare, it's a pain in the arse to find some food you can eat without prep while out (during work etc), also going to restaurants sucks dick and you can't drink alcohol (people say spirits are ok but they took my out of keto the same way eating an entire birthday cake would). You have to put your social life on hold. If you knock yourself out of it by accident or purpose, prepare to be ravenous for a solid week until you're back on it.
>>36611220
>it just makes you way less hungry.
It makes you sick so you eat less
>>36611536
>>36611220
It temporarily increases atp energy efficiency.
How do you stay lean while eating so much fat? Does one have to adjust their routine for this diet? Keto has always confused me. Why fat over carbs? From what I know it's energy either way, just different methods to dispose of it.
>>36609351
And despite all this theory, calories in vs calories out is still all that matters when it comes to energy balance/weight loss.
Most people perform better in the gym with lots of carbs in them, and most health bodies will recommend something like 50-60% carbs for the average person's diet.
It's difficult to eat 2000kcal of fats in a day without consuming a lot of saturated fat, which should not be consumed in excess.
Body fat comes largely from dietary fat. Protein isn't really able to be stored as fat and carbs can only form the glycerol backbone of triglycerides, can't be directly converted to fat. Eating large amounts of dietary fat while eating at or above maintenance calories could theoretically cause more fat accumulation (but it still basically comes down to energy balance)
High fat intake could mean high cholesterol intake, which *does* affect serum cholesterol (like 25%)
Carbs are delish
Fibre is good for you and hard to isolate without carbs
Basically, keto's for dumb poopoos or people with strange metabolisms that can handle high fat intakes. Source: patchy memory of my nutrition degree from a few years ago
>>36609618
Yeah I don't get this either.
I cut out carbs from my diet and am now eating lots of beans, aspargus, other vegetables and loads of chicken and meat.
Is this bad? I feel good, and I am making gains so I don't see why I should stop doing what I do.
>>36611551
Fucking google nigger
>>36611757
Couldn't this reply be to literally anything on this board though? Sorry to cause your butthurt tho.
>>36611797
Come on, do you think some anon is going to explain it better than the thousands of articles written about Keto?
>>36611805
I was mostly just hoping for a super condensed cliff note maybe. But I guess you're right.
>>36611685
Fibre supps are cheap, but essential if you enjoy having bowels.
Started it to get lean. Gonna stay on it because it's virtually cured my anxiety, depression and brain fog.
You could also sit around all day, do nothing but lift and get shredded on a conventional deficit.
Difference is, then you would get to eat carbs too.
Hell, if you woke up in the morning and consumed a huge protein shake and then spent the entire rest of your day eating nothing but pizza and donuts you would still be able to lose weight as long as you ate under maintenance.
>>36612426
>all that matter is muscle and body fat
Why do people think like this?
>>36612518
What else is there, huh Bridget?
>>36612518
Well obviously in the long term (multiple decades) you would be better off if you ate all health food, but if we're just talking a few months to a year or two, it IS all that matters.
>>36611749
Do you not know what carbs are?
>>36611542
No, it doesn't. Ketones are less efficient than glucose or even fat.
Is /fit/ always this full of pseudo-intellectual ninnies?
>>36609351
>Glucogenesis
Literally doesn't exist.
Either you mean Glycogenesis or Gluconeogenesis.
On turns Glucose into Glycogen, the other turns only two amino acid precursors into glucose, both of which aren't essential for your diet because your body synthesizes it.
>>36611685
>carbs can only form the glycerol
What the fuck are you talking about?
>>36609027
>A whole avocado has about 15 carbs, 10 of which are fiber
You literally don't understand what fiber is. The human body can not digest fiber, you can not get any caloric value from something you can not digest.
>>36609351
>weakening the draw of insulin that transports carbs into fat tissue.
how is that a benefit? insulin/mTORC2 signaling stimulates futile cycling in adipose and promotes a favorable adipokine profile. insulin-independent uptake via ASP, not so much
>>36605980
Why do people always fall for the meme diets. People just want to make money off of you by selling you bars (convenient labeled "atkins").
If you want to lose weight, eat at a caloric deficit. That's literally it.
>>36613506
Ketones are a functional group. Sugars you consume have either an aldehyde group or a ketone group. You literally break down fat so it has a ketone group so it can then be oxidized into Acetyl-CoA so it can go through the Kreb's Cycle and produce roughly the same number of ATP as glucose.
>>36613629
>The human body can not digest fiber, you can not get any caloric value from something you can not digest.
Depends on how poor your gut bacteria are. Fiber found in most vegetables and fruits can actually be broken down into fatty-acids - if your gut bacteria is strong.
>>36613668
Then that would be your G.I. fauna gaining the benefits of the fiber, not you.
>Many molecules that are considered to be "dietary fiber" are so because humans lack the necessary enzymes to split the glycosidic bond and they reach the large intestine.
>Fermentable fibers are consumed by the microbiota within the large intestines, mildly increasing fecal bulk
Once again, that's not you digesting it, it's your fauna.
>poor gut bacteria
>strong gut bacteria
Consider a high school biology course.
Mrolling for name
>>36613734
Valerie fucking Mack
>>36613506
You have zero idea what you're talking about.
>>36613734
kek faggot
>>36613655
>Ketones are a functional group. Sugars you consume have either an aldehyde group or a ketone group.
Thanks mister pop sci kid, but those wikipedia tier trivialities have nothing to do with my post
>so it can go through the Kreb's Cycle and produce roughly the same number of ATP as glucose.
This neglects the efficiency of glycolytic enzymes vs. fat -> ketones -> mitochondrial combustion, network rigidity of metabolic intermediates, anaplerosis, mitochondrial protein acetylation, the overall redox state of the cell, oxygen wasting, etc and even dumb shit like anaerobic production of ATP. "Roughly" is a sophistic weasel word.
>>36613757
>projecting this hard
don't come to fit and ask about keto
you wont get nothing but laffed it
yes you can do it for the rest of your life
the folks who have been in keto for years are as lean as fuck. there's only 1 bodybuilder I know of who eats keto. there a couple legit scientists/athletes who advocate keto are fit as fuck. personally i advise against refeeding. eventually you become entirely fat adapted and as far as weightlifting goes your muscles adapt, the pump comes back better, etc.
old school bodybuilders vince gironda era ate this diet but included refeeds 1-2 a week.
vince gironda was full natty king, so lean he got docked points in contest. advocated steak & eggs. a protein shake = raw eggs, heavy cream or half n half
however it's a legit lifestyle change, most faggots on fit cant even stop jerking their weiners to their computer screen
go to /r/ketogains I guess. idk
or /r/zerocarb
>>36613797
Sara cantu shutup
>>36613803
>wikipedia tier trivialities
>organic chemistry functional group
>literally the difference between something being okay to consume and lethality
>triviality
Troglodyte, and nothing more.
>This neglects the efficiency of glycolytic enzymes vs. fat -> ketones -> mitochondrial combustion, network rigidity of metabolic intermediates, anaplerosis, mitochondrial protein acetylation, the overall redox state of the cell, oxygen wasting, etc and even dumb shit like anaerobic production of ATP. "Roughly" is a sophistic weasel word.
All of this word vomit which doesn't even encompass anything of value.
Here, let me explain a really simple concept to you.
Fatty acids are large chains. Acetyl-CoA is a fraction as large as a triglyceride. Guess what, fuckboy, when you break something down you get energy out. Literally thermodynamics. You can not break down a large fatty acid chain and some how lose energy in the process. The fact is at the end of the day, gluconeogenesis will take glycerol and turn it into glucose. That process only consumes 2 ATP. The process of taking glucose and having it go through the citric acid cycle will net 36 ATP.
So yes, asshat, roughly the same amount of ATP. There is no fucking reason to anaerobically convert fatty acid into ATP because it's not fucking possible. You would have to take glycerol, turn it into glucose which is -2 ATP, and then after all of that you have to put in 2 ATP to form lactate and the end result is 4 ATP. You have a net of 0 ATP you retard.
If you think the word "roughly" is sophisticated you are as dumb as you think you are.
In conclusion, go fuck yourself. You don't know the first thing about metabolism or even thermodynamics.
>>36613856
> all this text to try and argue about eating a macro nutrient THAT IS COMPLETELY NON-ESSENTIAL FOR HUMAN FUNCTION
>>36613715
they can also be used by enterocytes for intestinal gluconeogenesis
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2212877814002221
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3735932/
>When taken up, a large part of the SCFAs is used as a source of energy. In humans, SCFAs provide ∼10% of the daily caloric requirements (31)
this increases on a high-fibre diet. other primates like gorillas get an immense amount of energy this way.
>>36613856
Oh an I also forgot, Lactate isn't something the body wants to hold around either, so that gets turned back into glucose which is another -2 ATP. So your net from turning glycerol into glucose and then anaerobically metabolizing it has now net you an astounding -2 ATP. You literally consumed more ATP than you produced.
>>36613868
Do yourself a favor and stop breathing.
>>36611685
>Basically, keto's for dumb poopoos or people with strange metabolisms that can handle high fat intakes
Keto was developed to control seizures in epileptic people, it really makes wonders for them, going to several seizures a day to only a few in a month is a huge improvement. Then someone saw a correlation between fat loss and keto, made it popular and subsequently and low carb diets were invented. My guess is because low carbs allow more variety so it's an easier transition and tastes better than a full keto diet, specially for fatties used to eating cakes
>>36613876
I didn't realize that the flora turned cellulose into fatty acids. Here I thought that by the time it hit the large intestine it was just time to suck water out of your turds. Thanks for the read.
>>36613856
>>36613930
>Troglodyte, and nothing more.
It's something every child learns, yet like an autistic pre-teen you're under the impression that it's deep and insightful and worthy of sharing while jerking off over how enlightened you feel. What the hell is wrong with you? Why the fuck are you bragging about your fedora'd pseudo-intellectualism and your developmental disorder?
>All of this word vomit which doesn't even encompass anything of value.
It's not my fault you can't understand it. I'm so sorry for overestimating your cognitive abilities. For now on I promise I will assume maximum low IQ mode from you.
>Fatty acids are large chains.
Some are short chain.
>Acetyl-CoA is a fraction as large as a triglyceride.
Glyceyl tridocosahexaenoate is a lot bigger than acetyl-CoA. Instead of mindlessly making shit up please do us a favor and read a book.
>Literally thermodynamics. You can not break down a large fatty acid chain and some how lose energy in the process.
Fatty acid degradation like all other enzymatic systems isn't a spherical cow, you mentally deficient piece of shit. For example, there is electron leakage at acyl-CoA dehydrogenases. Some acyl-CoA intermediates are highly reactive and can disrupt the integrity of the mitochondrial membrane and various supercomplexes ultimately reducing ATP formation. It's a lot more complex than what the University of Google and reddit taught you.
>when you break something down you get energy out
Bond-breaking involves breaking something down, yet it is an endothermic process. Did you drop out of kindergarten?
>>36613856
>>36613930
>Oh an I also forgot, Lactate isn't something the body wants to hold around either so that gets turned back into glucose which is another -2 ATP.
>The fact is at the end of the day, gluconeogenesis will take glycerol and turn it into glucose. That process only consumes 2 ATP. The process of taking glucose and having it go through the citric acid cycle will net 36 ATP.
Keep embarrassing yourself. We're talking about the efficiency and utilization of ketones versus glucose for energy. Glycerol and lactate have nothing to do with it.
>So yes, asshat, roughly the same amount of ATP.
nope
>There is no fucking reason to anaerobically convert fatty acid into ATP because it's not fucking possible.
That's one of my points. The gain in ATP from the initial non-oxidative metabolism of glucose, which is about 150x faster than oxphos. You're repeating my point and calling yourself retarded.
>If you think the word "roughly" is sophisticated you are as dumb as you think you are.
I never said it was sophisticated. Please take your meds. Your hallucinations and psychotic ramblings are devoid of content.
>>36609618
Not ketofag and not lowcarbfag but sometimes I have days when I eat alot of fat and lowcarb.
Oils
Nuts
Cheese (pic related)
Olives
Peanut butter
Avocados
Fatty meat and fish
Eggs
Dark chocolate
Raw cacao (specially with coconut oil)
Seeds
It's not hard
>>36613649
HOLY FUCKING SHIT
NONE OF WHAT YOU JUST SAID MATTERS AT ALL
GO LIFT SOMETHING YOU FUCKING NERD
Does keto work better than regular diet? Balanced, -500 deficit, you know your standard cut. Are the differences noticeable result wise?
>>36614555
Many people report feeling less hungry than on traditional diets.
>>36614566
Makes sense with all the extra fat consumption. Is that pretty much the only benefit of choosing keto over regular diet? What about getting to the lower bf percentages?
>>36614591
If you have a overactive insulin response, a ketogenic diet will allow you to maintain a higher metabolism and do higher levels of exercise.
This increased energy output will increase your weight loss.
>>36613629
>The human body can not digest fiber, you can not get any caloric value from something you can not digest.
That's why I listed it separately you stupid shit.
love these topics.
every neckbeard starts to spill out shits they never tried themselves.
got from 120kg to 75 with keto in 3 months. was great. felt great. when i got more socially active i dropped it (so i can take some qt for some food outside), gained 5kg. thats about it.
my brother is on it for 2 weeks now, recommended it due some cysts he has, so we can find out what food is causing them (if food at all)
guy feels better, has more energy, is more active, isn't losing muscles. eats psylium for good fiber shits.
all the scientific data you throw out there is valuable probably. but really, only time ketosis starts to be a problem is when you try to think about variety of food you want. fuck variety. stick to what works and ride it out.
>>36614591
you need one meal a day. you are mot affected my weather and pressure moods (some people never feel those some people know it and hate it)
you can go for longer periods without being cranky or easily annoyed cause you lack nutrients.
>>36615830
>has more energy
>on keto
literally lmao'd hard
>>36614623
>do higher levels of exercise
>on keto
kek
>>36615881
brain likes fats more than carbs :*
>>36616001
Not if you actually use it, senpai.
>>36616058
that's a solid argument right there annon.
you must be on ketosis, carb brain could never be so quick.
>>36616058
kek'd
>>36605980
runketo.com
>>36609618
not 75% in mass, 75% in calories. Fat is more than twice as high in calories than most carbs. Not enough fat? Eat coconut oil by the spoonful.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aTUAwfiFr6k
>>36615830
Agree. Was literally on the opposite side of the scale, skellington because of Crohn's disease. Eating carbs like a hambeast for them gainz, no dice. Constantly in terrible pain, gas, bloating, the shits, and small intestine refusing to absorb the nutrients from my SAD.
Switched to keto as an experiment after going vegan failed, and was cured within a few days. Been fat-adapted for three years, slowly gaining mass. Feels good, man.
>>36605980
>true ketogenic diet
>5% carbs
>the picture is a piece of bread
>>36616290
noice. do you count callories?
has anyone else with epilepsy tried keto? some articles say it might help
>>36616552
was a cure for seizures. you got epilepsy? try it mang. wprst case scenario ypu waste a month on a doet plan that doesnt work for you
I forgot you can't have milk
>>36616750
diet soda
>>36616735
yeah I do I only had like 3 seizures when I lost consciousness in 6 months so nothing serious
ok i'll try I need to lose some weight too and it can't be that bad
>>36616771
had an exgf with seizures, shit was fun in theory, scary when she collapsed first time.
>>36616750
Who needs milk when you got heavy whipping cream.
Gah Keto... Just do this.
(Carbohydrates/Proteins/Fats)
Cut: 40/40/20
Bulk: 50/30/20
