BE HONEST

obviously not. but i wont. you dont have to either

99% of people live and die like this.

Doesn't matter, ppl will always eventually forget you.
Google 'ozymandias poem'

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>>681597627
Yeah I'm fine with it it doesn't matter to you after you already dead. Life is for the living and after you die none of it matters.

>>681597943

If you're saying you're totally indifferent to the question of your posthumous reputation, or to having fame/respect/glory in this lifetime, I think that's completely ridiculous.

>>681597917

Yes, that's not the question.

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Absolutely. I wont be alive to give a fuck, plus im forgotten now anyway

That is why I will be America's Hitler I will exterminate the sand niggers and the normal niggers. I will be successful in finishing off both races.

OP here. I guess that some of us have certain skills... especially intellect, which seems translatable to so many things.

But I'm wondering if people who are born with very pronounced intellect/charisma sometimes demand or dream of outrageous success for themselves (and obviously I've come to ponder this by way of pondering my own life).

It's so easy to imagine ourselves becoming really fantastic at music, writing, leading etc. and I wonder if it doesn't drive us insane.

>>681598111
Nice trips

Also I don't mind being forgotten by everyone. If my future children think of me and have a good life because of me, that's all I want.

>>681597627
That last thing I want is recognition. I aim for anonymity.

I thought about this when I was 13. The idea that we won't be remembered is only shocking if you think you are capable of doing something actually important. But you aren't.

>>681599325

And yet certain people do great things.

>>681597627
Everybody dies alone.

>>681598184
rip

There's remarkable solace to be found in recognizing how pitifully finite the individual lifespan is.
For me it's made what experiences I do have far more intimate and personal, which effectively decimated any cravings for grandeur.

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>>681597627
the amount of grievence my life has suffered directly because of other people following, stalking, knowing whom i am, i would more then happily be the only known man in my existence, and live it out ever the more infinitely peaceful & progressive, productive, lifestyle.

the lower you are the more you need other people, the higher, the latter

>>681600987

This is paltry, even cliche. We all know we're tiny, nothing compared to the cosmos, remarkably instantaneous temporally, etc.

We all know George Washington will be forgotten someday too.

Yet these plain facts do not explain why we still value the idea of being loved, they do not explain why should care at all about anything in this world (like our families). Sorry if this sounded harsh, don't mean to single you out, a few posts have had this gist to them.

No choice. No, but wtf can we do? Nothing..

>>681601395
I'm pretty tolerant to criticism, don't worry.
I don't know why we crave affection. I'm sure there's some evolutionary cause, like it helps with our survival as a species and furthers the individual capacity to procreate.

>>681597627
I'm completely ok with this. Being made into a memory when I'm dead doesn't unnerve me at all. I like being alone because I never feel lonely. I never longed for someone to remember me and I never will

>>681602051

To be or not to be-that is the question:
Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer
The slings and arrows of outrageous fortune,
Or to take arms against a sea of troubles,
And, by opposing, end them. To die, to sleep-
No more-and by a sleep to say we end
The heartache and the thousand natural shocks
That flesh is heir to-'tis a consummation
Devoutly to be wished. To die, to sleep-
To sleep, perchance to dream. Aye, there's the rub,
For in that sleep of death what dreams may come,
When we have shuffled off this mortal coil,
Must give us pause. There's the respect
That makes calamity of so long life.
For who would bear the whips and scorns of time,
Th' oppressor's wrong, the proud man's contumely,
The pangs of despised love, the law’s delay,
The insolence of office, and the spurns
That patient merit of the unworthy takes,
When he himself might his quietus make
With a bare bodkin? Who would fardels bear,
To grunt and sweat under a weary life,
But that the dread of something after death,
The undiscovered country from whose bourn
No traveler returns, puzzles the will
And makes us rather bear those ills we have
Than fly to others that we know not of?
Thus conscience does make cowards of us all,
And thus the native hue of resolution
Is sicklied o'er with the pale cast of thought,
And enterprises of great pitch and moment,
With this regard their currents turn awry,
And lose the name of action.-Soft you now,
The fair Ophelia.-Nymph, in thy orisons
Be all my sins remembered

it doesnt fucking matter. you are so meaninless in the grand scheme of things.

and you know whats worse?
if youre a male and if you dont peak some sort of interest to females,


you are fucking worthlesssssss


thats straight up reality.
you better start making your DNA worth reproducing.

>>681597627
One day, the sun will engulf the earth and scatter all history, struggles, and accomplishments as radioactive dust to be swallowed by Sagittaurius A*.

Death is inevitable. Life is improbable. You are impossible.

Stop wasting your life trying to be immortal and just enjoy the fucking ride, would ya?

>>681603215

This is completely cliche and serves the purpose of ending thought/introspection and justifying the stupid gadgetry and distraction that characterizes our society's obsession and our daily lives. I'm not interested, at all.

Once one begins to notice that there are (contrary to popular "carpe-diem-just-enjoy-the-ride" sentiments) meaningful things in this world, that there are books and people and ideas that have had incomprehensibly far reaching effects, and that many of these are extremely rich, beautiful and good (which last word seems so pathetic a term for what Jesus or Shakespeare or Dante have wrought), one cannot help but aspire to exactly their project, that one of enriching life and the limitless capacity of human being through the activities of writing and working, or painting or building etc.

>>681597627
yes

ill be forgotten when i die
No family
No friends
Rarely leave my house
ill be surprised if any found my body in the first 2 weeks
And im okay with this im beyond all that shit anyway

My dead self will be okay with it, because he doesn't care. The living me will cope with it.

>>681603630
It sounds like your feelings are very important to you, but the way that you write pisses me off.

I also don't like being dismissed by naive children.

Try again when you've spent six consecutive hours entranced and creating an inner sanctum where your past-selves can visit with you.

>>681604425
i feel bad for you, you're too defensive

>>681604425
You sound fat and retarded,

Your past selves probably tell you to stop eating so much.

who gives a flying fuck if you get forgotten. you will eventually. think of all the 'great' people you heard of dying on the news who you have forgotten already.

if you want to be remember like a glorious golden statue to the point that you worry about it in day to day life then you seriously gotta get more realistic about things and stop thinking you are so special.

Fine by me

>>681597627
i wouldnt fucking care, im dead

>>681598093
this. Thank you

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>>681597627
Yes, I've wanted to die for a long time. But you aren't going to give it to me are you

>>681598111
I don't think it's ridiculous at all. Why should I care if my name is remembered after I'm gone? I won't be there to see it.

Truthfully, as long as I live a good life and contribute something positive to the world, I can die happy. I don't need any recognition, I just need to know I wasn't a waste of space.

>>681597943
Ozymandias had a poem named after him thousands of years after his death. That's some balls shit.

Maybe I need to Just make a stone statue of myself and write a book about our present age, and I'll be a historical figure.

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there's no point in thinking about things like this that don't even matter. even if you do live a remarkable life and remembered for a thousand years it wont make any kind of difference in the end.

>>681597627
i'm gonna die as i lived unnoticed

>>681598632
Exactly my feelings. I want to have or adopt some kids and raise them well. Barring that I want to make some positive impact. It's irrelevant to me whether my name is known, just that I did some good.

I would love to be forgotten by everyone now and not in 50 years

What a relief. I can't wait for people to forget all the retarded, fucked up shit I've done. Nothing helps me sleep at night like knowing my fuckups are anything but permanent.

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>>681603215

>>681597627
this is my current state of being.

Alone. I hang out with 2 coworkers at most and that's it. Which is fine. But I don't get laid, people I used to talk to less than a year ago probably haven't forgotten about me, but evidently they don't care much to make an effort.
I seemed to be putting in all the effort so I cut ties as sort of a test.

Such is life.

Yeah doesn't matter if I had a decent life.

>>681606406
FUCK. the only moral decision any of us can make is to kill oiurselves

I have answered my own question!

The reason I am terrified by never being great, is because a life characterized by the pursuit of the mean, the merely pleasant, the material condition, is a wasted life indeed.

No man is born who does not have it in his heart, some inkling towards greater things. Not for idle words of praise or the finite praise of his peers, but for the truly great, the comparatively everlasting, that which all souls truly long for, the sublime, the painfully beautiful and unlimited heights which nature ensures can be man's, if only he should dispense with all the momentary gratifications of his "happiness" (the kind that wanes even as it waxes), more still the cheap and impossible pleasure of his body.

I am haunted by the idea of a mediocre life, exactly because all I wish to be is truly great, the act of being great consisting entirely in ever becoming great, the constant labor of moving this soul upwards, thus never engaging that stillness and emptiness which every moment of time wasted is.

Our finitude is even the reason we must seek the infinite, and do so now, else we would delay forever, and never become anything.

I am skeptical of epiphany, but I should hope these thoughts stay with me. There is no time to waste. We must become great, or waste our lives.

As someone who was adopted from a village/town in the middle of the Amazon rainforest, I feel like I owe it to my birth parents to do something noteworthy. Something to let them know that their sacrifice wasn't for nothing. So I feel obligated to avoid the normie "live happily ever after with a 9-5 job, and a family in the suburbs".

>>681603630
who gives a fuck. at the end of the day everything you do is pointless, anyway. so what if humanity is snuffed out living in squalor or with amazing arts and science, life is amazing enough as it is without bloody shakespeare.

>>681597627
This kind of dictates my career choices

>>681607197

>who gives a fuck. at the end of the day everything you do is pointless, anyway.

Only a man whose great and terrible misfortune it is never to have done something worthwhile, or perhaps a man so consumed by the emptiness of his own life (which is his, not life's) could possibly think this.

>>681597627
Less than 5 years and have you been thinking of Steve jobs? Yea didn't think so. You're forgotten as soon as you die. And no I'm not afraid.

>>681607034
All of your petty problems and love affairs only last a second in this universe

>>681597627
This is the reality of almost all of our lives

Yeah. I don't really give a shit what people think of me when I'm dead. Is when I'm alive that counts.

>>681597627
I am happy with living my life as a spectator.
When you see
When I go out I'm unnoticeable.
This you won't even
Im wasting my prime years snorting coke.
I not very intelligent, street smart and common sense have gotten a good job, but not going anywhere with anything.
See this
Nothing to lose, nor gain.

>>681607449

Steve Jobs is an ant, Apple his vast anthill, an anthill nonetheless.

The sorts of people I had in mind are Dante, Jesus, Buddha, Shakespeare, Homer, Plato, Bach, Martin Luther King Jr., and there are thousands of comparatively minor poets, minor spiritualists, minor thinkers, minor musicians, minor leaders who march in league behind them.

>>681607643
This post is unreadable

>>681607446
how do you define worthwhile? worthwhile to whom? You, your boss, your mother?
it's a subjective definition. as such, none of us are authorities to define what is worthwhile. not you, not me.

>>681607446
sorry aristotle, some people need that kind of shit and some don't, and it doesn't mean you are any better or worse as a human. if you think doing something worthwhile is sitting on a chair and wondering whether we are really alive or not then fuck, i've done a thousand worthwhile things today already and its only half 8 in the morning.

>>681607493

If you're saying that all experiences are characterized by the fact of being temporally finite, then I must agree.

But in terms of depth, some are much greater than others. Leave it to God to be infinite in depth, infinite in experience, infinite in achievement. Man should only aspire to be as great as a man can.

>>681607711
Prince then gaybutt? Sublime lead singer? Michael jackson? Your family? Yea you already forgot.

>>681607901

All humans aspire. Do not try to trick yourself into believing you don't have aspirations. You want to make great music, or discover great things. You want to work, and you want your work to be meaningful. How you go about it is your business, and you're right that I'm no better or lesser the man for mine.

>>681607877

I don't define worthwhile. You do. And you learn what the meaning of worthwhile is as you roam about this earth, and see things you call "empty" and others you call "worthwhile."

>>681607920
And some are simply content. If you're bringing up God, His word says often that it is best to be content with your lot. While I'm certainly not making the argument that God doesn't want people to aspire to success, there's nothing wrong with simply wanting to live a good life, die, and let history forget about you. My lack of concern for having a glorious name isn't so much nihilism as it is simply not viewing it as important. It strikes me as very prideful to want your name to be remembered.

I say go, aspire to what you can, and let things lie where they do. Make some impact somehow. If the luck of the draw gets you put in the history books, so be it. If not, don't worry about it. Just live a good life and be happy.

>>681608273
fair point

>>681607993

The music these people made makes pleasant buzzing noises in people's ears, it scarcely stirs the soul. I am using an atypical notion of greatness here, but it involves the sublime. I can't describe it for you, I'm relying on the hope that you have experienced some things in this world that have really moved you, that have seemed to point (if momentarily) to some greater meaning.

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>>681597627
When you die, you've still left an impression on the world around you. The people you've influenced go on to influence others. Anything you've created stands to last much longer than you, and possibly influence others down the line as well. You may be directly forgotten once the people you directly affected are gone, but the ripples you've sent out still have their place. Whether you made a large impact or a small one, your influence never really dies, it merely changes form, like matter or energy.

Obviously I'd prefer to leave a large direct impact. I actually have a hero complex, so my ideal scenario would be helping so many people that I go down in the history books for that. But if nothing works out my way, what am I going to do about it, other than try again? If I die with my wishes expressed here unfulfilled, I'll still pass peacefully, knowing that if I at least helped one person, that action will continue to live on through others.

Humans are just one of the ways the universe knows itself. We're made of matter and energy, just like everything else in existence. It's only our hubris that brings about the belief in anything else, as well as the issues we have with what you're asking.

>>681608418

I agree with you in a sense. My OP seemed hung up on the idea of reputation. In a moment of confusion I accidentally associated the vast reputations of certain figures with their greatness. There is a complex relationship between them. Shakespeare radiates: he beams light, and anyone who reads him seriously will reflect it, will feel it stir something inside of them, and its this reason he's read. And the reason he has that affect is because of his greatness (so vast it awakens greatness in his readers).

So I see what you're saying. Reputation is peanuts, reputation as an end in and of itself is not good. But reputation can be a sign of greatness.

>>681608630
join the military and win some kind of medal and you'll be considered a hero by americans (so long as you fight for/with them)

>>681597627
I plan on dying alone, useless and completely insignificant, because if you think for one second that anyone outside your inner circle will care about you even a year after your death, you're fucking delusional.

or you know kill a bunch of people and then an hero. you'll probably be an icon to the next school shooters

>>681607643
Nah I read it.. I get you

>>681608630

I guess, after having my little moment of epiphany as laid out in >>681607034, I would only say, go be a hero. Go be a great hero anon. Go fucking be a great hero that makes life better for lots of people. Do it now!

And don't do it because you want to be praised, or remembered. Do it because you truly want to be great, because your heart has settled on this form of greatness as your life's purpose.

But goddammit own it like that's what it is. Don't use it as an occasional pat-on-the-back or a vague form of career guidance. Eat it and breath it. And don't apologize to anyone for wanting to be great.

>>681608273
We are not inherently responsible to uphold the cultural standard. Nor are we responsible, as humans born without choice, to abide by anything; be it morals, laws. Cultural expectations bestowed upon you finally collapse when you realize this.

>>681608928
I'm always there, but never seen.
Do I exist.
I don't know,

>>681609224

I completely agree, but I'm not sure I understand why this argument is relevant.

If anything I think our culture is totally insane, built on delusions of material satisfaction, and so powerful at distracting us from our quest for meaning that most of us die having never truly sought meaning, and thus, having lived a meaningless life.

>>681608807
I get that. I have a bit of cognitive dissonance here honestly. On the one hand I strongly believe in tabula rasa, you can do anything you set your mind to, etc. On the other hand, I also think different people are designed for different things - not destined, but inclined toward one end. For me, I'm inclined toward comfortable anonymity. For some, like Shakespeare or Newton, their inclinations were to greatness, and humanity remembered them for it. It sounds like you're inclined to greatness, but don't know what to do, so you're restless about it. I've honestly had the same feeling, it comes and goes for me. I don't have an answer for you, I just go with the flow.

>>681609509

I have not settled on any one thing. I used to think life was meaningless and rather disagreeable. But music, literature, political movements, religions (tricky topic, couldn't hope to indicate what I mean exactly here) and nature have all pointed to there being greater meaning in this world. Many other topics have pointed towards meaning in less significant ways. I think my personal inclination is towards writing.

Yes. I feel insignificant and important at the same time. No one will remember me. But at the same time no one else will experience walking home in the dead of night while everyone is sleeping with the taste of cheap whiskey in their mouth and the smell of stale cigarettes on their breath.

>>681609937

How many times have you stared down the bottom of a bottle, only to realize it's as empty as you, that what you were looking for wasn't in it after all?

>>681609937
I've experienced that. Except without those shitty excuses of drugs. Do that shit tripping shrooms nigga. The earth will move you as you move it.

>>681609899
I know what you mean. I guess for me it's priorities too. I absolutely believe that there's greater meaning in the world, and the idea of being just a suit monkey typing numbers into a computer is terrifying. But IMO the most important parts of life are the people you impact personally. I'd rather make a profound impact on one person's life than be known for some accomplishment by everyone.

>>681610184
I did. Then I asked myself why get surprised by the same result over and over. I'm a loser. I don't care. My life is shit. I want my death to be spontaneous. So I make my meager wage and do whatever the fuck I want in the meantime while I'm waiting for it to end. Sometimes there's people to share it with. Sometimes there aren't. Sometimes it's fun. Sometimes it's not. I don't care. I'm on a rock hurtling millions of miles per hour through a void while countless other rocks and gasses do the same. No one is truly happy. I guess knowing that is what makes me happy(ish)? I guess that's what makes me not afraid.

>>681610507

The thread's sort of unfolded from that, I would reword the OP if I could. As far as not caring about people who come after you, I have to disagree. You can generalize your own experience and recognize that humans in the future will deal with all the same stuff your life is made out of: fears of loneliness, impending death, fleeting desires, hope, disappointment, etc. And I think this can be a basis for loving them, or sympathizing them, certainly at least having some concern.

And as far as guiding behavior, you know, Walt Whitman writes some wonderful poetry where, as one person put it "he all but reaches out and touches you." His writing illustrates the sincerity of regard and love people can have, even for imaginary proto-people. It makes for a strange experience when you read him. You know he didn't really know you, couldn't count on you existing or you reading him, but here he is, talking to you as if he were a close friend, telling you all about yourself.

>>681610753

The life you've resigned yourself to need not be your life. If you're hell bent on carrying on that way till the grave, then maybe you will, but don't kid yourself into thinking it's not a choice you've made, or that it's the only life you can have.

(also the reason you can accept it as a choice is because you have an irrational hatred of yourself, a hatred which you don't apply to other people. You're probably pretty decent and kind to other people, and you'd forgive them half the things you begrudge yourself without a second thought. There's just an error in your brain, formed by habit, that refuses to extend this forgiving/acceptance towards yourself, and the path towards a different life consists in unwinding that ball, which is not easy but is possible, and I'm saying this stuff as someone who has wasted many a night drinking and self loathing.)