Please don't put a label on people just because of their stance on guns. My views are almost entirely liberal but I firmly believe people should be allowed to own guns.

>>693605653
Because if you did something like that shit would change regardless.

>>693605653
Because conservatives are already the angriest people on the planet and it will piss them off even more. I thrive on schadenfreude.

>>693605971
/thread.

>>693605653
>my mother has been hinting around asking me questions about why people need to own an AR15.
>Explain everything there is to know about the AR15, giving legit reasons to its uses.
>Even some outlandish reasons, but still legit reasons
>shes bought my dad 3 pistols one .40 just last year.

Jokes around with family today saying "hurdur know what anon said to me the reason why we need those guns, is to defend ourselves against the government, he says its gotta keep it fair." in the most posh way possible, sounded like an uneducated high school girl just ranting off.. fucking pissed me off that she listened everything I said, and that's the thing she took from it....

>>693605971
They already did and nothing changed.

>>693605653
Don't need to ban them all. You could still keep bolt actions and shotguns. Why would you need an assault rife or a semi-handgun? Go hunting and sporting with your Mauser instead.

Most of us...like, MOST of us don't want to Take Yer Guns. We want universal background checks. Waiting periods to decrease impulsive gun crime. Mandatory Gun Safety education. I mean, jesus fuck, I had to take a six hour course before I could ride a jetski, I have to take a six hour course tomorrow before I can be certified to guard a hotel. You should have to take a gun safety course before you buy a gun. Guns aren't toys. They're deadly tools. Any responsible gun owner knows this. Can a conservative explain to me why they think anything I just said is wrong?

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>>693606500
>>693606599
Dubs of truth

Black market cost for firearms is incredibly expensive and the common criminal couldnt afford one. If they had that anount of money they probably wouldnt be a criminal

>>693606599
To overthrow the tyrannical government, duh. Because that's something we do.

>>693606599
>never hunted fast game like coyotes or boar

follow up shots, and repeated shots are very important, and its even more important to be able to keep your eye on the sight picture and not have to worry about taking it off to pull the bolt back.

>hurdur but in call of duty..
>fuck off.

it changed things in britian and australia

bumpidy-bump

>>693605653
Then you'd finally have to do something physical to kill each other instead of just shooting each other. Killing someone not using a gun takes physical effort. We just care about the health of you fat fucks.

>>693606970
>follow up/repeated shots
when you hunt the first shot should always kill no need for follow up shots

>>693606505
You what? How did the USA get rid of guns already?

>>693606755
>checked

>>693606500
If you think owning an AR-15 will make things fair between you and the government you're probably retarded

>>693607585
Ladies and gentlemen, allow me to present you the person who never did hunting before.

>>693606769
If citizens take up arms against their government, in a Western Democracy, I guarantee they will end up fighting each other more. One group supports the government, the other doesn't. Fights break out. The military destroys the insurgency. The end. People vote for their parliament. If the majority are unhappy with it, it is voted out. Simple. If a government becomes tyrannical it is most likely engaged in a war. In that case, the right wingers will most likely support the government. And really, an assault rifle vs a modern army with tanks, air cover, artillery, missiles, training, supplies and leadership is not much of a match. You don't even have any anti-tank weapons (they are already illegal), let alone anti-aircraft. It is a good point though apart for the above. Not much consolation for the people who get their loved ones shot because some crazy owned a battle rifle

>>693606653
safety courses turn into licensing which turns into hoop jumping.
>>693606756
not true, the poorest countries in the world get guns through the black market. So really you just want to drive up the cost so poor people cant have guns.

>>693605852
same same

>>693608043
>Ladies and gentlemen, allow me to present you the person who never did hunting before.
Ladies and gentlemen, allow me to present you the person who never did good hunting before. Dude probably goes fishing using handgrenades. Uneducated pleb of a hunter.

>>693605852
Wait the world isn't just black and white, left and right? Daaaamn

>>693605653
Because guns allow you to kill many people quickly.
If you didn't have guns you'd not be able to kill as many people

>>693606970
So make do. Just because a bolt action is not as good as a semi for hunting doesn't mean you need one for hunting. I've hunted kangaroo and their fast as fuck, plus they jump over shit like fences easily. If I missed with the old lee-enfield I'd just reload and shoot again (this from the back of a ute (pickup truck) while moving). You see, people can also become the hunted. I'd rather someone with a bolt action went nuts and shot up my workplace than a guy with a fucking AR or AK.

>>693608189
What's wrong with using explosive when fishing? I agree though. A frag grenade is a waste when simple HE will do the trick

>>693608043
faggot ive done my durr hunting
riddle me this do you often shoot if you dont think the first shot is going to kill your target

Libtard here and I think the government should leave guns alone.

>>693605653
Nah

I'm not against guns, but they didn't really help the situation in Dallas. If there was a time to prove we should keep them, it's come and gone.

>>693605653
There shouldn't even be a ban on firearms at all. Just needs more regulation.

>>693605653
more muslim attacks that can be blamed on whites and racism
the liberal paradise

>>693608288
I suppose if one was retarded like yourself a bomb would be too hard to make. For normal people though it's pretty simple.

>>693606599

Ww1.....fought with bolt action rifles.
35million Kia, wia,Mia

Ww2

22million Kia, Mia

Hmmmm

>>693606653
Being a pro-gun Eurofag myself, I do agree with this guy.
Guns are lethal tools and should not be available to people who may use them to harm others, as simple as that. Nothing wrong with waiting and safety course will elevate gun culture. I had to go through a 6 month period to get a gun ownership license here plus evaluation from a local gun club. Wasn't that difficult, but it ensures that psychos will not get their hands on guns easily. It's just common sense really, you don't let kids handle guns alone, why should you let idiots do it?

>>693605653
Full on Civil war needs to happen now , overthrow the Governments and restore common sense and reasoning and fairness to the world.

The Government wants to take guns away because they know the people are pissed off and civil war may be very near.

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2016/07/somali-muslims-march-upscale-mn-town-threaten-rape-homeowner-video/

Statistically speaking, it's going to reduce gun related death and injury.

People like that always argue with statistics. They're not actually out to fix the problem, they're just scared by numbers on a graphs and want to reduce them to feel safer.

>>693608484
I love when someone has a good argument it generally goes unnoticed

>>693609383
>Statistically speaking, it's going to reduce gun related death and injury.
And it might reduce overall accidental death and injury but criminal death and injury will just translate to other weapons.

>>693609156
cant hab muh guns so lets have a massive civil war where shit tons of people die trying to over throw the only thing keeping this world on as much of an even keel as possible. honestly if the U.S. broke down into civil war, russia would own the shit out of everything

>>693609011
Nice dubs

Artillery caused the most deaths in WW1 mate

Could I shoot more kangaroos if I used an AR, yes. Could I get better followup shots with a semi, yes. Will a bolt action do the job? Yes. Will I get good followup shots when I shoot up a school with my enfield? No. Could I shoot eleven cops with a bolt action in a shootout? Maybe, if I was lucky. Could I do it with a semi-auto sniper rifle? Probably. I'm not against guns (I like shooting roos for farmers when they overpopulate). I just reckon you don't need a battle rife for that. Nothing wrong with a bolt action mate

>>693605653
maybe cops wouldnt pull their gun as fast if they knew for sure that the person they are talking to likely isnt in possesion of a gun

>>693608633
you're a real edgy faggot

>>693609573
And I doubt your shitty little ass AR15 can stop a tank, JLTV's and TAK-4i's. And there's so much more the army has that can just fuck you in your ass while you sleep. So what's a shitty assault rifle gonna do?

>>693606500
So your mother is smart but she raised a moron?

>>693609554
there is a difference between pulling a trigger and stabbing someone or beating someone to death

>>693609011
WW1 trench tactics, chemical warfare
WW2 gassy jews

>>693606970
You know what's really important?
Landing your first shot.

Shit like that just makes it sound like you need semi autos because none of you can shoot for shit.

>>693608484
>>693609498

bolt actions do more damage per round, but It really doesnt matter. what is actually happeningvis incremental bans. Eventually yoy slippery slope your way to thr UK or japan where its slmost impossible to own anything.

>>693605852
I am completely conservative but do not have a gun fetish. I have no issue with gun control. I remember a time, not-so - long ago, when these faggot NRA sjw's were considered crazy. Then Ruby Ridge came along and now every redneck with a Dirty Harry fantasy is supposed to be my bro. Fuck you. Your paranoia fucked it for the rest of us. You fuckers drove so many middle of the road voters to the left that Obama won. Fuck you.

>>693609912
You're talking from experience?

>>693607191
Guns aren't banned in australia though.
How did something that didn't happen make a difference?

>>693609554

Exactly, this is the same deal as the pittbull ddebate. Pittbull haters absolutely worship their fucking statistics to make a point that all pitts should be banned, failing to realize that banning pitts will only eleminate pitt related dog bite incidents, not dog bite incidents overall.

Also, once pitts are eleminated, it's the number two dog breed on the list that jumps to number one and we can use the same argument all over again. 80% of fodg bites involve pitts, but nobody focus on the number two and number three and number four on the list which are also a problem regardless of percentages.

People who argue with stats without the proprer training to analyze and interpret them in studies are fucking retarded. You make make numbers say anything you want.

>>693610120
>Guns aren't banned in australia though.
They fucking are faggot, unless you are a collector, sportman or farmer. Don't spout bullshit here mate.

Anti-gun UK fag here.

None of you motherfuckers need to own a gun unless your life is threatened every day by wild animals.

>but I need guns to protect me from people with guns

No, that's what the police are for.

>B-b-but gangsters and criminals will still have them, you'll make a black market

This is true, but it also creates an environment where anyone who isn't justified in owning a gun - ie. non-army, non-police - can immediately be recognised as a terrorist or violent criminal, as opposed to the weird system you have in America where seemingly every one of you cunts owns a gun and tens of people are murdered daily or killed accidentally by then

>but muh second amendment

That was relevant 200 years ago. Not now.

>but the government! the government! THE GOVERNMENT! WE MUST PROTECT OURSELVES FROM THE GOVERNMENEEEEENENTNTNTN REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

Get over yourselves, you tin foil hat delusionalists. The government aren't going to round you all up some day because you couldn't feebly attempt to murder the entire US armed forces by yourself. Besides, if the US government really wanted to take you all hostage for whatever reason, they probably could. You know why? The Air Force. Nothing any of you cunts could do could possibly defend against a bombing raid. Nothing.

come at me faggots

>>693610036
Youve never shot at any reasonable distance. Sometimes shots are off no matter what you do, other times the shot goes exactly where it should and the animal doesnt drop anyway. Followup shots are important for humane hunting.

>>693609912

Because you need to be next to someone to stab them and with a gun you could be hundreds of metres away? You fucking idiot

>>693609156
You Amerifags have always been better at killing each other than anyone else (check American Civil War for casualties). Also, civil fucking war? kek. Muh 2nd amendment. The argument for being allowed to own assault rifles and military grade battle rifles and pistols loses credulity every time some idiot goes on a shooting rampage. If you want to make a point, go on a mass shooting with a bow or crossbow or a fucking bolt action. Either that, or admit you may be wrong

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>>693610120
There are more registered in Aus than any previous time in history and only 20% of the guns banned in 96 were ever handed in.

>>693610241
heh

Im all for trigger finger amputation and castration.
You cant shoot from the hip if there is no mag to shoot from.

>>693610249
>No, that's what the police are for.

Nope, they never protect anyone, simply clean up the mess afterwards.

>>693609808
so?

>>693610346
Nice googled image mate. Timestamp or gtfo

>>693610088
>bolt actions do more damage per round
Yes some bolt actions do do more damage per round rather than some of you 7.56mm ammo (I think that's the usually caliber for standard assault rifles). But with semi auto's they are able to produce more RPM (Rounds Per Minute) over a standard Bolt action. Lets say a person could shoot 50 bullets from a bolt action rifle per minute opposed to someone able to fire 130+. That takes to possible casualties down from 130 - 50 in that minute. And also due to being able to heavily modify your assault rifles causes that number to increase a lot.

>>693610384

3edgy5me

if you didn't have guns it wouldn't so easy for people to kill people, and therefore statements like that wouldn't have any truth to them

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>>693610430
Double heh, like I'm going to open my safe and timestamp for a /b/tard

>>693610631
>Not Murrican
Cops are lucky to attend in half an hour where I live, how are they going to protect you anon?

>>693610665
Your problem, faggot. Guess you can just take a nice big cup of STFU

>>693610249
What happens to public opinion when governments use such overpowering weapons against civilians? They lose every shred of respect ftom every decent person in the world. What happens next? Decent countries invade and liberate the people, allowing the people to govern themsrlves in exchange for favorable commerce treaties. Everyone knows that.

>>693607902
Never underestimate a large armed population during an upheaval against less motivated government forces.

See: ISIS, Vietnam, etc....

>>693610088
Nice dubs

Australia and we haven't had a problem since the 1996 gun legislation. Someone went on a mass shooting with an AR. Now we just have bolt actions and shotguns. They get used as intended mostly. Hunting, sporting and shooting birds because it's fun (though technically illegal). No more mass shootings though. I don't think it's intended to ban guns completely. They are useful tools to a farmer or a target shooter, or even just to hunt kangaroos with to thin the herd so they don't overpopulate. gun regulation is different from anti-gun liberal faggotry.

>>693605852
so you are libertarian

>>693605653
Fewer guns = less likely some one will get shot. Not fucken rocket science.

>>693610249
> tens of people are murdered daily or killed accidentally
I think in March I decided to look at the daily gun related deaths in America and it was 80 per day (Any death relating to death by a gun, not just involved) Personally that is a substantial number that really needs to be seen here. Not to mention there's about 1.3 school shootings on a daily basis.

>>693609123

As an Texan I fully agree, but it would still take decades for the wave of violence to lessen.

>>693610736
I have a bat right next to me for anyone who gets into my house, I don't need a gun to knock a cunt out mate.

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>>693610768
You'd love that wouldn't you anon, so you can go back to your warm and cosy ignorance
>There's no guns in Australia reeeeeee

>>693610967
So do I, nothing to do with my point - anons claim was the police are there to protect you, I claimed they are there simply to clean up the mess.

>>693610631
it is basically impossible to own a firearm in china, but that doesnt stop rampages. They have mass stabbings that kill several people at once.

>>693605653

That's not a very good question because it has a definite answer. If you get rid of all firearms there can be no shootings.

The question you should be asking is how do you intend to get rid of all the firearms? The answer to which is you can't. Our country os saturated, it's not even a possibility.

>>693608043
The rifle shoots where you tell it to.
If you're not confident enough in landing a shot that you need multiple attempts, you shouldn't pull the trigger.

If you miss the first shot, you shouldn't take follow up shit, because most likely it won't be a kill shot even if you hit, and the animal will run away and die slowly and you won't find it anyway.

>>693605653
Hard to shoot someone without a gun.

>>693610778

>implying that it would ever actually come to pass that a government would act like that against it's people
>implying that armed invasion is ever the right thing to do in such circumstances
>implying that the average population en masse is capable of establishing decent governance and order

Mate, what the fuck are you smoking? I want some!

My whole point is that the government of a first world country would never act like that against it's citizens, and therefore all of the pro-gun faglords who argue that they need to protect themselves from the government are moronic

>>693610942
Start now and that difference will come sooner.

>>693610900

This

This is exactly why I'm anti-gun

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>>693611098
Bullshit.
Australia has a senate enquiry recently which found that 4% of guns used in crime had ever been registered, in a country that has mandated registration, the other guns must have been magic I guess because criminals follow the law to a T.

>>693611001
>warm
Now you are definitely a lying bitch. It's fucking freezing here right now, ya cunt

>>693605653

Because Amerifags are irresponsible with firearms.

I guarantee in Russia, you don't have as many incidences of idiots using guns improperly.

Japan doesn't have guns or knives, and the rate of homocide is significantly lower than the US.

>>693611080

You're not wrong anon, but at the same time, we can't ban knives, as they other have other useful functions. Guns only exist to kill people, and wild animals.

What is your point exactly?

>>693611060
What else can they do, I feel for the police in America because you can walk down the street and anyone you pass can have a gun and have ill attentions. Though I do agree police do have slow response time but it can be managed, without the intruder to have a gun you are more likely to hold out against them. My point is the cops do have a slow response time but eliminating the threat of lets say an intruder having a gun or even replacing it with a knife means you ( The victim ) are able to get away quicker or even able to fend of the intruder. Police are there to help and protect, they have prevented a lot in the past but not many people will see that unless they are saved themselves. Without the police a lot worse can happen.

>>693610799
Nice dubs

Vietnam was a war between governments. North Vietnam was never invaded and continued to send forces across the border as well as supplying the rebels. ISIS is the product of a failed state. During the turmoil of the early Syrian Civil War, ISIS were just another faction. It was when they decided to cross the border into the failed state of Iraq that they exploded. The Iraqi forces ran away and left their weapons stockpiles. Armed with modern equipment, ISIS returned to Syria and attacked the other rebel factions. Once they had become a force to be reckoned with, they started to draw in support from foreign populaces.

Western societies are different from the rest of the world. A modern democratic nation has never fought a successful (or even worthwhile) guerrilla campaign against a foreign oppressor (see WW1, WW2, aftermath of WW2). Armed or not, Modern Western Democracies are just really shit at fighting anything but a conventional war

>>693611351
Russia has rather Nazi gun laws.
You have to start with a shotgun and after 5 years you can get yourself a rifle or so. But there is plenty of gun violence in unstable regions.

>>693610826
>shooting birds for fun
Youre a perfect example of the mentality that leads to wanting gun bans. Youre first thought is to how many you could kil so you project your mental deficiencies on others and support bans.

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>>693611292
Pretty weak anon but don't worry there aren't almost 4 million registered guns in Aus, it's just everyone elses imagination.

>>693611351
Oh god, my sides.

Fucking Russians cant even drive to the store without recklessly massacring everyone they share the road with. You think a bunch of squatting gopniks would be any more careful with firearms?

>>693611225
Yeah I am the same. I was just following you up with facts to help get the point across. It's not tens its nearly hundreds

>>693610241
But that's bullshit anon.
I live here, and they are not banned.
In fact, statistically, 1/3 people own at least one firearm in australia.

You.dont need to be a collector, sportsman (whatever that is) or a farmer, you just need to have somewhere to shoot it.
A range counts.

Stop getting your facts from americans on /b/ you idiot

>>693605653
I'm one of the less libtardy libtards but eventually fewer guns will be in circulation and only serious criminals will want guns, making it less possible for kids to get guns to shoot up schools, and fewer home invaders with guns

>>693605653
In the 1960's when Black Panthers started open carrying in Oakland it took about a week for Nixon to push through strict gun control.
After what happened in Dallas last night - whitey gonna want gun control back.

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>>693611001
Now you are crossing the LINE! The ute is a national treasure you fucking Yank! Don't you fucking mention my beloved nation again you cunt. Australia is the best, yeah nah, one of the best places in the world. We invented the ute (pickup truck). So don't mock it

>>693611431
So what is the difference between you defending yourself with a bat against another who has say a bat or a knife and defending yourself with a gun against someone else who has a gun? Either way you're proactively defending yourself and the police are a non issue in both cases. The main difference is the average small person can defend themselves against a large/drugged person with a gun whilst this is less likely with a hittin stick.

>>693610967
criminals certainly follow the law and wont break into your home with a gun

>>693605653
>liberal here
It won't. Its too late. They're fucked.

>>693610333
> Sometimes shots are off no matter what you do

No, a rifles a tool, it does what you make.it do.

If your shots off, it's because you couldn't make the shot, or couldn't recognize circumstances that would increase your chance of missing

>>693611653
>doesn't know what a sportsman is
Probably don't know what Rugby is either.
You play football with your little pussy feet where you live?

>>693609847
Different anon, but that hit a little too hard for me

>>693608050
See
>>693610799

Also
>Guarantee they will end up fighting eachother more.

No, they'd fight the tyrannical government, you think america has lost all it's patriotism? We overwhelmingly despise corruption and if it's laid out plain and simple for us we work to end it together.

>Don't even have anti-tank weapons

Literally every average garage in America has chemicals that could make tank disabling bombs. Also unless the tyrannical government wanted to lose all infrastructure it wouldn't resort to bombing and drone strikes. It would need to be soldiers on the ground confiscating weapons. 7 million soldiers at most, to 120 million armed citizens.

>Not much consolation for the people who got their loved ones shot because some crazy owned a battle rifle.

So? I don't care if it's 'not much consolation' for car accident victims if that car wasn't banned afterwards because of it. You're statistically more likely to die from lightning than from a firearm in the U.S. if you follow the law, aren't in a gang and do not plan on committing suicide.

>>693611765
In close area's a bat can defiantly beat a gun hands down. I am saying there is no use for a gun for home defense. making the "I NEED IT TO PROTECT MY FAMILY" excuse pointless

Your problem is niggers, not guns

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>>693611748
No shit sherlock, where the fuck do you think I live? Does that look like American bush? 4runners weren't even sold into American when that was made.

>>693611124
It doesnt shoot where you tell it to. There are too many factors and animals rarely drop in one clean shot.

>>693611777
A bat to the head will knock the cunt out, if it doesn't hit him again, and again, and again.

>>693610430
You know of Google. ..
Maybe you.should use it to check if guns are banned in australia.

Dumb cunt

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>>693611593
I don't know where you get the idea that Russians are such bad drivers.

And don't they teach proper use of Firearms in their schools?

>>693611662
I'm personally against outright banning guns just so you know, I'm more of a restriction person

>>693605653

Can a liberal explain to me how they think they could get rid of guns in the States ?

Make it illegal ? Yes. Because by definition criminals obey laws.. 350 Million accounted for guns in the U.S... I would guess there's another 350 million that are under the radar..

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>>693611576
I never shot random birds. It was one of my mates who does that. I feel bad for the birds to be honest. Even the kangaroos I shoot I feel bad for. It has to be done though (the roos, not the birds). So I just have fun with it. Nothing wrong with roo shooting or guns. Just the legislation. Americans see guns as a right. Australians see them as a tool. If you don't need a gun then why own one?

Gun Owner here, personally I think there should be a couple more steps in the purchasing of the guns. Thats about it.

>>693611898
80% of gun homicides are gang related. You're statistically correct, sir.

>>693605653
Because it hasn't been tried. Everything else has, to no avail. It's an idea whose time has come.

>>693611943
Americans don't like the russians because they are in all ways better than them. And cause of the fear mongering over cold war and shit their perspective is heavily biased

>>693611160
So now you say governments wont use the tools you said they would, and you deny the foreign policy of usa and europe since world war 2. cool story, good fight.

>>693612012
Get Trump elected.

Won't be america for that long.

>>693611875
>thinks a civilian population could take on the US military
Found the retard

>>693611430
Banning guns does not stop rampages, thank you for agreeing.

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>>693612039
To make sure your government doesn't turn on you. Your country has no backup plan if corporate monopolies take over and shut down all legal means of re-establishing a representative democracy. I'm of the mind that if you're mentally stable and obey the law you ought to have a gun and be fairly well trained in it for the sake of your safety and those around you as well as being another person who can fight against tyranny through non legal means if that's the only choice left.

>>693610799
> See: ISIS, Vietnam, etc....
They couldn't be stopped, but they couldn't gain control either.

The difference is, they controlled their own infrastructure.
That's not the case in a civil issue.

In the case of USA citizens vs government, government can control the infrastructure.

If there was the ability to shut down water, power, communications, food production, and ammunition supply to ISIS, Vietnam, etc....
Things would've been very different

>>693612107
>thinks a bunch of alcoholic ex-commies make Americans jealous
Fucking kek

>>693611080
> several

>>693608145
And the problem with 'hoop jumping' is..?

>>693612039
Id rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it. I am a hunter however.

>>693605653

Er, simple math.

Fewer guns = Fewer gun-related deaths.

Dunno why that's so difficult for people to understand.

>>693612095
>whose time has come.

it's time hasn't come and never will. The facts are in, banning guns doesn't reduce crime rates. Murder doesn't go down, assault doesn't go down. Maybe you can stop the already extremely rare mass-shootings (you're significantly more likely to die by lightning than from a mass-shooting) but that's it. http://www.mintpressnews.com/the-facts-that-neither-side-wants-to-admit-about-gun-control/207152/

United Kingdom: The UK enacted its handgun ban in 1996. From 1990 until the ban was enacted, the homicide rate fluctuated between 10.9 and 13 homicides per million. After the ban was enacted, homicides trended up until they reached a peak of 18.0 in 2003. Since 2003, which incidentally was about the time the British government flooded the country with 20,000 more cops, the homicide rate has fallen to 11.1 in 2010. In other words, the 15-year experiment in a handgun ban has achieved absolutely nothing.

Ireland: Ireland banned firearms in 1972. Ireland’s homicide rate was fairly static going all the way back to 1945. In that period, it fluctuated between 0.1 and 0.6 per 100,000 people. Immediately after the ban, the murder rate shot up to 1.6 per 100,000 people in 1975. It then dropped back down to 0.4. It has trended up, reaching 1.4 in 2007.

Australia: Australia enacted its gun ban in 1996. Murders have basically run flat, seeing only a small spike after the ban and then returning almost immediately to preban numbers. It is currently trending down, but is within the fluctuations exhibited in other nations.

>>693612399
The Government - which just happens to consist of tens of thousands of citizens, you seem to assume everyone who works for the government will agree with and blindly follow any decisions made by it.

>>693611285
Because most of the guns used in crime were stolen from legal owners before gun control was in place.
One of which is that owned firearms must be stored in a locked and secure gun safe.

>>693611939
The fuck cunt?
Maybe you can't fucking read, but they are banned with some exceptions. Come visit us sometime with a gun and tell us they aren't banned, ya faggot.

>>693612515
There has actually been an increase in the number guns and a decrease in gun deaths in recent years

>>693612515
>Fewer guns = Fewer gun-related deaths.

But 0 evidence it will change the rate of death relating to crime.

People shoot other people with gun

Take away gun

People no able to shoot other people with gun anymore

>>693612469
Most mass shooters barely reach "several"
In fact the definition only starts at 4

>>693611748
Cheers mate. Good to know you're not a Yank. Nice ute

>>693606599
An AR is a semi automatic sporting weapon, not a fully automatic asssult rifle with child seeking rounds.

>>693612490
The hoops never end

>>693611848
I don't play with balls anon.
You seem pretty keen on it though.
Is that what a sportsman is?
A guy that plays with balls?
That sure is relates to firearm ownership.

Nice how you ignored the part that said you don't need any of that shit to own a firearm though.
Well.played faggot

>>693612247
120 million to 7 million, assuming half or more of the 7 million doesn't refuse to kill their own people and only 10% of the armed populace resist with force, that's still roughly 2 to 1 with the 2 being in their home territory. If you think it'd be a simple victory for the U.S. you're the retard.

>>693612599
Our safe laws came into existence in 76 anon, guns were registered before 96 just there wasn't a national consolidated database and ofc the information was kept in hardcopy - that's how they know only 20% were handed in during the 96 buyback.

The fact is guns are imported regularly by bikie and asian gangs along with the drugs they bring in, they're also manufactured in house as cheap throwaways.

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>>693605653
Because we are moving to repeal the 2nd Amendment entirely. Form an anti-gun militia in your area now, ask me how.

>>693611870
It's true though.
She obviously isn't against firearms, she just finds this idea of needing them to protect yourself from a tyrannical government laughable.

Rightfully so.
Sanity/10, would fuck

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>>693605653
i think it's too late for US to change anything, im afraid. youve dug this hole and now you cant get out.

>>693612490
If it's not just an inconvenience, but an additional price tag it can add up to the point that virtually no one that's poor can afford a gun for self-defense, the people most likely to end up needing a gun for protection.

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>>693611875
>thinks him and his mates can take on a modern army
It's nice to own guns. I shoot them a fair amount. It's another thing to think that your gun gives you a lot of power. Get over yourself

>>693612665
Evidence it doesn't reduce the crime rate if anything increasing it. http://www.mintpressnews.com/the-facts-that-neither-side-wants-to-admit-about-gun-control/207152/

>>693611922
Ah...
So the gun decides where the bullet will go.
But who is in control of the gun?


Do you have one of them new danfangled bendybarrel guns?

>>693605852
This nigga gets it. Follow your own path, fuck what you've been taught.

>>693612792
Neither does that slippery slope of an argument.

l2logic

>>693612691
> Crazy people shoot other sane armed people with gun

>Take away gun

>Crazy people shoot other sane people with gun

fixed that for ya

>>693612815
1 tank or 1 aircraft could take out literally thousands of civilians no problem
Also battleships, submarines, aircraft carriers, drones etc.

>>693612653

That does nothing to negate the idea that fewer guns will result in fewer gun-related deaths. Zero guns would equal zero gun-related deaths. Logic please.

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>>693612799
Fucking cheeky faggot.

If you have a gun, you have a licence. If you have a licence, you have an exceptional need for a gun. If not, then you are banned from getting guns.

Anything else, you little cunt?

PS: Go back to mexico and learn english. Maybe you might learn what "sports" are all about.

>>693613006
It gives you a chance nutsack. Especially here in the US. Other shit stain countries will get owned by rpgs, but at least with an AR there's a chance of taking over heavier equipment and becoming the wolverines.

>>693613184
>unless the tyrannical government wanted to lose all infrastructure it wouldn't resort to bombing and drone strikes. It would need to be soldiers on the ground confiscating weapons. 7 million soldiers at most, to 120 million armed citizens.

Why are americans so troubled with licensing farearms more strictly? Its happend in canada? Long arms for hunting requires a non restricted license. Pistols and semi auto-assualt rifles are restricted to people who are willing to do a mental and background evaluation

>>693613006
unless the tyrannical government wanted to lose all infrastructure it wouldn't resort to bombing and drone strikes. It would need to be soldiers on the ground confiscating weapons. 7 million soldiers at most, to 120 million armed citizens.

>>693612665

Zero evidence that the easy availability of guns and their total lack of regulation leads to their use? Don't be an idiot, the evidence surrounds us every day.

>>693613194
Assuming guns magically disappeared you would simply see an increase in other weapon related deaths, the urge to commit crime wouldn't change in the slightest.

>>693608050
You say that, but America has been stuck fighting barely trained and barely equipped goat fuckers for like 15 years, and we haven't just walked away with the win they've made us looked retarded most the time

>>693613313
Because no country which has introduced a form of registration has ever let it alone at that, it's always a slow erosion of gun ownership.

>>693612344
Nice dubs

Back up plan is always insurrection. Armed or not, popular insurrection is the biggest deterrent for tyrants. You can kill a President just as easily with a bolt action as you can with a AK (if you were so inclined). Thinking that starting a mini armed insurrection would do anything but strengthen a tyrants hold is a misconception. "Terrorists" home grown or not, as they are labelled nowadays, would only give a modus operandi, a casus beli. Popular insurrection is a last resort. Reform and Democracy are the best preventive measures

>>693613194
>drugs are illegal so nobody uses them
Logic you fucking retard
Good luck getting rid of every single gun

>>693613369
So you're going to also regulate other potential weapons? Bats, knives, bricks etc because if you remove guns then other tools will take their place - removing guns doesn't change criminality.

>>693612580
Water, power and communications can be shut down easily without citizen assistance by a few targeted strikes.

America can't supply it's own food needs, and exporters won't trade goods against the government's order, because it's legally in authority, and they need trade relations after the conflict.
They also don't give shipments of food away for free.

Ammunition stores are the easiest to be destroyed.

You nutters say you need them to prevent government tyranny, and back it up by saying that the government has far too.much control also it is, but then you say they don't really control anything when it.comes to you.fighting them.

A little thinking goes a long way anon.

>>693612505
>Id rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it.

What we should've said and left as is when they first argued to register full auto firearms. Tax funded gun safety courses, family gun safe laws that allow one loaded gun on your person or in your sight while in the home, univ. instant background checks, and cooling-off periods are all fine.

>>693613250
>assuming the government won't bomb a few buildings
>assuming drones are only used for bombing
God you're so fucking retarded

>>693613553

Let's ask the officers in Dallas how they feel about knives and bricks replacing guns. How many snipers do you think use bricks exactly?

>>693611875

this. haji's in afghanistan have disabled abrams with frickin molotovs.

>>693612617
I can read, that's not what you said.
And they aren't banned with some exceptions, it's the opposite...
Some exceptions are heavily restricted.
You can still own them, but it's so.difficult it may as well be a ban.

> full auto, semi auto, pump action, extended magazines
That's the restricted list.

>>693613455 In canada. Correct me if im wrong. I dont think they have tightent gun laws at all if not loosend them to restricted firearm owners. Again just specualation correct me if i am wrong

>>693606769
"You bought guns to a fucking drone fight"
-Jim Jefferies

>>693613557
Once again the assumption of unity, ~50% of the population votes for any given government in the US yet in the case of civil war you think there will still be a unified government in control?

>>693612767
Bolt actions mate. No need for a semi. It's a compromise. People still get their guns but mass shootings are minimised. I don't see how this debate turns into gun nuts vs liberal faggots. There is a middle ground that works (Australia). I love my enfield. I don't NEED a semi AR for roo shooting and target practice.

>>693613553

I'm not talking about eliminating the urge to commit crimes, I'm talking about reducing the number of gun-related deaths. Reduce the number of guns available to people and the number of gun-related deaths will drop. Again, simple math.

>>693613442
Have you looked at the kill/death ratio for those wars, it's like 20 to 1

>>693613610
>won't bomb a few buildings

oh like the super cool militia hangout building all of the guerrilla freedom fighters hangout at? /sarcasm they'd be in their homes, with traps, dipshit. They'd also in the hundreds of thousands be in the woods being hard as fuck to weed out. Or in cities where you couldn't use any bombs or you'd kill innocent Americans.

>assuming drones are only used for bombing

No I wasn't.

>>693613486

I'm not talking about legality, I'm talking about availability. If guns are not available, fewer people will have them. If fewer people have them, fewer people will use them and fewer people will be killed by them. Again, it's not a difficult concept.

>>693612739
Ok, so what would you call a situation where an individual pull out a gun and shoots down 4 or more people?

It's not individually targeted, and people got shot en mass...

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>>693605653

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate
>Click homicides

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overview_of_gun_laws_by_nation
>Strong correlation

>>693606500
AR-15 vs Government

You're dead anon

>>693611098
False, illegal weapons would still be imported and sold on the black market just as they are now

As a registered democrat. I don't believe in taking away guns i am all for the 2nd amendment however i do believe in making it harder for guns to fall into the wrong hands

>>693613650
And we can ask the poor cafe owner in Australia how he felt about being killed with a gun, bought illegally, used illegally and never registered in a country which registers every gun sold. How many criminals follow laws exactly?

Individual examples don't alter the overall statistics and crying about "gun crime" is looking at the overall statistics without ever breaking them down to study them.

>>693613788
>mass shootings are minimized

from extremely rare,to, extremely rare?

wow! what a change!/sarcasm Look, you really don't seem to get how this works. If someone wants to shoot up a place, they can make a semi-auto with stuff from home depot and handy youtube videos. However, now your populace is defenseless for the most part against criminals (gun bans did not reduce crime rates in the UK, Ireland, or Australia) and now you have no means of fighting against a turned corrupt government.

>>693605653
>Change is the only way to move forward
>A wise scientist once said: The definition of insanity is doing something over and over again while expecting different results.

>>693613801
And be taken up by deaths with other weapons, the criminals will still be committing their crimes.

>>693613855
Woods can be bombed
>assuming the military never allows for collateral damage
Also precise strikes from tanks or helis
>/sarcasm
This isn't reddit you fucking retard

>>693611351
Japan is also much smaller than the US mind you

>>693613801
Here's some more simple math. Gun bans = less gun crime and more non-gun crime.

http://www.mintpressnews.com/the-facts-that-neither-side-wants-to-admit-about-gun-control/207152/

UK, Australia, and Ireland's crime rates did not go down after their gun bans.

>>693614175
Australias gun crime rate has decreased since the 60's, ownership rates are higher than ever - yet the violent crime rate remains much the same.

>>693613934
So like Switzerland?

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Blaming liberals for anti-gun fags is like blaming conservatives for the tea party.

It's not the fairest comparison. The 2nd amendment is right up there, below the 1st amendment, which is about freedom of speech and religion. Any liberal worth their salt knows that free speech is above all else the most important right. And if they're not completely dumbed down, then they should remember from their school lessons that the 1st amendment is protected *by* the 2nd amendment.

See: every country that doesn't have a right to bear arms, and can't say bad things about their government without getting branded a treasonous terrorist, and then disappearing.

>>693605653
Actual liberal here. There's nothing liberal about telling someone else what they can't do, so long as what they're doing doesn't deny someone sense their rights.

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>>693614114
>A wise scientist

Don't define insanity. Don't do it. No one needs it.
That's also called perseverance.

>>693614150
>Also precise strikes from tanks or helis
Delivered by fellow countrymen of the rebels who may or may not agree with said rebels.

>>693613145
Well if you can't prevent crime I guess we should just make all crime legal then

>>693614282
>someone sense
Else. Someone else.

>>693614155
That's per capita mind you

>>693612850
Bikies produce their own drugs, they don't operate as middlemen, and they do not import firearms.

We're an island nation, importing secretly means independent transport across the ocean, which out values any potential return on sales.
And don't try saying that illegal firearms cost $30,000+ here, because that's complete bullshit

>>693614150
>assuming the military never allows for collateral damage

every man woman and child that is killed in this war that was innocent will have their names blaring on the news and social media. Every bad bombing or attack with soldiers will make the overall populace grow more and more sick of the conflict. If this government wants to maintain power it has to maintain order which means people can't not want to work for the government. Which means at best you can kill 'terrorist' gun owners fighting for the 2nd amendment, but overall it's an extremely hard position for the tyrannical government unless it's wanting to just dismantle the entire country so it's ready to be invaded by china or russia or both.

>>693614276
Switzerland will be a fine country to model ours after we overthrow the current establishment, and kick out / imprison the bankers / lobbyists who have been doing exorbitantly well in this economic climate. Not before.

>>693613442
Exactly. You won every time (Aussie soldiers as well) when fighting tradition set piece battles. Even fought well against guerrilla style tactics. The problem is, that Modern Westerners are shit at unconventional warfare. WW1, WW2, aftermath of WW2. No modern western democracy has ever fought a foreign occupier or tyrannical government well. We are great at war, but when it comes to the human cost of fighting an oppressor, we are shit. Western partisans, armed as they were, have never been worth much compared to partisans who have grown up in dictatorships. Assuming that owning a gun makes you comparable to a hardcore Jihadist or a Slav WW2 partisan is hubris. That is a good thing. Western Democracies solve their problems politically or by conventional warfare. Other societies are just fucked (even though their populace can fight successful guerrilla campaigns)

>>693612997
If you were concerned about the poor, you would be advocating for things that would improve their wellbeing (access to food, shelter, health care, education, etc.).

Also, where does this claim that poor people need guns the most come from? That is one of few pro-gun claims the NRA does not make.

>>693610855
Libertarian is conservative economic and liberal foreign/social policy you retard

>>693614276

Ironically, Switzerland has something closer to what the second amendment refers to, a well-regulated militia. And well-regulated it is, with ammunition kept well away from citizens to prevent accidental shootings or crimes of passion or robberies.

>>693614448
Exactly. Exactly this.

That's why we need to disarm the police force ASAP. Nowhere does it state "let any idiot have a gun." And since they're not really in a mood to do it themselves, that means it falls on the citizenry to make this happen.

Good point anon, couldn't have memed it better myself.

>>693614277
>not understanding that things have changed in 240 years
Fucking kek

>>693613976
take a look at honduras, jamaica, and brazil.

especially that jamaica entry on the gun laws article.

I'd rather have my guns thank you.

>>693614379
95% of gun crimes are committed with illegally obtained firearms. It's called context. You want to knock that 5% down a little more? Fine, but don't act like it's a pressing issue.

>>693614351
>assuming everybody will agree with the rebels
We know you're retarded you don't need to keep showing it

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>>693614396
>and they do not import firearms.

>mfw

They produce some of their own drugs and guns yes, they also operate importation rackets, of both drugs and guns - there has even been widely publicised cases of gun importation rackets being ended by the cops, there is no grey area here, the cops know they do and occasionally catch them doing it.

>And don't try saying that illegal firearms cost $30,000+ here, because that's complete bullshit

No shit, I've been offered a Mauser for $800 but seeing as I'm a LAFO and I like having guns I turned 360 and moonwalked away.

>>693609573
Ok lets just lay down and dye and no matter what laws the Government comes up with well just be obey everything

If you value stability over freedom you will have neither.

>>693614564
This isn't true - government issue ammunition is kept by the government, the populace can still buy and keep ammunition for their firearms.

>>693614086

I can't speak to the poor cafe owner in Australia about American gun crime, but it seems pretty fucking obvious that if fewer people possess guns fewer people will use guns to shoot people, whether in crimes or during arguments or by having their toddlers find them or what have you. Again, I don't see what's so difficult for you to grasp here: Fewer guns = Fewer gun-related deaths. Pretty simple really.

>>693614530
The U.S. is being invaded by a foreign army. It's just very sneaky this time around. Rather than arriving in force, and announcing their presence with trumpets this time around, they're inserting people into key power positions, and sabotaging the U.S.'s defenses at critical times. (There is no way that 9/11 could have occurred on any other day, but the pilots were busy running a "training simulation" of two planes crashing into cities, and couldn't distinguish reality from fiction. Look it up, it's fucking weird.)

It's Saudi Arabia, btw. Saudi Arabia has been infiltrating our government and military these past 30 years, and with our foreign policy towards them, I don't blame them.

>>693613230
> if you don't have a license you can't own a gun
> guns are banned

> if you don't have are license, you can't drive are car
> cars are banned

You dumb cunt.
Saying some funny shit though, so keep posting faggot

>>693614793
>lets just lay down and dye
Emo faggot.

>>693614726
>Completely misses the may or may not

Hows that reading comprehension tutoring going?

>>693614456
And a good chunk of the population will blame the terrorists for starting the conflict

>>693614822

And which part of "well-regulated militia" do you think applies to the gun owners of the US?

>>693614537
I do advocate for those things. Crime occurs in high poverty areas the most. Poverty is the #1 motivation for crime. Therefore if you're poor, you likely live in a poor area, therefore you're the most likely to be a victim of a crime out of any economic class and would be the most likely to use a hand gun in self-defense if you have one.

>>693614091
Who ever said gun ownership was related to crime rates? What we are saying is that the US has a fucking big problem with mass shootings. Every time the shooters use guns which are high capacity semi or full auto. Australia never had much of a problem because we instituted preventative legislation as soon as the problem presented itself. The US never did. Now you poor bastards have to deal with a rising number of mass shootings. Nothing wrong with guns. Something wrong with your gun legisaltion

>>693613455
With all those examples you gave, I'm totally convinced that you aren't just making that up

>>693614836
But not fewer deaths in criminal incidents - where's the hard to understand bit here? If you're trying to legislate for fewer deaths by accident and misadventure then you may as well issue mandatory bubbles to the populace, people will kill themselves in all sorts of interesting ways until we no longer exist.

>>693614490
Well that is the bigger issue really compared to guns but it's too complicated for your average voter so they ignore it

>>693614975
Did I mention militia?

>>693614836
>if fewer people possess guns
In australia that might work, since there's no Mexican cartels driving them in over the border, but in America gun restriction doesn't mean "fewer people possessing guns," it means "fewer people possessing guns *legally. *"

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>>693612247
They'd have a damn good chance.

>>693612815
>>693613184
>>693613250
>>693613610
>>693613855
>>693614150
>>693614351
>>693614726
>>693614888

>>693605653
So niggers cant shoot cops?

>>693615069
Nope, a recent senate enquiry in Aus found that 4% of guns used in crime were ever registered, in a country that has mandatory registration. Importation is big here also.

>>693605653
Taking your gun away is nigh impossible in the states, who ever says getting rid of such a right is ignoring the real discussion and neglecting the wider picture. You'll keep your guns

>>693614955
'starting the conflict' yes, they're called the idiots that don't know history. Everyone else will know what started the conflict was stripping us of our right that protects all other rights.

>>693614564
Switzerland is also tiny

>>693615003
>a rising number of mass shootings being reported by the media

Ftfy

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>>693614836
Oh. Well, that's your mistake right there.

>I can't speak to the poor cafe owner in Australia about American gun crime, but it seems pretty fucking obvious that if fewer people possess guns fewer people will use guns to shoot people,

See. That doesn't work, because our government is corrupt, and are just waiting for an opportunity to pounce on civilians, starting with people least likely to get sympathy, such as the homeless, and moving up from there. They grab land here, and there, put in a restriction once in awhile, start taxing. They're not obvious about it--but there is certainly the signs of an aggressive, out right attack on Americans coming from government sources.

http://www.breitbart.com/california/2014/04/30/johnson-land-vail-blm-bundy-land-grab-federal-rights-california/

This is what foreigners don't understand about the States. They see this aggressive fleet of warships and think "Oh, here come the Americans to battle the Middle East." But at home, we see these aggressive fleets of helicopters and SWAT teams, and we think "Oh shit, here comes the Government to fucking take our land and steal our money."

This decade is INSANE. I have witnessed a fucking foreign invasion going on in the U.S., and most people still have become so accustomed to it, that they're oblivious to it.
>Oh, well, that's just how the government is.

Stop fucking using the word Liberal, like you know what it means. You clearly don't. Being liberal is Not making more rules. In any way.

>>693615036

Dunno what to tell you, since you're being willfully stupid. We have a situation where people solve stupid arguments with guns, where toddlers shoot their parents or each other, where kids bring guns to school to get back at bullies, where couples shoot each other, where parents shoot their children because they're jumping on the bed, where ten thousand people a year kill themselves, all because guns are readily available and absurdly easy to acquire. Remove guns from the equation and most of those deaths won't occur. Make guns harder to acquire and criminals won't have access to them, and they'll have to find some other way to get people's money out of the register, ways that are obviously less deadly. It's so stupid, and the solution is so obvious, why be obtuse about it?

>>693614888
So you just disproved your own argument, congratulations retard

Can you americans just admit to feeling better with a gun? Don't you just feel manlier?

>>693613775
Yes, because the smart thing to do is be with the side that's going to win.

>>693615140
Nope, Australia isn't America.