I'm interested, for those here who are non white, and I guess those who are, what are your thoughts on racial depictions seen in older comics and cartoons? Should we edit them, remove and not allow the printing or showing of them?
This has been on my mind as I have been reading the Tintin comics. If you didn't know the comic "Tintin in the Congo" has not been allowed printing in the US due to its racist depictions. I was wondering how people feel about this.
>>81390988
Ah the... 1950's?
I'm in the US where Tintin never got talked about.
But I'm sure that's not the WORST thing that they wrote draw.
I'm mixed black guy, it's not something that's bothered me. Maybe as a kid I would be like "wow that's something you really wouldn't see now".
I don't think we should censor the content, the content isn't causing harm to anyone. It's a product of it's time. They could possibly offer a edited printing, but they should only do so if they also offer a unedited printing.
>>81390988
I'm Southeast Asian and nobody draws us so I'm not really affected.
Censoring modern content is already bad enough, censoring content from a time where values like this were more mainstream just makes no sense.
Many older cartoons to begin with simply aren't relevant for the majority of people. That said, some things should not be shown where children are going to be watching, but should be included for collectors/archival/whoever wants to see. It would be wrong to deny that they happened, but it is also wrong to wholly deny the zeitgeist.
tl;dr pic related
>>81390988
Well, speaking as a kid of 1st and second generation Jamaican-Americans of varying racial background (mostly black, with some Chinese and Indian family popping up), they usually range from comical to outright disgusting, sometimes at the same time. Look at Whitewash Jones from those old DC Comics that I can't remember the name for a good example.
>>81391829
Oh and I forgot to mention: Keep it in, but do some half assed "This was acceptable then but bad now" stuff to keep both sides happy.
>>81391758
This. I appreciate those kind of forwards.
>>81391758
I forgot to mention, it's pretty crazy how people will ride on Splash Mountain without knowing where the hell the theme came from. That does piss me off, I don't think Song of the South is racist.
See them as what they were... products of their time. No, we should not edit them, remove them, censor them, etc. Better to accept that they existed than to try and wipe it away.
>>81391758
>That pic
>>81390988
not white, don't give a rat's ass. my nationality has never been depicted in mainstream cartoons AFAIK and I don't give a shit.
I like seeing white people, I don't like seeing niggers. I bet most of the world is like me.
>>81390988
>Should we edit them
No. If upper-class suburban white libcucks driving their Rolls Royces to their Weekly Privilege Awareness Seminary can't accept the fact the world wasn't always the same place as it is now - nor was or IS the same in different places right now - they just ought to grow a spine.
>>81390988
All content is a product of its time.
Editing old content for a different era's sake may was be like trying to erase the past. I believe thats a mistake.
>>81390988
>Rewriting History to please some
If you do that I blow up the Alhambra and all the mosques in the Balkans
>>81392166
Yanakhim narika n'bari n'adun!
>Year 2087
>Sentient AIs all over the world being now accepted into society
>Nu-SJW bots want all old depictions of machine intelligences as evil, murderous and something to be wary off, erased from history or edited.
This will keep happening.
>>81390988
I wonder if trishaws will be considered racist in the future.
>>81391758
That picture makes me really happy.
It really shouldn't though. That ought to be the norm.
Disney SEEMS to be inconsisted about this kind of thing, but the two extremes of their behavior have something in common. The outright denied the existence of racist caricatures in Fantasia for years, and yet they released reprints of Carl Barks stories featuring racist caricatures without any forewords or scholarly editions or anything like that. The common factor - acting as if they had never done anything wrong in the past. Either they didn't do it, or it wasn't wrong. George Orwell had the right idea, but he never guessed that a corporation would pull that shit.
>>81392138
I miss smoking in cartoons..
>>81392018
>don't give a rat's ass
you seem to. You don't want see black people in the media, but for the opposite reason. Also who said this is limited to blacks anyway?
>>81392142
welcome to Germany!
>>81390988
editing them would basically be pretending it never happened which isn't right
>>81390988
To be honest, they're pretty fucking hilarious. What, am I gonna get upset because some dude I never met and probably died before I was even born made a stupid drawing of a categorisation of people I just happen to be a part of? Fuck no, how incredibly insecure would I have to be to get offended by that?
>>81390988
we really can't resolve or even sort through all this until we erect huge fucking sturdy walls between the concepts of race and culture, plus the difference between stereotyping a race's behavior and just making fun of their appearance. also the difference between an 'always' stereotype and a 'mostly / more than others' stereotype
>>81390988
>Should we edit them, remove and not allow the printing or showing of them
I would say that only if it is aimed to children. But since there are like thousands of new books for toddlers and childrens every year, it's really pointless
>>81392673
Don't bring Based Bavaria into this.
>>81393883
>Bavaria
worst beer ever
>>81390988
Mexican
Keep them in. I found that things only really offend me if I let them. Taking things like this personally just seems silly to me, I'm more than just my skin color and ethnicity.
>>81390988
As long as it's not produced anymore, I don't give a fuck. Look at all the old comics and cartoons you want.
>>81392338
To be fair is not like warner is entirely better either, remember when they cucked tom and jerry fans with their early DVD release of the classic shorts?, promising them uncut?, and they were exactly the same shitty transfers used by CN since the BEGINNING.
Also no Censored Eleven + Bugs hits the nips.
But they have release all the classic popeye shorts uncut, and their disclaimer screen>>81391758 is a lot better than disney's guilt trip leonard MartÃn condescending intros.
>>81392529
>Sheeeeeeeh!
>buy a bunch of looney tunes dvds
>WHOOPI fucki goldberg is in it to lecture you whiteys bout why this stuff was bad back in the days blah blah blah
>cant skip past it
>must always see that god damn guinan everytime i want to see bugs and daffy.
Fuck that shit.
no and have plans to write a comic that heavily plays with these depictions
Censoring art is wrong. More so if it is from a different era. Humanity is flawed, but we shouldn't try to hide it.
>>81390988
As a spic I don't give a fuck. I used to feel annoyed when I was 12, but now I find it amusing.
>people calling a comic/cartoon racist
Cartoons aren't capable of passing judgement on you. A comic doesn't care what race you are. Offense is taken, never given.
>>81392338
The newer fantagraphics barks volumes definitely do have them unedited and with commentary in the back where they have someone go through them all and talk about the stories.
Cartoons are almost always gonna depict a simplified version of the world. Archetypes and, yes, generalizations of groups of people will be used because they're easy to read.
Plus those patronizing forewarnings always seem to throw the original artists under the bus, in a backhanded way.
>>81395129
Oh shit I never got the joke was specifically that Zim rode a bus to Mexico. I just thought he just got lost and ended up in a weird neighborhood.
We started trigger warning for "racism" now Disney slaps a warning before any depiction of smoking.
Can't watch 101 Dalmatians anymore w/o another reminder that "smoke pipes are bad for you!" Shit's fucked, no kid ever started smoking because they saw a Disney movie.
>>81390988
African american
They shouldn't be edited at all
>>81394885
that sounds like torture man
>>81390988
Cartoons or comics are products, and as products they should be treated as the owners feel like to.
The idealcase is to ask the creators and the artists involved what to do with them and if they make the decission of editing or changing them, then they should be edited or changed.
>>81396143
George Lucas please fuck off
Once culture absorbs something for decades you stop having the right to keep changing it to suit your whim or push some political agenda, even if you created it.
>>81391642
>This mutha fucka right here
>is it even possible to be this fucking cool?
>holy shit guys I'm serious
>mahnigga.jpeg
>>81390988
Tintin In The Congo was a terrible, terrible, comic. Bad art, bad story, bad everything. Herge himself was ashamed of it, and didn't like being associated with it.
Every Tintin fan should read it.
>>81397663
Already did, some Anon storytimed all the albums a few months ago. The main problem with the first two is that they're too long and repetitive.
>>81390988
Asian
It's history, it shouldn't be cleaned up. Doomed to repeat and all that. Times were different, people were different. There was a time where featuring an Asian as a main character or good guy was seen as wildly progressive. People didn't get hung up on whether or not he had buck teeth and a fu manchu moustache. You just have to look at things in context.
Also WW2 propaganda cartoons about Popeye fighting japs and shit are obviously super funny today.
>>81397784
Tintin in America is only slightly better, really. Herge's early stories being compiled from Newspaper strips is really obvious and not so good for making a cohesive story as a whole.
Cigars of the Pharaoh is a bit better, but still not much. The Blue Lotus and The Broken Ear were big steps forward, and The Black Island was probably the first great Tintin story to set the mold for the rest of the series.
Herge did his research on the Blue Lotus, though. However the racism is still there, he just traded the Fu Manchu for those evil dirty Nips.
And rightfully so, fucking Japs. I'm glad we got to nuke them twice.
>>81398516
To be fair, not every Japanese character in Blue Lotus had all the caricature features, just Mitsuhirato, the General...hm, I think the Ambassador to the League of Nations. The average Japanese soldiers in the story were no more evil or caricatured than the average British soldiers in the International Settlement.
Honestly, I'd score Blue Lotus' racism scale at a 3 out of 10, at most.
And the Japanese totally WERE the bad guys in the real life incidents the story was inspired by, so it was a good example of Herge's increasing tendency of actually doing research and putting more thought into his work.
>>81390988
I'm a mongrel. I'm against censorship, and I think the majority of people on 4chan are too.
I think the best compromise is to do that they did for the loony tunes DVD and just have a (skippable) disclaimer where they let you know "this was made a long time ago, it's a product of it's time, some things that were ok to show back then are less ok to show now, yadda yadda yadda."
That way you get the unedited content, but anybody who might get all offended had fair warning and can just turn their dvd player off and return the DVD.
>>81395222
These are also good because in addition to being a way to cover their asses from people who might get offended by this shit, they're very informative.
I was reading though it a while ago, and thought the depiction of gypsies in the comic was interesting. It was more in line with modern European viewpoint of them. But it seems kind of alien to a modern American who's probably only seen gypsies in the Hunchback of Notre Dame. They certainly don't have any worries about gypsies overrunning the country like the book said.
> he's a xenophile
> he thinks there should be interaction between people of different races and creeds
how to tell when someone has shit judgement
>>81398922
I totally agree, his work was spot on and well research.ed It was just a bit of hyperbole.
>>81390988
I don't care anymore since whites are dying out anyways.
Karma's a bitch.
>>81400582
> pretending eastern europe don't real
Germanics and Latins are shit-tier anyways
They made their multicultural bed, now they can lie in it
>>81400659
>> pretending eastern europe don't real
you'll all be brown muslims in 10 years, Abed
>>81400582
It's a little late for fishing m8
>>81390988
Mixed Indian guy
I don't think they should edit them or anything, maybe put a warning at the beginning like "back in the day people were super fucking racist and it shows here so heads up"
>>81400872
Oh I didn't see this post
>>81391758
Basically that
>>81391702
At best they're mostly chinese caricatures
>>81400582
>I don't care
wew kid you must be over 16 to post there you know
>>81400759
This.
Once West-Europe is full muslim the East will fall as well.
>>81392289
Steven universe is likely to be edited because characters talk "black"
>>81400941
this is either absolute ignorance or bait
>>81390988
Nah. I don't mind blu-ray editions of edited classics but they have to allow the unedited version as a special feature or something.
Basically don't be George Lucas but with racial content.
>>81398516
To be fair, one of his best friends was chinese and taught him calligraphy and buddhism. Lotus bleu is straight up anti colonialist regarding China.
>>81390988
>Should we edit them, remove and not allow the printing or showing of them?
Anyone who thinks this way should be shot.
Nobody is this retard.
>>81390988
Censorship is NEVER excusable.
>>81390988
>I'm interested, for those here who are non white, and I guess those who are, what are your thoughts on racial depictions seen in older comics and cartoons?
Well it doesn't bother me. I'm much more bothered by there just being "White people" and "People of colour" since white peole at least pretend to be tolerant while Asians and Arabs still see blacks as Subhuman
>>81400929
China is East Asia not Southeast
Coming from a half-black, half-Arab person, I'm unbothered by the racist stuff in comics and cartoons from back then. I don't see the point of editing them out - show them how they were, it's probably educational to some extent, like "look at how racist stuff used to be, and how accepted it was - no one batted an eye." Removing them seems stupid, in my opinion, keep 'em in. I do think that adding a disclaimer like >>81391758 is good, though. Not so much to warn people about content, just to note "hey they were racist back then folks, don't sue and remember it could always be worse" and call it day.
>>81392287
>try to kill yourself out of disgust for the new world
>get to the afterlife
>all the SJW who died before you have nagged the angels into submission
>Heaven is the ultimate safespace, no God in sight
>>81395129
To be fair, this portrayal is on par with IZ's depiction of society in general. Disgusting, bizarre, practically dystopian, yet with a touch of MEAT
>>81390988
>showing tribal people as tribal people
>racist
I wonder what is going on in their heads
>>81390988
To some extent this might be a generational thing. Most of us here weren't alive when this shit came out. Our interest might have less nostalgia and more historical curiosity vs our parents or their parents (who up until recently were the market for this sort of thing).
Someone old enough might actually remember being thought of that way, and if I squint real hard I can see that maybe being uncomfortable. Maybe not letter writing internet outrage uncomfortable, but maybe uncomfortable enough to stop collecting DVDs. And that shit matters if you're selling something.
My own experience with this has little to do with cartoon depictions. AFAIK Arabs weren't really on America's radar at the time. That shit cropped up more recently, and has been kind of fucked up to actually experience in person. At least occasionally. I can imagine passing on the option to purchase a reminder of that, though I can't think of any /co/ examples offhand. That being said, old primary source literature about knights and crusades is fun as hell. It doesn't really rub me the wrong way when Muslims are depicted worshiping Apollo or some shit. It's just kind of comical.
We're working on crossing the generational threshold where it's more useful to remember than to forget. I really hope the people selling this shit can recognize that.
>>81390988
i'm black and i think it's hilarious
Hispanic here.
No, pretending like that shit never existed is idiotic. It's a part of history, a shameful part but a part of it nonetheless and trying to forget about it instead of learning from it is a hundred times more shameful then trying to baby proof art and history because it makes you feel uncomfortable.
>>81391702
A Belgian drew a comic about the twilight of their colonial empire in recent years. You were also featured extensively in the Theodor Poussin-series.
>>81398516
Reminder that Rasputin shanked a Ninja during his first appearance in Corto Maltese and ate a whole Japanese in a later one.
I find it hilarious, I do get that mentality extended from awful shit, but I can't help but throw my head back and laugh.
>>81392138
See, I look at this animation and just think it's interesting. I don't feel compelled to smoke. I'm a rational adult, of course, but it's silly we cut things like this from cartoons.
>>81390988
You know, freedom of speech doesn't cease to apply when it cover views opposing yours.
>>81406227
I wonder if even the edgiest SWJ could find something racist about Corto. It has one of the most diverse cast I've seen in a comic.
>>81407148
Do you think I meant it should be censored in the original post? I didn't say I think it should be censored, I think it should be shown as it originally should. I was interested in others views.
>>81407148
>It has one of the most diverse cast I've seen in a comic.
>MC is a gipsy with a "I am a homosexual"-earrrings who hangs out with black freedom fighters
>his "best friend" is a Slav
It's highly magical realm.
>>81398922
>And the Japanese totally WERE the bad guys in the real life incidents the story was inspired by
>>81408172
> slavs being friends with gypsies
fake and gay
>>81410938
Gypsies who aren't "integrated" are generally not friends with anyone who isn't a gypsy.
I used to hang out with one sometimes with i was like 9 and lived in an apartment complex, and her family was extremely weird and reclusive. One day they just moved out without telling anyone and left like 6 months of rent unpaid.
>>81411239
desu I lived right next door to an integrated gypsy family and they were super nice, we went over for dinner on occasion but they're the exception and not the rule. Usually it's the "show a 20-dinar note and get swarmed by 50 unwashed children" kinda deal
I'm a native american savage and I actually liked " What makes the red man red" song in peter pan, The problem is that Tumblrtards are gonna have a triggerfit about Whites demeaning the "underprivileged" by releasing these cartoons. I still want to own this piece of history.
>>81390988
They should be left alone, end of story.
Fuck censorship and this ultra PC society where allowing someone's feelings to be hurt is worse than death.
>>81392673
German stereotypes can be classified into two groups:
Nazis
Bavarians
>>81412109
Also neocommunist cucks
