The right to have guns is literally enshrined in our constitution. Doesn't get more entrenched than that.

25 people die every second, banning guns wont change this.

It's a core principle value will likely have a civil war before that changes

>>693608746
But it's not the guns that are the problem it's the people.
America's cities with the highest gun crime rates are those cities with the strictest gun controls.
Countries with stricter gun laws then the USA tend to use bombs for mass killings.

I'd like to know why everyone is more concerned about the tool getting used to murder people rather than the people committing those murders.
And if any Anons have a decent response to my last statement I'm actually interested in other opinions.

>>693608746
It's not really a gun problem, it's a nigger problem. I'd happily give up my guns if the U.S. was entirely white. People don't push for the second amendment because they think we can fend off the government, it's because we need defense against these apes. Blacks will be criminals regardless, and we want to protect ourselves. Liberal retards like yourself willfully refuse to acknowledge that niggers are subhuman, so everyone has to pussyfoot around the issue and claim ulterior motives to get shit fine. If liberals really gave a fuck, they'd stop crying about muh feels, put on their big boy pants, and open their God Damon eyes before sitting at the discussion table.

>>693609382
I'm just not sure how easily you'd be able to kill 5 police officers if you only had a knife

>>693608746
Rather think about solutions for what needs to happen so that people don't WANT to go shooting other people. The legalization of guns has nothing to do with it.

>>693608888
Fuck the constitution

(The NRA's true genius is not their apparent lockdown on gun rights policy and discussion, but their very forward-thinking investments in cornering the world's supply of Kool-Aid in the 1970s...)

>>693609486
This isn't true, as a liberal, if we had no niggers I bet uneducated faggots like you would run around killing others.

>>693608746
Maybe if you kill yourself on livestream, it would convince America to ban guns.

>>693609486
I'm a britfag and by no means a liberal and also the op, we have a nigger problem here aswell, but the difference is our niggers don't have guns, (yes I'm sure SOME of them do, but the majority don't, the same can't be said about ameriniggers) and we just tend to leave them in Brixton, and us decent white folk just simply don't go there, its basically a third reich ghetto but the walls are social barriers to work and education that they can't escape from, so they just stay in there and kill each other with knifes, which is a-ok with me.

>>693609489
That's entirely dependent upon your level of motivation and your skill with a knife.

And that's really not my point, I never said guns don't make killing people easier, because of course they do.

But even without guns people seem really motivated to kill each other
And no one wants to talk about that
We just want to say "guns are scary! Make 'em go away so I'll be safe!"
Well that's a complete load of shit, you're not safe with or without guns

Putting a ban on guns is the most fucking logically sound thing for America to do. Unfortunately America is full of fuck wits.

>>693610044
But I'm more safe without them. Guy with a knife is only as deadly as his arm is long. Tell that to a guy with a 9mm.

everyone is thinking it, im just saying it....... niggers

>>693610135
Just look at 90% of the trump voters for evidence.

>>693610242
Maybe you should just kill yourself now so you don't have to live in fear anymore.

>>693609486
I completely disagree with you
I totally support the second amendment because I'm confident our government/political leaders will eventually want most of us enslaved in some capacity
I'm also equally confident when that time comes most Americans will support giving up our liberties in exchange for the appearance of safety
So in the end keeping guns will probably be a little moot, but i like shooting shit, so?

>>693608746
If you want to remove guns from America, you have to literally pry them from the dead fingers of the people who own them. That's the entire point here.

The concept of a national police force was never imagined when the 2nd constitution was drafted. Well, it was, but they would have considered it a standing army.

>>693610300
THIS IS SPARTA!!!!

>>693609382
Not a gun fag or antigun fag here, just interested in discussion. Why is it always assumed here that strict gun laws create gun violence? Did it ever occur to you that perhaps the laws were a response to violence rather than the cause? I mean do you think people would pass these laws when no one around them are getting shot or do you think they acted on this after violence was already taking place?

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Only 1 post in this thread isnt a kike shill. Do you parasites sit in one room or is it a big building?

>>693610242
his arm long, his legs fast

I can run pretty quick
I fight, so I can close distance pretty quickly
If I had a knife and the desire I could probably kill you.
Might be a little more sweaty at the end than if I'd had a gun
but you'll be just as dead
As you're being stabbed will you think "damn, at least it wasn't a 9mm."
Oh, and by the way, getting shot puts you in shock, getting stabbed is supposed to be way more painful.

>>693610421
You are already a slave.

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>>693608888

>>693610639
We're watching you. There's an opening in your tinfoil hat.

>>693610629
I don't believe stricter gun laws create more violence.
Not sure if that's a generally head belief or not and not sure where you're getting that question from.
I don't think gun control creates violence, but I also acknowledge there is evidence that strict gun control laws doesn't remove violence either.

>>693610791
probably
But then so are you.

>>693610639
>Calls everyone a Jew
See, folks? THIS is a knee-jerk reaction. America is so full of them right now. Most jerks knees go so high now, the rest of the world thinks we're all goose-stepping. (Sadly, they're not far off.)

>>693609489
Timothy McVeigh killed 168 people, yet you can still buy fertiliser

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>>693610906
My hat is water proof rabbi

>>693609584

Imagine a world where you are not allowed to freely post your thoughts about the constitution online because you would end up jail immediately and you could never hope for change because you and your neighbors are all fully cucked. And the government tells you this is the right way to behave. Good little boy. Now kill yourself.

>>693611056
Not murican, but nice try at D&C shilling. Next trick, goldberg

>>693608746
Answer me this, lets say you got what you want, guns in america are banned. Its final, now what do you expect most gun owners to do? You really think ppl would turn it in? I wont ever give my guns up. Let alone the black market gun coming in from mexico, you would still have criminals with guns. Thats if it dosent turn to a cival war. States vs states

>>693611320
Agreed. Nigz already have shit ton of guns. Actually its easier and 40% cheaper to get black market pistols in south central LA than legit firearms.

>>693611320
civil war sounds good. you fags waste each other whilst the rest of us get on with not shooting each other.

>>693609382
It's pretty obvious m8 it's a helluva lot better sound bite to hear politicians blaming a singular organization like the nra than it is to address the already-taboo topic of how shitty our mental health care is even today

>>693611487
Moron response

>>693609978
>not from America
>from fagland
>presumes to know shit about shit
Fuck off m8

Americans lol
https://youtu.be/0rR9IaXH1M0

>>693611507'
...Really wish I had a good comeback for your statement, but the NRA has all the Kool-Aid, and I can't find my tinfoil hat...

>>693611667
I know its hard for your morbidly obese fingers to type a paragraph without sweating but please try to construct a decent counter argument, you're making the rest of us normal americans look like idiots.

>>693611507
Is that really it though?
So if we had better social service programs, free health care, ect we'd stop wanting to kill each other?

>>693611904
this made me actually laugh out loud

>>693608746
>>693609489
You dumb fuck
If a gun is obtained illegally, no ban can stop a murderer from getting one. If a murderer bring a knife he kills one, so... One is acceptable?
Your logic is as solid as jello nailed to a wall

>>693608746
In the GTA demo I used to play some 15 years ago you always got more points for killing cops. Too bad they didn't manage to lure them on the subway tracks, though.

>>693612062
Maybe wouldn't stop us WANTING to, but we might actually have the support and coping mechanisms to not actualize the violence.

>>693612236
No murder is acceptable but if you try and cast your mind back to maths class you might be able to remember that 1 is in fact smaller then 5

>>693609495
Well, that's only partly true. I'm sure most determined killers would be able to get guns no matter what the law, just witness Paris, but an autist recluse like Lanza? Here in Europe, he'd have basically no way of ever getting his hands on a gun.

>>693610421
>>693610421
You're so cute! If the government actually wanted to that, it could, no matter how many guns you have. And you know why? It's organized, you're not. Guns don't mean shit.

>>693612385
Fair enough.

Personally believe health care should be free, and not just "government subsidized" but legit free
Like we pay into a fund that pays the salaries, supplies, rent, ect for doctors, nurses, hospitals, ect
However as an Amerifag in the military I can attest to the fairly disappointing service you receive from government run heathcare
Any Britfags feel like commenting on the state of their healthcare system?

Australia has free healthcare and not a single mass shooting since the gun reforms

>>693612700
Tell that to the American colonists and British empire.
Yes, I realize they have guns that shoot more bullets now

Actually, fuck that. Tell that to the North Vietnamese.
They pretty effectively (with mostly modern weapons) told the American government they can get fucked.
And we went left.

>>693612860
Works that way in Denmark and Holland and various other places, and Oh Look! Practically no gun violence. Can't be connected in any way, right?

>>693613059
Wrong. We have atleast 1 shooting per week here in sydney. "Mass shooting" is 4 or more. There has been several since port arthar. Piss off cunt

>>693613081
Well, yeah, they were organized. They were not isolated individuals talking about their rights. They didn't care about whether guns were legal or not. Because that's never a problem, you know.

The left-wing terrorists in Germany, which has very strong gun regulations, just kidnapped some GI, used him to get into an army depot and soon enough they had bazookas and whatever they wanted. But it wasn't about guns, it was about being organized.

>>693613213
Please elaborate:
What works that way?
Those countries heathcare systems?
There gun control laws?
I'm not sure what you're referencing.

The Constitution can be edited. The part about guns was added later. It can be deleted now.

>>693608746
If criminals are planning to kill people, they either: A) aren't going to let a few laws stop them and are going to obtain the guns illegally like most do now, or B) find new and creative ways if killing people. Like shove an AIDs infested needle into a guys urethra. Long term suffering. Short term work.

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Just waiting for one of these to get stolen by blacks in Dallas that know how to operate it.

>>693610629
Not other anon but it's not a cause or effect. In fact, it's the lack of effect. Keep in mind that the USA is just north of the Mexican drug cartels and through Mexico, we also have access to the other major drug countries in South America. So banning guns wouldn't prevent smugglers from getting them to us. And the cities and states with strict gun control are proof that banning them won't stop it. Can't stop guns, so need to stop people. Fixing the real issue is more important.

>>693613081
Brits were on the other side of an ocean from Yanks, and didn't have bombers or drones.
We were on the other side of an ocean from Vietnam, and had a "Yeah, fuckit, this isn't worth it" attitude. So... Yeah. Oceans.
Worth note; last time folks rebelled with their trouser snakes in hand round these parts, WITHOUT an ocean between, they got trounced by the Bluebellies... and they STILL whine about it 140 years later.

>>693613370
But when it comes down to it we're not "isolated individuals"
We're members of towns, cities, ect
Mostly surrounded my similarly minded people, and by that I mean most people will choose to fight for their lives rather than be enslaved/murdered
and my believe in peoples desire not to be enslave might be a little misguided, but they'll mostly definitely not want to be killed.. I think
Point being I think those "isolated individuals" will rapidly become organized given the correct motivation.

>>693613581
Ok, tell me how an antisocial retard with no skills in anything whatsoever will kill 20 people without a gun. I'm listening.

>>693613525
added later?
what history books are you reading?
the second amendment is a part of the bill of rights
and that was included from the get go.

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What makes me sad is that everyone immediately cries 'this is a racial issue'. I'm sorry, but if you're pulled over, and reaching into your back pocket for your wallet while telling the cop 'I have a gun'.... it doesn't matter what color your skin is. Add to it this pattern of blacks and others thinking they don't have to follow orders from law enforcement, this is just going to be a scene played over and over.

>>693613409
Primarily health care, but also stricter gun controls. However, if cause (instability and privation) are removed, gun controls are less important. (For example, take Canada...)

>>693608746
>california made of guns

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHA

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as long as niggers and gangsters have guns, you HAVE TO HAVE GUNS.

>>693613858
Fair enough. I do think you're a little optimistic here but that doesn't matter. But this just proved my point that it's not about guns. They don't mean anything without the organization.
For the time being, what I see is people who claim to fear the government yet somehow expecting it to play nice. Why should a tyrannical government not just bomb, hell, nuke some insurgent town?

>>693613813
Apologies, I'm loosing you with your vernacular
Bluebellies?

>>693613967
(Bill of Rights was added after the Constitution was ratified, and was quite contentious at the time, so that poster is correct. And since the Bill (and the Constitution itself) has/have indeed been edited over the years, their argument seems valid.)

>>693611411
If you avnt black culture,
World hate you more America

>>693613813
Are you talking about the Irish? They did get their own state, so, some success there. But of course the government played nice. Western governments mostly do but those afraid of imminent tyranny never do seem to get that.

>>693614123
Spiderman has no guns. Spigerman NEEDS NO GUNS.

>>693614199
yanks northern forces - they wore blue uniforms, the south was in grey.

>>693614415
Actually I assume he was talking about the civil war. North soldiers wore blue, and thus were called bluebellies.

>>693614553
Ah, ok, very good point indeed. And, of course, the North was holding back and didn't hurt the civilian population as much as it could, and maybe should, have.

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>>693608746
A few deaths is not reason to overturn the second amendment.
Freedom and the responsibility of maintaining it come with inherent risks.

>>693614135
Well, when it comes to that, the person pushing the button that launches that bomb or nuke at that town is a member of the military.
The United States military is primarily conservative and mostly have a strong belief in the almost sacredness of American society.
how many of them will really want to murder their fellow citizens?

And that statement is totally contrary to my reason for supporting the second amendment, I realize this
And I agree I'm probably overly optimistic, but I also don't think we should make it easier for anyone to throw us in camps or whatever it may be they feel like doing with us

>>693608746
This wouldn't have happened if the police didn't shoot that guy.

We need to ban police from having guns.

>>693614415
Actually talking about the USA, in this case. You know, specifically the SAWTH. -They used all these exact same arguments that time, too. (-'cept back then, only whites had guns.)

>>693609382
>it's not the guns that are the problem it's the people.
idk, why is owning a bomb illegal then?
why don't we give everyone the launch codes for nuclear weapons?

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>>693612860
the NHS in the UK is excellent - rates as one of the best in the world on all metrics, and at a lower cost than most. Unofrtunately we have a COnservative Government (like the republicans) a rich people party intent on privatising everything and selling it to their rich mates so they can make a profit and take money away from health services. so they are running it down and defunding it, to force it to look bad and inefficient - current health minister is telling lies about doctors and forcing a new contract on them - to drive doctors to quit, so they can say "look it is broken we have to bring in private health care to fix it"

>>693608746
Gun Control is a joke. Theres too many arms already out in the general public by limiting guns you'd literally do nothing. This just in bad guys don't buy guns legally so therefore gun control doesn't in any way stop them.

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OP thinks the US has a gun problem.

>>693614832
Yes, it is totally contrary to your reasons for supporting the second amendment, glad you realized that.
And, you know, I don't care if you have guns or not, you seem like a smart guy, so go on and play with it. It might even help you not getting thrown in a camp. But only because they shoot you first, no matter what you have stacked up in your house.

>>693614832
I was a soldier (infantry), if my co told me to open fire on civilians I would have refused, but if he told me that Posse Comitatus was suspended and that he wanted me to shoot domestic terrorists I would have done so with a high level of motivation. It isn't nearly as difficult as you think it is to convince people that the wrong thing is actually the right thing

>>693614832

Don't want to be thrown in a camp? Don't elect fascist titbrains who say they have instant solutions to all the world's problems. Democracy: Some attention required.

>>693614887
Not sure I'm getting you. The north was really nice to the south. They could have just killed every civilian they saw but, you know, they didn't. They were civil. Guess that's another way to look at that war's name.

>>693614892
owning a bomb isn't illegal. you just need to apply for a stamp and get cleo approval in order to legally posses one.
the reason explosives aren't generally considered valid or advisable self defense tools on an individual basis is the lack of discrimination inherent in such a device.

>>693615146
Yeah, another thing those cute little second amendment idealists don't realize. They're kind of like hippies, really.

"You're a tyrant, I'll shoot you with my gun! ... Hey, using that tank against me, dude, that's so not cool!"

>>693614892
You need to rethink your arguments.
You could give me the launch codes to nuclear weapons and I'd do nothing with them.
I have the knowledge to construct a nuclear weapon (theoretical of course I've never actually attempted this)
It's the desire to inflict harm upon others that's the issue, not the ability to do so.

SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED

>>693614887
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/54th_Massachusetts_Infantry_Regiment
http://www.masshist.org/online/54thregiment/essay.php?entry_id=528

Bro, there were lots of black soldiers in the Civil War. Lots of them fought for the SAWTH too.

gun control is about making it harder for people to shoot each other, which will result in less people being shot.

u dont need a gun, the strong desire to make weapons easily accessible is just mind boggling to any non-american. grow up america we need u

>>693615529
Until a new amendment overrides that gay fag shit from the musket era.

>>693615151
I entirely agree with you.

>>693615620
Enjoy your violent revolution.

>>693615182
(And yet, Southerners whine, and call it the Wah of Nawthun Aggresshun, an go on and on about how badly the North treated their rebel asses when all they wanted were their Constitutional And God-Given Rights... To Bear Arms, Secede, and oppress people of color and immigrants...)

>>693608888
You mean the bill of rights

>>693615403
The knowledge won't be useful for you if you haven't got the means. And are you actually saying that everbody should be entrusted with the launch code to nuclear missiles? I've had some times in my life when I would have used them without hesitating, I can tell you that.

>>693615768
Which is an amendment to the constitution, faggot.

>>693615724
Good for them they'll never experience actual tyranny. There'd be less time for whining, that's for sure.

>>693615071
That's not fair though
if it's okay for me to have a gun than it has to be okay for that idiot next to me to have a gun
We just need to teach our children that murdering each other isn't acceptable.

And I say "just teach", I don't truly know it's that simple
But it seems historically we've been able to exist without too many mass murders
But then again maybe all those wars we had was just our way of getting those aggressions out

>>693615868
So is the prohibition of alcohol

>>693610629
generally, stricter gun laws do not result in more gun violence. they will reduce gun violence but disenfranchising law abiding citizens will leave them vulnerable to people who already do not follow the law.
criminals aren't as stupid as everyone likes to joke. after Australia's sweeping gun control legislation went into effect the nation saw a rise in violent crime that more than offset any results achieved in the realm of gun violence. home invasions and burglaries in particular saw a marked increase.
similar results were witnessed in the uk.
overall banning firearms has historically resulted in more net violent crime in the end. so which is preferable? defenseless citizens being victimized more regularly but less firearms violence or some firearms violence but overall less crime where citizens are able to defend themselves with arms that equalize individuals?
the form the violence takes won't leave you any more or less dead, in fact, there's a lot of data to suggest that criminals armed with firearms are less inclined to harm victims strangely enough, not that i advocate armed criminals or anything, just an interesting bit of info.

>>693608888
fuckin quads you lil shit

>>693615403
>I have the knowledge to construct a nuclear weapon

No you don't.

>>693615768
The Bill of Rights was originally intended to be included in the original document, but to appease some delegates that were on the fence, Madison and his allies compromised to have 12-14 amendments proposed after the confirmation of the constitution; of which 10 passed.

>>693615590
A handful fought for the South. Mostly at gunpoint, or on promise of family being freed. Most that could headed for the trees at the earliest opportunity. You're going to tell me that counts for anything?
Only whites had guns leading up to the war, because John Brown failed.

>>693608746
Gonna have to take my peacemaker out of my cold dead hands if you want it. Shits here to stay, sorry anon.

It would take a lot of politicing to repeal the 2nd amendment.

>>693616040
so is the repealing of prohibition of alcohol

>>693616009
I didn't mean that literally. In principle, I'm against private gun ownership but I'm neither American nor do I have any power to enforce my views, so what I think doesn't really matter. I just meant that you don't come across as the kind of person who'd do much harm with a gun.
Good point about the wars, might well be true.

>>693608746
>it's a nigger problem

Top Kek

>>693608746
Banning guns would do nothing. There are too many out there. Harsher punishments and better accountabilityaccountability are needed on people who use them to commit crimes.
The thing gun nuts and and the people who preach the 2nd amendment need to understand is that this law was put in place when the highest grade of weapon was and in accurate artillery cannon and the common weapons took 30 seconds to reload and shot a ball that went where it wanted. Doesn't matter what gun you have today because the oppressive government is gonna have drones.

>>693615371
Tell that to the insurgents in Iraq and Afghanistan that are using AK's and fertilizer bombs dumbass

>>693615860
There is no point in my life when I've thought annihilating an entire city of people is the correct course of action.
If everyone was like me, then yes, we could entrust everyone with nuclear launch codes.
Evidently if we're all like you not so much.

And the means to do something is only limited by motivation.
Don't lie to yourself and believe "means" is the limiting factor

>>693614734
a few deaths? Millions over the last few decades. And the injury rate is twenty times as high. A few deaths... you are a sociopath.

>>693615371
you really don't think there would be mass defection and abandonment of posts in the case of a government crackdown on the people? you don't think any equipment would walk off base with them?

>>693616689
it's worth the trade off. a government going off the rails costs a magnitude more. if you don't think so, relocate to Europe and accept your chains serf.

>>693616464
What does that have to do with the right to have guns?

>>693616552
The question, then, is how easy we should make it for people to kill others.

>>693616085
it wont be the most efficient nuclear weapon seen by humanity
but yes, I do
pushing fissionable material to critical mass is just a matter of density
again, my first attempt wouldn't be efficient but it would work
would probably spew more radioactive material than not, but it would be a "nuclear" explosion

>>693616689
Dial that number back a bit. Thousands. Unless someone has been hiding a lot of corpses under the rugs. (...Mind you, this rug is kinda lumpy...)

>>693608746
There are a lot of ways people DIE that are preventable as well. Gun violence doesn't even make it to the top of the list.
It's in the constitution and there so citizens can protect themselves. Fuck off if you don't want guns, go to some shit country with gun control.
There are going to be riots in the streets and probably a fucking attempt at another revolution if gun rights are infringed upon.

>>693616915
See >>693615146
and >>693613370

>>693616085
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-tAsHGFA-74

I don't think it's a stretch to say that if a 13 year old can build a nuclear reactor, someone could build a nuclear bomb

>>693616464
I don't think they care about rights too much. There busy doing things. And are you saying you want the US to be like Afghanistan?

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>>693616689
>>693617036
also worth noting is that that number has been continually decreasing as we have improved our society and there's no reason to assume it wouldn't continue to dwindle, especially if we continued to make inroads against the gang and drug problems that still fuel most of said violence.

>>693617139
i'd be curious to see how long a 'high level of motivation' lasted after they actually opened fire on their own countrymen.

>>693617003
I like my nukes like I like my women... Dirty, self-made, and leaking at the least little touch...

>>693617478
Seemed to work ok in the Civil War.

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>>693617333
>And are you saying you want the US to be like Afghanistan?
No one is saying that, but the .mil has spent the last 50 years failing miserably in asymmetrical conflicts, OIF/OEF included. I think that is more the point he was making.

>>693617548
kek

>>693616255
Exacrly, we realized it was a bad idea and changed it

We don't need to control guns. We need to arm the White population, and take the fight to all the colored descendants of Satan, who were born of his will and do this bidding on Earth.

It is our destiny as Aryan children of the light.

>>693616552
I'd do it before killing myself tbh

>>693617610
Ok, still, what does that have do to with gun laws? I doubt anybody in Iraq cares whether they have a right to carry arms, they just do because they need to survive. Doesn't seem like a situation you'd want.

>>693617782
Low Quality Poe is Low Quality... A raven wouldn't even take that bait.

>>693608746
You know a British PM was shot a few days before the Brexit vote right?
Banning guns doesn't work. Killing yourself, however, does.

>>693617856
Some twat was posting the same tired old argument that you can't fight tyranny with small arms. A counter argument to such a statement seems pertinent to me because that is ultimately the purpose of the second amendment.

>>693616996
I agree
But that's a "what if" style argument
eg: "we need to limit this ability because what happens when someone decides to do this?"
We could apply that same type of argument to just about anything:
What if we all feel like raping everyone, so we all need to wear chastity belts
What if we all feel like eating nothing by McDonald's so we're all fat with heart disease (wait that's actually happened)
Aaaaaand I'm a little drunk so I got lost at McDonald's... I think my point was I don't think we should limit decent people based off what shitty people might do

>>693608932
this is the dumbest statistic I ever read
Translate that into people dying every day and you'll realize it's impossible

Nice bait though

>>693618060
MP, my sweet, not PM.

>>693617548
Well then, sir, do I have a deal for you...

>>693618096
I don't think you know what a tyranny is, sweetheart. Look at Iraq under Saddam and see how far small arms get you if an actual tyrant is ready to use anything, even poison gas, to fight you.

everyone is going to die, dead people dont care that they got shot

live a life that is enjoyable

arguing over gun laws is one of the least enjoyable things u can do

therefore, shut up and go improve your life

>>693618346
>thinks Iraqi gun ownership was comparable to American gun ownership

Imagine if Iraqis had been armed during Sadam's reign, they might have actually resisted him

>>693618098
That's ok, that's you're opinion. Where I live, there is literally no use for a gun. I don't need to defend myself from others, because it's safe. I'm not into hunting and if I wanted to, I could, I just needed a permit. So, I guess the broader argument is about what kind of state you want to live in.

>>693609978
Brixton is pretty gentrified now, I go there every now and again and its mostly full of hipsters. I'm not sure which is worse...

>>693618439
Valid advice, but I actually enjoy some pointlessness every so often. On that note though, I'm going to take a short nap, and get back to work.

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>>693608746
Total
Race
War.

>>693618512
I doubt you have statistics about Iraqi gun ownership, but whatever.
You just seem to understand how tyrannies come into existence. They didn't resist him because they didn't want to, that's the main point. Do you think all gun owner think exactly alike?

>>693618520
where do you live?

And where I currently live (Japan) I'm pretty sure I have no use for a gun either (and I don't own one).
But that doesn't mean I think no one else should be allowed to own a gun

>>693618711
* don't seem to understand.

>>693616996
>such that an individual can reliably defend themselves against another individual as regardless of physical prowess as possible

>>693618346
So you'd rather they had no chance to defend themselves? I don't understand how Saddam gassing Kurds is an argument for gun control. The Kurds were a minority that had been shit on by every nation regionally for quite some time and really had very little going for them beyond the will to oppose their oppressors, far less the legal right to arms of any kind in Iraq. Loyal Baath party members were however allowed arms.

Poor OP. He must not know that even though cocaine is banned, people still get away with peddling it, as with all other illegal substances and paraphernalia.

>>693618711
Why didn't they want to resist him?

>>693618739
Austria. I guess we just have opposing views of the world, then. I like collectivism, you like individualism. At this point, your side is stronger. Good to see it has kind and open-minded supporters like yourself!
Ok, I think that's it for now. Enjoy!

>>693618711
>Do you think all gun owner think exactly alike?
Of course they don't, who's saying that?

>>693619013
OP is aware of that fact, i doubt you sincerely care for his state of knowledge, but i hope i have cleared up your worries.

>>693619068
Because his slogan probably wasn't "I'm a bloody dictator, I'll bring misery to all of you", it was probably more about more fairly distributing wealth or whatever.

>>693618833
It's not an argument for gun control. It's an argument as to why having rights to guns doesn't matter.

>>693608746
Stop being stupid op. We can't control guns the same way we can't control drugs. Making something illegal is just about useless.

>>693619141
So why do you think they'd all fight for a common cause?

>>693608888
The constitution was written 200+ years ago dude, weapons were different back then

>>693619571
Not just that but people did crazy shit in general that now a days we'd consider insane. During the time the "bill of rights" was written people were bought and sold and the people who gave other people rights owned human beings. And they thought that was okay.... enough said

>>693619268

How about fear of retaliation? Iraq under Sadam Hussein was a brutal, authoritarian police state that most people weren't happy with (at the time, now a days, a majority say they would actually prefer Sadam over their current mess, but that is a different topic). There were thousands of kidnappings/imprisonments against citizens, and that is not even including the Kurds.

So why try to change/overthrow the system when you know that it is hopeless to try?

But if enough people could resist (ie with firearms), it is at least plausible that people unhappy with Sadam's brutality would try to change it. That is why Syria is in a civil war right now. Anti-government forces got weapons and started to resist.

>>693619129
Honestly I prefer collectivism
I think the "army of one" mentality Americans have pushed recently has been horrible for our society.
Or the "I've got to get mines" for those of use less mentally inclined
But I still support individual liberties

>>693619068
Because he spent his reign shitting on sects and peoples his party's majority hated. He actually maintained reasonable economic prosperity in his country while he solidified his power and things didn't get bad until the war and following sanctions by which point his security apparatus was so entrenched the only people capable of resisting it had no reason to do so.

>>693619415
I don't know how much more plainly I can put this but no one is saying all would but people in this country are generally raised to believe in a similar set of principles which are the underlying basis for constitution and why the country was established to begin with.
Now so we can put this
>all
nonsense to rest and you can stop repeating yourself, historically less than 15% of the populace actively participated in the revolution and only 1/5th of that were active combatants. That is not very many people.

>>693619571
Many believe that the intent of the 2nd amendment was to prevent government tyranny. So it was less about owning weapons just because, but so that they could resist a tyrannical government.

>>693608746
ATTENTION:

To all non criminal US citizens HIDE YOUR GUNS! Neither candidate is going to become president after Obama declares martial law.

This is the end game, this is the real plan here. It is unfolding right before your very eyes.

>>693619767
>people
>niggers
Pick one you anti American libcuck. You can always fuck off amd see if anywhere else in the world suits you better faggot.

>>693615028
Wow so your solution is to have Americans be isolated.... you're a fucking redneck. And you think 32,000 deaths is fine?
You can clearly tell there is a problem by the. number of people who feel the need to have guns.,
And thinking the deaths don't matter and can't be helped because they're gang related. Look at other countries e.g. England. The cause for this Is guns.

owning a gun does not make you safer

no one is going to murder you in your home in such a way that u can defend yourself with a gun, and having a gun in the public puts you at more risk just by virtue of the fact that you are carrying a weapon.

I feel the root of this goes back to education. Not on guns but on a whole, the reason they do thuis is because they're stupid and don't have a job.

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ATTENTION FUCKHEADS

If you don't know what an 80% reviver is then you need to educate yourselves. I've never taken a single safety class. Never been to a shooting range. I don't have a license. Haven't been into a gun store to purchase anything but ammunition. I have an AR-15 that I built myself. Bought a plastic unfinished reviver online that I finished drilling in my garage. All parts were bought legally. My AR-15 is legally owned. I just can't sell it or give it away. Took me about 5 hours to get everything together and test fire it. I had never shot a gun before. This could be a fun weekend project for a mass murderer. If you idiots try to ban guns you'll just get more average joes like myself building their own weapons.

>by law the receiver is the part of a rifle that makes it a gun
>an unfinished reviver is not a gun
>i don't need a license to purchase not a gun
>what i do on my property is my business

>>693619571
>>693619767
By your arguments you should both be arrested because that "freedom of speech" was something those "crazy" guys did 200+ years ago

At the end of the day guns don't kill people, people kill people

>>693613674
Been done before.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XnUoUKEIGoo

>>693608746
Democrats would have to win additional seats in the house and senate for that to happen. But instead of campaigning or voting, young people just tweet vines.

>>693620222
RECEIVER. Idiot.

Over 40,000 Americans die from automobile accidents Every Year. Yet no one demands they be banned.

>>693612387
Two types of people. Those that can't extrapolate information from an incomplete statement.

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>>693620475
>bitches about spelling
>doesn't actually argue with an excellent point

>>693620222
>plastic lower
you fucked up.

you CAN sell it or give it away unless you have some state specific legislation regarding home built firearms.
you CANNOT however manufacture firearms with the explicit intent of selling them or giving them away without the appropriate FFL.

>>693620347

At the beginning of the next day you realise that this is a very inward looking quote that ignores all the people not killing other people at anywhere near the same rate in different civilised countries.

If guns don't kill people, then Americans do.

>>693620490
This isn't a good arguement, and I'm a supporter of gun rights. Cars are heavily regulated, to the point where you don't even have the right to have a car (and drive it) without your government's consent.

>>693613871
Bombs? Nerve gas? Cmon, this is /b/; I KNOW you know how easy it is to find info and supplies online.

>>693613871
>Knife-wielding attackers kill 29, injure 130 at China train station
http://www.cnn.com/2014/03/01/world/asia/china-railway-attack/

>>693620711
And yet look how many people have and use cars

>>693610044
you understand that while this is a good argument, taking away guns won't change it?

>>693608888
The quads have spoken. Now go buy a gun.

It's not guns, it's the people, you fucking dolt

>>693615028
You have a nigger problem

>>693608746

A war. It would take a war, using guns, to get rid of guns.
I hope the weight of that isn't lost on the people here.

>>693620878
The point is that it is much easier for the government to revoke your ability to drive then it is to revoke your ability to own a firearm.

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>>693620663
>you fucked up
How? I don't have the appropriate tools to finish a metal one.

>>693618146
>implying no more than 25 people are born each day
faggot

>>693620961
just because you use the word "dolt" doesnt mean you're correct.

>>693621097
How the fuck did you finish a polymer one then? Exacto knife and a melon baller?

>>693620684
It's not really, it's highlighting that people will always find a way to do something either with or without guns, its just that guns are there for the people to use

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>>693621237
Basically, yeah.

The NRA used to be in favor of gun control, back when the image of the Black Panthers was associated with carrying guns. If we went back to the days of heavily armed brown people, gun control would come quickly.

>>693621366
>>693615028
>4% are justified
>33% are homicides
So yeah, I'd sacrify the shit out of those innocent lives

>>693608746
There would have to actually be a gun problem but there is not. And there would have to be a way to show that any kind of banning and gun control would actually do any good and the only evidence for the situation has proven the opposite to be more true time and time again. The only way to end gun violence would be a magic wand that poofs all the guns in the world out of existence. But then we'd just start making more.

>>693620040
See? This is why I am against republicans on nearly every issue. Not only are you mentally deficient, but can't even present a valid argument before you turn into edgy racists.

You are literally white niggers.

Don't fall for this fake shit.

It's nothing more than an concocted story to push for gun control and intimately banning all guns.

>>693619571
>puckle gun
>defensive auto-loading machine gun
>used before the constitution was written
If you honestly think that things were THAT different, I encourage you to retake a history class or two

>>693612062
Given that the overwhelming majority of violent crime in this country , including shootings, takes place in very impoverished areas and usually one poor minority killing another, yes. Strengthen the safety net, chip away the conditions that allow gang activity to thrive, and you see violent acts decline.

>>693621613
It didn't "come quickly" back then. Why would it now? The Black Panthers used firearms (more often than not) as our founding fathers intended.
Now, we need a group called The Citizen Large Cats or some shit because those same rights are, and have been eroded away at due to unthinking faggots like you.

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>>693621613
Black people have every right to the possess arms unless they have lost it, the same as anyone else and by all accounts. Shove the storm nonsense up your ass.
>>693621679
According the data presented there are 1700 unjustified murders in which gang or drug crime were not involved vs 1200 justified homicides. However, a firearm does not necessarily need to claim a life or even be discharged in order to prevent or stop a crime. That data is not presented here but I can guarantee there are more than 500 such instances annually and figures cited go as high as 400,000 (violent crimes, no necessarily murders), although I can't comment honestly on the accuracy of that number. Who knows how many such cases go unreported but it wouldn't be a stretch for as many fatalities to be prevented nonviolently by firearms as there are firearm murders yearly.

>>693622126
They didn't quite use them as intended. The second amendment was certainly never intended to apply to black people.

>>693610135
Let's say they do, what would happen to the 300 million+ guns in the country? Just wisp away into the wind?

>>693610135
Law abiding citizens give their guns up
Non law abiding citizens (the guys who actually shoot other people) don't give their guns up. If people want to kill people, they will do it. Gun control shouldn't exist.

Either way medical issues kill boatloads more people than gun control but you don't see people running around screaming "WE NEED TO ABOLISH HEART DISEASE"

>>693617693
So is the prohibition of guns. You'd run into the same problems as they did with the prohibition of alcohol.

>>693622631
Toy?

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>>693608746
Alright, I'll explain this shit. The amount of guns in America per person is huge, banning guns will do nothing. Regulating ammunition is equally pointless, even with background checks, because of the laws of supply and demand. America's constitution isn't worth the paper its written on, their government has been shitting on it for decades. Harsher penalties for breaking the law does nothing to deter the considerable percentage of the black population/criminal population that has been raised by shitty parents to disregard the law anyway. Where does that leave America? Largely fucked on all fronts. It is not a problem that will resolve itself anytime soon, if at all. Any questions?

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>>693622743
I don't think so. The action looks correct, the furniture does look brand new though.

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>>693610135
Ok. Guns are banned. You've just turned 90 million law abiding citizens into criminals. What about the actual criminals though? They're not gonna give them up. And as for the legal guys about 1/4 are actually going to give theirs up. The police and military have publicly stated they won't be confiscating anything. So now what? Business as usual?

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>>693622989
>And as for the legal guys about 1/4 are actually going to give theirs up.
Last I saw the compliance estimates for the Connecticut AWB that followed Sandyhook was well under 10%.
>So now what? Business as usual?
Even with minimal compliance there would be extremely few new owners coming in and even if there were no door to door searches ownership would effectively die within a generation or two.

>>693611059
Underrated post

>>693611112
Fuck the constitution, and retarded on purpose fucks like you.

You know damn well its just a fucking piece of paper, meant to represent those values, not bind us to arbitrary tradition, like a bunch of slave niggers.

>>693608746
if brown people start buying ar15s they will be banned pronto

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>>693623647

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Just so you patriotfags are aware:
The constitution is made of amendments, which are not set in stone.

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>>693622787
Yeehaw.

I agree with your assessment.

>>693623269
Gibbs No. 7 carbine, very nice.

>>693623831
>which are not set in stone.
Uh.
What.

>>693623855
Dammit McNig!

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>I'm curious, after two world wars and countless dictatorships, what WOULD actually need to happen for Europe to allow guns, or is the prohibition to bear arms so deeply entrenched that nothing, no matter how bad ever be enough?

The law is working how it's supposed to. The government thinks it can kill with impunity. Turns out they can't.

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>>693623831
It's not prudent however to modify the first two amendments of the bill of rights.
It does not benefit the citizenry to disenfranchise them.

>>693608746
>mmuh gun control
why you are browsing pol, tumblrite?

>>693620684
I'm willing to agree with you there. Americans are crazy and murderous, so why WOULDN'T I want a gun? You see the kind of shit we put up with. I live in Florida, every day some crazy meth head breaks into someone's house with a crossbow and a machete or some shit. This shit happens, man, and I'd rather have something more than a baseball bat.

>>693622787
>he gets it

>>693619925
It was meant for people to form a militia in a timely manner. Gotta remember, the brits were fighting on three fronts at the time. The people who were living in America didn't stand a chance if the brits had concentrated their efforts fully on them. So, they allowed citizens to carry arms just in case. It was meant to fight the tyranny of an invading force mainly.

>>693608746
There is a massive divide between the law enforcement community and minority communities who feel oppressed by them. We have people walking around in our communities suffering from psychosis and sociopathic tendencies. And finally we have a group of people who think literally murdering everyone sends them to heaven.

But banning guns is the answer to all of these problems!

So long as you blame all of life's problem's on a piece of metal, nothing will ever be solved.

>But if we get rid of the guns at least they won't kill anyone!

You still haven't removed the threat from your community. They'll just find another way, like that psycho in the UK who walked into an elementary school with a hatchet and chopped people to death.

http://www.bbc (dot) co (dot) uk/news/uk-england-birmingham-36670689

>>693624036
You have to step back and realize that we look at the possession of arms two completely disparate ways.
>>693624404
All male citizens ages 17-45 are legally the militia.
>It was meant to fight the tyranny of an invading force mainly.
No, it was intended to combat tyranny. Its origin does not matter.

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>>693624036
>>693624758
Here's the one I was looking for.

>>693608888
You do realise that your constitution was amended to include that right, yeah? You can just as easily take it out.