I recently rewatched the Phase 2 solo films but one thing I was wondering was how they'll deal with this Mandarin clusterfuck they've created. The one-shot, though fun thanks to Ben Kingsley, also didn't help and makes matters worse
>Here's the Mandarin
>No he's not, this guy is
>No he's not, there's actually a real REAL Mandarin
Seriously who okayed this? Who thought this was a great idea? Will Feige actually introduce some real REAL Mandarin in another IM film (and that's pushing aside how RDJ's contract will be done after Infinity War) or was this just some retarded attempt to soothe the pain for those who hated the twist?
>>81545086
Who cares?
Mandarin's a shitty villain. That's why they dropped him after IM3 and why he's never going to be brought up again.
>>81545086
There isn't really a clusterfuck.
you have two options.
1: it isn't canon to the mcu and was just a fun little short
2: it is canon and theres a real mandarin out there comitting crimes....and probably a bunch of other secretive guys comitting crimes the super heroes are never gonna find out about so it doesnt matter.
>>81545109
I don't really care for him myself. It's just the repeated bait and switch for this one character is so retarded that I ought to wonder how Marvel even thought this was a good idea.
>>81545178
>you have two options.
Fuck, I guess I can just view the short as Ben Kingsley having some fun.
>>81545086
>Seriously who okayed this? Who thought this was a great idea?
The original idea was to build up the Mandarin over the course of the IM movies. Favreau compared it to the arrival of the Emperor in ROTJ. The real bad guy who's been pulling the strings the whole time. When IM3 was in production and later came out, Shane Black decided to go all 'fuck it' with that idea.
Then Marvel panicked because of the 'NOT MUH MANDRIN' backlash, and released the short to settle down pissed off fans. The short basically made it out that there was an actual Mandarin who leads the Ten Rings, and Killian had been using the name to cover up his Extremis experiments.
But yeah, nothing will probably come of it now since there won't be any more Iron Man films. As much as I like some of Black's previous works, he fucked us out of something potentially awesome.
>>81545658
Shane Black is based.
>>81545680
When it came to Lethal Weapon 1 and 2, Monster Squad, The Last Action Hero and Kiss Kiss Bang Bang? Yes, he was.
But Iron Man 3 is the worst one IM film.
Jesus Christ just because you don't like a villain doesn't mean they should pull the ol bait and switch. They're doing the same shit with Dr. Strange, replace Chinese characters as to not offend our Chinese overlords.
>>81545884
But Mandarin was anti-communist so wouldn't he be a good villain for the chinks?
>>81545882
>But Iron Man 3 is the worst one IM film.
I can understand not liking it, but worse than the muddled lame-ass Iron Man 2?
lel
>>81545086
Disney/Marvel's scared of pissing of the censors in mainland China (the 2nd largest box-office after North America), which is why it seems to be waffling over the identity of the real Mandarin. Chinese censors are infamously prickly when it comes to anything that can be construed as critical of the country, its citizens, and especially its government. All it takes is for those censors to ban a potential blockbuster film from screening in the mainland and that's easily half of a film's international gross up in smoke.
>>81545884
>Jesus Christ just because you don't like a villain doesn't mean they should pull the ol bait and switch.
why? trevor entertained me far more than the mandarin ever has.
The coolest aspect of Mandarin (being able to fist-fight and actually damage Iron Man) got taken up by Aldrich Killian so i care even less.
>>81545917
Nah, even if the films did manage to make the Mandarin appear as operating against the Party and the State, it would still look bad to Chinese censors that the Chinese government needed help from foreign devils to handle a domestic threat.
You have to understand how these censors think. They live and breathe paranoia. Everything to them, outside of the most innocuous reference, is a potential slander against the State. (Which is why the recent developments in the film industry in Hong Kong are so intriguing... filmmakers are starting to push back, although I don't know how long that will last.)
>>81545086
I never understand why marvel creates le fakey versions of their characters in movies
Are they just lazy to show the real villains? Oh wait, it would have taken effort to show Mandarin's rings magic power on screen
>>81545922
Iron Man 2 is capekino
>>81545109
>Mandarins a shitty villain because *I* think so and I lack the imagination to see other wise.
Fuck you.
Iron Man 3 is great for like 30-40 minutes, then it becomes so shit lel
It's like ROTJ in reverse.
>>81545086
Trevor is the Mandarin under deep cover. He's Keyser Söze.
>>81545922
>but worse than the muddled lame-ass Iron Man 2?
Iron Man 2 was the best one in my opinion. It was the most fun and enjoyable. And it was the one that began to set the stage for The Avengers.
>>81545658
>The original idea was to build up the Mandarin over the course of the IM movies. Favreau compared it to the arrival of the Emperor in ROTJ. The real bad guy who's been pulling the strings the whole time.
Aw man, that sounds fucking awesome. Especially since the aesthetic of the fake mandarin is pretty cool, this Osama Bin Fuck You America thing going on which is the perfect for Stark who represents the good side of American industry and military.
But nope, Shane Hack decided to nuke everything and hopefully his own career.
>>81546335
Yeah I think it's extremely underrated. Especially here. At least we go actual Iron Man characters that weren't jokes and self-parodies (yeah Hammer was a joke but he was meant to be, no TWIST.)
>>81546335
this tbqh
>>81546335
>>81546397
>>81546176
This is is some lf the shittiest taste ive ever seen
>>81546397
>yeah Hammer was a joke but he was meant to be, no TWIST.
He was mostly WHY IM2 was as enjoyable as it was. Hammer/Rockwell literally had no bad or boring scenes. He was 10/10.
>>81546397
not to mention this sweet one of a kind suitcase armor
effay af
>>81546457
Yeah well some of us have our own taste and can think for ourselves instead of meme-spout.
I will never forgive this fucking board for the months after Iron Man 3 came out and the shitposting it generated. Anon's literally said "I liked it because it pisses off /co/" literally just admitted to being contrarian, trolling, baiting fucks. So anytime any of you fucking faggots defend it I assume that's who you are. You lost your right to a valid opinion when 6 months later, when it was out on DVD and more people watched it people's REAL opinions came out and it obvious how much /co/ was trolling itself into oblivion.
>>81546544
Sam Rockwell is 10/10 in everything he's ever been in.
>>81546412
Hoo boy, I remember how everyone went nuts for that ass
>>81546397
>>81546412
oh please, that shit is almost as bad as Thor 2. Hammer is the only good thing about it.
>>81546559
Iron Man 2 always felt like it should've been both IM 2 and 3, too cluttered and with an ending more forced than how Monica Bellucci likes it in pretty much every movie she's been in.
However, Whiplash VS Suitcase Man should go down as one of the greatest scenes in the marvel cinematic universe.
>>81546582
You do realize the consensus always puts Iron Man 2 at the bottom of the MCU right? so you're technically the biggest contrarian at least in relation to those of us who liked Iron Man.
>it was cancelled after the second issue
p o e t r y
at least we saw what Favreau's Fin Fang Foom would look like
>>81546094
I do remember them not liking TDK because they thought that Lau escaping to China made China look like a corrupt haven for criminals.
I was like, "yeah, how awful, it's not like this movie series portrayed any American places as horribly corrupt..."
Plus, I didn't interpret China not wanting to extradite Lau as representing China as corrupt. In the reverse situation, the U.S. probably wouldn't extradite, either. The U.S. doesn't even always extradite to their FRIENDS (they harbour a bunch of terrorists and CIA contacts who committed crimes in Latin America and Europe), let alone their competitors.
>>81546671
>Consensus
So you're admitting you just go along with the group-think?
>so you're technically the biggest contrarian at least in relation to those of us who liked Iron Man.
No because my motivation here is not pissing you off. A contrarian likes the opposite of what people like as a way of spiting them, their opinion shifts determining on who they're target is. I generally enjoyed Iron Man 2 and my opinion didn't change when /co/'s changed.
>>81546812
Fin Fang Foom could of been a modified, controlled version of those big worm ships in Avengers, like someone took the corpses and it into something else, controllable. HELL Hydra was doing that in AoU right?
Missed opportunity. But hey, soccer moms laughed at goofy not-Mandarin so I guess it's okay in the end.
>>81546971
you're basically saying in that other post that only you get to have a valid opinion and that all im3 fans can fuck off. You see those iron man 3 supporters as contrarians, but i see you as a contrarian too. even though neither of us are lel.
>>81546812
It wasn't cancelled, he just stopped doing it. Like Kevin Smith with Daredevil: Target.
>>81547207
I thought I was clear though, I see them as automatically contrarian because I can't trust if they're lying or not. Especially how the majority of /co/ seemed to hate movie only a few months after the shitfest. And like I said, because too many /co/ posters straight up admitted to defending as bait.
It's boy who cried wolf scenario. I just can't trust /co/.
>>81545109
I liked him in the cartoon
>>81545086
there was no Mandarin . also a switch is better than another sandnigger in a cave
>>81545922
IM2 was mediocre at worst. Worth watching for the fun villain and action sequences.
IM3 was just kinda dull.
>>81545086
You nigger, when Pierce was going "I'M THE MANDARIN" he didn't mean literally, he was gloating about being the mastermind behind it all
I liked Trevor but fuck me, Kingsley made a great Mandarin in general.
I'd like to see them do a "real" Mandarin but it won't be nearly as good as Kingsley's fake one.
>>81546360
>But nope, Shane Hack decided to nuke everything and hopefully his own career.
The exact opposite actually. He's basically making Kiss Kiss Bang Bang 2: Banter Boogaloo and I can't wait.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GQR5zsLHbYw
>>81546360
>and hopefully his own career
You do realize that IM3 was widely well received, right? That any decision Black made was to be approved by Marvel?
>>81547865
>if you follow the consensus you can't think for yourself
>if you don't follow the consensus you're a contrarian
Typical IronMan 2-fag
>>81548000
That's not what Shane Black said though (who, for all intents and purposes, was the director and co-writer of IM3). True, Marvel and Drew Pearce changed it up later with the one-shot, but Black made it pretty clear during interviews that he wanted Killian to be the MCU version of Mandarin. Obviously that didn't stop Marvel from doing another switcheroo to please the fans, hence the clusterfuck we got in the end.
Is it a done deal that there will absolutely not be an IM4? I think after Dr. Strange, they will be comfortable enough with magic or "technology like magic" to finally have Mandarin and Fin Fang Foom as they were intended. It wouldn't even be hard to make Mandarin's rings be gadgetry that lets him do the same stuff.
>>81548273
I don't know what Black said exactly, but KillIan considering himself the Mandarin doesn't take away from the idea that the "real" MANDARIN exists at all.
Since the movie didn't come out of it's way to imply otherwise, we know that a cult of the ten rings exists, they were the ones that kidnapped Tony in the first movie, and in an Hydra-like fashion they seem to have agents everywhere since one of them was in Ant-man. The idea is that KillIan got inspired by this supposedly real obscure extremist group and made use of it's imagery and legends for his fear-mongering campaign. Delusions of grandeur and the fact that he made those legends come to life, so to say, made him a Mandarin. It's not like he knew of any real guy, for him the title must've been meaningless until HE gave it a real purpose
I mean, if things aren't like this then we should assume Killian was creating fake terrorists cells with fake cultists since even before the first Iron Man?
>>81548511
You're arguing from an in-universe mindset which is beside the point I'm making. Still I'm not disputing the fact that Killian appropriated the iconography from the Ten Rings nor am I saying that it takes away from the idea of a real Mandarin existing (hence the one-shot). I'm just saying that Shane Black outright claimed that he intended Killian to be his version of Mandarin.
Literally in his own words:
>"Ultimately we do give you the Mandarin, the real guy, but it's Guy Pearce in the end with the big dragon tattooed on his chest."
You can also find the entire interview/article about it here: http://www.ew.com/article/2013/05/04/iron-man-3-mandarin-spoiler
Not saying it was necessarily great idea mind you (I'm pretty neutral about it), just that it was intentional on his part to do it that way hence what we got in IM3. Marvel obviously didn't like the end result despite initially giving him the okay for it, thus we got the resulting the one-shot.
>>81548348
IM4 isn't happening any time soon. When asked about it, the Russo brothers said that they're unlikely to make another Iron Man until after a new generation comes in due to RDJ's popularity. At that time, they intend to close off RDJ's Iron Man in Infinity War and put him on hold while other heroes take the spotlight. Honestly I think it makes sense and besides, AOU might as well have been IM4 given how most of the conflict in that film stemmed from Tony.
>>81548000
>>81548273
>>81548511
>>81548783
Killian is Fin Fang Foom
>breathes fire
>can fly
>has a dragon tattoo on his chest
>>81548989
If only. Would have cleaned up the Mandarin mess while still somehow keeping to the spirit of the character.
>>81548783
Why assume Marvel didn't like the result? People always complain that the studio has too much control but now you assume they made an exception with Iron Man, of all characters? The pne-shot's purpose is to ensure they can use another Mandarin if they ever find a place for him, it's not damage control, who would try to damage control such a successful movie
>>81548989
Still pushin' that headcanon for all your worth?
Good on ya. I respect the persistence.
>>81549345
My bad, maybe not so much that they didn't like it. Rather I find it cheap that they basically dud another bait and switch just to keep the whole Mandarin thing afloat instead of sticking to just one idea for the film version.
