Only wrestler who can be argued for as the GOAT face and GOAT heel
try to debate this
>>1387227
I cannot debate that.
>>1387227
If Cena actually turned Heel (which would basically turn him face) he would be in that discussion
>>1387227
Can't debate.
Nobody even comes close
He let so many down he and his family got death threats that's how real people took it
Maybe Andre, maybe savage because he never got stale like hogan did. There's better faces and better heels, but I think hogan may be the goat when taking both sides in.
>>1387270
Why would Ambrose turn heel? He is like the only upper midcard face they have
>>1387270
Senor Ambronie, the only thing Deanetty is GOAT at is being cucked by Renee.
>>1387269
You can't argue Savage because he was always behind Hogan when they were playing the same role
>>1387227
Not gonna debate you brother.
Who rounds out the rest of the top GOAT Face/Heel?
>>1387296
Savage
Rock (Corporate Champ, not Hollywood Rock because he was struggling to get heat alot)
Kurt
HBK
Off the top of my head, you didn't see a drastic dropoff in those guys characters when they changed roles (Punk/Jericho as faces), and always got the reactions they were supposed to.
>>1387296
Angle, Jericho and the Rock have to be up there.
So Austin was too likeable to be a heel? Was Stunning Steve a heel?
>>1387315
Stunning Steve was good but it's not in the caliber of Hollywood Hogan/Corporate Rock etc
His run in 2001 was bad but it's a myth he never got heat, watch some of his entrances when the alliance was around and he got booed out of the building. It was just too radical of a change. Hollywood Hogan was cowardly too but you never saw him literally crying and begging a wrestler for his life, and Hogans heel turn actually made sense
>>1387227
HHH has to be in discussion.
>>1387348
Face Punk is on a lower level than heel Punk.
18+
>>1387439
Heel Flair is on another planet compared to face Flair, it isn't even close
>>1387439
Heel Flair is on another planet compared to face Flair, it isn't even close
>>1387267
He had a heel run as the Doctor of Thuganomics. You can really see in that period how good he was with his promos since there was no PG BS.
You don't really know how good he would be today if there was no PG that would give restrictions to his heel-ish run and promos.
It's like you think about Hogan turn heel in a PG era. I think would never be as big as it was in early monday night wars.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bX25ZYA-vlc
>>1387227
Well shit you've got a hell of a point OP.
I suppose the one point of debate is whether he'd have been as effective as a megaheel if he didn't build it off of his babyface reputation?
>GOAT heel
>Won't even put over the face clean resulting in a terrible finish in a match with the biggest build up ever
>>1387480
Hogan worked as a heel in his first WWF run and at the start of the AWA run, but he was so over that Verne was forced to turn him face (and never gave him the belt, which was the beginning of the end for them)
Combination of his character getting stale and being the most popular wrestler definitely helped him, but with Hulks charisma he could have pulled anything off for awhile
>>1387488
Nobody involved in that situation ever blamed Hogan, and that includes Sting. In fact, Hogan never beat Sting in a match.
>>1387227
> Ric Flair
When you think of Flair, you think of the Horsemen and how they were the top heels in the entire industry back then. If you think about it, that really says a lot how WCW wasn't even the top company.
Ric Flair was the best at making a babyface out of other people, with his great flamboyant style, plus his in ring style isn't what you could proper call babyface.
His run as a face wasn't good since the face one was more of a lifetime respect for a legend of the business and his legacy.
> Randy Savage
The guy did start as a Heel and was so fucking detested during his early WWF years. You'll never think at that time he would make audience cry in early 90's because of his reunite with Miss Elizabeth making a Wrestlemania moment as a love story.
The problem about Macho Man is that he was always behind Hogan, since Hogan wasn't heel until 96 when he was with WCW. So as good as he was, he could never top Hogan. Yet, and like Flair, I really think Savage was better as an asshole.
> Roddy Piper
Like Flair, he was GOAT at make a babyface out of other people. I even believe if it wasn't for him Hogan would not be as big babyface as he was.
Once more, like Flair, he wasn't good as a face. Sure he was average in his WCW run because of his humour promos towards NWO. Even so, he wasn't top notch since he couldn't be show playing to his strengths.
> Cena
Like Savage he started as a heel. Back in his Doctor of Thuganomics era he could really get some heat with his promos. Even so he wasn't a GOAT heel, he had and is good at mic and can really talk as face or heel.
Maybe if he did start as a face he could go full Hollywood Hogan and turn face, and maybe that could make all the families and children hate him. That won't happen since WWE sucks now with Vince's PG Samoan era.
Conclusion, that everybody knows, Gawker Hogan is the GOAT as both babyface and heel ever. Even so he is not the best heel of all time.
>Hulk/Hollywood Hogan
>GOAT face and GOAT heel
>posts picture of him without his horseshoe moustache
>>1387472
>You can really see in that period how good he was with his promos
Cena on the mic now is far more consistent and now he doesn't need to be restrained by a dumb rap gimmick
Niggers pls
The only correct answer after Hogan
>>1388013
Who's that?
In some years he will.
>>1388120
He's a little awkward as a heel. I think he would make an excellent babyface though.
>>1388179
It's hard to be an effective heel in WWE nowadays.
>>1388183
This, you're only allowed to follow like three models.
>Chickenshit narcissist heel that never fights, always cowers and is a bastardization of the opportunistic heel that Jericho and Edge perfected.
>Umaga tier monster heel, always coming in and hitting people and doesn't really speak and squash matches always.
>Authority Figure.
>>1388120
Wrong picture, my bad
>>1388239
You were close...
>>1387301
Came here to post Kurt and Rock. Id also add Eddie and Piper
>>1388249
Build the wall.
You gotta go home.
>>1387308
Jericho doesn't have a lot of great face runs. He was pretty over when he beat Rock for the title, but they turned him soon after. same happens after every return.
>>1387301
HBGay was the drizzling shits as a face though
Also Kurt was a comedy wrestler, he doesnt count
>>1388258
He was a lot better in his 00s run as a face then the forced 90s run
>>1388258
>Comedy wrestler.
18+ mistake had fun and wasn't a stone faced bastard who took himself too seriously as not a serious wrestler.
>>1388249
Face Piper can't compare to heel Piper, he was good but its the same situation with Flair
Eddie yes
>>1388013
How can Bret be considered a top heel if his gimmick was only getting booed outside of his home country?
BMJ is so based that he played the GOAT face and the GOAT heel *at the same time*.
>>1388492
ok Vince
>>1388476
So Iron Shiek and Piper were not top heels either?
![big-show[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/8aRGkAw.jpg "big-show[1].jpg")
ahem
>>1388507
When did WWF do tours in Iran?
and Pipers heel gimmick was more than "USA sucks Canada is better"
>>1388511
Did they only get booed outside their home countries? Yes?
Hush your gums then
>>1388519
WWF never did shows in Iran so how would I know
and again that wasn't Pipers gimmick. He got heat that wasn't "USA sucks Canada is better". Bret was a one trick pony heel
>>1388521
> he never saw the 80s Hart Foundation in action
18+
>>1388528
Was that around the time he first started wearing sunglasses because he was nervous as fuck every time he had to cut a promo?
Yeah he's one of the GOAT heels kek
Not the only OP, but I agree.
>>1388532
> doesnt even need a mic to be a 10/10 heel
Indeed
Based bret
Kane
>>1388492
Came in to say this. He's the only guy who can do both ultimate heel and face at the same time.
>>1388247
KO is far better as a heel than he would be as a face.
>>1388253
I somewhat agree. Jericho is just so much better as a heel than he is as a face.
>>1387296
it'd have to be the rock, right?
>>1388492
well by that logic Ramen is no. 1 all time
>>1389022
It would also make X-Pac one of the goat heels.
Shield Dean was best heel of the 10's
>>1388899
fuck off bretcuck
Can't debate. This man is heavily responsible for the massive rise of WCW and the WWE. Plus he fucking killed Gawker. Hulk is literally the dictionary definition of GOAT.
