https://archive.is/jgHFE
>Diverse comics aren't selling.
>N-not everyone buys their comics from places you can track like bookstores or Walmart!
>S-some borrow from their friends or read from a library!
>C-comic shops aren't friendly and inviting so we can't buy the comics there!
>C-comics are too expensive to buy!
>C-comics need MORE diversity to make me want to buy them! They're just not diverse enough!
Well they should know it's a niche market. If they want to pander to squirrelkins they need to wonder how many squirrelkins actually buy comics on a regular basis.
>>82209965
3 of those are correct tho.
Why Ms M of all people? She's not a top seller but she's always pretty solid for a newbie.
>>82209965
She even admits that she doesn't buy comics, has no intention of buying comics, that no one else on tumblr buys comics or ever will, and then says that Marvel should keep making comics for people who don't actually buy them.
This is like saying that Marvel/DC should do whatever pirates want. IF YOU DON'T ACTUALLY BUY THE COMICS THEN YOUR OPINION ON THEM DOESN'T MATTER.
>>82209965
>SJW Pandering Comics Flopping
Are the Dark Ages coming to an end?
Can we blame the readers for those used cars for sale?
>>82209965
Ms. Marvel isn't SJW pandering though, it just so happens to be the one diamond in the turd pile.
>>82210107
Nope. They're just gonna try harder.
>>82209965
>N-not everyone buys their comics from places you can track like bookstores or Walmart!
This is partly true, though. Ms. Marvel does well on Comixology, IIRC. And Bookscan is good enough for getting a rough estimate of how well TPBs sell at non-comic shops.
>S-some borrow from their friends or read from a library!
That's definitely not gonna help sales enough.
>C-comic shops aren't friendly and inviting so we can't buy the comics there!
This might be true in some areas. There's a lot of better comic shops now, but some places may still have really bad comic shops that look like the worst of the 90's shops.
>C-comics are too expensive to buy!
This is true, though. But I think that means they can go get the TPBs instead. Problem is, if the monthly doesn't get supported, it's less likely to get collected.
>>82209965
Diversity is good. It can't replace quality writing and content, but anyone that actually gets upset over it just nauseates me.
>>82210090
She's always at a safe 30-35k.
This is amazing, Secret Wars and Convergence are the gifts that keep on giving.
>>82209965
>Latonya
It is amazing she is not unemployed with that name, what the fuck is wrong with black people?
>>82209965
>>Diverse comics aren't selling.
True
>>N-not everyone buys their comics from places you can track like bookstores or Walmart!
True. I've never even seen a paperback at a Wal-mart. Maybe a trade or two.
>>S-some borrow from their friends or read from a library!
This is a poor excuse. If you like comics, you buy them.
>>C-comic shops aren't friendly and inviting so we can't buy the comics there!
This is without a doubt true. There needs to be a normie ambassador program or something set up in most of these nerdhavens. Comics are going the way of the movie. We need normies to increase the margins.
>>C-comics are too expensive to buy!
You KNOW this is true. Comics should be 2.50 tops.
>>C-comics need MORE diversity to make me want to buy them! They're just not diverse enough!
This is retarded. This is only ever said by strawmen. No actual "progressive" says this because they know the rebuttal.
>>82209965
Nevermind that shit, there's used cars for sale.
>>82209965
>it's another "let's bitch about SJWs ruining comics" thread made and perpetuated by people that likely don't read comics either
Oh joy.
>>82210090
The article's from the Mary Sue, so their image is to show a title with diversity that's actually consistently successful.
>>82210090
Because she's the flagship "DIVERSITY" character.
>>82210112
>Ms. Marvel isn't SJW pandering
>>82209965
>MUH DIVERSITY
No. Fuck you. I like Kamala because she's a good character and her stories and supporting cast are great as well.
Saying that one should like a fictional character only because of their skin color isracist.
>>82210226
y-you too?
>>82210183
>Diversity is good.
Diversity is a marketing buzzword.
>>82210112
lol, it's not popular in the slightest, people just want lewds and 34 of Khan.
Here's the article the article linked in OP is responding to.
https://archive.is/cQukL
>>82210107
It is simply The End Anon.
Soon the industry will crash, and in its ruins, it will be reborn or wither away.
>>82210224
Here is a reply for your mediocre effort at flamebait. You can now feel you had social interaction for the day.
>>82210107
No. They haven't tried putting more diversity into their diversity yet.
>>82209965
Is this Mary Marvel's niece or some shit?
I still question if this implied someone at Marvel had a bit more self-awareness than most of them.
I felt betrayed by Ms. Marvel as a fan of Alphona.
>>82210101
>The way I buy comics now is somewhat influenced by how I purchased comics growing up. Every birthday or Christmas, my mom would take me to buy manga from Barnes and Nobles. Occasionally, she’d buy me a cheap Archie Digest comics from the grocery store counter. While I don’t buy these kinds of comics anymore, I still remain frugal when I buy digital comics from Comixology.
stop fucking lying fag. You don't need to lie to win a argument you stupid fucking loser.
>>82210240
Subjective opinion. I think media and creations that anti-SJW cattle approve of are boring, samey and depressing overall, while stuff they hate is often fun or at least harmless. Plus, anti-SJW attitudes just ruin societies as far as I can see.
I just see anti-SJWs unpleasant to listen to or be exposed
>"Sometimes, accessibility is also tied into whether or not people can afford to buy comics. As a comic fan on a budget, I rarely buy comics more than a few times a year (birthdays, a couple personal treats, and Christmas). All the extra money I have is on my Amazon gift card, and I even have to budget that in case I need to buy something more important. As a result, the best way for me to read comics is to either buy them digitally or borrow them from the library"
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
>>82210310
That's just someone trying to tackle an issue he doesn't understand
>>82210310
Why is Gante fatter?
>>82209965
Who the fuck should they blame BUT the readers for low sales?
>N-not everyone buys their comics from places you can track like bookstores or Walmart!
>S-some borrow from their friends or read from a library!
>C-comic shops aren't friendly and inviting so we can't buy the comics there!
COMIXOLOGY
>C-comics are too expensive to buy!
This is true.
>>82210341
Cry some more.
>>82210310
That's just Bendis playing both sides for kicks and giggles.
>>82210160
Those who work to hasten the end may wind up delaying it, just as those who work to delay it, may bring it sooner just as well.
They'll flounder about and whine but eventually they'll move on when not enough people pay attention. That's not exclusive to this situation either.
Patience.
>>82210305
She's a fangirl of Carol Danvers who got Superpowers and noticed that nobody's using the name Ms. Marvel anymore.
Wow, for a second there I thought that Ms Marvel wasn't selling well. I don't care if she's the "SJW flagship" hero, don't bunch her in with the failures.
>>82210378
Bendis uses the same magic as Stan Lee, but instead of leaching the life of celebrities, he feeds off of nerd rage
>>82210310
Self awareness isn't really always a good thing.
Him pointing out that he doesn't see himself as THE BLACK SPIDERMAN doesn't suddenly not make him THE BLACK SPIDERMAN if his personality doesn't have the extra layers it needs
They're basically just point at a criticism but not actually working on it
>>82210344
Christ, I have problem of being not American when it comes to buying comics, but even I buy more often than her.
>comic fan on a budget
Yeah, to save up those tickets to next Disney movie or pay for Netflix subscription.
We should always cancel books like Omega Men because they don't sell well in stores but sell well online.
Fucking retarded logic. I think more than the diversity thing, this article shines more light on the insanely antiquated method of keeping track of comic sales.
>>82210344
What's so funny?
I thought the only reason people were excited for "diverse comics" was that they could get the subsequent "diverse branded merchandise". Are the merch sales high? Maybe if they're selling more of the merch than they are the comics, then the companies could cater to those fans by putting the comics in the merch. Y'know, sort of like those trading cards they used to pack in with toys. That seems about their speed.
I've always wondered about this, how did the woman Thor sell?
>pander to full time opinion mongers who don't actually buy comic books
>why aren't they buying the comics??????
The people who demand diversity in comic books don't read comic books because their only hobby is finding things to complain about, and they'll complain about it no matter what.
>>82210361
>BLAME THE READERS!!
ayyy, when I order a big juicy steak for dinner and the waiter brings out the house salad imma be pretty fucking upset.
What are the diversity titles anyhow?
I don't count Ms.Marvel because it is actually good, not great, but it is one of the 3 marvel titles that have not caused me cancer.
I stopped reading muhvel after Superior Spider-man. I knew for a fact SW and Hickman run would not pay off, but the parody was worth all of it.
>>82210206
>Latonya
That's actually not a bad name. A lot of those names sound mythical and cool, it's just the stereotype around the name that's bad.
>>82210239
If I were diverse I would find things like even having a flagship diversity character to be insulting. Diversity pandering itself should by logic be offensive to the people it's aimed at. Because how is being put in a box for racial marketing purposes not offensive?
>>82210431
If that's true, then Bendis truly is immortal.
>>82209965
>Comic shops aren't inviting
Literally what?
You go in. You buy comic. You go out.
Why does that need to be inviting?
>>82210431
Isn't that Dan Slott?
>>82210441
She basically says that Marvel should make sure that it'd be convenient for her to buy comics at all times when she buys them once or twice in a year.
>>82209965
I could agree with not tracking all possible sales but then you fail when you turn around and explain the reasons why it's not selling, choose a side.
>>C-comic shops aren't friendly and inviting so we can't buy the comics there!
This legit pisses me off because I don't often follow comics as strong as my other hobbies but never once did I ever feel out of place or unwelcome in any comic shop at any age.
I don't get people whining about comic being too expensive.
Unless you buy a massive amount of comics every month, it's a super cheap hobby. You don't need to buy any special equipment or resources, you don't need to pay membership fees, nothing. Just a few bucks per book. The vast majority of hobbies is far more expensive than reading comics.
>>82210488
>food analogy
Kill yourself.
>>82209965
>S-some borrow from their friends or read from a library!
I have never once from the '80s till now had someone loan me a comic or see a library that carries them to check out
>>82210488
>Food analogies
If you knew that Bendis was cooking that steak, would you still order it?
>>82210488
That analogy doesn't really apply here.
It's more like them taking an item off the menu that no one even you never ordered but then you saw it was gone and decided you want it
>>82210440
>refuse to correctly measure how comics sell
>TV still uses outdated ratings systems
>Movies cautiously start keeping track of digital sales, but even then they can claim making millions isn't enough to justify more or things like it
What is it with media and always being streets behind?
>>82209965
>>C-comics need MORE diversity to make me want to buy them! They're just not diverse enough!
I can't take this as a serious argument when you are lying
>Of course, you can’t buy or read any comics if you don’t even know about them. This particularly applies to new comic book fans and fans who get interested in comics through their films or shows. Both the Marvel and DC films aren’t as diverse as their comics. Even television shows like Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. and Jessica Jones aren’t as diverse as they could be, with characters of color either relegated to the background or killed off. Animated series aren’t doing too much better, especially with some superhero cartoon executives not wanting a large female audience.
she says. The comic books main source of advertisement don't advertise the comics with advertisement in question.
the comics with low sales probably also have little to none advertisement to the actual comic.
>>82209965
That stuttering meme is fucking stupid. At least randomly do more than just stutter the first word.
>>82210498
There are good and bad comic shops. Writing them all off as uninviting is as dumb as saying " the one I go to is fine so all of them must be"
>>82210339
>Every birthday or Christmas, my mom would take me to buy manga from Barnes and Nobles. Occasionally, she’d buy me a cheap Archie Digest comics from the grocery store counter.
late '90s/'00s child. How disgusting
>"Sometimes, accessibility is also tied into whether or not people can afford to buy comics. As a comic fan on a budget, I rarely buy comics more than a few times a year (birthdays, a couple personal treats, and Christmas). All the extra money I have is on my Amazon gift card, and I even have to budget that in case I need to buy something more important. As a result, the best way for me to read comics is to either buy them digitally or borrow them from the library"
Batman here figured out that hobbies cost money.
>>82210443
>I thought the only reason people were excited for "diverse comics" was that they could get the subsequent "diverse branded merchandise".
No. Comics aren't selling because, like most print media, it's an outdated entertainment source. Young kids aren't buying them like they were in the past. The average comic reader is in his mid 30s.
Comics need to expand their audience in order to survive. So they're trying to put out more diverse and female-led comics to appeal to more people and because SJWs are a thing right now. Unfortunately, as the article illustrates, those people don't actually buy comics in the first place. So the effort on them is largely wasted.
>>82210537
I can kind of understand the TV and movies thing because there aren't a lot of good online TV streams and movies don't release the same day online as they do in theaters.
Comics however are released everywhere simultaneously
>>82210498
>Comics...merch...atmosphere...
>>82210506
see that only works until they eventually do their mega summer crossover event of the year. Then you're stuck getting only a partial story for 3 to 4 months and if the event has a major impact on the shit you do follow you're in trouble down the line when the new status quo is relying on stuff that happened in a book you didn't read
>>82210310
Its Bendis saying he wants Miles to replace Peter.
>>82210488
BULLSHIT
Demon Knight wa a fucking good capecomic that was in my opinion the most SJW ever and no one bought it. Amethyst was also a god comic with a female lead and no one bought it bearly lasted 6 issues. Batwoman well before the writers change was a fucking good comic and no one bought it.
>>82210492
Those names are a red flag to employers. It is proven that vanilla names like Kate, Karen, and Joscelin are more likely to get hired. Unless her parents are loaded, which could be the case, naming a kid with anything that sounds weird can damage future opportunities. I remember watching a video about these women who submitted the same curriculum under two names, their real one and a vanilla one, and the vanilla one was picked up without a fail.
Then again this was a long time ago, I don't know if that can lead to a lawsuit nowadays, and the field has been balanced since.
>>82210479
>09/14 Thor v5 #25 – 53,047 ( 38.4%)
>10/14 Thor v6 #1 – 150,862 ( 184.4%)
>11/14 Thor v6 #2 – 89,131 ( -40.9%)
>12/14 Thor v6 #3 – 72,563 ( -18.6%)
>01/15 Thor v6 #4 - 69,497 ( -4.2%)
>02/15 Thor v6 #5 - 69,513 ( +0.0%)
>03/15 Thor v6 #6 - 70,569 ( +1.5%)
>04/15 Thor v6 #7 - 71,372 ( +1.1%)
>05/15 Thor v6 #8 - 86,222 (+20.1%)
...
>11/15 Mighty Thor #1 - 112,053
>12/15 Mighty Thor #2 - 70,331
>1/8 Mighty Thor #3 - 60,345
>Mighty Thor #4 - 56,568
>Mighty Thor #5 54,568
tl;dr Better than normal Thor until they relaunched it. Relaunched Jane Thor sells about the same as normal Thor did.
>>82210506
>4 bucks for a 10 minute book
>$10-15 for a trade worth an hour or two
>$10 a month for netflix
Comics are one of the less cheap options as far as "nerd" entertainment goes. Games cost more at the start, but have way more longevity
>>82210625
Sadly, there is this anti-DC bias.
>>82210488
That's not the right analogy, you dipshit. A better one would be having a restaurant that has a declining business, so they decided to revamp their menu to have more gluten-free options because that's a big thing right now. They eventually make half their menu gluten-free and people in Yelp and other websites talk about how they have so much gluten-free stuff and how they're so awesome. But in the actual restaurant, nobody's buying any gluten-free food because they just like to talk about it more than actually buying and eating it.
>>82210441
She's saying that a for-profit business should keep making a product for people who don't buy it in the first place.
>>82210582
A lot of people have digital cable and boxes that could send that data, but hard, concrete evidence can't be twisted to support a producer's own ideas
>>82210631
Try getting into Warhammer or something, then come cry to me about paying $4.
Besides, I'm not just talking about "nerd" hobbies.
>>82210573
>Comics need to expand their audience in order to survive.
The problem their isn't "diversity" though so much as it's those 30 something fans and writers refusing to let the new fans have their own stories and characters
To bad young readers, the writer doesn't want to let Kitty Pryde go so any character you might latch onto is either gonna be wallpaper of event fodder so the writer can jack off his 30 year old stiffy
>>82210616
Trying too hard
>>82209965
> comics are too expensive to buy!
Yeah it's real inconvenient that the people making them want to pay the bills and not starve
Problem is Comic Fans hate change even when its good.
Half of /co/ seems to take it on faith that the comics industry is 'dying' (whatever the fuck that means) but is that actually the case?
>>82210378
Fucking Bendis. "Skin colour isn't important" says young black man (says middle-aged white man).
>>82210650
How much is Gotham Academy selling?
>>82210684
Floppies are what drive a series though. They're not gonna suddenly do trade only releases. If the floppies bomb then even if they make trades the series will still get cancelled much sooner rather than later
Look at the Runaways. That series is constantly selling big in trade but because the floppies do meh the series gets tanked and shelved
>>82210112
Yes it's good but it's following the same route of "take a white character and replace them with a person of color because that character wouldn't be successful on their own."
>>82210698
If you want money you shouldn't work in comics.
This has being the actual deal since the days Siegel and Shuster were screw over and the reason Watterson cried like a bitch.
Maybe people don't want to read these books
>>82210717
About 14-17k in floppies, but the first trade sold 7k in 2015.
>>82210381
No one claimed this when people shilled Waid's middling DD run for being fun.
>>82210675
The very picture you posted proves you wrong, since it nicely shows that new fans do have their own stories and characters.
God forbid a story or character arc getting its natural conclusion and ending, instead of being milked for years...
You complain about writers still using Kitty Pryde while complaining they are not using anymore those other now old and used characters.
>>82210763
>Most people don't want to read comics
ftfy
>>82210669
But comics aren't a hobby, they're just entertainment. I mean, I guess you can consider them a hobby if you go deep, but to most people they have more in common with lower priced movies and TV than they do with /tg/ stuff
And table top games, have multiple aspects to them as well that can justify their high price tag.
And don't talk to me about warhammer sempai, I know how it feels to buy dozens of plastic men for their weight in gold
>>82210631
>Games cost more at the start
Bullshit Steam offers good games starting at the same price, $60 USD buys you a full year worth of free videogames on PSN. I got Demon's Souls, and LBP2 from the service and those were 100 hours each.
Comics cost more and have gotten worse. Anyone who paid for any book written by Bendis is upside down retarded.
>>82210669
>I am gonna name one of the most expensive games you can get into, that will show him
wew lad, it is a shame you did not use a food analogy too, you were down on retard alley already
TCG and such are only expensive if you do plan to go competitive and yet there are people who can tell you how to get a competitive build under $60 USD
>>82210506
>$4 for 5-10 minutes of reading
>multiply that by 10
Shit gets expensive. It's like buying a new video game every week. Some people can afford it but most can't.
Digital comics need to be universally cheaper.
>>82210705
It's hard to see if the floppy part is dying since variants and #1s have been happening so much lately. But floppy sales ARE up from what they were years ago, like before New 52 and Marvel Now.
Trade sales on the other hand have skyrocketed, no doubt about it.
And digital had tons of growth over the past few years, but the growth is starting to stagnate.
>>82210727
>Yes it's good but it's following the same route of "take a white character and replace them with a person of color because that character wouldn't be successful on their own."
alpha is a direct opposite with that
create a new white character that mentorship of a legacy character. and not direct name that can connection with his mentor
AND HE FAILED SO HARD.
>>82210495
Racial profiling is apparently isn't racist so long as it's done by people trying to sell you something.
>>82210840
Good thing DC is lowering their prices
Things should only pander to me.
>>82210882
Should every christian character talk about the Inquisition?
>>82210675
This. We need new content by contemporary artists.
Let all the old super heros, and their concepts, just die already. What is even the point when they go on forever? Aside from money.
>>82210840
Diamond has a stranglehold on the big 2 and by proxy everyone, they force the price parity with digital.
>The US government ruled that diamond did not have a monopoly because they do not distribute regular books, just comics
>literally the only time in the history of the united states that comics have been considered to be on the same level of the prose novel
>>82210886
They should pander to the reader rather than an audience that doesn't care.
>SJW jani damage control in this thread
>>82210830
you still have to buy the systems, (assuming current gen stuff) can cost you a year worth of comics
But with everyone having a phone or ipad/laptop its way more accessible now
>>82210846
But Alpha was shit and used as a gimmick to generate sales by fooling people into thinking the status quo was changing.
Not only that but it actually worked at first.
Imagine if Slott actually wrote a good story and gave Peter a sidekick?
>>82210112
>I like her so it's not SJW pandering!
Face it, she started Marvel's new trend of legacy heroes who aren't white. Sam Nova didn't even get this.
They didn't expect her to be such a success, but after people threw fits over her existing, more people came to know about her, and marvel started pushing her hard, her sales in general got fantastic for a new character, legacy or not.
They repeated with it Thor by announcing it on the View and got some success there too, but every attempt afterwards has been middling.
>>82210919
If the Inquisition was contemporary...
>>82210882
are you the same anon that would be mad when a black character brings up racism in america?
>>82210413
They put her in the mix because she doing well so it them trying to make a point but it falls flat if you look at the numbers.
>>82210101
>IF YOU DON'T ACTUALLY BUY THE COMICS THEN YOUR OPINION ON THEM DOESN'T MATTER.
Nah. If you've read them your opinion matters just as much as anyone else's. But your opinion on the kind of comics that should be produced definitely don't matter
>>82210630
No, Jane sells on issue 5 as well as normal thor did on 25
>>82210935
...then /co/ is out of the picture since most of /co/ don't buy comic books.
>>82210675
>>82210920
>writers want to make their own characters
>publishers want the best sales so they push the most popular, older characters
>readers only buy popular, older characters because of the name on the cover
The whole industry fights against the concept of new. Status quo is god.
>>82210777
Man that blow don't Trades usually have more ales than floppies?
>>82210989
"Anything I don't agree with", usually.
Well yeah, that's the whole SJW M.O.
They care more about the message than the practice. As long as you've *got* diversity, who gives a shit if it's good or successful or makes sense.
And it's not that diversity in of itself is bad, it's that the people demanding it are often selfish and short sighted. Like this person, who flat out admits that she isn't the target, but still wants to be in the sights.
>>82210628
>It is proven that vanilla names like Kate, Karen, and Joscelin are more likely to get hired.
Guarantee you the parents didn't think their daughters name would be a reason she'd be unemployed. When picking baby names you usually go with the one that means a lot to you or holds the most weight in you community. The parents didn't think the name would be a burden on their child's life and judging by the matter at hand, it doesn't look like Latonya had any trouble being hired.
>>82210174
The thing is those facts apply to all comics, so it doesn't explain why the comics with diversity are selling worse than others
>>82210788
way to miss the entire point of the comic. All those new characters get benched as soon as someone feels nostalgic for the 70s or 80s.
Cyclops, Wolverine need to actually retire for the new generation to take over, grow up, pass the tourch to their own successor.
That comic shows 4 NEXT GENERATIONS and THREE of them are still treated as students. The first one is lucky to be viewed as STUDENT TEACHERS.
Cyclops Storm and Wovlerine are still the main X-men and now we have the time displaced Original X-men running around too
>God forbid a story or character arc getting its natural conclusion and ending, instead of being milked for years...
Indeed.
>>82210160
Then they're gonna fail harder.
>>82210979
Marvel and DC are not in the business of making "opinions". If you don't buy their product then you are irrelevant to them.
>>82209965
ok I regret even giving this article a click. Does this idiot even know how supply and demand even works
>>82210698
There are two issues here:
First off pulp and comics used to be cheaper, and the quality used to be better, even nu52 started at $2,99.
Then Marvel shit on everything with $4,99 titles, especially since some real idiots would read Bendis X-men or Slott Spider-man. Now the standard is $3,99 to $4,99. When Dc had "draw the line: they explained they did not want to offer a line that might as well become a line of Graphic Novels for $19,99 if anything Based DiDio prevented DC titles from getting too expensive, for all that served when media shat on DC and put Marvel bullshit on a pedestal. Indie titles also helped to increase the price with their bullshit, and then we got Image.
Today, You need to get four $3,99 comics to form an arc that any writer a decade and some could had done in two issues including a nice wrap up. Bendis titles are down right a scam.
Second, at THAT price, you can pay for literally better forms of entertainment. Either older, collection comics, or any other hobby.
Marvel has become such a fucking cancer it is ridiculous that people fall for it.
Problem is anytime there i a new "sjw" comic mainly from marvel people will initially buy it because of curiosity and not being seen as racist but then they realize the comic is crap and not buy it anymore. with two exceptions
Harley Quinn
Spider-gwen
I have no problem with a new Sjw character if the comic was good and the go to ethnic was something than than black
>>82210216
totally agree with you m8. Especially about the 2.50 dollar tag. I actually do buy comics from a comic book store and I can't believe how quickly a few comics add up. Also they never seem to go down in price no matter what. At my local comic book store they still charge the full price for comics they literally can not move.
>>82210216
$2.99 is the most I'm willing to pay for a comic.
>my comments were deleted
What's the fucking point then of keeping this thread up if we can't even discuss the subject matter with opposing views? Are we all just meant to agree with one another? Close the fucking thread then in that case.
>>82210783
Waid's DD was half decent at first. After the Ikari arc it just got straight up boring.
>>82211149
$2.99 is the basic cost for most DC comic issues, DCs bigger titles and Marvels titles go for $3.99
>>82210965
Do you really think Marvel would ever open that can of worms in their comics? Whens the last time Marvel or DC tackled issues like that? those 9/11 comics? they were crap, patronizing, and offensive.
![DCUDrawingLine[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/nq04q11.jpg "DCUDrawingLine[1].jpg")
Friendly reminder that DC has your back.
>>82211162
"RON PAUL can still win RON PAUL"
>>82211122
>media shat on DC and put Marvel bullshit on a pedestal
See? There is an anti-DC bias, I told you.
>>82210955
You can use whatever you use to shit post on /co/ to play binding of isaac or spelunky, any laptop these days can run Diablo 3.
Comics aren't worth it because the quality dropped hard (Compare George Perez art to the awful bullshit on Marvel titles, and no, Alex Ross Covers do not count as the quality of the comic inside is severely lacking both from the narrative pov to the drawing pov, comics have never been this bad and neutered since the days the CA ran rampant)
>>82211045
They don't care about buying the products. They care about making others buy the products they approve of.
>>82210919
The Spanish Inquisition was a relatively limited persecution of Protestants by the spanish government between the 1400s and 1800s. It killed around 1000 people, or less than 3 per year.
The version of it that you're used to seeing in movies is literally 100% fiction.
>>82211189
Yep, with Rebirth DC is acknowledging that the bulk of their audience is white men and most of their comics should be geared to them. I imagine the next Marvel relaunch will follow suit given how ANAD is a DCYou-esque disaster.
>>82210216
>>>C-comic shops aren't friendly and inviting so we can't buy the comics there!
>This is without a doubt true. There needs to be a normie ambassador program or something set up in most of these nerdhavens. Comics are going the way of the movie. We need normies to increase the margins.
I will agree with this, but I don't think it is gender based in the least, like the article is portraying. I personally think it just isn't inviting to the newbie in general and that hurts the demographic
Outside of that I agree completely with all your points and I think comics have been more than doing their part to try and pander to their market, and at this point it is in part their fault for not being regular buyers
>>82211185
So they'll let Waid do an absolutely terrible Trayvon Martin inspired arc, but they won't dare touch on muslim terrorism?
>>82211054
>look like Latonya had any trouble being hired.
>"I am a blogger at the Mary Sue"
No further comments.
Comics sell low regardless. They're incredibly niche. Have been for decades. It's not a new phenomenon - SJW pandering or not.
>>82211205
>Marvel movies are great, so their comics must be great, too!
People actually believe this.
Just as many white male books are flopping
Articles like this are retarded
So how do you make comics cheaper?
Hard mode: No comparisons to manga production
>>82210524
I do both of those things all the time. It really doesn't sound good in this context, though.
>comic journos write over 5 years worth of "if you pander, they will come"
>a couple of people come
>one person (rightly) points out that it would help if people bought the books they said they wanted to see, in the metrics that they measure
>another person use observable behavior as excuses for the void where big sales were supposed to be
No matter how you spin it, the results don't match the hype. The hard sell wasn't "if you publish digital sales, make comics easier to buy and tweak the prices, then you'll breath new life into the industry" - it was "your business is dying because you can't tear yourself away from filthy neckbeards, and if you want to survive, you need a more diverse lineup for a more diverse clientele." The cultural critics botched the call, plain and simple; the things that comic publishers need to do to pull them in were the things they've always needed to to, and the mythical hordes of savvy, woke readers they wanted to court was never a factor in that.
>>82211117
That couldn't be more wrong. If you don't buy their product then they will scramble to try and get you to buy their product. They are a business and most as big as marvel/dc want to grow and expand their audiences while maintaining their numbers.
>>82211236
Funny you say that, I'm not even white and I am more than happy with the Rebirth changes coming. I think DC is just smartening up and realizing what fans really want
>>82211243
pretty much yeah
>>82210934
Actually they ruled that it wasn't a monopoly because the industry was so small that it simply was literally IMPOSSIBLE for more than one distributor to profit and Diamond just lucked out.
>>82211278
Digital only. Injustice sells very well and they are only 99 cents an issue.
>>82211189
It also was the best time for DC.
Cereal Lord GL was brilliant from beginning to end.
>>82211054
>Guarantee you the parents didn't think their daughters name would be a reason she'd be unemployed.
Maybe they should've.
>>82211273
Talking about that, what exactly ISN'T flopping right now?
>>82211265
>Marvel movies are great,
People actually believe this.
>>82210524
Do torrents count?
>>82211017
That's because most of /co/ is here for cartoons.
>>82211317
>right before the reboot was best time for DC
Nigga you don't remember grounded do you?
>>82211278
give good writers/artist a chance. A real chance
focus on advertisement.
how did american alien do?
>>82211022
Trades sell FAR less than floppies.
>>82211342
Oh shut up.
>>82211375
Or JMS WW. Or Eric Wallace's Titans.
The just should remake the Inhumans movie int Ms. Marvel focused.
>>82210524
My hometown library has an expansive collection of older comics, including all of Hellblazer through Carey's run. It's pretty awesome
>>82211367
That's doesn't stop them from shitposting,,,
>>82211273
This is undoubtedly true, however they see the world with their skewed idea that everything is racist, misogynistic and there is no way to escape it
>>82211326
Big name books aren't flopping, pretty much any big Superman, Batman, Spider-Man. The regular titles that are just a must among general audiences and big time comic fans. Mind you even their sales dip and rise at times, but it's usually guaranteed enough to keep going
>>82211432
Supes Bats and Spidey are such pop culture Icons theres there's 4 people to buy it for every three who drop
If marvel didnt hate the x-men they would push diversity inside the x-men, I have read stories of how gay people in the 90s/20s loved the x-men stories because it tackled issues they were dealing as teenagers.
X-men also deal with race issues and I am sure in 2016 America that will attract a lot of SJW into buying comics.
>>82211401
Where is that?
I live in Canada and I can confirm here that trades sell much better than floppies, though we don't have a good gauge on digital sales to make a comparison
>>82211353
>Cape movies are great.
>>82211257 has a point, that's kind of a low point.
I don't think it matters much. Everyone's coming up with tryhard spellings of their names to try and set their kids apart from the crowd nowadays, just like in ancient times. Between the phonetic names and the stupidly-spelled names, everyone will have a dumb name in the future - and once everyone's name is dumb, no one's name will be.
The Flips were ahead of the curve when they started mashing their first names together for their kids as a general rule.
>>82211375
does anyone? I do remember NU Krypton arc which was going places before DC had the entire run, changes, and characters be placed under order 66.
>>82210573
>No. Comics aren't selling because, like most print media, it's an outdated entertainment source
>2016/04/11- 17, 455,713 Shingeki no Kyojin
sure outdated
>>82211481
See all of Claremont's storytelling was hamfisted so when he hamfisted social shit it didn't seem out of place.
>>82211405
Oh yeah because Titans got good right after that...
Dc had good and bad titles on almost the same measure back and now.
Not gonna say Geoff JL isn't great or Injustice ain't fun, but I feel nostalgia over DC era 2008 - 2010.
why does it feel like LESS has happened in comics compared to the previous decade?
>>82211532
Ok, weeb shit still sells. Good taste is dead.
>>82209965
They can buy this shit online too if LCS is full of scary people for them.
>>82211481
>I have read stories of how gay people in the 90s/20s loved the x-men stories because it tackled issues they were dealing as teenagers.
And Marvel had them all GASSED.
And in favor of the inhumans no less, you cannot make this shit up.
>Omega Men not talked about
Kyle is latino you fucks
>>82211466
exactly they are guaranteed and always will be because of their worldwide statuses.
However other characters need the marketing to float, and even then that only gets you so far before your book flops. There needs to be something that keeps these heroes in peoples eyes if they even expect to sell. Hell floppies are probably not even the best option, but they need to make sure that the general audience is at least aware of the product in some way if they want it to sell or even do well
>>82211635
Latino is too close to white so they barely get any minoripoints.
>>82211575
>Good taste is dead.
>Big two cape comics
>Good taste
>literally the same idea repeated over and over that is predictable as fuck
>Good tastes
>>82211523
This is indeed a problem and true. There are books that overly place their political agendas into their stories and forget to write, well stories.
Then there's the artists who want to do their tumblr art. I mean shit I like differing art styles, but there's a difference between "I tried" to "can it go on the fridge mommy?"
>>82211635
Kyle is one of those Latinos that passes for white so it doesn't count.
Like Diaz who goes around telling everyone he's Hispanic when he's a ginger cracker.
>>82211739
>I will never understand
Well, that part was true, anyway.
>>82210573
But why just add dark skinned people in Superhero costumes and minorities, is that REALLY expanding and updating the medium? It just sounds like it's tacking racial diversity into an already niche box.
When Superheros start to fade and western comics become more than just capeshit, we can say they've expanded. Make them diverse in topic and genre, not in who you code your characters as.
I'm not white, but I'm not gay or Latino either, and I still enjoyed Giffen's Blue Beetle and Orlando's Midnighter. On the other hand, I can't read half the diversity stuff Marvel puts out without feeling like everyone involved should be dragged out back and shot.
>>82211572
You don't know shit about the relaunch if you think that Injustice is even related to the new 52
On relaunch there were a lot of good titles that either didn't exist or were shit before the reboot Swamp Thing, Animal Man, Frankenstein, Demon Knights, WW, Action Comics. The only book that was really killed by the reboot was Morrison's Batman, which finished, albeit a little incongruously and Secret Six.
>>82211756
>political agendas into their stories
the only comic i can think of is Thor and it tanked what comic else did this
not saying you are wrong but I actually want to see it myself instead of believing the same repeated argument.
>>82211643
Probably less important heroes having frequent team ups with Bats, Supes, and Spidey. Cartoons too
>>82211575
>Cape shit
>Ever being good taste
>>82211541
Compared to modern soapboxing, Claremont's screeds are drops in the bucket. The navelgazing of modern creative teams is protracted, smug, presumptuous and overhyped by a brown-nosing clique of journalists. But that's how most social commentary is nowadays, and that's been flopping pretty hard lately too, so I guess the works reflect the times pretty well.
>>82211762
His name is Diaz though.
>>82211611
>They can buy this shit online too if LCS is full of scary people for them.
If you read the comments, they complain about the inconvenience of digital comics because Comixology requires you to use your credit card.
>>82211792
>When Superheros start to fade and western comics become more than just capeshit, we can say they've expanded. Make them diverse in topic and genre, not in who you code your characters as.
There are a large number of webcomics that aren't about superheroes.
>>82211850
Are they all crims or illegal immigrants? How the fuck are they paying for the internet?
>>82211848
So is hers. But she's not actually who they have in mind when they say there should be more Hispanics in Hollywood?
>>82211848
Could easily be a Spaniard. A lot of people forget that Spanish comes from Spain.
>>82211850
Amazon
>>82211823
Angela Queen of Hel and bombshell from DC, funny enought the same writers is doing those.
>>82211880
They're bloggers, baristas and college students. Money isn't exactly flowing
>>82211902
He's Cuban
>>82211817
I said here and now, I collected Dial H, you don't need to tell me you overeating autist.
>Animal Man
Those were some great 6 issues, weren't they?
>>82211792
they do though. every year more non cape comics comes out but the problem is that people don't even know about it. There are people in this thread that don't know about it and this is a freaking comics board
when was the last time we talked about nailbiters or birthright. Fuck even Preacher
>>82210727
She didn't replace Carol. Carol's still doing her thing.
>>82211850
>SJWs are useless fucks nobody would hire
>this also means they don't meet the requirements to possess a credit card
P.S. You can use a debit card like Visa Electron for the same shit so these people are just retards.
>>82211892
Stage names are really common, I have no idea if she's actually hispanic. Aaron Diaz, while being a general shitter and a deluded hypocrite wouldn't lie about that shit because he would get buried if it were ever found out.
>>82211918
With the way he looks he's probably 90%+ Spanish conquistador though.
>>82210700
Brown hero's don't sell , their books always end early or get shit canned
Vibe and Blue Beetle.
The new Wally and Power girl are mostly hated.
>>82211823
Thor wasn't the only one, take a look at Captain Marvel and Spider-Woman, Spider-Gwen, and more do exist.
>>82211918
So what, they still have an ATM card, if they can spend money on comics at all the electronic payment v cash is kinda irrelevant.
This worked out so well for indie games.
>>82211880
Starbucks has free WiFi.
>>82211803
>At this point diversity means black or muslim.
>muslim
not really. only blacks to be honest. we got alot more asian characters including silk and the new superman. black people is probably the famous choice well after white people
>>82211926
You only liked the first arc? How? It was good until at least rotworld
>>82211941
According to wikipedia, Cameron's family is Cuban and they originally came from Spain. Aaron probably has a similar history.
>>82211974
But you cant tell how much indie games sell, also indie game are now published in steam, where everyone around the globe can buy it, comics, modern comics can only be bought in american, north americans, comics stores.
>>82211949
>Brown hero's don't sell , their books always end early or get shit canned
This is true for the most part,
>Vibe and Blue Beetle.
Man I miss Vibe, he was awesome
>The new Wally and Power girl are mostly hated.
With good reason, these characters felt forced and were just pushed in for diversity and it's painfully obvious
Hell even original Powergirl is around on Earth 2 and she was bastardized as well, but Earth 2 is just a mess anyway
>>82211620
Oh god. Your image is /pol/ as fuck, but I imagine an inhuman terrigan mist gas chamber.
>>82211635
Not only that but Omega men actually takes on political issues like repression, colonialization, and the problems that cultures have dealing with the power imbalances between them head on. It deals with this better than any comic I've seen in decades. Maybe Transmetropolitan and V for Vendetta.
>>82210506
It's four dollars for 15 pages. That's hard to justify
>>82211939
They can use paypal and Skrill.
They want to be acknowledged, they don't care about comics.
I live in Mexico and I still managed to get my grubby hands on Multiversity trades, several HC, Omnibuses and that is not taking into account the Marvel / Viz translations.
I got a HC edition of Starman, most of Morrison Batman Run, and then my digital comics. I even got Battle Pope.
They don't care, period.
>>82211941
Her father is Mexican. People like Odette Annable and Aubrey Plaza are Hispanic too, but they look white and so no one thinks of them as Hispanic because everyone's image of Latinos is just uniformly brown people who fill some Danny Trejo/Sofia Vergara stereotype. There are plenty of Hispanics who are indistinguishable from your everyday cracker.
>>82211880
Payment kiosks and check cashing stores?
I mean, I know what you're getting at, and I'm sure most of them are bums, but people use their card info online too much as-is and they could stand to use gift cards more often.
>>82210700
This is untrue, but the vast majority of the time that 'change' is for the worst. So there's a very good reason why comic fans would be adverse to change.
>>82211949
>The new Wally and Power girl
are shit that's why also comic fans hate change every other day we have 300 post threads begging for Superman red trunks back.
Also new 52 earth 2 old alright even though it immediately turned to shit
>>82212060
Despite that, it sells about as well as Gail Simone's The Movement which handled political issues about as well as you'd expect her to.
>>82211905
Already tackled. They need the Amazon gift card bucks for necessary stuff. So you have that situation and apparently digital comics are inconvenient because you have to spend their own money on it. But don't you dare take away their diverse comics that they can read an article about in The Mary Sue, io9, etc.
>>82212060
>Magneto a literal survivor of the Holocaust will confront the inhuman, a superior race in x-men civil war
>>82211941
He would make it about himself if someone called him on his ego wanking.
>>82212081
Her father is Cuban, sorry
>>82211933
No, she really did. She took the name Ms. Marvel and Carol had to scrape up some other name because she's a shit character Marvel still wants to push.
>>82212060
>an inhuman terrigan mist gas chamber.
It kinda was, the context is as simple.
Inhuman terrigen gas kills off mutants, or severely fucks their shit. Possibly the editors did not think that they were gassing minorities in favor of the inhuman "Master Race" possibly because any company that read their own comics would not have Bendis on board.
I have lost count of how many extinction events the x-men have gone through these past 16 years alone.
>>82211813
Milestone is fantastic. I loved Hardware despite being whiter than an albino.
>>82210506
it's not about the total dollar number it's about the entertainment per dollar. For $10 a month I can watch as many films and television shows as I'd like on netflix. For $10 on comics I get less than three issues most of the time, 30 minutes of entertainment. No one is going to spend that when these other options are available.
Fuck, comics are less price efficient than movie tickets, which is really bad when you're supposed to be pulpy populist media.
>>82210407
>Fangirl of Carol Danvers
That's how I know it's fiction
>>82212124
yeah but you are forgetting that all the characters that had the ms/cap marvel mantle had some kind of cosmic power, Kamala is part of the exception along with Monica.
>>82212171
Also, Cyclops is worst than Hitler for some reason.
>>82212167
>A used car is actually cheaper than collecting hickman's run
>>82212120
is he 100 now?
>>82210107
Yeah, and maybe the outspoken comic writers will keep their political views to themselves instead of forcing it down towards an audience full of children and manchildren. And before some idiotic SJW from /co/ thinks I'm kind of Nazi Terrorist from /pol/, I think all political rumblings from all sides of the political spectrum is fucking retarded. I'm here to read comics, not be lectured by the moral police about what I should feel about certain controversial political issues. I literally see politishit everywhere, in my video games, my television shows, my cartoons, my films, and on the internet. I don't want that drama shit on my comics. For heaven's sake, you want me to take the opinions of fictional posthuman characters who wear goofy costumes and solves their problems by knocking out other costumed freaks seriously?
>>82212195
>>82212113
Hey, slow your roll there, pal. Living up to the standards of the current year and reposting something from social media is one thing, but we can't expect people to spend credit on comics. You know what you can do with a gift card? You can buy stuff other than comics! That's way too much power to waste.
>>82212089
Very true
>>82212242
He is going to die this or next year.
>>82212242
Chronologically he's probably in his late 80's to early 90's
Physically there's a lot of comic book fuckery involved
>>82212209
Even if it's been done in the past doesn't mean it's not being done now.
>>82212280
okay but is he actually 100 years old like he should be
>>82211792
Only three companies specialize in superhero comics, and one of them is Valiant so it's more like two and a half.
The rest of the industry is almost all sci-fi, supernatural fantasy, and "indie"/hipster shit. THAT is by far the most common types of comics and what there is "too much of" if anything.
>>82211958
>Captain Marvel
>Spider-Woman,
>Spider-Gwen
spider woman was about her being pregnat and helping a villain change his ways so he could be reunited with his dotter. it was a solid comics with fun jokes
spider-gwen was about a superhero that tried her best to make good so she could feel clean with the guilt that she killed her friend (peter parker the lizard) it was pretty great but stoped because of the art.
haven't read everything with CM so i can't say much there.
But man I don't know why people is even in this thread when they just spout so much bullshit. fucking christ. everyone screams forced diversity and political agenda.
you see memes like thor fighting Misogynistic Odin and you think that's every fucking comic with woman.
>>82210174
>>82210216
Comics cost $4 an issue, plus a Quarter if you buy Bag n Board for it.
If I were employed, I'd buy the lastest issue of my favored periodical every time a new one came out.
>>82212308
Technically close, or there, but he's been deaged more than once I think
>>82212181
I think this is why comics need to offer a monthly subscription service of some sort, hell even have them set a month or two behind from current floppies if you want.
I mean look at services like crunchyroll, netflix, or lootcrate. They offer a monthly solid rate that covers everything monthly, sure it's not always the greatest stuff but it's not overly expensive and it offers something you may like on occasion
