Cassandra Cain is clearly the best Batgirl..
>>83910215
>>83910215
Everybody knows that, she was also the first batgirl that was part of the batfamily and a character that had tons of potential but was wasted.
His interactions with bruce are still some of the more human things about Batman.
>>83910258
There are people that think steph brown is the best..
>>83910382
I know. But in universe she was by far the worse
>>83910215
>>83910382
>..
Kill yourself
>>83911010
what is your frustration anon?
>>83910382
They're wrong, but that's okay, because at least they're following their hearts.
still wrong tho
>>83910258
I miss Batdad. Bruce dealing with a daughter was so interesting after decades of adoptive sons. Does he ever see Damian lately?
>>83910215
Well, yeah.
She wasn't in the DCAU though, so she's basically forever sidelined now. For all you'll get of her she may as well not exist.
She was an awful fit for the Bat-universe and a terrible 90's replacement character that could never match the iconicstatus of the original. Most other 90's embarrassments had the dignity to be forgotten, but waifu fags won't let this one fade away. No matter how overpowered she is, it doesn't matter.
>>83911981
>replacement character
She was the star of the first Batgirl ongoing.
Frankly, the only comic Babs had that was as good as hers at that point was the one where she lost the use of her legs.
>>83911981
>dignity
>>83911953
Too bad Cass' cameo in The Savage Time wasn't foreshadowing of
>>83911899
>Bruce dealing with a daughter was so interesting after decades of adoptive sons
I think that for many Cass fans Bruce interactions where a big reason to want the character in.
Bruce relates to his sons in the only ways he can: With dick is about adventure and responsability, with jason he needed to be a mentor and learn how to grow up and be strict with a child that was full of rage, with Tim he was a teacher, a support. Even with damian, he was a sensei first and then a loving father, but with him he had the whole support of the rest of the family.
With Cass is really different, she didnt need a sensei, or a partner to look up, she didnt need redemption she needed someone that loved her as a daughter. For bruce that thinks eating ice cream and watching movies is the only way to show love it was extremely different than the relationship with the kids, with them he could say "good job" and they would understand that he is saying i love you, they were all proud (tim a little less). But with cass he actually had to be open about how he feel about her. Batdad is probably my favorite take on batman along with Batspookyman
>Does he ever see Damian lately?
Read robin son of batman, Damian got his family reunited again, and bruce once again flirted with talia.
>>83912093
They gave Azrael and other losers a book, too, who cares? comics don't really matter; red head Batgirl sells more merchandise.
Batman's ally's daughter becomes a crimefighter is a much more succinct and well written origin for Batgirl than "assassins have a daughter that's a perfect trained killer but she doesn't want to kill so she runs away and becomes mute and then and then and then", which is so fucking convoluted and far removed from Gotham city it barely fits. It might've worked back in the 90's but it has no staying power.
>>83911981
>She was an awful fit for the Bat-universe
Let's think about that for a second.
>Dark haired badass
>Trained to be the best in her field
>Driven by tragedy
>Silent, stoic
versus
>Red haired girly girl
>Just dresses up in a costume one day and decides to go with it
>No tragedy
>Quips and girl power.
>>83912459
Cass' secret origin is "Trained Super Assassin doesn't want to kill and becomes a super-hero".
Hell, the Robins' secret origins are harder to summarise.
>>83912459
You really don't care about anything else than red hair right?
>>83912530
And there's something REALLY important about Cass: she brings back the martial arts element to the batbooks, something that was neglected by grant and dixon
>>83910382
I hate Steph. She ignites a gang war out of spite and gets herself killed, is a burden to every member of the batfamily because of her stupidity and poor fighting skills, but she's lolquirky so she gets away with it. She's a more annoying and less intelligent Babs.
Meanwhile Cass is a badass fighter and she's recruited into the batfam because of her talent and because she truly believes in the mission but she gets the shaft because teenage white girls can't project onto her.
>>83912603
Still thinking they should just have made a Batgirl&Spoiler book, with Steph being Green Hornet and Cass as Kato. Except Cass would be the main character.
>>83912697
>Batgirl&Spoiler book,
Me too.
>>83912675
Reminder that it was all Bruce's fault.
>>83913529
what the fuck
>>83912697
I'd prefer a Red & Black comic. Cass is the muscle while Tim is the brains.
>>83912603
That was why I liked new52 Batgirl. She was a badass fighter.
Well yeah. Most intelligent Batfags know this. The only real Babsfags out there are either stupid or total casuals.
Stephfags are alright. Remember, we're practically on the same side against Babsfags.
>>83912459
Only because they themselves said and did so.
Barbara was never this marketed until DC went this route of "iconic" over characters like Cassandra, Wally, Guy, Kyle, and John (all superior models over the 'iconic' ones).
Now look at the direction Barbara's at. She's going to freaking Asia in an attempt to yet again "rediscover" herself.
There come's a point were DC has got to just throw in the towel when it come's to a Barbara solo. She doesn't work well by herself. She works best with Dinah, Helena, and Zinda.
There's a reason Cass survived for over 70 issues.She's got more depth to her character and journey is helluva more interesting than Barbara's.
Who would win in a fight out of all the Batgirls here??
>>83913943
The Joker
>>83913943
>>83913943
Cassandra Cain by far and away.
>>83913967
joker confirmed best batgirl
>>83913682
That's nice, too, but Tim is a good fighter.
The underlining idea of Batgirl&Spoiler is the dichotomy of Cass' super fighting powers and Steph's above average mind while not being confined to not have action like Oracle.
This way they would still find situations they cannot resolve easily: Cass&Tim would be next to unstoppable.
That's why Cass&Tim with Steph as Oracle would have to be the NEXT step, when they become a family.
>>83914033
Lies! Joker is the best Robin and his Batman is second to none the superior Batman! I mean look at these two! It's poetry! Utter poetry!
>>83914084
>That's why Cass&Tim with Steph as Oracle would have to be the NEXT step, when they become a family.
Yes.. family.
>>83913730
badass fighter isnt the same as a Martial arts book.
>>83913996
Cass could beat all the others alone.
>>83914181
I'm sure they can find a way to make three-way marriages legal.
I still see Cass a giant amount of wasted potential. Even in her own series it wasn't done particularly well. There's that concept of someone being completely physical and nonverbal. Someone who has to convey complex concepts without talking is something I like.
I really liked that time where she told Dick to attack her to replicate the conditions of Vesper Fairchild's murder, as Dick legitimately thought Bruce really might have done it. After giving her a beating and then putting a gun to her he realized that no matter how angry Bruce had been in the past he would never go so far as to murder someone in cold blood like that. Forcing him to go through the physical motions of killing someone was different than just saying it and it was a different method of communicating. Alfred complemented her stageplay in convincing Dick. Where she lacked in vocal skills she was able to make up for in other ways that ended up being more effective than traditional methods.
I miss Cass
>>83914257
Hey it's Gotham it probably is.
>>83913943
Who dat
>>83914498
In the middle
>>83914498
Bette Kane, Barbara , Helena Bertinelli, Cassandra, and Stephanie.
>>83914498
>>83914526
Not sure I'm going to go ahead and say it's an alternate version of Selina Kyle as Batgirl.
>>83914539
Oh shit I didn't know Helena was a batgirl
Basically Helena went around as "Batman" during the first few months during No Man's Land realizing Gotham City needed a Bat. That was her first costume she wore during that until a punk used spray paint to blind her. So she stitched the eye holes and mouth piece up. How Cass got her mask.
We only saw this version for one issue (like right after we learned she was Batgirl and the missing months when Bruce was away).
Is there any reading list for Bette?
>>83910215
Hey OP
what is the reading list for the best girl?
>>83914661
>>83914422
There was no need for fucking duke. Bruce adopted an Asian Girl.
A fucking Asian girl that was a badass. She was perfect for all the autistic SJW crap, and Barbara was a hero on a wheelchair.
>>83912603
>something that was neglected by grant and dixon
Man, Dixon basically worshiped O'Neil and had martial arts as a major aspect of all the side books. The 90's in general kept the martial arts aspect alive, I'd say its only around Hush when the old guard died that that element was ditched. Which is really what hurt Cass in the long run.
>>83914084
>>83914181
All in all a Cass/Steph/Tim book thats basically Strangers in Paradise would be nice.
>>83914628
Anons pls
>>83914760
Asians are old news, if you're not black or muslim you may as well be white as far as the diversity police are concerned.
>>83914760
well now Bruce has damian which is somehow half arab and half chinese
>>83915069
Talia and R'as Al Ghul's creator, dennis O'Neil, wrote a graphic novel where R'as origin is described and Talia's mother is described as part Chinese and part Arab, and R'as is implied to have similar ancestry( a document related to his origin is described as being found in Asia with proto-Arabic writing, or something like that). Of course, I don't think O'Neil described this to Neal adams 20 years prior when he first drew them, so he effectively just drew them as exotic white or just vaguely arab.
>>83910382
I'll admit she had the best costume.
>>83915069
He is half white, one quarter random Caucasian from asia, and one quarter chinese.
The idea that arab most be brown looking is retarded pic extremely related.
>>83914974
> Tynion IV will never do this.
;_;
>>83913943
A better question is if all the other Batgirls combined would have a chance against Cass?
>>83914422
I really loved Cass' durability. It gave a great visceral feel to the character.
>>83914556
In No Man's Land, Huntress wasn't getting a lot of respect from the Mad Max-types doing evil in the ruins, so Helena decided to do some rebranding.
Eventually, she failed to stop Two Face from taking a huge chunk of territory, Batman bitched her out, so she gave up the costume and went back to being Huntress. Batman turned around and gave that costume to Cass after she had proved herself.
Fun Fact, that mask is covered like that due to some punks spraying Helena in the face with spraypaint, so she stitched a mouth-covering on the mask.
>>83910215
Well obviously, the others are all complete shit. A more controversial statement is Cassandra Cain is clearly the best member of the Bat Family.
>>83910215
>Cassandra Cain is clearly the best Bat-anything..
Fixed it for you.
>>83913943
Cassandra Cain.
>>83917546
She is my favorite, but obviously she doesn't have the classic stories that Bruce does.
>>83913647
Bruce in the late 90s, early 00s was a massive ass.
>>83919249
If THAT'S what you got from that image then you have serious mental issues, buddy.
>>83919337
Not that guy, Bruce really was a paranoid fucker back before Infinite Crisis.
>>83919477
that's normal behavior for everyone with a daughter
>>83919210
I feel like she's got more potential in her to have good stories than Bruce. Same with Dick Grayson, all the garbage Nightwing stories in the world can't shake my faith in the potential of that character. Bruce will probably always be third best Bat Family member to me, assuming they don't come up with anyone amazing going forward.
>>83919519
No, you threaten the boy to ensure his good behavior. A sane person doesn't threaten the kid's guardian so he stays the fuck away unless he's a delinquent.
>>83919619
>threatening superboy
I would have asked Clark too
>>83919477
What?
That's literally extremely sweet.
>>83919654
Superboy stood up for himself, but he was still open to being intimidated.
>>83919681
It was sweet, but in a crazy way.
>>83919477
If you were going to show Bruce paranoia you should have picked something from all that Brother Eye bullshit he caused around that time, rather than him being overprotective of his adopted daughter.
>>83919840
It's a really flawed NORMAL reaction for a father that at that moment had 3 sons and is a well known manwhore.
In the world of Batman red sun gloves are the equivalent of "i a NRA member stay away from my daughter"
>>83910382
Cass might be a better character, but I think Q. Miller's Batgirl is probably the better run and Steph is a big reason why.
>>83920025
Yup. Steph is my favorite character, in large part because of BQM's run. (The other part is a combination of Dixon's run on Robin and her general underdogness.)
>>83910382
I liked Barb, Steph, and Cass equally because they all brought dfferent things to the table that I enjoyed. I'd really like it if we had books with all 3 available to read - I could care less about who's best.
Just as long as we all agree that Damien sucks ass.
>>83920512
>Steph is my favorite character
Jesus christ
>>83920593
What's wrong with Damian? I think that most writers have figured out the problem with Damian - no one challenges him to be more human=brat - so they've given him good characters to interact with who remind one of the Batgirl/Robin interaction from BQM's Batgirl.
>>83920601
We all have em.
Got her statue today at a con, good condition too.
>>83919249
>It's YOUR fault that I went into the Batcave after you fired me as Robin where I stole the secret plans you had and poorly executed them!
Really, Bruce is not AT ALL at fault here.
>>83919477
>Superboy
>Listening to someone
That would just make him want her more, you Bat-moron.
>>83919742
Who's the artist here? I remember he also worked on some great Nightwing stories before new52, I just can never remember his name.
>>83910382
Steph is my favorite of the three, but I do like Cass a lot too. I think Steph had a lot of potential and could have grown to be a lot of people's favorites had she been handled better in her pre-batgirl phase.
this whole Orphen and Harper nonsense has me cross but they reprinted her trades so Im pretty happy in general
>autistic asian girl who's the daughter of a ninja and a hitman is beat until she gains superhuman reflexes and strength
>implying Cass is a good character and not a donut steel that hits /co/'s fetishes
Her Batgirl series is really cool.
Cass is pure sex.
>>83922006
Well you can rest easy. Harper's not doing anymore superhero shit, and I doubt Orphan will last long as a name.
I however, must worry. Row is in the next issue of Gotham Academy, and there's not even any sign of her brother.
>>83922302
I loved that image so much back in the day it gave me a huge fetish. Fuck she was qt and hot as fuck, i dated an asian goth cutter girl for like 2 weeks just to fuck her and then dump her.
>>83922302
I need to read Cass's series, but do I recognize those two from Futures End? They get stronger the closer they are? Or do I need to sleep?
>>83922375
Those two are dykes. Well, the black one is. She's the daughter of Black Lightning. The other one is an amazon that pounded both Arsenal and her for some time. Nobody cares for either anymore.
Is Lady Shiva still the mother of Cass?
>>83921859
Yeah, you tell him!
>>83922502
Probably not? David Cain's entire life and character got changed and he never had anything to do with the League of Assassins in the New 52 so it'd be pretty unlikely they would meet.
>>83922612
Too bad.
>>83921934
>>83922979
Shiva's costume is dumb as hell now so it's probably for the best she's in as little as possible until someone redesigns her wardrobe. I mean it's hard to take her seriously when it looks like she's pretending to be some kind of spiky dinosaur or something.
>>83916889
No chance. Cass is so good that she's rated as metahuman. None of the other Batgirls even come close, not all at once or singly.
>>83916457
After B&RE, I'm wary of Tynion doing anything with the character.
My favorite part of TEC Rebirth was that, after a long stupid talking fight with Steph and Tim, Cass was not shown committing any violence on screen. Thanks a lot for that, Tynion.
>>83923356
He might do some quiet moments like Batdad in #13
>>83923233
Does Misfit count? Because she just needs to teleport with Cass and she's dead
>>83922420
I'm still mad that DC didn't turn those Thunder and Lightning shorts from the DC Nation block into a full cartoon.
>>83923931
Not really.
>>83923871
The most I expect from that book is a scene where Kate lines the kids up and does the drill sergeant bit where she does an R. Lee Emery schtick and makes them each attack her in turn. Tim and Steph get planted on their asses, but Cass wins effortlessly. In the background, the Batman smirks.
>>83924855
I hate Batwoman, is there a more annoying and useless character? Cass Cain was interesting and new.
>>83925180
Part of Batwoman's gimmick is treating far older characters like complete nubs.
Kate has almost a full head on Cass so it would be funny seeing her overconfident after laying out Steph and Tim before she found herself on the floor.
>>83925304
>Cass this short
Makes my blood boil
>>83919619
Batman didn't WANT to threaten Superboy.
He's basically hoping Clark would get him to back away peacefully.
>>83924855
Kate has them ina battle royal.
She turns away for one panel, still talking.
Next panel, she turns back at them, not having finished the previous phrase.
Everybody is down except Cass.
Kate thinks she never was into underage girls before...
>>83925304
Actually, if they write Kate as competent, she's going to have Cass fight Clayface. He should be a hard opponent for her.
>>83926198
Did Cass shrink or did Tim grow a foot? I remember them being about the same height.
>>83926449
Sounds terribly dangerous to let Clayface loose in on the kid's practice.
Bruce is the only one who can be her sensei!
>>83926601
Well, Clayface isn't exactly going to try and murder them...
I miss her weird crush on Bruce. She admired the way he moved and stuff so she liked being close to him early in her career. I guess she recognized how he could fight with all his might and not be a killer about it. Since for the longest time she never fought anyone, afraid of becoming a killer herself. It felt like if Bruce wanted a romantic relationship she would have said yes in an instant. But she was like 16 or 17 in her first appearance so he wasn't interested.
I don't have that pic of Babs calling her out on her crush on Bruce so here's one where some social worker is lead to believe Bruce has very young women over for sex parties.
>>83926633
>>83926510
Dunno, but midget Cass looks just wrong
>>83926633
I always thought her crush was more like a pure and idolized thing, which I really liked
>>83926633
>>83926687
>>83926697
>Cass's response
Lol every time
>>83926689
Yeah I saw her crush as a pure idolized thing, but it could become something different at least for a while if Bruce took a few steps forward.
>>83926828
Please no, thats reserved for Superboynever ;_;
>>83926510
Man, too bad those two never went anywhere.
>>83926633
I prefer the bit with the Cafe owner thinking Alfred is her sugar daddy.
>>83927122
Cass being mistaken for a prostitute was my favorite running joke of the chracter, just ahead of Barbara being "Old Batgirl".
>>83914181
>>83914426
Tim = absolute trash
>>83910215
Cass is better than all the other female Bat-characters. She's better than most of the male ones as well.
>>83914181
>>83914257
>>83914426
>>83914974
No lying, it's litterally the only poly-romance idea I like. And it would work too.
>>83926633
I never felt that, she always seemed to see bruce as the greatest thing ever and as his dad.
>>83927490
I wonder what happened with that, Cass had a crush on Bruce true but she also found Tim interesting and they even worked as a team for a bit. Like the author's didn't want to let Tim get over the trauma of Stephs miscarriage.
>>83927717
I always saw it as a little girl having a crush on her dad, like most daughters get in their lives. It would eventually fade and then become an attraction to men like her pop..
>>83927876
Cass also had a crush on Connor, so there's that. And like >>83927910 said. And back in the day Tim was kinda like Bruce, right down to the whole detective thing.
Cass is best girl
>>83927990
Then they made him generic, a midget and a jobber. Before 52 he was fucking badass he was literally Batman 2.0 without the brood holding him back he'd get tail and great stories his dry sense of humor was always good. Fuck they screwed him over.
>>83928242
The worst thing they did to Tim was make him the Teen Titans' Robin. Superboy was ruined after FP, too, but he had his own book to be terrible in.
>>83928242
No, he was a detective and more of a scientist, he was also more into prep time than bruce. Tim was the less proud and less interested in martial arts.
>>83928691
> less interested in martial arts
Didn't stop him from being the best martial artist in the family. Don't know who said it but Tim was not only a genius at fighting like Bruce but out of all the Robins he hit the hardest.
I haven't really kept up with dc since the new 52 came out, have they finally done something with Cass again? Last thing I read with her was gates of gotham. What series should I pick up to catch up on her?
>>83929022
Completely rewritten to fit into Harper Rows past. Yeah, fuck you DC, Tynion and your hard-on on that shit character. Don't expect something good.
>>83926198
As long as i can remember Cass has been described as 155cm tall.
>>83929022
She was brought back a few months ago in a terrible series called Batman and Robin Eternal. Now she's going to be part of TEC, which is by one of the main writers of B&RE.
>>83929138
I think he did okay in the few issues focusing solely on Cass, though. #13, the Cass solo issue, was probably the best issue of the series. Her storyline was just dragged down by being intertwined with Harper's.
>>83910215
>>83929131
Really? So Tim was a manlet?
>>83910215
Babs is a cake and New52 deaged Babs is disgusting
Would gladly be in a threesome with her and Steph
>>83913874
Yeah she got over 70 issues because it was the 90s
>>83929189
I was extremely annoyed that we never saw Cass kill Harper's mother on screen. Her one kill is the culmination of her origin story, but instead we got a few pages of how Harper felt about her mom dying.
>>83910215
Depends on what you mean by best.
By martial arts, yes.
Beyond that, don't see what makes her the best Batgirl. She never even dressed like Batgirl. The Robins all dressed pretty similar, but Cassandra's costume looked more like Symbiote Spider-Man and Scarecrow's lovechild, wearing pointy ears and a Bat-logo to remind you she's a member of the bat-family.
She looks more like Bat-Ghoul than a Batgirl.
She was in Injustass for like 2 seconds.
But she probably won't return for the sequel.
I doubt even Babs will.
>>83929370
>that neck
yeesh
>>83929267
Batgirl v1 (because there was no Barbara solo comic) started in 2000, and was ended by Infinite Crisis.
>>83922979
Given how badly they've fucked up Shiva in nu52, it might be for the best.
>>83927490
Fucking shippers.
Cass never had any romantic interest in Tim, and Tim never had any romantic interest in Cass. They were teammates, allies, siblings. Plus, Cass thought Tim was too cerebral and Tim was afraid of Cass on some level.
Likewise, there was never anything romantic between Cass and Steph, either. Not even a tiny hint of anything. Just friends.
If there's one thing that annoys me, it's the fucking hordes of shippers trying to turn Cass into the batfamily's bicycle after Gates of Gotham and that one fucking page.
>>83929243
I liked the dynamic of her coming before Robin, that was a good show.
>>83922502
>>83929429
In some of the interviews, Tynion has hinted that Shiva will show up in Detective and may still be Cass's mom. Here's hoping she gets the Rebirth treatment.
>>83929838
Should I read Batman and Robin Eternal for some Cass?
>>83929838
I hope not. I cannot forgive what he did to David.
>>83929866
Just read #13, the Cass backstory issue. I don't think the rest is as bad as /co/ makes it out to be, but the climax is pretty disappointing for how Cass is made just a prop for Harper.
>>83929866
No. Just pick up Tec and keep an eye out for her in the other books.
>>83929939
Reading it now, anon.
>>83930163
Will do.
I guess I should also finish her solo Batgirl series.
>>83930223
Finish it. While the quality declines at the end it is still a great read. I miss her series and the storytelling.
>>83929838
>Tynion writing Shiva again
Oh boy.
>>83930394
No please not again!!!
>>83929866
>Should I read Batman and Robin Eternal for some Cass?
No. If you're a Cassandra Cain fan, BRE will just make you angry.
Maybe take a look at the first issue only, and imagine it's the worst issue instead of the best.
>>83929939
#13 will especially make you furious because the new background is shit, the new David Cain is shit, and her being linked to Harper Row is especially shit.
>>83930716
You ready, kiddo?
>>83929189
>I think he did okay in the few issues focusing solely on Cass, though
He did not. Issue thirteen is absolute shit, just like every other issue of that cursed series by a writer who hopefully doesn't live long. The rest of DC employees hopefully die with him.
It makes me angry beyond belief that after making use wait FIVE YEARS for Cassandra to come back, they waste her reintroduction on Harper mother fucking Row, a non-character that nobody likes.
>>83931033
They even took the friendship from Steph and Cass and swapped it for fucking Harper
>>83931290
I want to know who did it. Who decided it would be a great idea to make BRE revolve around Harper Row. Somebody made that call, it didn't happen by itself. Tynion? Snyder? Some editor? Who is the fuckhead that did it?
Imagine the same comic but with no Harper in it. Much better. Still shit, mind you, but way less painful shit. Way less blood in the feces.
>>83922347
>Well you can rest easy. Harper's not doing anymore superhero shit, and I doubt Orphan will last long as a name.
Id even be happy if she went back to being Black Bat
>>83929254
Tim has always been smol for his age. Partially for stylistic reasons(gotta keep Robin tiny next to Batman).
>>83924855
>In the background, the Batman is also unconscious.
We need some lewd Cass.
>>83922347
>Well you can rest easy. Harper's not doing anymore superhero shit,
Tynion already said Harper was going to appear in 'Tec in the future.
>>83931539
Cass is not for sexual.
>>83931702
Yes she is. I specifically started reading her because I thought her bondage batgirl outfit was hot.
>>83910215
>qt asian instead of boring white girl
>best costume by far
>intense personality
it wasnt even a competition
>>83931702
Her outfit is a skintight Bondage outfit.
>>83913529
lol
Steph, those plans relied on Matches Malone being there.
Matches Malone being fucking Batman, the man who should have been executing those plans.
This is like complaining to the man who designed a bomb after you stole the plans and fucked up the fuse. Of course it blew up in your face.
>>83913943
Cass, obviously. That's not even in question - she's a better fighter than Bruce, for god's sake.
Cass isn't as good a detective or hacker as Barbara, isn't as good with people or marksmanship as Helena, and isn't as purple as Steph, but she's far and away the best fighter.
>>83932023
It's totally Batman's fault that Steph ever saw the plans, though. Steph is not a computer genius or master spy. If Bruce had spent five seconds of effort hiding them, they would not have fallen into the hands of a retarded girl who wanted to impress him.
>>83931981
It's ninja.
But it can be read as gimpsuit too.
>>83913943
Cassandra could take on all the others at the same time and they'd have 0% chance of winning. You could throw Kate Kane in there and the result would be the same.
That's pre-Flashpoint Cassandra, which is the only Cassandra that matters. Post-Flashpoint bullshit garbage Cassandra appears to be much weaker, as well as inferior in general.
>>83931981
You ever think Cass gets pissed that everyone thinks her outfit is some BDSM thing when in reality it's only just a latex fetish thing?
>>83929756
No it was not a good show, it was fucking terrible!
>>83928929
>the best martial artist in the family
Cass Cain says hi.
So does the floor.
>>83931597
>>83932212
He is talking about the robins, and i think it has to do with jason being a brawler and dick fighting style being mostly focused on fighting metas.
>>83928929
What in the fuck? Tim isn't even the best fighter out of the Robins. Damian and Jason are both better.
And Cass wipes the floor with them all.
>>83931702
Cass popularity has all to do with her being a young Asian girl that don't speak but it's a hot marital artist.
>>83932555
I like her because she's the only Batgirl who's competence doesn't feel forced.
Babs is supposedly able to run with the others despite not having nearly as much training, and Steph just gets plot armor after people scream that she died like she logically should have. They devalue the whole concept of being a non-powered vigilante when they can pull out wins despite being so light on the qualifications.
But Cass? She's got more years of training than anyone except Bruce and maybe Dick.
>>83932309
He didn't say he was the best fighter.
He said he was the best martial artist (of the pre-Damian Robins).
Which is true.
>>83932555
>Cass popularity has all to do with her being a young Asian girl that don't speak but it's a hot marital artist.
Fuck off, half of the posters had said his relationship with bruce is the best thing about cass
>>83932555
I always like her empathy personally.
>>83929939
Just up to #13. Takara drawing her and the Bat Dad moment are about as great as it got for Cass in the series other than the beginning.
>>83932555
Fuck you, I liked her whole redemption arc and her trying so hard to find her place and save people at all cost.
>>83930859
#13 doesn't have the Harper Row shit though save at the end when she and Dick arrive to fight David Cain with her.
Mostly the origin is straight up only Cass.
>>83931597
She'll be recurring and not a prominent fixture.She'll be in Gotham Academy shitting that up instead.
>>83933532
>#13 doesn't have the Harper Row shit though
No, it just has every other kind of shit. That's the issue that replaces Cass's perfect correct origin with a shit Nu52 origin, and David Cain with Shredder.
>>83933629
> David Cain with Shredder.
He is discount Storm Shadow in this universe! And no it doesn't. Cass's new origin was in #9 or 10. Basically, #13 is Cass going the South Air Temple to rescue children who Mother had there, instead finds "Storm Shadow", they fight, he dumps her into a pit which has the bodies of the children (all dead). She goes Rambo starts beating the crap out of him. Then Dick/Harper arrive and it ends with Mother deciding to nuke the entire base.
>>83932148
So many things about Nu52 Cass drive me nuts.
The fact that Fake David Cain doesn't stop monologuing at her (when the whole trick behind the body-reading thing is preventing the child from hearing human speech).
The fact that everybody seems to be able to lay hands on her when she's supposed to be untouchable.
The fact that her origin is now tied to the least threatening villain in ages and the shittiest hero in forever.
The fact that said shittiest hero ever is apparently an even match to Cass AND Jason at the same time, despite having no training or powers at all and being basically a civilian with a stun gun.
The fact that Fake David Cain displays none of the traits that made him a remotely interesting character originally, and the unique relationship between him and Cass has been thrown in the trash.
The fact that the most impressive feat she has in Nu52, after 28 issues of comics, is sneaking aboard an airplane.
The fact that no artist in Nu52 seems to remember how to choreograph an on-panel fight.
>>83912675
Steps was the only member of the Batfamily who came into it without natural talent. Her training relied entirely on Bruce's skills as a trainer, and he not only failed her, he activated her before she was ready
The writers also did that really annoying thing yet do on that they had him just stop communicating with anyone and shit himself off because he "works better alone." Nigga you got thirty disciples you helped train, learn some communication skills
>>83933629
Funny you mention this, I just watched TMNT Out of The Shadows right now.
It's like the TMNT cartoon bought to life.
>>83934239
Yeah, both old 52 and nu52 screwed Cass, she becomes Lady Shiva jr. in the old 52!
Since the first Arkham game I hoped to see Cass in one of the Rocksteady games but DC bought Babs back from the wheelchair.
>>83934479
Seriously, Cass is fucking perfect for an Arkham Game, why are DC and Rocksteady so stubborn fucks?
>>83934239
>The fact that Fake David Cain doesn't stop monologuing at her (when the whole trick behind the body-reading thing is preventing the child from hearing human speech).
It was like the author didn't read or understand his own fucking story. How stupid can you get?
>>83934521
Because Babs.
Babs is the "iconic" one so she's the only one they use. But she's only iconic because she's the only one they use. But she's iconic so she's the one they use. And so on and so on. They've crafted a lovely little red headed self fulfilling prophecy.
>>83934479
>Since the first Arkham game I hoped to see Cass in one of the Rocksteady games
>>83934521
I don't get it either, especially since in that universe Oracle is active and in the chair, and she's aesthetically perfect for the darker and grittier Arkhamverse.
They teased her a little bit in Origins (David was mentioned), but nothing came out of it. Bunch of cucks.
>>83934615
Ever since Beechen's days I've been noticing a pattern that shitty and lazy writers have a real problem understanding the body-reading. That's a big problem. It's kind of like if a Spider-man writer didn't understand how spidersense works, except worse, because Cass's whole motivation comes from the body-reading. It's the whole reason she's so empathetic, and why she hates killers so much, and so on. If you forget the whole ability or don't understand how it works, you don't have a foundation for your stories anymore.
I've gained newfound appreciation for how logically consistent Cass's solo series writers were with this, after a decade of assorted chucklefucks failing to grok it at all.
>>83935030
Even writers that are normally okay, like Seeley, didn't get it at all in BRE. Like they didn't even try. For a series that was supposed to sell people on Cass, it did a real shit job at even explaining what she is.
>>83934268
Bullshit. Shitanie apologists I swear to god...
She forced her way into the Batfamily. Nobody fucking wanted her, but she thought she deserved it for some reason so before you know it fucking Batman himself is taking time out of his busy schedule to humor her. She'd get in way over her head and others would have to bail her out, because she had made herself their responsibility. Then Batman goes off the deep end and in a fit of bad writing he makes her Robin. She was awful and more a danger than help of course and was fired quickly. So she gets all pissy and steals some plans from Bruce, puts them into action out of a selfish need to prove herself a hero, and ends up fucking up royally and getting not only herself, but innocent people killed.
And then the waifufags apparently bombarded DC's offices with a record amount of angry letters, so they not only retcon her death, they kick Cass off Batgirl, and as if she hadn't already been insulted enough by that point, they replace her with the normie bimbo Stephanie. Because apparently fighting crime in Gotham really isn't a big deal, so all those times Batman and co got seriously hurt doing it are starting to make them look pretty pathetic. Why waste your whole life training if some dumb normie can do it with two weeks of karate lessons?
Also, with all the terrible and irresponsible shit she did, she just puts all the blame on Batman for some reason, since it's apparently his job to make sure she doesn't do stupid shit. She's an annoying fucking character who is only liked by waifufags and self-inserting tumblrinas.
>>83935213
Kelley Puckett and Damion Scott created Cass to be like a cartoon or shonen manga character that express physically, Puckett had written the Batman Animated comics and Scott art was heavily influenced by shonen manga, other writers and artists don't get the character because they don't understand sequential motion
>>83935349
>so they not only retcon her death, they kick Cass off Batgirl, and as if she hadn't already been insulted enough by that point, they replace her with the normie bimbo Stephanie.
DC had already had plans in place to kick Cass out. Stephanie was just a last minute decision given Gail Simone was the hurdle of changing Barbara back into Batgirl at that time.
> plans are in place for her in 2010.
> we didn't get actual plans until 2011.
>>83934615
>You will never have this relationship between David and Cass back
It hurts
>>83935030
Till this day I seriously cannot understand how some writers have such a difficult time understanding the simple core elements of her character. It's not like she is a complicated one.
>>83935213
That's because it was a Harper wankfest. No time for Cass.
>>83935569
>That's because it was a Harper wankfest. No time for Cass.
What is the deal with Harper? It's because Snyder created her that she is getting good treatment by DC? She looks like blue haired lesbian tumblrina.
>>83935667
Snyder originally created her because he couldn't use Cass. But she's like a discarded toy now because Cass is back and he's moved to Duke.
I think the only writer who liked her was Tynion IV.
>>83935349
War games was fucking rubbish, though, we should all just forget it.
>>83935667
Harper is like a discarded Warren Ellis character. You know he based like forty snarky aloof teen characters on people he saw on SuicideGirls? Harper is one that didn't make the cut.
>>83938024
>>Harper is like a discarded Warren Ellis character.
It would take Warren Ellis writing her to make me like her at this point. Then she would be a cool cyberpunk girl instead of a wannabe Robin in a gimp suit.that's just missing the ball gag.
>>83938337
For me, I don't think even that would cut it. BRE made me really hate her to the point I was just hoping she would fucking die and leave the panels to characters that deserve them.
>>83938024
>You know he based like forty snarky aloof teen characters on people he saw on SuicideGirls?
Well he needed someone to go with all the snarky aloof British guys in trench coats that were clear self-inserts.
>>83938925
I liked Ellis's comics, but he was really kind of shit when it came to characters.
>>83932309
>Damian and Jason are both better.
>Damian
Damian isn't better.
Maybe when he gets older, but right now he isn't better.
>>83935349
Way to rewrite history there, pal
>>83910215
I prefer Steph because I love her solo and her interactions with Damian, but Cass is by far the best one.
>>83941067
Dammit that's cute.
>>83941250
Nice empty reply
>>83912675
the writers wanted her to fail and used bruce to do it
bruce manipulated a teen from a broken home, used her and then discarded her
>>83914181
>timfags self insert fantasy
no thanks
>>83914084
>The underlining idea of Batgirl&Spoiler is the dichotomy of Cass' super fighting powers and Steph's above average mind while not being confined to not have action like Oracle.
it's more of cass' battle power combined with steph's street smarts, the super ninja girl with no childhood and the average gutsy muggle that grew up in a lightly more normal home (at least compared to cass)
>>83941602
>it's more of cass' battle power combined with steph's street smarts, the super ninja girl with no childhood and the average gutsy muggle that grew up in a lightly more normal home (at least compared to cass)
well, that' the underlining idea od Cass&Steph, the "civilian side".
Obviously a book would combine both....
>>83939324
Son of Batman is great you are a dumbass
>>83941499
He didn't manipulate shit. He didn't want anything to do with her. She forced herself upon Robin and wouldn't leave him the fuck alone, then by extension she got to be Batfamily because apparently nobody gave a shit anymore.
>>83931290
>They even took the friendship from Steph and Cass and swapped it for fucking Harper
I'm still mad about this.
It seems the only relationship that Steph had pre-new 52 they decided to keep was with fucking Tim, which became stagnant more than a decade ago.
>>83941793
He did, he made her Robin to make Tim come back.
>>83935349
My brother of African descent.
>>83941893
let's remember Tim isn't actually Tim.
>>83941995
Even worse.
Timsteph was cute when it started, but they really need to let it go at this point.
>>83941348
>and her interactions with Damian
> they are never going to interact again
feels bad, man
>>83941995
There needs to be another Tim spotted like the 3 Jokers.
>>83941781
He landed a cheap shot on Tim but the next time they fought Tim kicked his ass.
>>83934239
>>83934615
You know Cass is still repairable, but the fact that they ruined David?
That hurts.
That hurts a lot.
>>83943799
At least Orphan is dead. Every single part of that character was terrible, even without comparing him to the previous David Cain.
>>83943799
Shit like this is why, when people tell me 'No, nu52 isn't shit! Really! It's gotten better!', I still don't believe them.
Rebirth has been good so far, but David and Cass are so recent (in nu52 versions) that they're unlikely to really be touched by it...especially him. And Shiva...
>>83944316
I would have sooner waited and have Old 52 Cass come to Nu 52 universe or some shit like that
>>83944955
Not bloody likely.
How often do Batfamily members get involved with multiversal shit?
The best that can happen now is for her to get her memories back with everyone else.
>>83947366
>How often do Batfamily members get involved with multiversal shit?
not counting Bruce?
>>83941995
I hope they retcon everything with this impostor.
>>83943799
Really? Because everyone in her fucking childhood spoke to Cass in some way, so they took the one thing which defined her from her. How does her skills and powers work now? Seems the writers don't have any idea either.
The more I think about that shitfest BRE the more angry I get. Why did I even get my hopes up?
>>83943799
David is still repairable.
