All thins considered, is he a successful business man?
>>1114122
If you compare him to other kids of millionaires or billionaires I'd say he's pretty well off
he has way more money than he started with, so obviously yes
>>1114122
I don't like him much but yes, he a very successful businessman. That's why it makes me laugh when middle class cucks and queers think they are smarter than him.
>>1114122
I'm really looking forward on how he'll get Mexico to pay to build this wall. He'll probably find some kind of trick to make them believe that they are the ones that need this wall.
>feels good to be european
No he sucks, NEETs are better than one of the most well-known billionaires with a beautiful wife and children.
And I mean don't even get me started on his roaring success as a presidential candidate. This guy is just pathetic! Not successful at all!
>>1114174
Well tbqh a shitload of Mexicans are going back to Mexico now in literally record numbers so I highly doubt Mexico wants them back
>>1114122
He's successful, yes. Whether or not it's entirely due to him is highly debatable, though.
>>1114186
really? where i live i can't tell a difference. spics as far as the eye can see, and it wasn't like this 10 years ago.
>>1114122
He'd probably have a much smaller company if he started out as am average Joe. No loans, no assuming control of daddy's real estate business, no connections.
>>1114122
He takes the blows for Atlantic city going to shit. He's a good businessman
>>1114139
>he has way more money than he started with
Just like most people his age. The only difference is that the Donald started with a higher score thanks to his daddy.
Since he's underperformed a simple market index fund, you have to call him a failure. The collective value of every decision he's made is worth less than just riding the market. That's the very definition of failure.
>>1114501
So anyone who cannot outperform a market index fund with their business is a failure?
I think the very definition of failure in the business world is to have all of your businesses file for bankruptcy and being left penniless because of it.
>>1114647
>So anyone who cannot outperform a market index fund with their business is a failure?
Pretty much. Being successful in business means deploying your capital and resources in the right place. If you can't beat the market, then you should just be in the market. Otherwise, you're falling behind.
>I think the very definition of failure in the business world is to have all of your businesses file for bankruptcy and being left penniless because of it.
Jesus man, get a clue. If you let things get this bad, you're retarded, ignorant, and clueless in addition to being terrible at business.
>>1114186
>he believed the mexican government lies
More are coming illegally through the southern border than ever, mostly thanks to Obamas lax border control.
>>1114174
He's already stated the 2 main ways to
Firstly, we give like a quarter billion a year to Mexico as foreign aid because ???, so he wants to pull money directly out of that to partially pay for the wall
Secondly, illegal immigrants costs the use an estimated $11 billion a year or somewhere thereabouts
Based on the assumption of building a wall like Israel (They've got an effective wall and it's relatively recent), it would cost less than $5 billion to construct a wall across the entire southern border, not to mention however much cheaper labor ends up being if he can use the Army Corp of Engineers as manpower like he wants to.
>>1114501
So much this!
People don't seem to understand that you have to be better relative to something, otherwise there is no way to gauge success.
The market return is the average "take" that _anyone_ can get. If you want to claim to be a good investor, then you _must_ beat the market. Preferably consistently and in a risk adjusted manner as well. If you do not do this, then you cannot be considered an "above average investor". You are merely average.
>>1114122
Yes, he is a perfect lying scheming scumbag who made a lot of dough by fucking other people and cities over, driving them into bankruptcy.
Makes sense that he would try his hand at politics, it fits his rattiness perfectly.
>>1114501
>believing a clickbait lie
>when even the liberally biased politifact debunked it
I thought /biz/ was supposed to be the smart board
>>1114122
He's decent, but not great.
Guys like Larry Ellison and Warren Buffet blow this clown out of the water.
Without his dads money and step up, no way he would be where he is now.
>>1114174
I think he's going to fuck with their trade agreements and tax everything coming in from Mexico, thereby ruining the shitty economy they already have. So basically he would give them an ultimatum, pay for the wall or I ruin your economy.
There's a reason why everyone in Mexican gov is pissed off about it, and it's not just cause their jimmies are rustled.
>>1114186
No fuckin way. I live in the southeast and there is more of these people every damn day.
>>1114709
But at the date that return is calculated from, the market returns were shitty. So that would have been a dumb move, even if it would work.
"Lol i'll just liquidate all these assets and bet on a bear market YOLO"
>>1114709
You don't beat the market.
>>1114678
Show me a reputable source that shows how he could've outperformed through index funds.
>>1114647
It's called benchmarking. An investor's success is affected by the market's growth. To accurately assess how good an investor is you account for market growth
The S&P 500 is somewhat an unfair comparison, Trump deals only in real estate. Still, the economic growth during his lifetime definitely helped.
>>1114752
>that would've been a dumb move because at the time returns were shitty
A good investor sees the returns in the future.
>liberal retards who ready clickbait articles post on /biz/
Time to leave the board.
>>1114749
High tariffs and other trade war tactics have historically ended up being complete and miserable failures. They are repealed shortly after being instated
>>1114717
>debunked
It wasnt debunked. Politifact just pointed out that he would have had to liquidate. The larger point was that, if *you* were an investor, investing in Trump was not as good a return as the rest of the market
>>1114754
That's kind of the point.
>>1114501
>builds magnificent buildings like trump towers
>creates jobs for thousands
>was a billionaire before his father passed away
>"hurr he should have just put it in the hedge fund and sat on his ass"
>>1114941
>magnificent buildings
You realize his buildings are considered shit by architects? Also, you heard about what happened to him in the Hudson Yards?
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/why-probably-better-investing-donald-233020366.html
>"Now we need to establish his net worth at some point in the past.
>Trump was on the Forbes 400 in 1982, when the magazine published its first annual list of America’s wealthiest denizens.
>That year, Forbes said Trump’s fortune was “estimated at over $200 million,” but also acknowledged that Trump claimed it was “$500 million,”
>Imagine Trump had retired in 1982, sold his real estate holdings and invested his $500 million in the S&P 500 — that is, 500 stocks representing the American stock market.
>From 1982 through the end of 2014, the S&P 500 index had an annualized return, including reinvested dividends, of 11.86 percent, according to MoneyChimp’s S&P 500 Compound Annual Growth Rate calculator.
>Per this calculator, every dollar invested in January 1982 would have been worth $40 by December of 2014. That means Trump’s initial $500 million would have grown to $20 billion. That’s twice what Trump says he’s worth today.
You can argue he wouldn’t have been as happy doing that – seeing his name on buildings and creating interesting new projects had more value to him, therefore making it the more rational course of action. There’s also the fact he’s benefited society in the form of construction jobs, property taxes, etc., that otherwise wouldn’t have existed so it was a net gain for civilization. It’s still worth noting for the financial purists who are interested in the bottom line.
>>1114122
>le inherit everything from daddy, go bankrupt numerous times and then make a reality tv show man
no
>>1114968
>jobs, taxes paid, etc
But wouldnt someone who was a better business person have been able to create more jobs with the same amount of money?
I love the fact that Trump fanboys in the thread are actually trying to turn his failure of under performing the market average into a good thing.
By that logic if Trump had lost every penny he had, he would be the greatest businessman ever because he created jobs for people.
top kek
>>1114930
That assumption has many flaws. First of all, Trump didn't invest every single cent. Nope, he lived like a king all these years. And the other major flaw is that those calculations often assume he had more than he actually had back in the day, they count money he inherited afterwards as if he already had it in the 80s.
And yet another thing, he could have invested all that and be a nobody. Instead, he's left his mark on the world.
>>1114968
>That means Trump’s initial $500 million would have grown to $20 billion
that assumes he wouldn't have expenses. The man has lived like a king all these years.
>>1114968
Oh and BTW what some dude commented:
>Had he invested his original million dollar loan into mutual funds for 50 years, its safe to say he would have been broke. For one, he had to pay the loan back with interest. Then, he needed to eat and pay rent and living expenses, including taxes with what slim margin there was between the return, and paying the loan back. So he's done pretty well doing it his way.
>>1115016
>Instead, he's left his mark on the world.
>Daddy, it's good I made less money with more work because it means I left my mark on the world
Come back when you actually realise that business is about the bottom line not being a celebrity and acting like a moron.
>>1115020
>Mutual funds
of all the books he's written, which should I read?
links appreciated
>>1115020
We're not talking about his million dollar loan, rather what could have happened if he liquidate the 200 million dollar company he inherited
Nice try, Chump
>>1115024
>he's in the business for the money
I recommend you read Aristotle's ethics.
Money is never an end, it's a means to an end. What's the point of making money if you don't get to enjoy it? You're probably a kike.
>>1115028
Well he didn't inherit it until the 90s. He was put in charge of it in the 80s but it wasn't HIS company, he was the CEO.
>>1115030
>read aristotle's ethics
Thats hilarious because in literally any thread not about trump, youd be explaining how ethics has nothing to do with business.
Are you now suddenly against shorting, credit default swaps, and all the other unethical trading that goes on?
>>1115033
Ha, confirmed for not having read it.
One of the points he makes is that seeing money as an end is degenerate.
Money is a means to an end. What's the point of having money if you can't use it because you only have it to multiply it? What's the point of being rich and living like a poor man?
Might as well be a NEET, kek
>>1115035
You can't run under the assumption that Trump has read Aristotle (I doubt he has), and that he is following that particular philosophical framework (he isn't).
>>1115175
>>1115189
I'm not saying that, I'm saying that he obviously agrees that money is a means to an end. Some quotes from him:
>I don’t do it for the money. I’ve got enough, much more than I’ll ever need. I do it to do it. Deals are my art form. (The Art of the Deal)
>Many people are afraid to fail, so they don't try. They may dream, talk, and even plan, but they don't take that critical step of putting their money and their effort on the line. To succeed in business, you must take risks. Even if you fail, that's how you learn. There has never been, and will never be, an Olympic skater who didn't fall on the ice. (Trump 101)
Listen to what he says about money and happiness here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qmClYIQqEn8
You guys are forgetting he lives in maximum luxury and gives a lot to charity. When you deduct that kind of stuff from the money left to invest it isn't so cut-and-dried
>>1114717
We're a containment board for /g/. What makes you think we'd be smart?
>>1114122
I have recently started a group dedicated to investments. I am only adding a handful of people that provide something of use to the group.
Trolls will not be tolerated and will be kicked out.
If anyone is interested then go ahead and add me on Skype.
The_Resistance CRF
>>1114749
You can't hold a country that isn't being accused of developing nuclear weapons hostage like that.
>>1114970
>But wouldnt someone who was a better business person have been able to create more jobs with the same amount of money?
So if you're investing directly in a business 1st party, and not the market, then you can say a better business person than Trump could have made more money. but theres many ways you could say better; more efficient and less wasteful, reorganised debts, expanded its market, etc etc etc.
but, no. the people here are just talking about market trading/investing versus Trump's business actions.
while money is kicking around in the market, its not being spent on anything except other businesses, or loans/bonds awaiting payback with interest and shit.
Its only when that money jumps off of the market and into a business directly does it start doing anything as far as material goods and jobs, so you cant make an apples comparison
>>1116155
They are sending narcos, guns and drugs, why couldn't you? Not only they look the other way when it comes to illegal immigration, they encourage it.
he's gotten out of some holes, but I think that demonstrates aptitude.
The fact that he managed to overcome crippling bone spurs in his left/right/both ankle that came on in just two years means he is a success in life no matter what else he does
>>1114968
That calculator does not include fees. Which were massive throughout the 80's
>>1115627
You can't be helped.
You're so delusional you think earning less returns than a single mother an index fund is a good thing.
When you stop being a Trump fanboy, you're going to feel so stupid.
>>1116840
>earning less returns
that's one hell of a huge assumpition
what I'm saying is that the only way to match the index is not only earning more than it, but also not spending a dime.
>>1116656
Xiang Ping Shenzen Mao Xiaomi?
>>1116155
> hostage
There's nothing illegal or immoral about it. He'd basically say, "look until this wall is paid for taxes on anything that comes into the USA are gonna be through the roof".
Besides they are sending thousands of their poor here every day. And truckloads of drugs. They are literally destroying this country.
Test
>>1114750
> anecdotal data
> Southeast
> hurr every brown person is a mexican!
>ivy league graduate that played it safe
I guess
>>1114912
The index is intended to represent the average of all firms in the market, anon. That means that approximately half outperform the market and half under perform. I disagree that performing worse than the S&P makes you a failure at business, but it's not as if it's not possible or not likely for a businessman to outperform it.
>>1114928
i haven't seen a single link to a clickbait article
also, dont shit yourself about leaving the board. see you in a couple hours
>>1117254
he said "who read clickbait articles", not "who post links to clickbait articles"
Top 10 Donald Trump failures:
http://content.time.com/time/specials/packages/article/0,28804,2068227_2068229_2068223,00.html
His 4 bankruptcies
http://www.thestreet.com/story/13286068/1/the-backstory-on-donald-trump-s-four-bankruptcies.html
Donald Trump was born ultra-rich anyways:
http://www.wsj.com/articles/trump-rules-for-success-be-born-rich-get-political-favors-1441970585
Also Trump made a golf course in Scotland. He threw a bitch fit because wind turbines "ruined the view" and lost the case. He also bullied the locals who had limited access to water due to his barely-used golf course, including a 90-year old woman
http://www.businessinsider.com/donald-trump-bullied-a-90-year-old-woman-over-scottish-golf-course-2015-6
Donald Trump is an obese degenerate who spent his massive inherited childhood wealth on a plethora of embarrassing failures, is actually a complete asshole to regular people and has politically switched sides all his life to whatever whimsical monthly flavor he favors.
