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Was Disney better in the 80s and 90s when it was essentially animated Broadway musicals and not pop songs?
>menken and ashman power team
>>83395188
There isn't enough porn for those chicksand it upsets my boner
>>83395188
i hate to say it but yeah. faggy stage-musical music is a lot better than pop songs. that's why oliver and company is so irritating to watch.
so yeah if all these bitches were all over aladdin howcome he couldnt sell his body for money?
>>83395188
sameface
>>83396432
they were on screen for like five seconds, anon...
>>83395188
Tangled was pop songs. The Princess and the Frog, Frozen, and probably Moana (the songs are being written by the guy from Hamilton) are Broadway.
>>83397865
Let is go is not a broadway song, it is a pop ballad
>>83395188
Eww those Twigs on a pearl body proportions, its s shame that women were drawn as being elastic stretch dolls.
>>83396505
So were most of the animals in Zootopia and that has a shit ton of detail put into it unnecessarily.
Disney is objectively higher quality in visuals and storytelling than they have ever been. Their comedic relief characters don't hijack scenes (Like in Little Mermaid, Pocahontas), they've been more tonally consistent, the level of detail has been bumped up to a 900, and their stories are more interesting.
>>83399459
disney now or then?
>>83395188
Why were the late-80's to 90's so obsessed with Broadway anyway? I'm absolutely not complaining, I love the stuff, but it's pretty notable in a lot of animation from the era. It wasn't just theatrical animation either, the Spielberg cartoons and Simpsons come to mind as cartoons that frequently used or referenced it.
>>83398928
>let is go
Are you black by any chance?
>>83399504
Disney now. Everything Tangled and onward. Even Bolt wasn't that bad, but it's obvious every department took it to the next level once Tangled hit. Probably because in between that time, they spent so much time doing tech development as well as working on stories that have been on shelves for awhile.
They can afford to do way more revisions now than ever, which helps a lot, as is evident by Zootopia.
>>83395188
I used to hate it when a song broke out in any animated movie when I was a kid, but I've really come to appreciate it as an adult. The Broadway style songs are immensely better at story telling than pop songs, so I'm going with Broadway. It's nice to have a catchy pop song sprinkled in once in a while but I think they should be limited to one per movie.
>>83395188
Agreed. Menken and Ashman forever
>>83400000
Well this thread ended quickly.
>>83400044
No... stupid numbers are not going to stop this. You're a faggot.
>>83400114
Rude.
>>83398928
>a pop ballad
what's the difference?
really?
are you going to sit there and lie to me and say that broadway doesn't regularly feature shows with pop ballads
>>83400000
quints of truth
but seriously, I first noticed it watching beauty and the beast, and it finally clicked. i think thats what modern disney is missing, which is weird considering how many people "pretend" to love broadway and all its movie offshoots (rent, hairspray, etc)
>>83400132
Damn! school is out. I forgot.
>>83400223
My God, are you salty.
>>83400166
Pop ballads are things that could be played on the radio, where as broadway music is less likely
>>83400223
>posts "rude"
>calls anon salty
right back at ya
>>83400166
I kind of agree with you. Idina's 'let it go' isn't actually super pop-y. But when demi sings it then it's firmly pop.
>>83399459
>So were most of the animals in Zootopia and that has a shit ton of detail put into it unnecessarily.
Eh, the animals not so much. Once you watch the movie twice you can see where they reuse the models. There's exactly one male tiger model and like three wolf models.
The backgrounds are detailed as fuck, but they can only waste so much time on minor characters that don't say anything.
>>83400166
Heres an example
The first version is something you'd find on broadway and not on a pop radio station
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jBg3SZTU_Nk
The second version is the duet which sounds horribly 90s and perfect for radio play but would've sounded terrible in the film
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4WLzd86kj-k
>>83400331
>>83400214
I'm the guy who got the quints earlier. The reason that Broadway-type musical music is so much better than pop is that it is not beholden to cliche. Your average pop song is supposed to be as vague as possible so that as many people as possible will find it relatable. The girl in a love song is never named, no specific experience is mentioned, it could be about any goddamn thing. Common emotions packaged and sold.
The songs in musicals are forced to be about something. The lyrics have to reflect what's actually going on. That's why I've always liked the lyrics in musicals better than almost anywhere else. It's like there's some higher standard.
This is also why I violently despised Frozen. It was one vague feel good pop ballad after another. "Let it Go" for example was just one damned cliche after another: from "I tried to be a good girl" to the vague title refrain which could refer to the release of anything: revealing feelings, coming out as gay, etc
And the worst part is that it worked. There's nothing so bad about seeing a shitty film. But a shitty film or book or song that everyone but you reveres is the worst feeling in the world. It can make you feel insane. People fucking loved Frozen. This proved that the one thing that made musicals great was unnecessary. Frozen proved that musicals can be as stupid and generic as everything else. It set the art back, both musicals and animation, in my opinion. Compare the shit in Frozen to anything by Menken or Sondheim or Tim Rice and you'll see what I mean.
>>83396432
>>83399459
You saying?
>>83397865
>Tangled was pop
>Frozen was Broadway
Wtf are you smoking?
>>83401033
well said
>>83400847
Quintsguy here: you wanna see a REALLY cringeworthy example of a disney pop cover
Original:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o69amRNgeAM
Cover:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZemMpJmV6aA
>>83400401
Yeah but literally nobody cares about the demi version
>Second song is what Little Mermaid would sound like in 2016
i hope to god they dont to remakes
>>83402028
The champ is here.
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Je9ZfezquCI
>>83402357
oh lord that really is dreadful
>>83399990
>I used to hate it when a song broke out in any animated movie when I was a kid
You were that kinda kid? I hated that kinda kid so much. He would always start fidgeting and fucking up the best parts of the song by monkeying around.
>>83395188
I don't really like musicals either way, I think they're the weakest aspect of Disney movies.
>>83396190
> that's why oliver and company is so irritating to watch.
This. Broadway style musicals are timeless. Flavor of the moment "Let it go" modern day pop songs will start to feel dated within 10 to 15 years time.
>>83399459
FUUUUU!!
I love the cute side kick characters.
I just don't get people who hate the side kick characters in shows and films like Orko, Slimer, and the Gargoyles from the Hunchback.
They are fucking awesome and I hate all the hate they get. It's always the same complaints and they usually come from males.
>they're to cute
>they hijack the scenes
>they're annoying
>they talk and sound to cute / annoying
>I wanna see more action and less cute comedy bites
Fuck you man.
>>83400847
>not liking sparkly, echo-y 90's synth pop that STILL after all these years hits a deep, primeval nostalgic nerve of early youth and joy
I don't like you.
how come /co/ doesn't like pop music? I grew up with dad rock and by now all I listen to basically is pop music of all kinds
>>83401096
That's the point of that gag. Lemmings.
I don't ever wanna here the try song again...
>>83396432
and where is the problem?
>>83402357
Allow me to be your guide through the fiery depths of hell!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nakgtc9OVMM
>>83406999
>changing from dad rock to present pop
>>83396432
>not having fun with the triplets
>>83395188
I mean
Frozen WAS essentially an Animated Musical.
The songs were all written by Tony award winning writers.
>>83406753
It had its time, it the 90s it was great, its like they went to their casio keyboard, looked up rhythm 003 - R&B Ballad and sang karaoke over it. It doesnt hold up well for me anymore
>>83408231
I thought it was meh. I was going to say shit, but thinking about it I didn't feel that strongly about it.
>>83395188
They were better in the '90s when they did hand drawn animation. The CG stuff just looks like porcelain dolls brought to life. Especially when they animate humans. It looks awful.
>>83396432
Why would Genie bother creating hundreds of individual servant girls with unique features?
>>83406999
Shit taste, anon
>>83409298
>hand drawn animation.
This makes little difference to the quality of a movie. It's only a superficial thing. Being hand drawn doesn't make the movie better anymore than being CG makes the movie better. Really getting tired of you little shits whining about this all the time.
>>83395188
Frozen was a musical too, anon.
Menken used to be alright but he's shit now, and even when he was good he put out some stinkers. Newsies was fucking garbage.
>>83406386
>HURR LET IT GO IS STANDARD POP SONG DERP
You fucking dipshit, it's a power ballad. Frozen was written in the broadway style just like the older movies. Robert Lopez did Frozen after Avenue Q and Book of Mormon.
Pretty much the only Disney film in recent memory that didn't really have a broadway flair to the music was Princess and the Frog because they hired that idiot Randy Newman.
>>83399459
>Disney is objectively higher quality in visuals and storytelling than they have ever been.
>implying Frozen had an actual plot
>Tangled wasn't just ok
>Big Hero 6 wasn't the most banal capeshit movie ever
>Zootopia wasn't propoganda for multiculturalism with a clever sloth scene
>this new trend of 'surprise' villains
>CGI having more charm than traditional animation
No.
>>83409318
Because he can?
>>83395188
>I want Disney movies to be like they were in the 90's!
Ok, here's a movie musical with the score written by one of the most popular and prolific broadway writing teams alive today.
>It's not Menken so it sucks!
Well fuck you, then, everyone else likes it.
Also Menken stopped writing good songs over a decade ago.
>>83411670
>Also Menken stopped writing good songs over a decade ago.
No. The music/songs from Tangled were good. The songs weren't as immediately memorable as they used to be, but they were still good.
>>83411717
>complain that disney is too pop
>prop up Tangled as good
>>83411731
I didn't make that complaint. I was not that guy. I think Disney's songs are fine, though I'm glad we're getting movies without them now.
>>83411750
>I wasn't that guy
Well you're still wrong, I didn't think Menken could do worse than Newsies but he proved me wrong with Tangled.
>>83411768
I'm not wrong, you just have shit taste.
Robert Lopez and his wife are fucking amazing, OP, you don't know what you're talking about.
Whitman ain't bad either: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zNJxHVJtAVw
>>83411549
>it's a power ballad
You and I have very different definitions of power ballds.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ssL_b2lcmHk
>>83411768
How can someone not like the Music in Tangled?
>>83411572
>Zootopia wasn't propoganda for multiculturalism with a clever sloth scene
If it was then fucking kudos to them for not letting it interrupt the overall experience. Now I'm even more convinced they're back and better than ever before.
>>83411836
>He thinks power ballads have to be rock with shrieking effects pedals
Power ballads are rooted in soul, anon. It's more about the tempo and vocal timbre than it is about the backing.
>>83411856
>How can someone not like the most generic music Menken has ever shat out
The same way everyone can dislike Newsies. It's just lazy and boring.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eaeoDn23hOk&index=4&list=PLB492F0A47AACB3FE
>>83411871
>with shrieking effects pedals
I don't even know what this means. Are you referencing the Digitech Whammy?
>>83411871
>Power ballads are rooted in soul, anon
And Let it Go has zero of it. Seriously, she can barely hit the high notes and has hardly any body in her voice at all. Soul singers make powerful, incredible singing sound effortless. Let it Go sounds like it's two tones to high for the singer to manage comfortably.
>>83411894
..That's supposed to be bad? I mean, that does sound a bit Generic, but Tangled's music isn't. Unless we're talking about the scores and not just the lyrical songs. Which I would have to agree, Aladdin and the Little Mermaid both have instrumentals that I can recall off the top of my head; I can't think of any from Tangled.
>>83411856
>how can someone not like the music in tangled?
You're one of the people who in a couple of years will be complaining that nobody makes good music in movies anymore because it doesn't sound like a 2010 pop song.
>It's a "people with no formal education in music tries to analyze music" thread
>>83406319
You have weird fucking autism anon.
>>83412018
>Let it go has no soul
>Idina Menzel can barely hit the high notes
>Idinia Menzel has hardly any body in her voice at all
You went full retard, anon.
>>83412026
>That's supposed to be bad?
No, not at all. It's an entirely competent arrangement. The problem is that that's all it is. It's plain and boring. Not in any way memorable or exciting. Like Tangled.
>>83412060
>you can't say food tastes bad unless you're a chef
>>83411858
>If it was then fucking kudos to them for not letting it interrupt the overall experience.
Of a fairly mundane caper that was thematically confused?
>Now I'm even more convinced
Good for you Anon.
>>83412026
What the fuck is that?
>>83412099
Why do you think you have better taste in music than the next guy? What gives you such confidence?
>>83412083
>You went full retard, anon.
I see I'm arguing with a fanboy here, so I'll let you keep your shit opinion.
Broadwayfags are the worst.
>>83412125
I'm not the one arguing about taste in music, just hate the dumb argument you can't judge something unless you make do the thing you're judging
>>83412106
All I know is that he's from Miss Spider's Sunny Patch Friends and some anon had a LOT of pictures of him in a thread last year
>>83412147
You're a total retard if you think Menzel is reaching at any point in Let it Go. You don't know what reaching sounds like.
>>83412191
>You don't know what reaching sounds like.
Reaching sounds like saying that Broadway singers are anywhere near as good as real soul singers.
>>83412188
I'm pretty sure his name is Spiderus
>>83412188
But why does it look like a cross between Ted Cruz and an acid trip?
>>83412240
If you want to pretend that's what I said you go right ahead
If you think Let It Go isn't a power ballad you are objectively wrong.
>>83412191
>I am one with the wind and sky
Yeah, she's one with stuff she has no power over. This line existed entirely to rhyme with "Cry" in the next line.
The song has a few good lines and then is just half thought out crap to rhyme its way to the next meaningful bit
>>83412373
>weak ass voice
>weak ass lyrics
>no passion
>no heart
The only reason people even connect it with power is because of the pairing of the song with her building her ice castle. The song on its own has nothing that would deem it a power ballad.
Your only arguments are "You're wrong, retard", which means you have no argument other than that's what you've chosen to believe.
>>83408231
Just because it's a musical doesn't make it good. The thing with old disney stuff is they were GOOD musicals. The biggest difference I tend to see between the 90s stuff and say, Frozen, is lack of strong artistic direction. The songs all seem like they could have just been pulled from elsewhere, and are very off tonally with no overarching sound to them (theme). This extends to the look of the characters and environment too, there's tonal clashes all over the place. Serious political stuff with correctly proportioned human characters does not match cartoony out of left field gnomes and snowmen. At least the old Disney films made the cartoony side characters extensions of the environment and characters, and backseated them when things got heavy.
I mean, theres a reason Disney was caught flat footed by Frozen's success. They were comparing it to Brave, which strangely has a lot of similar plot elements. Mother figure with magical stuff going on. Family issues. Girl power. Brave executed on these with far greater artistic prowess than Frozen did. However Disney didn't anticipate that a blonde girl singing pop songs would be more successful than a ginger who didn't. Which really is obvious, but political correctness constantly tries to tell us otherwise.
>>83407863
>Posting a video that's considered torture by the Geneva Convention.
Not today, anon!
>>83396190
Nothing wrong with it, those homos can write catchy, memorable tunes. I don't fucking understand the love for Let It Go which sounds like some generic, B-tier pop song.
>>83397865
Something being Broadway doesn't necessarily mean it's what one would think of as a stage musical. They're thinking more your Rodgers and Hammerstein-style show tunes.
>>83412083
But Adele Dazeem is such a sexy chub, i would let her sit on my face and fart on it all day while she sings "Hello from the other siiiiiiide"
worst princess
>>83412452
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Let_It_Go_(Disney_song)
>"Let It Go" is a power ballad in the key of A-flat major overall, but begins in the relative minor (F minor)
Disney needs to go full on operatic.
>>83412548
It's ok, anon, you don't understand how musical genres or arrangements work and your ear for a tune is probably shit.
You'll be fine as long as you don't spout your uneducated opinions in public.
>>83412731
mmmm the production values of dat sequel. Feels bad mang.
>>83408231
The songs serve their narrative function fairly well, which is more than can be said for the attempts made by non-Broadway songwriters (look at how superfluous and narratively monotonous the songs in Princess and the Frog are).
But the majority of the music is cringingly generic mid-'00s fare, and the lyrics are uninspired and utilitarian at best, godawful at worst. I have/will always hate the phrase "love is an open door." It's like a middle-schooler just learned what a metaphor is.
Quints-anon has it right (though I'm personally ok with the film as a whole). Menken-Ashman and their ilk are god-tier and timeless, and I can only hope the inevitable Frozen-clone era doesn't last too long.
>>83412078
I wasn't the ADD child that couldn't stand still during a brilliantly written and composed musical number you uncultured swine.
>>83407786
Jafar fucked up. If he was going to force Princess Jasmine to wear a sexy red slave outfit he should have put her in something more raviling and sluttier like the outfits created by Genie to cock teas his boy Aladdin.
>>83414254
Love is an open door was a key phrase with different meanings to the two participants. It was actually quite clever once you know Hanz' motivation.
>>83412188
He makes me genuinely uncomfortable.
>>83416522
It was a generic flavor or the moment bubble teen pop song that sounded like it came straight from a glee / High School Musical soundtrack and Nothing more.
>>83416817
How to totally miss major themes and symbolism - A book by anon
>>83416817
Anon come on. Even kids get the song.
>>83408231
>The songs were all written by Tony award winning writers.
That doesn't mean much seeing that we live in a world where even the guy who wrote the music for High School Musical has received awards.
>>83415146
>apples
>not any other fruit under God's blue sky
Jaffar's so classless he didn't deserve shit
>>83417809
>>83417854
Frozen has as much of a point / "symbolism" as the new Femalebusters film does.
>>83412916
The sequel was actually shelved because it was thought it didn't live up to Disney's standards.
Eisner sat on it for a few years until he was like, "Screw it, we have no standards" and released it.
>>83412731
That movie was ruined by having to stick to the formula. Taking out the Gargoyles would have made it so much better.
>>83418617
>Jaffar's so classless
You are talking about a Disney villain in his 50s who not only made a sex slave out of a 15 year old Disney princess but also wanted to use his final wish to force Jasmine to fall desperately in love with him. Not only did he want her to do that shit. He also wanted her to love doing that shit.
The man literally did noting wrong.
>>83418631
>I know because I've seen the new Ghostbusters movie
Come on anon.
>>83418896
having decent fetishes doesn't excuse shit taste on fruits anon
>>83418984
>I know because I've seen the new Ghostbusters
I have and it's shit.
>>83419334
why did you do it? was it willingly? how do you feel? Are, are you ok, anon?
>>83396114
Of all teh things I didn't need to see today...
>>83418617
>>83419059
Fuck off, apples are great,
>>83419735
really? ok, which one is your favorite?
>>83420141
>>83420141
Easy, golden delicious.
>>83420304
>not gala
>or red delicious
>>83420141
everyone knows Granny Smith is the GOAT, right?
>>83420141
pink lady a best
>>83420141
what happened to disney
>>83395188
Ashman's death weakened them considerably. He knew how to write Broadway-style songs that worked within the story and had charm, here or in LITTLE SHOP OF HORRORS.
His successors didn't have the same deft touch.
Ashman was one of the saddest casualties of the AIDS era.
>>83401033
>>83400044
>>83400000
So many winning digits, so many winning posts
>>83406999
Goddamn man, broaden your horizons at least a little.
Carly Rae Jepsen's Emotion was pretty fine, though, so you've got that going for you.
>>83407564
They were hamsters, anon.
>>83419668
>not calling it raff.gif
>>83406484
I only have a problem if they hijack the show, like the worms did in MiB and get shoehorned in everything
>>83396114
God dammit NO just it's his freaking pants OH WHY BOTHER
>>83401096
That scene was extremely unsettling. Just...look at them eat those paw-cicles....
>>83412184
I agree with this guy. Being an elite/expert gives your argument more weight, but it doesn't automatically discredit the argument entirely.
Bullets shred through elitists all the same.
>>83420141
>Not based Empire apples
>>83420141
Red Delicious in this mother fucker.
Also, this proves you fags would argue over anything.
>>83420459
>>83420304
>not Granny Smith
>>83424372
God Dammit NO I just read >>83424372 as OH WHY BONER
I actually think that the reason Frozen pales in comparison to older Disney musicals is because they wrote it for the stage. The songs are full of easy exposition and direct address to the audience, and the whole film is paced like a stage musical. You can even tell where the interval is gonna be. It's obvious there's gonna be a Frozen stage musical somewhere down the line.
The older films had songs written by musical theatre composers, yeah, but they were written as films. There's nothing like Let It Go, where a character suddenly lays out her entire motivation and personality through song for nobody's benefit but the invisible audience.
>>83424746
>MFW Red bruddah
>>83424927
>>83420527
>I want Granny Smith people to go and stay go
