So Cap's not ACTUALLY part of Hydra, right? It's all just some kind of ruse, right?
Right?
>>83251145
Yes.
he SAYS hail hydra, so that means it's obviously permanent.
As permanent as your parent's love, OP.
Hol up.
Are you saying comic books might use outrageous plot twists that end up not what they seem for short term shock value that grabs headlines?!
Said it ain't so!
So, we placing bets here?
What are the odds of memory implants?
How about the odds of an alt universe Cap after all that Secret Wars shit?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zzjOjc1fHME
Yes OP, welcome to comics.
Get out while you still can.
>>83251145
Just think of him as the Superior Captain America. Does that answer your question?
>>83251595
>How about the odds of an alt universe Cap after all that Secret Wars shit?
Shit I could see Ultimate Cap turning HYDRA
>>83251145
Probably. It's comics, this shit happens all the time only to go back to the status quo.
>>83251870
But SpOck actually tried to be a hero and for all intents and purposes was a semi-decent hero
Here it's just another stupid cop-out to generate eyeball counts
>>83251913
How? He dought Hydra in the Ultimates and didn’t like them.
>>83251993
Ultimate Cap was a jackass compared to 616. I could totally see him working undercover all his career as a legit HYDRA spy
>>83251145
I think you have to read the comic to see how it plays out...
Well, since Tony Stark is still a double agent for Kang and Peter Parker is still just a clone made by Jackal, this must be just as permanent.
Marvel is changed forever now that this is revealed and Captain America will be the next big villain in the MCU after Thanos.
I'm pretty sure Red Skull boasting about having a master plan before is completely unrelated.
>>83251775
what a waste of a chin cleft
Hail Captain Hydra!
>>83251145
Don't worry OP. Cap is just telling them to contact Hydra, he's on a plane so he's using proper terminology but also a poor choice of words. He SHOULD have said "Radio Hydra." or "Contact Hydra." but forgot himself in the moment.
>>83251145
He just chose not to activate till now for a certain reason
>>83253210
>everyone lost their shit, got passionately angry, and organized literal book burnings
>all over a bad pun
>>83251145
No shit
That's what makes it so retarded. No on in their right mind would believe this for a second, but the characters are going to 100% buy this shit in it's entirety because the narrative calls for it
Tony Stark, Kang agent though is dead.
Franklin Richard simply aged up a teenage parallel universe counterpart of Tony's then raped his brain to give him old Tony's memories and disintegrated the real Tony Stark's body to keep it from being used against no longer Teen Tony
If this ends up being permanent (it won't) I honestly wonder how they'll play all of Cap's anti-Hydra antics in the past.
Like he was trained by Hydra as a boy to be sick and feeble just so he could get the SSS and becoming a WWII Champion of the United States so that he could infiltrate the higher echelons of American influence and social tiers at the cost of stopping Hydra a MULTITUDE of times including some times where by showing his true colors, Hydra could have achieved their goal of World domination only for that Hydra training to kick in now for some unknown reason.
Like that's som Next Level Keikaku
I wonder if the huge backlash is going to lead to issue #2 being hastily rewritten/redrawn to flat out state that Cap's being brainwashed/reality has been warped to make it look like Cap has been Hydra all along?
Supposedly, they've had to rewrite the Serpent Squad and upcoming Americop storyline to curb Spencer going full retard. Wonder if they will be doing the same to this arc and much quicker too.
OH GEE,GUESS YOU'LL HAVE TO BUY MORE COMICS TO FIND OUT
>>83253693
Assuming they don't backpeddle like crazy and go a Hydra civil war route (with Nazi Hyda run by Red Skull and Cap being part of secret society Hydra that Hickman created when he retconned Hydra being an ancient death cult), they will probably go the route that Cap was allowed to repeatedly beat up Hydra because of Viper and Baron Strucker being "loose canons" going against script via open attempts at world domination and needing to be put down because they routinely outed Hydra to the unwashed masses as evil shits out to take over the world.
Either way, I fully expect that Marvel is frantically rewriting their plans for Hydra Cap.
Note how in spite of all of their hype that Otto was going to rape by deception Mary Jane, they ended up pussying out on it when the internet exploded in flames over it?
That's going to happen now with Cap.
They are going to either A. make Cap be part of the "good part" of Hydra and probably assbend rape Hickman's "Hydra" retcon to reveal that one part of Hydra is SJW approved "good" and that Strucker co-opted Hydra to make it Nazi-like after the war.
Also, I would not be shocked if issue #2 has Cap still spewing SJW one-liners in regards to being part of the SJW sect of Hydra that is at war with the racist Trump-esque version of Hydra Red Skull is a part of. And for them to say Cap was recruited by Hydra as a kid BUT stopped attending meetings when the war broke out and he became Captain America and only recently, since the events of Standoff, has Cap reunited with the SJW sect of Hydra to bring Red Skull down.
>>83253707
What? What changes are you talking about?
>>83251145
SPENCER: Issue 2 will lay a lot of our cards on the table in terms of what the new status quo is, but the one thing we can say unequivocally is: This is not a clone, not an imposter, not mind control, not someone else acting through Steve. This really is Steve Rogers, Captain America himself.
>>83254190
Diamondback was supposed to go full-villain and go to jail at the end of the Serpent Solutions arc.
Someone at Marvel leaked this to Mark Gruenwald's widow (since Diamondback was based off of Mark's wife, who used to be a wild child before settling down) and she raised hell to Brevoort over it and Brevoort forced Spencer to rewrite the ending so that Rachel ended up turning on Viper and getting away with no consequences for her brief heel turn.
Also, the Americop arc (the next FalCap arc) was heavily revised from what Spencer originally pitched/wrote because the story was too critical of police to see the light of day.
>>83254220
I believe it when I see it.
Seriously, they are going to pull an Otto/MJ and damage control like hell for issue #2 while doing their damnest not to abort the fucking storyline outright.
Just like they promised Otto would fuck MJ while wearing Peter like a flesh suit then caved to the backlash and then lie like hell that Otto NOT raping MJ was the plan all along, they will backpeddle like crazy and then refuse to acknowledge that they backpeddled at all.
>>83254151
>Also, I would not be shocked if issue #2 has Cap still spewing SJW one-liners
Oh Cap will. But it'll be FalCap.
>>83254310
That anon was lying because they also said things that were outright impossible about Spencer and DC and Evans.
>>83254134
>>83254394
>damage control
this is the most people have been talking about marvel comics in years
I wouldn't be surprised if they just double down and have peter parker join isis
>>83254220
they should put it on the cover.
>THIS IS NOT A CLONE!
>NOT AND IMPOSTER!
>NOT MIND CONTROL
>NOT SOMEONE ELSE ACTING THROUGH STEVE!
>READ THE SHOCKING AND ABSOLUTELY STORY OF HOW STEVE ROGERS HAS ALWAYS BEEN AN AGENT OF HYDRA
http://panels.net/2016/05/26/on-steve-rogers-1-antisemitism-and-publicity-stunts/
Is making Steve a Nazi offensive to Jews? This article writer's (pretty much only) point is that his creators were Jewish and he was created in a time when a lot of Jews were dying/being discriminated against.
>>83254310
Do the Gruenwalds even have any sway/importance in the eyes of Marvel these days?
I mean, Ed Brubaker routinely shitted on Mark Gruenwald's run by claiming he wrote Cap as a pussy became Ed wanted a Cap who indiscriminately killed while Gruenwald came up with the story that codified the notion that Cap America refuses to kill anyone unless it was a literal "kill or be killed" situation and even then, only as an absolutely last resort.
>>83251145
Cap is part of Hydra. He believes in Hydra's ideals. Cap has always been part of Hydra. He has always believed in Hydras ideals. This is not a ruse. Everything up until this point has been a deception. The Cap we knew never existed. This is canon now.
>>83251595
>Yfw this actually IS Ult Cap
Holy shit that would be awesome.
>>83254522
They're reaching like every other media outrage machine. A character can be shaped and evolved, original intent be damned. The really issue is how stupidly lazy the concept is/executed.
Plus, it's just gonna be spectacular Spider-Man all over again. He'll be normal in no time but no one will trust him until they reboot the character again.
>>83254487
Not exactly; they said DC was kissing Spencer's ass, offering him A-List books to come back and Spencer simply using the standing offer to blackmail Marvel into giving him Bendis-level protection from editors status.
>>83254611
And that sounds impossible.
>>83254512
This is my favorite so far.
>>83251595
I think it has to do with the Cosmic Cube girl Kobik. When making Captain America young again she most likely altered his past and it needs to be corrected
>>83254662
So Cap is gonna' have to kill a little girl?
I mean we could just toss her off a bridge and ask Spider-Man to save her, we'd get the same results.
>>83251145
The thing is I don't care that he's Hydra or anything like that, but this was such a horrible left field twist to end on that it left a bad taste in my mouth.
I mean what is with recent comics and the shock value endings in hopes of getting headlines, what happened to trying to tell a good story?
>>83251145
Are you retarded?
>>83254700
I doubt that's what's going to happen. I presume it will probably be some kind of time fuckery bullshit that is used to make sure Captain America's timeline stays intact and he never joins Hydra
>>83251145
The really funny thing is Lee and Kirby created HYDRA as Nick Fury's equivalent to SPECTRE (and Lee had the catchphrases already in the very first issue they appeared in).
It wasn't until Steranko took over that he revealed Strucker was the head of HYDRA.
So turning a Jack Kirby creation into Nazis was already done while Jack Kirby was working at Marvel.
>>83254713
>what happened to trying to tell a good story?
Good stories don't make money. Just look at Bayformers.
>>83251145
He'll be part of a secret faction of Hydra that is benevolent, before Stucker changed it to an evil organization. Screencap this.
>>83254634
If DC was able (and successfully I might add) to get Greg Rucka back, you think they wouldn't try and get Spencer back?
IIRC the poster said they offered him a couple of high profile books (including Suicide Squad), and a Bat-villain ongoing title with all of the A-List villains.
And again, it said that Spencer simply used the offer to get his way on the Cap book, which means while he still hates DC, he's not above trying to play DC against Marvel to get his way.
>>83254790
Alas I know this to be true, but I guess I was hoping for at least some good
he's evil
>>83253210
If that is true I will buy this series.
>>83254787
Steranko is a Nazi.
>>83252054
Because he was an ultra-nationalistic conservative? That really doesn't make sense pal.
>>83254555
Nah, he has just realized that his ideals are unrealizable in the real world because the people he wants to give equality will subvert and degrade it.
Hydra's methods will lead to the best possible world. Hail Hydra.
>>83254794
>Spencer hates DC
And this is because...?
>>83254794
How badly did Spencer burn his bridges at DC?
I know he shit talks DC on Twitter, but so does everyone in the industry since New 52 started.
>>83254994
>Nah
>proceeds to agree with me
Since we're talking about Hydra, have they ever gone against Doctor Doom?
>>83251145
I'm going to sort-of repeat myself here. Now in a month you'll be glad you screencapped and was smarter than everyone else.
>>83251145
He's not part of Hydra. Nick Spencer is just a fucking hack, still, again, as usual.
>>83255034
They pulled the rug out from under him on Supergirl.
>>83255164
He is, but a good Hydra.
>>83255191
This. If AIM can be heroes then why can't HYDRA?
>>83255209
He pushed Jack Flag off to his apparent death while lamenting the necessity of his action.
>>83255034
>>83255042
IIRC it's a combination of two things:
1. New 52. Spencer got fired from Supergirl, which to his credit he had turned from a god-awful shit comic to one of the best Superman books on the market during his short run.
2. THUNDER Agents. It was a vanity project of Spencers', using characters DC acquired but had been sitting on due to issues with the original creator having creative control over the franchise and DC not being able to do anything new with it because of the veto power, until the creator of the character died.
Spencer was given the franchise to reboot and it was a huge passion project for him and it got canceled due to shit sales. Spencer was butt-hurt like hell, as he felt that DiDio should have kept the book going, even if it didn't sell at all, as a favor to him to keep him happy.
>>83255247
Exactly, if he was truly evil then he wouldn't have any regrets.
>>83255249
>which to his credit he had turned from a god-awful shit comic to one of the best Superman books on the market during his short run.
You must be mistaking him for someone else. He was going to have a Supergirl run, but he ended up co-writing a single issue.
>>83255249
The THUNDER Agents thing was kinda bullshit though because it was a mini that was cancelled prematurely. It's one thing to cancel an ongoing because of shit sales, it's another to cancel a mini. Even if the floppie sales sucked, they could have probably made up the loss through trade sales, but then they couldn't put out a trade because it was never finished.
>>83255334
Also Didio keeps books that should be cancelled due to sales going all the time. Just look at Jonah Hex/All-star Western. That should have been cancelled like 2 dozen issues before it was but Didio kept it going at a loss because he loves Jonah Hex.
AND they did jack fucking shit in terms of advertising the book. I didn't even realise it existed until it was already cancelled.
>>83255334
They released a trade of THUNDER Agents volume 1 a couple of months after vol 2 started. They knew what they were getting jack.
>>83255518
They gave Spencer 16 issues, which is 4 more than Omega Men got and that guy got an exclusive deal.
With SHIELD becoming more and more questionable under Maria Hill, I'd love to see Cap bring in his own version of a "good" HYDRA to go against it.
>>83255560
By the way I checked and vol 2 was always solicited as a six issue mini, so if it was cut short by 4 issues, it was done so before the first had been released. If Spencer got pouty and refused to change his story, that's on him. The floppies didn't sell, the first trade didn't sell, he was a failure.
This made me want to go out and buy Thunderbolts Classic.
Is that weird?
>>83255679
I sincerely hope that's what happens, if only because I think it would be funny for Cap to infiltrate HYDRA and make a 'good' branch
>>83251145
1,000 hours in GiMP
>>83251145
Who cares? It will just get written off in a year or so as so brainwashing or some shit. It's a fuckinh comic book.
>>83251145
See this kinda shit is why I stick to the movies.
a) its mind control
b) Hydra wasn't necessary an evil organization (as seen in the flash back) and Steve is trying to bring back the "good" hydra
c) he's pretending to be Hydra to trick them into letting him in
>>83256739
If he was a member of HYDRA as a kid, that's long before the war and the nazi influence. I really doubt that Cap being HYDRA means he was suddenly working for the nazis all along like everyone is claiming. People are way oversimplifying HYDRA's history. It's possible that Steve's values and ideals are still the same as they have always been.
I'd love to see Steve take over HYDRA to fuck up SHIELD.
>>83253780
> genius marketing
>>83255164
>Nick Spencer is just a fucking hack, still, again, as usual.
How much of this Spencer and how much of this editorial directed shenanigans? This very much feels like forced controversy to me.
I'm giving Spencer the benefit of doubt because Superior Foes and The Fix are both great.
>>83258694
In interviews he talks about how he presented this plan all the way back in 2014 and was expecting to be shot down or have to fight for it, but that everyone was surprisingly on board.
The idea of Steve always being HYDRA chills me to the bone but I'm alright because I don't think they'd ever do that.
But the fact that there's a part of me thinking "would they?" means they're doing something right.
I doubt a HYDRA agent could ever lift mjolnir.
>>83255209
Because they are straight up Nazis? AIM is just scientists and a highly fractured organization is a hilarious amount of divisions, cells and branches.
Now if we were going into MCU territory then Cap launching a infiltration into HYDRA backstopped with help from Nick with a story that he was HYDRA all along. And not playing gotcha with the audience then this could be something.
>>83254151
It takes too long to draw an issue for them to change issue #2 in any significant way. It's extremely, EXTREMELY unlikely they'll change anything. Brevoort ain't a bitch and Spencer doesn't seem too bothered by the reaction.
It's just a 6-12 issue story arc about Cap being mindraped by the Red Skull. It's not even particularly subtle for a "shock" cliffhanger. Gee, the mysterious woman who recruited Steve's mom in a sepia toned flashback is wearing red? I can't imagine what that could possibly mean. Motherfuckers need to relax.
>>83251595
The most interesting theory I've seen is that he really is part of Hydra, but it's a part that's splintered off from the Red Skull-led sect long ago and is actually good.
But he killed Jack Flag so that's out.
>>83259095
>Because they are straight up Nazis
They aren't though
>>83251145
This is the most interesting thing Caps done in years
>>83259293
Then what are they?
>>83259340
Terrorists
>>83259340
Just curious- have you only watched the movies for your knowledge on HYDRA? I feel like that's what's causing all this CAP IS A NAZI outcry.
>>83259340
Generic fascists.
>>83259419
Which is confusing, since in the movies HYDRA is only embezzling resources from the Nazis. "Berlin is on this map!"
>>83259393
And so is Cobra. But We've seen that Cobra gives a damn about the people that live under their rule and honestly seek to better their lives, under Cobra.
What does HYDRA do, for anyone?
>>83259419
Oh I know I'm just partly playing devils advocate on this. Cap as taken then place of Superman in the minds of plenty of the viewing populace as the upstanding figure of right.
And since they are being exposed to this its akin to having Superman come out as a White Supremacist.
>>83251145
>hydra starts talking like /pol/
>Caps is part of Hydra
I see no problem with this.
>>83259553
>We've seen that Cobra gives a damn about the people that live under their rule and honestly seek to better their lives, under Cobra.
So did the Nazis, what point are you trying to make here?
>>83254134
>>83254512
moar?
We all know that characters routinely "die", get "replaced", universes get rebooted, etc. for temporary sales boosts but the problem with this is that it's such an absurdly dumb plot-twist. It's like if we were told G.I. Joe were secretly members of Cobra all along or Batman and Joker were secretly close friends. It'd be easier to believe Wonder Woman has a dick because we've never seen her vagina, whereas Captain America has been fucking up Hydra's shit for decades.
Why is it that people always think the latest issue of anything is the permanent ending? Like Widow and Hulk was supposed to be the ultimate relationship? I mean, do they think Cap is Hydra and that's final? What is he going to do in the future issue? Try to lure Wiccan, Wanda and Magneto into a trap?
Mario is actually a Bowser secret agent.
>>83259629
Hydra barely any development as an organization ever. Part of the reason I think AoS has been such a fucking train wreck is trying to build with something that was never really that well put together in the first place.
If HYDRA looked and acted more like COBRA people might not just pin this as Cap doing a heelturn and being a villain now.
>>83259677
Even Buzz Dixon (writer of /co/'s favorite Christian Manga, Serenity) is getting in on this.
Good times!
>>83259701
Diana has been subject to skimpy censor-steam and she either shaves or never had any
Goku was actually a part of Freeza's army all along.
>>83259419
But Hydra isn't Nazi in the movies. They're explicitly multicultural and far more idealistic.
>>83259965
That's not really explained rather well. Most watching will just be "oooh THEY ARE WORSE THAN HITLER"
>>83259878
Fuck, this one made me kek.
>>83260026
It's hard to miss that many of their members aren't white.
Heck, in Civil War, when the survivors of the raid unmask in the opening scene, they're all minorities.
>>83259878
>>83259878
I don't get it?
>>83260069
To be fair those guys aren't HYDRA. Crossbones is leading them but the group itself just seems to be generic terrorists
>>83259701
Considering there's been all sorts of reality warping bullshit going on lately it just seems like an overreaction to something that'ss probably going to get reset in 6 months
>>83259893
Fuhnuck?
>>83260135
They're stated to be HYDRA. His HYDRA buddies in Winter Soldier were also multicultural, though less blatantly.
>>83260263
I think its Canadian
Samus has been an undercover agent for Ridley this whole time.
>>83260135
Don't forget Sitwell
>>83260101
/co/posting
>>83259965
Yes, but they made their origin directly tied to the nazis in Cap1. Most people can't see past that.
>>83259965
WE WUZ NAZI
>>83260781
HYRDA murdered Herman Goering and were going to nuke Berlin along with NY. Did they even watch the fucking movie?
Hydra is a fascist, totalitarian organization brought west by the nazis von Strucker and Red Skull. They're supposed to be worse than Hitler.
I'm not sure what people in this thread are arguing about.
Superman was actually Lex Luthor's secretary THE ENTIRE TIME!
>>83261412
Hitler was a chill guy. Hydra are comic book villains. But Red Skull seems to be coming around based on his latest speech.
>implying he's wrong
>>83261524
What's wrong is exploiting people's fears to turn them into the very thing he's saying they need to be saved from.
>>83251145
Hydra's another evil comic book organization, and heroes turning evil for an arc has happened, billions of times.
Should have went for Heil Hitler. Or Allahu Akbar if you want to be modern.
>>83261412
I thought it was just Strucker, Skull wasn't invilve until later for one Cap arc and he wa just using HYDRA to further his own schemes but Red Skull has a habit of taking over other groups (Watchdogs, Militia, a Black Liberation Movement etc...) and manipulating them into doing what he wants.
Strucker is all for making HYDRA.
>>83261879
Yeah, his diagnosis is spot on, but his cure is just as bad as the disease.
>>83259893
Actually Buzz Dixon went into more detail in the comments section
>>83261524
This is one of the worst parts of the comic, it tries to impose Trump onto the Red Skull.
>>83259248
noice, haven't seen that fanfic referenced since like 2008
>>83261524
This is 100% right. Too bad the writer fucked it up with the suicide bomber memes afterwards.
>>83251145
I think you just gave my eye rolling muscles a hernia
thanks fucker now I have to have eye surgery
For all we know he is a double agent. Hell there are a shitload of things it could be. There is no way that marvel ruins one of their iconic heroes. It is literally a fake out to generate buzz and sales, and it worked like a charm.
>>83251145
You'll open the comic and it will have nothing to do with Hydra at all.
Like all the bait comics.
>>83261524
I thought sixasis was over?
Remember how Peter was dead?
>>83261524
>abandon cultural identity and homeland to immigrate to another country for personal gain
>generations later, cry when other people immigrate to the same country but respect their culture enough to bring it with them
Americans crying about the loss of their shallow "culture" and "values" will always be hilarious.
I mean is just one issue.
Probably little Steve heard the ideals of Hydra and he was all "yeah that sounds great" then he couldn't help Hydra or whatever because weakness so he went to the army and realize Hydra was bad but his mom was probably Hydra so to stay loyal to his mom he said Hail Hydra because reasons
>>83264804
so you're admitting that's what's going to happen?
>>83264981
>American "culture"
>diabetes and school shootings
>>83264804
I know we brought our culture to America because my family has a work ethic.
>>83251595
No don't be silly a comic would never do that
So did this do any significant damage to DC's Rebirth?
I hear more people talking about this than Rebirth.
>>83265101
>2016
>unironically preferring middle eastern culture over western
I gotta be talking to a muzzie at this point.
>>83265101
>european "culture"
>whining and getting raped by brown people
>>83265358
maybe if they rape enough we'd get a 4th reich going to unfuck it all
>>83265166
So you admit that you're Mexican in a /pol/ thread?
>>83251145
He did it for ethics in gaming journalism.
>>83265698
I fail to see the goobergate aspect of any of this, so your joke isn't entertaining me.
Why the fuck does anyone even care? It's such a boring twist and boring storyline. It boggles my mind that people at all find this interesting. It's so against the characters grain that it's obviously an asspull, so there's no drama whatsoever.
All this grace and tact from the same guy that wrote the Red Skull, one of the most unequivocally evil beings, as a tame democrat discussing refuges in the same issue.
Amazing Spider-Man 700 was shit, but at least there was a sense of gravitas. Peter actually died. Otto became this strange crazy version of Spider-Man. With this, it's just... shit. He'll pretend to kill people for a few issues and in the 6th it'll all be revealed to be a dumb plan and everyone was fine.
I can only assume Mouseketeers are shilling this, because this entire idea is so forgettable.
>>83266022
didn't his issue also show his mother was brainwashed by hydra this whole time and raised him as some double agent bullshit? there's so much bullshit implications that it's more bullshit than most "shocking" things marvel puts out.
He's as much a permanent member of HYDRA as he is dead and rotting in the ground after Crossbones killed him.
>>83266265
>not a fishing pole
Missed opportunity desu
its happening
>>83251145
Yes, it is eventually going to be buried once the hype fades, and Marvel just like DC will delete it from the canon.
>>83269561
>>83269800
This shit is gonna go places. Topfuckingkek
>>83270192
Can someone do an edit of Gene Wilder's Willy Wonka saying "You're a regular, here"
>>83262482
I'd buy a book about wonder woman being a hooker turning tricks.
>>83266265
I can't believe that Kylo's actual face is stupider than Max's.
>>83270192
>>83270617
>>83254713
>recent comics and the shock value endings
fucking casuals I swear, click b8 marketing, bullshit GUESS YOU'LL HAVE TO BUY THE NEXT ISSUE endings have been going on since forever ago.
>>83251145
hypnosis,brainwash,mind control,spying,swap body, possession .....
I have no idea why are people even mad about this.
>>83253789
>Assuming they don't backpeddle like crazy and go a Hydra civil war route (with Nazi Hyda run by Red Skull and Cap being part of secret society Hydra that Hickman created when he retconned Hydra being an ancient death cult), they will probably go the route that Cap was allowed to repeatedly beat up Hydra because of Viper and Baron Strucker being "loose canons" going against script via open attempts at world domination and needing to be put down because they routinely outed Hydra to the unwashed masses as evil shits out to take over the
This. I want this.
>>83271719
>>83271899
So he's infiltrating Hydra then?
>>83271957
Or Red Skull cosmic cube'd him to alter history
What if it is a switch side thing, Cap takes Hydra and Red Skull has Shield now.
>>83273406
oh shit like a wife swap?
>>83273509
pretty much.
>>83271868
TOO FAR
>>83251145
nobody actually reads captain america comics so none of us knows the answer, wait until marvel makes another captain america/avengers movie to find out.
>>83272075
What the what? Red Skull has a chunk of Professor X brain hooked up underneath that red skull, he's got mind control powers now, that's not altered history, that's altered memories. He doesn't need a cosmic cube to fuck with Steve's head these days.
>>83269561
TOO FAR!
>>83254790
But that made lots of money, didn't it?
R E D S K U L L H A S P S Y C H I C P O W E R S
>>83273952
so he hypnotized shield to be his cronies and cap took over hydra. It's the perfect plan.
>>83262390
I fear for the people that don't get that. That's exactly why this sort of reality and fear-based propaganda is so successful and what leads normal, well-meaning people into following horribly manipulative leaders. They're saying shit that makes sense, but the actions and solutions they have are what's wrong.
>>83274149
that is true, it's just most people constantly have problems and go with anything that sounds good. If you try to make it political to America, none of the politicians are good.
>>83251145
give it a year or two
>>83274190
It's not just America. It's leaders everywhere during all times. Politics, religion. They start by addressing real fears and problems, and manipulate that by saying the solution is something that normal people wouldn't usually buy into, but go along with because they're desperate for solutions. People are crying this is Trump or whatever, but the only reason it sounds so similar is because Trump is using the same methods as every other leader who rises to power during a time that a nation is this level of hopeless and angry. It's rhetoric designed to sound reasonable and appealing at a base level, that's exactly how these leaders sell themselves.
>>83274266
yup, that's spot on, it's just humanity won't ever change unless we are 1)wayyyyyyy to over populated, 2) have space colonies, or 3)aliens visit
>>83273759
You're forgetting something very important, anon/co/ doesn't read comics
>>83273952
>>83273759
My theory is the Red Skull in CapSteve #1 is the original, somehow escaped from his Zola body & not the clone that stole Xavier's brain that appeared in Uncanny Avengers v1.
>>83251145
>It's all just some kind of ruse, right?
Literally exactly what it is. If you can't fool your friends you'll never be able to fool your enemies. Forget that 'memory imprint' theory because that's rubbish. He's just setting up for having a big laugh when he stabs Hydra in the back and brings them down to the ground. But for that to happen he'll be hailing Hydra with a straight face for a while.
>>83274349
That goes against literally everything that set up this run
>>83274419
I haven't read most of Standoff. I take it some hidden detail I missed is in there?
So does that mean Tony Stark was the good guy all along in the civil war and Steve is a hypocrite?
>>83274498
Yeah,
Zemo makes a hostage Steve take a walk across supervillian town with a disguised but telepathic Red Skull.
If this ends up being some kind of Modern Super-Dickery dredged up from the Silver Age I'll go out and buy five issues of the reveal.
Too lazy to make it but
>It wasn't me, Dio.
>>83274956
>It was you, Jonathan!
>>83251145
Yes, it's a ruse by Marvel Comics to make sure you keep giving them your money in exchange for them shitting on your face.
>>83273759
Hmm. I said that because of the "no mind control" thing Spencer said. But I guess altered memories are different from being directly controlled
>>83274336
I do read comics, just not current Marvel comics other than Vision
>>83251145
My speculation: Steve is HYDRA, but his personality remains the same. He'll fight HYDRA's enemies, but eventually will decide Red Skull is a massive cunt and punch him out, starting a reformation of the organization.
It's a ruse, he's being brainwashed by Xavier, who IS the real Hydra agent from the start. You really think his obsession with Homo Superior was for humanitarian reasons?
>>83254522
I don't know, is Israeli politicians demanding concentration camps for certain demographics offensive to Jews?
Will this finally be the thing that makes SJW fuck off of comics and we can finally have them back
>>83251145
Aren't you supposed to raise your hand when you say it?
>>83251210
KEK
And it just makes Red Skull look reasonablesince the issue he's addressing is a really big fucking problem in Europe right now and they are trying to force it into the US as well
>>83279217
Both hands.
They did a good job though. Even my little brother is getting Hail Hydra memes on his social media. Believe me when I say that if he's getting that, it's really gone mainstream. This will get them a lot of attention and might convince quite a few people to pick up comics. Any of the people who are mad right now will learn how comics work when this storyline wraps up and then come back anyway.
>>83270192
Should be "No more mutants"
Just posting this here.
http://time.com/4347224/captain-america-hydra-agent-marvel-tom-brevoort/
This all really does have to do with the election.
>>83251145
It depends. If Trump wins the election, it's permanent because America has rejected the joys of Globalism, the dirty racists. If Trump loses the election, we'll see context given to those flashbacks where young Steven is offered to join the Hydra Society and rejecting it like the good goyim he is.
>>83259095
Setting aside the fact that HYDRA aren't Nazis. AIM was HYDRA's science division that then splintered off to become their own orginization. So if you consider HYDRA Nazis, which you shouldn't, then you'd have to consider AIM nazis as well by association.
>>83271376
But didn't this actually happen?
>>83270617
>>83271411
>>83280638
Who are these guys?
>>83278981
I recognize Toph, but who's Mango Duke?
>>83251145
He's gonna turn out to be DOUBLE deep cover. There, he isn't brainwashed and technically is a member of HYDRA, Spencer wasn't lying, and Cap is still a good guy.
>>83282618
Yes, as did the Spider-Man is a clone one. That's the point. It makes no sense with what is previously established and just like Hydra Cap it will be returned to the status quo before the end of the storyline
>>83254220
Don't have the page but I think in the black Captain America comic they set up some nonsense about some sort of reality-warping device.
It'll likely turn out reality was warped to make Captain America a Hydra agent, then eventually things will reality-warp back to normal.
It's fucking stupid.
Everyone ignore it. Don't buy the comic just to see how bad it is or anything. Don't talk about it, don't look it up. Let Marvel fail and know what they did wrong.
>>83252054
>He was a meanie so he could be a legitimate HYDRA spy
Why is everyone on this board so easy to make fun of?
Is there a King Crimson edit yet?
>It doesn't work
>>83258274
Wasn't there a retcon somewhere that Hydra has always been racist, etc and the nazis were just a small off shoot of it? Or am I confusing shit?
>>83259293
>They aren't though
No one cares about your fanfic floppies, we're talking about the main universe. You know, MCU.
>>83259950
That's technically true actually.
>>83261085
That just means they're Super Nazis, so Nazi they even wanna kill regular Nazis for not being Nazi enough.
>>83269800
>My brother made some persuasive arguments.With his trappy butt.
>>83283360
>Don't have the page but I think in the black Captain America comic they set up some nonsense about some sort of reality-warping device.
Which is Kobik, the same "device" that created Pleasant Hill and deaged Cap. So it's quite possible.
>>83269800
Fixed
