>>675223168
America was usurped by federalist cucks. the rebel flag isn't a flag of treason, it's the flag of the true America.

I live in a small town in Florida. There's a house around the block that Flys a confederate flag and several pick up trucks around that fly it also. They are all strange looking white trashy people. They have no power in society. Why do you even care?

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>>675223168
Ga anon here, agree

>>675223815
>Why do you even care?
I'm a patriot what can I say?

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>>675223168
If you stand against the Confederate Flag, then also push to ban most other foreign Flags. The Logic is flawed.

We all came from somewhere and it's not considered racist or wrong to display your colors for any other nationality. Half this country used to be another country and those of us descended from it refuse to be ashamed of the sins of the long dead and on many issues, take argument that their actions were sins at all or that the north were saviors. The leaders of the CSA saw this government for what it really was and considered it corrupt and abused. Is the fundamental left not also anti-establishment for similar reasons? At least the CSA was more effective than Occupy. The arguments aside, the logic concerning the flag is still a hypocrisy of the left.

We are not racist just because of our heritage or for existing and we are what we are. The hatred being levied against southern whites, the wide sweeping generalizations, the claims that one or two violent men represent us all, these are the exact things that the Left claims to be synonymous with the systematic discrimination and oppression that they oppose, yet they turn around and levy such accusations upon southern whites without their usual sense of irony. This is a blatant double standard.

What it looks like to us is that white culture is not allowed to exist, white history isn't allowed to produce heroes, and every claim forbidden to be made of other groups may be made against us and the Left commits this vile and degrading discrimination towards us virtually every time they talk about us in any of their media.

If a poor southern white does something bad, they make fun of the rednecks as a whole. If a poor black does something wrong, you better not generalize or you're basically Hitler.

My guess is that OP is a nigger or a nigger lover who takes BBC up his ass every weekend.

>>675224115
The CSA is the biggest enemy America ever faced. All confederate soldiers should have been executed en masse for treason.

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>>675223168
nice bait nigger

>>675224077
I think muslims and niggers are a much bigger problem. Most of Asia is fucked up. But you care about a dead flag that represents a government that was completely defeated in 1865.

>>675223721
> cuck
Nobody who uses the word "cuck" unironically has ever said anything worthwhile

>>675224704
nigger lover detected

>>675224883
Cuck user detected

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This is the flag of treason.

>>675224115
>then also push to ban most other foreign Flags
I made it very clear I have zero desire to ban the Confederate flag.
>We are not racist just because of our heritage or for existing and we are what we are.
This is the reason I said racist implications aside. I don't care if you fly this because you don't like black people. I personally like black people but if you flew a flag that said. "I hate niggers" it would offend me less than the confederate flag.
>the wide sweeping generalizations
I used to be guilty of this until I kept getting trapped by my own hypocrisy I have no issue with southern whites as long as they fly the true American flag.
> white history isn't allowed to produce heroes
What are you talking about? Most of the confederate soldiers where just defending their homes. I acknowledge that. It's the people who organized it where the traitors.

Believe me friend I will never apologize for being white. Never. I will never apologize for the crimes other white people committed because they were not me and I'd kick the shit out of any black/hispanic/asian who tried to tell me otherwise.

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>>675223168
Fuck niggers lets lynch em

https://soundcloud.com/couchtruthing/smoke-weed-kill-niggers

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>>675223168

whole lot of heritage there in all those long four years of a "country"

i'm glad that people still fly those flags. great way to figure out who the assholes are without having to talk to them


>>675224618
>completely defeated in 1865

debatable. we didn't put the fear of god into those inbred fucks. should have genocided a lot more whites in the aftermath to drive home the fucking point. now we have to deal with the unrelenting cancerous faggotry that is the current american south.

>>675224507

What is Nazi Germany, or Japan, or the Soviet Union? All were more serious threats than the CSA.

If you think the war should have ended with more death then you've probably been brainwashed from years of liberal bullshit. Congratulations on proving you are a faggot.

True ending, everyone was tired after the war and no one won. They were family and already killed their own nationalities and their own race and their own families. Even northerners were pretty disgusted with the violence it took to get that far. They came to terms and surrendered. If the north went to shooting all the confederates then it would have killed most white men and resulted in a situation where most of the South's men were black.

No surprise a left shill suggests an alternative plan that would have wiped out whites even sooner. Fuck you.

>>675225657
The south is not a problem. They literally work shit jobs and go hunting. That's it. Why is everyone so concerned about the south? Get a life.

>>675225652
Don't cut yourself with that edge.

>>675226030
>they vote in shitty politicians
>they suck down federal money while contributing fuckall to the nation
>they tilt national elections towards faggots like cruz, trump, and rubio
>they promote a shittier version of an already shitty religion

>>675225657
>should have genocided a lot more whites in the aftermath to drive home the fucking point
Op here. I was with you up until this point. The Union was right not to drop to their level. Sure it made for a bit of turmoil later on but in the end the people who fly the true US flag can stand tall knowing that we were and always will be better than them.

>>675226325
All of this.

>>675226325
The south is one section of the US. It's not particularly populated as compared to the rest of the country. The entire country decides who gets voted in not just the south. I don't blame the white south for hating niggers. Everyone hates niggers. Case closed.

>>675224618
>>675224115
>>675224077
>>675223815
>>675223721
>>675223168
Alright folks, here's an answer for everyone:

Who fucking cares? The only value a flag holds is much like that which a religion holds: Everything to its followers, but just another target for its opposition. And really, if anything, the fact that we care about who's flag is where is a sign that we've made no progress as a global society since the caveman days, painting our respective thug mammoth designs on each others rocks.
In short, acknowledging it at all is what gives it power, and why people keep using it. So, if you didn't give a fuck, and stopped attaching it to actions that happened 150+ years before your death and were initiated between two parties who had drastically different views about what was important for their country and their personal well-being than either you or the person you want to bitch at for flying an essentially useless item on their personal items in their own time, then MAYBE, we could stop seeing these goddamn threads and get back to the important things, like fapping.

>>675223168
>I feel that the confederate flag is just a plain flag of treason.

So is the American flag, faggot. Treason against God and Country.

>>675226728
I meant before birth. Whatever, /b/ is shit today anyway.

>>675226547
Nigger

>>675226728
I disagree with you because I've been sick of confederate assholes rallying behind that guy who suckerpunched the protester. Now honestly I also think the protesters were in the wrong but saying they were "unamerican" pissed me off.
>get back to the important things, like fapping.
I agree with this part. The sooner this batshit crazy election is over the better.

>>675227002
kek I'm probably the whitest person in this thread

>>675227368
And a fag

>>675227760
Damn straight.

>>675227145
Did I not just say the only reason there is a cause is because you hate it, thus validating it? The entire point of being American is to do what you want, and fuck what the other guy says. That's the problem with our modern government and its party system, is that we gave the government another guy to shove shit off on, when really everyone in the government should be round up and shot. But like I said, hating only validates. Find something more useful for you energy.

>>675227843
.....

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>>675223168

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>>675223168
The US is founded on treason you cockwad. There is nothing wrong with a rebel flag unless you are a part of the establishing order, dont you agree?

>>675223168
You're correct sir!

>>675226653
>Everyone hates niggers.
I like em.
Went to school with a bunch of them. White kids were the only ones whoever messed with me.

In fact I get uncomfortable around white people because of that ironically. Family and friends are cool but I make an active effort to avoid speaking to white people I don't know.

>>675226325
they tilt elections, and yet the majority of america's population resides on the east and west coasts, the two most liberal areas in the country. face it, everyone loves Trump and he's gonna be your next President.

>>675223168
This

>>675229505
>everyone loves Trump and he's gonna be your next President.
I'm still convinced it's all a bad dream.
There's no way a manchild like him could gain this much support. It's too surreal.

>>675223168
>raised in opposition to the sovereign rule of the people.
I'm pretty sure this is bait. The people flying it were trying to BECOME sovereign.
>I'm not saying you can't fly a Confederate flag. The first amendment is sacred to me.
Then why did you make this thread? I am with you on supporting free speech, even that which I find repugnant, but I don't go around starting threads knocking it, either.

>>675225191
>if you flew a flag that said. "I hate niggers" it would offend me less than the confederate flag.
Then there's something wrong with you. That's just my opinion.

>>675230814
>but I don't go around starting threads knocking it, either.
Well why should I honor other people's free speech and not exercise my own? I have opinions. Strong ones and I have my constitutional right to voice them.

I grew up in the south and as a boy only knew it as a 'Rebel' flag. (From the Dukes of Hazard) It held Zero racist or treasonous connotations for me until history classes much later. I still think of it as being about 'sticking it to THE MAN' and nothing else. No hate in my heart.

>>675231176
They're still wrong. Maybe you should actually learn about the United States history.

>>675223168
At least post the confederate flag if you are going to be this whiney.

>>675226325
>>they vote in shitty politicians
As opposed to the awesome politicians from everywhere else? Don't make me laugh.
>>they suck down federal money while contributing fuckall to the nation
The south contributes economically, culturally, and socially to the greater country. I'm sorry if our contributions aren't to your liking, but we feel the same way about yours, sometimes.
>>they tilt national elections towards faggots like cruz, trump, and rubio
"Tilt" seems to imply that we have some unfair advantage...if you have a problem with the electoral system, I join you in your dissatisfaction, but there are many liberals in the south. Also, we have just as much right to representation in federal government as you do.
>>they promote a shittier version of an already shitty religion
You are stereotyping and generalizing. There are myriad religions and denominations in the south. I personally don't partake, but I will fight for the right to freedom of religion, even if your religion is abhorrent. It's when you actually start committing violence that I draw the line. Protip: speech/thought is not violence, and never will be.

>>675231553
No your opinion is wrong

>>675231936
Are you ignoring the fact that the south takes more money than it produces or just stupid?

>>675223168
How about this instead?
http://frtyb.com/go/gQ0i_bAaEj/Omekle

>>675231176
Absolutely. We all have the right to say what we think, thankfully. I guess I just don't understand your point. You want to let us know that you support the right to fly a flag, but that you don't agree with it? We already knew that. Do you want congratulations for supporting the Constitution? Or recognition for disliking something, yet condoning it? Do you want us to call you a hero for being so enlightened? You're the one that made the thread, I'm just asking. I don't go making threads saying that I hate Zapatistas but support your right to be one.

>>675223168
Do you even know what the confederate flag looks like?

get christopher hitchens' lambasting hillary to the frontpage of /r/hillaryclinton (MODS ARE SLEEPING)

https://www.reddit.com/r/hillaryclinton/comments/4bg667/silenced_reporter_praising_hillarys_vast/

>>675225765
>True ending, everyone was tired after the war and no one won.

Incorrect. Grant secured Lee's unconditional surrender at Appomattox Court House. You are a very misinformed person.

>>675223815

I can rep this

Florida is full of black hate groups

some of the bullshit in this thread is evidence that General Sherman didn't go far enough.
I speak as an Illinoisan currently stuck in Keksas, fuck the Confederacy

>>675232834
I just wanted to start a conversation.
It's always more fun on 4chan because unlike Reddit and Facebook people here aren't afraid to speak their mind and I always find it to be good to hear the oppositions argument because it prepares me for the future when I may confront someone irl who wishes to have an intellectual debate and be a little bit prepared.

That's how mah mommy and pappy raised meh.

>>675232251
If what you say is true, that is a federal government decision, and as most southern states lean conservative, you can hardly blame us. Many of us hate the welfare state, despite the widespread poverty in many communities. I don't really see your point. You first accuse us of tilting elections to the right, and then of taking advantage of leftist policies. Which is it?

>>675233357
Ok, I can respect that. And your commitment to free speech. Also, no one I've ever met in the south calls their dad 'pappy'. That would be more commonly used for a grandpa. :)

>>675233956
I had a feeling. Wasn't thinking too hard about it. Though it is true I was raised to always hear out your opponent. That's why I tune into Republican rallies. It's always good to know where your opponent stands.

You could call me a "blue diaper baby" the raised me on politics and debating. I mean I'm not totally brainwashed by my parents. I have arguments with them when they want me to support the feminazis. Or how I defend the ACLU's decision to defend the Klan even though I loathe the Klan as much as they do.

Either way it's nice to meet a level headed anon.

ITT: Faggots.

The flag is for hicks and trash. When your country is poisoned with shit tier ideology and you go to war with them and fuck them up guess what? That flag that represents the other side's ideology should be removed. Think Germany. Guess what? That nazi flag.. crime to fly it. We should treat those hillbillies like that since they still use it to divide the nation largely. You lost, take it down and shut the fuck up.

Next:

It was a point of division in the country. You flying it spits in the face of the idea of unity as a nation. It really does. You may be from the south but you're American first and foremost. Fly the main flag rather than invest so much stock into a defeated one that has a fucking trail of hate behind it within our country.

Another country's flag is more acceptable since it isn't as heated a point in America regarding our war and history. National heritage is one thing. Flying a flag of a once great enemy of the nation in defiance (and usually with racist hicks too. No always but there is a very real history of that with its flyers today and in the past) is bullshit.

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>>675223168

Thank you for sharing ^-^

>>675223168
Its a flag, who cares.

>>675226910
anon has a point here. the patriots were terrorists in the eyes of the british. they wouldve been hanged on display if they were captured

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>>675225765
the civil war was pretty serious

>>675234722
>Either way it's nice to meet a level headed anon
Same here. And I think it's super cool that you defend that kind of stuff to your folks. It's crazy seeing the diverse cases the ACLU has to stand up for these days...causes that are often at each other's throats, yet the same organization defending their right to be bigots or radicals, on BOTH sides. I'm glad they exist, and I'm glad people like you are around too. I don't mean to get mushy, but sometimes I start to get sad because I don't meet enough people that support others' rights to even think their own thoughts, let alone speak their own minds. It always lifts my spirits when I do. Thanks.

>>675223168
>I feel that the confederate flag is just a plain flag of treason.
Forming a Confederation is not treason and leaving a Federation is also not treason.

>raised in opposition to the sovereign rule of the people.
Sovereignty belongs to the states. The Union is simply a framework of cooperation.

>Against the very essence of our nation.
We are not and never have been a Nation State.

>flying the flag is as unamerican as you can be.
Nationalism is retarded so who cares.

>>675234830
>That nazi flag.. crime to fly it
Maybe in Germany, or other European countries, where they don't believe in true freedom of speech. I'm glad I live in America, the place where you can fly any flag you choose, no matter what. And burn any flag you choose, as well.

>>675224704
Ha this is too true

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>>675223168
It only upsets you because it upsets the pc/sjw crowd. Seriously, get over it you fag.

>>675236242

in my opinion almost all speech is acceptable but I'm going to treat this like I would a foreign country in war and shut it the fuck down. Prevent problems 150+ years later. You know.. like we have today.

>>675236242
>but you're not allowed to say that you're gonna bomb/shoot up somewhere

>>675236761
Thats a threat though.

>>675236537
OP has stated that he/she believes in the right to fly the flag, just disagrees with the motives of some who do. It's not necessarily a pc/sjw thing, and I do think it's cool to be able to have a discussion about it, rather than the usual bullshit about "it ought to be outlawed hurr durr" vs. "the south will rise again white power".

>>675236608

You could say "I support the confederacy" in short. good for you. However, if you fly a flag it's a symbol, it's a faster marker to see your side and hold territory socially.

Why I'm fine with discussion. Symbols and logos can make the social implications more clear.

>>675236608
>I'm going to treat this like I would a foreign country in war and shut it the fuck down
What do you mean by that, make it illegal? Good luck. I'll fight for my free speech, whether it's the right to fly a Japanese flag, a Nazi one, or a Confederate battle flag. I have no urge to fly any of them, but I'll die before I let the government tell me I can't.

>>675237745
OP here and you took the words right out of my mouth.

>>675234830
>hicks and trash.
Get over yourself. You are not better than anyone else on this rock.

>That flag that represents the other side's ideology should be removed.
People have the right to think whatever they want.

>Think Germany. Guess what? That nazi flag.. crime to fly it.
And that would be a scandal but they needed a time out to discover an ounce of individuality. It should not be a punishment.

>You flying it spits in the face of the idea of unity as a nation.
We are not a Nation but a union of states encompassing many nations.

>Flying a flag of a once great enemy of the nation
It was not an enemy flag for the south and we are members of the United States.

>>675237745

That's great because a bullet cost almost nothing.

>>675237900
>It was not an enemy flag for the south and we are members of the United States
I was just going to let this one slide up until this part.

If you consider yourself a citizen of the United States then you should fly the official United States flag. Not one of a nation that divided the union. I'm not saying you CAN'T fly one. But you shouldn't fly one and say it's patriotic or anything to that effect.

>>675236761
Yes, that is one exception to the 1st amendment. It has little to do with flags, though, unless your flag explicitly says "I'm going to bomb/shoot you." Even a swastika could not be considered as a clear threat, unless it was used in an overtly intimidatory fashion. And even symbols that are usually beneficent can be used that way...for instance, a flaming cross in a black family's yard. It's all about intent, not about the symbol/flag/etc.

>>675237900

It's flown primarily by low SES southerners with lower IQs and less education.

Deal with it. They are hicks and they are trash as a collective. In FL I see them flown by gator hat, camo wearing guys in trucks. It's the most American Stereotype you can get and protip: At the bars they call Obama a nigger and use slurs. Sit in on a discussion. It's great. Not all of them but most are dicks.

I know a faggot who flies it and he has black friends but he straight up said "I would never date a girl who fucked a black guy." As if they taint them or they are ruined forever. Not any partner.. a black guy.

Not all people who fly it are like this but so fucking many are I'd dare say the majority hold onto these thoughts. Others say "Christian nation" and fly it. It's a shitty subset of society.

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>>675223168
OP was not a fag today.

The Confederacy was treacherous filth. The Southern Aristocracy would've sold the Americas to European kings and tyrants.

God Damned the Confederacy to hell.

>>675236761
That's a threat not an opinion. The 1st amendment only defends opinions and the right to voice them.

>>675237900

Also we are a nation. We may have smaller substituents but as a whole we are still one functioning nation under national laws. State laws go too but we do have some broad brush national deals.

We aren't just small parts. We are both. However, the small parts do on some level need to act as a bigger picture.

>>675238041
If I take your meaning correctly, that bullet would cost a lot. It would cost this country a person who believes in the precepts upon which it was founded. It would cost the innocent belief in their country's values of anyone who heard about it. It would have a cost on the sincerity and conscience of the American people. Martyrs are sometimes required to wake people up, to show them that their government is betraying the very principles that make a country unique and great. We haven't come to that point yet, thankfully.

>>675238327
The idea of a country is dead to me. I've watched my community die under a massive wave of foreigners and I don't recognize this "nation" anymore. If this is what the Union killed so many people to preserve then fuck the Union. If people still live in a place where those flags mean something then let them fly.

>>675238327
If you really loved America, and the freedom that is its trademark, you wouldn't tell people what flag they should or shouldn't fly.

>>675238473
>It's a shitty subset of society.
Of which there are many. As you said, deal with it.

>>675238655
What a democracy that would make for. Just elect an emperor and lets end of pretense of self governance or local determination. While we are at it lets drop the "United, STATES" and just call it Merica for short.

Can you imagine what a nation would mean if the Confederacy succeeded? Constant war in North America for decades. A Hapsburg emperor ruling in Mexico, the British owning the west coast. Slavery would never really come to an end. American democracy would be dead all for the sake Southern pride.

The Confederacy was degenerate and deserved to fail.

>>675239019
>Give me your tired, your poor,
>Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
>The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
>Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
>I lift my lamp beside the golden door!

We should be taking more immigrants not less. They are the people who acknowledge the superiority of American life and wish to stand with us as brothers and sisters.

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West Virginian yankee reporting in.

How do you like my battle flag?

>>675238473
And yet you are still no better than they. Deal with that.

>>675238476
>The Southern Aristocracy
If you think that's what your average Confederate flag-flier is supporting, you're out of your mind. We're mostly talking about people whose ancestors were the dirt-poor soldiers who made up the southern army, who never would have been able to own slaves and didn't think/know that was one of the primary reasons for the war. I don't think there's anything wrong with people having pride in their home and history. And yes, some of them are racist to the bone. It doesn't make any difference.

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>>675226728

>>675239652
>We should be taking more immigrants not less.
We should be taking in more LEGAL immigrants.

>>675239652
>stand with us as brothers and sisters.
Yeah right. You mean colonize us until nothing remains of our own identity. Let it happen who gives a fuck.

>>675229505
Love? C'mon I'm a black guy who almost definitely vote for Trump, but it's definitely not because I love him as a candidate. It's because Ron Paul is too old, Rand Paul's campaign was completely ignored, and Ted Cruz supported Kim Davis

>>675239900
>We should be taking in more LEGAL immigrants.
We should be grating mass amnesty. Have you SEEN the citizenship test? I doubt any person in this thread could pass it without studying.

>>675238994

50 cents. Big deal.

>>675239392

See: 50 cents. Big deal.

>>675239500

No need for an emperor. Just removing a few lingering radical groups from a war that was fought. Clean up. You know how it is.

>>675239760

In the grand scheme of mortality sure. In the "what can you do while you're alive, IQ/ education level" sense. I can say I'm beating almost all of them.

>>675239840
yeah, these poor southern bastards have been cucked by their landlords for generations.

Undying loyalty to their masters.

>>675240077
change the test, make it fair, but don't encourage illegal border crossing by promising amnesty to those who've already broken the law.

>>675226728
>we've made no progress as a global society since the caveman days
I hate social theory so much. We live this way because of our interdependence on one another for almost every facet of our lives. If some bullshit social garbage was enough then some Jesus cult would have berried our demons sometime in the last ten thousand years. The sole processor of civilization has been technology. All social progress trails it.

>>675239524
So are there any circumstances in which you would support the right of a region to secede? What about Crimea? They don't want to be part of Ukraine. What about the Kurds in Iraq or Turkey or Syria? What about Ireland or Scotland? The fact is that regardless of anything, very few parent countries are willing to let go of part of their land and population, even if they have radically different cultures or visions for the future. I'll give props to the UK for even entertaining the possibility. Do you think for a moment that the US feds would give the south the opportunity?

>>675235359
>The patriots were terrorists in the eyes of the British

Good fucking thing we aren't British then, huh?

>>675240260
>change the test, make it fair, but don't encourage illegal border crossing by promising amnesty to those who've already broken the law.

Broken laws that make very little sense and are way to broad.
Most illegals are just looking for work and don't do anything to mess with the man. They just want to keep their heads down and live a life free from the cartels.

If I was in their place I would take my chances with hopping over the fence too. Aside from a few nice cities like Merida life in Mexico is hell.

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>>675223168
Nah. Treason would be trying to overthrow the government in Washington, or what Booth did. The South less committed a crime against the state than simply left the state to try to make their own.

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>>675223168
>>675223168

Rebel implications aside.
I feel that the American flag is just a plain flag of treason.
You faggots can throw around your "heritage" bullshit all you want but at the end of the day it was the flag that was raised in opposition to the sovereign rule of the Crown. Against the very essence of our Empire.

I'm not saying you can't fly an American flag.

But my true opinion would remain unchanged.

I'm saying flying the flag is as un-British as you can be. A fucking French would be more British than this flag and anyone who flies it is a faggot.

Cool story right? I think so.

>>675223168
Hillary drone detected. Fuck yourself, kyke

>>675224883
Son of a cuck detected

>>675240682
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LPjzfGChGlE

Nice drivel. Really pulls the heart strings but lets think of the practical matters. Or we can simply pretend that petro industrial farming will continue indefinitely and we won't starve to death.

>>675240905
OP here. I think Hillary is a bitch and a sellout.
She's better than Trump or Cruz but not by much.

>>675240682
Granting amnesty will encourage people to break the law regardless of whether the law is fair. YOu have to keep the integrity of the law.

Open borders is insane.

The south had a right to secede, fascist.

>>675240557
treason against the British empire was patriotic because it was ruled by tyrants

Treason against the Union was heinous, selfish, and outright profanity under the eyes of God. So many poor Southerners died for rich men to keep their "niggers." It's disgusting. I have nothing but pity for my ancestors who fought for such a shiteating cause.

>>675242097
>The south had a right to secede, fascist.
They have that right, but under God, they can't justify what they did. The Confederacy abused that right and in doing so made themselves traitors.

So what the fuck do they mean when they say "heritage"?

>>675242524
they mean that its okay they're poor because they're not black

>>675242416
Don't believe in God. Don't think slavery is right either. But the american government made slaves of us all when it took away our right to leave the republic.

>>675241237
I knew this video existed but I never sat down and watched it. Very intelligent and hard to dispute. It even has a ring of truth to it I'm not going to deny it.

But the unemployed number of Americans is dwindling because of the Obama administration and the jobs immigrants take are jobs that no native born American citizen would even consider doing. Even if the pay was good which it isn't. It's god awful.

Also in case you haven't seen a garbage dump lately we are not strained on resources. We could support more people.

Also as for that "agents of change" thing. That is like trying to get a rose to bloom in concrete. Often it's not even the fault of the government but rather they are so massively indebted to larger nations that they can't afford to make anything better for their citizens. If we truly want to help them we'd have to ease their debt to an affordable rate which conservatives would sooner commit to eating dogshit for the rest of their lives than even consider doing.

>>675242158

I'm not even from the South and I know that your reasoning is BS.

The civil war had absolutely nothing to do with slavery. The Emancipation Proclamation was a political move used in the mid-point of the war. Research it.

>>675242624
Hey you must have dropped your fedora somewhere.

>>675223168
>Fuck I'm studying to join the ACLU

Literally costs 10 dollars to become a card carrying member.

Jesus kids are fucking dumb.

>>675242624
It's better to be a slave under the stars and stripes than back under British rule. Or in such a weakened state that you can't fight off the Nazis so that the communists end up winning ww2.

Fuck the confederate degeneracy. America would amount to nothing divided.

So, when America has lived out its potential. Let's tear this nation apart. We can revert back to regionalism or whatever you want. But so long as this nation is still alive and kicking, you owe this country your allegiance.

>>675242938
Yeah but I can't defend people in a court of law without taking the bar exam.

>>675242854
>absolutely nothing to do with slavery
This is what retards actually believe.

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>>675243054

>>675223168
>flying the flag is as unamerican as you can be
>I'd defend anyone who flies this flag if an authority told them to take it down with every fiber of my being

What the literal fuck? Since when is supporting the 10th amendment by way of the 1st amendment unamerican. Its not. Next to gun ownership freedom of speech is one of the most american things you can possibly do.

The ACLU has long lived past its usefulness. If faggots like you are going to be at the helm, good ahead and close up shop.

Study your fucking history. The South had every right to rebel. This authority to do so is found in the Deceleration of Independence, 2nd, and 10th amendments.

>stop sucking off your community college professor and learn to think for yourself

>>675242158
I didn't even bring up the American Revolution...what are you even talking about? You didn't answer my question or address a single thing I said in my post. Just hit the general reply next time.

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>>675223168
Here's the real flag faggot. I thought you liberal cucks were supposed to be well-informed and smarter than Southerners.
>Fuck off

>>675243054
>We can revert back to regionalism or whatever you want.
Sounds good.
>But so long as this nation is still alive and kicking, you owe this country your allegiance.
Says you.

>>675243151

The irony in this post is poetic

>>675223881
Leave. The South doesn't want or need you. Move to some other fag-loving town like San Francisco or New York.

>>675243560
The South never had a good reason to succeed and because they abused that right we all suffered for it.

>>675223168
State's rights faggot!

>>675224507
>Be Southerner
>Poor as fuck
>90% chance you didn't own slaves
>be invaded by the North
>get called traitors

Ignorance- Lacking knowledge
Stupid- foolish or dumb
>way to go faggot your post is ignorant and stupid

>>675225657
>now we have to deal with the unrelenting cancerous faggotry that is the current american south.
The autism. oh my god the autism. You are the reason Obama is in office.

>>675244196
who's dumb? Surely it's the ones who got tricked into fighting a war for their "rights" when really it was about slavery.

>>675244032
>The South never had a good reason to succeed
You mean secede. "A good reason" is in the eye of the beholder, first off. Secondly, it's not needed. If a group of people decide that they want to be independent of any outside governance, I'm all for it. Of course, they will have to deal with all sorts of difficulties, as far as trade/negotiating travel/treaties/defense/etc, but that should be their choice.
>and because they abused that right we all suffered for it.
The right to secession? So you agree that there is one? Or should be?

>>675244415
>You are the reason Obama is in office.
I'm not him but I'm glad I'm a part of his presidency. Better him than some conservitard who will only run us even further into the ground.

>>675242819
>We could support more people.
http://www.dieoff.com/page55.htm

The math says something a bit more grim. Good by billion of people.

>It even has a ring of truth to it
As opposed to simply being true.

>>675226325
>>they vote in shitty politicians
George Washington
Thomas Jefferson
Andrew Jackson
James K. Polk
Should I go on?
>>they suck down federal money while contributing fuckall to the nation
Total bullshit. Detroit, Newark, New York, San Deigo, Oakland, Clevland, should I go on?
>>they tilt national elections towards faggots like cruz, trump, and rubio
A) Cruz and Trump are the only viable candidates B) Kasich is a RINO and will not win a general election
>>they promote a shittier version of an already shitty religion
Ever studied religion in the South? Apparently not. You're just regurgitating the seaman you sucked out of your community college professor.

>>675244644
>Better him than some conservitard
Obama is a straight neo-con...GW Bush 2.0...

>>675244596
The south wasn't seeking independence from an outside government because it was the right thing for American democracy. It was selfish and amounted to nothing but treason.

>>675245010
>B) Kasich is a RINO and will not win a general election
'Republican' has changed in definition...If anything, I would say that Kasich is the true Repub versus Trump/Cruz. Now, if you want to coin the term "CINO", I could see your point a bit more, not that ANY of them are actual conservatives.

>>675245229
We are not a democracy.

>>675244497
Why would 90% who did not nor have the means to own slaves, fight so that the wealthy 10% of slave owners could keep theirs.

Do you honestly think you can "trick" 90% of a populace into a war?

This is a battle of wits you will lose anon. I've got a BA in History specializing in the Civil War.
>In b4 worthless degree
>I'm in law school now

Just because your community college professor told you the war was about slavery, that doesn't make it true.

>learn to think for yourself

>>675245229
What's wrong with being selfish? Rational self-interest is healthy. I never claimed that the south's desire for independence was a selfless act, but you bring up American democracy. If a region (DEMOCRATICALLY) decides that they would rather have their independence than be subject to a remote government (which GASP, may not know that much about them or care about the things they do), who are you to say that it is "selfish" for them to want to be left alone to run their own lives?

>>675244644
>run us even further into the ground.
President Obama has racked up more debt than a preceding presidents combined.
>Nice try /b/ro

>>675245426
The Confederacy wasn't some Libertarian paradise. It would've turned out far more fascist than we are today.

The Civil War isn't the right front to defend states' rights.

>>675245361
>true Repub versus Trump/Cruz
Kek. He was the only Republican governor to expand medicaid, supports amnesty, and cannot stop sucking dicks.

>Dole, McCain, and Romney.
All RINO moderates and all failures. Moderate RINOs can't win the white house.

>>675245797
With you BA in history, you can compare with the First World War. Why did anyone fight for that war? Because they had a profound understanding of the issues at hand? No. Because its WAR MOTHERFUCKER. WAAAAR!

>>675245885
>If a region (DEMOCRATICALLY) decides
and how would the South democratically decide to secede when slaves weren't represented?

>>675223168
That's not the confederate flag. It's the flag of the Virginia militia.

It only became popular in movies because it is much more colorful and better designed then the actual confederate flags.

Southern Democrats raised it in the 1950s and 60s as a way of causing blacks and liberals butt hurt because people knew it from Hollywood movies as "the flag always facing the Union" and presumed it was the flag of the confederacy.

KKK picked it up after Democrats started flying it, seeing how much butt hurt liberals and blacks became seeing it.

People that fly it now do so to cause liberals to get all butt hurt. They may or may not care about making blacks butt hurt as well.

Notice the theme? That flag = butt hurt liberals.

That is not the flag of treason. It's the flag of trolling.

>>675246273
Sweet word salad bait, but ill bite. The average anyone could see that Germany was violating the Peace of Westphalia. The may have never heard about the treaty but innate to any basic understanding of what a State is, is its right to exist. No trickery there.
>nice try bro
>keep watching History 2

>>675224507
Federal government disagreed. Every confederate soldier was named an official AMERICAN soldier. That's why confederate memorials and confederate cemeteries are also AMERICAN military memorials and AMERICAN military cemeteries.

The treason was committed by the politicians. And few of them got punished for it, because most of the politicians of the time were family.

>>675246693
>It's the flag of the Virginia militia.
Sooooo close anon. That was the confederate naval jack.
>democrats, the klan, and racism.
Not much has changed today, but good luck getting them to admit it. Kek.

>>675226325
A butt hurt liberal who realizes his side is losing the White House in 2016, has already lost the House of Reps and Senate, and that American culture is putting down his side.

>>675247007
True AF. Jeff Davis was a fucking cuck. He doomed the South.

>>675227145
You mean the old black guy who beat the hell out of that Sanders supporting Klansman? Yeah, I bet that causes you distress.

>>675246924
im not trolling. The common Southerner was led into a war by their aristocratic leaders. Choosing a side was simply a matter of loyalty to your home. Isn't that Robert E. Lee's story? He didn't care about the cause of secession, only his loyalty to Virginia.

That's how you sucker 90% of people to fight for a cause as deplorable as slavery.

>>675223168
Shut the fuck up, commie.
Think I wouldn't notice your little subliminal input there?
Fucking reds man.

>>675234722
Klan is a Democratic organization. Always has been, always will be. That's why the ACLU has no trouble defending them--- the Klan can always be counted on for donations to the Democratic party and its politicians, always ready to support affirmative action, welfare, food stamps, black women's rights to abortion no matter what, Planned Parenthood, and many other Democratic positions. You should ponder why.

>>675246634
3/5th of them were. kek.
You've got to stop analyzing this war from a 21st century lens. Since the begging of time people could also be property. It was a huge advancement that land owners got the right to vote. It was even more wild that non-land owners could vote. These were radical change in less than 200 years. To us it seems natural, but it wasn't so then.

I digress, property and freedman couldn't vote then. Whether they were represented or not didn't matter regardless of which side of the mason-dixon line you lived on.

Those that could vote democratically chose to leave the union. They voluntailry joined it so why couldn't they voluntairly leave it?
>makes sense

>>675223168
This isn't even the real confederate flag. It's a wider version of The North Virginia confederate Battle flag that emerged in the 30s or 40s

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>>675223168
Lol, fuck off

>>675247932
Close but no cigar. You live in state X. People are coming to invade it. Except your "new" rulers and the raping and pillaging involved with it or defend it.

There's no trickery to defend your own home. No rational person is going to lay down and accept the invasion.

>>675248135
>You've got to stop analyzing this war from a 21st century lens.

You're right. We should have cut off Jefferson Davis' head and displayed it in Richmond, why brutally occupying the South for the next thirty years. Give the treacherous filth what they deserve for betraying their country.

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>>675248443
>No rational person is going to lay down and accept the invasion.

Wrong.

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>>675248193
>It's a wider version of The North Virginia confederate Battle flag
What? Its the Confederate Naval Jack.
This is the flag your thinking of. THE BATTLE FLAG OF NORTHERN VIRGINIA not The North Virginia confederate Battle flag

>>675242158
Wrongo.

Most of the people in the colonies wanted to stay British. That's historical fact--- 2/3rds wanted to stay. But a few crazy rich men wanted to make up their own rules instead of following the British rules, and they paid a shitton of money to raise armies and rebel against Britain.

The only reason they were successful was Britain was unwilling to commit most of its forces to keeping the American colonies. They had bigger concerns closer to home.

So what happened for the common british citizen in the Americas after the war? Their taxes went up by a few thousand percent, the local asshats started telling them they had to change how they lived, and they had to mind their manners around a new set of rich betters (where prior they rarely had to because the British rich betters mostly stayed out of the Americas).

Face it. The average person was better off as part of the British empire. The British responded to the break away colonies with punishing tariffs and outright violent hostility for decades afterward. Life for the new Americans got much much worse. But hey, at least all the rich American leadership got to suck George Washington's dick.

>>675248634
>You're right. We should have cut off Jefferson Davis' head and displayed it in Richmond, why brutally occupying the South for the next thirty years. Give the treacherous filth what they deserve for betraying their country.

Lincoln did not advocate for this nor did Johnson. What in the literal fuck are you talking about. Even analyzing reconstruction from a 19th century lens would not produce the result you described. They were trying to reunify a country, not start another rebellion.
>inb4 we would have lost
Do you think the Yankees wanted to keep fighting? A bunch of newly freed black were moving up north to compete with them in the job market. Hell, they knew that before the war started (NY draft riots)

>>675223168
You do realize the first slave owner in the United States was indeed a black man, I have done work for re-in-actors of the civil war, it holds a lot of history, also many men both black an white have defended this flag in honor of being a Confederate American at the time

>>675242624
They didn't just take away your right to leave the republic. They took away your right of sovereignty, and made you a servant of the federal government. Before the civil war, the states were equal to the federal government. Afterward, the states were subservient to the federal government.

That is the big deal from the civil war. "We the (sovereign) people" became "We the (servile) people".

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>>675223168
Bravo, op.

Though of course, you're a faggot because anyone who makes sense on b is a fag or retarded 13 year old.

>>675249270
Largest oversimplification and quite frankly teetering on a revisionist history there, but i know you gotta dumb it down for the /b/tards.

>>675249534
True AF. There's a monument to 9 black soldiers who fought for the CSA. I honestly think if the South would have allowed greater numbers of slaves to earn their freedom through battle race relations would be a lot better now. It also woulda helped if Lincoln was killed. That was the South's only friend after the war. Radical reconstruction really pissed the South off and the Blacks were a good scape goat. If Obama hadn't been elected I think race relations would have continued in a positive direction as well, but you cant change history.

>>675242854
Slavery was a part of the civil war. The North needed the taxes from all the slave labor industries of the South to fund the federal government and subsidize the northern industries. If the South broke away, the Northern industries would no longer get federal monies to exist and compete against the British (and European) industries, and so they'd go out of business. Without that income, the North would not be able to buy food from the South and would starve. The federal government wouldn't have the funds to pay for most of its operations and it might even collapse. All of these things, Lincoln and his advisors believed (whether or not they are actually true). And it all was built on the intensive slave labor of the South's cash crops and the taxes upon them.

THAT is why Lincoln took the North to war. Pure survival of the Northern states and the Federal government. He states on several occasions if the South came back, he'd let them keep their slavery and everything else intact, unpunished, as long as they just kept paying all the taxes, including the new taxes. And that is why the South left the North. Their businesses were being taxed out of existence. Its why they didn't come back when offered the chance on multiple occasions.

>>675249534
>re-in-actors

Holy shit how

>>675250564

I've done some camera work for re-in-actors, to help them get more momentum for some small re-enactments, my goal is to get to PA an record some of the re-enactments of gettysburg.

>>675250362
Also glad to see another person on /b/ who knows their shit, cool beans /b/ro

>>675223168
Please learn your history better, this is to more than just you, but its something that should be pointed out to alot of people. The flag you have posted as your image was the second Navel Jack, and was never actually used to represent the south on any means, besides being a small decal on the second and third national flags. I believe you are seeking the war flag of the south which was a square with a almost identical design. So the fact that people get offended by this flag is absolutely asinine, it was never an official flag of the south. And the war wasn't started over race and slaves, in fact until Abraham Lincoln used the slaves to keep the motivation for the war to keep going that race wasn't involved at all.