>>660831695
bump

If you want to learn web stuff like html and css, goto W3Schools.com

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Alright, how about more tits then, come on /b/, I know you don´t have anything better to do

>>660831695
Go to YouTube and study c++. I forgot who the dude is but he does a good tutorial of different skills.

Go to code academy, I'm a computer science major and that shit will work

Languages I recommend you study:

Java
C/ C++
Python
Javascript

>>660833093
C++ is too low level for a beginner imo.

>>660831695
Learn Java first and then move to to lower level stuff like C++ and then C. Learn some scripting languages like Python after Java too.

>>660833511
do this

Programming is for pussies. Real men implement their algorithms on an FPGA.

Learn Assembly.

>>660831695
Learn python first if you are completely new

>>660833947
you can't expect someone who knows nothing about computers 'cept apps to start with field programmable gate arrays.

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If you're good at math learn C first. It's like portable assembly. Don't use a IED. Get GCC and you'll be golden

>>660831695
Start with python or groovy.

You need a degree for it to be worthwhile. You can make 3-4x as much money doing the same work if you have one.

>>660835295
Use this as a tutorial/resource

http://sys.4chan.org/derefer?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.moreware.org%2Fbooks%2FKochan%2520-%2520ProgramminginC.pdf

>>660833947
no, they reflect photons using mirrors into which alter surrounding particles in such a way that cosmic rays bounce back from adjacent particles and write the correct concentration of 0s and 1s to the desired disk by mastering electromagnetism, pleb

Well what are you going to do opie?

>>660834625
Yeah, I can. If they don't, they're pussies.

>>660836729
Kill myself

>>660833783
I disagree but respect your opinion.

>>660838105
Why do you say this? Just learn C. It will be fun.

Doing the Code academy Java tutorial now, like the structure they´re using when teaching, and as an old WoW player, it is very rewarding (mentally) to get fucking achivements for clearing stuff.

Schools should use this, and not just programming, math, language, anything

>>660838680
I hate java

>>660831695
search for some java course on the internet or get a java book, its a good point to start. or c# but i think java is easier

>>660838641
Suicide sounds funner

Fucking go to college loser

>>660839062
I have no opinion of it as of yet, but seems simple enough, its kinda like writing cave man language, no full sentence, just the get the point across, if that makes any sense

Don't listen to the Java fags op. Learn C first. Doing so will immediately put you ahead of like 90% of these code monkeys

Codecademy is a great site to start

>>660838680
Impossible. You can't reduce the complexities of gender studies into a bunch of binary digits. How patriarchical of you. Consider checking your privilege cis scum

>>660840130
C is really hard to learn for a first language. Plus he would lose interest fast because you can't do "cool" things like app development with C.

>>660833511
Another cs major here:

This is great advice, take it.
Also practice on your own projects all the time, the experience will only help you.

>>660838680
>Schools should use this, and not just programming, math, language, anything

It's called gamification and it's coming.

due to things like distributed computing and a larger emphasis on concurrency I predict a steady decline in OO languages. I would recommend trying clojure or if you want a challenge haskell. ultimately thought it doesn't matter what language you start with learn theory and basics. good devs use a large number of languages and tools depending in the requirment. bad devs try to make every requirment conform to their preferred tool (rails community is known for doing this)

Is opie kill?

>>660840980
You can´t say that to me, I identify as a non binary, non gender transniggermolekin, check YOUR privilege transniggermoleophobe.
>>660840999
>>660841300

So Java is like dummies first programming language, but the big money is in C/C+?

I´ve also seen C# around, I get they are different types of languages but is there a major difference in structure or just in the way they are implemented?

>>660841775
Opie is busy wrapping his head around Boolean values and flow control, gotta study /b/ro

Focus on SQL, most $ for the least effort. Reporting is like the #1 growing field right now, I have a friend who just landed an $80k year job doing that shit (greater Seattle area but still).

Codecademy or treehouse. Learn Java and develop android apps.

You need to do some Maths on a Degree course.

I'm shit at Maths, therefore I cant get on a course just yet...

>>660841784
If you learn C first you will actually get a feel for what's going on "under the hood" of the computer. You won't get this from learning Java first.

>>660841784
Don't underestimate Java, it's used in a lot of places, especially Android development.

C/C++ is if you want to get into hardcore graphics programming/systems programming. It's also used in hardware programming, but if you want to do THAT (not recommended for beginners), learn Assembly.

>>660833511

If you're a beginner, better to learn in this order

1) Javascript
2) Python
3) Java
4) C/ C++

>>660842809
where can you even learn assembly?

>>660843232
python before javascript i'd say
Also use codeacademy.

>>660843371

A book?

I recommend:

C++/C
Python
JavaScript

Those are essential for what I do everyday, but for a beginner's language I would do either Visual Basic or C#. Both work very well with Windows and don't so weird shit if you fuck up.

>>660833511
Hate to rain on the parade, but code academy is shit.

All it teaches you to do is how to copy and paste code.

Get a programming book in the particular field you want to get into. If you don't know which field, study C++ via books and youtube.

May the programming gods bless you.

Also, look into dual booting linux if you don't use it already. It'll help you become familiar with using the terminal. Ubuntu and Mint are good distro options, not much hassle to setup or use. Good for linux beginners.

If you care about privacy disable amazon search that comes with Unity. Unity is the default desktop environment that comes with Ubuntu.

>inb4 hurr durr u dun need linux to program
>The point is to make anon familiar with the terminal, and a bit more self reliant

>>660843371
Literally just google it...

>>660843371
There's books on it littered around the web. Look up best assembly books and pdfs. Should be something helpful. Still, be prepared for a learning curve so steep you'll need ropes and pitons to get up it.

Try code academy its where i started ik tht everyone is going to be giving h8 but its actaully really good and its how i started now im majoring in comp science its my freshman year btw

Best place to start is online videos, real basics.

You'll get frustrated just doing it by yourself with books and you waste a lot of time figuring stuff out that is already been documented by someone.

>>660844452
It's okay for total noobs, but you only make real progress by working on your own.

>>660844144
This. I always hear shitters saying they know how to code but they don't know anything about data structures or basic algorithms. You can't get a job for anything more than a shitty startup looking for a typing monkey if you don't know basic stuff like that.

>>660844452
>now im majoring in comp science its my freshman year btw

OMG look at you, you're an expert at this point! You should be very proud of yourself! Maybe if I work hard enough, maybe someday I can learn introductory computer science too!

>>>/g/
Also MOAR

>>660844144
>All it teaches you to do is how to copy and paste code.

This.

CodeAcademy is good, but it made me lazy and wanna CopyPasta without really learning

>>660844452

Did code academy give you an understanding of what was actually going on?

IMO it's an alright introduction, but doesn't explain basic concepts and what the hell is actually happening in your code that you basically copy and paste. At least, this was my feeling when I did the JS course.

>>660844893
>OMG look at you, you're an expert at this point!
Give him a break, he managed to work through it, unlike me (I'm learning by automating Javascript for my work)

>>660835597
LOL most retarded thing I've ever heard. College is for retards to lazy to self teach and self implement. If you don't want to go into acedemia and you're attending college may as well be burning your money fucktard.
I.e. my bffl has been offered 150k jobs for shit he has on his resume from highschool for programming. No ONE GIVE A FUCK ABOUT DEGREES if you can get shit done.
Kill yourself DAVE

>>660845059

Exactly. In the JS and web development tracks it also introduces JQuery. I think that should be a separate course. How can someone learn how to use a 3rd party library without knowing what hell it really does or why?

>>660831695
OP - 10% of the general population has whatever gene it takes to be a programmer - 10% of those people are any good at it.

So, rather than hopping in blind - tell us what you'd like your first project to do - and we can point you to something that may interest you that will allow you to do it in a way that is manageable. Telling someone to go learn Java, C++, Python, and Javascript is a tall order for - languages aren't as important as general constructs and familiarity.

So, what is it that would interest you?

>>660845456
Work through what? He's a freshman, he has literally worked through nothing.

>>660835597
I make $400k per year managing developers. I don't have a college degree. I was a developer myself for about 20 years.

>>660833947
>real men
>computer work
pic related

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>>660831695
Learn C first. It's not as difficult as people make it out to be--more correctly it doesn't need to be as difficult as people make it. Learn good habits, and stick to them and you will do well.

Now, I'm sure at least one person will disagree and tell you to learn X language first instead. The thing about C is that it's fucking everywhere in software development. It is deeply ingrained in the *nix world, and that alone is enough to ensure that it remains relevant and dominant. It not going anywhere anytime soon. Other languages will fall in and out of vogue constantly, but C will be around for a very long time to come.

Now, don't take this as me claiming C is the best language. To be honest it's a complete mess, or at least lazy, sloppy coders make it so. C does give you lower level access than most other languages, so it does give you more control over hardware, but not complete and total control like asm. It also teaches you to think like a programmer, rather than a skiddie.

On the other hand just about any job you could want to do with C, there is almost certainly at least 1 other language that can do it better, and likely easier.

So why bother? Because like I said it's influential, and it's widely used. Your resume will never, ever be passed over because you know C, but not X; it will be passed over if you don't know it, and other applicants do, even if the job doesn't require it. Right or wrong it's more impressive to employers. If you only ever learn 1 language (and you most certainly should not limit yourself to just one) let it be C.

Build a strong foundation in C, and picking up most other languages will be a trivial matter. Just about any more modern language worth learning has been influenced by C to some degree, so knowing it, will help you learn pretty much most other commonly used languages.

>>660841784
nigga this people don´t know shit lel.

>>660845703
"No ONE GIVE A FUCK ABOUT DEGREES"

Well at least you're funny. If I'm an employer and it's you vs me, same experience, same background, but I have a degree, guess who's getting hired. Me.

College isn't for the lazy, it's the exact opposite. Much easier to do shit on your own, but employers want to see that you can follow directions, work with others, shit like that.

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>>660846139
404
Brain has crashed. THIS is the related pic

This is what I'm going to tell you. Save up. Because, within five years, you'll be out of a job programming.

There is absolutely no thinking or creativity involved in programming. It's just fixing your own mistakes.

Economic's 101. Demand will kill you eventually. I know this.

>>660845771
>OP - 10% of the general population has whatever gene it takes to be a programmer - 10% of those people are any good at it.

Nailed it. I love coding, but I know I'll never make a good Pro programmer.

>>660846176
nigga the man, wants to start making money, he can´t build any program without a cs degree, let him do some webpages or some stuff that will let him start.

You can´t build software today without a software degree.

>>660846270
i don't get the pic

I can´t believe how retarded you all are.

>>660846176
Heed this mans words OP.

C or C++ are good starting languages. I think C is probably a better start than C++ if your not down with being dragged through a mile of obsidian shards like C++ will do to you when you attempt to learn it as a first language.

>>660846572
Seems like thats a you problem

>>660845771
I'm really interested in making memes. I would ideally be writing software that searches the internet for content it then uses to generate memes.

>>660845973
I mean he worked through CodeAcademy, enough for him to know the basics (hopefully) and start a course

Oh shit. That's funny.

http://codingbat.com/

>>660845973
You sound pretty jealous.

Listen up C/C++ advocates.

If OP doesn't know shit about coding, he'll need a language that can give instant feedback on a browser, like Javascript?

And not be pissed having to compile every time he wants to print "Lulz" on his screen?

>>660847968
>instant feedback
What is a compiler/interpreter?

>>660845771
Be able to make my shitty indie game in my spare time, make a fun program/app that may one day sell for $0.99 on the app store. As for my proffesional life, I have no idea, anything from code monkey to data wrangler, anything that pays whitout having to do long hours and overtime on a regular basis.

Game dev would be cool but I got a friend that works for DICE (yeah, I know, belive it if you wish) and he looks like he´s 40 when he´s just 30, says it is an unholy amount of stress and preassure involved.

Working as a chef right now, gotten sick and tired of having to pull 12 hour days just so I can can keep the prep up to par.

Udacity has free programming courses for beginner and intermediate

>>660847968
If OP does not have the patience to wait for his code to compile then he should just quit while hes ahead.

If you cant wait 5-20 seconds for code to compile how do you think you're gonna handle staring at code looking for an error for hours on end?

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>>660844908
alright, MOAR it is

>>660848551
B/ro, the only thing I'd say is that the IT field is constantly changing every year, so you'll need to learn new stuff or you might get left behind. If that's not for you, then consider something else.

Better for you to work on HelpDesk to start with, help people with desktop PCs, printers and shit (actually, that's where most grads start)

>>660848551
You sound like a decent guy OP, best of luck. Hope things work out for you.

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>>660848551
IT is long hours too, but working in an office sure is better than 12 hour Chef stints.

All best to you OP whatever you do

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>>660849251
Got no problem with that, being a chef is all about making your next dish better than the last one, always looking to improve and perfect. Help desk sound more like my kind of deal, gonna look into getting somethin along those lines, since I´m the PC literate of the family
>>660849539
>>660850101
You too /b/ros, have some bush on your way

>>660848508
>What is a compiler/interpreter?
In english, software that turns your slow, badly written code into optimized machine level code so it runs faster ; )

>>660848551
Game dev might not be for you, because your friend's experience is pretty typical for devs in those big companies.

This thread is a bunch of autists arguing over languages. If writing your own games is what you like, learn C#. Go find an online tutorial, or some dude in a video that takes you through a project, or pirate an O'Reilly book on C# and fucking dig into it. Learn everything you can.

Just know you have a lot of work to do before any good jobs will be available. A degree is the easier but more costly option.

>>660846266
I actually will be graduating with 2 degrees in may then going on for a PhD in Mathematics. Again though... I want to be in acedemia.

>>660850996
OP better to do Java for games to begin with.

sorry,

Pro Autist here

>>660850996
man writing games today is more about learning a game API than learning a language.

Why are you all so misinformed you all gave shitty advice.

>>660844908
Check out /sci/ too

>>660851318
I doubt that. Am I correct in assuming one of those "degrees" is in Math?

>>660851493
Unity is the easiest, most accessible game engine for a new person, and C# is the most robust language it supports. Java is shit.

>>660851543
Lol just no.

OP I don't give a fuck if you listen to me, this is the internet and I can't prove shit. But 4chan's user base is clearly 15 year old wanna-be children and it's showing here.

>>660831695
I'll make it easy for you.

1. Download/install a Python interpreter.
This will give you the basic tools to write whatever programs you want. You can always learn more specialized tools in the future.
2. Work your way through Project Euler problems
This will teach you about math, complexity, algorithms, cryptography, all the abstract CS stuff.
3. Get bored with that and do other stuff with programming. Maybe get a job.

>>660831695
I learned python through docs alone and making stuff. I'm currently using freecodecamp to learn Javascript html and css. Working great so far.

>>660852977
you say use unity, unity has less to do with knowing c sharp than knowing their API.

Java is not shit, java is in more places than C sharp, c# is in everything microsoft BUT not everything in the world is microsoft. That is were java works.

>>660833093
>>660833783
All the curly brace languages are just too complicated to bother with unless you need them for a specialized purpose, like highly performant or embedded code. To learn programming, strong typing and all the other gotchas that come with curly brace languages are a distraction.

Python, on the other hand is so easy that even a /b/tard can do it. It's as fast as Java, has almost as many libraries, and is extensible with C++ once you learn that. Can't go wrong learning Python.

>>660853535
yes, man, only autists that can't understand context say that he should learn c. The guy wants to start making money he wont be writing an OS from scratch.

>>660843232
This is the most sensible suggestion, but I don't see any reason to learn Java/C# at all. Maybe throw in Haskell/Prolog/Lisp at #4 after C/C++.

>>660831695
Teamtreehouse.com got me from customer service rep to full time web developer in ten months. Look into their Web Development track. There's a lot to learn though before you really can do anything worth charging for.

Learn, in this order, HTML, CSS, JavaScript, jQuery, and Sass to get down the basics, then try building a site or two. Then, you should learn a Content Management System (CMS) like Wordpress, and probably some PHP.

After you've made 5-6 sample sites, Put together a portfolio site and start applying. This industry really only cares about your skills so if you show them you know what you're doing they will hire you.

>>660853956
all the good advice when the thread is dead, the faggots who answered earlier should be shot.

>>660843371

Buy a Raspberry Pi, and use it to learn ARM assembly. Or alternatively, get a MIPS Creator Ci20 development board instead, and learn MIPS asm. Both ARM and MIPS asm are simplified compared to x86/AMD64 asm.

MIPS is the simpler of the two as far as it's instruction set goes, but on the other hand RPi has a larger user community, that happens to be very open, and welcoming to newbies. You'll find more community written guides for the board, and you'll have an easier time getting help and advice if you need it.

>>660853458
>hurr durr java is popular so is gud

Java spread because the internet was growing, and the support given to the JVM meant portability that no other language could match. It is not a good language.

Your arguing is even stupider given that they're so similar syntactically that a Java employer will gladly hire a good C# programmer since the transition is negligible.

>>660831695
Check out the new Boston on youtube

>>660854695
read what I said, you call java shit, they have a niche in the market, I am saying MAN both java and c# are good for different things.

Learn to have a conversation before you get killed for being an autistic pile of human shit.

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What I do really hat is all these people telling other people how they are capaböe of programming but don't know shit.
I'm nearly done with my Informatik degree (what's basically real IT and not a dumbed down USA CS education) and do programming jobs and projects since 6+ years.
Most people do not even know what design patterns are, datastructures, formal languages and grammas and all this stuff.

Thus, I would be careful what kind of adivce I would take from anyone in the specific domain.
Get a good book, learn the concepts (because it doesn't really matter - do you know one programming language, you basically can work yourself in the next one in no time) and do ALL of the exercises. At best, you get a book about programming exercises as well.

In this order
>Pick Java or Python (both have modern languages aspects like OOP)
>Get a good book or if you don't have the discpline means to work through a book
>https://www.youtube.com/user/thenewboston/playlists (Java playlist)
>programm

Later on, get down proper design patterns, learn about datastructures and maybe on the way a good book about theoretical computer science (it doesn't have to be that math heavenly with proofs, just to get a basic knowledge)

Stackoverflow.com for questions.
Git for project hosting
-> Build up a programming portfolio on github
(just google the last 3 mentioned websites)

>>660855024
this guy is not autistic, I think op has already left, but as I said all the other faggots should be fired and set on fire for giving such a terrible advice.

>>660852785
One in Math and one in Computer Science. Want to do my PhD within Algebraic Geometry

>>660831695
Start off scripting with BATCH or try BASIC.

Both will run on Windows 2000 and later no problems, and you can easily install that on nearly any computer.

Google is your best bet. WinBoards maybe?

>>660854659
Bad advice from a try-hard attempting to look smart.

I'm out OP, idk if you're even here but just take this advice: try shit until you're interested enough. Language doesn't matter (I'm the fag that suggested C# but what do I know), you'll learn them as you need. Just start coding. Do what will keep you motivated and engaged. It's all the same skill.

>>660846007
Makes $400k/yr and you are on 4 chan? Bullshit.

Is there any book which could teach me to design and code faster? I have a couple of ideas in web but I can't even create a prototype in a week.

>>660846007
You are just an unemployed shit stain who jerks off to loli 3 times a day like the rest of us and you know it.

>>660831695
Try my shitty 90's website at:
http://sites.google.com/site/aiosysdesign/home/
and go to utilities on the right. You should find a few documents there to hep you get started with the shitty scripting language I use as well as a wealth of random garbage programs my and my idiot friends have made.

Feel free to use my contacts on there for more help.

>Please spam SkipperDMudkipz / Agnast Da Beefy, they have limited internet

>>660855024
>design patterns
>data structures
>formal languages
>grammars
OP wants to learn programming, not get a formal education. You act like you know what you're talking about with your second semester of uni + big boy internship concepts, and advise OP about Git and design patterns. Top fucking kek m8.

>>660855676
nigga the trick to coding faster is: find a framework that can do what you want, git good.

The other thing people lack is focus, like start doing shit till you finish it.

>>660845703
>College is for retards to lazy to self teach and self implement.

Software engineering hiring manager here to tell everyone what a load of bullshit that post is.

If you don't have a degree in computer programming, your resume won't even get past the HR department to my desk.

Completing college proves that you can accomplish a task given by someone else, to their satisfaction, under a deadline and constraints. In other words - it proves you can do a job for someone else.

Self-taught guys are flakey - you don't know if they can deliver on time, if they're going to get bored and quit, if they're worth investing in. An employee straight out of school is not going to be very effective for 6 months after being hired - so think about 1/2 year of salary as on-the-job training cost. We're not going to invest that money into someone who's going to flake out when the going gets tough.

That's the difference between someone who can make it through college and someone who thinks they can do it on their own.

>>660855676
This comes down along with experience. Code more. Bets thing is to start off with pseudo-code in some aspects and translate it into actual code. Maybe UML design and sketches on paper will work for you.

>>660856379
man this shit is good advice, you don't learn shit by learning a language, you have to understand what you are doing. I give you that wihtout a focus one can study formal langauges for years, not a very good advice for a begginer.

>>660855349
Alright, why must the manifold be compactly supported in order to be able to use Stoke's theorem?

Also, algebraic geometry huh? Explain to me WHAT that is, I'd be surprised if you can. Stop googling random shit.

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if you aren't learning C you're a faggot webdev nodev.

>>660856379
It's not about formal education. All of this is used in the industry. I can smell your insecturities up until here.Second semester? Final, BA thesis is left.

>Git/Github is in the industry used
>Design Patterns are used in the industry as well
>Stackoverflow is a good website for idnetifiying bugs and errors and fixing them
>Formal languages and theoretical CS is not a must but a plus. Regular Expressions and (formall) grammars are daily used as a programmer.

Did you even hold a programming job?
You're one of those smartasses I don't really like in the industry. No skillset, no experience but some hello-world programs and all big talk.

It's up to OP if he wanna take my advice or not.

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>>660856666

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The STEM autism in this thread...

>>660857148
as I said this nigga is right, he shouldn't be trying to convince shitters but w/e, he should uh give a more focused curriculum for op to follow, like OP you don't need to learn a shitton of formal grammars to understand pattern recognition that is the most used application in cs.

>>660856666
I'm not going to even pretend I know enough about algebraic geometry (Still an undergrad, taking my first algebraic topology course next semester). My professor who I did research under recommended that I look into it for grad school due its connection to variety and gave me a brief explanation of what it all that was so i thought why the fuck not.

>>660856666
Also sick Quads

>>660857587
Alright, let's ignore the algebraic geometry thing for now then. Can you answer my manifold question? That's just differential geometry, you should certainly have been taught that by now atleast.

Also, for the CS degree. What can a NFA do that a DFA can't?

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The basics:

Python:
>http://learnpythonthehardway.org/book/

Then once you've done that, C:

http://c.learncodethehardway.org/book/

And go here:

https://projecteuler.net/

But you shouldn't be sticking to just one resource when learning. Look at as much shit as you can and find out what works for you. Learning programming is like learning any other language - it's about immersion and constant use so find an excuse to do it for 1-2 hours every day, even if that's just fucking about with it.

>>660857148
>>Design Patterns are used in the industry as well
Aren't they just a crappy version of Monads tho?

>>660857472
>implying that STEM fields don't have ethics training
>rationalizing getting a babby degree

>>660857148
Git and design patterns are not a place to start learning programming. Reading is fucking fundamental.

Please, act all high and mighty, but you know that you can go a whole career using REs without knowing the theory of regular languages, or why the parts of a compiler beyond the lexer and parser need context-sensitive grammars to work. Not gonna start arguing my credentials on the internet, cause I don't give a fuck what you think.

Also you're writing a thesis? For a BA? BA in technology...? Aite little buddy, keep doing great work.

>>660846266

As an employer, your certificates mean nothing if you are forgettable the second the interview is over. Whats on your Resume landed you that interview but more often than not the people I call in with little education are a much more attractive hire.

>>660858022
Never took differential geometry but I know some basic manifold shit. Sorry for being a dumb dumb I guess.

EPSILON TRANSITIONS OP OP.

Also no need for a state transition for every possible element of alphabet.

mein code kamf!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Freecodecamp dot com gives you 800 practice hours and 800 hours of actual work experience

>>660858022
>>660858022
>What can a NFA do that a DFA can't?
Nothing. In the end, you do have the same set of automatas what's not basically more than the set of L(A). You can translate a NFA to a DFA and a DFA to NFA.

Next time, be more precise sempai. :3

SoloLearn is great for learning c++

>>660858251
niggers you shouldn't be attacking each other just learn to give constructive advice, even in b. There is a bunch of people watching thist thread maybe you can be serious for once.

>>660858022
I actually think my analysis class will probably cover that next semester. I'm only doing 3 years for both degrees so didn't have a shit ton of time to all the courses in each.

>>660851318
I'm doing a double major in pure math and comp sci. What benefit do you get out of doing a double degree instead of a double major?

I haven't decided if I'm going into academia so I've been taking a bunch of grad courses. Already did computability (recursive function theory) and category theory, gonna do homotopy type theory next semester.

>>660858182
To a degree ye, like design patterns are only a thing because the language doesn't have a construct for the thing you want to do.

>>660856499

continued

While I'm here, let me give the rest of you some free advice.

When we have a job opening, we publish a job listing on various websites and call in corporate recruiters. That listing has some minimal qualifications, and some desired qualifications. After being online for a month or so, I'm handed a stack of 20+ resumes to sort through (that have already been weeded out by HR).

The first thing I do is go through that stack with a highlighter and mark every qualification on the resume that matches one on our job posting. When I finish, if your resume only has a few basic highlights, like "C/C++", then it never gets considered for a follow-up. If your resume has a bunch of highlights, I pass it back to HR for a preliminary phone screening.

The result of this is, candidates who actually read our posting and are pro-active enough to send us a customized resume pass a very important hurdle. You wouldn't believe how many resumes I get where the candidate obviously doesn't care what we do and is just spamming job openings. I can see that loser sitting at home playing video games, telling his parents, "Gee Mom, I don't know what the problem is - I applied to like 20 different job postings. No one is hiring now! (Click bleep click zap click pew pew.)"

Give us a resume that's customized to our job opening. And attach a cover letter that explains why you're interested in the job.

>>660858777
CS and Math are in different colleges at my school... Sadly mean I need to do two degrees.

>>660855902
>You are just an unemployed shit stain who jerks off to loli 3 times a day like the rest of us and you know it.
kek

>>660858251
>Git and design patterns are not a place to start learning programming

No, it's something you are required to know nevertheless.

>Not gonna start arguing my credentials on the internet, cause I don't give a fuck what you think.
Because dropping some buzzwords are sufficient enough. I take that.

>you're writing a thesis? For a BA?
In germany you are required to write a bachelor/master thesis to gain your BA/MA.

Like I said. It's up to OP. In the end OP takes what works the best for him.

>>660858378
>>660858517
>>660858687

Alright, I can give credit where credit is due. I was wrong, you weren't lying, you seem to know your shit :) Best of luck with the PhD man!

Btw automata question was just a trick question!

>>660858660
I gave my constructive advice, this thread is now a pissing contest. And I'll argue all I want to satisfy my inner autist, eats a bag of dicks

>>660831695
Op, if u r still about.
Ethical hacking and penetration testing
https://www.cybrary.it
Is a good place to start. Sign up for free and fair not free courses

>>660859200
You fucking nigger I can piss a hell of a lot further than you. Don't you dare fucking challenge me on that you whore.

>>660859156
lol thanks, and I appreciate the skepticism. Always good to call out potential bullshit.

>>660831695
learn ruby, then ruby on rails, its the best paying pl now and a pretty good place to start. also ios development.

also
>>660833050
kek

If you're looking to become employed you're probably going to need more than CodeAcademy. All of the online resources are awesome - so use them - but there is a big difference between being able to run through some online exercises and being worth hiring.

I'd also suggest a coding bootcamp - they will accelerate your learning, plus get you ready to be employed. It'll probably run you 10-15k and 3-4 months of your time. But - when you're done, you'll be as/more hire-able than a kid with a 4-year CS major.

Your results may differ - but in 14 months, I went from no legit job for almost 3 years to accepting 110k salary position as developer (mostly Javascript).

>>660859282
Typo that was meant to read enjoy the free courses

>>660859145
>buzzwords
I guess you skipped taking the compiler class? Or maybe your shit school didn't offer it. Bottom line is you wanted to show off your degree, and no one here is impressed. Go jerk to yourself elsewhere, and stop giving bad advice just to talk about what you learned in class last semester.

And you were talking about "the industry". Gtfo

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Beginner Javafag here, got through my first CS class last quarter. Went on to finish the textbook (we covered beginner shit up to recursion in my course), struggling a bit with recursion and GUIs.

Any of you more experienced coders have an idea for a project or two for me to work on that will help me learn shit while I'm still on break for the next few days?

Thanks fam

>>660859684
>also ios development.
ios needs Objective C knowlegde

>>660859756
any recommendations?
which camp did you go to?

>>660860226
>Any of you more experienced coders have an idea for a project or two for me to work on that will help me learn shit while I'm still on break for the next few days?

Get the Android Studio and Android Development Tools and build a simple app, then install it on your Android phone.

(If you don't have an Android phone, then why are you a computer programmer?)

>>660860159
https://www.tuhh.de/t3resources/tuhh/download/studium/pruefungsamt/po/Plaene_ab_WS15_16/E/20150422_Studienplan_Bachelor_CSBS_KohorteWiSe2015.pdf

I won't link my Github portfolio here.
But as a student earning about 50-80 Euro/hr (depending) isn't that bad. Working 20 hrs real programming jobs while studying is the difference between me and you. Stay salty m8.

It's always a pleasure to show off my life standards and knowledge to no-achievers like you.

>>660858788

>>660858931
Oh, I see. Our university allows us to either double major or double degree. The difference is that a double major allows courses to count for both degrees (they'll fill up each other's elective spots) whereas a double degree won't. We can also have minors and shit can get pretty complicated. It's maybe not the best system. I know a girl doing two double degrees with a double major on each and minors too. She's gamed the system somehow so that she doesn't have to take that many more classes.

>>660859145
I agree that a person should know git but I wouldn't set it as a starting point since you typically need some project to use git "with". It's like deciding you're going learn to drive when you have nowhere to actually go. Even if you manage to pull it off, it won't be useful to you and you probably won't retain it.

As far as design patterns, I would suggest learning that after getting a firm grasp of a programming language and the sort of problem solving necessary when approaching programming problems. Otherwise they may have trouble grasping how they work and seeing their true benefit (you're offering them complex solutions to problems they've never had).

I think a person should have attempted (not necessarily successfully) to write a simple programming project before looking at these techniques. That way they can understand, appreciate, and really see the value they provide. That is just my opinion though.

>>660833010
This

>660860924
Was already thinking of doing this, and I have an idea in mind, too. Thanks.

>>660860226
niggu dont hit yourself too hard with that shit, don't try to make guis with code, nobody does it they use a framework, uh netbeans lets you design guis.

for recursion you only have to understand what a function is like

F(X) apply f to the argument, X can be anything a constant a variable or a function.

make a simple recursive function like

Function OPisAFag(int x)
{
if x <= 0 return
else
print(op is a fag);
OPIsAFag(x-1);
}

>>660860226
GUIs are just a fucking mess in Java. Don't make yourself hate Java any more than necessary.

Recursion is gonna be uncomfortable until you learn it in a context where it makes things easier and is actually natural. You can always do shit like calculate Fibonacci numbers recursively, or try navigating through your computer's file system recursively and printing out existing directory names.


You'll do lots of it in your data structure course when dealing with trees and graphs, so don't stress too much.

>>660831695
One doesn't learn programming. One is born a programmer.

>>660861131
Oh that's pretty sick, good for her. Feel free not to answer but what school just out of curiosity?

>>660861586
then there is the chosen one, he has 10 fingers in each hands, he pull in small kids with his gravitational force, and he can melt steel when the sun hit his glasses.

re: college degrees

If you've got one from a school like MIT... yeah, it's probably going to get you some interviews that Joe "no-degree" isn't going to get.

If we're talking about a CS degree from State U. or a generic expensive private U. - a hard truth your high school guidance counselor and college admissions officer didn't tell you - is outside of the chance the person hiring you is an alumni, the degree is almost worthless

>>660858924

What do you do with people who lack a minimum requirement on their resume? What about people who have a similar qualification?

What about experience? How much does it matter?

What about people who have a basic background in academia (have performed paid summer research for instance) or have a masters instead of a bachelors?

>>660861586
>One doesn't learn programming. One is born a programmer.

The way I'd say it is, most people can learn to be computer programmers. However, most people don't have the temperament for computer programming - such as living in a structured, logical world inside your head for 8-10 hours a day while sitting in a box.

>>660862188
you made it sound like a rat in a maze. lel

>>660831695
Learn some discrete math and abstract algebra first.

>>660831695

Go here for books: http://it-ebooks.org/

>>660861013
80 Euro an hour. As a student. I'm sorry, I just feel bad for you now. Best of luck man, hope your thesis goes well.

>>660862052
>What do you do with people who lack a minimum requirement on their resume? What about people who have a similar qualification?

The HR department which receives the resumes filters out many before I ever see them, based on the minimum qualifications. In the case of a gray area, they pass it along to me with a note flagging it. So far, I've only received two flags - one was vetoed right away, the second we went ahead and passed through the interview stages because he was local, and talked a good game, but did a poor job on the technical questions of the in-person interview.

>What about experience? How much does it matter?

Sometimes we hire entry level positions, and sometimes we hire senior level positions. Our experience so far is that the current entry-level hires are not showing enough initiative and ownership of the job, so they're not becoming productive even after a year's training. We're focusing more on experienced hires now because the responsibility of maturity is a benefit, even at the extra cost.

>What about people who have a basic background in academia (have performed paid summer research for instance) or have a masters instead of a bachelors?

If you have the minimum qualifications and enough matches between your resume and our job listing, you'll be seriously considered and given a chance to impress us in a phone interview before a fly-out in-person interview.

>>660844814
Which algorithms and data structures do u count as basic? I'd like to know so I know if I know them

>>660860508

Launch Academy in Boston.

The other thing that worked for me is the structure. If you attend one of these, you're going to be coding 8-10 hours/day, 5... sometimes 6 days/week, for 3 months straight. If you get stuck, or need help... you're surrounded by other students and teachers to motivate/un-stick you.

>>660846007
>400k a year
>no college degree

Lie to me more.

>>660864033
lol the thing is that one doesn't use data structures or algorithms too much, the most used are prepackaged, but you must know them to understand what you need to use in which case, you need to know they exists.

lists, hashes, heaps, stacks, trees.

sorting algorithms. what else do you faggots ever use lol.

I have never had to program any data structure or sorting algorithm, ocassionally you use a tree a hash, most of the time you use lists.

>>660864033
Different person but I would say:
Basic sorting algorithms i.e bubble, quick
Basic graph algos: BFS DFS Prim's (and mother MST finders) djkstras (and other paths ie Bellman)
Structures
Maps, vectors, linked lists, heaps, trees

>>660831695
Uhg, man, why do you ask the retards on b? Just google something like "which programming language should I learn" and look at the results. Clever people have done analyses of job ads (which languages are hired?) or created flow charts that tell you which language you need for what so you can choose depending on your interest. But you should realize that well paid jobs are available for good programmers only, not for amateurs who have to look up basic coding solutions. It takes a few years of full time effort to learn coding on a level that will get you a well paid job. So either you study computer science or stay in your old job.

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>>660863368
Thank you for answering my questions anon.

>>660864700
>>660864591
>no sleepsort
How did you guise even graduate?

>>660865513

kek.

>>660865211
Have you even read anything in this thread?

>>660864591
>lol the thing is that one doesn't use data structures or algorithms too much, the most used are prepackaged,

That's not really true. A list or a queue data structure may be pre-packaged by the library you use (like STL), but you'll be inheriting from it to create your own custom data structures.

For example, two threads need to communicate data. You probably pick a Queue object to manage the data flow. Easy enough - but what is the data you pass through the queue? It's a data structure - maybe in the form of a Class instance.

Pre-packaged libraries help with the low-level details, but they don't do the important, custom stuff, and that's the heart of the application.

>>660865211
>But you should realize that well paid jobs are available for good programmers only, not for amateurs who have to look up basic coding solutions

This applies to all high achievers, b/raggers and liars on every 'how much yoo earn threads' on /b.

The majority never get to work at HotShot Inc with office DJs playing ambient muzic, free massages and discreet shares

>>660865941
yeah sorry, uh in collegue they call data structures the trees and all the useful shit, you are right you use your own data structures A FUCKING LOT.

>>660833511
if you're looking for the most basic shit for beginners, start with python. I did that and it made learning java much easier

>>660865360
>Thank you for answering my questions anon.

Thank you for saying thank you.
If you are as considerate in your job applications by including a polite, targeted cover letter, and sending a thank you note after every stage, you'll have a leg up on most other candidates.

(Another by-the-way: after one in-person interview, he followed up with a polite thank-you email. It was sent and received as formatted text. During the interview debrief, we sat around and puzzled why there seemed to be random font changes in the letter. Then it came to us - it had all been copy/pasted from multiple online website examples and had picked up whatever formatting had been on that page. It made him seem sneaky rather than polite, since he wasn't able to put together four sentences by himself. We gave the job to someone else.)

W3C School

>>660866218

Cool, I figured it was probably some terminology difference.

>>660866894
kek,
happens alot in MS Outlook even though you 'paste without formatting'

To any of u android studio users out there, how the hell do I add a fragment to an activity? I'm new to android development (not Java) and started making a simple meme maker app and need to add a fragment to an activity but it won't let me and idk why. I've googled but I can't find anything at all.

>>660867153
in the end I saw that /b/ is not a good place for advice, there are many loud idiots and few good answers. someone without experience won't be able to tell one from the other.

>>660867962
>how the hell do I add a fragment to an activity?

Hi, I'm the software hiring manager that's been putting in long posts above. We write Android Service apps to work with our custom hardware and I can help you, but it will take me a while to type out the longer answer. I wanted to send you this quick note to say - wait for it, something useful is coming.

>>660868225
K great, thanks!

ITT starts.

Chef considers career doing programming.

ITT Ends.

I've got a bigger MIT cock than you have (insert complicated Enstein theory, Nazi comparison)

>>660868063
Ask /g or /sci or other

Nevar leave /b though

>>660866894
>Then it came to us - it had all been copy/pasted from multiple online website examples and had picked up whatever formatting had been on that page.
Hahaha, oh wow. That just seems like such a strange thing to do. I mean all that effort to not put in effort.

>>660838641
is your name paul, by any chance?

>>660867962
>how the hell do I add a fragment to an activity?

continued -

My question back to you is, do you really need to use a Fragment, or is the template that the Android tools are giving you include a fragment?

If you're just trying to learn, then you don't need fragments, and IMO they will only get in your way and make life difficult. Many of the online Android examples were written before fragments were being pushed, so they won't work with Fragments.

The problem with Fragments is that they require their member values to be static, and that makes it more difficult to integrate with Activities which are not static. This is what makes many of the existing code examples break when porting to Fragments.

So my advice to you if you don't need or care about fragments, delete all that stuff about fragments from the templates the IDE is giving you, and replace it with standard activity code blocks that you'll find dozens of examples about online.

If you really need fragments, let me know and I'll follow up with what I remember.

>>660868795
Ask /g/. /sci/ regularly gets people coming in asking for beginner programming advice and they just get rudely sent to /g/.

>>660868521
all that study and they are all still kindergarten children, that is what sucks about people you think they grow up but some people is incapable of doing it.

>>660866894
MS Outlook problem, does that even though you paste plain text from text editor.

Messes up my daily email..

>>660869006
It is not. But your friend Paul must be a wise man

>>660868923
>Hahaha, oh wow. That just seems like such a strange thing to do. I mean all that effort to not put in effort.

Agree - the guy was very smooth and presentable during the interview. He was so smooth and polished that it made us wonder if he was more politician than engineer. He was definitely smart, and smart enough to tell us what we wanted to hear. His technical answers weren't very deep though. When we received the (yes, MS Outlook) email from him and realized he was continuing to put up a front, rather than being genuine, it raised a big red flag for us.

>>660869277
I've been using linux for years now but I remember that whenever I wanted to get rid of formatting in Windows it was often easier to just paste into notepad and then copy and paste again from notepad.

>>660833511
i always stayed away from java, wich saved me a lot of time and frustration.
Working with bash/html/python/php/javascript for 10 years now.

Start with some basic python, then make some django websites. you probably dont need anything else. and use linux.

>>660869021
I'm just following thenewboston's tutorial on android development and he said that fragments are really important and showed how to write one. Like I said, it's a meme maker so I'm pretty sure the best way to get it done would be with fragments. I'm not really sure I'm still really new to android development so what do u think I should use in terms of a meme maker app ( pick a meme picture then add top text and bottom text)

>>660842619
no, that just leads to frustration. Its like learning to drive a car by studying the engine, while all you want to do is drive fast.

>>660869648
example:

Type email message, then click insert signature button "Kind Regards, Anon" to save typing out. Check formatting that font and font size is the same.

Check 'sent' folder for message - fonts are all different sizes and colours.

That bad.

Surprised there was no mention of Swift. Nice thread tho

>>660840130

after you learn java and all data structures and programming, you learn assembly and CPU design as well as memory stacks. THEN you learn C and unix and THEN you learn how to make a compiler in assembly and THEN you write an operating system.

that's real university. learning C first is stupid and not the way it's done.

>>660851318
mathematics, academia... and they didnt teach you coding?? wut?
Python is the most used language amongst scientists btw. especially numpy libraries and such.

>>660871139
you won't work with c unless you are making an application, most people with work with some website or some shitty gui app.

>>660871139

also, when you take"compilers" or "operating systems", girls with facial piercings will try to get you to settle for getting 17/20 test cases passing and just go get beer. "MORE BEER!" is their argument while you're sitting around waiting to get office hours with the professor. that's what i saw last semester. learning from home... i'd want 100k to give you a "syllabus" for what you need because it would take me a few hours.

>>660870830
>Surprised there was no mention of Swift.
Applescript?

>>660871349

yeah but when you go to real university, you take C after java and assembly. my school knows what it's doing. that's for fucking SOPHOMORES or baby JUNIORS. that's still nothing. it's the algorithms and operating system class that kill people and operating systems are written in C, bitch. it's a five phase process with groups working to make one over the semester.

practice its dood!

Try turning it on and back on again!

>>660844144
>May the programming gods bless you.
This in a half. you will NOT learn how to problem solve, just syntax

>>660870038

Fragments are the current mechanism for building modular, re-usable portions of a GUI in Android. For example, when a person is holding their phone in portrait orientation, they may have to press a button, etc to get to another page. When they rotate their screen to landscape orientation, perhaps there is now enough side-to-side space to show both pages. That's the code re-use, and the intent of fragments is to allow each of those sections to be coded modularly.

The problem with fragments like I mentioned is that since it has to be the same data whether it is shown or now, or whoever is showing it, it has to be coded with "static" Java data values, and since the Activity that invokes the fragment is not itself "static", that causes code violations when trying to interact between the two.

If I recall correctly, what you'll need to do to use fragments is to basically treat them as a separate, encapsulated class. You won't be able to interact with their member values directly (because of static vs non-static), so you'll have to implement setter/getter/etc methods on the fragment to manage the interactions. Push as much layout and behavior into the fragment as possible, and minimize what exists in the Activity itself, and even though they may exist in the same file, code as if they are completely separate classes.

Again, I would suggest for just a demo application, ignore fragments. It's a code re-use convenience which you won't need unless you're doing Real Product Engineering.

Also, regarding the actual GUI widgets for implementing the text on graphics, I can't help much there. The Service Applications we write have to work with the fragment framework, but our GUI is usually limited to text output with only a few buttons.

>>660846596
job security or many trolls. 1 or other

>>660846266
I have degrees in shit and i'm getting employed to do other stuff, front end web being one of them.

It's not an absolute.

This thread is facepalm. It's clear as daylight that the majority of replies are still completing their degree because all they know is curriculum and how to recite the list of reqs from memory.

Thank god I don't do entry level interviews. On that note...interviews are luck-based. You'll find morons in every company. I had a guy who asked me for help with code I wrote on a project before I got switched, so I figured I'd help him for an hour. Then it became a weekly hour session, then I realized the other 39 hours of the week he did jack shit. It was UI...

Do your own projects, can't go wrong

>>660862731
You know 80 Euro in EU is like 130~140 $ here in the US?

In EU you don't even have to pay that much health insurance. This guy who is earning 50-80 Euro there is better doing than 95%+ of other people there. I don't know what's your point at this matter. He does and have to live like a king with this amount of paycheck in germany.

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Some tits

>>660873254
>interviews are luck-based

I don't believe our interviews are luck-based.

We have two panels - a cultural panel and a technical panel.

The cultural panel is composed of people from different parts of the company - sales, factory, testing, etc. They ask a set of scripted questions such as "Tell us about a time you had to speak up for what was the right thing to do in your company." These questions are geared to pull out a candidate's character.

The technical panel involves some basic whiteboard work, writing pseudo code. We have three fairly simple algorithms to implement, and we have the candidate walk us through how they would implement it. It's great for separating the people who did the work themselves from the people who were able to find ways to coast.

>You'll find morons in every company.

I agree you'll find useless people in every company - but they're not necessarily morons. They've found a way to temporarily coast until the next layoff.

>>660874361

Oh, I forgot to say, on the cultural panel, if the candidate is male, we always include a mature female. They have years of experience in sniffing out male bullshit.

>>660874361
People like you are disgusting. HR generally.
Most HR people won't know shit and all this circus parade just to get a job is more than ridiculous.
I'm not projecting but c'mon.

>>660831695
First off, head to /g/, not /b/

Second of all, begin with a basic language and learn all of the basics in programming (modular/functional programming, data structures (dequeue, list, tree, etc.), OOP, design patterns, algorithms (all, so you know how to write an algorithm on your own), MVC (the non Web kind), frameworks, visual coding (VisualC/.Net/Qt/etc.), basics of graphics (like Bezie and such).

Personally I began with html&css when i was young, then I got to university and we went directly to C/C++ and learned kinda all basics of programming, then i moved to Java, then PL/SQL with OracleSQL (due to uni...). In the meantime i began learning also PHP and better SQL queries (like JOINT) as well as WordPress. I've also learned vb.net due to university and self taught myself C#.net and also SeleniumSDK for Java. In the meantime I also self taught myself a bit of android and later when i got in a company also SASS, Javascript, jQuery, Twig and Laravel.

The thing is, once you begin thinking in programming in any language, you can progress and learn anything. Many suggest you to start with python/perl etc. and beginning with C is not the best option, but then again 90% of all modern languages are C based.

Then, once you know ~ok 4-5 diff. languages you can decide what to use.
For simple scripts which need to do some work, I just use PHP whereas most ppl would use perl/python.
If it needs to be extra fancy I'd go with C++ or if it has to be web Java (cus i know Selenium).
If it needs to have a GUI I'd go with C#.net (i've been wanting to use Qt for a while though)
If I want to make a game I'd use GameMakerStudio
If I want to make a mobile app I'd use probably Eclipse or AndroidStudio and make an android app.

Oh and another thing: LEARN YOUR TOOLS!
Learn how to customize and maneuver in your IDE/editor.
I've made myself a custom dark theme for Notepad++. I also love VisualStudio, not only due to the Dark Theme but also because it's maybe the best IDE.

>>660831695
I think you should follow this order:

C
Assembly
Java
Python

>>660874741
cont.
Personally for writing simple scripts I use Notepad++, for work I use PhpStorm (doh i kinda hate it as well as all IDEs from JetBrains). I use whenever I could VisualStudio and Eclipse. it's really going offtopic though.

Also, if you are so clueless as to where to begin or which path to follow: here's a great idea for you:
Go to the website of an university which has a great IT program and see their schedule. Check what they got and pick up the basics and follow them.
Personally my program was quite versatile, 4 years Bachelors engineering degree in computer science (computer systems and technologies) and then i had my 1.5years of masters degree in Computer Technologies in Business... so I know my shit I guess.

tl;dr of CTB: ERP

And lastly don't be afraid to experiment.
I've experimented with.. writing graphic animations, doing android games and apps, doing windows apps and games, doing websites, doing linux programming (client&server via SOCKETS), multi-threaded programming (using locking mechanisms like semaphores, mutex and varlocks) and even doing Ladder diagrams for fucking Schneider microcontrollers.
I HAVE EVEN WRITTEN ASSEMBLY CODE for the fucking Intel I8086 (and some I8088 which is kinda same family). I fucking hate assembler. Almost as much as Javascript. Almost. But Javascript takes the shitcake in the shitcontest.

>>660874662
>People like you are disgusting. HR generally.

You are exactly the type of toxic personality we try to avoid hiring, which is why the interview process is successful. We don't want people who are competent technically, but have such a grudge against the system that they cause problems for everyone else.

We occasionally hire contractors for months at a time - they don't go through this interview process, but are hired solely based on their technical merit. And so far, in every case, they create team problems. They don't work efficiently, they challenge their assignments. Not one of them has performed well enough in the big picture to be worth hiring for a permanent position.

>>660846266
>Much easier to do shit on your own, but employers want to see that you can follow directions, work with others, shit like that.


lol. autodidact here. 10years in coding/sysadmin jobs. I had to do a lot more to proof my skills (github,stackoverflow,codingblog) since I dont have a uni degree. School is for lazy followers, not for ambitious self-directed people.
For a first job it is important to show a degree, but after that it just doesnt matter. After 4 years the knowledge is outdated anyway.

>>660875371
FORTRAN is all you need

>>660846748
no, they are terrible starting languages. It takes 2 years before they are able to make something cool. That is very frustrating and probably nobody will stay motivated for that long.

>>660875425
So it's a gathering place for special snowflakes?
People are bullshitting to get any job they want. They lie on resumes, they lie in the job interview and they will lie to you just to get profit out of it.
You think 'your system' is smart enough to filter them out. The retarded ones.
People like me can and will bullshit just to get a position. Stealing your infrastructure and personal company information and just go away to the next company.

You think you are so smart and outsmarted all these kids but in the end you get outsmarted.
Checkmate HR.

>>660875722
YES

>>660875999
Trips of truth

>>660831695
The language that make you get faster result is java, easy, difficult to get wrong, and it works everywhere.

You just have to follow tutorial how to do first program, then follow another one and add stuff, tutorials are made for it, no need to get a teacher

>>660876132
>difficult to get wrong
the thing I like about java is not it's simplicity but more of the IDE. Java gives a damn amazing stack trace of the crash log, unlike many other IDEs/languages.

as to OP, what do you wanna work as?

>>660875953
>So it's a gathering place for special snowflakes?
I don't work in IT, but they hired someone where I work and who was good and dedicated and is now a manager.

But after he got promoted, he just sits around watching illegal stream movies, Amazon shop all day, everyday for like 5 years...

Humans are un-filterable.

>>660875480
>10years in coding/sysadmin jobs. ... School is for lazy followers, not for ambitious self-directed people.

you realize that sysadmin is basically the garbage man of the computer field, right? just like QA/testing engineers, it's what people fall into when they've failed at real development.

I wouldnt have called you on it except for you saying formal schooling is a joke. we call your job a joke.

>>660876297
>Java gives a damn
Eclipse* typo.

>>660876424
i dont get why that Sysadmin is even taking in a programming thread.
A sysadmin only programs in Bash/Shell or writing Cronjobs, wow rocket science.

>>660875425
I bet you turn away many applicants who would have been very cost effective workers.

The contractors were the smartest devs in my previous company team. They are contractors after all: get shit done and move on to the next one. They have a track record and call out bs or when something's a poor choice.

Based on your judgements, I would stay away from your company