So, I've been doing boxing/kickboxing, etc. for a couple years. I'm looking for an art to add tricks to my kickboxing. I like throws and locks and such, but does Hapkido have any practical application?
>>1073445
not really on paper it sounds great but a lot of American dojangs that teach this style do compliance kata and no pressure testing of the techniques.
Since you're already a striker pick up some of the pressure tested grappling styles like judo, wrestling, bjj and sambo. If you really want something from east asia go get judo,
>>1073445
or do actually muay thai and get good at thai style clinching which would add a new dimension to your kick boxing with the setting up of knees elbows and takedowns.
I really want to do Sambo, but no one close to me has it. Hapkido was just because I happened to notice a place around me. I checked out their Facebook and they posted a couple a pics from competition, so I know they actually practice.
Guess I'll just search more diligently for Judo.
Thanks though!
>>1073502
Sanda/Sanshou? I know it's basically Chinese kickboxing, but do they have all those throws/takedowns? Is it popular in the NE of Murika?
>>1073561
you're in new england?
you're in the bread basket of folk style wrestling
>>1073566
I am indeed. I wrestled years ago, like when I was 6, but it was with the YMCA. Please tell me more about the wrestling culture in New England! Apparently I missed it in my quest to be a better striker.
I need to know where to go to improve myself.
>>1073576
well New England is probably home to the largest feeder system and its probably one of the oldest established communities of folk style/free style/greco.
It might be tough for you to get your foot in the door, but NE has probably the largest club wrestling scene, high school and college. I mean you hear about Iowa Oklahoma, they're great and have good local scenes but NE is probably has a longer tradition
>>1073576
you were 6? so you were in a cadet academy? why did you stop? if you kept wrestling from elementary/cadet to high you could be a bad ass college level wrestler.
>>1073595
I'm well past highschool/college, are there any private schools in the area that are famous?
I really would like to know more about this stuff. My gym can never keep a grappling program as the interest is never there, but I know it's needed, and I want to have a solid base.
>>1073600
Probably because at 6 he wasn't exactly planning ahead.
>>1073600
I was not in cadet academy. I know how much sticking with wrestling would've helped me now. Hindsight is 20/20.
I wasn't committed to anything in life until mid 20s when I started boxing.
>>1073601
The most famous is New England Gold Wrestling team. they do elementary, middle high, college and post.
There the most famous. A lot of NE wrestling coaches also help with the MMA scene which is why i think NE has a huge florishing amature MMA scene since most wrestlers go from college into MMA.
>>1073611
Thanks anon! I think my distance from MMA really hurt me here. I kinda snubbed my nose at them being into purely striking, but now I realize all the crossover stuff I want to know has gone to MMA. I'll ask more about MMA before I check i nto Hapkido
>>1073445
It's shitty aikido combined with shitty tkd and sold as "ancient 2deadly hwarang warrior style" despite the fact it didn't exist before the 60s.
>>1073445
There are serveral systems that blend standup and grappling together, the only really decent ones are (in desecnding order):
1. Sambo
2. Kudo / Daido Juku
3. German JuJutsu (at least the full contact fighters)
There are other systems like Tang Soo Do or Hapkido which will make you more well rounded and good enough to fuck up the average street thugh.
But in the long run the lack of real sparring will become noticeable.
Hapkido will probably "feel better" in the beginning, but I'd still recommend something like Wrestling, BJJ or Judo. Because they train against full resistance more or less straight from the beginning, which mean: if you can throw someone HERE you can really throw someone.
Hapkido isn't that bad, but a specialized grapplign art (Judo, Wrestling, BJJ) will take you further.
Another option would be Muay Thai, you can use your kickbox skills very well there and add clinching and sweeps.
>>1073995
How much hapkido experience do you have?
>>1073561
Only leg catch and sweep. They use shin guards,head guard and body guard tho so it's gentle(r) to the noobs
>>1073561
>>1074624
>Only leg catch and sweep.
Lies. There's more grappling in Sanda/Sanshou than there is in Muay Thai.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanshou#Curriculum
Sanda/Sanshou has a lot of Grappling:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H8nCgNTByiE
But practically, a Muay Thai practitioner will often be better, because it's a bigger pool with more competition and because Muay Thai is a very refined system:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mqjq0dJ3AYA
Of course NOT if it's a fight between two chinese fighters (in chinese TV)..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rwyDS6uzOiQ
As for Hakido:
They have a standup which is about on par with generic kickboxing or something like Shotokan:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BM6vQ2ezJ0w
..and can even (more or less) play with Kyokushin guys, if they manage to charge in and fight from the clinch distance, because the Kyo guys aren't that good at clinching:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UOWFnuglnFs
IF they can get into the clinch distance, that is:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TeYZsz8JBwA
But against a Muay Thai guy they will have a hard time:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lr4Tw3T1qrM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G0fA3aFgbbw
But why can't we be friends?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zQrAzGELCdY
>>1079117
Fair enough! You have convinced me! I will just search a little more for a traditional Muay Thai school in my area. Or, as everyone pointed out, a classic wrestling/judo school.
Oh no, not another hapkido thread filled with people that don't know what they are talking about.
I though these kind of threads died with the wrestling take over.
I normally used to come in these threads to lay down actual facts and "be a buzzkill" but I don't really think it is necessary in this case.
OP, you are ready know what you are looking for and can already tell if a place is full of shit or not from spending a few classes there.
It is really the same as anything, is their training alive and the instructors down to earth?
What is the primary goals of the place, money, produce great martial artist, get new cult members, recreation, etc?
Is their primary interest kids or adults?
And so on and so forth.
From asking questions like this you can tell on your own if it is worth your time and hard earned money.
The quality of hapkido places vary hugely with a lot of places being on the low end.
Also please keep in mind that standing locks are super low % against resisting opponents and are not efficient or practical most of the time, but because of "reasons" Hapkido is still kind of obsessed with them.
But then again the same could be said about jumping spin kicks and the like... which you will also probably do in hapkido too now that I think about it.
If you or anyone else has any questions about hapkido I have little problem answering them as I am in a good mood for the time being.
>>1080616
>Also please keep in mind that standing locks are super low %
>the same could be said about jumping spin kicks and the like
The better you are at using them and timing, the higher percentage they are.
>>1080632
yes and no. some moves won't land no matter what unless there is a huge discrepancy in strength or experience, and then what's the point of using said move if you could just muscle your way or already beat them.
>>1080648
>what's the point of using said move if you could just muscle your way or already beat them.
For the fun of using your superior experience to do something different.
Also, there's a lot of possibilities in combat, even in professional UFC.
Sometimes, despite being the top 5% in skill, there're just openings where someone could 360 flying spinning twin side kick you, or maybe do a crane-kick style running flying knee.
Here's a kind of related video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LWE79K2Ii-s
>>1080746
so to show your an arrogant asshole and showboat that you're better then someone? that's called poor sportsmanship
MMAfags showing why no one in the martial art community respect their classless antics
>>1080766
Let's assume you aren't posting b8.
>to show you're an arrogant asshole
Part of martial arts is fun. If there's an opening for something fun, why not take it? Because the risk is high? Maybe if it's a belt fight, you should play it safe, so when you're on your death bed, you could think about that accomplishment. If it's a fight, sparring, something to add some weight to your record, you could be on your death bed, and think about all the chances you had for fun, but didn't take.
Also, remember the second part of the post, there're openings for things, no matter what your skill level.
>MMAfags showing why no one in the martial arts community respect their classless antics
gr8 b8 m8
>>1080632
>The better you are at using them and timing, the higher percentage they are.
Goes from 0.01% to 0.1% after years of training. Yup seem totally practical.
But realistically speaking, when it comes to joint locks, the better you can control the opponents body and isolate the joint, the more efficient and effective they are. The best way to do that is to take them down first then go for the lock.
So it is much easier and more practical to say hip throw someone and slam on a arm bar then try to fiddle around while they wiggle out of trying to lock in a standing arm bar.
>>1080832
I'll say this coming from a judo background and being around for awhile. The best standing arm lock guys are always good uchi mata players, The same principles of position before submission always apply.
Have someone get good and getting into position and timing a throw, and then teaching them to make one modification to their grip makes standing arm locks for them high percent, which is a huge reason why you see waki gatames and other standing armlocks in every judo tournie. They don't train full force in practice, but they uchikomi their regular throw, one modification and boom its high percent.
On the converse, a lot of other styles like hapikdo and aikido do nothing to train or instill the body posistion, timing and footwork to land their standing locks, which is why the footwork looks so poor, they focus on rudimentary movement and then look for the tap or roll, and that instills horrible habits that don't translate to someone resisting or fighting back
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EuA5O6rYxOc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dwHDB1ckyJ8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eCnZzxbW08g
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VmDoyaR2umA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O_BJvpVzjF0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DVhTGelMBnU
The webm is psuedo related but grip fighting/kumi kata submissions are another discussion or rather branch of attack for standing armlocks that isn't really taught in traditional means but is rather drilled during pummels and their just minor details rather then big techniques
>>1080866
Good post.
I'm also coming from a Judo background, but have also done escrima which has a lot of arm locks for obvious reasons.
You are right that the most important difference is the way of training. Hapkido has amazing throws, often very close to Judo or sometimes even simpler, throws with big potential. For example if you are allowed to directly manipulate the head, Kuzushi gets much easier (that's why wrestlers do it). Nevertheless the problem is that Judo also trains the whole stuff arround the locks: where do I push/pull/feint to make him do a certain step to create an opening for my lock? And while the standup fighting of Hapkido is great, they don't care that much that aspect but rather assume you will "somehow" get to grab his arm so you can do a wrist turn. This might be indeed enough for a fight against some thugs, but on higher levels they can't keep up with Judo.
I'm not trying to be arrogant, but I think the aliveness training is a very important part of Judo. Once you include wirstlocks you can't do full power sparring anymore which drags down the whole fighting capabilities. That's why wristlocks are really low percentage.
BTW I once applied a wristlock in escrima sparring. It's not that difficult if the other guy has gloves you just trap his hand between yours, step outside and twist. But the problem was that it really fucking hurt the other guy and I would definately NOT recommend to try it. But I'm not talking out of my ass here.
>>1080616
OP here.
Thanks anon. Like you said, I get a good feeling from the gym, they show a couple of competition awards for sparring, not really forms, so the place seems legit.
My real question was more along the lines of how do the techniques from Hapkido, mostly throws and takedowns stack up against things like Muay Thai, Judo, etc.
Is it worth me trying to find another gym, or go with what I found.
